Sex And The City - General Discussion

[Inquisitionist]

I wanted to hurl something at my TV when Carrie said that -- "sufficiently hurt each other..."??????  In what way did Aidan hurt you, Carrie?

 

So true!

 

Let's reverse the situation:  If Aidan had cheated on Carrie, then pleaded to get her back, but insisted on being "friends" with the woman who was the object of his cheating, wouldn't Carrie, et al, be whinging loudly about how crazy and unfair Aidan was acting?

[TVFan17]

So true!

 

Let's reverse the situation:  If Aidan had cheated on Carrie, then pleaded to get her back, but insisted on being "friends" with the woman who was the object of his cheating, wouldn't Carrie, et al, be whinging loudly about how crazy and unfair Aidan was acting?

Absolutely!  I thought about that, and how Carrie would have regaled her friends with endless tales of how Aidan wore her down and won her back, against her better judgment, only for her to discover that he was keeping "the other woman" in his life, for no apparent logical reason!  And her friends all would have told her to dump him, and that she shouldn't put up with it because it's not like he and the other woman had to be in each other's lives!   Carrie and Big didn't have any kids together.  They didn't own any property or run a business together.  They had no legal ties at that point, so there was no reason for her to keep Big around if she truly wanted to make a go of things with Aidan. 

 

I was glad whenever the girls would occasionally put Carrie in her place and tell her she was being ridiculous (or wrong!), but it didn't happen nearly as often as it should have because she was ridiculous much of the time!

Edited June 4, 2014 by Sherry67

[27bored]

Queasy-bo (and Sherry), it's good to see you guys over here.

 

 

Exactly. The mythology of the show has Big as this emotionally unavailable creep who toys with poor Carrie's emotions, but, frankly, their season 1 relationship was fairly ridiculous. Carrie acted like a straight-up lunatic - stalking his ex, his mother, throwing fits (and hamburgers), and generally being clingy, needy, unreasonable and neurotic. Carrie pushed too hard for too much too soon. Like the Paris thing - what did she want? For him to decline the assignment? For him to ask her to come along after (what I recall) was only a few months of dating? He brought it up nonchalantly because that's his communication style. Frankly I'm surprised he didn't dump her drama-queen ass sooner.

 

Right! He brought it up at the time he did, how he did, because he didn't know yet. Carrie just decided that she wasn't a factor in his decision. WHAT DECISION?! It's not like he was leaving right then and didn't tell you, chick, he said he would know more when he got back! Carrie was just exhausting when it came to Big. I think Big just gave in to her paranoia too easily. If he explained to her that he's been married before, and one of the lessons he learned from his previous failed relationships is that he shouldn't give too much too soon, that he has have time and space and trust before committing emotionally to a woman, that he has to have time and space for his work and career, and he needs a woman who can respect and trust that, it would make him seem real and normal. Like maybe he has an inner process Carrie wouldn't understand because they're two different people (even though, Carrie full well would understand where Big was coming from regardless if she liked it or not...look at how she was at times with Aiden). Just giving in to her summation of his personality made him look like an asshole, and that made him intriguing to Carrie, which is why she kept running back.

 

If Carrie cared about easy love without the bullshit, she would've understood this about Big early on. Instead, she found every reason to play patty-cake with him whenever he wanted. They weren't "friends"; Big knew he had her mind and Carrie liked him giving her attention.

[Mozelle]

As I recall the scene, when confronted with these two numbers:

• 100 pairs of shoes
• $400 per pair

Carrie initially concluded that she had spent $4,000 on shoes.  And this from the woman who had the temerity to call Natasha an idiot because she had mistaken there/their in a thank you note -- a note that she went to the bother of hand-writing, by the way.

I related to (or at least understood) Carrie's fling with Big, at least initially.  Where she lost me is when she continued to see him after Charlottle pointed out (and Carrie agreed) how Carrie would hate someone doing to Charlotte what Carrie was doing to Natasha.  Top that off with sex in Big's marital bed and lolling around afterwords -- there are no words.

I put that on human beings being messy and often times wrapped up in their own mythology.

I have a friend who recently started seeing (even though she's denying it) a guy who, it turns out, was in a long-term relationship (I'm talking five years) but had been dating my friend for something like nine months (he even took her to meet his parents, which still astonishes me when I recall that bit). After some big confrontational blow out where my friend called the girl to the guy's apartment (he was asleep, my friend went through his phone and found tons of pictures), she walked away from the relationship. This was last fall.

Fast forward to this spring, and not only are they in contact again but she's trying to tell me alllll about how he's supposedly over with the other girl and he misses my friend and wants to be friends with her again. I can only think that she's telling me this because she's actually trying to convince herself and not me.

