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A place to discuss particular episodes, arcs and moments from the show's run. Please remember this isn't a complete catch-all topic -- check out the forum for character topics and other places for show-related talk.

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So, I've gone back to marathon watching this series on dvd (I got the full series on sale a few years ago, in that very purty packaging).  And I find the first season to be the weakest; ironically, or rather, I ????? when Bellisario says in the first season special features how the first season was "the best." Whatever, Don. The show premiered shortly after the Tailhook scandal, I think, and I was never a fan of Andrea Thompson, but I really, really really loathed her character on this show and was so happy they scuttlebutted her off like so much trash.  I couldn't stand her harassment of Harm. I don't think he reciprocated, but he definitely gave me vibes that he was uncomfortable.  The show did get better halfway through the season when John M. Jackson joined as Admiral Chegwidden. Why the network brass preferred such a weak actress like Tracy Needham over the Awesome Andrea Parker, I'll never understand.

And since there isn't an Unpopular Thread here, I'll say this: I think the show still stands up pretty well. None of the gritty/edgy nonsense that seem to infiltrate or have to be mandatory in shows for the past decade or so. It's very interesting how they undercut real live footage of real people and the actual sitting presidents during this  show, such as Clinton, Bush, Powell, and even Princess Diana, yet when mention was made of "The First Lady," meaning Hillary Clinton in the pilot, they had an actress stand in for her, watching out the window. The actress was horrid, even if she didn't speak a single word. The look of fear and uncertainty as she watched her secretary or Chief of Staff, lead the characters played by Kevin Dunn, who was the JAG at the time and Commander Lindsey (W.K. Stratton) was so ?????

And when the show was brought back on CBS after NBC cancelled it, the one thing I wish they had explained was what happened at the end of "Skeleton Crew" when John Ashford's asshole of an NCIS investigator, arrested Harm for Diane's murder and the last scene we have is him being taken away. I think they may have touched on it when the show revisited her murder, later in the second season, or maybe it was the third, when the real murderer was revealed.

Either way, I'm having a damned good time rewatching this and yes, swooning over the scrumptious David James Elliott as Harmon Rabb, Jr.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule

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I think Tracy Needham got the role over Ms Parker for precisely the reason you stated. Harm had a superior officer sexually harassing him and although they were both Lieutenants Harm was a pay grade higher than Lt JG Austin and the hero wasn't going there until Mac came on at an equal rank. And more so in that era than today a young blond woman would be part of any cast.

Edited by Raja

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13 hours ago, Raja said:

I think Tracy Needham got the role over Ms Parker for precisely the reason you stated. Harm had a superior officer sexually harassing him and although they were both Lieutenants Harm was a pay grade higher than Lt JG Austin and the hero wasn't going there until Mac came on at an equal rank. And more so in that era than today a young blond woman would be part of any cast.

Well, no. Not based on Bellisario's interview. Before they even went to film the first season, after the pilot was pitched, the network said no to keeping Andrea Parker in the series. And as for Catherine Bell as Mac, he hadn't planned that far ahead--plus, he didn't know that NBC would cancel the show after a season. And Catherine fought to be cast as Mac when CBS decided to pick it up--because she was cast in the finale as the murder victim, and Bellisario was all like "I can't cast you, because I just killed you in the season one finale!" But she persevered and convinced him to cast her as Mac.   And Andrea's character was of equal rank to Harm's. Andrea was the stronger actress.

I don't dislike Tracy, but she wasn't that strong of an actress. Doesn't matter, as it's all moot at this point. Once again, NBC was being stupid.

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Sounds like  the network wanted a little sister, able to have her own romances   and probably a cute blonde. Ms Parker as a possible love interest didn't leave Harmon as a free agent. The second network wanted the sexual tension among the leads and Mac was brought in.

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7 minutes ago, Raja said:

Sounds like  the network wanted a little sister, able to have her own romances   and probably a cute blonde. Ms Parker as a possible love interest didn't leave Harmon as a free agent. The second network wanted the sexual tension among the leads and Mac was brought in.

Except that Meg had feelings for Harm. Feelings that weren't sisterly.??

