Season 3: Goodbye Jonathan, Hello Alyson!

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Elliot Zimet, Paul Gertner, Matthew Disero, and Rokas.

[SomethingClever]

Contrary to my normal stand on big stage illusions, I really liked Elliot Zimet. If you described his act to me, I would tell you I'd hate it, but he was really good. The staging was good and he brought a great energy to the stage. Really engaging.

Didn't like Rokas very much. Some of the presentational awkwardness probably came from the language barrier, but I just didn't think it was framed particularly well, and it dragged on without a dramatic build. 

Matthew Disero...I mean, I guess it was fine? It was never going to fool Penn and Teller, and it's nothing that you couldn't see from any mentalist. He had some funny lines, he wasn't a complete disaster, but he's not up to the standard I've come to expect on this show. 

I loved watching Paul Gertner. Unshuffled is a damn good trick, and you can tell by watching that he's been doing it for 20+ years. It's not just the sleight of hand (though that's not an easy trick to do consistently), but the way he frames each of the moments for maximum effect. I've seen that trick done poorly, and it can get boring to watch in the wrong hands. Gertner gets like 5-6 different moments where the audiences gasps. It's great even before the kicker ending which fooled P&T (and me).

[Amarsir]

Paul Gertner's trick is so great. The math is not that tricky, though the work to do it so smoothly is. But I just love the concept of it: marking cards on the side and rearranging to create deck patterns and spell things out. Just beautiful.

Quote

Didn't like Rokas very much. Some of the presentational awkwardness probably came from the language barrier, but I just didn't think it was framed particularly well, and it dragged on without a dramatic build. 

I probably give him a little more credit on the language barrier than you. I agree there was awkwardness in the flow of the whole trick, but I think if his patter was more native it would have smoothed a lot of the edges.

Disero on the other hand I probably liked less. A lot of magicians come on with a trick they know P&T know, then end with something different. (e.g. Gertner) So after the 5 volunteers went to sit down I was waiting for the rest of the trick.  I also think he was unlucky in that none of the 4 female volunteers were wearing pink, because that would have played into him teasing the guy so much better.

[Zeditious]

What in the fuck-shit could the "mentalist" have said that got bleeped? The one would be stupid; the other just stupid.

Of course, no matter what it was, the bleeping itself is oh so goddamned, mutherfucking, c*** stupid.

(And, yes, the trick would be very simple to pull off... Pen and Tell'er were not going to be fooled and the routine wasn't especially special either)

Edited August 18, 2016 by Zeditious

[ae2]

On 8/13/2016 at 1:32 AM, Kromm said:

Geez, that trick with the guy being chained up was old hat.  And yet predictably the audience goes nuts for it.

It seems the show has fallen back on classic, big stage performances more this season than in the past.

There's nothing wrong with them, they are what they are. Not everything needs to be completely new and original, nor can everything be. The only problem is the more they bring these acts in the further they shy away from their premise of fooling P&T. But I think it's been pretty clear from the start that not everyone is there with the intention of fooling them.

Part of the problem is magic acts are, like just about anything, so much more ubiquitous and accessible than in the past. You don't have to go to Vegas to see a big show. So we get tired of the same routines.

Anyway. I've actually seen Greg Frewin before. If you like that sort of act, and you find yourself in Niagara Falls (the Canada side) it's worth spending part of your afternoon to see his show. It's very old hat, but it's a good performance and it's fun. There were one or two bits that were exceptionally stunning and well done, that have stuck with me for a few years now. Don't bother with the dinner package though.

On 8/15/2016 at 5:24 PM, theatremouse said:

Oh, I am so completely bored of any and all tricks that involve iPads.

Me too. The closest I have come to liking a magician incorporating $technology into their performance is Rokas' use of an X-ray machine in S03E06. Otherwise they're just an annoying distraction that makes the act drag on too long.

[ae2]

Elliot Zimet - this is the first time on the show that I've felt the camera work has impacted the act. The overhead and close up shots of the platform really broke the illusion the performer has to create regarding the platform.

Otherwise it was a so-so performance. He brought a few fun elements to a routine that's a part of nearly every stage show. I didn't find it very engaging because, well, he didn't do anything. His assistant did all the work. (She seemed slightly less petite than the typical person doing what she had to do, so I'm actually impressed by her more than anything.) I think I would have enjoyed this bit in the middle of a full show, where I've already seen what the magician can do, but it didn't work for me here.

I found Rokas routine to be creative, but I didn't like him that much and he felt a bit shaky. Maybe he's more likable if I swoon over him like Alyson did? (Insert flute joke here) Not sure. I was hoping he would leave the watch "inside" of her though. 

He does have a bit of a Doogie Howser resemblance though. 

[theatremouse]

Plus, for me, there's nothing magical about it. It's pretty much the least mysterious thing you could do. It's like...gee how'd they they do that in xyz movie...computer generated effects...so if I'm watching a stage show of something that's supposed to astound me and you introduce, basically, a computer, gee how'd you do it? You programmed the thing to do it. Even if it is somehow more complex than that, it's inherently unimpressive to watch.

