S07.E17: Reunion Part 1

[zoeysmom]

53 minutes ago, AnitaKnight said:

I think Jac was involved in strippergate.  Why else would she keep pointing out that Teresa didn't give Mel a heads up?  How was Teresa supposed to know that the guy was even going to be at the fashion show, let alone be mic'd and confront Melissa on camera? How could she give a warning about something she didn't know was going to happen?  Jac's big defense has been that she had a girlfriend that was in the room at the time he talked to Tre and heard the whole conversation, but didn't Kim D take Tre into a separate room in the salon where it was only her, Tre and the bald dude? That would mean that Jac's friend was Kim D.  Also, I'm with Melissa on this as to why Jac would miss the reunion the next day.  If anyone should have been too traumatized to show up, it should have been Mel, NOT Jac. 

It would have been a big nothing had Teresa not followed Melissa into the bathroom and told her what the guy said, on camera. teresa seemed more disappointed that Melissa called her husband.  Or in Teresa's world-HER BROTHER.  It is not as if Teresa could not have text Melissa the connection.  Phones seemed to be working overtime that night.  Teresa acts as if she had not been trash talking Melissa.  There was the, "she will leave you for a richer man," moment.  The only one who has been consistent is Joe Giudice in his disdain for Melissa.   

There would be producers and camera persons in the same room where the conversation took place at the salon.  And yes they talk to the other RH, to keep them anxious about what could come down.

The Reunion Jac missed did not cover the strippergate-Jac was there for that Reunion.  For the next entire year Teresa and her brother did not speak so I don't think Melissa was really convinced at that time that Jac was involved.

One thing the Giudice/Gorga should not so is get together and concoct conspiracy theories.  Collectively they have a remarkable lack of reality and seem to relish in revisionist history.  News for this clan, be careful who you want off the show, as your interest is waning-only so many contrived storylines of cute little families and new businesses.   

[zulualpha]

16 hours ago, charming said:

Teresa actually blamed Jacqueline and Caroline for setting her up with the Feds. She hasn't changed a single bit. She'll never take responsibility for the FRAUD she committed so she could live beyond her means in a mausoleum and finance her spending sprees.  

Teresa pled guilty to the charges and served prison time, is that not taking responsibility?  According to the gossip web sites she and Joe also completed paying restitution to the victims including all the back taxes that were owed.   When I see Teresa defending herself against people like Jacqueline, I think it's because she knows that they are trying to portray themselves as better than her and full of righteous indignation.  Which is laughable imo.

So Teresa didn't want to drive a Ford?  I don't want to drive a Ford either, I've a bad experience with a Ford so I drive a Toyota Rav4.  Point being, we can both drive whatever kind of car we want as long as we can pay the bill.  As Teresa said, she has paid her debts and now she wants to drive a Lexus, it's no one's business.  All these HWs go in for the status symbols.  Mercedes, Bentleys, designer clothes, outrageously expensive handbags and luggage, opulent vacations.  To me it's hypocritical to pick out one HW for criticism.   A book could be written on how these top 10% of the population choose to spend their wealth.  And in the case of people like Heather Dubrow, Lisa Vanderpump, Kyle Richards, Erika Gerardi, Betheny Frankel, the  top  1%.

[tenativelyyours]

The one bit of pleasure seeing LowBrow Guidice mouthing her excuses and attempts to blame anyone but herself and her knuckle dragging husband of their crimes is that it speaks to the level of entitlement and greed this creature has.  This type of deluded self-serving behavior strongly points to her simply taking what she can and thinking it is hers by right.  I so look forward to another cycle of her getting caught for something and having to deal with the second time around giving a stronger and longer sentence.  Because all this return to the show has done is justify her sense of victimization and reward her for being a criminal.  A thieving lying stinking piece of shit criminal.  And people like that tend to revert to basic core behavior.  Disgusting thieving piece of shit behavior.  I so hope this means that in the not too distance future this felonious piece of trash can't resist trying to take what isn't hers and I get to see her flushed socially like she should have been already.

[ginger90]

Teresa either got lousy advice or didn't pay any mind to good advice before taping the reunion. There's no way she should have said 90% of what she did, especially since Joe is incarcerated. 

[AndySmith]

Quote

And in the case of people like Heather Dubrow, Lisa Vanderpump, Kyle Richards, Erika Gerardi, Betheny Frankel, the  top  1%

Except unlike Theresa, those women can (legitimately) afford it.

[movingtargetgal]

9 minutes ago, zulualpha said:

Teresa pled guilty to the charges and served prison time, is that not taking responsibility?  According to the gossip web sites she and Joe also completed paying restitution to the victims including all the back taxes that were owed.   When I see Teresa defending herself against people like Jacqueline, I think it's because she knows that they are trying to portray themselves as better than her and full of righteous indignation.  Which is laughable imo.

