S01.E01: Doll 123/ S01.E02: Ladies In Waiting

[Tara Ariano]

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Episode 1: Upon the death of King William IV, his 18-year-old niece, Princess Alexandrina Victoria of Kent, inherits the throne as Queen, and finds herself tested by new responsibilities and conflicted loyalties.

Episode 2: As Lord Melbourne's popularity in the House wanes, the Tories eagerly await triumph, while Victoria's uncle, the Duke of Cumberland, sees a chance to prey on her vulnerability and establish a co-regency.

[Primetimer]

Jenna Coleman is done being a companion. Is she ready to rule?

View the full article

[Catri]

Having watched the UK airing, I would recommend watching it, even if just for the beautiful theme music.

[skyways]

Not just the music. It's a really good show.

[janeta]

Does Rufus Sewell EVER age??

[ChlcGirl]

4 minutes ago, janeta said:

Does Rufus Sewell EVER age??

I believe there is a Dorian Gray thing going with him.

[prican58]

I'm digging it. Ever since Downton I have tried to watch as much of this kind of stuff as possible. I've always loved these British dramas.

[fourPLUSseven]

Juicy, historically accurate, gripping. Well done.

The choice of Melbourne as PM certainly changed the history of England.

[Straycat80]

Beautiful scenery and music. This will fill the void Downton Abbey left. I like the drama of the upstairs/downstairs too. The actress playing Victoria looks like she's twelve years old. 

[prican58]

Rufus always reminds me of Ian McShane.

[HoodlumSheep]

Hardcore shipping Victoria and Melbourne, despite the fact that it's guranteed my heart is going to get ripped out and trodden on. Holy smokes, the chemistry! Darn, you history!!!!! *shakes fist*

Also, Victoria just needs to straight-up banish half her staff to the shadowland. Like, seriously. Why hasn't she sent that evil royal advisor packing?

Chef Gusteau (I know that's not his real name, but all I can think of is Ratatouille when I see him) is one of my faves besides Victoria and Melbourne. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

Loving the costumes!  What a huge responsibility to have thrust on her shoulders at that age and all these people trying to manipulate her.

She certainly had an awful mother.

[LittleIggy]

1 hour ago, prican58 said:

Rufus always reminds me of Ian McShane.

I've always thought they could play father and son! I'm loving Rufus as Melbourne. I've adored Rufus since "Middlemarch," and he never disappoints.

[Brn2bwild]

I like this so far.  Not as lavish as The Crown, but I'm a nut for all things Victorian.  Some observations:

1. The actress who plays Victoria, of course was much prettier than the real Queen Victoria, but she does bear a passing resemblance to her daughter, Victoria the Princess Royal.

2.

Spoiler

In real life, Victoria lurrrved dancing with Tsarevich Alexander (later Alexander II)!  She was swept away by him, making me wonder if, in some alternate reality where Victoria had a brother, she might have married Alexander and become Empress of Russia.

3. Interesting to see rural versions of the roads passing by Buckingham Palace.

4.

Spoiler

Lord Melbourne was 40 years older and more of a father figure than the hot match they seem to be trying for here (and in The Young Victoria).

Overall, I thought it was pretty well done and look forward to more.

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tags added

[jumper sage]

On 16/01/2017 at 3:55 AM, fourPLUSseven said:

Juicy, historically accurate, gripping. Well done.

The choice of Melbourne as PM certainly changed the history of England.

Big fan of Queen Victoria and her relevance in history.  I am so in!

On 16/01/2017 at 6:06 AM, Brn2bwild said:

I like this so far.  Not as lavish as The Crown, but I'm a nut for all things Victorian.  Some observations:

1. The actress who plays Victoria, of course was much prettier than the real Queen Victoria, but she does bear a passing resemblance to her daughter, Victorian the Princess Royal.2.

Spoiler

 

In real life, Victorian lurrrved dancing with Tsarevich Alexander (later Alexander II)!  She was swept away by him, making me wonder if, in some alternate reality where Victoria had a brother, she might have married Alexander and become Empress of Russia.

 

3. Interesting to see rural versions of the roads passing by Buckingham Palace.

4.

Spoiler

Lord Melbourne was 40 years older and more of a father figure than the hot match they seem to be trying for here (and in The Young Victoria).

Overall, I thought it was pretty well done and look forward to more.

I agree with every one of your points.  

Spoiler

There was a reason she allowed her motherless grandchild to marry Nicholas the future Emperor.

I have a historical atlas and loved having it while watching and also doing images on Google.......that's how I read too.

