S04.E01: The Jinger Gown

GeeGolly · January 17, 2017

In the car business, more often in new car sales, a dealer will call on another dealer for a car that they don't have in stock. Usually the customer isn't even aware this is happening. Maybe the DC dress shop did the same for Jinger and called Renee for a dress that was close to what she wanted? And maybe the DC shop owner didn't want to give the false impression to future customers that she 'designs' dresses? I think the Duggars include having folks make money from being on their show as part of their 'ministry'. They did this a lot with the Bates prior to them having their own show. However most of this would have had to happen prior to filming so the TLC crew did some fancy footwork to make this episode happen.

I have to finish the episode; I fell asleep in between the 2nd & 3rd dress, well I think it was in between because my eyes were already closed when I heard them say dress #3 two different times and I figured that was the before commercials tease and the after commercials tease.

Barb23 · January 17, 2017

I'm being petty here. Why didn't Jinge wear her hair up or at least pulled back in a ponytail while trying on the gowns? That mop had to be in the way buttoning up the back & it showed. Jill's black flip-flops also drove me nuts. We know she's not into fashion but a decent pair of shoes or sandals would have looked nicer. Guess it was better than bare feet. MEchelle dresses up by throwing on some pearls.

How many of these painting places do we have to endure? Give us something new TLC. Benessa & the Dullards have already done it. Amy Roloff just did it. At least Amy & friends got to drink during theirs. Ben really thought he painted the Mona Lisa didn't he?

I think the dress should have been named "The Babe."

Edited January 17, 2017 by Barb23

lulu69 · January 17, 2017

7 hours ago, Marigold said:

I don't find selecting a dress worth an entire episode. It's just not interesting ESPECIALLY since we saw the wedding.

I'm also not a wedding person.

I hate to be the one to point this out. TLC previously devoted an entire episode to Jill's wedding party choosing shoes. Not even dresses, just shoes. The yawn fest has only begun.

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

1 hour ago, lulu69 said:

I hate to be the one to point this out. TLC previously devoted an entire episode to Jill's wedding party choosing shoes. Not even dresses, just shoes. The yawn fest has only begun.

No worries...I'm sure that will be covered next week. No doubt the foot fetishists would have been all over that...

Damn, Muffy, flip flops, really? And not even a decent pair? That frumpy A line skirt made her look bigger than she is....did her no favors. At least put on a pair of Teva sandals for some foot and ankle support, Muffy. Derick introduced her to those and they do make a difference. She must have noticed they are way better than a dollar store flip flop.

dccfan37 · January 17, 2017

10 hours ago, Fuzzysox said:

Jinger is getting married!

Wow, precious, getting married, moving away, wow, precious, Jinger is moving away from us. Pretty much sums up the whole episode.

Oh, I enjoyed Renee throwing shade on the ring, saying he didn't do great on the ring but did great on the girl! OMG bless her heart.

He said "he didn't only do great with the ring but he did great with the girl"

tabloidlover · January 17, 2017

10 hours ago, flyingdi said:

Does the bridal designer remind anyone else of Cheryl Hines?

She reminded me of Judy from Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders (until she started talking).

laurakaye · January 17, 2017

14 hours ago, BitterApple said:

It really is. A wedding dress shopping trip for a wedding that took place on the show several months ago. Have the producers just completely give up on life or what?

I saw the episode title and had to really think - whose freaking wedding did I just watch a couple of months ago?! Are the TLC editors laughing at the sneaky way they can draw viewers by sweeping film segments from the cutting room floor and randomly gluing them back together?

9 hours ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

Something is off about Jilly Muffin. Even when she smiles or laughs, she still looks so sad. She really does look like a sad limpet.

Untreated depression. She knows the mechanics and timing of how and when to smile, there's just no true emotion behind it. The worst part is even if her dimwit husband or moronic parents notice the change in her, nothing will be done to help her. It's treatable, and I feel sad that no one will probably ever care enough about her to let her get some help...because admitting it would be akin to admitting that their lifestyle has failed her.

