The Killing - General Discussion

[Brooke0707]

I said in another thread that I watch this show for the interactions between Linden and Holder.   The actual crimes are just filler.   Consequently I don't get too upset if the crime story isn't a home run. 

 

I'm getting weary of the "it would be an embarrassment for the city so we are going to overlook your indiscretion" resolution to plots in which there is no good way for the main hero to otherwise escape punishment for his/her actions ("The Wire" is another).   Linden should have been arrested, gone to trial or accepted a plea deal.   They could have made it work somehow, with Sarah serving minimal time, or even receiving a suspended sentence given all the mitigating factors.

 

I am convinced Holder did take the shell casing as insurance.   I thought it the moment it vanished, because only a scene or two earlier, Linden told Holder that she had left the casings on the table.   Not only that, Holder didn't deny it when confronted.  Are we to believe that Linden, a trained detective, couldn't find that casing on the ventilation grille?   Are we to believe that a squad of policemen and detectives with a search warrant didn't find that casing either?   Don't forget who was in Linden's house during the execution of that search warrant (which by the way makes no sense at all since he was still under suspicion of being an accessory) and likely would have had opportunity to leave the casing on the grille after everyone else had left: Holder.  

 

I suppose I should be grateful Sarah didn't find it in her Roomba.

 

Regardless, this episode left me emotionally wrung out.    I am happy and hopeful that the show/series ended in a way that leaves a door open for future episodes.

 

A big thank you to Mireille Enos for making Sarah Linden a deeply flawed and thoroughly believable character.

Holder didn't verbally deny it, but the expression on his face and his demeanor suggested to me that he was deeply disgusted that she could think he could do something like that after all they had been through.  IMO, he didn't do it and it wouldn't really mesh well with Linden's speech and apology at the end if Holder engaged in that kind of deception.  Because it would be one thing if he took it, but a whole other level of deception to take it and then bring it back in a way that would make her think she misplaced it.  She also flat out apologized for accusing him and to me, Holder would have said something at the very least at that point if he had done it.  And her talk about him being someone who always stays wouldn't have much meaning if he had taken the casing after all.

 

I did think it was believable that she couldn't find it.  I find that sometimes when I am looking for something, no matter how hard I try I don't find it until I stop looking (funny how things can work out that way).  Plus she was a total mess because of what had happened and so I can buy that part of it.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Brooke0707

[millennium]

But it wasn't just Linden who failed to find the casing despite it sitting in almost plain sight -- her house was searched by a team of policemen specifically looking for incriminating evidence.

 

I still say Holder swiped it, then put it back.   In the end, it's always every man for himself.  Maybe he regretted it later, but he took that casing to protect himself and his family. 

[Brooke0707]

Well it's the same police force that Linden and Holder came from and as has been demonstrated, they're not the most competent detectives.  I mean after all of her time being a cop, Linden went back to the scene of the crime to dump evidence (not even to destroy it - but just to throw it into the lake of doom) and sent texts from her victim's phone post-death...

 

Agree to disagree.  I think if that had happened, Holder was the kind of man who would have admitted it especially when she came back and the speech from Linden would have been pretty meaningless/false.  I don't think that was the show's intention.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Brooke0707

[designing1]

Just finished watching...

 

At first I thought Kyle was playing piano in his final scene with Linden and thought WTF, but I think it was actually background music. He was most definitely playing in the flashback where he kills his beloved yet still forgotten baby sister, and considering even the police said the wires had been cut long ago -- add it to the list of plot holes that have always been a hallmark of this show.

 

Most incomprehensible to me is how any living, breathing, straight woman looks up at Joel Kinnamen and chooses to leave, even for a bit. I guess if I ever meet Olivia Munn I'll have a conversation starter.

Edited August 8, 2014 by designing1

[stillshimpy]

The military school stuff was clichéd and boring. How many times have we seen that these faux soldiers are attracted to the worst aspects of the military, macho bravado and cruelty, misogyny, and a psychopathic fondness for killing?

 

Agreed, they were all cliches, but at least there was some Joan Allen.  Not a good character, or a particularly believable one, but it was Joan Allen and she elevated the material enough that I felt for her.  

 

The mystery was, as per usual with this show, not going to hold up to much scrutiny so I just sort of rolled my eyes at the resolution.  However, plot structure around the police work side of the story has always been this series' weakest link.  It has lived or died on the strength of the performances by Mirielle Enos and Joel Knnaman.  They were great here and whereas I could have lived without the semi-romantic connection, I do think the show worked hard to make that believable and both the actors really sold it.  Plus, Kallie's mom basically absolving Holder in the graveyard and smiling gently at him was one of the nicer scenes any series has pulled off.  It was suddenly apparent that the actress is absolutely stunning and it looked like he was being blessed.  Nice work.  This show always has done well with its directorial choices. 

 

Plus, they changed lighting filters there at the end from "the living dead" to something closer to "pretty people, in possession of pulses" and that really helped them both look happier and healthier. So good for them.  

 

Rest in peace, The Killing, you strange show with your even odder renewal story.  

Edited August 8, 2014 by stillshimpy

[RealityGal]

Never good to watch The Killing when you are already depressed. :)

 

I'm not looking forward to Linden being blamed for Skinner's death. Very curious as to why the School Superintendent was granted custody of the boy in the will instead of the uncle? How weird is that? Also curious about the marks on his back - abuse from the parents or the school?

 

You know when I think about it, the most interesting thing about that is how recently the parents must have made/changed their will.  I mean, I guess they could have made it a long time ago assuming their son would get into the military academy and would be there until he was 18 years old, but what if they had died before he was even of an age to go to high school.  If they made it 10 years ago, he would have only been 8, so the parents couldn't know if they would die when he was 9, 10, 11.  Because they didn't have a contingency plan for those years, it makes me think that they would have made/changed the will at least when he turned 14 (freshman year).   Or in fact even later than that, because it sounds like he went into the academy during his last year of high school, so they had no idea until he was 17 that he was even going into St. George's.

 

So did they make those changes because they thought he might try to kill them?  The parents seem all about image, and perfection, I'm sure they were all about him going to college, even if they thought he was dumb, they would at least not want him to embarrass them by not going to college, so why not leave any money in their will for that?  Did they hold back the money until he was 35 so he wouldn't have a monetary incentive to kill them?  

Sadly, Season 4 is the last. Enjoy it while you can.

This makes me so sad.  I was just turned onto "the Killing" and I think its the perfect show for Netflix.  Its a perfect show to binge watch especially if its one crime solved in one season.  Boo.

Edited August 9, 2014 by RealityGal

[RealityGal]

Oh Holder, and this is why I still watch The Killing:

 

"I think Boo Radley over there is one sunny day away from cutting his ear off."

 

"It's like with lions.  Once you tame 'em you got to put them up on a pedestal."

