S08.E13: The Lies Are Going to Catch Up With You

[formerlyfreedom]

Damon and Alaric come face to face with an old enemy after they obtain a weapon that may be able to destroy Cade. Stefan is held captive by a surprising acquaintance and is forced to confront a dark secret from his past. Meanwhile, Caroline and Matt try to keep Stefan’s violent history from destroying him. Cade focuses his attention on Bonnie and digs deep into her mind.

 

[TigerLynx]

I want Bonnie to be stronger than Cade, and to be able to defeat him because she is actually a good person.

Free Caroline already.  She will be better off without Stefan.

Kai is still amusingly evil.  I prefer Kai's "I like being evil" to Stefan's whining.

Damon and Stefan just need to die already.

I agree with some of the things Rick and Matt are saying about Damon/Stefan and vampires in general, but it is years to late.

[GraceAnne]

So stabbed last week and shot this week... and yet the cure remains in Stefan.....Sigh.  

As always enjoyed Kai and someone rightfully telling Damon he's redemption arch is bullshit.  I less enjoyed the irony of Damon thinking the creepy guy taking advantage of a younger girl made him a bad person.  Sell it somewhere else show. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Clip:

[Artsda]

Caroline should have chosen Alaric and stayed a mother to her kids last year. The only reason she seemed to remember they existed this episode is because Alaric brought them up. She seems to not be able to be a mother and be with Stefan at the same time. 

She's also mad at Matt for not being team Vampire when she has to sit there all day and compel people to forget all the murders who boyfriend committed?  

I enjoyed Kai's return more than anyone else in this episode.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Artsda

[steelyis]

I love Kai Parker, he's right up there with Katherine Pierce; they're always entertaining and continually flawless.

I'm going to need Bonnie and Kai to have at least one scene together, or better yet, I want a Bonnie, Damon and Kai reunion.

 

1 hour ago, GraceAnne said:

As always enjoyed Kai and someone rightfully telling Damon he's redemption arch is bullshit.

 

Right? I love that Kai didn't fall for Damon's idiotic wake Elena for redemption, because fuck that.

Outside of Kai, and Bonnie finding Enzo in the afterlife she created, I can't say the episode was anything special. I don't care enough about Intern to feel moved by his plot with Stefan, though I think the actor portrayed anger and grief fairly well, and I never warmed to Alaric and Caroline's kids so their drama isn't compelling either.

[Jessie monster]

Up until he decided to save him, Dorian 2K17! 

I fully understand Bonnie looking at Cade as a better option than Kai and Damon in full Elena mode. My girl screamed herself a new dimension.

Caroline, you can do better than Stefan and Alaric. PS Alaric, why did move back to Mystic Falls, you dummy.

[TigerLynx]

I thought Damon was an idiot for thinking even for one moment that he could work with Kai on anything.

I don't see the point in all these near death experiences for Stefan.

I want Bonnie and Caroline to get out alive, enjoy there lives, and never have to deal with Damon and Stefan Salvatore ever again.

Edited February 18, 2017 by TigerLynx

[imaneassi]

I want Elena, alive, awake and free from both brothers,moving on elsewhere without looking back

[GaT]

2 hours ago, doram said:

When Katherine, then Elena turned human, why didn't we have the ripple effect of people falling out of compulsion?

Silas compelled the entire town to stand silent as he murdered their mayor. Where was that ripple effect?

But Stefan turns human, and suddenly there's a crisis and vendettas piling up for him.

Once again, the show loves punishing Stefan.

Because the writers of this show don't know what the word "continuity" means. 

Why are they introducing new plots at the end of the show? Why did they bring Kai back? Why are the twins developing powers? Why is Bonnie spending the end of the show trying to get Enzo out of hell? I'm so glad there's only 3 episodes left.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I know Kai is evil, but I just love him because he is so delightful. I loved when he was ordering food at the beginning. Two cheeseburgers and a beer. No, three cheeseburgers and two beers! I loved that Damon made him sit in the back seat like a little kid and that, like the child that he is, Kai was leaning into the front seat whispering, "Let me say hi!" when Damon was on the phone with Bonnie. Watching Kai try to climb out of the back seat in the background was hilarious.

Maybe I've watched too many supernatural shows, but Bonnie, do you really think that opening your mind to the devil is a good idea? Advising her to embrace her pain and live in the trauma sounded like Darth Vader telling Luke to come over to the dark side.

I don't understand why she went to Cade at all. Let me see, Cade wants the souls of people who have done evil things like, say, vampires who killed a bunch of people aka Enzo. Why would Cade then tell her how to get Enzo out of hell?