As much as I loved this show, and I did, and continue to do so, Bellisario didn't endear himself to me by waiting until the last 15 minutes of the series finale for Mac and Harm to finally admit they were in love with each other and wanted to be together. ???Of course, they did admit that sort of in the episodes filmed in Australia, though Harm wouldn't commit to Sarah. And again, in the clip show/Sarah's engagement to Mick episode.????

If they had to give Harm a temporary/placeholder girlfriend, did it have to be Renee? ???I couldn't STAND her. ??And she was dumped in five minutes, too, in the ninth season, I believe. Or was it the last season? ????

I liked Jordan the best.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule

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In the end Miss Parker got her career making role. And NBC got the cute blonde for the Uncle Ollie cameo

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So I finally finished the marathon and all I can say is that THANK WHOEVER NIXED having an 11th season without DJE, and thought all the newbies and especially Chris Beetem's Vulchovic, was ANYWHERE near a comparable replacement for Harm. He was an unethical, self absorbed narcissistic arrogant asshole who was too in love with himself and only cared about winning.??

While Harm was a bit of a chauvinist, he respected Kate, Meg and Mac, and cared about the Truth and Justice.

And I really hated how gullible and soft and weak they made Mac in the final season. They should have just had Harm and Mac get together at season's start, and have them juggle their personal and working relationship, instead of keeping both Harm and Mac APART.?????

So now going forward, I'm just going to watch the first nine seasons and the series finale.

And as much as I like David Andrews, he was a poor replacement for Jackson. I really wish the show had convinced him to stay if it was his decision to leave or wish they hadn't let him go if that's what they did!

I much prefer Tyner to Coates.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule

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You are reminding me of things I loved about this show, and things we missed because of life back in those years.  All I had to do was read the name Renee and it all came flooding back. 

And I think I'd rather watch this than most of what's on this season.

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52 minutes ago, enoughcats said:

You are reminding me of things I loved about this show, and things we missed because of life back in those years.  All I had to do was read the name Renee and it all came flooding back. 

And I think I'd rather watch this than most of what's on this season.

Yay!!! Someone to talk to about this show! Hi @enoughcats!!!

I LOATHED Renee. So come on, I wanna know what you thought! I'm thinking about creating a thread for Mac--she was kickass yet could be vulnerable, but the parade of men, okay, two, Mick and Webb, she got involved with and WHY just annoyed me, though it could be explained away due to her daddy, mommy and abandonment issues. I have to come up with an awesome title though.

Not for nothing, but I think it was Mac who resigned her commission because of all the unnecessary drrrraaaamaz they gave her in the last season--endometriosis and a less than 5% of conceiving and she did want babies. So, there you go. I don't mean to sound sexist, but she did want that. And the way David James Elliott said he knew who won but he wasn't telling--with that charming and roguish grin, I think it Harm didn't resign his commission. I'd like to think he's an Admiral now, and back at JAG, as the JAG. Full circle, so to speak!

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To this day there are 42 episodes that I can never rewatch...those with Mic. That hideously awful travesty of a character. I hated that the show runners shoved this moron in our faces so often before they finally axed him. The actor was appalling and however hard they tried, there was no chemistry at all between Mic and Mac..it was all so forced. Very rare for me to have such a strong reaction to a fictional character..but ye gods I still cheer that Mac was never permanently stuck with him.

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1 hour ago, PixiePaws1 said:

To this day there are 42 episodes that I can never rewatch...those with Mic. That hideously awful travesty of a character. I hated that the show runners shoved this moron in our faces so often before they finally axed him. The actor was appalling and however hard they tried, there was no chemistry at all between Mic and Mac..it was all so forced. Very rare for me to have such a strong reaction to a fictional character..but ye gods I still cheer that Mac was never permanently stuck with him.

Over on the granddaughter show NCIS New Orleans they just added a boyfriend to the "City Mouse" which seems has the same root as Mac being with Mic and Clayton Webb. You want your leads to be into each other but then you fear if you actually put them together you would break the magic

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On ‎1‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 4:54 AM, PixiePaws1 said:

To this day there are 42 episodes that I can never rewatch...those with Mic. That hideously awful travesty of a character. I hated that the show runners shoved this moron in our faces so often before they finally axed him. The actor was appalling and however hard they tried, there was no chemistry at all between Mic and Mac..it was all so forced. Very rare for me to have such a strong reaction to a fictional character..but ye gods I still cheer that Mac was never permanently stuck with him.

