S03.E02: Sin That Amends

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

Jamal tries to turn his being shot into something positive when he teams up with a businessman to talk about gun violence and host a summit for awareness. But when he tries to perform again, things don't go as planned. Meanwhile, Lucious attempts to get Cookie in his corner; Hakeem enters the recording studio with Shine; and Andre gets in trouble with the law.

[Primetimer]

As Cookie continues to deny Lucious her affections, his desperation grows and grows.

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[SimoneS]

Stay away from him, Cookie, keep resisting evil Lucious!

Edited September 29, 2016 by SimoneS

[mtlchick]

She really is Becky with the (Great) Hair.  (I didn't like the blonde on her at all last year.) 

 

Will have to rewatch as I missed parts of it and I have like 6 shows to watch tonight (oy!) but I really interested on how the young versions fell for each other.  Still loving the scenes with the brothers together.  And BIZ MARKIE!  That takes me back.  

[Dee]

I love this show. Deeply.

[Athena5217]

I hope this Becky leaving plot is a red herring.  I can't loose Rhonda AND Becky.

it is a very sad statement that I found the Andre being assaulted by the police storyline totally realistic.  

Lucious and Cookie are too old to have been singing "Just a Friend" in high school. That song came out in 1989.

[Dee]

If we're going by the actors ages, Taraji was born in 1970, which would make her a high school senior/college freshman when Just A Friend was released & Terrence is only a year older than her, so it's not much of a stretch IMO.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Dee

[Artsda]

I love the flashbacks.

Glad they figured out the bear so fast. 

Wow Andre loses his wife and now is targeted by the cops. I can't wait for them to meet Lucious and see whose son they were racists too.

[Marley]

I don't know why but I really dislike Jamal. Everything about him bugs me.

[Empress1]

"Jawn," King of Prussia, and "water ice shop." Somebody did some Googling about Philly lingo. Cookie wouldn't have done 17 years if she'd stayed with Barry, probably.

Lucious has killed a bunch of folks so him hosting an anti-violence summit is ... ironic.

Get it, Becky! (And she looks great. Better hair and she's lost some weight.) Take the job and stay with that fine-ass man. Lucious would cut you in a second if you stopped meeting his needs (and you know he's one of those "pack your things. Today is your last day" bosses when you resign). Never feel guilty about doing what's best for your career.

So I guess they're really not going to bury Rhonda. That's cold. It looks like they're not going with a "Jamal gets addicted to pain pills" story, which I'm glad about.

8 hours ago, Athena5217 said:

I hope this Becky leaving plot is a red herring.  I can't loose Rhonda AND Becky.

it is a very sad statement that I found the Andre being assaulted by the police storyline totally realistic.  

Lucious and Cookie are too old to have been singing "Just a Friend" in high school. That song came out in 1989.

Totally realistic. Would have been just as realistic if they'd shot him when he turned away from them to put the box in the car.

[Biggie B]

Always glad to see Becky! I really hope she doesn't leave. She has a great relationship with Jamal and is always so rational - even when others around her at Empire are flipping out, Becky gets stuff done! So fingers crossed that she stays and gets that job she's going for. Loved her green dress.

Anika's discovery of the teddy bear cam was interesting.

The flashbacks continue to excel. The actress playing the young Cookie really nails it. When she was telling Barry that she someday wants the house, the kids, etc. but needs to pursue music first, I actually felt bad for her, knowing that she had such plans but would be spending 17 years in prison before seeing them come to life. 

Andre can't win, can he? Just when he takes one tiny step forward, another horrific thing happens to him.

[SimoneS]

4 hours ago, Empress1 said:

Totally realistic. Would have been just as realistic if they'd shot him when he turned away from them to put the box in the car.

Sad, but freaking true. The good thing about this happening on Empire is that there will be some emotional satisfaction in the fictional fall out. You just know that Lucious is going to make those two cops lives a living hell. They will be lucky to still have jobs when he is done with them.