That's how I often view Carrie. I always thought that Carrie knew better, but she'd rather convince herself that what she was doing was cool then not think that way. Honestly, I don't know too many people who go around calling themselves out on their flaws so maybe that's why Carrie never really bothered me the way she still seems to bother people ten years after the show has been off the air.

[Inquisitionist]

Mileage varies, of course, but there's wishful thinking (which sounds like your friend's situation), and there's deliberately doing something you have already admitted to yourself and your friends is wrong (Carrie).  I have a lot of difficulty with the latter.  Especially when it's accompanied by Carrie's pathetic need to make everything about herself, e.g., stalking Natasha to "apologize" in person.  Just write a damned note, Carrie. 

[braziliangirl]

 

and one of the lessons he learned from his previous failed relationships is that he shouldn't give too much too soon, that he has have time and space and trust before committing emotionally to a woman

But  at the same time he actually didn't learn. He married Natasha like 7 months after they broke up, right? I don't think Big is a creep. And I do think Carrie made her share of mistakes with him (acting crazy, longing for something that she wasn't going to get). And I also think Carrie can be very selfish and just plain awful (as she was with Aidan both times around. I still can't believe that I rooted for them first time I watched. Run, Aidan, run.) but I still see her point about the Paris trip. Maybe it wasn't Big's or Carrie's fault. They were essentially too different and communicated awfully something that made Carrie feel insecure all the time. Maybe being nonchalant is Big's way but it's not her way.

It was like she never fully believed he loved her or how much he loved her. And I don't know if that is because he didn't (I'm more inclined to this one) or if he started doubting his feelings because she put those doubts in his head. I think Carrie put Big in a pedastal and neither could let go of that idea.

 

Loved what Mozelle said:

 

 

I put that on human beings being messy and often times wrapped up in their own mythology.

 

[Spartan Girl]

ITA with everyone previously said about Big.  He had his faults and he certainly isn't absolved of cheating on Natasha, but when he and Carrie were dating, she was the one who kept pushing for a commitment and making mountains out of molehills.  Any man with any common sense would have made it work with Natasha and stayed as far away from Carrie as possible...so I guess in that way, he and Carrie were perfectly matched in being crazy idiots.

 

The scene where Carrie stalks Natasha, ambushes her at lunch and then drinks her water while forcing her to listen to her apology is absolutely Carrie's worst moment for me. And it's made all the worse because I agree that it felt like the writers wanted me to be on Carrie's side. When Natasha says "I'm sorry, too" Carrie looks so relieved. What did she think Natasha was going to say?

 

 

Seriously!!!!!  The fact that Carrie would think, even for a second, that Natasha would have ANYTHING to apologize for showed just how much Carrie thought of herself.  And I hated how Samantha enabled her in that episode with her "Who does (Natasha) think she is?!" comment at the restaurant and her convincing Carrie that she did not break up a marriage.  Again, Big was just as guilty as she was, but sleeping with a married man IS breaking up a marriage.

[ShellSeeker]

Absolutely!  I thought about that, and how Carrie would have regaled her friends with endless tales of how Aidan wore her down and won her back, against her better judgment, only for her to discover that he was keeping "the other woman" in his life, for no apparent logical reason!  And her friends all would have told her to dump him, and that she shouldn't put up with it because it's not like he and the other woman had to be in each other's lives!   Carrie and Big didn't have any kids together.  They didn't own any property or run a business together.  They had no legal ties at that point, so there was no reason for her to keep Big around if she truly wanted to make a go of things with Aidan. 

 

Oh, I agree with this so much. There are many scenarios where, had the tables been turned, Carrie and all her friends would have been apoplectic with righteous indignation.

 

Let's see...what if it had been Carrie who had been married to Big, and she found out he was cheating on her with Natasha? And then what if Natasha had stalked her and ambushed her at lunch, essentially cornering her and forcing her to listen to an apology? Can you imagine? 

 

How about if it had been Aiden getting cold feet and backing out of the wedding at the last minute, after she had spent a crap-ton of money on not one but two apartments? Do you think she would have given him 30 days to vacate the premises, or would she have kicked him to the curb immediately?

 

One scene I did love was when, after the second breakup with Aidan, he left her the envelope, and she got all prepared with a box of tissues to read the missive he composed to say goodbye to her, and it turned out to be this instead:

 

http://www.reactiongifs.com/marilyn-monroe-bye-bitch/

 

It was a great example of how deluded she was.

Edited June 7, 2014 by Queasy-bo

[ktwo]

Seriously!!!!! The fact that Carrie would think, even for a second, that Natasha would have ANYTHING to apologize for showed just how much Carrie thought of herself.

I really think that she thought Natasha was going to apologize for marrying Big when he was so clearly in love with Carrie.