"Well, he is a captain and can pull rank...."

I love the crunchberries too, so I liked that.

 

This storyline is more appealing to me than past seasons, perhaps because I'm going into it with the knowledge that Linden and Holder have only six episodes to wrap it up and thus the red herring factor will probably be low. 

 

Some asshole on Netflix pseudo-spoiled the conclusion in his review comment (when I went on the site to view the episode last night it was at the tippity-top of all the comments and I happened to see it) which pisses me off royally.  WTF is wrong with people?   Why is their need to see their stupid thoughts in type greater than the enjoyment of millions of others?   I hate this whole "Share" generation and their complete lack of discretion.   I could do with a lot less "sharing" and a whole lot more STFU.

People are jerks.  They probably need more crunchberries.

[RealityGal]

I don't think I ever hated Holder but after his behavior with his sister and her kids I pretty much am disgusted with him 

I love Holder, so I may be an apologist for him, but I think addicts hurt others in order to hurt themselves.  The psychiatrist/psychologist in the Sopranos used to always say "depression is rage turned inward" and I think its almost opposite for holder.  I think he wants to hurt himself because of the guilt, and so he does that by hurting others.  His happiest times have been having Caroline and his sister, and his nephew who he loves, and ruining all of those relationships that he has worked so hard to build, hurting himself with drugs is a way to punish himself for his guilt.

 

But frankly, I have no idea why he feels so much guilt.  Not only did Holder not pull the trigger, he begged Linden not to.  He helped her clean up, but he didn't kill anyone, and honestly, I'm getting a little tired of Linden.  Its time for her to turn herself in and stop being an anchor on Holden.   She should explain what happened, because I think its probably something more along the lines of manslaughter since she was under such emotional distress.  The second shot was pretty intentional, but I think it could be a manslaughter case.  If thats the case, she is out in under 10 years.  As for Jack growing up without a mom, whatever, she can't even remember when he is coming to town, and he pretty much lives with his dad.  She can't keep asking Holder for permission, she just needs to confess, and leave Holder out of it.  Just say that he never found them, or that she parked the car in the garage and he could never find them.

[RealityGal]

I never considered that Nadine was someone else's daughter. I did think maybe Colonel Rayne was Kyle's Mum. That might be why his Mother never cared about him much and hit on him. She wasn't really his Mother. Perhaps, Rayne gave Kyle up and Stansbury adopted him? Maybe? I have no idea.

 

I'm completely confused. I think Blond Buzzcut is up to no good. I bet he did it. 

 

That kid was way too nice, way too fast and for no apparent reason.  I think the Colonel is their ultimate mother figure, and something of a love interest for some of them.  Blond buzz cut is very gung ho about taking her "directives" to the extreme.  Which is why he protected Kyle at first, but then when he someone getting to be mom's favorite I think he didn't like that one bit.

 

Or, he could just be a straight up psychopath, who was always setting Kyle up.

 

^^^ explains why I'm sitting here wondering if I fugued during a significant plot development.    Oh lordy, lordy!  I done been spoiled!   Unclean!  Unclean!  

 

 

The final scene of the car being hoisted from the water was just beautiful.   The blue lighting, the angle, the slow sway, water cascading from the chassis as Linden and Holder gaze upon the magnitude of their sin ...

 

I am really going to miss this show.

 

As that car came out of the water I thought "and it ends as it begun" a beautiful haunting scene of a car coming out of the water in the middle of the night.  Even creepier to see the outline of the dead body at the wheel.

 

I stopped reading the "spoiled" post because I had no idea what the poster was talking about, I figured I might have fallen asleep when something important happened.

 

 

I was just impressed that Linden had the correct charger at her disposal to keep Skinner's phone alive for so long :)

 

why in the world do they all have flip phones?  I'm the lamest tech person ever, but even I have a swankier model phone!

 

when Jack set up that dreadful mother-daughter reunion and then apparently shambled back to the car for a smoke. And laughed again when poor Linden came storming back enraged and wrecked and just this side of losing her mind entirely...and was so berserk over being set up, she didn't even notice the cigarette. Oy.

 

Sometimes this show just seems to be one hour long ad for big tobacco.  Is there anyone on the show who doesn't smoke, didn't recently smoke, or is about to defy someone's authority by smoking?

[mledawn]

Ah, the ending at last. Holder standing soclose to Linden had me on the edge of my seat. I liked how their relationship was written at the end, it was just ambiguous enough to keep both shippers and noromos happy.

 

Since I was trying to watch my 11 wk-old border collie puppy while watching this,  I was unsure about comments made here about the search of Linden's house and not finding the bullet casing. When the police arrived at her house, with Holder, I thought they were looking for Kyle. They wouldn't be scouring the house for Skinner clues in that case, would they? Just a "she's not here" and off to the lake house they go? Did I miss another search?

[Cardie]

At a minimum, they would have made a new will six or seven years ago when the little sister was born. The dad was very involved as a St. George alumnus, so perhaps he always intended for his only son to be ruled by its commandant. A more specific question would be how he knew that Rayne would remain in charge for years and years. So, if I had to guess, that will is less than a year old.

[RealityGal]

At a minimum, they would have made a new will six or seven years ago when the little sister was born. The dad was very involved as a St. George alumnus, so perhaps he always intended for his only son to be ruled by its commandant. A more specific question would be how he knew that Rayne would remain in charge for years and years. So, if I had to guess, that will is less than a year old.

 

But the father, who seemed to always be in charge, only was able to get Kyle (?) into the academy for his senior year.  So I don't know that they always had the intention of him attending the school, since he was in regular high school for so long.  It sounds like up until he was 17, he was going to regular school and thats how things were going to be, it just sounds like in his last year his father put his foot down, or someone decided he should go to St. George.  But the Rayne question is another factor in believing that the will is only a year old or less.  And so, if you changed the will less than a year ago, with the idea that the kid would go to college (because this seems like one of those families where its not really an option to not go to college) why would you hold the money back from him until he was 35 unless you thought he might do something to you, and you wanted to take away the incentive he might have to kill you....

[shelley1234]

Netflix shows are awesome because you can binge watch a whole season, but also horrible because you can binge watch a whole season.  I like being able to see the case through, but it also takes away the slow build and the anticipation of having to wait out a whole season.  

 

Holder is the reason I watch this show.  I frick fracken love that kid.  I love how damaged he is, but that kind of makes him awesome.  And yes, the crunch berries was a highlight.  I also love how great he is connecting with kids and how often how awful he is connecting with adults.  The Boo Radley comment was the bestest.  I literally LOL'ed and had to click rewind cause I missed things.  

 

The neighbor is such a red herring.  I never pay attention to who they think did it until way later in the season since they wrongly accuse about a bajillion people until they finally get the real killer to basically fall in their lap.  