[TobinAlbers]

Love that we find out that Cookie was a studious Catholic girl who had a plan (music career and then a man and babies). Yes, she knows the street but we see now she had a road not traveled with a guy who was on the straight and narrow. He was just locking things down on her a little too soon and didn't quite get her love for the music.  Makes you understand her overt resentment towards bougie black men in that it's some bitterness about not choosing that life over Lucious and nicely sets up her even considering TD's character as a love match. It adds some nice layers. Cookie's got a lot of baggage so she's not going to think she could deserve or ever get that life again and yet it was once an option and could be again.

Having said that, I still hate how Andre is just left twisting in the wind by his parents. Yeah, we got a great scene with him and Cookie and it was powerful because those two actors can bring it, but she showed more concern over Jamal's panic attack issues and if he could sing again instead of her mentally ill son who lost his wife and near term child in a matter of months. I don't think Lucious even said his name this episode much less thought about him. They really leave him to fend for himself for the most part and prioritize the music, the company, and themselves over everything else.  Actually they kind of overlooked Hakeem as well.  His fiance dumped him at the altar and Lucious made off with his child and alternately tells him to man up and be a daddy while also saying he's the daddy of record so Hakeem needs to hop to his beat.

The Lyon boys needs to just get a house together as they all need to look after each other. Hakeem can move the baby and a nanny in; Jamal can keep the medicine calendar for him and Andre, and Andre will have people who can tell him if what he's seeing is real or not.

The preview scene shown during Lethal Weapon was great and should've been part of the episode. Andre was talking to Nana and she basically told him to embrace his crazy and not to worry about Anika as she'd take care of her. And then she said that Andre was as crazy as she is which they both cackled over. Pivotal scene that hints at things to come.

[Biggie B]

Quote

 You just know that Lucious is going to make those two cops lives a living hell. They will be lucky to still have jobs when he is done with them.

While I'm sure that Andre will make it through this mess, I somehow don't see Lucious as the one to straighten things out. Maybe it will be Taye Diggs who saves the day, which could endear him to Cookie.

[Dee]

Cookie and Lucious are prioritizing Jamal's condition over Andre's because Empire is on shaky ground (with the revolving door of CEO's and the recent acquisition of the company's new streaming service) so they (especially Lucious) are intent on leaning on Jamal (one of Empire's premier stars) for fresh content.

And it isn't like their parents efforts are all that beneficial to Jamal. Between Cookie's pushy (albeit well meaning) encouragement and Lucious borderline bullying (WORST DAD EVER), the poor kid is literally wilting underneath the pressure.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Dee

[SimoneS]

I also think that Cookie and Lucious see Jamal's PTSD as easier to fix than Andre's long term struggle with mental illness. Frankly, both Jamal and Andre need to see mental health professionals, particularly Andre.

I have been meaning to post about Vanessa. She is the first dark skin woman of color to be a potential love interest for one of the Lyon brothers. I am glad to see this.

Becky should pack up and leave Empire, never looking back. I don't see any career advancement for anyone who isn't a Lyon at that company. Plus, if she does leave, it will cause all the Lyons to finally appreciate her contributions.

Edited September 29, 2016 by SimoneS

[TobinAlbers]

17 minutes ago, Dee said:

And it isn't like their parents efforts are all that beneficial to Jamal. Between Cookie's pushy (albeit well meaning) encouragement and Lucious borderline bullying (WORST DAD EVER), the poor kid is literally wilting underneath the pressure.

True. Cookie means well but just last week when she slapped Jamal while he was having a panic attack, I winced.  Cookie and Lucious are still pretty old school about mental health issues and instinctively lean into the 'snap out of it!' mode of handling it. Not that they don't understand more of the reality of mental issues being real and how therapy and medication can help.

Also to give Cookie more credit, in her scenes with Andre you can tell she just doesn't know how to handle Andre's illness because it's in a lot of ways beyond her ability to navigate which is why she pushes him to his faith so hard. Her love for him is undoubtedly clear and when he put it on a level where she could relate (You're the only one I know who lost more than any of us and you stayed strong. How do I do that?) she immediately reminded him that she was with him.  And by the way for Andre who was mired in absolute devastation in losing his wife and child to acknowledge just how much Cookie lost in those 17 years was amazing.

[Lovecat]

6 hours ago, Empress1 said:

"Jawn," King of Prussia, and "water ice shop." Somebody did some Googling about Philly lingo.