[WhitneyWhit]

I actually think the scene where she received the Thank You note for attending Natasha's luncheon was worse than the restaurant debacle. There was a typo on the note, I believe it said they're instead their, which led Carrie to call one of the girls and laugh hysterically and actually Natasha an idiot. I think that, more than anything else, showed Carrie's level of maturity. All I could think was gee Carrie, maybe she would have more time for spell check if she didn't have to constantly chase frizzy headed bitches out of her house.

Edited June 7, 2014 by WhitneyWhit

[BookWoman56]

 

I actually think the scene where she received the Thank You note for attending Natasha's luncheon was worse than the restaurant debacle.

That scene bothered me tremendously because it was so mean-spirited. My day job is as a technical writer, which involves writing materials myself and editing pieces others have written. I also occasionally teach a college freshman-level writing class, and have all too many students who literally do not know the difference between there/their/they're. But Natasha had written those notes by hand, and when you've been writing variations of the same thing over and over, it's all too easy to let a mistake slip by. So, Natasha makes one tiny spelling error, and somehow she's an idiot? It's not as if Carrie's own writing was particularly strong; that "I couldn't help but wonder" verbiage got very old, very fast.

 

I agree with the post upthread that at the scene where Carrie had stalked Natasha at lunch, Carrie was expecting Natasha to apologize when Natasha began her response by saying, "I'm sorry, too." Carrie was self-absorbed enough to think that Natasha somehow owed her an apology for having been an obstacle keeping Carrie and Big apart. Natasha owed Carrie nothing except total contempt and disdain. No, Carrie may not have been able to control how she felt about Big, but she sure as hell could have controlled her actions, especially after one of her BFFs had pointed out to her how hurtful her actions were.  Having sex with Big once when he was married to someone else could be understandable, perhaps, as two people caught up in the passion of the moment. Continuing to do so, though, just speaks to Carrie's total disregard for other people. Between the stalking Big at church, stalking his first wife at her work, having an affair with a married man, and then stalking Natasha to force an apology on her, it's as if Carrie had no respect for anybody's boundaries.

 

A few weeks ago at work I heard one of my colleagues, who constantly talks at a high volume, tell another colleague the story of how he met his wife. While in college, he met two women who were roommates, and he began dating one of them. However he had zero interest in her and wanted a relationship with the other roommate, who initially did not like him. So for a couple of years he strung this woman along, deceiving her into thinking he was serious about her; he boasted that he had driven off her other boyfriends. He did all this in an effort to make the woman he wanted jealous enough to become interested in him, and eventually she did decide she wanted a relationship with him. The colleague who was on the receiving end of this story asked him if he had any regrets about his actions, and his response was, "No, I got what I wanted and the other woman eventually married someone else." He was completely oblivious to the fact that this story made him sound like a complete and total jerk; that his actions had most likely caused the friendship between his wife and her former roommate to end in bitterness; and that he had shamelessly used this woman without any regard for how hurt and resentful she would feel when she realized he had seen her only as a path to his true desire. And at that moment when he finished his story, I thought that he reminded me of how Carrie might be equally oblivious when telling new acquaintances the story of how she and Big ended up together. "Oh, we dated and then split up after I stalked him at church and stalked his first wife; he then married someone else and I was in a relationship with another man, but we both cheated on our significant others and only broke off the affair when his wife caught me in their house. But it's all OK because ultimately we ended up together."

[andromeda331]

There are many scenarios where, had the tables been turned, Carrie and all her friends would have been apoplectic with righteous indignation.

 

 

Not only that but they would have been right. Getting back together with your ex but remaining friends with person he/she cheated on you with despite the fact they have no kids or anything that ties them together? That's a huge red flag.

Edited June 9, 2014 by andromeda331

[Spartan Girl]

They never actually show the part where Carrie drinks Natasha's water.  Maybe even the networks think that was rude on so many levels: 1) that Carrie had the nerve to even ask Natasha for a sip, 2) that she didn't even wait for her answer before taking it and 3) that instead of a "sip" she took a BIG LONG FUCKING GULP.  I give Natasha credit for not throwing the rest of it in Carrie's face!  But maybe she didn't want to spoil what was left of her date.

 

And I really hated Carrie's comment of how her actions put Natasha back in the singles market, which made it worse for other single woman.  As if she's the one that affects everything for all single women.  Shut the fuck up Carrie!

[andromeda331]

I give Natasha credit for not throwing the rest of it in Carrie's face!  But maybe she didn't want to spoil what was left of her date.

 

 

I give Natasha credit go going off on Carrie period. If I had been the one sitting there while the woman my husband cheated on me ambushed me at my lunch, stole my drink, made me listen to her crap, and then expected me to apologize? There would have be bloodshed. The fact there wasn't and Natasha managed to make herself look even more awesome with everything she said to Carrie. 

