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Season Six: The Destruction of Bobby Goren Commences

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Sorry for the depressing title, but that's how I see Season Six--when WarrenthehackandtalentlessfuckwitLeight becomes show runner.

Bobby Goren is no longer this smart as a whip, intelligent detective, but is someone who is suddenly overwhelmed by his mother's illness, and can't even string a single sentence together without stuttering. I HATE Leight for that alone.

Oh and for giving us that arrogant, blowhard, Ross. Whose attitude toward Goren once he got to Major Case peeved me beyond reason.

Though of course, this season also gave us "Worlds' Fair" a Logan episode, which is one of my favorites.  When Logan asks that Jewish kid, who was threatening all those illegals with a chainsaw, to put his hands on the table and to spread his fingers...and then SLAMS! his fist over said hand--though the kid is quick enough to remove said hand.

Then there's my favorite line, when Logan is questioning Meena's "fiancé" when he says his alibi is that he was at a "restaurant", and that Meena was a "whore." Turns out the restaurant was a strip club.

Logan: "Was it a pure one?" Oh, SNAP!

Watching  season six, it's really weird how Leight just SHOVED Bobby's "mental" issues down my throat, starting with "War at Home"  where we first see his mom, followed by "Brother's Keeper", and making Bobby all slovenly, not wearing a suit...saw some shades of my Bobby in "Privileged", where Doris Roberts was AWESOME.

And then I'm all peeved and pissed in "Players" where that rich entitled son of a federal prosecutor, thinks he's Black and acts all "gangsta" and Ross, the putz, figures to put the blame on the lone BLACK kid involved. True, they probably, or HE didn't think Colin (the black Kid) did it or was the leader, because Logan, love him! KNEW it was the rich fucking WHITE kid.

Oh, and they didn't change history that Bobby's mom was schizophrenic to having cancer. She had cancer, final stage or something, in addition to her being schizophrenic. ( I thought someone either here or maybe it was TWoP mentioned it or something).

But I do have to admit that between Season five and six, Noth somehow got more sexier and slimmed down, whereas, D'Onofrio, the opposite. Me no likey, that the toll on D'Onofrio was starting to show. Or was it a deliberate choice since we were getting lambasted with all his personal and family issues? Bobby's, not D'Onofrio's.

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About Bobby's mom, I remember reading an article or post where it was said that Frances Goren worked more effectively as an unseen character, and I agree. There was something more potent about her influence that way.

Rita Moreno was a good actress, but her take on Frances just never worked for me.

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I love Ross!! And fattie beardo Goren, ha ha.

As can be deduced by now, I can't sign off on Ross love, BUT...while I MUCH preferred Sharp-Dressed Man (TM ZZ Top) Bobby Goren and his suits, I didn't find him repulsive or anything with the weight. Maybe because it was Bobby's mind that always made him cooler to me, if different.

Still, once S10 rolled around, I was thrilled to see him back in a suit in "Rispetto"! It's the little things.

As for S6 (this thread's true topic!), I thought he looked good in "Siren Call" and liked that one, if just for the fact that it wasn't all wrapped in a bow and had a dark ending. And I have a love-hate deal with "Blind Spot". I liked that Alex disappearing threw Bobby off and he was just human and not in control, and I liked that Alex saved herself, but I hate that the show even went there and had Alex tortured like that.

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Not to cross-contaminate the L&O world

Nothing wrong with that, to me, since there have been the occasional crossovers, and these characters seemed to exist in the same "world", so to speak! But I do agree that the Mothership was best at meting out info in small chunks, but enough to feel satisfied overall.

Leight deciding (I assume it stopped with his decision, being the EP) to give Frances a face/presence really undercut a lot of the psychological concept, which is the root of Bobby Goren right there. Leight was on CI under Balcer, and it astounds me that he never grasped that, and watered things down.

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I liked that Alex saved herself

That is one of my favorite aspects of this episode. While SVU will tell you again and again and again how strong and amazing Benson is, CI shows Eames being strong and resourceful.

