Jump to content
Forums forums
PRIMETIMER
halgia

All Episodes Talk: Crime And Punishment

Recommended Posts

On 6/12/2021 at 11:24 PM, LittleIggy said:

People are forgiven for much worse.

And people are not forgiven for much less.  It’s up to the person that was wronged to decide whether or not to forgive.

Toby chose to cut herself out of her sons lives for a convicted murderer 21 years younger than her.  If she wasn’t happy in the marriage, then do marriage counseling or get a divorce.  Buy a sports car. Don’t have  an affair.  Don’t drain the retirement and bank accounts that are supposed to be for both you and  your spouse when you get old.    Don’t  break a dangerous criminal out of prison, becoming a criminal yourself. 

They were going to be on the run until they were caught. If it had been years, then she wouldn’t have been able to speak to her sons for years. She had to know this and she had to know they would be caught eventually and she would go to jail.  

 

Edited by mythoughtis
  • Like 13

Share this post


Link to post

On 6/13/2021 at 11:42 AM, Crashcourse said:

I also found it strange that the inmate lost 25 lbs. in order to fit into the dog cage, and did any of the prison staff wonder why he lost so much weight?  Seems to me like that would have raised their suspicions.

No kidding. It’s exactly what Ted Bundy did before one of his escapes. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
18 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

When this first started, I thought it was the case in NY where the Female Prison Guard helped 2 convicts escape because she was in love with one of them. She was married and, had a family she abandoned too.

It was interesting to see how this unfolded. I'm not surprised that her husband and sons cut her off. That's a major betrayal; it goes beyond a simple affair (which is bad enough). 

I'm glad she at least got to make peace/say goodbye to her youngest son before he died. 

I followed the NY case closely and watched the Showtime series. She was actually not a guard but rather she ran the tailoring shop where the inmates worked manufacturing uniforms. So in both cases the women were around the inmates all day with opportunities for fraternization and flirting, that is, manipulation by the inmates. Maybe they really shouldn’t allow women in these jobs. 

  • Like 2
  • Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post
On 6/15/2021 at 12:24 AM, GussieK said:

Maybe they really shouldn’t allow women in these jobs. 

Women are not the only people who are susceptible to manipulation. 

Edited by biakbiak
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post

Can't believe they allowed her to go visit him 10 years later. Why!?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
On 6/13/2021 at 12:44 PM, JudyObscure said:

Well in the "Escape to Dannemora" case,  the prison seamstress manages to smuggle in a file and shovel so that the prisoner she fell in love with could, and did,  dig a tunnel out from his cell, and no part of that raised suspicions.  It makes me wonder about all the things that go unnoticed in prisons.  It also makes me shudder.

As someone who struggles to lose a pound, I couldn't help but be struck by this man having the discipline to lose 25 pounds, but not the discipline to stay in school, work a steady job or wait out his prison sentence.  Now he has ten extra years to do and ruined the dog lady's life.

He probably was motivated with the be free and it's not like he has a refrigerator to raid late at night to ruin his diet.

I missed how long his original sentence was but it didn't seem like they had much of a plan except to escape and just hole up and have sex til they were found.

He sounds like a man who likes being a white knight, like when he wrote her in prison saying he wished he could rescue her and/or that's just his line he writes all the women.

I watch LOVE AFTER LOCK UP, those cons sure know how to turn on the charm.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post

Besides Tobi and the seamstress breaking out prisoners, there was the one who was the wardens wife.  They ran off and lived together for 15 years or so til they were caught. She claimed she was under duress the whole time but she had plenty of opportunities to leave and never did.  She even stayed with him after he had a heart attack.

Her husband took her back and I was just recently trying to find out if they're still together.

I digress but the women breaking out prisoners fascinates me.

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
13 hours ago, LEILANI2 said:

Besides Tobi and the seamstress breaking out prisoners, there was the one who was the wardens wife.  They ran off and lived together for 15 years or so til they were caught. She claimed she was under duress the whole time but she had plenty of opportunities to leave and never did.  She even stayed with him after he had a heart attack.

Her husband took her back and I was just recently trying to find out if they're still together.

I digress but the women breaking out prisoners fascinates me.

LeiLani2, yes.  You’re thinking of Bobbi Parker and Randolph Dial.

The last I read on the subject, Bobbi and her husband (the former warden) are still together.  He is adamant that she did not want to go with Dial and was forced.