[27bored]

 

But  at the same time he actually didn't learn. He married Natasha like 7 months after they broke up, right? I don't think Big is a creep. And I do think Carrie made her share of mistakes with him (acting crazy, longing for something that she wasn't going to get). And I also think Carrie can be very selfish and just plain awful (as she was with Aidan both times around. I still can't believe that I rooted for them first time I watched. Run, Aidan, run.) but I still see her point about the Paris trip. Maybe it wasn't Big's or Carrie's fault. They were essentially too different and communicated awfully something that made Carrie feel insecure all the time. Maybe being nonchalant is Big's way but it's not her way.

It was like she never fully believed he loved her or how much he loved her. And I don't know if that is because he didn't (I'm more inclined to this one) or if he started doubting his feelings because she put those doubts in his head. I think Carrie put Big in a pedastal and neither could let go of that idea.

 

It did seem implausible that Big would marry Natasha after less than a year of dating, but I can see why he wouldn't mind committing to her over Carrie. Natasha seemed "easy"...for lack of a better word. Not simple in the way Carrie described her at the end of season two, but just easy to be with. Big didn't seem like the type of guy who would be in love with a woman he couldn't stand.

 

I just felt like Carrie didn't give Big a chance to be a good guy re: the Paris trip. She was all wounded and upset because he didn't tell her before he even knew anything concrete. Then she's all with the late-night drunken phone call. Big probably didn't want to deal with her BS in another country. And after a few months of dating, I can see why he wouldn't want her to move with him to Paris. As it turns out, had she not acted like a crazypants about the whole thing, they probably would've still been together since the Paris deal fell through.

 

I do agree with you, though, about Carrie putting Big on a pedestal.

[lucindabelle]

Big married Natasha on the rebound. She was everything Carrie wasn't-- he thought. Uncomplicated. Easygoing. Pretty. Confident. Unneurotic. Etc. But it turns out, he really only wants that as a balm from the pain of the difficult woman he truly loves. I bought it.

That doesn't mean I approve of all of Carrie's actions by a long shot. But I bought it.

As for Natasha, well, she was basically the Winona Ryder role in "The Age of Innocence," but without her guile. In that book/film, the young wife plots to "trap" the husband into staying married to her-- which he does until she dies.

Natasha could have kept Big that way too. I've no doubt. She didn't want to.

Even in "Age of Innocence," Mae wonders WHY the wedding has to be rushed and immediately suspects the worst. That Natasha didn't want to look too closely at her prince's history-- well-- women who do that often do end up like Lady  Di, the deceived innocent by a man who has a history.

 

Again, none of this excuses Carrie. But I don't think that marriage would have lasted had Carrie moved to China. It wasn't based on anything real.

[WendyCR72]

I get your point, lucindabelle, but what it comes down to for me is, Carrie wrecked a marriage. Yes, the onus of the blame is on Big as he was the husband. But whether Big loved Carrie and vice versa, well...then Big should have manned up and told Natasha the truth.

 

Don't fuck your ex behind her back. And don't let the ex browbeat the wife because the ex needed to have a clean conscience for screwing said wife's husband.

 

Of the three, Natasha is the only one who came out of it without looking cheap, selfish, and to be crude, an asshole. By the end of the series, Big and Carrie deserved to be together, but not by the criteria TPTB were hoping for, I'm sure. They were both, to me, so off-putting that they deserved to be trapped in misery with each other. Reap what you sow, etc.

 

Which is a bummer as I liked Chris Noth's other character, Mike Logan, on L&O/L&O: CI so much. But Big deserved Carrie's narcissism and she deserved his slickly smarmy remoteness.

[lucindabelle]

I would say she contributed to wrecking the marriage. But then I do not believe a third party can wreck a marriage that is between two other people.

I understand a lot of people feel as you do. But I was very touched and thrilled. I may even have cried. Those two actors had a lot of chemistry and managed to bring it.

I was happy for them.

 

Similarly, Camilla Parker-Bowles was REVILED as the third wheel in Princess Di's marriage. But now she and Charles are married and happy and so what? I'd say Charles was wrong to have married Di when he didn't love her in the first place. She was only 20, and he should have known better. Camilla should have too, but that doesn't make his actions her fault.

Edited June 10, 2014 by lucindabelle

[CleoCaesar]

Carrie wrecked a marriage. Yes, the onus of the blame is on Big as he was the husband.

 

Then it should be "Big wrecked a marriage", because - as you point out - it was his marriage to wreck, not Carrie's. Carrie played a part, but this is on Big, IMO. "The other woman" gets reviled far too easily and often seems to receive more venom than the cheater. Carrie deserves scorn for cheating on Aiden and for sleeping with a married guy, but she doesn't deserve to be labeled as the person who wrecked the marriage. Big and his wandering penis do.