Edited by stacey · Reason: Fixing duplicated text
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Hey there all L&O:CI fans, this is your spot to talk about the specific episodes found in Season Six, they include:

 

1 Blind Spot 2006-09-19
2 Tru Love 2006-09-26
3 Siren Call 2006-10-03
4 Maltese Cross 2006-10-10
5 Bedfellows 2006-10-17
6 Masquerade 2006-10-31
7 Country Crossover 2006-11-07
8 The War at Home 2006-11-14
9 Blasters 2006-11-21
10 Weeping Willow 2006-11-28
11 World's Fair 2007-01-02
12 Privilege 2007-01-09
13 Albatross 2007-02-06
14 Flipped 2007-02-13
15 Brother's Keeper 2007-02-20
16 30 2007-02-27
17 Players 2007-03-27
18 Silencer 2007-04-03
19 Rocket Man 2007-05-01
20 Bombshell 2007-05-08
21 Endgame 2007-05-14
22 Renewal 2007-05-21

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Just finished watching "Brother's Keeper" and ashamedly, I can't remember if it was here that Bobby told Alex that his mother wanted to meet her? Or is that in another episode? Because it was here that Frank asked Bobby if Alex was Bobby's wife.  I guess the drugs must have really addled Frank's brains for him not to know what "partner" meant, considering that Bobby is a fucking COP.

 

And gah, I wanted to punch Ross's face in "30", the polonium poison episode. Oh gee, a murder victim isn't being honest and so because of that, the case is over? STFU, you arrogant putz/puppet of the brass.  Loved it when Mike got in his face. Yep, Mike still has that famous temper, though it was muted a bit his last season. But it came rarin' back during his last few episodes. It's like, ingrained in his DNA or something, heh.

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As I said to you before, GHScorpiosRule, although it was later in S7, I also loved Logan reaming out Ross in "Senseless", when Logan accused Ross of speaking for the suits upstairs or whatever. Poor Falacci, the usual hothead here, had to play referee.

 

I know many warmed to Danny Ross, but I always thought he was a blowhard douchebag 9 times out of 10. When I like blink-and-miss Joseph Hannah better (way after Deakins, of course!), you know it's bad.

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Which brings to mind, since I never watched Season 9 after Loyalty, was Mary Elizabeth Mastroantonio's captain a total failure? I like the actress, so I'm wondering why they didn't bring her back? It would have been...interesting to see Bobby interact with her. From the one or two scenes I recall, she gave off the vibe of being the female version of Deakins. Or am I just hallucinating that?

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Which brings to mind, since I never watched Season 9 after Loyalty, was Mary Elizabeth Mastroantonio's captain a total failure? I like the actress, so I'm wondering why they didn't bring her back? It would have been...interesting to see Bobby interact with her. From the one or two scenes I recall, she gave off the vibe of being the female version of Deakins. Or am I just hallucinating that?

 

I have watched most of S9 through the marathons (as I never watched in real time and only watch Loyalty on the S9 set, to be honest), and Zoe Callas seemed pretty low key. But maybe, like Jeff Goldblum, Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio wasn't given a heads up if CI was coming back and got a better deal elsewhere.

 

But as much as I had no use for S9 much, it is odd that these characters just went poof once S10 rolled around.

Edited by WendyR72

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Though of course, this season also gave us "Worlds' Fair" a Logan episode, which is one of my favorites.

It was a Logan and Wheeler episode.  And I liked that episode if only for the awkward faces on Logan, Wheeler, and Meena's father as Wheeler was used as the prop for how Meena got killed.

 

Speaking of the latter, this season also saw the departure of Barek and the introduction of Wheeler as her replacement.  Honestly . . . I don't know why everyone is so down on her.  Most places I go, people liked her, for the most part.  I mean, yeah, her youthful look made her come off as less experienced than she was, and she seemed a bit too low-key.  But it says something to me that the writers took more care to flesh out her character's background and personality than they did with Barek.  Plus, I think Julianne herself was pretty low-key in her acting, hence why Wheeler might've come off as such.  Plus, Wheeler appearing so young did help them quite a few times, like when she "played young" in "Maltese Cross" and was picked to speak to the "kidnappers" in "Weeping Willow" (which had one of the moments she showed a larger amount of personality -- her complete reluctance to make the public announcement when Logan and Ross both looked to her to do it).