Fuzzysox · January 17, 2017

1 hour ago, dccfan37 said:

He said "he didn't only do great with the ring but he did great with the girl"

Oh I thought Ms. Perky Perky said the opposite.

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

43 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

Untreated depression. She knows the mechanics and timing of how and when to smile, there's just no true emotion behind it. The worst part is even if her dimwit husband or moronic parents notice the change in her, nothing will be done to help her. It's treatable, and I feel sad that no one will probably ever care enough about her to let her get some help...because admitting it would be akin to admitting that their lifestyle has failed her.

Yeah, everything about her is rictus and wooden. Between PPD after a difficult birth and the shame of a long buried secret being made public knowledge, it's hardly surprising to anyone that she lost her shit.

Less than that would have done most people in and had them get a Rx. Michelle is medicated to the hilt, but I guess only the brood mare gets help. They can't judge Jill for it, then. I call bullshit on that. My heart hurts that she's suffering and they won't get her the help she needs, she fears condemnation for seeking it.

Fuzzysox · January 17, 2017

1 hour ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

No worries...I'm sure that will be covered next week. No doubt the foot fetishists would have been all over that...

Damn, Muffy, flip flops, really? And not even a decent pair? That frumpy A line skirt made her look bigger than she is....did her no favors. At least put on a pair of Teva sandals for some foot and ankle support, Muffy. Derick introduced her to those and they do make a difference. She must have noticed they are way better than a dollar store flip flop.

The Duggar girls have no clue how to dress for social situations. They don't seem to care what they look like. The Bates are always better dressed and clean looking.

And a bwahahaha on Jessa and Jinger showing us their "fashion sense." Looked like thin cheap crap from the clearance rack at Walmart. (oh and did Jessa steal Jill's famous maxi skirt for that brief segment?)

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

6 minutes ago, Fuzzysox said:

The Duggar girls have no clue how to dress for social situations. They don't seem to care what they look like. The Bates are always better dressed and clean looking.

And a bwahahaha on Jessa and Jinger showing us their "fashion sense." Looked like thin cheap crap from the clearance rack at Walmart. (oh and did Jessa steal Jill's famous maxi skirt for that brief segment?)

I zapped thru that part...using Duggar and fashion sense in the same sentence never ends well. I feared a Mustard Cardigan sighting.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

3 hours ago, lulu69 said:

I hate to be the one to point this out. TLC previously devoted an entire episode to Jill's wedding party choosing shoes. Not even dresses, just shoes. The yawn fest has only begun.

I guess lingerie won't be happening?

Jordan Baker · January 17, 2017

8 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I guess lingerie won't be happening?

You have to watch Sister Wives for that. :)

And, yes, "drawLing" made my ears bleed every time the "designer" said it.

Having been dress shopping for myself (back in the Dark Ages) and more recently for my daughter, I would never have made it through this experience. How many times did the designer talk about which dress was in Jinger's heart? And she was all over Jinger, or so it seemed. I'd have backed up right through the front door.

I wish I could quit this show, but the snark here is too good.

January 17, 2017

omg the girls hanging onto the guys before leaving them...if it was my husband I'd give them a quick kiss and then leave. I want my alone time and I'm sure they want some guy time.

sheshark · January 17, 2017

Cute vid of Izzy doing a 'fake run' to Chariots of Fire. Between his untied shoelaces and the wires on the floor, it's a good thing he isn't 'real running'. Oh, Jill, you are the absolute worst about video chronicling your kid. Danger lurks.

Edited January 17, 2017 by sheshark

BitterApple · January 17, 2017

1 hour ago, Fuzzysox said:

The Duggar girls have no clue how to dress for social situations. They don't seem to care what they look like. The Bates are always better dressed and clean looking.

Case in point, Diana Vuolo in her stylish summer dress and sandals contrasted with the Duggars in their finest frumpwear. I'll give Jessa a pass because she's preggers, but the rest of them looked a scraggly mess.