Teresa has paid (and is still paying) for her's and Joe's crimes.  What more do people want from her?  She spent almost a year in prison, and Joe will be incarcerated for at least 3 1/2 years.  The loss of their freedom and in Joe's case the threat of deportation is their punishment.  Jac needs to stop being so self righteous because she and Chris are up to their eyeballs in debt.  They are accused of and being sued for several fraudulent acts and there may be criminal charges down the road.  I can't blame Teresa for defending herself against Jac's high school mean girl antics.  She has had enough of Jac's hypocrisy. 

[zoeysmom]

9 minutes ago, movingtargetgal said:

Teresa has paid (and is still paying) for her's and Joe's crimes.  What more do people want from her?  She spent almost a year in prison, and Joe will be incarcerated for at least 3 1/2 years.  The loss of their freedom and in Joe's case the threat of deportation is their punishment.  Jac needs to stop being so self righteous because she and Chris are up to their eyeballs in debt.  They are accused of and being sued for several fraudulent acts and there may be criminal charges down the road.  I can't blame Teresa for defending herself against Jac's high school mean girl antics.  She has had enough of Jac's hypocrisy. 

Chris and Jac's case is about 9 years old-if there were criminal charges pending they would have been filed by now.

It is Teresa blaming others, claiming she didn't know what she was signing that gives rise to the comments about her not accepting responsibility.  I read the transcripts, she concealed assets and businesses from the government and a whole slew of other payments.  It wasn't about not knowing what she was signing it was about trying to discharge her debt, keep her assets and rip off her creditors.  Teresa didn't got to prison for Chris' company's bankruptcy-she went to prison for her own actions.  I believe what she regrets most of all is there was prison time and Joe was not allowed to take the fall.

If Teresa doesn't want her past acts brought up perhaps she should stop bringing up Jac punching Caroline 14 years ago.

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, zulualpha said:

So Teresa didn't want to drive a Ford?  I don't want to drive a Ford either, I've a bad experience with a Ford so I drive a Toyota Rav4. 

I actually agree with most of your points about Tre, but I didn't take her comment about Fords as anything but snobbery. I HATE Fords. I have had horrible experiences with them as well. I'm a Chevy girl. I could care less if Tre wants to drive a Lexus, but I felt her car comment was more in line with "cleansy houses" than worrying about dependency, safety, etc. 

[Irritable]

I enjoyed that when Teresa was asked her feelings about the rumors that Joe cheated on her, her response was that if it were true she would go out and find the hottest guy... (and, what? presumably have sex with him? She never actually said what she would do with The Hottest Guy), because she KNOWS she's not ugly.  Mmmmm...I don't think that answer quite matches up with the question that was asked, but, okay.  Also, some people do think you're very ugly indeed, Teresa, so there's no reason to assume The Hottest Guy would want you, but I guess that's a minor quibble compared to all your other delusions.

Yeah, for someone who is already so sensitive about how her neck looks, I don't at all understand why Jacqueline went with that crazy choker.  Maybe it's like how some overweight people think if they swim in a big t-shirt shirt no one will be able to tell they are overweight?  She thought a choker big enough would cover her turkey neck?  Such a bad choice.

I get why Melissa is backing Teresa so hard right now.  I really do.  But I hate watching it, and I'm sure she feels disgusting doing it.  I had to tolerate a sister-in-law who is a total garbage person for many years, and it made me sick to my stomach, but I wanted to keep peace in the family and I loved my brother-in-law enough that I would do anything to maintain calm relations for holidays.  Sadly, he died, and I tried so hard afterward to be there for my S-I-L, but she burned me, and all I could say was OF COURSE SHE DID.  She burned everyone who had loved him, she burned down the whole family unit, and she burned every bridge on the way out because nothing else mattered but herself and what she wanted.  She's a hideous, greedy, selfish toxic piece of lying shit, just like Teresa, and one day Melissa will regret biting her tongue just to keep her flimsy, teetering position on Teresa's good side for the sake of her husband's happiness.  It's going to fall apart again, and Mel should probably buckle up.

I kind of love that Dina eventually just looked around at everyone in her circle and said, "You know what?  Screw this, I'm moving to the other side of the country and getting away from all of these backbiting lunatics."  I've never understood her friendship with Teresa and never will, but I don't for one second believe that it's anywhere near as strong now as it was a few years ago.  Good for Dina for taking the giant leap she needed to find some real peace.  I wish everyone could do that for themselves, or at least recognize that they need to make changes towards their own happiness instead of just walking through these infinite loops of fighting/making up/fighting/making up, like so many of the Real Housewives in all franchises seem to do.

[jaync]

Quote

According to the gossip web sites she and Joe also completed paying restitution to the victims including all the back taxes that were owed.  

Only the court-ordered restitution was paid...the creditors and workers who were g***** are still owed. If they decide to sue and win, the Giudices are fucked. Teresa may have to start riding a pole herself, because a yogi's salary won't cut it in paying off those millions.

Nobody set Teresa up, and it's beyond pathetic that she's still trying to sing that bullshit song. It's also insulting to the audience's intelligence, which she must think is as low as her creepy hairline.