Bobbi’s two daughters apparently have a different take on the subject.  According to an episode of Dateline about Parker and Dial, they were now grown and did not want a relationship with their mother.

That of course could have all changed but if they think she was a part of Dial’s plan, it would mean that to them, Bobbi chose to leave with an escaped convict and not be with them for the years when they depend on a mother figure most.

Let me just say that if a person is lacking in self-esteem and/or attention, those prisoners have the routine down cold.  They also have the uncanny ability to ferret out those most in need - and will certainly take advantage of the situation.  Couple that with someone looking to escape and it’s a recipe for disaster.

 

 

 

 

 

 

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
12 hours ago, PsychoKlown said:

LeiLani2, yes.  You’re thinking of Bobbi Parker and Randolph Dial.

The last I read on the subject, Bobbi and her husband (the former warden) are still together.  He is adamant that she did not want to go with Dial and was forced.

Bobbi’s two daughters apparently have a different take on the subject.  According to an episode of Dateline about Parker and Dial, they were now grown and did not want a relationship with their mother.

 

 

Yes that's who I was thinking of!  I agree with the daughters, she had many opportunties in the decade plus she was gone to contact them and/or escape.  She also had a history of inappropriate relations with other inmates too. 

I'll have to find the episode, I never saw the part where the daughters didn't want contact, I only saw the one where they were glad she was back.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post

If a friend is sick and needs help, I’ve learned that you get the friend to the hospital, and haunt the ER admissions desk until the friend gets attention,  Me telling everyone that medicine is ineffective because a doctor didn’t call up my friend for a health inquiry leaves so much out of the story.

Your friend/boyfriend was murdered; you have information.  You can walk into a police station and demand to speak to a detective.  If you see something, say something - that’s been drummed into us since 9/11.  

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post

I see the Lifetime movie version of the Doomsday Cult, Lori Vallow story is on tonight. I wish they'd got someone really ugly to play Lori, but they didn't.  That probably would hurt her more than any death penalty.

  • Like 1
  • Laugh 1
  • Surprise 1

Share this post


Link to post

@JudyObscure  That is so true.  Or if the ratings of the show ended up being 0.1 household watched it. :)

 

  • Laugh 1

Share this post


Link to post

5 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I see the Lifetime movie version of the Doomsday Cult, Lori Vallow story is on tonight

Is Lifetime a channel? I wonder how I can see it. I'd love to hate watch it. 

Share this post


Link to post

As much as I want to see these two pay for hurting these children I couldn’t watch the show.  The thought in some way Vallow/Daybell might be compensated in any way or that Vallow would continue on her journey of being in the limelight was too much for me.  
 

 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post

Did anyone watch Friday's episode "Story of Somebody"? I was so disturbed by all those police officers standing around talking to each other while the victim was reaching out to them. No one was even rendering the basic first aid of putting pressure on the wound! 

I can't blame the mom for initially thinking it was the police that shot him. And since it turned out it wasn't, why make her wait 500 excruciating days while she went through the process of forcing them to let her see the video? Hope she solves the case. 

  • Like 8
  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
7 hours ago, TVbitch said:

Did anyone watch Friday's episode "Story of Somebody"? I was so disturbed by all those police officers standing around talking to each other while the victim was reaching out to them. No one was even rendering the basic first aid of putting pressure on the wound! 

I can't blame the mom for initially thinking it was the police that shot him. And since it turned out it wasn't, why make her wait 500 excruciating days while she went through the process of forcing them to let her see the video? Hope she solves the case. 

I saw that one, yeah. So infuriating how the police kept trying to claim her son was "being aggressive" and that's why he had a handcuff on when he was wheeled into the hospital...only for the video to show that no, he wasn't anything of the sort. 

And then these officers complain about the treatment they get from the public, and talk about the failing of the community. Well, gee, it's hard for people to respect you and your profession when you keep lying about simple facts like that, and do nothing to even try follow up on a lot of these leads. Yes, it's true that most families in general do tend to get frustrated with investigations, even ones that are very active, feeling they go too slow, but as we've seen many times on this show, there's some investigators that just don't even bother to try, for a whole host of reasons. So yeah, in those cases, sometimes it does have to be up to the victim's loved ones to keep things moving. 

I too hope she finally gets answers about what happened to her son. I liked her recording her interview with the police, too-it's sad that she has to resort to such measures in the first place, and speaks to just how little trust there is out there, but it's a smart move on her part, and clearly it worked in terms of proving the discrepancies between what the police told her and what actually happened. 