The whole episode was a snooze fest minus Jessa nearly bursting into flames when she told the camera she was happy Jinger was getting a custom dress.

BitterApple · January 17, 2017

34 minutes ago, heatherrrrz said:

omg the girls hanging onto the guys before leaving them...if it was my husband I'd give them a quick kiss and then leave. I want my alone time and I'm sure they want some guy time.

That was such a ridiculous pissing contest between the two couples. "We love each other more!" "No, WE do!!!" "My husband can't bear to be without me!" "Well, mine can't either!!! (cue to competitive makeout sessions on busy city street). It reminded me of the frenemy love saga of Joshley Madison and TFDW.

Edited January 17, 2017 by BitterApple

birkenstock · January 17, 2017

The show did a good job making dress shopping boring. It was three versions of the same dress. Jinger had already chosen her dress, the trip was just to finalize sleeve and train length and lace style. If they're going to fake scenes at least make it interesting and show her in different types of dresses. I think one of the reasons it was in the D.C. area dress shop was that Jeremy's parents were able to drive down and meet them. Easier to coordinate travel around them since the Pensacola dress lady would fly anywhere to be showcased.

Ben is going to miss Jinger as much as Jessa is. Jinger gives him more onscreen affirmation than Jessa. I actually smiled when she called him Benji. He looked so proud showing everyone his coffee painting.

BitterApple · January 17, 2017

20 minutes ago, birkenstock said:

Ben is going to miss Jinger as much as Jessa is. Jinger gives him more onscreen affirmation than Jessa. I actually smiled when she called him Benji. He looked so proud showing everyone his coffee painting.

Ok, I'm glad I'm not the only one who peeped that. When Bin was showing off his painting he reminded me of a shy schoolboy presenting a flower to his crush. Every time I've seen him interact with Jinger there's something there. I don't mean it in the sense that they'd cross a line or do something inappropriate but there's always an aura of "what if...." between them.

sigmaforce86 · January 17, 2017

The best part about that dress shopping was watching Me'Chelle. She could not have been more checked out - Jinger goes to try on the dress; "Mom you come too, help me out". Me'Chelle - thousand yard stare in a different direction. Jessa - "Mom she wants you to help her". Michelle FINALLY wakes up, looks at her daughter (you know Michelle, the one you're actually there for) and it still takes a couple beats for her to get up and go to the dressing room. The ever lasting question - is she on meds or just deranged? (both?)

Absolom · January 17, 2017

13 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

She may be emotionally spent, but her cooter can still spit out a gazillionty blessings if she can VBAC like her mummy.

Personally I'm hoping for another section for Jill and the OB taking Derick aside and telling him that if he loves his wife it's time to stop the baby factory NOW. She isn't emotionally or intellectually able to handle a horde of children.

The Pensacola "dress designer" going to the DC area was a very interesting take off especially since Jinger had already selected the dress. Maybe it was so the Vuolos could more easily be there.

Edited January 17, 2017 by Absolom

gunderda · January 17, 2017

15 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Okay, I've been reading the FJ snark. How could Renee the designer have three dresses "designed" for Jinger, and flown up from Florida? (from context, it sounds like she was in VA and no trip to FLA was made). Jinger was only engaged a week. Sounds like she was planning with them months ahead (I still maintain that they started courting sometimes in April), but I still maintain that they pulled this Renee person out of their asses due to Jenni Hartono. How else do you get someone totally unrelated to "design" three dresses for you if they weren't already the intended designer?

Rats, I smell them.

I was so confused!! we went from her not knowing what she wanted, to the designer telling her they were going to design her dress there, ON THE SPOT, to showing Jinger some drawings of dress ideas, to the dresses magically appearing... So the "Jinger" will look identical to 2 other dresses. Nice.