 

Reddick seeing Kallie's ring (it was really Bullet's ring but whatevs) on Skinner's kiddo's finger.  I still can't believe that Skinner would ever be that reckless and careless to give the one ring that EVERYONE knew belonged to one of the missing girls to his daughter.  Of course it is the one piece that moved the story along, so fine.  

[shelley1234]

But it's always the cover-up, not the crime. They should have phoned the incident in and Linden could claim temporary insanity after her former lover and boss essentially kidnaped her and taunted her with what he'd done. With her mental health history, everyone would believe she just lost it.

 

I think there is a better defense than that if they called it in right away.  Linden was being taken to what she thought was Adrian the night Skinner died.  He drove her to the abandoned lake house and then said that the kid was dead in the trunk.  Linden could easily saw at that point that she thought she was going to be killed like all the other victims.  She could say that he slipped (hence why he would be on his knees) and she took that opportunity to grab her gun and kill him dead.  Holder could say he figured out they were at the Lake House when the wifey said so and headed there.  He was looking for Adrian when he got he call that Adrian was A OK safe, heard the gun shot and came running to find Linden and now dead Skinner.  With all the bodies in the lake that could be connected to Skinner, it would be a pretty easy slam dunk case.  But instead they covered it up and made it so that they are always running from killing a man that deserved to die.  

 

Holder in this episode...wowzers  Whoever writes this knows about addiction in a big time way.  He's classic of someone in a relapse.  It was so sad for me to see him using and see him just willing to throw everything and everyone good away.  I also love that of all the people in his life the only one to outwardly ask him if he was using was Linden.  Everyone else just shut their eyes and hoped they could ignore it away.  

 

Linden botches throwing away even more evidence.  For homicide detectives they seem to almost want to get caught with how stupid they have been since this all happened.  Let's just wash off the blood like there is no evidence....let's use a cell phone that can be traced back to me...let's ditch evidence in a way that can be found and connected to me.  Stupid stupid people.  

[RealityGal]

 

 

Reddick seeing Kallie's ring (it was really Bullet's ring but whatevs) on Skinner's kiddo's finger.  I still can't believe that Skinner would ever be that reckless and careless to give the one ring that EVERYONE knew belonged to one of the missing girls to his daughter.  Of course it is the one piece that moved the story along, so fine.  

 

But you gotta wonder if he was either thinking he had gotten away with so much so why not take some more risks, or if he was somehow wanting to get caught.  I mean you gotta have a set on you to think that you're going to give your daughter a ring, a picture of which is blown up 100x and pasted to a wall in your office and get away with it.

[shelley1234]

Ahh....I binged through the whole season.  Damn you Netflix!  

Yes I have to admit

I was surprised to find that Kyle was the one who killed his family. I too had pegged Colonel Rainne as being involved somehow, but not Kyle. Those boys broke him.

 

As for Linden and Holder

I don't think they had crazy sex or have any kind of attraction to each other. I have never felt it and was dreading what I thought was going to be a kiss and confession from Holder. I do however believe they have a bond that only law enforcement partners can understand. They need each other, and maybe not in a healthy way, but I think they can work on that. I don't think they function well alone.

 

Those boys didn't break him...his family did a long time before then.  When they show the actual depiction of Kyle killing his family when he shot his parents you see the absolute look of shock on the faces of Lincoln and AJ.  They thought it would be a fun joke, but never thought he's actually go in and kill his whole family massacre style.  

 

I have to say I was very disappointed in this season and I felt the resolution of the crime(s) felt rushed. The symbol of the sun finally coming out when Linden left her house was a bit simplistic (but a welcome relief from four seasons of dreary grey rain).

Ugh, as you can tell I was so disapointed with this season. By the time Linden came back I could have cared less if she and Holder got together because keeping their lie would always be over their heads and would, IMO, tear them apart.

 

I don't think the lie will be held over them because they told their truth.  Linden sat in a room and said what happened and after that....it is not on them.  Their consciences are clean.  I think they both looked at peace with what happened with Skinner when she came back years later to see Holder.  

 

I still think a lot was left unanswered. I didn't get Lincoln and AJ. Why did they keep harrasing Kyle with the murders? Why did Lincoln point at AJ?

 

I think they both wanted to see if he was going to remember.  They knew that if he remembered what happened and it came to light that they would be accessories in the crime.  They were trying to jar him and see what would shake out.  

 

But it wasn't just Linden who failed to find the casing despite it sitting in almost plain sight -- her house was searched by a team of policemen specifically looking for incriminating evidence.

 

I still say Holder swiped it, then put it back.   In the end, it's always every man for himself.  Maybe he regretted it later, but he took that casing to protect himself and his family. 

 

When they were at Linden's place I believe they were looking for Kyle.  They didn't know anything about Skinner at that point.  All Clear was that Kyle was not there, not that the room was cleared for evidence....or at least that is how I took it.  

[shelley1234]

But you gotta wonder if he was either thinking he had gotten away with so much so why not take some more risks, or if he was somehow wanting to get caught.  I mean you gotta have a set on you to think that you're going to give your daughter a ring, a picture of which is blown up 100x and pasted to a wall in your office and get away with it.

 

True.  And he did say to Linden in the end of Season 3 that he was sick of hiding who he was.  I kind of think Skinner knew that he was driving to his own death when he drove Linden out to the lake.  

[millennium]

When they were at Linden's place I believe they were looking for Kyle.  They didn't know anything about Skinner at that point.  All Clear was that Kyle was not there, not that the room was cleared for evidence....or at least that is how I took it.  

 

That's interesting, because clearly I interpreted that scene differently.   I would have to rewatch.   Maybe I skewed that way because the whole episode felt like waiting for the sword to drop on Linden's head.   If your take is the right one (which seems more likely the more I think about it), it would solve the problem I have with Holder being on the scene.   Still, it does leave Holder an opportunity to plant the casing on the grille.

 

One thing I've learned in life is that people are capable of anything, whether they're your family, your soul mate or your best friend.  You just never know what they're going to do when push comes to shove.    It was becoming obvious to Holder that Linden was getting sloppy about getting rid of the evidence, or procrastinating, or whatever.   If I were Holder, I might have taken that casing to cover my ass.    Just in case.    And scriptwise, I can't think of another purpose that would be served by Linden specifically telling Holder that she left the casings on the table (prior to the one going missing) when we the viewers had already seen them there.    

[Cardie]

To me the missing casing symbolized Linden's growing paranoia. It meant that someone was on to her, someone knew the secret and came in to seize it. Of course Holder was suspect #1. But the point the show was making was it was just paranoia. The casing fell off the table and rolled to a part of the floor she never checked. The whole story reason it showed up after everything was over was to make that ironic point. Had Holder taken it, we'd have seen that he had it.

And yes, the police came to Sarah's house looking for Kyle, not evidence in the Skinner murder. Reddick only told the higher ups about his suspicions, never rank and file cops or SWAT.