So gossipy, and correctly done, so juicy and so good!

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tags added

[LiveenLetLive]

On 16/01/2017 at 6:06 AM, Brn2bwild said:

I like this so far.  Not as lavish as The Crown, but I'm a nut for all things Victorian.  Some observations:

1. The actress who plays Victoria, of course was much prettier than the real Queen Victoria, but she does bear a passing resemblance to her daughter, Victoria the Princess Royal.

2.

Spoiler

In real life, Victoria lurrrved dancing with Tsarevich Alexander (later Alexander II)!  She was swept away by him, making me wonder if, in some alternate reality where Victoria had a brother, she might have married Alexander and become Empress of Russia.

3. Interesting to see rural versions of the roads passing by Buckingham Palace.

4.

Spoiler

Lord Melbourne was 40 years older and more of a father figure than the hot match they seem to be trying for here (and in The Young Victoria).

Overall, I thought it was pretty well done and look forward to more.

Spoiler

Yes the real Melbourne looked nothing like the swoon worthy Sewell (who is only 20 years older than Coleman and is well preserved on top of that), I sort of hate that they changed the father-daughter aspect into a crush,

but I am also a nut for Victoria and enjoyed the first episode very much. I thought that Coleman did a good job.

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tags added

[Jeebus Cripes]

5 hours ago, HoodlumSheep said:

Hardcore shipping Victoria and Melbourne, despite the fact that it's guranteed my heart is going to get ripped out and trodden on. Holy smokes, the chemistry! Darn, you history!!!!! *shakes fist*

THIS! Good luck trying to get me on board with Albert after watching only one episode. 

[JudyObscure]

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

[pasdetrois]

I'm all over this like white on rice. The first episode was well done - beautiful locations and costumes, fantastic acting by Sewell, and the story moved along.

I was surprised at the implication of Victoria's crush on Melbourne, and I could have done without so much of the Snidely Whiplash characters endlessly plotting to dominate her. I've never gotten the impression from other productions and books that the governess wielded so much power.

I enjoyed seeing the little snippets of real life - the servants selling Victoria's cast-off gloves and used candles. I hadn't heard the Lady Flora story.

[PRgal]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

I'm sure it'll repeat some time?  Then DVR it? 

I knew that Victoria's mother was a b!tch, that Victoria HATED HER and that Victoria, had, by late 20th and 21st century standards, an emotionally abusive childhood (and into early adulthood), but HOOOLLLLLYYYY CRRAAAAAAAAPPPPPPP!!!!!!  I wanted to hug the girl and tell her things would be all right. :(  At least she had her dolls (according to the show, anyway...don't know if she still had them in real life (but I don't see why she didn't - she was pretty much treated like a child) and dog. 

[Suzysite]

I liked this....maybe I wasn't immediately grabbed like I was by The Crown, but we'll see.  

Something that threw me was the opening shot of Jenna with bright blue contact lenses.  I got used to her brown eyes on Doctor Who

[JudyObscure]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

I'm sure it'll repeat some time?  Then DVR it? 

No, for some reason Masterpiece shows almost never repeat, I know because I've waited and watched a long time for certain things.  Can't DVR.  When the cable man came to hook us up to our latest expensive package he unhooked the Magnavox and used its cable for the box.  That Magnavox took about 20 minutes to program anyway, as opposed to the old DVR that took about 2 minutes.  It's a conspiracy to get us to buy the DVD's I tells ya'!

[Nidratime]

Really? I know I benefit from living in the Washington DC area and have access to at least two PBS stations, but our local D.C. station is playing it again today at 4:00 p.m. and in the middle of the night as well. Also the Maryland station is playing it again tonight.

[irisheyes]

3 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

We became one because I missed Hamilton's America. You can be a sustaining member for only $5 a month. I figured getting all the back episodes of Great British Baking Show was worth it!  

I enjoyed it. Didn't draw me in as quickly as I had hoped, but it was enjoyable. Don't buy the book, though, it's like reading the script. It reads more like historical fiction than actual history. 

[Constantinople]

I'm a little dubious about the accuracy of the story involving the Duke of Cumberland / King of Hanover.  

Spoiler

According to Wikipedia, he was in Hanover 8 days after his brother William IV died.

Victoria was horrible to Lady Flora.
 

On 16/01/2017 at 0:35 PM, JudyObscure said:

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

Strange.  I'm able to watch it at http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/episodes/victoria-s1-e1/ without sustaining anything (there are a few "messages from our sponsors", but nothing so plebeian as a commercial).