Oh, Dorian. Your first mistake was shooting Stefan before he'd finished digging a proper grave. It's a good thing he changed his mind because that hole was barely big enough for Stefan to sit in. His body would have been found within a few weeks which means you might as well have just not bothered with digging that shallow grave in the first place.

So how long is it going to take these dummies to figure out that the twins started getting out of control because of the Maxwell bell being rung three days ago? And how long before Cade tries to take them to replace Stefan and Damon? What the hell was Kai doing for the three days between when he showed up at the Mystic Falls Grille and when he went to Damon and Alaric in the Cave of Wonders? I mean, besides finding himself a new outfit which hopefully didn't take him three days. Then again this is the guy who spent like ten minutes talking about the merits of pockets big enough to fit cell phones, so maybe it did take him three days to find a new ensemble.

Obviously Damon should have known better than to trust Kai. I mean, hello, when Alaric had him against the wall, Kai tried to magic Alaric right into the special Cade knife. If that wasn't a clear indication that Kai would kill any of them in a second, I don't know what was. But nope, Damon was so blinded by the idea that Kai would remove the Bonnie/Elena spell that he teamed up with him.

I totally cracked up when the former police officer described Stefan as "intense guy, weird hair." It reminded me of ye olden days of BtVS and Spike cracking on Angel's hair. For me, Stefan will always be Puppet Angel.

Edited February 18, 2017 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Dizzychickstar]

I thought Bonnie and Cade interacted well--deals with devils don't seem wise, but she got what she wanted--rare. 

 Damon bugged, trying to get Bonnie's help right during her grief over Enzo. She didn't have to be psychic to know he was fishing. 

Apparently Damon's desperation makes him dumb. Trust Kai? At no point has he ever proven trustworthy---I was surprised he took Elena, but not surprised he siphoned Damon.  Just wondering what his next play will be. 

I agree with the points about Stefan, plus when you show commercials for next week featuring him greeting Elena, it kills any potential suspense.

[gibasi]

Kai was the all star of this episode! The rest of it was just background noise for me. 

[RachelKM]

God Damn, I love Kai.  I love him so much that I can't even not like the actor as Mon-El on Supergirl despite a somewhat half-assed characterization.

I appreciate that this show decided to address the fact that murdering people has more victims that the person killed.  But, um, why the fuck was Stefan so taken aback by the notion when Dorian pointed it out? Like, setting aside they fact that he's been killing people for over a century and compelling their loved ones to cover his tracks meaning he's been face with the collateral effects repeatedly, these asshats have been living as "friends" with Matt Donovan for close to a decade and witnessed his grief first fucking hand.  Did Stefan suppose he was only in pain because he knew how she died? Or maybe look at Bonnie, who's also lost almost everyone she's ever loved in any capacity.  Again, did all these dipshits think it was because she wasn't compelled to think they died in car accidents or random burglaries that she hurt? As if Dorian's family dying in "fire" wasn't painful for him?

Even if you don't include the countless times he killed people with his switch off/in Ripper mode, it never occurred to "I'll just kill some bad people to help with my project" Stefan that there might be consequences for the people he compelled to do irresponsible things and/or be thought to have done out of character stuff to cover his actions?  

And Caroline with her "Is that what you think you deserve? Hell?"  I agree with her that Stefan's atonement would be for him, but her attitude that Stefan feeling the guilt of his actions was somehow unfair to him, ugh.  

Holy Hell these idiots are self-absorbed. 

Goddammit Bonnie!  You are so much smarter than that.  Never make a deal with the evil dude. As a rule, they are not super inclined to be forthright or fair. 

Damon, however, is consistently dumb as shit when anything involves Elena. 

Edited February 19, 2017 by RachelKM

[Snow Fairy]

Did the twins start to use magic when the sirens were killed and Cade came? Was that three days in their timeline?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, RachelKM said:

I appreciate that this show decided to address the fact that murdering people has more victims that the person killed.  But, um, why the fuck was Stefan so taken aback by the notion when Dorian pointed it out. 

Because he doesn't really care.  

Stefan wants to atone because he wants to feel better about himself not because he has compassion for others.  Stefan doesn't want to go to hell.

When Dorain was worried about where he was going to end up if Stefan died, I thought here's your chance Stefan do something selfless and forgive Dorian for your murder and give someone else something you want so badly yourself.  Nope, not Stefan is greedy for atonement but not because he cares about anyone besides himself even his victims.

I'm seeing the writing on the wall.  Nearly everyone is going to die in the finale.  And the world Bonnie created is the magic escape clause that lets hem all escape hell.  Oh, well at least they will be subjected to each other for all eternity which is its own kind of hell.