 

On the whole, despite the complaints about Wheeler, she'd always been my favorite of the Logan partners.  I thought she was a decent fit for him as a partner, and it seemed like season six was partly about them coming together and respecting each other as partners.

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Megan Wheeler just didn't seem like a seasoned detective to me. I'm sure her youthful look and demeanor did help those cases, but honestly, I could never buy she was some dynamo as Ross had described her to Logan.

 

Carolyn Barek did have the vibe for me, that she had seen a lot, did a lot, and had clawed her way to a detective's shield. 

 

It's nothing to do with being down on Wheeler. The character just, to me, would have been a better fit as a new uniformed officer. But for the stuff on CI, she just didn't "fit", but that's just one person's opinion. Others obviously felt differently, which...hey, again, viva la difference, and all that.

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While "Endgame" sort of veered towards soap, I do think all involved performed really well. But it was depressing.

 

So what did the show do? Why, it decided to follow suit with "Renewal", Logan's season ender, too. God, could no one not be miserable?

 

I did find it odd that he and Wheeler seemed to work two cases with minimal input from the other. And why was Mike so afraid that Wheeler wasn't coming back from her European job?

 

Chris Noth did a great job, but Mike seemed way more broken up about Holly than I expected. Didn't they just meet?

Edited by WendyR72
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I think it's what both represented, a sense of unwanted change or abandonment.  I think Leight breathed new life into the show.  Season 5 was terrible.  I heard it was Vincent who wanted to take Goren down.

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Well, there's taking Goren down and then putting him so deep into the rabbit hole that he can barely dig himself out. So even if it WAS VDO's idea, I still blame Leight for the execution. As it is, it is Leight who has taken delight in turning SVU into "let's drag Benson to hell every damned episode", so, yeah. I hold him accountable for HOW it all played out.

 

In any case, I liked a portion of S6, but the seeds of doom and angst were planted. S7 had a few good episodes, but that was just so DARK. S8 pre-"Loyalty" lightened up a tad (and while I thought Leight was there in S8, someone named Waylon Something was EP then, so maybe that's why S8 lightened up).

 

I was personally very happy with S10. Goren was even-keeled again and not looking as if he wanted to slit his wrists, even in therapy. It was nice to see some levity and, dare I say it, a smile or two...

 

To tie it all to the topic, I think S6 was the turning point into the rabbit hole right from the premiere with Eames being tortured. And it took the show forever to dig out.

 

And this is just me, but I liked S5. Hell, I think the first 5 seasons of CI were its best years by far, then S10. The rest? At the bottom.

Edited by WendyR72
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They were a roller coaster for me, with season 3 and 4 being small hills, 5 being a trough, and half of 7 being a trough again until 10.  A real Space Mountain.

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I did find it odd that he and Wheeler seemed to work two cases with minimal input from the other.

I found it odd that Eames was free to work with Wheeler in that episode, but there was no mention of Goren.  Not that I minded them being kick-ass and taking down that crazy woman, but couldn't he have been free, as well?

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As the title here says, this season began Bobby's downfall, and the more personal nature of the show. But I noticed when seeing some S6 episodes again, I think it is around now that Bobby and Alex went from partners who respected each other to actual friends (although maybe S5 opened that door with the whole letter business in court and Alex trying to reign Bobby in regarding his mother with Carver's help).

 

I say this because I noticed in "Siren Call" that Bobby confided to Wasniewski, the suspect, about his mother's lymphoma and about her time being in months [since the suspect's wife had breast/liver cancer] and Alex looking surprised (though she covered) and then later asked Bobby about it. He actually cracked a bit and said his mom's a fighter.

 

Again, and I'm now blanking on the episode, but it was the one with Tom Arnold as a preacher whose wife with labyrinthitis was murdered, Bobby ran into Frank, who asked Bobby in front of Alex, "How's mom?" and her look of surprise again. (I am guessing Alex knew he had a brother but not the circumstances.) I am guessing Bobby was ashamed of Frank and also had issues with his mom, so he kept it close to the vest, and only when things were exposed against his better judgment/out of his control, did it seem like he realized that Alex didn't look down on any of it.