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tag added

[Arwen Evenstar]

I think Victoria's dislike for Lady Flora had more to do with her dislike of Conroy. Even though her mother was dreadful, Conroy clung to her mother. Her mother and Conroy were complicit in something called the Kensington System, which had to do with the oppressive way Victoria was raised by them.  There's a whole article about it in Wikipedia.

I can only imagine how degrading and shameful that whole ordeal must have been for poor Lady Flora.

[Neurochick]

5 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

Judy, where are you?  I am in NYC and I watched this online just now and I didn't have to pledge anything.

Re:  Lady Flora, she must have known something was wrong with her if she knew she wasn't pregnant.  It looked like she was having a gyn exam.  Embarrassing for a woman at that time.  

Edited January 16, 2017 by Neurochick

[LittleIggy]

5 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I didn't watch it last night because staying up till eleven is impossible for me, this is why I couldn't watch "Indian Summers," either.  Anyway I thought I could watch it online today, but apparently we are no longer able  to do that unless we become a "sustaining member," of PBS for $60. I just recently sent a donation to NPR and now this!

Look for places online to watch it. One begins with Couch...(you didn't hear me say that! ;-)). 

Lord Melbourne was apparently a handsome man, so even if Rufus is younger than he was at the time, he was a good pick to play him.

Wonder why Lady Flora hadn't consulted a doctor herself. That was a mighty big tumor!

[dustoffmom]

Judy, I just got an email from Masterpiece informing where it could be viewed online.  Here is the link I received:  http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/episodes/victoria-s1-e1/?elqTrackId=25562fe9638a45f38e68c2f2ba75bbb9&elq=bef2141061d2428ea00e5755c13ecd68&elqaid=3821&elqat=1&elqCampaignId=1944

[Broken Ox]

1 hour ago, LittleIggy said:

Look for places online to watch it. One begins with Couch...(you didn't hear me say that! ;-)). 

Lord Melbourne was apparently a handsome man, so even if Rufus is younger than he was at the time, he was a good pick to play him.

Wonder why Lady Flora hadn't consulted a doctor herself. That was a mighty big tumor!

According to the Wikipedia article about her, she had been seeing a doctor. Since she wouldn't consult to the exam then either, the doctor also assumed it was a pregnancy but was keeping quiet.

[JudyObscure]

Thanks Dustoffmom and everyone else!  I did manage to watch it and I wouldn't have tried so hard if you hadn't all said it was good.  Loved the beauty of it and the music.  ( My PBS is WOSU and they're very loyal to their regular schedule.)

[ProudMary]

3 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Re:  Lady Flora, she must have known something was wrong with her if she knew she wasn't pregnant.  It looked like she was having a gyn exam.  Embarrassing for a woman at that time.  

It was a gyn exam specifically to determine if her hymen was intact, i.e. a virginity test.  When Victoria was told that Lady Flora had not been "deflowered" she still asked whether or not she was with child and Lord M told her that was not possible, that one precludes the other.  It made me wonder if Lady Flora was similarly ignorant of how pregnancy occurs and might have thought she was pregnant even though she had never been with a man.  
It really makes you feel for these poor women of the 19th century.  

[BooksRule]

I liked the first episode and have set my DVR for the remainder.  I know very little about Queen Victoria except that she married Albert, she ruled for a long time and a little about the whole 'Victorian age' era.  We have several good biographies about Victoria in my library that I really want to read now.  I knew nothing about the Lady Flora scandal, and I'm also wondering if it wasn't against Flora as much as trying to pin something on Conroy.

I've only seen Rufus Sewell in a couple of things (I mainly remember him from the short-lived 'The Eleventh Hour' series), but whenever I see him I'm reminded of actor David Selby ('Dark Shadows') in his younger days.  

[PRgal]

44 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

It was a gyn exam specifically to determine if her hymen was intact, i.e. a virginity test.  When Victoria was told that Lady Flora had not been "deflowered" she still asked whether or not she was with child and Lord M told her that was not possible, that one precludes the other.  It made me wonder if Lady Flora was similarly ignorant of how pregnancy occurs and might have thought she was pregnant even though she had never been with a man.  
It really makes you feel for these poor women of the 19th century.  

