The Founder (2016): do you want fries with that?

[wlk68]

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The story of Ray Kroc, a salesman who turned two brothers' innovative fast food eatery, McDonald's, into one of the biggest restaurant businesses in the world with a combination of ambition, persistence, and ruthlessness.

Great performances by all in involved but wow, Ray Kroc was a cutthroat douchebag. This was like the fast food version of The Social Network.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Athena

[snickers]

I've been waiting for Hollywood to make a movie about Ray Kroc...he was cutthroat alright, but brilliant.....

I want to see this, but it is not at the top of my list....hopefully it sticks around in theaters.....

[partofme]

After seeing this I'm glad I don't like McDonalds because I would never want to eat there again.   Never knew Kroc was such as asshole.

[MadyGirl1987]

Just saw this last night and really enjoyed it. It was interesting to see the story behind such a huge American icon as McDonald's. Kroc was a grade a jerk, but Keaton was great in the role. I really felt bad for the brothers and Kroc's first wife. It is funny that now In-N-Out, where I ate after the show, seems more like what McDonald's started as then McDonald's itself. I loved that you could kind of see both the past and future of fast food. From the drive-ins Kroc was going to at the start of the movie to things like the artificial shakes and the mention of frozen fries. Shows where the industry has been and where it's going.

Interesting note;  I just read somewhere earlier this morning that the number of McDonald's shrunk in the US for the second year in a row.

[King of Birds]

Not sure if you all know Mark Knopfler wrote a song about Ray Kroc, based on Kroc's autobiography.
 

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(partial lyrics)

Folks line up all down the street
Now I am seeing this girl divide her meat now
And then I get it  - Wham! as clear as day
My pulse begins to hammer then I hear a voice say:

These boys have got this down - ought to be one of these in every town
These boys have got the touch- It's clean as a whistle and it don't cost much
Wham! Bam! You don't wait long.  Shake, fries, a patty you're gone
How about that friendly name, heck, every little thing ought to stay the same
....
You gentlemen ought to expand
You're gonna need a helping hand now
So gentlemen well what about me?
We'll make a little business history now
....
Well we build it up and I buy 'em out
But man they made me grind it out now
They open up a new place flippin' meat
So I do too, right across the street
....
I got the name but I need the town, sell em' in the end and it all shuts down
Sometimes you gotta be an S.O.B. if you wanna make a dream reality
Competition - send 'em south, if they're gonna drown put a hose in their mouth
Do not pass "Go", go straight to hell
I smell that meat hook smell

Or my name's not Crock, that's Kroc with a K
Like crocodile but not spelled that way now
It's dog eat dog, rat eat rat
Dog eat dog, rat eat rat now
Oh it's dog eat dog, rat eat rat
Kroc style... Boom! like that

 

I thought the movie was good, but missing things. Laura Dern seemed she was not even part of the movie. I know they tried to cover some of his pre-McDonald's salesman efforts that went for naught, but I think it would have been interesting. Plus what happened after he was "king of the fast food world." They glossed that over. And yeah, he divorced his first wife, but didn't marry Joan (Linda Cardellini!) until 1969.  That's a big gap.

So, was Ray the biggest asshole, or was the BJ Novak / Harry the worst for giving him the idea about the land!!-?

[choclatechip45]

Wow Michael Keaton really had the a-hole thing down pat. I thought it was okay found the middle a little boring.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

I absolutely loved this movie.  

It was nothing less than thrilling for me to see Kroc as a mixer salesman.  There were so many like him back in the day.  Nothing whatsoever was promised and they had to hustle on the road, as was depicted.  It took real guts to do a job like that and no small amount of faith.  The toll it took on these folks was quite something.  Unemployment insurance?  Hahahahaha.

I was literally alone in the theater.  I wanted to cheer and shout right after the scene where Kroc took the McDonald's to dinner and they recounted their decades-long industriousness, and yes, genius, in developing the restaurant (best prototype of McDonald's) they created.  My God, was that affirming to me.

The great irony I perceived was how those brothers so clearly understood the process of operating a place like that, but were willfully ignorant as to leveraging what they had.  In their defense, I just don't buy that they trusted Kroc on a handshake to give them any equity.   They were very sure to force Kroc into an onerous and ironclad contract at the outset.  They saw what he was becoming.  And we are to believe they thought a handshake was worth something?  Puh-leeeeze.

I also have little sympathy for what they missed out on.  Those dudes cashed out LARGE.  That kind of money 60 years ago?  Enormous.  They certainly had earned it, though.  Fo sho!

Keaton was brilliant.  Linda C. was, to me, shockingly sexy as the Siren Joan.  

If an excellent representation of what America was on the cusp of the homogeneity we now know has any appeal to you, viewing this movie is a must.  Must.

[Traveller519]

The Founder had been on my list for a while. I love a good business movie. I appreciate that these movies don't shy away from what assholes their subjects can be. The Steve Jobs Movies and The Social Network definitely come to mind.