[Bella]

I'd like to suggest one of two options going forward:

 

When it's not specific to an episode we're rewatching, let's either have the Carrie/Big relationship discussion in the Carrie thread, or I can set up a separate thread for their relationship. I'm inclined toward discussing this in the Carrier thread.

 

Also, FTR, I think Carrie and Big were both culpable in the break-up of his marriage. He should have kept his pants zipped, and she should have avoided him. It wasn't as if they lived in a small town with one industry and a single restaurant and had to see each other all the time.

[27bored]

Looking back at the episodes with Trey and Charlotte fighting because he doesn't want a baby kind of cement why I never really liked Charlotte. First of all, I found the entire plot line to be a tad unrealistic. I know it's difficult for women of a certain age to get pregnant, but Charlotte was a perfectly healthy woman in her thirties. They didn't mention any kind of genetic traits that might hinder her from having a baby. But her every attempt was goose-egg, bupkis. Trey was a perfectly healthy man and a doctor and he tried avoiding the issue and making excuses like any regular guy would, but wouldn't a doctor care a little more than most about something impeding something common like childbirth? Him wanting to leave it up to chance was kind of incurious and silly knowing Charlotte's resolve to have one, which made it unrealistic given he's a doctor, IMO. I also don't understand why Charlotte would agonize over not being able to have a child in her mid-30s. If she always knew she wanted children, why would you wait until you're at a statistical disadvantage? I know she had high expectations but it seems to me a woman who wants a husband and kids doesn't wait until her mid-30s to do so, nor does she try to do so with a man in his early-40s.

 

Besides that, their having a baby become almost entirely about Charlotte. She quit her job before she was even pregnant. She put them on the waiting list for a Mandarin baby before even discussing it with him. She was just becoming a bit...much. I think she should've played it better than she did. I think Trey had become stressed about it and tired of her being all about babies and her outburst at the Scottish Fling thing was just the icing on the cake. And, though I didn't entirely like her throughout the series, I was kinda/sorta on Bunny's side. She was being messy and catty and butting her nose into their business, but Charlotte, baby, think for a minute. Tradition matters to Trey, if for no other reason than it matters to his mother. He...might not want a Mandarin baby. Before you go learning Mandarin and putting your name on lists, you need to talk it over and allow for the fact that he might not want to go for it. He might want his own kids that share his own heritage. There's nothing wrong with wanting to love a child, but this isn't about just fulfilling your need for motherhood by any means.

 

I think Trey would've been up for a baby if she had tabled the matter for a few months and they tried the regular way with her taking fertility treatments. Or, she could've been honest and not a passive-aggressive baby and told him that she didn't want to give up trying to have a baby and that if he did, that might mean they can't be together. Instead she turned resentful as if the entire problem was that he didn't consent to it. Not to sound nasty, but Charlotte was going to have a hard time regardless how much they tried. I doubt Charlotte wanted to adopt and raise a baby by herself, so why ruin your marriage over a baby that you might not have anyway? It just didn't make any sense.

[Bella]

I don't think Trey ever wanted a baby. Ever. I don't even think he wanted a wife. I think he got married because of family expectations and for no other reason. He was otherwise perfectly content being a flirt and taking care of his "needs" on his own. 

 

Charlotte isn't off the hook - she viewed him as a rich sperm donor, someone she was "supposed to" love. But I don't give Trey any kind of a pass. I think he was fraudulent from Day One. 

[Princess Sparkle]

I know she had high expectations but it seems to me a woman who wants a husband and kids doesn't wait until her mid-30s to do so, nor does she try to do so with a man in his early-40s.

 

 

Well, I don't really think that was her choice.  Charlotte was always portrayed as being very traditional, so no way would she have had a child before she got married.  She wanted a husband and kids, she just didn't have anyone propose to her until she was in her 30s.  Doesn't mean she wasn't trying - I'm sure Charlotte would've much preferred having children in her mid-20s.  But life didn't work out that way.  

 

And I didn't find it unrealistic that she would have trouble conceiving, and then later, difficulty carrying a pregnancy to term.  Plenty of women who are healthy in other ways can have trouble with fertility, and the stress one gives themselves trying to conceive (like Charlotte did) can make it difficult as well.  I think Trey didn't really concern himself with it because he didn't want children, and Charlotte having fertility issues is an easy way to avoid having the "guess what, I don't want kids" conversation.  Don't get me wrong - they were both ridiculously passive aggressive with each other and neither wanted to admit that this "fairy-tale" romance they concocted wasn't going to work out.  That marriage was headed down the tubes anyway, the fertility issues just hurried it along. 