That's what I was thinking.  It also makes me wonder what girls are told when they get their first period.  I mean, was Lady Flora menstruating?  I just can't get my head around how ignorant many young women were about reproduction back then.  :(

[Atlanta]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

That's what I was thinking.  It also makes me wonder what girls are told when they get their first period.  I mean, was Lady Flora menstruating?  I just can't get my head around how ignorant many young women were about reproduction back then.  :(

I can only imagine. Imagine that you're clueless about periods and suddenly have cramps and are bleeding. Those poor young women probably thought they were dying. O.o

[gator12]

On 16/01/2017 at 9:35 PM, BooksRule said:

I liked the first episode and have set my DVR for the remainder.  I know very little about Queen Victoria except that she married Albert, she ruled for a long time and a little about the whole 'Victorian age' era.  We have several good biographies about Victoria in my library that I really want to read now.  I knew nothing about the Lady Flora scandal, and I'm also wondering if it wasn't against Flora as much as trying to pin something on Conroy.

I've only seen Rufus Sewell in a couple of things (I mainly remember him from the short-lived 'The Eleventh Hour' series), but whenever I see him I'm reminded of actor David Selby ('Dark Shadows') in his younger days.  

I learned a lot about Victoria last year watching a documentary,

Spoiler

she was a horrible mother.

She would have been better in the modern world, it looks like

Spoiler

she didn't want to be a mother but love sex.

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tags added

[Mumbles]

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Imagine that you're clueless about periods and suddenly have cramps and are bleeding. Those poor young women probably thought they were dying.

Sadly I think this is how the Samaritans started out....A teenage girl had her period, was ignorant about what was happening, assumed she was very sick and dying, and killed herself. A vicar set up Samaritans so that people would have a place to call before doing something drastic.

In Victoria, I chalked it up to the doctor using the term "Virgo intacta" and Victoria not knowing the Latin. But she seemed very well educated and probably educated in Latin,  so maybe she was just naive about sex.

[elle]

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 I knew nothing about the Lady Flora scandal, and I'm also wondering if it wasn't against Flora as much as trying to pin something on Conroy.

I thought that was the case.  Victoria considered Lady Flora part of the "Kensington System" and no friend of hers.  I wondered why Lady Flora did not tell Victoria she was sick, but as it was pointed out, she may have not known herself.  It was a sad business all around.

Quote

In Victoria, I chalked it up to the doctor using the term "Virgo intacta" and Victoria not knowing the Latin. But she seemed very well educated and probably educated in Latin,  so maybe she was just naive about sex.

She would have known Latin, based on what was considered classical education at the time.  It is very plausible that she did not know how babies were made.

Quote

Lord Melbourne was apparently a handsome man, so even if Rufus is younger than he was at the time, he was a good pick to play him.

He had a reputation which was mentioned more than once even by his allies.  He knew what the gossip would be and tried to impart this to Victoria but she was having none of that.   I wonder if Victoria was searching for a "father figure" based on her dependence on Lord M and then later Albert and after him John Brown.

Quote

I've only seen Rufus Sewell in a couple of things (I mainly remember him from the short-lived 'The Eleventh Hour' series), but whenever I see him I'm reminded of actor David Selby ('Dark Shadows') in his younger days.  

He so often plays the bad guy, it is nice to see him in a sympathetic role.  And I can see how he would remind you of David Selby. :0)

I was not bothered by the blue contacts, did not really notice them after the initial "oh, that is what people are talking about".  The CGI London scenes did start to bother me.  The first view of Buckingham House was interesting, but after that it would take me out of the story.

I do wonder how much of the all the downstairs drama is true.  I can believe that many things were sold to the pickers, but the mustache twirling is making me raise an eyebrow.  The whole rats in the house is playing out strangely.  I don't see how those rats made it onto the cake without anyone noticing!  It would seem that "Dash" would certainly be raising the alarm whenever one would be in the room.   Does anyone else think that Albert will be cleaning house, rats four legged or two,  once he comes on the scene?  I don't see him being bluffed into putting stop to the renovations, adding gas line to the house.

[SusanSunflower]

The show currently can be viewed at PBS online  here PBS link for this episode

(It's the archives you need the Passport ($60/year iirc) to view. 

[Atlanta]

Other than "A Knight's Tale," everything I've seen Rufus in, he's been a nice guy. I first remember him from "Dark City" (I think that's what it was called) and "Tristan and Isolde." He doesn't age. He must have fab genes or a talented surgeon.

When I see Nell Hudson, I keep thinking of Laoghaire from "Outlander." :D She's a much more sympathetic character here, but if you watch Outlander, we'll get to see a little bit of her in season 3.

I'm calling BS on the dog not figuring out the rats. I'm amazed there wasn't a cat kept in the castle to keep the rats in check.

[jumper sage]

10 hours ago, pasdetrois said:

I hadn't heard the Lady Flora story.