BitterApple · January 17, 2017

42 minutes ago, gunderda said:

I was so confused!! we went from her not knowing what she wanted, to the designer telling her they were going to design her dress there, ON THE SPOT, to showing Jinger some drawings of dress ideas, to the dresses magically appearing... So the "Jinger" will look identical to 2 other dresses. Nice.

It made no sense at all. A "designer" isn't going to waste thousands of dollars in material and man hours creating three dresses, two of which the bride will never wear, just to have options for a buying trip. It was pretty obvious the third dress had been in the works for some time and Jinger was just there to see it in person and decide what sort of adjustments she wanted. The other two were grabbed off the rack. But they needed to fill an hour so we get a fake SYTTD episode.

Edited January 17, 2017 by BitterApple

Marigold · January 17, 2017

48 minutes ago, sigmaforce86 said:

The best part about that dress shopping was watching Me'Chelle. She could not have been more checked out - Jinger goes to try on the dress; "Mom you come too, help me out". Me'Chelle - thousand yard stare in a different direction. Jessa - "Mom she wants you to help her". Michelle FINALLY wakes up, looks at her daughter (you know Michelle, the one you're actually there for) and it still takes a couple beats for her to get up and go to the dressing room. The ever lasting question - is she on meds or just deranged? (both?)

Fundamentalists typically do not do any psychiatry due to the history of it being demonic, or so they believe. I think I posted a link somewhere on this forum. One of the main reasons I left the IFB is their twisted view of mental health.

I know people think Michelle is completely medicated and acts so out of it.

I think she NEEDS medication and is not given any and that's why she is so bizarre. Medication should be helping her and we have seen Michelle go from a bit kooky on her THs to downright checked out and in bad shape.

My opinion is that she never properly recovered from Jubilee...she never was allowed to grieve due to the belief that "all things happen for the good". She had to smile and recite Bible verses even though her heart was broken. Jim Bob with his stupid smile blathering on about Jubilee is heaven when that's all you want is your child here on earth. We know that she has 19 kids already but that is not how Michelle feels. She must've been devastated. Then came the Josh scandals and I'm sure that was a horror for her and Jim Bob. Of course, it is their fault but from her point of view? That must have crushed her.

Michelle needs psychiatric help and hasn't gotten any. She is told to pray harder and submit to God's will more. My guess is she is not functioning and that is why Jana stays. She feels her mother is sick and is loyal to taking care of Michelle...just as many of us would help out if (God forbid) our mother/husband/sister/brother etc got a serious illness. Maybe Jana is the only one who actually realizes Michelle is not well at all. jana is one of the sharper Duggars and who knows what she thinks? Maybe she has done googling and realizes michelle is very depressed or whatever. Jim Bob is a goofball and the other Duggar girls are busy with curling their hair, courting, wedding gowns and babies...they might not realize or have the intelligence to realize.

Michelle looks progressively worse and worse throughout the years. She was always kooky but that is Michelle. Last night she looked out of it. It's almost like she is distancing herself from reality...

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

5 minutes ago, Marigold said:

Michelle looks progressively worse and worse throughout the years. She was always kooky but that is Michelle. Last night she looked out of it. It's almost like she is distancing herself from reality...

It's entirely possible that she's so out of it that we think she's overmedicated, when this is how she's had to adapt to cope. 19 kids would render the sanest, most organized person into a raving looney in no time flat. I have often believed that Michelle carried a lot of guilt over Josie as well as her heart was broken over Jubilee. Then if that wasn't enough, being public paragons of high moral standards and public backlash from Josh's sins, and the shame of having ones dirty laundry on every page of the tabloids...though they rightly deserved some of the backlash, Michelle was already toast before then.

Jana and JD both know Momma is not well at all and that Josie needs extra care she's not getting but there's always too much to do.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

Look at the difference between Josh's wedding and Jinger's wedding. (I type for work so I put all different Youtubes on to keep me company. I recently played Josh's wedding and the difference was shocking)

with Josh, she was decorating the church, laughing, smiling and was part of the whole thing. Jinger's wedding? She was all wacko with Josie's crown and just stood around, people needed to guide her. Her expression was void. A forced smile but very out of it. Jim Bob was acting normally but Michelle was just disconnected. Putting on Jinger's veil was a big deal for her.