 

Then again, I think Bobby was blind to a lot of support or whatever as he seemed to want to compartmentalize things and not share, and I think that's why he started being so fucked up emotionally. Not that he needed to have it all hang out (as it seemed to be in S7), but still.

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Again, and I'm now blanking on the episode, but it was the one with Tom Arnold as a preacher whose wife with labyrinthitis was murdered, Bobby ran into Frank, who asked Bobby in front of Alex, "How's mom?" and her look of surprise again. (I am guessing Alex knew he had a brother but not the circumstances.) I am guessing Bobby was ashamed of Frank and also had issues with his mom, so he kept it close to the vest, and only when things were exposed against his better judgment/out of his control, did it seem like he realized that Alex didn't look down on any of it.

 

I can't remember, but I'm pretty sure in Season 2 or 3, one of the perps they were investigating, got someone to see Bobby's mom, and he went ballistic. He shoved papers off his desk, said something, about his mother, and stormed out, leaving Alex and I think Deakins, to look at each other. So, Alex does know he has a mother. I say earlier seasons, because Bobby was still lean, pardon the pun.

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Oh, I forgot that. But for the most part, Bobby seemed to try to keep his two worlds separate. I know Alex knew he had a mom with issues as far back as "See Me" (when she told Carver "Don't ask"), but I'm not sure that she knew just how...severe, maybe, her particular case was. But the desk thing and then flipping out in "Wee..." certainly would clue her in fast.

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Yeah, and likely hired that fake friend of Bobby's to go rile his mom up. (And I know it's fiction, but Bobby should have sued the place. Hee.) But, yeah, I think in S6, that's when the cracks appeared and those two sides started to merge. Luckily, Alex was a good friend, even if she had to pull teeth.

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He was in Tenn.

That was season eight, when Eames worked with Nichols.  I don't know where he was when she worked with Wheeler in season six.

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My guess would be bereavement leave, since his mother had just died the prior episode (depending on the timeline that the episode with Logan/Wheeler/Eames took place shortly after "Endgame", anyway.)

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Gawd. I felt so sorry for those kids, knowing the favoritism would carry on to Adlaaaaaaaaaaaai's son. That whole family was screwed up.

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Liza Minelli. CI. File under "What were they THINKING?!"

 

OK, Ms. Minelli USED TO not be a joke and a decent actress, but it's clear in this episode she is hammier than Porky Pig, and it ruins what is basically an interesting idea for a story. (Apologies if any such fans are lurking here!)

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Why do I do this to myself? Just from the first two episodes of this season, Ross comes in, waving his dick, if you will...telling Bobby and Mike who's in CHARGE...as if he's got something to prove and it continues to irk and piss me off.

 

And though it wasn't quite said, I got feeling in "True Love" I think it was? With the stoopid teenager who was having the affair with his teacher, who was also having sex with said teen's father, and was married to the much more hotter LaPaglia brother, that Barek returned to the FBI.  I think it was also referenced again that's where she was in a later episode. Just STFU, Ross and leave the detectives alone to do their job. Oh, wait. He only does that with Wheeler.

 

Yeah, yeah, I know the father was blackmailing Danielle to have sex with him, and he was...just not attractive. At all. UGH.

 

And yeah, though the new ADA said that Carver referred to Major Case as "Major Hunch" I can see why he did. So many times, the didn't have the evidence and Carver went along with them, based on Bobby's gut and hunch, heh.

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True about hunches, but they did pay off, so it made Carver look good.  LOL!

 

And of course Douchebag Ross only left Wheeler alone since he brought her to MCS..

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Gawd. I felt so sorry for those kids, knowing the favoritism would carry on to Adlaaaaaaaaaaaai's son. That whole family was screwed up.

I seem to have gotten ignored twice in saying this, I'll do so again.  I really wanted to give the less-than-favored kid a hug at the end of the episode.  And I get the feeling, based on their reactions, that Goren and Eames looked like they really wanted to, as well.  Anyone else feel that way?