Right??  I have to give it to the actress playing young!Cookie for nailing the "wooder ice" pronunciation, too.  Minus one point from young Barry, though for his precise "King.of.Prussia"...that would be "Kingaprussia" in the local vernacular :)

[Dee]

5 hours ago, TobinAlbers said:

True. Cookie means well but just last week when she slapped Jamal while he was having a panic attack, I winced.  Cookie and Lucious are still pretty old school about mental health issues and instinctively lean into the 'snap out of it!' mode of handling it. Not that they don't understand more of the reality of mental issues being real and how therapy and medication can help.

Also to give Cookie more credit, in her scenes with Andre you can tell she just doesn't know how to handle Andre's illness because it's in a lot of ways beyond her ability to navigate which is why she pushes him to his faith so hard. Her love for him is undoubtedly clear and when he put it on a level where she could relate (You're the only one I know who lost more than any of us and you stayed strong. How do I do that?) she immediately reminded him that she was with him.  And by the way for Andre who was mired in absolute devastation in losing his wife and child to acknowledge just how much Cookie lost in those 17 years was amazing.

Exactly! And to the family's credit, Andre hasn't been all that forthcoming about, or willing to lean on, his family for support with his issues in the past.

With Lucious off being a star, Cookie locked up, and his brothers being kids, Andre became accustomed to leaning on Rhonda to help him control his disorder. A good portion of that lack of familial trust (on his end) had to do with the disdain Andre held for his parents shady lifestyle and Vernon's insistence that he be "the protector" of his baby brothers.

As Ilene Chaiken and the writers have said in recent interviews, a lot of Andre's identity is tied into doing the "right thing" and subsequently getting punished for it. In the span of two years, he's lost his surrogate father figure, his son, his wife and any outside chance of running the company he played an integral part in building. Those would be huge losses for anyone, let alone a guy who's (barely) an adult, tormented by mental illness and was largely forced to fight his way out of the ghetto & into the ivy leagues all on his own.

His biggest lesson, at least for right now, is learning to trust his family. Lucious is an ass, but as you said, when he needs the rest of the family (and they're aware he's in need), they always show up for him. They may not deal with his condition as well as trained professionals but they're determined to have his back.

Edited September 30, 2016 by Dee

[thuganomics85]

Of course, Lucious' attempts to win Cookie back would be a shit ton of presents, including a giant-ass lion statute.  Subtle was never in Lucious' vocabulary.  She did enjoy the gift of Biz Markie at least, because who doesn't like Biz Markie?!  Also, she kept that golden gun, so that's a golden, shiny, Chekov's gun, if I ever saw one.  Have to think she is going to use it somewhere down the line.

Jamal still can't go on stage without melting down, and neither Cookie or Lucious are doing a good job at helping, although at least Cookie means well, while Lucious continues his classic "be an asshole and wear him down" approach to parenting.  Since Bre-z is still a regular, I have to think this is going to end with him having to confront Freda about what happened, and really address what happened.  Since he did refer to her as a victim, it's clear that Jamal has a lot of conflicting emotions about what happened with her.

Here's Taye Diggs, being his normal Taye Diggs self.  He's totally going to be Cookie's new love interest, and Lucious will probably stick his nose in it, and make it worse.

Hakeem and Nessa are also clearly starting a thing, which will be fun for everyone once Xzbit finds out, since he will freaking not a guy out just for staring at her ass.

While I don't want Becky to leave, J Poppa makes a lot of sense, and it probably would be wiser to try her luck elsewhere.

The flashbacks are good.  I wonder if they're setting things up to bring this Barry guy back.

Favorite scene was the kitchen scene with the Lyon sons.  I always enjoy it when it is those together.  So much history between them, but I always get the sense that they truly love and look out for one another, even when they are at odds.

[tennisgurl]

Poor Andre. Nothing good ever seems to happen to him, ever. In just a few months, the guy has lost his unborn child, his wife, he is still struggling with mental illness, and now he is getting unjustly beat by asshole cops. Can the poor guy have one day where nothing goes horribly wrong? 