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post

So there was no resolution to the Friday night episode? We don’t know what happened? My DVR cut off bc it started late for gymnastics. 

Edited by woodscommaelle
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post

2 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

So there was no resolution to the Friday night episode? We don’t know what happened? My DVR cut off bc it started late for gymnastics. 

No one has been arrested in the murder case.  And unless someone confesses and gets a plea deal, the future defense lawyers have a Dateline episode to use to challenge the police investigation, unless a judge deems it inadmissible. 

  • Like 1
  • Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post

Finally ... murder charges!  
 

Has any family members said anything yet?  Was glad Daybell was charged with Tammie’s death also.  
 

 

  • Like 1
  • Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post

House of Horrors. I found this episode sort of confusing. The evidence seemed so weak. Plus, I never understood why Jason would kill his wife and stepson, or why the stepson would kill his mother then himself. The motives didn't seem to be there. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
11 hours ago, Melina22 said:

House of Horrors. I found this episode sort of confusing. The evidence seemed so weak. Plus, I never understood why Jason would kill his wife and stepson, or why the stepson would kill his mother then himself. The motives didn't seem to be there. 

I thought the evidence was pretty common in these types of murders. Couple has money problems. Check. Wife wants to divorce controlling husband. Check. Husband takes out life insurance policy on wife before she turns up dead. Check. I would assume he wanted the step son out the way because he did not want to raise him after he killed his wife.  Making him look like the murderer was a bonus I guess. 

One thing I found interesting is that in the Dateline show, they said that the gun was tested and only the dead son's fingerprints were found on it. I thought that was odd, because both the father and the adopted brother also used the guns, so what are the chances that only the dead son's fingerprints would be found on the gun? Unless of course the gun was wiped clean and then placed in the dead son's hands. I did read on another site though that the gun was tested and no fingerprints were found on the gun. So of course if that was true the dead son could not have been the murderer. 

Also as far as the rag in Jason's truck goes, the blood would not have stayed bright red had it been from a cut that happened two months before. The defense attorney was really reaching there. 

Jackson and Remington were pretty forgiving of their paternal grandmother, when she took the $100,000 life insurance money and didn't give any of it to them. Also don't understand why she didn't sell the $200,000 house rather than lose it for unpaid taxes. In any case Jason was a POS for not having the children on the policy. I guess he thought that his mother should get the money in case he needed it for his defense should he be charged with murder? 

Edited by UsernameFatigue
  • Like 10
  • Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post

The prosecution attorney in House of Horrors reminded me of Droop Dog (but with worse hair).

 

41551FC6-84FA-43D6-9920-92BBA11F2AA7.png

  • Like 1
  • Laugh 5

Share this post


Link to post

As they often do with these cases, they sometimes leave out evidence to help make their twists and turns more surprising.

I would imagine the autopsies helped establish the time of death for both of them. 

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post

On 6/14/2021 at 8:55 PM, mythoughtis said:

She had to know this and she had to know they would be caught eventually and she would go to jail.  

On 6/14/2021 at 8:55 PM, mythoughtis said:

And people are not forgiven for much less.  It’s up to the person that was wronged to decide whether or not to forgive.

+1 to all.  She had to know that she also could die.  And that is my personal pet peeve.  It is indeed the choice of the person who was wronged to decide whether or not to forgive.  It has become more of the norm for people to be looked down upon if they DON'T forgive.  Toby served her prison time.  That means she paid her debt to society.  That does not mean her ex -husband and child must forgive her.

On to Jason in TX: His behavior in prison is damning him even more.  If you're willing to intimidate a witness's child, I TOTALLY buy that you'd kill your wife and try and frame your stepson for it.  He's completely guilty, and his mother?  She's scary.

  • Like 12

Share this post


Link to post

I found the sibling split in this one interesting. The older one who had already moved out by the time the murder happened would have known his parents and their issues better than the younger ones, but he’s the one who is staying on Jason’s side. 
 

I felt terrible for that poor 16 year old girl. Kids who have to live with knowing one parent killed the other break my heart. 

  • Like 4
  • Sad 4

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, Ohmo said:

+1 to all.  She had to know that she also could die.  And that is my personal pet peeve.  It is indeed the choice of the person who was wronged to decide whether or not to forgive.  It has become more of the norm for people to be looked down upon if they DON'T forgive.  Toby served her prison time.  That means she paid her debt to society.  That does not mean her ex -husband and child must forgive her.