I fully agree. He wasn't a good actor, but he was good looking so I guess Bellisario figured that's all the public would care about. Wrong

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On 1/16/2018 at 7:54 AM, PixiePaws1 said:

To this day there are 42 episodes that I can never rewatch...those with Mic. That hideously awful travesty of a character. I hated that the show runners shoved this moron in our faces so often before they finally axed him. The actor was appalling and however hard they tried, there was no chemistry at all between Mic and Mac..it was all so forced. Very rare for me to have such a strong reaction to a fictional character..but ye gods I still cheer that Mac was never permanently stuck with him.

I watch them, but I just fast forward all of his scenes, except when Harm gets in his face or makes him look stupid.

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My problem would be that Commander Brumby was the first of the liason officers and the franchise fell in love with the concept 

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So JAG is back on broadcast TV. The Wednesday afternoon marathon on the Heroes and Icons network.

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18 hours ago, Raja said:

So JAG is back on broadcast TV. The Wednesday afternoon marathon on the Heroes and Icons network.

AWESOME! Time to put it on the DVR!!

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On 6/28/2018 at 11:14 AM, GHScorpiosRule said:

AWESOME! Time to put it on the DVR!!

Looks like there will be a week's delay since nothing says let's celebrate the American Revolution like a Xena Warrior Princess marathon 

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There was no delay. At least not that I recall. But what the network has done is instead of airing shows daily, they're airing them in all day mini-marathons.  On Tuesdays, it's Nash Bridges.  Wednesday is JAG day.  But of course, I couldn't wait and pulled out my dvds and zipped through to the end of season 8. I have NO desire to watch season 9 because we lose Chegwidden at the half-season mark, and well, it starts to drag. And my blood pressure rises at the asshole who would have been the face of this show had it gone on for another season.

So I went back and watched the second half of the first season, and only a handful because I really, really, really cannot stand Krenick and her sexual harassment of Harm.  I'm up to the third season now. Two things that really irk and confuse me and I don't understand why Bellisario chose to do this.

One, having some guy with a slightly southern accent to play Harmon Senior in the letter tapes. When we know that David James Elliot played Harmon Senior; and that in all the episodes we got with him playing Hammer, they didn't dub in that irritating voice, but David got to use his own voice. It just bugs.

The other thing is changing Catherine Bell's voice in the flashback to Diane's murder. It's not as if Catherine is the ONLY actor to appear as a different character on this show. And Bellisario initially told her he couldn't rehire her when CBS picked up the show because he'd "killed" her. But she convinced him, and I'm glad she did.

I'm bummed that only Jeff MacKat and Larry Manetti were the only Magnum Alum to appear on this show; no Tom Selleck or John Hillerman. Or that in the last two seasons we got Al (Dean Stockwell) from Quantum Leap, but no Sam (Scott Bakula).

Mick continues to be such a slimy character and I can't stand him and always fast forward his scenes. And boy, did they want to jettison Rene off the show but FAST. The sudden falling in love with Cyrus the mortician and just wanting to be married because he father died, was lazy as feck. But I didn't care because I would be free of her finally.

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So im binge watching JAG and am noticing that the on-screen timelines don’t make sense. For example, why are Harriet and Bud just going to bed at 3 am? Why is everyone still working at 2 am? Why is court in session at 4 am? And it’s daylight at 10 pm. In Washington DC! Lol.

I never noticed these things when the show was on the air. 

One thing hasn’t changed...I didn’t  like Brumby or Renee then and I still don’t like them now.

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13 minutes ago, Sake614 said:

So im binge watching JAG and am noticing that the on-screen timelines don’t make sense. For example, why are Harriet and Bud just going to bed at 3 am? Why is everyone still working at 2 am? Why is court in session at 4 am? And it’s daylight at 10 pm. In Washington DC! Lol.

I never noticed these things when the show was on the air. 

One thing hasn’t changed...I didn’t  like Brumby or Renee then and I still don’t like them now.

Are you not adding like seven hours to the time posted onscreen? Because the time we see isn’t EST time, but ZULU time, so  3:00 ZULU is 11:00pm, so Bud and Harriet are going to bed at 11!???