Michelle has really come unglued. You can really see how the emotional abuse of this insane cult like mentality has affected her.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

http://www.awmi.net/reading/teaching-articles/psychology_christianity/

I skimmed this and I have no idea who this guy is. Just posted to give a point of view. If you google, there are tons of articles like this.

I doubt Michelle is drugged up. Jim Bob would never, ever put Michelle on medication. No way.

I think michelle has disconnected in order to survive. Maybe someone with mental health training can expand on that thought? What do you call that? Dissociation?

yogi2014L · January 17, 2017

1 hour ago, Absolom said:

Personally I'm hoping for another section for Jill and the OB taking Derick aside and telling him that if he loves his wife it's time to stop the baby factory NOW. She isn't emotionally or intellectually able to handle a horde of children.

The Pensacola "dress designer" going to the DC area was a very interesting take off especially since Jinger had already selected the dress. Maybe it was so the Vuolos could more easily be there.

Jesus himself could appear and tell them to use a freaking condom and they wouldn't listen.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

6 minutes ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

It's entirely possible that she's so out of it that we think she's overmedicated, when this is how she's had to adapt to cope. 19 kids would render the sanest, most organized person into a raving looney in no time flat. I have often believed that Michelle carried a lot of guilt over Josie as well as her heart was broken over Jubilee. Then if that wasn't enough, being public paragons of high moral standards and public backlash from Josh's sins, and the shame of having ones dirty laundry on every page of the tabloids...though they rightly deserved some of the backlash, Michelle was already toast before then.

Jana and JD both know Momma is not well at all and that Josie needs extra care she's not getting but there's always too much to do.

I agree 1000%.

Josie, Jubilee and then Josh.

That really was a lot to handle with no support system other than reciting Bible verses.

I left IFB after my mom died and I was told that "If you're grieving, you can't be saved"

My church was IFB lite.!!! Women went to secular colleges. I can't even IMAGINE this Gothard crap that they got mixed up in and how damaged Michelle is.

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

5 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I agree 1000%.

Josie, Jubilee and then Josh.

That really was a lot to handle with no support system other than reciting Bible verses.

I left IFB after my mom died and I was told that "If you're grieving, you can't be saved"

My church was IFB lite.!!! Women went to secular colleges. I can't even IMAGINE this Gothard crap that they got mixed up in and how damaged Michelle is.

Yes, just one of those would be a lot for anyone to deal with, but not all 3.

So sad someone told you that while you were down. Maybe that's what makes the experience at an IFB church, even a lite one, so varied. Because they're so independent, there's no uniform code of conduct on how to treat parishioners who are facing life events. Attacking your profession of faith when you're down? Glad you decided to leave after that, because that would have run me off as well.

No, you are right...I CANNOT even fathom the misery Gothard heaps on those whose lives are less than perfect. Just how they treat sexual assault and molestation victims should be warning enough to run far, far away.

bigskygirl · January 17, 2017

Hmmm...I do not know if Michelle was feeling guilty over Josie because, imo, she was lapping up the attention she was receiving after Josie was born like a thirsty dog lapping water on a hot summer day. She has to be the center of attention no matter what. To be honest about it, I would not be surprise if she was having some sort of mental health issues before JB came down the turnpike. The scary thing is JB and Michelle were ripe for the Gothard pickings. He knew a couple of suckers when he saw them. She should not have kept having kids right and left if she was having a nervous breakdown in the laundry room. And if she did not want to deal with the shame of what Josh did, she should have not jump on the TLC famewhore bandwagon because anyone with half a brain would have figure out sooner or later the scandals were going to hit the fan. I feel bad for her because she does seem to have some form of a mental illness, but I do not feel bad for her because her own children are suffering because she chose this type of life for herself. The chickens have come home to roost for the Duggars, and it ain't pretty.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