[lucindabelle]

I agree, I think Charlotte wanted to start a family as soon as she married, which is fairly traditional, really. And while mid-30s doesn't sound so old now, int he 90s it was still considered the pale.

 

But I also agree that charlotte was a little ridiculous. In her dfense, the hormones were making her crazy, but she wigged out much too soon. And I agree that as a doctor Trey was... odd.

 

I also think Charlotte didn't really deserve to get the apartment that had always been in Trey's family, but since he didn't mind, Bunny should have (and ultimately did) butt out.

[Inquisitionist]

Trey was odd, period.  Charlotte rushed into that marriage without knowing him.  She saw him as she wanted to, but the reality was very different.

[Princess Sparkle]

I also think Charlotte didn't really deserve to get the apartment that had always been in Trey's family, but since he didn't mind, Bunny should have (and ultimately did) butt out.

 

I realize I'm a total weirdo when it  comes to some things, but you know what always puzzled me - how Charlotte was going to pay the taxes/assessments on that place.  I mean, I know ultimately Harry ended up moving in decently quickly (I'm guessing no more than a year), so he probably paid that after he moved in, but when she got that place she had no job, and I don't think she ended up with any money outside of the ring and the condo.  I guess maybe Harry could've worked out that Trey sill paid for it, but I doubt it. 

[Bella]

I realize I'm a total weirdo when it  comes to some things, but you know what always puzzled me - how Charlotte was going to pay the taxes/assessments on that place.  I mean, I know ultimately Harry ended up moving in decently quickly (I'm guessing no more than a year), so he probably paid that after he moved in, but when she got that place she had no job, and I don't think she ended up with any money outside of the ring and the condo.  I guess maybe Harry could've worked out that Trey sill paid for it, but I doubt it. 

 

Yes, but we're talking about a show in which a freelance writer has $40,000 worth of Manolos plus about 6 closets-worth of bad but probably expensive clothing. Samantha and Miranda were probably making enough to pay their own ways, but I don't think this show was very realistic in correlating work, income, and spending.

[Hanahope]

I would imagine that Harry got at least some money for Charlotte to help defray taxes and such. 

 

I'm not too surprised Carrie had those shoes.  She probably splurged every month or so when she got a big paycheck, then mooched off her friends for meals the rest of the time.

[27bored]

 

I don't think Trey ever wanted a baby. Ever. I don't even think he wanted a wife. I think he got married because of family expectations and for no other reason. He was otherwise perfectly content being a flirt and taking care of his "needs" on his own.

 

Charlotte isn't off the hook - she viewed him as a rich sperm donor, someone she was "supposed to" love. But I don't give Trey any kind of a pass. I think he was fraudulent from Day One.

I...wouldn't go that far. I think the show did a decent job trying to make Charlotte seem less neurotic than she was. It did that with all the girls. I think they married too quick, but there's almost no question in my mind that Trey would've been happy with a baby. He just didn't want one as much as Charlotte did, which is probably true a lot of the time. But when you add in Charlotte being obsessed with it and sort of dragging Trey along for the ride, he probably wanted out. Charlotte cared more about having a kid than she did having a kid with Trey, which is why she let their relationship quickly deteriorate.

 

And Trey was several years older than Charlotte; if he didn't want to marry, he wouldn't have married. I'm sure there was some familial pressure involved, but I thought Trey was who he was and he only looked bad because of the expectations Charlotte projected onto him. He loved Charlotte and wanted to make her happy. But Charlotte moreso saw him as a means to an end than a spouse and life partner.

 

 

Well, I don't really think that was her choice.  Charlotte was always portrayed as being very traditional, so no way would she have had a child before she got married.  She wanted a husband and kids, she just didn't have anyone propose to her until she was in her 30s.  Doesn't mean she wasn't trying - I'm sure Charlotte would've much preferred having children in her mid-20s.  But life didn't work out that way.

Well, IIRC, she said she was scared of getting pregnant in her 20s when she could've been screwing everything in sight, so some of this is the result of decisions she made. Not that she was wrong, per se, but unfortunately this is how it works for many women in their 30s who decide they want to have kids with someone in their 40s. It's not a simple process.

 

I do agree Charlotte was very traditional, but I've known (and dated) plenty of chicks in college who knew they wanted a husband and kids at some point. Most of them don't wait until their mid-30s to start for exactly this reason. They don't just shack up with the first eligible guy they can find, but they don't search high and low for the rich WASPy guy of their dreams, either. So I think she was shallowly waiting for the perfect guy to come along and sweep her away and that's why it took her so long.