On to Jason in TX: His behavior in prison is damning him even more.  If you're willing to intimidate a witness's child, I TOTALLY buy that you'd kill your wife and try and frame your stepson for it.  He's completely guilty, and his mother?  She's scary.

The mother looks like the devil.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post

Pretty sure Mommie Dearest DID find those tapes and burned them. I wonder if she was in on it, being that she had a lot to gain as well. 

When the older son said his dad was not the type to ever do something like that, Andrea should have asked him if his dad was the type to threaten an EMT and her child with violence if she didn't change her testimony? 

  • Like 8
  • Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post
20 hours ago, Lsk02 said:

I found the sibling split in this one interesting. The older one who had already moved out by the time the murder happened would have known his parents and their issues better than the younger ones, but he’s the one who is staying on Jason’s side.

I thought that was interesting too but maybe he was out of the house by the time the issues started in their marriage.  He also knew what it was like to be orphaned, I gather?  The two of them gave them stability.  Depending how messed up his early life was, it's possible he didn't see dysfunction as dysfunction.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post

On Saturday’s case about the foster-daughter murder, did anyone else have trouble believing the perpetrator?  She was savvy enough to ask for a lawyer at the start, and her six month silence gave her time to draft a story to fit the circumstances.  And the detective was convinced she was telling the truth because the husband bought cars and trailers?  I didn’t believe her at all.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post

3 hours ago, TVbitch said:

When the older son said his dad was not the type to ever do something like that, Andrea should have asked him if his dad was the type to threaten an EMT and her child with violence if she didn't change her testimony? 

Andrea said that Jason's mom didn't want to give another interview.  I vaguely remember this case from an earlier time.   Maybe I'm wrong, but I got the sense that Andrea interviewed the older son several years ago and Remington and her brother much closer to present-day.  Meaning when Andrea interviewed the older son, Jason hadn't threatened the EMT yet.

  • Like 3
  • Useful 6

Share this post


Link to post
15 hours ago, nora1992 said:

On Saturday’s case about the foster-daughter murder, did anyone else have trouble believing the perpetrator?  She was savvy enough to ask for a lawyer at the start, and her six month silence gave her time to draft a story to fit the circumstances.  And the detective was convinced she was telling the truth because the husband bought cars and trailers?  I didn’t believe her at all.

I had seen this before, so while I had it on in the background, I didn’t pay that much attention this time, but I remember feeling that the foster daughter was manipulative as hell.  I think she created a fantasy in her mind about her, Kevin and the youngest daughter being a family.  While I think it is possible that they may have had an inappropriate relationship (sexual and/or emotional), I can’t buy the guy deciding stabbing the wife to death was the best plan of action.  I think that was all on her.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post

I wanted to see some of the hundreds of texts. I wonder why we never saw them?  We saw the one from the wife telling the husband to cut the cord.  Even if deleted is it possible for police to retrieve them? I had a friend of a friend  who was going through a divorce and called her cell phone carrier about retrieving texts on her husband's phone, they told her they couldn't hand them over but she could go through the courts to get them.  Idk if she ever did but the husband didn't hide the affair very well so it was out there.

I thought the foster  daughter was lying but then the husband wanting to see her in jail  idk . Maybe something was going on but that was a ridiculous plan if it was a plan.

Edited by Cozytea
  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post

House of Horrors: First of all, what a title. 

I am 99.9999% sure Jason is guilty, but there's this tiny, nagging question I have in the back of my mind about the possibility that it was the son who did it, and that Jason just became so desperate to clear his name he resorted to all kinds of criminal antics after being accused and convicted, twice. 

The sticking point is that the EMT testified the mother's body was warm to the touch and the son's body was cold. That would seem to eliminate the possibility of the son being the shooter. So, why did the so-called expert conclude it was a murder suicide and even testify to that opinion in the second trial? 

Also, assuming Jason is guilty as charged, why the disparity in time between the two murders? He murdered the son, then went somewhere and came back home and then murdered the wife and called 911? How does that even make sense? Did he tie her up until he got back home? How could he have murdered the son without his wife knowing? 

Quote

Plus, I never understood why Jason would kill his wife and stepson, or why the stepson would kill his mother then himself. The motives didn't seem to be there. 