[Juneau Gal]

Teresa, Teresa, Teresa....girl, you were winning this season and in one hour of reunion footage you have blown that all up. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Before the reunion aired and the commercials showed Tre stating "You set me up (sic)" or whatever exactly it was she said, I thought and hoped she was referring to that evening around the picnic table discussion Jacq tried to have with Tre many seasons ago. You now the one where she was pushing Tre to share with her all her problems and suddenly Caroline emerged out of the shadows and double downed with Jacq. I have always thought that was a clear effort on their parts to try to get Tre to spill damaging info on camera and I was standing by to support Tre in that accusation. But sadly, no, this was not what Tre was referring to and she went full on back to old Tre mode. Jacq is definitely not worth anyone losing their mind over; she's got the crazy all taken care of herself. Hate her, hate her choker.

[zulualpha]

2 hours ago, jaync said:

Only the court-ordered restitution was paid...the creditors and workers who were g***** are still owed. 

My understanding of bankruptcy court is that the creditors have to agree with the settlements,it's not "ordered" per se.

[zulualpha]

4 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I actually agree with most of your points about Tre, but I didn't take her comment about Fords as anything but snobbery. I HATE Fords. I have had horrible experiences with them as well. I'm a Chevy girl. I could care less if Tre wants to drive a Lexus, but I felt her car comment was more in line with "cleansy houses" than worrying about dependency, safety, etc. 

No, I know.  It's all about the status with these women.  Pretty much all these women.

[JAYJAY1979]

Delores' facial expressions were the best part of part 1.  she doesnt fit in with these women...and thats actually a compliment.

[happykitteh]

7 hours ago, movingtargetgal said:

Teresa has paid (and is still paying) for her's and Joe's crimes.  What more do people want from her?  She spent almost a year in prison, and Joe will be incarcerated for at least 3 1/2 years.  The loss of their freedom and in Joe's case the threat of deportation is their punishment.  Jac needs to stop being so self righteous because she and Chris are up to their eyeballs in debt.  They are accused of and being sued for several fraudulent acts and there may be criminal charges down the road.  I can't blame Teresa for defending herself against Jac's high school mean girl antics.  She has had enough of Jac's hypocrisy. 

Well said, Movingtargetgal! Does Jac, self righteous bitch, expect her to get the death penalty for a white collar crime? What Tre did was wrong but it's not like she murdered someone and she did her time and made the required payment under the law. Truth be told, I'd only pay what was required of me and not a dime more and IMO most people would do the same. I think there's some jealousy that Tre had a fairly short sentence, got to keep her house and cars - along with a bitchin' new Lexus-  and Jac may end up with nothing after her bankruptcy. Let's not forget she and her loser husband defrauded a cancer charity which IMO is a worse than what Tre did.

I absolutely believe it's possible that Caroline dropped a dime on Tre and then drug Jac along for the ride. What Tre did was wrong but so is what Caro did, if she is indeed guilty, because Caro didn't turn Tre in to the Feds out of a feeling of justice and moral obligation, esp since she and Al defrauded the taxpayers of NJ. Nope, bitch did it (again, if guilty) because of spite and jealousy. Caro thought the show would be a showcase for her and her half wit arrested development spawn. Once it became clear that it was turning into The Teresa Show and Tre's books were NYT best sellers you could actually see the change in Caro on camera. She was absolutely seething with rage, haha! Also, I remember her telling Andy on WWHL that she knew charges were coming for the Guidices but was a bit cryptic about it. Guess she had the heads up since she was the rat. This would also explain Jac trying to squeeze info out of Tre during that incident on Jac's deck, the one where after haranguing Tre for hours Caro just happens to come lumbering in.

[AndySmith]

I tend to agree with most people that Caroline and Jac couldn't have really done much damage to Theresa, unless they were somehow acting as Theresa and Joe's accountants or lawyers. I mean really, how much info could they have had on her and Joe with regards to their finances? At most, they could have just told the Feds the Giudice's were up to some shady shit.

Of course, the Feds would have probably replied "No shit, we've known for a couple of years now, but thanks anyway".

I hope Joe gets deported.

[ginger90]

If Joe gets deported, I have a feeling there will be a Real Housewives of _________, Italty.

[Kellyee]

Quote

I absolutely believe it's possible that Caroline dropped a dime on Tre and then drug Jac along for the ride.

Teresa ran around with wads of cash and built a massive house, and let it ALL be filmed and shown on national television, while filing bankruptcy. If anyone called the Feds, it was probably one of the show's viewers. Plus, Teresa and Joe were given chances to correct the situation with the Feds, and they continued to lie and play stupid. They went to jail just as much for being uncooperative as they did for the original fraud.

Can you even get a lease on a car after being charged with such massive financial crimes? Their credit has to be trashed, doesn't it? I want to hear Teresa's definition of "not a lot of money".

Quote

Teresa has paid (and is still paying) for her's and Joe's crimes.  What more do people want from her?

It would be nice if Teresa would admit the mess is their own fault, without using "but" and blaming other people.

Jacqueline did look crazy in the eyes though. Teresa is guilty, but Jacqueline is obsessed. She just can't let it go. And all the women need to stop it with the ball gowns. They look stupid, and after the last reunion, we all know they're really sitting in a nasty warehouse that was fixed to look fancy.