[Cardie]

It's hard to have a complete discussion about the will until you've watched all six episodes. In general, though, the family hated Kyle and I can see them leaving him a pauper until 35 just for spite.

[RealityGal]

It's hard to have a complete discussion about the will until you've watched all six episodes. In general, though, the family hated Kyle and I can see them leaving him a pauper until 35 just for spite.

 

I'm on the last leg of episode 6, and now I'm going to try to use the spoiler tag.

But I would think if they just hated him and wanted to spite him they would have left him out of the will altogether, or they would have left him much less than 50 million dollars

[RealityGal]

Wut??

 

WHY DIDN'T THEY KISS?!?!

 

Gotta save something for the Lifetime Movie of the Week, maybe Holder and Linden head to Hawaii, she trips, falls into his arms and the long waited for kiss finally happens....I could totally see it going down like that....  :)

 

 As far as I know the kid didn't "lawyer up" but I could have missed it. I guess the guardian can limit the questioning but it all seemed contrived to string out the story.

I counted four officials in the room when they told Linden that Skinner's autopsy was officially listed as a suicide and she readily admitted that she shot him. So these four officials and the pathologist all had to accept the lie in order to "save" the Police Department? So everyone is in on this and all subject to covering up a crime and going to prison to "save" the Police Department's reputation? WTF? You know a secret isn't a secret if you tell one other person and pinning the murder of those girls on another dead guy seems so far fetched and just plain lazy.

 

The pathologist called it a "suicide" from that point, IMO there is plausible deniability.  Linden has a history of mental issues and because of that mental instability, its not a stretch to assume that he committed suicide, but due to the pressure of the case, the guilt she feels over breaking up Skinners family (probably part of the reason he shot himself at the lake house), and the mental shock of seeing him come out of the water, she convinced herself that she shot him even when she didn't.  You really only have to convince the pathologist, because the story of Linden having a mental break is believable since she has had one before.  Now there is Holder, and the other cop guy.  But Holder isn't going to ever say anything because he has a kid on the way and would be just happy to have a way out of it, and people would just say he is an unreliable junkie.  The other cop who was investigating isn't trying to mess with his pension and if evidence was "lost" he wouldn't have anything to back up his allegations.  Holder's "confession" could probably be applied to a million other situations, it was just that Reddit (I just remembered his name) knew the right situation to apply the "confession" to.  The mayor could have all the evidence "lost" the way the evidence from the Rosie Larsen case just "never made it" to the right place, and no one else could really put all the puzzle pieces together except Holder, Reddick or Linden.

 

Pinning the murders on a dead guy is perfect, IMO.  I think it would be hard to really age the bodies given how long most of them were in the water, and its not like Joe Mills died 10 years ago, he died fairly recently, so you could just say that he picked a new dumping ground.  I don't think that you could accurately pinpoint time/date of death for someone thats been sitting in the swampy waters.

 

I think that under the age of 18, a parent can step in and stop questioning of a minor.  So it would make sense that a guardian could too.

 

 

My ovaries exploded seeing Holder with his daughter.

That is all.

Nope...ETA it was a lovely break from the worst chapped lips in television history during the last five minutes.

 

I know right - everytime I saw Linden on screen I wanted to reach for my cherry chapstick and give it to her through my computer.

 

And yes - Holden and his daughter was so very sweet.

 

 

 

In all honesty i didn't think the military plot was all that complicated. A damaged boy was bullied by his school chums and bad things happened. The only difference was he killed his family and not them because it was his emotionally/physically/sexually abusive family he hated. Col. Rayne was his biomom and tried too late to protect him from the abuse. She was like Linden well meaning (she did love her son) but was not really built for motherhood.

The whole theme of the series could possibly be: its not always easy to stay.

 

This show made me want to hug my mom.  Geez, was there one super solid mom in the bunch?  Maybe Holder's sister?  Mitch is debatable IMO.

I did enjoy the last few episodes, though as with season three, if I thought about it too much, massive plot holes started staring back at me. Like, wasn't it established in episode one that the piano wires were cut - yet Kyle was playing the piano when Linden found him at the house in episode six. Would Skinner's wife or daughter really let Linden's presence at the Lake House and the text message from her later-established-dead-at-the-time-husband drop without a fight? 

 

Etc. etc.

 

How does anyone know exactly when Skinner went into the water?  I mean, we the viewers do, Linden and Holder do, Reddick only knows that he went to the lake house.  I think it would be awful hard to establish time/date of death to be exact when someone has been in the water like that.  But I don't know how many days it was until they got the text message, but he had vacation scheduled, he was having a terrible time at home, its not out of the question to think that he goes to the lake house to think, and after a few days just gets so depressed about his situation and commits suicide.  I would think that there would be a margin of error for date of death that might go a few days either way.

 

 

So, after the murders happened, the two other boys went to the colonel and confessed what happened and she helped them cover it up?  If they didn't know that Kyle was her son, why did they trust that she would help them and not call the police?  Also, why were they so worried about Kyle remembering when Kyle was the one who did all the murders?  Yes, AJ and that other guy were horrible, gross people, but why were they so convinced that if Kyle remembered, his first thought would be to turn the others and himself in when that would lead him to go to jail forever?  Kyle did confess upon remembering, but were they convinced he'd do it because he was a softie (minus the whole brutally murdering his family thing)? 

 

And it was okay for Kyle's dad to raise Kyle, but not the colonel?  She just didn't want to or was it something her dad wouldn't allow?  I wasn't clear on that.

 

Holder and Linden's get out of jail free card was rather convenient, eh?  Not that I mind.  I didn't want the series to end with them rotting in prison.

I think the col's job is to take on damaged young men, who may either be the sons of overzealous parents that have hammered military values into their children since birth, or sons who are doing crazy shit that make their parents want to send them to a military school to see if that can discipline the crazy out of them, or sons who just aren't wanted around by their parents.  The first category are going to be tempted to mindlessly follow those that are higher up the chain of command.  The second category aren't going to be believed by anyone and are probably going to be the first suspects if bad stuff happens.   The third category is going to be loyal because they are going to want to cleve to any mother figure that has told them they are special and worthy of protection.  So I naturally think that the boys came to the col, and followed her lead.  The colonel has been very clear that the military school is a home, that they are a family, and that they handle things "inside the family" and outsiders are not to be trusted, so I could see them thinking that she would just "take care" of everything.

 

I don't think either of those guys had any intention of going to jail for even a minute.  I don't think for those kids it was a matter of degrees.  AJ wanted to join an olympic shooting team, and is a psychopath, I don't see him thinking "well I'll just get aiding and abetting, and maybe conspiracy after the fact...I'll only get a two year sentence"  I think someone like him would be thinking that Kyle's actions could potentially be an obstacle for him accomplishing his dreams, and so he should just kill him.