13 minutes ago, bigskygirl said:

Hmmm...I do not know if Michelle was feeling guilty over Josie because, imo, she was lapping up the attention she was receiving after Josie was born like a thirsty dog lapping water on a hot summer day. She has to be the center of attention no matter what. To be honest about it, I would not be surprise if she was having some sort of mental health issues before JB came down the turnpike. The scary thing is JB and Michelle were ripe for the Gothard pickings. He knew a couple of suckers when he saw them. She should not have kept having kids right and left if she was having a nervous breakdown in the laundry room. And if she did not want to deal with the shame of what Josh did, she should have not jump on the TLC famewhore bandwagon because anyone with half a brain would have figure out sooner or later the scandals were going to hit the fan. I feel bad for her because she does seem to have some form of a mental illness, but I do not feel bad for her because her own children are suffering because she chose this type of life for herself. The chickens have come home to roost for the Duggars, and it ain't pretty.

I think Jim Bob and Michelle just repressed reality.

These fools never really processed what Josh did and how horrible it was for the girls. Jill even blew it off on the Megyn show...talking about how this happened all the time. Huh???? Guess that's what they told themselves to deal with their hell child, Josh. It was no big deal, right? Happens all the time.

Plus, TLC offered money and it is obvious that the Duggars needed money.

I feel sorry for all of them but then, like you, I don't. (except the little ones, we all feel sorry for them)

bigskygirl · January 17, 2017

I always hope one of the kids would break free and have a happy normal life. I also would love to read a tell all book, but I am sure there are some things about the Duggars I really do not want to know.

Now back to the subject at hand...Jinger reminds me a little of Jill with the giggle, giggle of teenage girl with her first boyfriend playing house. I sometimes feel like I am watching a junior high romance when it comes to Jill/Derick and Jinger/Jeremy. And why are they showing the wedding prep work after the wedding episode.

DangerousMinds · January 17, 2017

2 hours ago, Absolom said:

Personally I'm hoping for another section for Jill and the OB taking Derick aside and telling him that if he loves his wife it's time to stop the baby factory NOW. She isn't emotionally or intellectually able to handle a horde of children.

The Pensacola "dress designer" going to the DC area was a very interesting take off especially since Jinger had already selected the dress. Maybe it was so the Vuolos could more easily be there.

I'm not married, but do brides usually drag along both sides of the family to dress shop? I would hate that.

January 17, 2017

11 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

I'm not married, but do brides usually drag along both sides of the family to dress shop? I would hate that.

Some do, some don't. Usually brides take the mom and girl siblings. Sometimes they invite the mother of the groom along too.

awaken · January 17, 2017

3 hours ago, birkenstock said:

Ben is going to miss Jinger as much as Jessa is. Jinger gives him more onscreen affirmation than Jessa. I actually smiled when she called him Benji. He looked so proud showing everyone his coffee painting.

This is a profound, and somewhat heartbreaking thought! They do really seem to have a connection and I'm sure they all miss having each other around. (All the more reason for Jer to hurry up and plant a new church in AR so they can all be back together!)

1 hour ago, Marigold said:

Fundamentalists typically do not do any psychiatry due to the history of it being demonic, or so they believe. I think I posted a link somewhere on this forum. One of the main reasons I left the IFB is their twisted view of mental health.

I know people think Michelle is completely medicated and acts so out of it.

I think she NEEDS medication and is not given any and that's why she is so bizarre.  Medication should be helping her and we have seen Michelle go from a bit kooky on her THs to downright checked out and in bad shape.

My opinion is that she never properly recovered from Jubilee...she never was allowed to grieve due to the belief that "all things happen for the good". She had to smile and recite Bible verses even though her heart was broken. Jim Bob with his stupid smile blathering on about Jubilee is heaven when that's all you want is your child here on earth.   We know that she has 19 kids already but that is not how Michelle feels. She must've been devastated.   Then came the Josh scandals and I'm sure that was a horror for her and Jim Bob. Of course, it is their fault but from her point of view? That must have crushed her.