I wish they served sprinkle cookies at every reunion.

Edited November 8, 2016 by Kellyee
adding something

[Yolo]

On Sunday, November 06, 2016 at 11:04 PM, charming said:

Teresa actually blamed Jacqueline and Caroline for setting her up with the Feds. She hasn't changed a single bit. She'll never take responsibility for the FRAUD she committed so she could live beyond her means in a mausoleum and finance her spending sprees.  

This show needs to stop revolving around her "redemption" because there's not an ounce of character there. When Teresa sneered about driving a Ford she revealed who she really was, is and always will be.

Well said, Teresa is a slow idiot!

[ZaldamoWilder]

18 hours ago, zulualpha said:

Teresa pled guilty to the charges and served prison time, is that not taking responsibility?  According to the gossip web sites she and Joe also completed paying restitution to the victims including all the back taxes that were owed.   When I see Teresa defending herself against people like Jacqueline, I think it's because she knows that they are trying to portray themselves as better than her and full of righteous indignation.  Which is laughable imo.

So Teresa didn't want to drive a Ford?  I don't want to drive a Ford either, I've a bad experience with a Ford so I drive a Toyota Rav4.  Point being, we can both drive whatever kind of car we want as long as we can pay the bill.  As Teresa said, she has paid her debts and now she wants to drive a Lexus, it's no one's business.  All these HWs go in for the status symbols.  Mercedes, Bentleys, designer clothes, outrageously expensive handbags and luggage, opulent vacations.  To me it's hypocritical to pick out one HW for criticism.   A book could be written on how these top 10% of the population choose to spend their wealth.  And in the case of people like Heather Dubrow, Lisa Vanderpump, Kyle Richards, Erika Gerardi, Betheny Frankel, the  top  1%.

If there had been a way for either of them to get out from under the burden of the government's extensive evidence pile, I'm positive they would've entered a different plea.   So I see it less as taking responsibility than having it assigned by whatever mandatory sentence accompanies conviction.   If she actually had no problem accepting, let alone taking, responsibility, we wouldn't be subjected to cutesy euphemisms and vague/general terms for where she's been and what she was voluntarily complicit in doing.  To this day she, if she's pressed to describe what she was convicted of, she says she signed some papers without reading them.   Which doesn't really explain the post-charge surreptitious behavior exhibited towards her own defense attorney after he explained that full disclosure of assets was her last hope to avoid jail time.   Bruh.   The dude working to get you free said come clean, put everything down on that paper and she might let you go home with a slap on your wrist.   That disclosure was the judge literally giving the Guidices a last shot at accepting responsibility and they threw it away.  

We know Teresa not wanting to drive a Ford is not about practicality.   Andy said:  you don't care how it (buying a Lexus) looks (considering)?  Her response was:  would you drive a Ford?   In other words, either I am or my station is higher than that of somebody who couldn't afford anything better than a Ford.   No shade to the Ford name but I thought she meant this as synonymous with some putzy little standard issue $25,000 American car.  Several bits of irony hit me at once (1) Andy's answer to her was yeah actually I would (2) having so much hubris as to flat out state that you can afford a better car than a Ford, while still owing a fortune to an untold number of debtors is incredibly tactless and (3) Warren Buffet only recently gave up his putzy little standard issue $25,000 American car (a 2006 Cadillac) and replaced it with an updated version of the same car.   Not that she'd believe it but somebody oughta tell her that successfully wealthy people don't invest in depreciating assets.    

All in all it's a shame, I thought she was on track to be credibly redeemed.   But her fuck it, let em eat cake side is just as entertaining.  I'm watching either way. 

16 hours ago, Irritable said:

I enjoyed that when Teresa was asked her feelings about the rumors that Joe cheated on her, her response was that if it were true she would go out and find the hottest guy... (and, what? presumably have sex with him? She never actually said what she would do with The Hottest Guy), because she KNOWS she's not ugly.  Mmmmm...I don't think that answer quite matches up with the question that was asked, but, okay.  Also, some people do think you're very ugly indeed, Teresa, so there's no reason to assume The Hottest Guy would want you, but I guess that's a minor quibble compared to all your other delusions.

 

Ok I giggled at the tv.  I was like so Joe's not hot huh?  lmao!  I mean we knew it, but hell, I thought at least you believed it. 

[AndySmith]

Quote

Not that she'd believe it but somebody oughta tell her that successfully wealthy people don't invest in depreciating assets.    

Well, first you'd have to sit her down for like an hour or two and explain what all of those big fancy words mean.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

The Real Housewives Of New Jersey's Middle Name Is 'Toxic'

Butt implants, apes, and conspiracy theories in Part 1 of the seventh-season reunion.