 

 

 

And of course Douchebag Ross only left Wheeler alone since he brought her to MCS.

Probably helps that she didn't go off half-cocked when it came to some things the way Logan did.

Edited by Donny Ketchum
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I wasn't ignoring you, @Donny Ketchum , I just must have missed the post about hugging the unfavored kid. I agree, and agree G/E looked like they wanted to (and looked disgusted at the poor excuse of a grandfather).

 

But we differ on Ross (obviously - LOL!). I don't think it's JUST that Wheeler is calmer. I mean, she became engaged to a criminal (which caused an issue) and while OBVIOUSLY not her fault, Ross didn't even question her judgment or whatever - just said she made a mistake, while comparatively, Goren finds out he was spawned by a killer, but in Ross' eyes, that suddenly meant Bobby was a possible murderer, too. Even though Bobby, like Wheeler, never chose to be tied to someone with such a background.

 

And while Logan WAS a hothead, he was also often good with his gut, and I think that pissed the suits off.

 

So I think Ross had his favorites (Nichols, Wheeler) and everyone else was just there to be barely tolerated (maybe minus Eames, whom he seemed to respect).

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"Tru Love" was on yesterday.  And it had what's probably one of my most favorite Wheeler moments in it.  Did anyone else think the auto mechanic had a bit of a thing for Wheeler?  She was making eyes at her pretty openly.  Wheeler's facial expression told me she had to have suspected that.  Then, when she and Logan revisit her later in the episode, she confirms she's a lesbian with a girlfriend.  Wheeler's subsequent smile tells me she did indeed suspect that.

 

Julianne certainly wasn't the strongest or best of actresses on the show, but she gave Wheeler some pretty good facial reactions.

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I did see that and admit Julianne Nicholson did a good job with that whole thing.

 

While I wasn't a huge Wheeler fan, I oddly found I do/did like Julianne Nicholson on yet another L&O offshoot (only lasting one season with SVU's Alex Cabot/Stephanie March), Conviction. Perhaps its because she seemed suited to her character, Christina Finn, a wet-behind-the-ears ADA. Her young appearance (and demeanor on that show) worked for me where the actress was concerned there. (And must have been her unofficial casting reel since she was cast on CI shortly after that show's demise.)

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Nah. She made her first appearance on the mothership. On trial for the murder of her half-brother.

 

See? They all start at the mothership and then...converge elsewhere!

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Not surprising, @GHScorpiosRule . :-)  But I figure Conviction was likely the unofficial audition reel for JN for CI because it ended the same year JN started on CI, so it was likely more recent!

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Why do I do this to myself? Just from the first two episodes of this season, Ross comes in, waving his dick, if you will...telling Bobby and Mike who's in CHARGE...as if he's got something to prove and it continues to irk and piss me off.

 

Let us remember, @GHScorpiosRule , he also pulled that shit on Alex, as he was talking shit about Bobby's rep and Alex was being all flip with Ross, telling him that she and Bobby are a team.

 

After she made said flip remark in answering Ross about Bobby, we got the ol' "it took me a long time to get here and I have the POWAH and don't forget it!" speech.

 

I realize CI wanted to differentiate Deakins and Ross and have another angle, but did they have to have this guy start off as, no other way to put it, such an insecure raging asshole in the process?

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Wow, this episode ("Bombshell") doesn't even TRY to disguise the Anna Nicole/son Daniel tragedies. Sincerely shocked the show wasn't sued. And I barely recognized the original Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Kristy Swanson, as the Anna Nicole wannabe.

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I remember reading Kristy agreed to do this, and she'd just had a baby, which explains how...lush she looked. I'd say that CI did a much better job of it than the mothership with Muriel Hemingsway did.

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Yep, Roy Scheider played a creepy charismatic serial killer to the hilt. Good job there. I did like the angle of Mark Linn Baker's OCD character from seasons before giving Goren Brady's message.

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@Chattygal, it's because S6 opened with a new show runner. Rene Balcer (who was there for the first 5 seasons) left, and Warren Leight took the reins for S6 and S7. Waylon Green was the EP for S8, no idea who was EP for S9, maybe still Green?, and Chris Brancato was EP for S10 (which, to me, harkened back to "early" CI, but that's my take only).