[GraceAnne]

3 hours ago, RachelKM said:

 

Holy Hell these idiots are self-absorbed. 

 

Dear lord yes!

Im gonna stop myself before I get all worked up again about the incredible self absorbed killing of Kol and his entire line to give little shit Gilbert his mark/Tatoo.  Not today, Satan, not today! 

[miss-vanilla]

Caroline, Stefan, Damon, Matt, Bonnie and Alaric pretty much got on my last nerve in this one.  Not fun viewing really. The only saving grace was the annoying Kai and his antics, but being annoying is part of his charm and his cover. His obsession with food was pretty funny as was his thing for Bonnie- drawing hearts in his breath on the car window was just so in character. It reminded me of when he was catching snowflakes on his tongue in the 1903 prison world.

It felt like a filler episode where nothing really happened except for Kai stealing Elena's casket right in the last 10 seconds. 

Everything was predictable:

Everyone forgives Stefan- Check.

Damon believes Kai will help him get Elena back so he helps him-check

Kai dupes Damon (no suprises there)- check

Bonnie mourns Enzo and spends the screen time with him sucking face-check.

Defan ignore each other- check

Bonnie lets yet another shady person share her mind-check

Alaric is still a dick- check

Caroline is still in a one way relationship- check

Stefan will not die (even as a human)-check.

Stefan is still a manipulative, self-righteous, self absorbed prick (even as a human)- check.

The plot didn't move that much either. Bonnie created a psychic world of her own but I think most people guessed that 2 episodes ago.

The whole thing with Stefan and Dorian seemed redundant since no-one believed he would really kill Stefan. As was all the Caroline and Matt stuff sanitizing Stefan's crimes that have suddenly caught up with him because A) Stefan did not have to face them...Caroline and Matt did and B) It does not impact the story in any way. Caroline just wanted to carry on regardless as did Matt.

 Damon died again and lost the all powerful dagger of killing Cade that we see him holding (while fully alive again) in the promo screen caps for the next episode. 

Aside from Elena's casket being the moonstone again, what else did we learn? oh yeah.. the twins are magical siphon witches. Except we knew that already because they have been used to siphon magic before right?

I'm so disappointed we didn't get to see more Defan interaction. It feels like this relationship should be the focus leading in to the END OF THE SERIES, yet Damon doesn't even get to know that his human brother was (almost) fatally wounded.

The whole moralistic heaven/hell/redemption/atonement/moralistic narrative is just making my head spin. Damon mentioned having an eternity to atone for the things he has done and boy does he need an eternity but Stefan thinks he can atone in a human lifetime. He can't especially when he has a team of people willing to tidy up after him every time.

4 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

ere's your chance Stefan do something selfless and forgive Dorian for your murder and give someone else something you want so badly yourself.

THIS!

It's the Lexie mentality that got Stefan into this mindset in the first place. Throughout his entire existence people have made excuses for his behaviour and reinforced the notion that he is good. Dorian threw a lot of truth bombs his way and he isn't used to it. The one thing Stefan said that I agreed with is that he doesn't know himself because he doesn't. Caroline is another Lexie and the last thing he needs right now is for someone to bury all the wrongs so in hindsight Stefan was right to want to leave MF and try to sort himself out. Sucks for Caroline but she hasn't ever really accepted/known the monster she invited into her bed ( her own words coming back to her bite her hard).

Damon is being equally and uncharacteristically delusional about his own redemption.  For the Salvatore brothers I feel that death in the saving of humans for all the suffering they have caused will be their only redemption BUT I really don't care about that. I have watched this show for 8 years and I have no qualms about admitting that I want to see them all find some kind of peace however that manifests, because despite how much suffering they have caused, they are no strangers to suffering either and despite everything, I have continued to watch this show because I have enjoyed their journey.

PS: I think Damon will be the one to die. Stefan was crying in those promo stills for the finale and despite how self absorbed he is only the loss of Damon or Elena would make that happen. Since he is over Elena (or meant to be), I am guessing Damon is dead/dying.

With all the hemorrhaging Stefan has done lately are we to assume the cure is gone now? will Stefan begin the death march AKA Katherine?

Forgot to add. Damon's line about why Ric is still following Kai on twitter cracked me up just because I'm still following cobra_kai and I only just realised that this last day lol.

Edited February 19, 2017 by miss-vanilla
I'm an idiot.

[Moxie Cat]

5 hours ago, RachelKM said:

God Damn, I love Kai.  I love him so much that I can't even not like the actor as Mon-El on Supergirl despite a somewhat half-assed characterization.