And the 10:00pm is ZULU so it’s only 6:00pm!???

I can’t stand those two, either! Blech!

Edited by GHScorpiosRule

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oh DUH! That makes much more sense. I kept looking at the timeline and thinking 'huh?'

Unfortunately I was only able to watch S1 online and then picked it up again with H&I's broadcast, which started mid-S4. If I want S2-3, I have to subscribe to CBS all-access. Not sure I want to do that just to rewatch JAG, no matter how much I adore DJE. 

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45 minutes ago, Sake614 said:

oh DUH! That makes much more sense. I kept looking at the timeline and thinking 'huh?'

Unfortunately I was only able to watch S1 online and then picked it up again with H&I's broadcast, which started mid-S4. If I want S2-3, I have to subscribe to CBS all-access. Not sure I want to do that just to rewatch JAG, no matter how much I adore DJE. 

I’m not sure what season it’s up to now, but since they air them in 8 hour blocks, season two should roll back around quickly.

I find I can’t stomach the ninth season and Harm is hardly seen in the last season, Chegwidden is gone and it’s so clear that season is like an audition for new blood if they got a season 11. I wasn’t going to watch because he was leaving after 10 years. Even though Catherine was reported to have agreed to remain.

I’ve always been miffed that neither Mac or Harm ever made an appearance on NCIS, while Bud and Chegwidden did.????

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10 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

’ve always been miffed that neither Mac or Harm ever made an appearance on NCIS, while Bud and Chegwidden did

That's because Bellisario is a petty asshole. He publicly stated that DJE was too old to continue to play the lead. That's why he brought in TAWP Jordan on OLTL. He was young and hot and sexy and all the things DJE wasn't (according to Bellisario). I've never forgiven him for that. I was also pretty much over Harm and Mac by the end (or at least Mac), although I was glad they  FINALLY got together. Honestly, until the very last scene, I was ready to throw something at my TV because I was sure the series would end without them as a couple.

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45 minutes ago, Sake614 said:

That's because Bellisario is a petty asshole. He publicly stated that DJE was too old to continue to play the lead. That's why he brought in TAWP Jordan on OLTL. He was young and hot and sexy and all the things DJE wasn't (according to Bellisario). I've never forgiven him for that. I was also pretty much over Harm and Mac by the end (or at least Mac), although I was glad they  FINALLY got together. Honestly, until the very last scene, I was ready to throw something at my TV because I was sure the series would end without them as a couple.

Really? David had nothing but good things to say about Bellisario in the interviews on the dvds. And it was my understanding that David didn’t want to do another season, hence hiring that smug asshole who looks like a smug asshole.

But also, Bellisario pretty much is out of the picture after the first two seasons with respect to day to day running of the show. That was always his pattern. He’d come back and write for some really good episodes. I know he’s an asshole, but I refuse to listen anymore! LALALALALALALAAAA??????????I can’t HEAR you!!!????????????????

I had had my fill of Mac right around the time after she killed Sadiq. And her penchant for getting into relationships with men who she wasn’t attracted to or had the same feelings because Harm refused to commit and she didn’t want to be alone. That last part irks me because Mac was NOT this needy, clingy insecure person when we first met her!

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Sorry, but there’s nothing in those articles that “prove” that Bellisario had it in for David James Elliott. Just a lot of speculation based on what seems upset fans.

And since, as of 2010, when the whole series was released and I’ve watched all the interviews? I’m believing what I saw, and not ambiguous “quotes.”

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I haven’t seen the interviews but I do remember reading Belliszrio’s comments in the paper when JAG was canceled. I can’t find them now but can see them in my mind very clearly. It made me so mad I’ve never forgiven Bellisario!

maybe they patched things up. I dunno. 

Ive never understood why dje had such a hard time finding work after JAG. He certinzly had leading man looks and wasn’t lacking for talent. 

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I think with David-he played Harm for a decade that maybe producers could only see him as Harmon Rabb, Junior. When he showed up on that one show, about a woman lawyer, he was a...lawyer. The summer show about him playing the patriarch of a family of criminals while he sat in jail, bombed.

Anyhoo, back to the show.

I really enjoyed the courtroom scenes and listening to them argue their cases.