 

I get the impression the colonel didn't want to raise him because it would mess with her life/career, and she didn't really want to be a mother 18 years ago.  She wasn't the "sticking around type" and probably convinced herself that Kyle would be happy with his rich father living in a giant glass house.

 

 

I really didn't think the Colonel's motivations were well established beyond "it's his mother." It almost would have made more sense had she been the killer because she had found out about the abuse of Kyle and the attempted seduction of Lincoln. Although that wouldn't explain offing the entire family. I really didn't see why the Colonel would risk everything and rely on the loyalty of a couple of snot-nosed bro-hazers.

 

Another head scratcher was Kyle telling Linden he kept shooting until the screaming stopped only... he somehow failed to remember he had a little sister.

 

Ugh, this is what I mean, poking holes at this show is shooting fish in a barrel.

 

I think the colonel doesn't see snot nosed bro hazers. I think she sees misunderstood, broken and thrown away boys, which is why she works so hard to protect them.   I think its why she struggled so hard to hold it altogether, even though she probably know on some level that the whole thing was going to break apart.  She seemed to be in shock having to kill the boys.

 

As for the shooting until the screaming stopped, could have been the screaming in his head.  He killed everyone he meant to kill, everyone who had tormented him, so whatever screaming was going on in his head may have stopped after accomplishing that task.  Because it sounds like he pretty much shot everyone in the face, and they died relatively quick, so I don't think anyone was screaming.  But his youngest sister was never his tormentor, so she was never part of the anger and rage that figured into him going to that house to kill everyone, and maybe thats why he forgot her.  I don't think he was having rational thoughts, but rage induced, crazy thoughts.  Kill the tormentors....so I think it might be easy to forget someone who you never saw as a tormentor.

 

Sorry about crazy verb tenses

Yes, the notion that it would be that easy to sweep Skinner's identity as the Pied Piper under the rug was ridiculous. The police can't pretend like a double-digit body count doesn't exist - especially when Caroline made the point of saying her office was overwhelmed with the discovery, meaning the press surely had a hold of the story too, not to mention the gaggle of grieving family members who showed up to identify their loved ones. 

 

In fairness, Holder and Linden have been pretty terrible detectives since season one. Sometimes, I think all that's missing from the show is the theme to the Pink Panther in the background.

Yes, but who knows when those bodies were dumped?  I think the conditions in the water would make time of death hard to pin down, and if Joe Mills died fairly recently it would make it easier to pin the deaths on him, IMO.  From what I understand serial killers use multiple dumping grounds, or change dumping grounds.  I believe that was the case with the Green River Killer.

 

 

I still think a lot was left unanswered. I didn't get Lincoln and AJ. Why did they keep harrasing Kyle with the murders? Why did Lincoln point at AJ?

 

I think they wanted to see if he was remembering things, and so they would try to "jog" his memory by harassing him.  The minute he remembered they knew that they would have a problem.  Which I think they wanted to resolve by killing him, and the Colonel did not.  I think she should have had a better game plan though for when/if he remembered....

 

I said in another thread that I watch this show for the interactions between Linden and Holder.   The actual crimes are just filler.   Consequently I don't get too upset if the crime story isn't a home run. 

 

I'm getting weary of the "it would be an embarrassment for the city so we are going to overlook your indiscretion" resolution to plots in which there is no good way for the main hero to otherwise escape punishment for his/her actions ("The Wire" is another).   Linden should have been arrested, gone to trial or accepted a plea deal.   They could have made it work somehow, with Sarah serving minimal time, or even receiving a suspended sentence given all the mitigating factors.

 

I am convinced Holder did take the shell casing as insurance.   I thought it the moment it vanished, because only a scene or two earlier, Linden told Holder that she had left the casings on the table.   Not only that, Holder didn't deny it when confronted.  Are we to believe that Linden, a trained detective, couldn't find that casing on the ventilation grille?   Are we to believe that a squad of policemen and detectives with a search warrant didn't find that casing either?   Don't forget who was in Linden's house during the execution of that search warrant (which by the way makes no sense at all since he was still under suspicion of being an accessory) and likely would have had opportunity to leave the casing on the grille after everyone else had left: Holder.  

 

 

I thought the warrant was to search for a suspect, I don't think they would be looking for a shell casing.  Since he wasn't hiding in the corner by an open vent it wouldn't be a good place to look.  I thought Holder's reaction was one of "I shouldn't even have to deny something like this after all I've done for you"  and if he wanted it for insurance, he would have had to put it back after the need for insurance was gone, which would have been, IMO after Linden confessed, and I don't think he was in the house after that.  I think Linden was half mad after she killed Skinner, her chapped lips alone tell me she was barely holding it together.  So, to think that she would act as a rationally trained detective when looking for a shell casing that connects to the gun she used to kill her lover who was also a serial killer seems a little odd IMO.  And Linden is a naturally suspicious and maybe paranoid person, so I don't think her go to reaction is "it must be here in the house, let me just rationally push everything around and look for it"  I think her natural reaction is to start wondering who is fucking with her, who has broken her trust.  So I think as soon as she looked around a little and the casing wasn't automatically in her line of sight, she went right to thinking that Holder must be messing with her.

 

I think if this was a small incident I would agree with you about Linden doing some time.  But gosh, a high ranking officer as a serial killer of over 20 girls?  I think people simply wouldn't trust the police department ever again, and beyond that, they wouldn't trust the mayor, or anyone in any position of power.  It would effect past politicians and others who worked with/supervised Skinner and never noticed.  Some of those people had probably gone onto pretty high ranking political office.

 

ETA: not to mention they would probably have to reopen every case that Skinner worked on, which could be an endless process....

Edited August 11, 2014 by RealityGal

[RealityGal]

Guy in wheelchair: what proof do you have?

 

Seriously? How about all those bodies being found at Skinner's house next to his which he somehow put in the lake after he shot himself? How about the fact that at least one of the bodies was put there after that guy was already on death row? How about all of the jewelry his wife and daughter are wearing? 

 

Why are TV cops always so r*******? That was the dumbest ending ever.

 

The lake is so big and so wide, it appears to be fairly secluded during the winter months, and it doesn't seem to be hard to access.  It looks like the perfect place for any serial killer to dump bodies.  Any random serial killer.  I don't think that Skinner's cabin was the only one there either.  Via six degrees of separation I bet you could find a way for Joe Mills to know about that location.  I thought Seward died for his wife's murder, what body went missing after someone went to death row?  The only piece of jewelry I know of is Skinner's daughter wearing the blue ring, but that hardly looks like a one of a kind, you'll never find it anywhere else ring.  Skinner could have picked it up for her at any number of places.

[shelley1234]

Yes, but who knows when those bodies were dumped?  I think the conditions in the water would make time of death hard to pin down, and if Joe Mills died fairly recently it would make it easier to pin the deaths on him, IMO.  From what I understand serial killers use multiple dumping grounds, or change dumping grounds.  I believe that was the case with the Green River Killer.