I thought both motives were equally plausible.  A hormonal teenage son throwing a temper tantrum over not getting a phone is just as possible as a greedy husband killing his wife for the insurance money. Plus the adopted son described his  brother as odd.

Edited by iMonrey
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post

Finally...

Pam Hupp charged in Betsy Faria's murder, prosecutor says criminal charges against investigators, attorneys could follow

"LINCOLN COUNTY, Mo. (KMOV.com) – Not only were murder charges filed against Pamela Hupp in connection to Betsy Faria's 2011 death Monday, Lincoln County Prosecutor Michael Wood announced his office uncovered prosecutorial and police misconduct in the initial investigation that could result in criminal charges.

Hupp was charged with first-degree murder and armed criminal action Monday, and Wood said his office would seek the death penalty in the case." 

"He said at the news conference three separate sources told him that witnesses for the prosecution in Russell Faria's trial were asked to lie on the stand and that the sheriff at the time attempted to issue an order to have all evidence in the case destroyed."

https://www.kmov.com/news/new-charges-to-be-announced-against-pam-hupp-in-betsy-farias-murder/article_312466c8-e30f-11eb-9fdc-7f136b754d44.html?style=feature

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/pamela-hupp-facing-new-murder-charge-and-potential-death-penalty-in-her-friends-2011-murder/article_5625a77e-79d6-5bdc-a356-6d3796f4eb59.html

  • Like 9
  • Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post

It's too bad that she can't be charged in her mother's death.   There is no way that woman died accidentally.  

  • Like 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I am 99.9999% sure Jason is guilty, but there's this tiny, nagging question I have in the back of my mind about the possibility that it was the son who did it, and that Jason just became so desperate to clear his name he resorted to all kinds of criminal antics after being accused and convicted, twice. 

I hear what you're saying, and teenagers have been known to shoot their parents.  However, there was mention of a $900,000 that Jason got in some sort of settlement.  They blew threw that in some amount of time.   Coincidentally, Nichole had a life insurance policy on her worth S100,000.  Money is the age-old motive, and it's a heck of a lot easier for me to get to an adult male killing his wife to collect 100K than it is a kid shooting his mother AND killing himself over a cell phone.  Admittedly, the temperature stuff I can't fully explain, but Nichole is dead either by Taylor's hand or by Jason's.  Given Jason's mother's behavior, I'd say the apple didn't fall far from the tree.

Another thing...during Jason's questioning, he talked about Taylor not wanting to go to school.  He specifically mentioned it.  The other two kids went to school.  Jason took them.  I suspect that was the plan.  The kids would be at school.  All of them, but when Taylor chose not to go, Jason killed him and then framed him.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Ohmo said:

Admittedly, the temperature stuff I can't fully explain,

What about the possibility that the son shot her, then after awhile shot himself and died immediately. But the mother wasn't actually dead until awhile after the son died. Maybe unconscious and barely alive, but enough to account for the temperature issue. 

  • Useful 6

Share this post


Link to post
15 hours ago, Melina22 said:

What about the possibility that the son shot her, then after awhile shot himself and died immediately. But the mother wasn't actually dead until awhile after the son died. Maybe unconscious and barely alive, but enough to account for the temperature issue. 

Did they mention how long her husband was gone? He dropped the kids at school,  and returned straight home.  I wouldn't think he'd be gone long.  And according to him they were both alive when he left.

Edited by Cozytea

Share this post


Link to post
On 7/10/2021 at 6:33 PM, Lsk02 said:

I found the sibling split in this one interesting. The older one who had already moved out by the time the murder happened would have known his parents and their issues better than the younger ones, but he’s the one who is staying on Jason’s side. 
 

I felt terrible for that poor 16 year old girl. Kids who have to live with knowing one parent killed the other break my heart. 

When I caught a rerun of the first version I found the sister in law's blog and found out more. The older son was a foster kid.  He actually was a bully and mean to the younger one who was also murdered. It's sick that it was Nicole who took him in and he ends up siding with her murderer.

He was sent away and back to his bio brother because as they got older he became meaner so he sides with the abuser and also a pyschopath himself.

Edited by LEILANI2
  • Like 1
  • Useful 1
  • Surprise 2
  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post

Twisted Loyalty: Wow, Katherine is a true psychopath. I figured she had killed her mom when I heard that the mom had been stabbed 28 times. I’ve watched enough “murder shows” to know that kind of killing means it was personal. I feel sorry for her brother. She played him, used him, and abandoned him.