I just feel really bad about the fact that Andre seems to be spending his time alone, in his cold apartment, falling apart, and no one seems to be really helping him. I mean, how long has it been since Rhonda died? A week? And if thats not bad enough, this is a guy who already suffers from mental illness, and has at least one suicide attempt in his past. Maybe someone should invite him to say with them? I mean, the Cookie scene was great, but I feel like Cookie still feels weird dealing with Andres mental state. She acknowledges its an issue, but she really does not know how to deal with it. Plus, and while I do think Cookie means well and she loves all her kids very much, she connects the most with Jamal, so it makes sense that she would focus more on his PTSD issues. Plus, he happens to be melting down in public, while Andre is having his freak outs in private, making things seem a little less pressing. 

Man, Cookie really should have gone with cute nerdy guy. I mean, teen Lucious has a ton of charisma, but cute nerdy guy probably hasn't killed as many people as Lucious, so theres that. 

Hi there Taye Diggs! Always good to see him on my TV, looking amazing as always, if just slightly smug at the beginning. Already calling him as Cookies new love interest. He can be her Road Not Taken Guy. Also calling a tragic end to the 3.9 bound for MIT kid. Announcing you just got into your dream college after years of struggle is like the under 50 equivalent of being three days until retirement while investigating a drug ring. The odds are not in your favor. 

[wanderingstar]

 I love Lyon Brothers scenes.

I would love it if Cookie really was done with Lucious, but this is a TV show, so...

Glad Anika and Lucious found the mic in the teddy bear, though I'm sure that won't stop Tariq for long.

Of course Lucious bought Cookie a giant lion statue with diamond-studded eyes. That's our Lucious - go big or go home.

Loved the song Nessa and Hakeem recorded. 

Seeing Andre get body slammed by the police was just...way too close to home.

Edited September 30, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[darkestboy]

Far better than last week. The scene alone with Jamal, Hakeem and Andre and the Andre/Cookie scene was worth the watch of this alone. The cops attacking Andre at the end I did not like one bit.

I am loving the Lucious/Cookie flashbacks this week. Angelo is clearly meant to be Berry 2.0 and a chance for Cookie to explore a road she previously didn't take. Lucious is not going to stand for that.

I did like Tariq's inclusion in the flashbacks and found it funny that Lucious and Anika rumbled his spycam so early as well. Anika being wary of Leah is gonna lead somewhere, right?

Hakeem/Nessa are obviously going to be a thing with Shyne posing a threat of some kind too. I like Nessa, she's far more charismatic than Laura but can we also have Tiana back properly too?

Ghost Rhonda last week and voice Rhonda this week. It works well enough.

Looks like Becky is finally going to get an actual plot as well in the first time since ever, 8/10

[DollEyes]

22 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Sad, but freaking true. The good thing about this happening on Empire is that there will be some emotional satisfaction in the fictional fall out. You just know that Lucious is going to make those two cops lives a living hell. They will be lucky to still have jobs when he is done with them.

 True, but don't count Cookie out. For all her faults, Cookie can be a fierce mama bear when she wants to be. Those cops will be lucky to still be alive when Lucius and Cookie get through with them. 

Edited September 30, 2016 by DollEyes

[phoenics]

23 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I just feel really bad about the fact that Andre seems to be spending his time alone, in his cold apartment, falling apart, and no one seems to be really helping him. I mean, how long has it been since Rhonda died? A week? And if thats not bad enough, this is a guy who already suffers from mental illness, and has at least one suicide attempt in his past. Maybe someone should invite him to say with them?

I thought Jamal invited Andre to stay w him?  That's why Jamal has interrupted twice when Andre has a Rhonda episode.  And why Andre had to go to his old place to get his stuff.

Also - pretty sure Lucious' brother has something to do with the police brutality and Andre situation.

[Rae Spellman]

Yes. In the first episode, Jamal mentioned that Andre was staying with him. Also, I imagine it would be difficult for Jamal to manage Andre's meds if he wasn't living with him.

[Happytobehere]

For all those upset about the shows treatment/non-burial of Rhonda, here's something you might enjoy.

http://tvrecappersdelight.com/empire-rhonda-lyon-speaks-out/