[jaybird2]

kellyee, i'm going to play the devil's advocate here.  this is in response to your post re tre paying for things with as wad of cash.  (sorry, i don't know how to quote).  

during the first reunion it was brought by (if iirc) andy that she was paying cash for everything.  her response was "the producers told me to".  andy dropped the subject like a hot potato!

i thought it was strange to be paying with cash because it looked very fishy....but remember, this was when  the hw's franchise was in it's infancy.  little did we know how producer driven the shows are.   so i give her a pass on paying cash...

[AndySmith]

Andy never really brought it up. Theresa mentions in one of the clips that she paid so much cash because she "heard the economy was crashing". You can see that part starting at 04:34.

[tvfanatic13]

16 hours ago, zulualpha said:

My understanding of bankruptcy court is that the creditors have to agree with the settlements,it's not "ordered" per se.

Bankruptcy lawyer here. That is not true. A court can confirm a bankruptcy plan over the objection of creditors.

[Kellyee]

Quote

kellyee, i'm going to play the devil's advocate here.  this is in response to your post re tre paying for things with as wad of cash.  (sorry, i don't know how to quote).  

during the first reunion it was brought by (if iirc) andy that she was paying cash for everything.  her response was "the producers told me to".  andy dropped the subject like a hot potato!

That's very possible. However, when you are claiming you are bankrupt and can't pay bills, it doesn't look so good when you are building a massive house and buying $300+ worth of fancy clothes for your kids, and saying you get them whatever they want on national television. My point was that the Teresa shown on the show didn't match the poor Teresa described in bankruptcy documents. Caroline and Jacqueline didn't have to call the Feds. The whole thing looked fishy all by itself. And I still think they could have avoided jail time if they came clean up front and declared every single asset as soon as they were confronted with the allegations by the government.

I wish Andy had asked Teresa if she would have driven a Ford and lived in an apartment to keep Joe out of prison.

[happykitteh]

9 hours ago, Kellyee said:

Teresa ran around with wads of cash and built a massive house, and let it ALL be filmed and shown on national television, while filing bankruptcy. If anyone called the Feds, it was probably one of the show's viewers.

 

I would think - and hope - the Feds are intelligent enough to understand this is a television show and that reality tv is not really "real". They had to have more to go on to start an investigation than some tv viewer calling in a report.

Edited November 8, 2016 by happykitteh
left out the word "not"

[Natalie68]

On 11/6/2016 at 10:10 PM, breezy424 said:

Apparently, Tre thinks that driving, God forbid, a Ford is beneath her.  This, from the woman who NEVER filmed at the house she was living in during the first season.  The real Tre came out in part one of the reunion.  She's not sorry for anything she has done.  It was all Jac and Caroline's fault that she went to prison.

Good for you Tre.  You announce you know what autism is.  Too bad you don't get it.  Just like you don't 'get' why Danielle was upset about what you said about her when you screamed and flipped the table.  The question from Danielle was about what you said in front of 'her' children.  Your excuse:  Well, my children were there too.  This woman is clueless.

Joey's sex life?  How old were you?  Really?  Did I hear that right?  How old was your partner?  Disgusting.  Please correct me if I'm wrong....

Well when this show ends and she has no way of supporting herself in the manner to which she has grown accustomed I am not sure she COULD afford a Ford.  It is something that she thinks Caroline and Jac turned her in.  I seem to remember that they were being investigated well before the show but I could be mistaken.  Their stupidity just gave the feds et al more evidence than they previously had if its true.  I would love to see her IQ test results.  I am guessing it is in Forrest Gump territory.

[Natalie68]

4 hours ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

If there had been a way for either of them to get out from under the burden of the government's extensive evidence pile, I'm positive they would've entered a different plea.   So I see it less as taking responsibility than having it assigned by whatever mandatory sentence accompanies conviction.   If she actually had no problem accepting, let alone taking, responsibility, we wouldn't be subjected to cutesy euphemisms and vague/general terms for where she's been and what she was voluntarily complicit in doing.  To this day she, if she's pressed to describe what she was convicted of, she says she signed some papers without reading them.   Which doesn't really explain the post-charge surreptitious behavior exhibited towards her own defense attorney after he explained that full disclosure of assets was her last hope to avoid jail time.   Bruh.   The dude working to get you free said come clean, put everything down on that paper and she might let you go home with a slap on your wrist.   That disclosure was the judge literally giving the Guidices a last shot at accepting responsibility and they threw it away.  

We know Teresa not wanting to drive a Ford is not about practicality.   Andy said:  you don't care how it (buying a Lexus) looks (considering)?  Her response was:  would you drive a Ford?   In other words, either I am or my station is higher than that of somebody who couldn't afford anything better than a Ford.   No shade to the Ford name but I thought she meant this as synonymous with some putzy little standard issue $25,000 American car.  Several bits of irony hit me at once (1) Andy's answer to her was yeah actually I would (2) having so much hubris as to flat out state that you can afford a better car than a Ford, while still owing a fortune to an untold number of debtors is incredibly tactless and (3) Warren Buffet only recently gave up his putzy little standard issue $25,000 American car (a 2006 Cadillac) and replaced it with an updated version of the same car.   Not that she'd believe it but somebody oughta tell her that successfully wealthy people don't invest in depreciating assets.    