 

 

I realize I'm a total weirdo when it  comes to some things, but you know what always puzzled me - how Charlotte was going to pay the taxes/assessments on that place.  I mean, I know ultimately Harry ended up moving in decently quickly (I'm guessing no more than a year), so he probably paid that after he moved in, but when she got that place she had no job, and I don't think she ended up with any money outside of the ring and the condo.  I guess maybe Harry could've worked out that Trey sill paid for it, but I doubt it.

Yeah that was pretty unrealistic. Charlotte wouldn't have been able to afford that apartment for a year even if she didn't move Harry in. And she's all with the "oh I paid for that apartment" bit. What? Trey wasn't a bad husband, he just got tired of her acting like their marriage is a fertility seminar. And he must've felt guilty for not giving Charlotte what she wanted which is why he agreed to give her the apartment. And I thought they said it wasn't actually Trey's apartment...that it had been in the family for years. So, Trey just decides he's going to go stay with his mom and give his precious, self-centered ex-wife an apartment that wasn't really his to begin with. Again, I'm no Bunny fan, but I see why she was fighting Charlotte. She pretty much bailed on the relationship after Trey said he didn't want kids, but she feels entitled to keep their apartment? Plus, Trey was a grown ass man. Had I been Bunny I would've told him and his stupid bowl haircut to go get his life because he's not staying with me when he has a nice, big Park Avenue apartment. Charlotte wasn't entitled to shit.

[Maysie]

I guess this is the right thread to post this:

 

http://www.harpersbazaar.com/culture/reviews/sex-and-the-city-3-jennifer-hudson

 

I am in the minority that I didn't care all that much for the first movie and I felt the second one was god-awful. I can't imagine what the untold story is that SJP and MPK are referring to. I know I won't spend money to see it, but I can't deny there's a curiosity factor for me -- just how bad can it/will it be? If they were having a hard time dealing with the aging process in the second movie (meaning Sam's menopause), I shudder to think what they'll do in the third one when they're all approaching/firmly in that point in their lives.

[Bella]

Wow, after the poor reception SatC 2 received, I'm stunned.

 

I thought the first movie was pretty bad and didn't see the second, so I won't be seeing the third unless it gets rave reviews.

[TVFan17]

Well, you know... I will admit that I am very happy about a 3rd movie.  I had been hoping it would happen (if for no other reason than to erase the memory of the 2nd movie from my mind!).  Even if it were not a theatrical release, but just a made-for-TV or straight-to-HBO movie, I would be fine with it.  SJP has given the same basic non-info for a while (about the "one more story to tell" concept of a 3rd movie).  The most detailed she ever got was when she said that the story for a 3rd movie will be a "small" story, but she didn't know if it would be possible to go back to that kind of small, intimate tone that was present in the first season at this point in time (probably since they already tried to go "big" with Abu Dhabi).  She also said that she would want to tell the story sooner rather than later (as if to imply that none of them are getting any younger!).

 

I know that SATC 3 could have the potential to be awful, or it could be bittersweet because it will undoubtedly be the last time we ever see our girls together onscreen again (not counting the repeats), but... I miss them!  Character flaws, personality flaws, outrageous fiascos, huge mistakes and all -- I am one of those nutty people who feels like she has lost friends when a favorite series goes off the air.  (Hell, I am upset that Breaking Bad is off the air and I wish there were a way for it to come back!)  I get abnormally attached to the characters!  Lol.

 

When I first saw SATC #1, I didn't love it like I wanted to.  However, over the years and with many, many viewings of it, I have decided that I think it is a good extension of the series.  The series would have stood on its own just fine without that movie, but if there had to be a movie I think that the first one was a good continuation of the story.  It was the second movie that really annoyed me the most because the whole Abu Dhabi thing was ridiculous.  And yet, I loved seeing all of those characters together!

 

So, I am glad that the completion of the trilogy is in the works!  It will be like seeing 'old friends.'  Hopefully MPK has realized at this point that the fans of the series would be fine with the ladies just living their lives and running into minor daily, comedic conflicts and not jetting off to the Middle East for shenanigans.

Edited October 6, 2014 by Sherry67

[CleoCaesar]

So, I am glad that the completion of the trilogy is in the works!  It will be like seeing 'old friends.'

 

Exactly. I'd be thrilled if they made a third movie, cinematic quality be damned. I miss seeing these 4 characters and being in their world. I'd just be happy to see them all together again. The one exception being is that if one of them is killed off. I can see them going for some cheap emotional manipulation and having Sam's cancer come back or something. Everyone must be alive.

[WendyCR72]

I wish I could say I'm excited about this...but I'd be lying. I liked the first movie well enough - even if I had issues (as in, I never thought Steve would cheat, ever, and Carrie's Bridezilla Act, etc.). But the second is best erased from the memory, and I think odds are any third movie will just be a continued sinkhole of crap.