And they made a huge goof-that one Christmas episode “The Ghosts of Christmas Past” where the cast and recurring guest stars played real people and part of the USO, they messed up with the casting for young Tom Boone. He ALWAYS had a moustache-but Peter Munik-who player Palmer, didn’t have one. And then a couple seasons later in ”A Separate Piece” I think it was when Boone was accused of murdering women and children in Vietnam, the actor playing Boone had the moustache! And this incident happened close to the time Rabb senior went MIA!!!

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I wonder how much they will mention Harm and Mac's relationship? I am assuming he will be wearing a ring and they will be mentioned somewhat.

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I don't watch NCIS: LA, but if Rabb's gonna show up I may have to watch these episodes.  The article says he's Captain Harmon Rabb.  JAG ended 15 years ago, if he's still in the Navy wouldn't he be a Rear Admiral by now?

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1 hour ago, Magnumfangirl said:

I don't watch NCIS: LA, but if Rabb's gonna show up I may have to watch these episodes.  The article says he's Captain Harmon Rabb.  JAG ended 15 years ago, if he's still in the Navy wouldn't he be a Rear Admiral by now?

Making General or Admiral is not just a matter of time in grade or in service. It is political influence as well  as military or naval competence which gets you flag rank. 

On the other hand however in real life since Captain Rabb has been identified as USNA class of 1985 he would have been forced into retirement after 30 years of service if he wasn't selected for Admiral. So it would be highly unlikely that he would be an XO, thus next in line to command an aircraft carrier if he was already at retirement age as those XO slots are generally used for the next CO and not given as a last assignment reward.

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1 hour ago, Magnumfangirl said:

I don't watch NCIS: LA, but if Rabb's gonna show up I may have to watch these episodes.  The article says he's Captain Harmon Rabb.  JAG ended 15 years ago, if he's still in the Navy wouldn't he be a Rear Admiral by now?

My thoughts exactly! If I recall correctly, the most recent appearance of Bud on NCIS, he was Captain. And with his limited ability due to his lower leg being a prosthetic, Harm should be Rear, if not full Admiral. I’m hoping we’ll get a mention of Mac and Mattie, and eventually an appearance from them. Gimmel did say that he wanted both Bell and  Elliott on and both were available at one time.

But yeah, I’m SO IN for some Harm since I’ve been wanting to see him reprise his role. I stopped watching LA during the first season, but I’ll be watching for Harm.🥰🥰🥰

27 minutes ago, Raja said:

Making General or Admiral is not just a matter of time in grade or in service. It is political influence as well  as military or naval competence which gets you flag rank. 

On the other hand however in real life since Captain Rabb has been identified as USNA class of 1985 he would have been forced into retirement after 30 years of service if he wasn't selected for Admiral. So it would be highly unlikely that he would be an XO, thus next in line to command an aircraft carrier if he was already at retirement age as those XO slots are generally used for the next CO and not given as a last assignment reward.

PSSHT. This show rarely followed real life, though it did the best it could based on who the show runners were and the consultants. Plus Bell’s interviews in the special features regarding the uniforms. So I’m perfectly okay with Harm still in the Service, but NOT with his still being Captain since he’d shown a LOT of growth and maturity when the show ended.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule
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Well its like the CAG advised him during his second tour as a aviator. Jumping from JAG to aviation left Harmon behind his contemporaries. While Bud may have risen higher in  the JAG corps, Harm went about as far as an aviator can go but sacrificed two stars to do it.

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3 minutes ago, Raja said:

Well its like the CAG advised him during his second tour as a aviator. Jumping from JAG to aviation left Harmon behind his contemporaries. While Bud may have risen higher in  the JAG corps, Harm went about as far as an aviator can go but sacrificed two stars to do it.

As an aviator, yes. But Harm went back to JAG, where he could have risen higher than Captain. There, he wasn’t behind his contemporaries.

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20 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

As an aviator, yes. But Harm went back to JAG, where he could have risen higher than Captain. There, he wasn’t behind his contemporaries.

But then we are discussing Captain Rabb the XO or a CO of an aircraft carrier showing up on NCIS: Los Angeles. Thus he choose to go back to aviation at some point to end his career, instead of staying on the path to perhaps being chosen for the Admiralcy  and eventually becoming the US Navy JAG or higher.