Check out this site for what her family endured and how they retaliated.

 

3 hours ago, BooksRule said:

We have several good biographies about Victoria in my library that I really want to read

Good reading, but let me warn you that you will be hooked and will spend the next many years continuing on with how she spread the family throughout the world and thrones.  Might I suggest Reluctant King George VI?

Edited January 17, 2017 by jumper sage

[elle]

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Other than "A Knight's Tale," everything I've seen Rufus in, he's been a nice guy. I first remember him from "Dark City" (I think that's what it was called) and "Tristan and Isolde." He doesn't age. He must have fab genes or a talented surgeon.

I should have said, that of the movies I have seen, RS plays the villain.  Besides the one you  mentioned, he played the bounder "Jasper" in The Holiday with Kate Winslet.  A total of two. :0)

Loving all the links!

Edited January 17, 2017 by elle

[scenicbyway]

Victoria is a fascinating character,

Spoiler

really a sad life with a brief moment of happiness in the middle.

 I was really tired of all of the close ups of "Victoria" by the end of the episode.  The CGI was really bad too.  I did like her fiery independence and Lord M was an ally she desperately needed.

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tag added

[Dirtybubble]

I enjoyed the first episode as well.  My only real gripe is the downstairs/servants storyline.  I like the head of household Lehenz but I find myself comparing everyone else to downtown abbey and nobody can hold a candle to Carson & Ms. Hughes!  I don't know I just feel like there is enough story in the royals; the servants feel shoe horned in.  

[StaceyNotStacie]

I watched The Young Victoria a few weeks before watching this. While I like Emily Blunt and enjoyed the movie, the casting and story of this series was much better. I'm looking forward to the casting of Prince Albert and seeing the chemistry with the two actors.

I'm wondering how this will spread out compared to The Crown. Will this run through many decades over the seasons or will it focus on the early years. 

[Miss Chevious]

Well my Sunday night void left by Downton Abbey has been filled. I was immediately captivated by this episode. Cast, lighting, costumes, jewels, etc. were  great.

What struck me most was how young and inexperienced Victoria was when she became queen. Her mother didn't do her any favors by keeping her isolated and ignorant in matters of state.  Although her mother had her reasons, right or wrong, mainly that she felt others were out to get her child and there was a conspiracy to keep her from the throne.

I had known of Lady Caroline Lamb's association with Lord Byron and her quote about him but didn't realize she was Lord M's wife until it was mentioned in last night's episode. 

Also looking forward to seeing Albert with Victoria. Are they still dating in real life?

[howiveaddict]

So Lady Flora's family retaliated against Victoria by putting postage stamps, with her likeness, on upside down. That fixed her!  Oh burn!  Oh and Lady Flora's sister refused to sleep in a bed, in the palace when she stayed by her dying sister's side. Refused to lie in Victoria's property.  That showed that  Victoria!  Now days they would all just take their hate to twitter.

[pasdetrois]

Quote

I wonder if Victoria was searching for a "father figure" based on her dependence on Lord M and then later Albert and after him John Brown.

One of my all-time favorite movies is Mrs. Brown.

[JudyObscure]

On 17/01/2017 at 0:00 AM, gator12 said:

I learned a lot about Victoria last year watching a documentary,

Spoiler

she was a horrible mother.

 

From the documentary,

Spoiler

"Victoria and Albert had terrible rows.  Think of the worst row you ever had and magnify it." 

I always take the pedantic statements of British historians with a grain of salt.  

Spoiler

The woman may sound like she was  right there at the time, but she probably only read a few mentions of arguments in  letters from the period.  Almost all children were raised strictly at the time and these children, being the product of first cousins might have had all sorts of unrecognized special needs that Victoria would have been unaware of.  I, at least, admire the fact that Victoria seems to have  tried with her children, at a time when most aristocrats delegated the entire job to the hired help.

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
Tags added

[jumper sage]

Such a lively discussion!

11 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Spoiler

Almost all children were raised strictly at the time and these children, being the product of first cousins might have had all sorts of unrecognized special needs that Victoria would have been unaware of.

 

Spoiler

May I add hemophilia into the picture the last gift of Queen Victoria.  When the Tsar and his family were killed it was said that hemophilia was finally stopped in most European regal families.  She wanted one of the Tsar's daughters to marry one of her grandsons but alas the murder of the Tsar's family ended all talk of that.

 I believe only the Spain limb still carry the disease and is why no more marriages with Spain.

They had me with the diagram!

Edited January 18, 2017 by SilverStormm
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