Michelle needs psychiatric help and hasn't gotten any. She is told to pray harder and submit to God's will more. My guess is she is not functioning and that is why Jana stays. She feels her mother is sick and is loyal to taking care of Michelle...just as many of us would help out if (God forbid) our mother/husband/sister/brother etc got a serious illness.  Maybe Jana is the only one who actually realizes Michelle is not well at all. jana is one of the sharper Duggars and who knows what she thinks? Maybe she has done googling and realizes michelle is very depressed or whatever. Jim Bob is a goofball and the other Duggar girls are busy with curling their hair, courting, wedding gowns and babies...they might not realize or have the intelligence to realize.

Michelle looks progressively worse and worse throughout the years. She was always kooky but that is Michelle. Last night she looked out of it. It's almost like she is distancing herself from reality...

1 hour ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

It's entirely possible that she's so out of it that we think she's overmedicated, when this is how she's had to adapt to cope. 19 kids would render the sanest, most organized person into a raving looney in no time flat. I have often believed that Michelle carried a lot of guilt over Josie as well as her heart was broken over Jubilee. Then if that wasn't enough, being public paragons of high moral standards and public backlash from Josh's sins, and the shame of having ones dirty laundry on every page of the tabloids...though they rightly deserved some of the backlash, Michelle was already toast before then.

Jana and JD both know Momma is not well at all and that Josie needs extra care she's not getting but there's always too much to do.

I 100% agree. I have always doubted that she is drugged up; rather, that she very much is in need of some helpful medication and therapy. Going on with life after any one of those traumatic events, even WITH family, medical, and counseling help can be crushing for a person, and they may be changed and deal with the fallout from it for life. Imagine what she has had to do in order to continue to survive without the true help she needs. I would be disassociating and acting strange, as well. Unfortunately I see a lot of similarities with what Jill has been through, and how she may end up, not having received the help and care she needs to process all that has happened to her in the past few years (and derick, too). So I have always had a bit of sympathy for Michelle. She needs help.

Marigold · January 17, 2017

I think Jinger was doing a "Say Yes to the Dress" type of show. Boooring....

They should get to the good stuff... Why is Derick puking? And what does Jeremy's tat say? Do the Vuolos really hate the Duggars or are they just quiet people?

Edited January 17, 2017 by Marigold

Squirrely · January 17, 2017

So that wasn't the same dress all 3 times? I would have sworn it was. Lol

I'm so happy I've escaped wedding dress shopping, despite having been in several, and having been a bride myself (my wedding was very casual). If that's your thing more power to you, but there are few places I want to be less than a bridal shop.

Was Anna in the wedding? I can't remember. I felt bad that she wasn't included there. Guess she probably couldn't leave the smallest baby M and they certainly couldn't have included Josh in the daddy ice cream snooze fest.

I'm going to be using the FF button liberally this season, I can see. Which is nothing new, I suppose.

gunderda · January 17, 2017

14 minutes ago, Squirrely said:

Was Anna in the wedding? I can't remember.

yep. I forgot she was until Jinger was naming off her bridesmaids and said "Joy.... Anna...." and at first i'm like huh, what? It's Joy Anna one person? (cause that's Joy's full name right?) and then it clicked. I totally forgot about Anna!

Adeejay · January 17, 2017

I was surprised that no one corrected Jinger when she kept saying that Jessa was going to be the "maid of honor". Jessa is a married woman and should be referred to as the "matron of honor".

I thought it interesting that Spurgeon was described as, "jovial, happy and amiable" while Izzy was described as "stoic and determined".

GeeGolly · January 17, 2017

The video of Izzy above, IMHO, is an example of how parents, myself including, think their kid is the cutest/funniest/smartest. It was a very unremarkable video.