 

But it says a lot when one notices the drastic changes not even knowing about the changing of the show runner guard. And of all that, the theme even changes in S7 (when CI moved from NBC to USA [NBC owns it]) when it used the theme to the canceled Law & Order: Trial By Jury. I found the theme OTT and missed the original. But I'm anal retentive like that!

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WGN had "Blind Spot" yesterday and "Bedfellows" today. Blondes with pixie cuts were bad news in season 6.

 

Hee. So sad, yet so true, @Eolivet .

"Privilege," "Albatross" and "Flipped": You have now entered the part of the season where straightforward cold opens have been replaced by music videos.

 

Yeah. But after those...auspicious beginnings...I thought "Privileged" was decent. Doris Roberts did fine in a more dramatic role. S6 was a mixed bag for me, to be honest. And despite its soapy, bordering on ridiculous premise, the end of the season with VDO and Roy Scheider in "Endgame" is, IMO, a worthy episode to watch.

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I don't know what the reasons for the flashier openings were, to be honest, unless it was simply Leight wanting to leave a mark or something. Not all episodes had them. But those that did, they unfortunately stand out more, and not in a great way. However, I did notice that in the more "heavy episodes" (i.e. "Blind Spot", "The War At Home", "Endgame", "Framed" in S7), those kind of openings were toned down, thankfully.

 

Still, as you know doubt know by reading this forum, I'm not a Warren Leight fan. And I'm not at all happy with what he has turned SVU into now that he is EP there, so...

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I do find the back and forth between Goren & Eames and Logan & Wheeler to be sort of jarring. I like it in concept - I think instead of cancelling, NBC should have kept L&O mothership, folded SVU back into it, and rotated casts over twenty-four episodes, However, it would have been nice if the detectives would at least reference (or glimpse) each other occasionally.

 

Especially since all L&O series are/were in the same universe (i.e. Van Buren crossing over to CI to consult with G/E in S1's "Badge"; in the S14 episode I deny - as CI's ending was perfect, Eames crossed over to SVU, etc.), so all the detectives referencing each other wouldn't be unheard of.

 

The closest I've ever seen of such a thing, however, was on an Emmy "For Your Consideration" set cover with the casts of all 3 series mingling on the cover (along with semi-offshoot [Alex Cabot as head of the department], Conviction, back in the day.)

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I think Logan referred to Goren in "Blasters" while talking to Wheeler, mentioning that he would've known the meaning of a phrase or term that she didn't know.

 

Also, Logan was mentioned by someone in "On Fire," even though Goren and Eames were in the episode, not he and Barek.

 

Finally, I'm just gonna say it.  I love how everyone here will totally, happily mention Goren/Eames episodes, but completely discount Logan/Wheeler ones.  Blech.

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Finally, I'm just gonna say it.  I love how everyone here will totally, happily mention Goren/Eames episodes, but completely discount Logan/Wheeler ones.  Blech.

 

I don't see that, @Donny Ketchum . I did see @Chattygal say the back and forth between the two teams is jarring. And I see her point. But like she also said, it was generally not a bad idea.

 

Talk about Wheeler (I know she is your favorite) and Logan, if you like. I'm sure others would be willing to discuss them if something is said to spur discussion.

 

The trouble - and this only applies to me - is maybe besides "Neighborhood Watch" and "Last Rites", not many of their episodes stood out for me much, and one Logan episode that really did, "Senseless", was with Wheeler's temporary replacement, Falacci.

 

That said, I did much prefer Wheeler with Logan than with Nichols. And think there could have/should have been another "Wee Small Hours"-like deal with Logan, Wheeler, Goren, and Eames as there was with Logan and Barek.

 

And I did like Julianne Nicholson in Conviction (another semi L&O-universe show) as an eager, young, and green ADA, so maybe it was the writing on CI that didn't flesh Wheeler out as much as the other 3, minus being from a single-parent home, being some fan of a rock star in her teens, and having bad taste in fiancés...

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