 

And while the movie is about the girls and should be, I do wonder if any of the guys (Noth, Eigenberg to start) will be onboard since these two are now in ongoing TV shows (The Good Wife and Chicago Fire, respectively.).

 

Either way, I wish the cast well, but unless word of mouth is out of this world, I'll pass.

[WendyCR72]

While I hated the second movie in the theatres, I admit that I enjoy watching both films on the small screen at home. Yes, I said "enjoy."

 

The cheese stands alone!

 

Mozzarella? Provolone?  :-)

[ktwo]

And while the movie is about the girls and should be, I do wonder if any of the guys (Noth, Eigenberg to start) will be onboard since these two are now in ongoing TV shows (The Good Wife and Chicago Fire, respectively.).

In Noth's case, he has never been a regular on TGW so he can be free for other projects like this. I watch the show and it's actually noticeable because there will be plotlines that need his character's reaction but he is unavailable for that episode so we don't get it.

I am confused as to why Jennifer Hudson would be involved in a third movie.

[Maysie]

 

I am confused as to why Jennifer Hudson would be involved in a third movie.

 

I wondered that too. She was really my favorite thing about the first movie, even if she was just kind of a sappy plot point.

 

I think part of my issue for both movies was they kind of killed any affection I had for the characters. Watching the show after seeing the movies made me see the characters in a new, rather unflattering, light. They were all at varying levels of self-absorption in the film and it seemed like they lost all humor or something (no matter how hard they tried to make Sam's menopausal adventures and Charlotte's gastrointestinal problems funny). I can't put my finger on it, but none of them were people I would want to spend an evening sharing drinks with, and I didn't get that feeling from the tv show. So I think a third movie would be even more worn.

[Maherjunkie]

http://jezebel.com/mr-big-called-carrie-bradshaw-a-whore-1646750503/all

[Bella]

Okay, that's funny.

[Spartan Girl]

LOVE Chris Noth.

[Inquisitionist]

Although the headline is about Carrie being a whore, I took this as a joke (pointedly followed by [laughs]).  Noth was just contrasting how much of a player Big was portrayed as being versus actually being by pointing out that Carrie had many more sexual partners on the series than he did.   He also called her a strong, smart woman (which is a very generous view, IMO).

[Maherjunkie]

Agree.  The only time I would ever use the term Feminazi is when I am reading  Jezebel.

[sunrisepink]

I found it ironic that when Carrie first started dating Aleks, she Googled him and found his dating history and got all scared. What if someone she was dating looked up HER history?

[Maherjunkie]

I think it is probably typical by now.

[Judge Milianaire]

That article was cute, but I think Noth is a little confused on the timing. The first movie was the one that came out right when the recession hit (or more accurately, six to eight months into the recession). By the time the second movie came out, we were well into the recession.

And who is the "they" he refers to who got greedy on the second movie? Did he not bring home a paycheck from it? I read he got a million dollars for that movie.

If the movie bombed, I think it was because it was lame; not because the viewing audience was scandalized that four fictional middle-aged American women would dare take a (free) trip to Abu Dabi when real Americans were taking pay cuts.

[Judge Milianaire]

http://www.vanityfair.com/vf-hollywood/sex-and-the-city-season-rankings

I guess this is the page where we share the good articles. I found this piece that ranks the seasons from worst to best, as well as the best and worst episodes of every season, and I think it's very well-written and captures the essence of the show enormously. It came out in February, so I'm sure some people have already read it.

I wholeheartedly agree with the choice for best season.

[SFoster21]

Back to the show, I just hated the these people had all of New York and all they did was dress up and eat. Nobody saw a play or went to a concert or a museum or a library.

They were such boring people. Carrie couldn't be bothered to learn more than four words in French despite going there to live permanently and she exhausted Paris in a week?

I have no patience for people without a life of the mind.

[Maherjunkie]

No they went to a play (Harvest Harvest), and a comedy club (Miranda) and a museum (Carrie had to see the REnoirs) and the Opera.

[Inquisitionist]

I just hated the these people had all of New York and all they did was dress up and eat. Nobody saw a play or went to a concert or a museum or a library.

 

I sometimes felt this way about the characters, too, but I rationalize that they had lives outside of what we saw, encompassing activities that did not fit within the show's main theme and perspective.

[izabella]

Back to the show, I just hated the these people had all of New York and all they did was dress up and eat. Nobody saw a play or went to a concert or a museum or a library.

 

Charlotte did have her art gallery work for a while.  But yes, point taken, and I totally agree with you.  One of the most fascinating cities in the world, and they seemed to really only care about dinners and martinis.

 

Carrie, especially, bugged.  As a writer, I would have expected her apartment to be full of more books and fewer shoes.  I've never met even a hobby writer (meaning one who never gets published but writes for the fun of it) who didn't have a houseful of books.