Edited by Raja

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1 minute ago, TheOtherOne said:

Bell will be back too. Arc expected to last the final two episodes of this season and first two of next.

JAG Reunion! Catherine Bell to Join David James Elliott on NCIS: LA

giphy.gif

Harm and Mac BETTER STILL BE HAPPILY MARRIED! I do NOT want to see anything like the stupid "what if" episode. Especially after that bullshit series finale where they finally say I love you in the last five minutes!

Why no, I'm not bitter at all!

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4 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Please let this be true.

Come on, CBS, make this happen, even as a limited series.

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As I've always understood it, for officers there is a maximum time in grade, at the end of which you need to be promoted or retired.  What sticks in my memory is that if you miss on two chances for promotion, you are out.  And at the higher ranks, which include Navy Captain (Rabb) and Marine Colonel (MacKenzie, who I really wanted to win that coin toss), the next promotion is to flag rank, which is more a matter of being selected for an existing position, as opposed to being promoted because "it's your turn".

Maybe the wars change all that, with all the stop-loss.  However, I'm reasonably sure the one thing the military is never short on for aviation positions, is pilots.  Rabb really did lose to many years in aviation.  And while Chegwidden went from SEAL to Surface Warfare to JAG, aviation to JAG to Surface Warfare doesn't seem natural.

Bud Roberts as a JAG Captain was perfectly done and well-timed, and with four (five?) children and a career that is going to probably be mostly shore duty and no more deployments to a combat area, staying in gives him a solid career, good prospects after retirement, and military medical care for all those kids.  Plus, the man's a silver fox.

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I didn’t want Mac to win that toss because as immature and manipulative as I thought both Harm and Mac were, I thought she was just a little more so, just enough to put her over the top.

Considering all the inappropriateness Mac surrounded herself with, Harm would have hands down won a promotion far more easily, so it really should not have come down to a coin toss unless Harm really didn’t care about advancing.

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5 hours ago, kassygreene said:

As I've always understood it, for officers there is a maximum time in grade, at the end of which you need to be promoted or retired.  What sticks in my memory is that if you miss on two chances for promotion, you are out.  And at the higher ranks, which include Navy Captain (Rabb) and Marine Colonel (MacKenzie, who I really wanted to win that coin toss), the next promotion is to flag rank, which is more a matter of being selected for an existing position, as opposed to being promoted because "it's your turn".

Maybe the wars change all that, with all the stop-loss.  However, I'm reasonably sure the one thing the military is never short on for aviation positions, is pilots.  Rabb really did lose to many years in aviation.  And while Chegwidden went from SEAL to Surface Warfare to JAG, aviation to JAG to Surface Warfare doesn't seem natural.

Bud Roberts as a JAG Captain was perfectly done and well-timed, and with four (five?) children and a career that is going to probably be mostly shore duty and no more deployments to a combat area, staying in gives him a solid career, good prospects after retirement, and military medical care for all those kids.  Plus, the man's a silver fox.

Being an aircraft carrier XO, or commander is a Naval aviation slot, not a surface warfare officers position.

Given that Harm has been identified as class of 1985 by real world up or out policies he would have been forced to retirement and not be serving as an XO in line for the next commander of his aircraft carrier as the promo for his NCIS:Los Angeles appearance suggest 

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On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 12:14 AM, katie9918 said:

I didn’t want Mac to win that toss because as immature and manipulative as I thought both Harm and Mac were, I thought she was just a little more so, just enough to put her over the top.

Considering all the inappropriateness Mac surrounded herself with, Harm would have hands down won a promotion far more easily, so it really should not have come down to a coin toss unless Harm really didn’t care about advancing.

The only way their marriage and careers were going to work was if she won. She was never going to leave the military to play nurse to Harm's newly-quadriplegic foster child. There was also no way that Mattie's doctors would have let her leave the country for Harm's new post in England that soon after her injury. He had to stay home and take care of Mattie while Mack stayed in the military state-side.

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I despise everything about the Mattie story line.  It was so freaking stupid.  I'm still pissed about a lot of things that happened on the show in those last two seasons.  I watched this show religiously for 10 years; but If a revival happens, I hope they retcon some of the stupid crap that happened at the end.

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