 

 

Seward is the one who died recently (on death row for his wife's murder).  Joe Mills is currently in jail and they were about to announce that he was being charged with all the Pied Piper murders when Linden and Skinner went up to the lake house.  I am assuming they did in fact charge him and he is being framed for the murders.  Joe Mills was the creepy boyfriend of Kallie's mom who made those amateur porn tapes in the back of his mom's hotel.  Creepy mofo, but not a murderer.  

[RealityGal]

Seward is the one who died recently (on death row for his wife's murder).  Joe Mills is currently in jail and they were about to announce that he was being charged with all the Pied Piper murders when Linden and Skinner went up to the lake house.  I am assuming they did in fact charge him and he is being framed for the murders.  Joe Mills was the creepy boyfriend of Kallie's mom who made those amateur porn tapes in the back of his mom's hotel.  Creepy mofo, but not a murderer.  

 

Well...stinks to be Mills, but I don't have much sympathy for guys who beat up women and are creepy around young girls.  I wouldn't mind him spending a lifetime behind bars, if only to save his potential future victims.

[shelley1234]

Well...stinks to be Mills, but I don't have much sympathy for guys who beat up women and are creepy around young girls.  I wouldn't mind him spending a lifetime behind bars, if only to save his potential future victims.

Me neither.  Skinner killed them, but Mills victimized them as well.  I actually felt more for Seward in the line of people taking the fall for what Skinner did.  That episode in S3 where he was put to death was almost unwatchable for me.  

 

I also don't mind at all Linden and Holder not being brought down for killing Skinner and then covering it up.  They made the world a better and safer place by putting a bullet in his brain.  

[Cardie]

Geez, was there one super solid mom in the bunch? Maybe Holder's sister? Mitch is debatable IMO.

Adrian's adoptive mother comes closest, I think.

I doubt Kyle forgot about his little sister. He never planned to kill her and would either have eventually left the house or killed himself. But when she saw him and asked about the monster, he knew she'd realize some day that he was that monster. He couldn't stand her living with that realization. It was selfish of him but I'm sure in his mixed-up mind it was a mercy killing.

[Cardie]

Who knows what gives cruel people their jollies? I'm not sure any of us could reliably get into the heads of Kyle's sicko parents and determine what they would logically have done. Getting on with your life, knowing that you'll have to make your own way, isn't objectively worse than having $50 mil. tantalizingly there for you while you wait for over a decade.

[RealityGal]

Me neither.  Skinner killed them, but Mills victimized them as well.  I actually felt more for Seward in the line of people taking the fall for what Skinner did.  That episode in S3 where he was put to death was almost unwatchable for me.  

 

I also don't mind at all Linden and Holder not being brought down for killing Skinner and then covering it up.  They made the world a better and safer place by putting a bullet in his brain.  

 

Yeah, I felt really bad for Seward.  I know its hokey but I was hoping for a last minute call from the governor or something like that.  It was a hard scene, and then made about 10x worse when you realized he was still alive after dropping through the door.....

[RealityGal]

Adrian's adoptive mother comes closest, I think.

I doubt Kyle forgot about his little sister. He never planned to kill her and would either have eventually left the house or killed himself. But when she saw him and asked about the monster, he knew she'd realize some day that he was that monster. He couldn't stand her living with that realization. It was selfish of him but I'm sure in his mixed-up mind it was a mercy killing.

 

I could see that, except that, to me, the attack had no rational thought at all, and I don't think it really had much of a plan.  He wasn't planning anything, he was just going off of emotion.  Probably an emotion of rage and anger.  If he just planned for her to sleep through the attack, or to kill himself before she woke up and he was thinking rationally I don't think he would have spent any time playing the piano.  His piano playing happened after he had killed the part of the family that he was enraged with, the part of the family that he hated, the objects of his rage and anger, and he seemed at peace.  Not like a man who had better shoot himself right away, because he doesn't want to wake up his little sister.  Its part of what makes me think he simply forgot about her, his desire to commit any murder was motivated by the rage and anger he felt towards those members of his family he hated, to me it makes sense that he was only thinking about them when he ran into that house with a gun and two psychopaths.  I can see how his mind would be so filled with visions of released rage towards those three that he almost had no room in his mind for the one person he loved.  

[RealityGal]

Who knows what gives cruel people their jollies? I'm not sure any of us could reliably get into the heads of Kyle's sicko parents and determine what they would logically have done. Getting on with your life, knowing that you'll have to make your own way, isn't objectively worse than having $50 mil. tantalizingly there for you while you wait for over a decade.

But even assholes have a certain logic to them. It's not a very nice or loving logic, but its a certain logic. These people were all about appearances, the pristine white glass house, IMO says everything. So to me, it makes more sense that they realized that Kyle was upset with the two of them, he hated them as much as they hated him. I think they had an idea that he was going to hurt them. Because there was no love between any of them, his "love" for them wouldn't stop them from killing them. But, as with many people who have money, they think money is super duper important. So they probably figured if he had a plan to kill them, and he found out that he wouldn't get any money until he was 35. It would be financially better to keep them alive. Because you know these people, IMO were going to send him to college, and fully pay for it because they want the world to see a perfect family, with supportive parents.    I think they would have thrown all sorts of money at the Kyle situation, because the money for them, is much easier than the emotions, IMO. After college, they would probably support him through graduate school.  And I making him wait to inherit may have not really kept him in the poorhouse until he was 35, I imagine with that much money guaranteed to him a bank would be willing to loan him money at a spectacular interest rate, and enough in the amount to where he could live comfortably.  So if they really wanted to financially screw with him just leaving him out of the will altogether would have been their best bet.  But I think they may have just been scared and figured if he was going to try to do something to do them, something he planned out, he may check the will, and as soon as he figured he would have to wait until he was 35 to inherit he would just drop any well thought out plan to kill them.

Edited August 11, 2014 by RealityGal

[Cardie]

You could of course be right. But I have seen the "leave the kid you hate/believe too immature to spend it well money in trust till 35" trope a lot. (It's a plot point way back in The Importance of Being Earnest).

It could also be a way to keep Colonel Rayne from benefiting from the family's wealth. Of course, if they didn't think he was going to kill them, the whole will is moot because he likely wouldn't need a guardian and would be older than 35 if they lived a normal life span. Knowing these wri3rs, I suspect the will is just a way to make us realize something is more fishy than that this is a troubled teen who didn't get along with his parents. YMMV.

[Cardie]

I think we can agree that he wouldn't have killed her if she hadn't confronted him. That was my main point. I thought you were implying that he forgot to kill her. It was only her death that made me ever doubt that he was behind the murders.