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post

Katherine (Catherine?) was the proverbial bad seed. Her father doused her and her brother with gasoline and threatened to light them on fire. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. There was obviously something not right with him so it's no wonder at least one of the children turned out so damaged.

  • Like 2
  • Sad 3

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, LittleIggy said:

I thought the father doused himself and Katherine.

Yes, her father doused himself and Catherine.  I think he never got over the loss of the first son.  I think Catherine did indeed kill her mother.  Her childhood was horrific, and for that I have empathy.  However, I think Catherine has been damaged enough by that childhood to be dangerous.  She needs to be in jail.  I'd support Andrew's release, however, but I also support Robert's family's feelings about Andrew. 

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
On 7/12/2021 at 3:21 PM, iMonrey said:

 

House of Horrors: First of all, what a title. 

I am 99.9999% sure Jason is guilty, but there's this tiny, nagging question I have in the back of my mind about the possibility that it was the son who did it, and that Jason just became so desperate to clear his name he resorted to all kinds of criminal antics after being accused and convicted, twice. 

The sticking point is that the EMT testified the mother's body was warm to the touch and the son's body was cold. That would seem to eliminate the possibility of the son being the shooter. So, why did the so-called expert conclude it was a murder suicide and even testify to that opinion in the second trial? 

Also, assuming Jason is guilty as charged, why the disparity in time between the two murders? He murdered the son, then went somewhere and came back home and then murdered the wife and called 911? How does that even make sense? Did he tie her up until he got back home? How could he have murdered the son without his wife knowing? 

 

The son was in a garage that had been converted to a bedroom. No insulation and holes in the wall.  
the Mom was in an upstairs bedroom. Heat rises. Her room would be much warmer than her son.  I think that’s why the expert ignored the differences in body temperature.  

I might have bought a murder suicide rather than two murder except for Jason and his Moms behavior. Innocent people do not threaten peoples’ children. 
 

 

 

Edited by mythoughtis
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post

Pet peeve:  The show said  Katherine was placed in a prison southwest of Chicago. The prison shown was Logan women’s prison located in Lincoln IL …. A good 2 hours southwest of Chicago.  Note to everyone - the Chicago area has two thirds of the Illinois population… but it covers only a small part of the states’ geographical area.  
 

She was really something. 

Edited by mythoughtis
  • Like 2
  • Useful 3

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Ohmo said:

I'd support Andrew's release, however, but I also support Robert's family's feelings about Andrew. 

There's a concept of Restorative Justice in some States whereby the victim's family gets to communicate on different levels with the convict who committed the crime against their loved one. 

In this case, Andrew seems authentically remorseful and has taken responsibility for committing the crime. 

With the exception of committing this horrendous crime due to the coercive and sinister influence of his evil sister, he lived an exemplary life and has continued that pattern throughout his years of incarceration.  

The Restorative Justice program might be a success in his case because of Andrew's unique attributes and the fact that the family might come to benefit from having a relationship with him to try and gain some relief from the anguish and grief they have experienced from the death of their loved one. 

I know of several cases where this program has created a special relationship between the  victim's family and the perpetrator of the crime that has benefitted both.

  • Like 3
  • Useful 5

Share this post


Link to post
14 minutes ago, pdlinda said:

The Restorative Justice program might be a success in his case because of Andrew's unique attributes and the fact that the family might come to benefit from having a relationship with him to try and gain some relief from the anguish and grief they have experienced from the death of their loved one. 

Yes, but I got the distinct sense that Robert's family doesn't want that, at least not now.  I'd support Andrew's release for the reasons you've stated, but I think he's got to be realistic about Robert's family. They may never want to interact with Andrew.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Ohmo said:

Yes, but I got the distinct sense that Robert's family doesn't want that, at least not now.  I'd support Andrew's release for the reasons you've stated, but I think he's got to be realistic about Robert's family. They may never want to interact with Andrew.

Well, that is certainly their prerogative and it is to be respected. 

They had facilitators from the court in the cases I'm familiar with who work with both parties but are trained to be very sensitive to victims families thoughts and attitudes toward the perpetrator.  He/she would never "push" for a proscribed result or try to interfere with the wishes of the victim's family. 

The successful use of the Program is when all parties feel a sense of fulfillment being in contact with each other.

  • Like 2
  • Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...

Customize font-size