Yeah, this is OT, but I wish Mon-El had had more Kai in him. Clearly Wood was hired by another CW show because of his success on TVD. Mon-El would have been more effective had he been a Kai-ish smart-ass from the start who gradually learned how to be a better person. But the Supergirl PTB have tried to have it both ways from the start, resulting in a weaker character in my view.

So Cade is the devil because he was a good person who was betrayed for being different? And this makes him special why? Because he's a super-psychic? Does that mean there was no devil before his time? (Which was hardly depicted as prehistoric, IIRC.)

These last two seasons of heretics and sirens/Cade have made me nostalgic for the Gemini coven. Thank goodness there was finally an Originals promo on tonight.

[TigerLynx]

I forgot to mention that I find it hilarious that these people keep asking Cade questions.  He is the devil.  The devil lies.  The devil lies even when he is telling the truth.  Yet, in all these years, after dealing with Katherine Pierce, The Originals, Kai and the Heretics, these people have learned nothing.  They actually keep trying to figure out a way to get the DEVIL to help them with whatever their current idiotic goal is.

I didn't think about all of them dying and ending up in the world Bonnie created.  If that happens, how long until they step on each other's last nerve?

Edited February 19, 2017 by TigerLynx

[roctavia]

I like the idea that Bonnie will be stronger than Cade, does he know she used to be a witch? Clearly she has some more powers than he does... so I just want Bonnie to kick his ass and call it a day. She's been dead, she's been to the other side, she's been the anchor for the other side... Bonnie's done it all, she can handle the 'devil.'

Kai was actually a fun addition, hopefully it won't get old the way his original run got old fast... But Damon is an idiot like always.

I was sort of hoping that they would just let Stefan die... I mean, there are only three episodes left, it would have been super dramatic and surprising... and it's kind of time, we've been playing this game for too long (and I say that as someone who likes Stefan)

I have zero faith that the writers are going to give us something decent to end the series with... so I'm glad it's almost over.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Inside the episode (remember when the CW cared enough about this show to post these videos before the episode aired?):

[TigerLynx]

That's assuming Cade was telling Stefan the truth.  Cade could have simply been playing Stefan in order to get him to die and go to hell sooner, or the writers once again can't be bothered to make sense of their own SL.  Didn't Cade also tell Stefan that Elena was going to hell because of him?  By the rules that have been established regarding Cade's hell, they are all going there.  So either Cade lied, or the writers are incompetent idiots.  It would be better if it was the former, but it's probably the latter.

I would love for Bonnie to be stronger than Cade.  After everything Bonnie has been through, it would be great if Bonnie defeats Cade, retrieves Enzo, saves Elena, and kills Kai.  Damon was right when he told Stefan that Bonnie was a better person than they are.

I still don't see the point of having Caroline compel people all day long, or Dorian try to kill Stefan.  It went nowhere just like when Rick and Matt killed Damon.  Damon pops back up alive, and in spite of some very accurate and truthful comments to Damon from Rick and Matt, they still work with Damon.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Damon is being equally and uncharacteristically delusional about his own redemption.  For the Salvatore brothers I feel that death in the saving of humans for all the suffering they have caused will be their only redemption BUT I really don't care about that. I have watched this show for 8 years and I have no qualms about admitting that I want to see them all find some kind of peace however that manifests, because despite how much suffering they have caused, they are no strangers to suffering either and despite everything, I have continued to watch this show because I have enjoyed their journey.

I`m the same way. I KNOW they are horrible and selfish and only able to overcome that in terms of their tribal mentality - that is being selfless for someone they love. And that doesn`t just for the Salvatores but lots of people on the show. But I have watched them for the last 8 years and I kinda want my happy ending.

I was spoiled for the Dorian stuff in this episode and yes, he got a raw deal but I remember how the summer of ripperdom came about. And I liked Stefan after it happened so I still like him now. Dorian is a very new character I don`t remotely have that history with. The Originals did something akin to it in the Season 2 Finale and I had the same reaction: yes, you people were all horribly victimized and have legitimate gripes but I still care about the perpetrator far more than you. This is fiction.  

[miss-vanilla]

On 2/18/2017 at 3:25 PM, Snow Fairy said:

Did the twins start to use magic when the sirens were killed and Cade came? Was that three days in their timeline?

Yes. I think the ringing of the bell eleven times affected the twins and Bonnie and enhanced their psychic powers.

It's all about the bell apparently.

On 2/18/2017 at 6:25 AM, Dizzychickstar said:

Apparently Damon's desperation makes him dumb. Trust Kai?

I would rather see Damon desperate to bring Elena back than be apathetic . Yes he was naiive and stupid but at least he is trying to do something.