[RustbeltWriter]

Was it stated in the first episode that the gun found at the scene was not the gun used to commit the murders? That the gun found was the father's gun which was only used to shoot Kyle in the head and not used to kill the rest of the family? And because of that they couldn't be sure Kyle was the killer? If so, there may be a hole in the plot.

 

Kyle brings Lincoln's gun from school to kill his parents, as shown in episode 6. When he begins shooting his parents, Lincoln and AJ run from the scene while Kyle continues through the house. Eventually Kyle shoots himself with his father's gun. How did the gun used in the murders make its way back to the school?

[Guest]

You could of course be right. But I have seen the "leave the kid you hate/believe too immature to spend it well money in trust till 35" trope a lot. (It's a plot point way back in The Importance of Being Earnest).

It could also be a way to keep Colonel Rayne from benefiting from the family's wealth. Of course, if they didn't think he was going to kill them, the whole will is moot because he likely wouldn't need a guardian and would be older than 35 if they lived a normal life span. Knowing these wri3rs, I suspect the will is just a way to make us realize something is more fishy than that this is a troubled teen who didn't get along with his parents. YMMV.

 

I think I'm executor of a will where a niece gets the money when she's around 35, unless I decide she's responsible enough to get it sooner.  

 

I too had to really think back to S3 during this.  I don't remember if Seward killed anyone or not.  

[gesundheit]

Just finished up the season last night. Terrible conclusion to the season's murder mystery. One would think AJ and the other kid wouldn't be so concerned about Kyle's memory. If Kyle got his memory back, he'd remember that the two of them witnessed him going on a psychopathic murder spree of four unarmed people (including two innocent children) and, instead of reporting him to the police, actually swapped out the guns in a manner that helped cover up the crime and planned to keep permanently quiet about it. He'd get away with it forever, thanks to their actions. So I was a little baffled by that. I also didn't like the way the show seemed to position those other non-murdering boys as the villains and Kyle as some sort of victim. They were little shits, but they weren't murdering any of their siblings at least. One point for them!

 

Also, "IT'S BECAUSE HE'S REALLY MY SON!!!" Wow. It was like a really long L&O: Criminal Intent episode.

 

It's also odd to me that the show seemed to be asking us to feel compassion for Seward being executed for a crime he didn't commit, but to shrug off Mills being executed for, what, 27 crimes he didn't commit?  We know Mills was a violent criminal nonetheless, but so was Seward (by his own admission). It's not okay in either case.

 

I was never once rooting for Linden/Holder to get together, but I was actually far more charmed by the idea once they played out that ending. (Overwrought ending, yes, but it still got me. Love those two.)

 

I kept wishing Linden would be a little nicer to Reddick. I don't think he would have been entirely unsympathetic to the situation if he hadn't hated her so much.

 

Ultimately the finale made me glad only because it had a good share of callbacks to Season 3, which I found to be its best by about a million country miles.

Edited August 12, 2014 by gesundheit

[shelley1234]

Was it stated in the first episode that the gun found at the scene was not the gun used to commit the murders? That the gun found was the father's gun which was only used to shoot Kyle in the head and not used to kill the rest of the family? And because of that they couldn't be sure Kyle was the killer? If so, there may be a hole in the plot.

 

Kyle brings Lincoln's gun from school to kill his parents, as shown in episode 6. When he begins shooting his parents, Lincoln and AJ run from the scene while Kyle continues through the house. Eventually Kyle shoots himself with his father's gun. How did the gun used in the murders make its way back to the school?

In one of the final two episodes the Lincoln and AJ say to the Colonel that they cleaned up the scene for Kyle aka brought back the gun.  That is how the father's blood got in the gas station and how the gun made it back to the school.  It's also why they were so concerned with Kyle remembering what happened because they would be accessories both before and after.  

 

Now to be honest, I don't know why either AJ or Lincoln didn't take it upon themselves and kill Kyle one night at the school and make it look like a suicide.  Sure, Mama Colonel would be pissed, but it would wrap up their little crime.  

[RustbeltWriter]

In one of the final two episodes the Lincoln and AJ say to the Colonel that they cleaned up the scene for Kyle aka brought back the gun.  That is how the father's blood got in the gas station and how the gun made it back to the school.  It's also why they were so concerned with Kyle remembering what happened because they would be accessories both before and after.  

 

Now to be honest, I don't know why either AJ or Lincoln didn't take it upon themselves and kill Kyle one night at the school and make it look like a suicide.  Sure, Mama Colonel would be pissed, but it would wrap up their little crime.  

 

Ah, okay, I do remember that. Thanks. The timeline is strange, though. AJ and Lincoln ran away when Kyle started shooting, waited until the shooting stopped, waited for Kyle to sit at the piano and play a bit, shoot his little sister, shoot himself and then they looked the scene over, swiped the gun, stopped at the gas station to clean up and then went back to the school so they could tell the Colonel.

 

I like this show but, man, sometimes the plots really get out there.

[Cardie]

Seward was a thief and did serious assaults on a number of people but never killed anyone, I believe. I don't think Joe Mills ever killed anyone either, major creep that he was.

[shelley1234]

Ah, okay, I do remember that. Thanks. The timeline is strange, though. AJ and Lincoln ran away when Kyle started shooting, waited until the shooting stopped, waited for Kyle to sit at the piano and play a bit, shoot his little sister, shoot himself and then they looked the scene over, swiped the gun, stopped at the gas station to clean up and then went back to the school so they could tell the Colonel.

 

I like this show but, man, sometimes the plots really get out there.

 

Yeah, it doesn't seem very plausible.  In season 2 I totally bought that Aunt Terry put Rosie in the lake not knowing it was her niece because she didn't want any meddling throwaway teenager to get in the way of her happy life with her man.  This time though it takes a lot more to believe what they are selling us.  I guess we are to believe that the kids ran out and then I imagine they might have called the Colonel not knowing what the F to do.  I believe she told them to go back there and CLEAN IT UP and that is when they went back, took the gun and got the hell out of there.  At that point they would have seen that Kyle shot himself and thought he was dead.  I guess, but still...I'd think that it wouldn't take the police a long time to get there from when the creepster neighbor called 911.  

[pagooey]

And yes, the police came to Sarah's house looking for Kyle, not evidence in the Skinner murder.

Not to mention, Linden and Holder might be the least incompetent members of an apparently terrible, horrible, Keystone Kops-level police force. She could've had a whole 20-round bandolier holster and a surface-to-air missile on the kitchen table go without notice. Is Kyle here? Hey, anybody seen Kyle? No? Okay, back to the boat, fellas. ;) (Not that I don't love them because I do, so much.)

 

 

I doubt Kyle forgot about his little sister. He never planned to kill her and would either have eventually left the house or killed himself. But when she saw him and asked about the monster, he knew she'd realize some day that he was that monster. He couldn't stand her living with that realization. It was selfish of him but I'm sure in his mixed-up mind it was a mercy killing.