The McDonald brothers are made out to be sympathetic characters, but I also enjoy how the movie built the frustration between Ray's goals and Dick's control freak nature. The brothers basically painted themselves into a corner. They didn't recognize the growing business that Krock was building in the background while believing they had the power because of their contract. And I genuinely believe that Ray wanted to work with them. He loved their concept and (at least the movie portrays) was diligent to their model early on. But Dick's refusal to renegotiate probably cost them in the long run. He really set up the us vs. them mentality between the parties.

I found this article on the McDonald's IPO from Investopedia.

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/120215/if-you-had-invested-right-after-mcdonalds-ipo.asp

If my math holds up. If each of Mac and Dick had invested half of their $1m take home into McDonald's IPO, that investment would now be worth nearly $2 billion to each of their estates having paid $52,877,500 in dividends (which seems low - I think Investopedia's number is off on that, since they say up thread the shares are currently paying $60,000/year in dividends versus the $243,900 LTD dividends to close the article. Even with hikes, that number likely would have been exceeded over just the past 10 years.)

The movie definitely dragged in the middle, Laura Dern and Linda Cardellini's characters were pretty shallow. Thankfully his assistant was well constructed. I did enjoy seeing Nick Offerman do something different thoguh.

[Hanahope]

Still Ray was a real asshole to open a McDonalds right across the street from the original and put the brothers out of business 

[MisterGlass]

Finally caught this on Netflix.  I didn't know much of the story beforehand, though I vaguely knew of Ray Kroc.  It was well made and a bit brutal to watch near the end.  Michael Keaton played Ray well, from industrious but hard luck case at the beginning to shark and conniver at the end.  I quite enjoyed and empathized with Nick Offerman's Dick MacDonald.

The most offensive thing Ray Kroc did was not cheating the brother's out of their money.  It was stealing their identity and their work.  He took their ideas and their name, and almost erased their contribution to, not just MacDonalds, but history.

It gave a me a little relief when the end title reminded me that Joan gave away so much of their money.

[jah1986]

I'm glad I finally caught this on Netflix.  Michael Keaton was wonderful, although I wound up not liking his character by the end. I also didn't know a lot of the history but like others felt worse for the brothers losing their identity and even their name.  They did receive a nice check for the times they were living in but the fact that they had to remove their own name from their restaurant was just sad.  And that Ray Kroc took credit for their ideas just made me mad.

I'm glad we didn't have to see any more of Joan leaving her husband for Ray, it was painful enough watching Ray tell Ethel (?) he wanted a divorce after passing the salt, the guy was just ruthless.

But well acted by everyone involved.

[Kel Varnsen]

On 2/20/2017 at 2:52 AM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

I just don't buy that they trusted Kroc on a handshake to give them any equity.   They were very sure to force Kroc into an onerous and ironclad contract at the outset.  They saw what he was becoming.  And we are to believe they thought a handshake was worth something?  Puh-leeeeze.

 

According to the Wikipedia entry on McDonald's the story about the handshake deal can't really be confirmed, since the person who revealed it was a decedent of one of the brothers who wasn't at the actual meeting.  That said if it did happen I am totally picturing the brothers like George Bluth and saying "I have the worst fucking attorneys".

On 9/3/2017 at 11:48 PM, MisterGlass said:

The most offensive thing Ray Kroc did was not cheating the brother's out of their money.  It was stealing their identity and their work.  He took their ideas and their name, and almost erased their contribution to, not just MacDonalds, but history.

Even if the handshake deal thing didn't happen, not letting the brothers keep their original location as a McDonald's franchise was pretty cold blooded. Although I guess that would hurt his history he created that his McDonald's was the first one.

On 1/22/2017 at 7:15 PM, snickers said:

I've been waiting for Hollywood to make a movie about Ray Kroc...he was cutthroat alright, but brilliant.....

I am not sure he was brilliant, cutthroat like you said, persistent like the movie said, and incredibly lucky. Had BJ Novak not been in the bank at the time the bank would have foreclosed on him and he would have never figured out how to leverage land. Had the bible salesman not come to his office he might not have thought to sell to family types instead of rich jerks. And had his shake machines not been sold to McDonald's he would have never seen their system in the first place.

Overall it was an interesting story.  My big complaint, as with a lot of bio pics is they don't give you a good idea of how much time has passed. Some dates on the screen or at least some real life historical references would have been helpful. It would also have been interesting to know what happened to those first franchises he sold to his club friends. Did he take back there franchises for selling chicken?

[Stenbeck]

Just saw this on Netflix...and.... I don't think I ever want to eat at a McDonald's again.

WOW. I'm a bit shell shocked at how Kroc took the business especially their! name! from the brothers. 

When the deal was signed and the verbal agreement was made, you could tell the brother's attorney opposed the deal and even one of them knew Kroc would not uphold that end of the agreement.

Excellent performance from Michael Keaton. Laura Linney was just there...but I guess her performance is in tune to what was expected from a housewife at the time. 

[jah1986]

1 hour ago, Stenbeck said:

Excellent performance from Michael Keaton. Laura Linney was just there...but I guess her performance is in tune to what was expected from a housewife at the time. 

I think you mean Laura Dern.