All in all it's a shame, I thought she was on track to be credibly redeemed.   But her fuck it, let em eat cake side is just as entertaining.  I'm watching either way. 

Ok I giggled at the tv.  I was like so Joe's not hot huh?  lmao!  I mean we knew it, but hell, I thought at least you believed it. 

There is the rub.  She would actually have to know what those words mean.  

Every time she films she is providing evidence that she is living beyond her means.  She owes 13 million dollars to creditors.  If she were living within her means that shit would be paid off.  

I have not watched but I was reading here that Joe Gorga claims he lost his virginity at 9 (at 9 that makes it stolen not lost).  Yes that does make him a victim of child molestation.  Its sad really.  But at least that 1/2 wit doesn't seem to FEEL scarred by it.  I hope he doesn't think its cute or something to be applauded if it happens to his own kid.  

I have had the theory all along that Real Housewives franchise is a front for the FBI.  There is a high number statistically it seems of major grifters associated with this franchise.  Hasn't there been someone busted for major financial crimes in each location?  

[ghoulina]

31 minutes ago, Natalie68 said:

I have not watched but I was reading here that Joe Gorga claims he lost his virginity at 9 (at 9 that makes it stolen not lost).  Yes that does make him a victim of child molestation.  Its sad really.  But at least that 1/2 wit doesn't seem to FEEL scarred by it.  I hope he doesn't think its cute or something to be applauded if it happens to his own kid.  

But that's my issue. No, he doesn't seem permanently damaged (although, there could be damage we don't see and he just doesn't understand), but the way he's crowing about it on TV, like it's really cool, makes me scared HIS kids will get into a similar situation. What happened to him is nothing to openly brag about. 

[MatildaMoody]

19 hours ago, zulualpha said:

My understanding of bankruptcy court is that the creditors have to agree with the settlements,it's not "ordered" per se.

But that is only true if they had actually been granted a bankruptcy. The thing that Teresa keeps omitting is that the they were denied the opportunity to discharge their debts through bankruptcy because there was so much fraud involved in their filings. THAT is what put the Feds on their trail, not Jac or Caroline, or Melissa or Joe Gorga.

The court ordered monies they paid was part of their punishment for federal fraud charges and does not go back to the original creditors that they were trying to discharge. Any settlement with their creditors would be on a per creditor basis because they aren't protected by a bankruptcy filing. So, Teresa is being disingenuous when she says she paid all of her debts. 

[ginger90]

One of the things that got me about Joe Gorga's age when he " became a man" , his words, was that Andy asked if Teresa had walked in on them. She said she did and then used it against him as a way to control him by threatening to tell their parents. I know she was around 11, but that's some f'd up shit.

[HunterHunted]

50 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

One of the things that got me about Joe Gorga's age when he " became a man" , his words, was that Andy asked if Teresa had walked in on them. She said she did and then used it against him as a way to control him by threatening to tell their parents. I know she was around 11, but that's some f'd up shit.

I'm wondering how old the other "participant" was. Maybe close to Joe's age?!? Not that it makes it better, but that might explain why Teresa used it as blackmail instead of reporting it. If it was a little girl Joe's age, it still could indicate that she had been molested or abused. Joe said he had older girls interested in him. Yuck. But if it was their babysitter raping him and Teresa didn't report it and used it for blackmail, then that really is fucked up.

When you add in Dolores' attempt to justify things by asking if you grew up around Italians, I'm curious and repulsed about this particular community of Italian Americans in New Jersey. I'm asking what the fuck is going on there.

[MatildaMoody]

53 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

One of the things that got me about Joe Gorga's age when he " became a man" , his words, was that Andy asked if Teresa had walked in on them. She said she did and then used it against him as a way to control him by threatening to tell their parents. I know she was around 11, but that's some f'd up shit.

It's beyond fucked up and disturbing.  Here we have child who was sexually abused (I honestly don't know what else to call it) who not only was too young to realize he was a victim, but whose older sister used his abuse against him (again she most likely didn't realize he was a victim) and both of them have children around the same age as the abuse and blackmailing began. And neither of them see anything wrong with laughing about it. It makes me wonder about the type of environment they grew up in that they, with children of their own, see this as a funny family anecdote.

I know that reunions are even more heavily edited than actual episodes, but is it even feasible that no one involved in filming raised an objection or tried to point out just how sick of a dynamic that is? Because how does that make it to air as family lore?

[nexxie]

12 hours ago, ginger90 said:

If Joe gets deported, I have a feeling there will be a Real Housewives of _________, Italty.

Love Italy - that would be fun, especially watching Milania navigate her new digs!

[happykitteh]

3 hours ago, MatildaMoody said:

I

3 hours ago, MatildaMoody said:

It's beyond fucked up and disturbing.  Here we have child who was sexually abused (I honestly don't know what else to call it) who not only was too young to realize he was a victim, but whose older sister used his abuse against him (again she most likely didn't realize he was a victim) and both of them have children around the same age as the abuse and blackmailing began. And neither of them see anything wrong with laughing about it. It makes me wonder about the type of environment they grew up in that they, with children of their own, see this as a funny family anecdote.