 

This paralleled Linden's story in a way, too: Skinner revealed himself to be the monster she was chasing, and she put him down--which, given that he was a spree-killing child molester, I don't feel too bad about--in some terrible combination of horror and rage and mercy and, surely, humiliation. She'd loved him, and hadn't seen him for what he was...and then she had to become monstrous herself to finish it.

[shelley1234]

It's also odd to me that the show seemed to be asking us to feel compassion for Seward being executed for a crime he didn't commit, but to shrug off Mills being executed for, what, 27 crimes he didn't commit?  We know Mills was a violent criminal nonetheless, but so was Seward (by his own admission). It's not okay in either case. 

 

True.  I am always and forever against the death penalty, however I didn't feel much compassion for Joe Mills and the situation he found himself in.  The show spent a lot of time telling us the story of Seward and therefore we wanted to see his redemption and Linden to be able to find the truth in time.  I imagine if the show spent the same amount of time with Joe Mills I might feel the same.  I remember that one scene where Danette is telling Linden that she thought Joe was one of the good guys and thought he might be a father figure for Kallie.  Of course he wasn't much of a father figure when he was telling Kallie to take her clothes off and make a dirty porno.  

 

As for Linden and Holder, I never looked for them to be a couple either until the very end.  They just seemed like good partners, but never saw anything romantic between them in their partnership.  Even when Holder tried to kiss Linden in the end of Season 3, it was clearly just a moment of absolute pain and not because he was attracted to her.  However, I bought it in the last few scenes and thought they might just not destroy each other....maybe.  

[Whimsy]

Just finished season four.  I wasn't necessarily rooting for a Linden/Holder romance because I always thought Linden was a miserable human being.  But that scene with Holder standing super close and looking down on Linden- it did make me swoon. 

 

I thought Tyler Ross did a good job as Kyle.  Yes, the storyline was convoluted and kind of crazy, but my heart ached for Kyle when I thought he was still innocent and was being tortured by those boys in his school.  I couldn't understand how anyone could be so heartless.  Then, I thought he did a great job with the flashback and the story of what actually happened.  I mean, he did a good job with what he was given.  There are still some plot holes I am confused about- mostly how he came to live with the Stansbury's and the cut piano wires.  I think the first question is just that Kyle was adopted but they never made that clear.  But, maybe that's why they never seemed to love him like the other biological children.  The piano wires- I got nothing.  They said there was dust on them, that's how long ago they were cut.  Maybe Kyle wasn't ACTUALLY playing the piano?  The sound was only in his head?  I would've liked more clarification on that point too, since it was seemingly a big deal and was mentioned frequently. 

 

I also think adding the Colonial as the bio-mom was a little over the top.  She could've just been an overzealous "protector" of all of the boys and it still would've made sense (as much sense as anything else). 

 

Overall, I still enjoyed this little mini-season.  I am grateful to Netflix for picking it up. 

[shelley1234]

Just finished season four.  I wasn't necessarily rooting for a Linden/Holder romance because I always thought Linden was a miserable human being.  But that scene with Holder standing super close and looking down on Linden- it did make me swoon. 

 

I thought Tyler Ross did a good job as Kyle.  Yes, the storyline was convoluted and kind of crazy, but my heart ached for Kyle when I thought he was still innocent and was being tortured by those boys in his school.  I couldn't understand how anyone could be so heartless.  Then, I thought he did a great job with the flashback and the story of what actually happened.  I mean, he did a good job with what he was given.  There are still some plot holes I am confused about- mostly how he came to live with the Stansbury's and the cut piano wires.  I think the first question is just that Kyle was adopted but they never made that clear.  But, maybe that's why they never seemed to love him like the other biological children.  The piano wires- I got nothing.  They said there was dust on them, that's how long ago they were cut.  Maybe Kyle wasn't ACTUALLY playing the piano?  The sound was only in his head?  I would've liked more clarification on that point too, since it was seemingly a big deal and was mentioned frequently. 

 

I also think adding the Colonial as the bio-mom was a little over the top.  She could've just been an overzealous "protector" of all of the boys and it still would've made sense (as much sense as anything else). 

 

Overall, I still enjoyed this little mini-season.  I am grateful to Netflix for picking it up. 

 

As for how Kyle came to live with the Stanbury's....I had always assumed that Kyle's dad was in fact Mr. Stansbury.  I would think that it would have come out in the police investigation (but then again you never know with the Seattle PD) that he was in fact adopted by the family and not in fact related to any of the family that he may or may not have killed.  I assumed that Colonel "I can't be a mom" and Daddy Stansbury found themselves preggers while she was in the military and that she abandoned the baby aka Kyle and Daddio raised him.  That kind of explained to me why Kyle's dad might have resented him and hated him.  

[Whimsy]

Yeah, I can see it both ways and thought about that too. I just wonder how the wife agreed to raising Kyle- but she was her own brand of sicko...

[Cardie]

Yeah, my scenario was that Rayne dumped Kyle on his bio-dad Phil Stansbury who forced his wife to adopt the child with him. Rayne did say that she had known Phil for 20 years. The older daughter the Stansburys fawned over was their only biological child together, and Nadine was the result of one of Mom's dalliances with underage boys.

[Lyndy]

Re: the piano playing when the wires had been cut, I just assumed it was a "music is all in my crazy head" kind of thing which only proves that I'm quite capable of fanwanking on the fly. The whole military school plot had some issues but it also reminded me why I bloody love Joan Allen. The whole series had plot issues, of course, but you can't say they didn't develop the characters. I don't know that I need to see more of The Killing but I'm going to miss some of these characters for sure.

 

Also, I liked the conclusion. I appreciated that the Holder-Linden relationship is odd and still somewhat undefined. 

[seamusk]

I'm completely confused. I think Blond Buzzcut is up to no good. I bet he did it. 

 

That's what i'm thinking at this point.  Just something is off with him.  As someone else said, he seems to really want to impress Colonel Rayne.  And I can imagine as her right hand boy, that he has access to her car keys (or at least knows how to get access) and would be able to do the knife and gun sneak job.  Maybe he worked up a relationship with Kyle's mom?  Or, perhaps Rayne is Kyle's mom (as suggested herein) and that's why the Corolla was often at the house.  She would often visit with his dad?

why in the world do they all have flip phones?  I'm the lamest tech person ever, but even I have a swankier model phone!

I just assumed they were all phones given to them by the police and that they rarely budget to upgrade them.  It fits in well with some companies i've worked with.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I don't think Francis Fisher looks old enough to be Linden's mother. Even if she conceived her at the age of 12.

[Cardie]

Frances Fisher is 62 and Mireille Enos 38, so a mother/daughter relationship is quite feasible. The problem is that with all the expert plastic surgery actresses get in Hollywood, no one looks old enough to be the mother of anyone older than 12!