Jinger reminded me a lot of Michelle with her facial expressions, manufactured appreciation & sweetness, need to respond to anything said to her and her altered voice. With that said I think Jeremy is the winner of all who married into the family.

Michelle presents with a flat affect which can be signs of depression, schizophrenia, side effects of some medications or being over medicated.

Arwen Evenstar · January 17, 2017

7 hours ago, sheshark said:

Cute vid of Izzy doing a 'fake run' to Chariots of Fire. Between his untied shoelaces and the wires on the floor, it's a good thing he isn't 'real running'. Oh, Jill, you are the absolute worst about video chronicling your kid. Danger lurks.

OMG, they're training him to do interpretive dance!

Fuzzysox · January 18, 2017

45 minutes ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

OMG, they're training him to do interpretive dance!

If Derick gets any skinnier, Izzy can jump right in because he'll have more energy than Derick. And now the horse and pony show can go on just featuring The Giant White Baby teaching us about JESUS!

louannems · January 18, 2017

I didn't appreciate the fact that Jill kept whispering to Izzy, "Do it. Do it!". Leave the kid alone!

On the laptop, they had up Ideas For Worship. I guess Derick gives sermons now, too?

Have they even seen the movie Chariots of Fire?

Marigold · January 18, 2017

Izzy is cute but that video wasn't anything special.

At least he didn't injure himself...

woodscommaelle · January 18, 2017

When the designer asked who was in charge of the train and it was Jana, she (Jana) made sure Joy knew she wasn't doing this shit alone. Three other bridesmaids were GOING to help. Hah! Go Jana.

I think Ben was either embarrassed or shocked/surprised when Jessa said her taking the kids for a drive was selfish (bc she didn't want to paint). Or he was thinking 'what.a.bitch.'

I had to stop watching for a few minutes. Jeremy's dad reminded me of mine (religions aside though). He just seemed so kind and gentle. A sensitive soul. That was just like my dad. And he LOOKED like him too. ?

When Jessa and jinger had their little fashion commercial...was jinger's favorite the outfit she was wearing when Jeremy proposed?

Each wedding dress looked exactly the same to me. Also, I would never want my dress to be described as 'cute.'

Was Jessa always so nasally? She sounds so stuffed up...just like Ben. Allergies? Maybe I just never noticed.

Edited January 18, 2017 by woodscommaelle

leighdear · January 18, 2017

23 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Seriously, I guess they found the dress on Renee's website, but the trip was already booked for VA. Cheaper to fly her to VA than all of them to Florida. I knew there was a catch in this episode, based on what I knew.

The posse never came here to Pensacola for the dress selection. Renee's shop isn't the one they were filmed in, as she flew up to Virginia with a selection of dresses. The shop owner there is a friend of hers.

And now, Renee is knee-deep in Mardi Gras dresses, so now is when she's really making her money. She got a little attention for the Dugger party, but those cheap, mass produced gowns are nothing compared to the serious glitzy gowns she has to produce for the women in the Mardi Gras Crewes.

zenme · January 18, 2017

Did anyone else see the suitcase Jinger packed for her trip? She had a pair of what appeared to be stinky looking huaraches in there. They looked like they had been purchased from Goodwill already heavily worn. What are they now? Third hand huaraches? In any case, I hope Babe ups Jinger's thrift store budget, cause girlfriend needs help.

woodscommaelle · January 18, 2017

I have to defend Jill for a sec. I will wear flip flops for many occasions so I saw nothing wrong with her choice of shoes. It's my first choice too. I thought they were totally acceptable for dress shopping.

Edited January 18, 2017 by woodscommaelle

woodscommaelle · January 18, 2017

On 1/16/2017 at 7:22 PM, GinnyM said:

Drawling

Is that a thing? I've literally never heard that word before.

Designer lady sounds just as nutso as Michelle. And sadly so does Jinger.

Was Jessa snarking on Jinger's train? Cause that was awesome.

Edited January 18, 2017 by woodscommaelle

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S04.E01: The Jinger Gown

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