I know that reunions are even more heavily edited than actual episodes, but is it even feasible that no one involved in filming raised an objection or tried to point out just how sick of a dynamic that is? Because how does that make it to air as family lore?

I wonder if Joe and Tre are exaggerating this story and that Joe was more like age 13, Tre age 15 when this happened. Joe thinks it's macho to have lost his virginity and the earlier the more "manly" he sees himself.  I grew up old school Italian, dad came here as a child, mom's family shortly before she was born,  and didn't even know what sex WAS at the ages of 9 (Joe) and 11 (Tre). That was not discussed AT ALL in any of the old school Italian families I grew up with and at that young age the hormones that make you start thinking about it haven't kicked in yet.  I do think they grew up in a really fucked up household regardless of whether this story is true or not.

[LilaFowler]

Wacky Jac read all of Danielle Staub's court documents --  she's nuts.  She had someone fax them to her and she actually read through them.  I can easily believe that she sent out a thousand emails to anyone she could google about Teresa and Joe.

[Juliegirlj]

I get guilty pleasure out of watching Teresa, but there had to be a massive eye roll around the world when she said she is like Dolores in that, if her husband put his penis into another woman, it would be a deal breaker for the marriage. Juicy Joe sure seems like he dipped his wick a few times.

[Watermelon]

2 hours ago, Juliegirlj said:

I get guilty pleasure out of watching Teresa, but there had to be a massive eye roll around the world when she said she is like Dolores in that, if her husband put his penis into another woman, it would be a deal breaker for the marriage. Juicy Joe sure seems like he dipped his wick a few times.

If Teresa thinks I think Guidice was in the vineyard talking to a man in those low, dulcet tones, she's even more of an idiot than I thought.

[Kellyee]

Quote

I would think - and hope - the Feds are intelligent enough to understand this is a television show and that reality tv is not really "real". They had to have more to go on to start an investigation than some tv viewer calling in a report.

I think the Feds were clued in to Teresa and Joe because of their questionable bankruptcy filing, but I don't think the show helped them any. They advertise it to the public as their real life, and its marketed as their real life. That Teen Mom star ended up with a restraining order after she was filmed having a violent fight in front of her small child. If you let them film it and call it "real", you can get in trouble for it. And when you make dumb comments like saying you can't drive a Ford, you are asking for trouble.

[ginger90]

I haven't really had an opinion one way or the other about Delores. Until she freaking said Albie and Chris Manzo are mentoring her son. 

[zoeysmom]

1 hour ago, Kellyee said:

I think the Feds were clued in to Teresa and Joe because of their questionable bankruptcy filing, but I don't think the show helped them any. They advertise it to the public as their real life, and its marketed as their real life. That Teen Mom star ended up with a restraining order after she was filmed having a violent fight in front of her small child. If you let them film it and call it "real", you can get in trouble for it. And when you make dumb comments like saying you can't drive a Ford, you are asking for trouble.

One of the issues that came before the Bk Court, was the purchase of the Pizza Dump and the apartments that were featured on the show.  The Giudices attorney cringed when he saw the episode and said his phone would light up like a Christmas tree, when these episodes aired.  Joe's father claimed he bought it but had misplaced the documents or some such nonsense.  That had nothing to do with Jacqueline and Caroline.  Jac, Chris and Caroline even bought the Joe fell asleep at the wheel story when he was arrested for drunk driving and put that story out there that he yawned and hit the tree.  Tre did show the receipts from the six figure on air furniture extravaganza, turns out it was $16,000.00.  She also received a $60,000.00, and had the hubris to tell the Court, she had blown it on drapes and the like, while still owing money to her creditors (there was nothing illegal about spending the 60k), it was just another example of the Giudices working the system.

Teresa thinks paying off the mortgage lenders who were defrauded wipes the slate clean-and claims they paid everything off.  There are still outstanding creditors and various tax liens.

[Iguessnot]

On 11/7/2016 at 6:11 PM, Irritable said:

Yeah, for someone who is already so sensitive about how her neck looks, I don't at all understand why Jacqueline went with that crazy choker.  Maybe it's like how some overweight people think if they swim in a big t-shirt shirt no one will be able to tell they are overweight?  She thought a choker big enough would cover her turkey neck?  Such a bad choice.

A woman wears a big shirt while swimming for a couple of reasons. One, she's modest and whether model thin or overweight, she's not putting her goods on display. Two, she's overweight and she has bumps and rolls that aren't cute to look at so she's not interested in displaying these issues.

Anyway, Jacqueline looked like a growing turtle stuck in a soda can plastic ring.  

[zoeysmom]

44 minutes ago, Iguessnot said:

A woman wears a big shirt while swimming for a couple of reasons. One, she's modest and whether model thin or overweight, she's not putting her goods on display. Two, she's overweight and she has bumps and rolls that aren't cute to look at so she's not interested in displaying these issues.

Anyway, Jacqueline looked like a growing turtle stuck in a soda can plastic ring.  

Jac needs to forget about her neck.  She is going on 50, is a grandma, and needs to just accept her body and face for what they are.  People care more about the cover up than the neck wrinkles.  With all of Jac's issues her neck is way down the list.  She might want to tone down the fillers as well-it makes her face look huge. 

[Iguessnot]

20 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Jac needs to forget about her neck.  She is going on 50, is a grandma, and needs to just accept her body and face for what they are.  People care more about the cover up than the neck wrinkles.  With all of Jac's issues her neck is way down the list.  She might want to tone down the fillers as well-it makes her face look huge. 

Seriously. When are these women going to develop a sense of themselves beyond being the hot beyotch at the prom?

Edited November 11, 2016 by Iguessnot

[FamilyVan]

Her choker was digging into her neck so hard that the skin above it was folding over the top of it.  Her face has a moon-face look from all the botox and fillers, and she talks like she just came from the dentist and her novocaine has not worn off yet.  She should just stop trying to look 30. 

[Angelsmom1009]

On November 8, 2016 at 6:42 PM, MatildaMoody said:

It's beyond fucked up and disturbing.  Here we have child who was sexually abused (I honestly don't know what else to call it) who not only was too young to realize he was a victim, but whose older sister used his abuse against him (again she most likely didn't realize he was a victim) and both of them have children around the same age as the abuse and blackmailing began. And neither of them see anything wrong with laughing about it. It makes me wonder about the type of environment they grew up in that they, with children of their own, see this as a funny family anecdote.

I know that reunions are even more heavily edited than actual episodes, but is it even feasible that no one involved in filming raised an objection or tried to point out just how sick of a dynamic that is? Because how does that make it to air as family lore?

I completely agree with this, especially the bolded part. There were some really effed up things going on in that Gorga house, and it wasn't the "incredible Italian upbringing" that they like to brag about, and the truth started bubbling up in Season 3.  Papa Gorga has always given me a creep vibe, the vicious below-the-belt way they all attacked each other, the long history of fights between the parents etc. That's why I can't completely hate on Melissa, because I think she didn't realize how much of a shit storm she married into when her and Joey got together. That's also why I can't get on the board that the truce between her and Tre is only for the show.  Some of it may be, but I think more than anything, they saw how they were on previous seasons, how much their kids were hurting, plus the very real life situation of Tre and Joe getting indicted, and they just got tired.  So instead of continuing nonsense fighting that has literally spanned generations, they just decided to stop and move forward. 

Nothing really to say about anyone else…Teresa basically erased any redemption that she built up throughout the season (FYI I drive a Ford and I rather like it, thankyouverymuch), Jacqueline lived up to her wacky name, Dolores and Siggy were just there, and Andy seemed over it. I don't think this franchise is going to last much longer. 

[AndySmith]

Quote

FYI I drive a Ford and I rather like it, thankyouverymuch

Yeah, but unlike Theresa, you're just a basic peasant, whereas she is a cosmopolitan, upper-class, sophisticated, worldly blue blood who is entitled to luxurious things.

I mean, honestly, how can people not understand that?

Edited November 11, 2016 by AndySmith

[HunterHunted]

On Tuesday, November 08, 2016 at 2:50 PM, Natalie68 said:

I have had the theory all along that Real Housewives franchise is a front for the FBI.  There is a high number statistically it seems of major grifters associated with this franchise.  Hasn't there been someone busted for major financial crimes in each location?  

I guess that explains why Kingsley is on the FBI's most wanted list. Maybe if Kingsley had committed tax, mortgage, or bankruptcy fraud, someone would have caught him and kept him from mauling people.

Edited November 13, 2016 by HunterHunted

[breezy424]

Tre and Joe did not pay full restitution for their debts.  Correct me if I'm wrong but most of their debt had to do with properties that they allowed to go into foreclosure which included their income properties as well as the vacation home and the Lincoln Park home (the one with the linoleum floors).  Foreclosure doesn't mean the 'debt' is paid.  It means that the property is taken over by the bank and the bank takes the loss.  Who pays for the loss?  We do.  We pay for loses by banks.  We pay higher fees.  We pay higher interest on loans.

Jac and Caroline did not set up Tre.  Joe and Tre set themselves up.  They both lied on loan applications.  The court didn't need either Jac or Caroline to give them information.  The information given by Joe and Tre couldn't be backed up.  Tre submitted false W2's.  Easily verified by the IRS.  It's all BS.  But that's Tre and Joe's MO.  The loan officers may have bought it or were willing to buy it with a 'wink' but the court didn't because there was no verification.

Joe and Tre cheated the banks out of millions.  Yeah,  God forbid Tre drive a Ford when she can afford a Lexus.  But the only reason she can afford the Lexus is because they defaulted on millions of dollars of loans and the consequence is that no one is going to give them a loan on anything.  That's all the banks can do.  Unfair?  Yes.  Bottom line:  Neither of them have any sense of morality or integrity and neither of them care.  How dare Tre enter a church and pray.  She's full of shit and always be full of it.