Sort of like people who come on the show and do a very obvious trick with a very obvious known method, and they do it some other way, but without a prover against the obvious and even try to make it seem like they did do the obvious, so they goad P&T into guessing the obvious thing, and in turn are foolers, but watching it the whole time I'm thinking "that's obvious" and unless they're doing the trick on this show (still without a prover) anyone else watching would also find it obvious and therefore uninteresting. There's no fun in that.

I did not enjoy the rat trick mainly because it made me think of 1984.

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Vitaly Beckman, Simon Coronel, Mac King and Kevin Viner.

[SomethingClever]

Yay, Mac King is back! He might have been my favorite act from last year

[marketdoctor]

I loved how Mac King owned that he couldn't come up with a good insult for Teller.

The "sit on this case with the clock in it" was a clever bit.

I'm still not sure how the card trick with the picture of the bus was done (though that was clever, as was the discussion of multiple outs.)  I think it was a trick where Penn & Teller would have done it that way (they did a card trick that way on their TV show), and maybe that distracted them.  

[Amarsir]

If memory serves, the last time a trick had a photo as the reveal they just barely got it. (Saying they'd just learned about it a week earlier.) I don't know what the method is but I wonder if there's an aspect of modern stuff that they just have a weakness for.

Always great to see Mac King, and Alyson was the perfect assistant for him.  I also like Penn's broken bottle juggling. There's a lot of talk to it, but it's an important explanation. Of course broken bottles are uneven and dangerous, but it's the kind of thing I wouldn't think about unless he goes through all that.

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Matthew Laslo, Zabrecky, David Garrard and Wayne Hoffman.

[Amarsir]

Penn's daughter appearing in a trick? I'm surprised he never teased this sooner. (Or if he did, I don't recall it.)

[SomethingClever]

Lesson #1 in why presentation is FAR more important than method. Rob Zabrecky did essentially the exact same trick that Matthew Disero did a couple weeks ago. Zabrecky was matching drawings while Disero was matching underwear colors, but it was the same basic effect: A group of spectators writes down information and mixes it up, magician discerns who drew/wrote each one. Disero's act was boring, Zabrecky's was the best performance of the night. He's funny, he's unexpected, and he has a clearly defined character and voice that elevate that trick far above generic mentalism. It was pure entertainment, I loved it.

Wayne Hoffman might have fooled them, but man, that trick was kind of a mess. The effect has a lot of potential, but there was no throughline in the presentation. All that stuff about predicting the future and "do Penn and Teller think I'm going to blow them up?" had nothing to do with the eventual effect. Halfway through the trick, I just wanted to go "what the heck are you even doing right now?"

[Amarsir]

Well that explains it. Not his trick! Moxie is adorable and she looked so thrilled to have been involved.

Matthew Laslow: I like the t-shirt cannon. I'm less a fan of using every Millennial cliche in the book. If you're going to use selfie sticks and hoverboards, do it with a wink. 

Zabrecky basically did the same effect as Disero did two weeks ago, but so so much better. His character-based deadpan humor was so much funnier and he had a much better ending.

Wayne Hoffman constructed his magic trick the way the writers of Lost created their series. Lots of stuff going in different directions that would be awesome if it all came together, but only half of it really did.  I won't discuss his method here, but I think he fooled them for the exact same reason I said Penn had a weakness last week.

[marketdoctor]

This show had a few winners:  Moxie, of course; Wayne Hoffman for actually fooling them (the best bit being the "can we have the tablecloth?" "Yes."  "Really?" and the "we know how you did it.  It's not really dynamite.")  

Zabrecky for the presentation win; he made being "on the spectrum" look incredibly cool, and as P & T noted, for actually drawing on his face with the marker.  

Also, you had a minister-magician on Penn & Teller, and everyone was cool about differences in theology, because there's a time and a place, and this wasn't it (and a method, and that method is polite conversation.)

[dabbrusc]

The camera angle did Matthew Laslo no favors, was pretty obvious that P&T wouldn't get fooled with it.

Spoiler

You can pretty blatantly see him doing a card force (especially with the five of spades) when they did the close-up of his hands.

[theatremouse]

18 hours ago, Amarsir said:

 I won't discuss his method here, but I think he fooled them for the exact same reason I said Penn had a weakness last week.

Explain what you mean in the explain thread?

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Xavier Mortimer, Fielding West, Caleb Wiles and Kevin Hall the Magic Maniac.

[marketdoctor]

1.  Adding Alyson to a self-working trick was brilliant.  I'm kind of glad they didn't stop on the three of clubs, but that might have been just me.

2.  I'm 90% sure the Magic Maniac knew they'd know, but the whole bit about "Rellet, the truck stop magician" was one of my favorites.

3.  Although not an illusion, those were really impressive escapes.

3a.  The P&T store is currently sold out of their metal Bill of Rights card--kind of a shame, but maybe they'll get some back.

http://www.pennandtellerstore.com/p-t-tsa-bill-of-rights-card

[theatremouse]

The self-working trick guy frustrated me because part of the beauty of doing that kind of trick is he's taking himself out of it. But he handled the cards twice after it started. I get from the reveal it was a gimmicked deck anyway, but it annoyed me. The whole point of having Alyson do it is to take himself out so it's all the more magical. If he touches stuff in the middle, even when I don't know what the illusion is, it's ruined because the mind just jumps to "well that's when he made sure it worked".

[Monty]

I'm guessing the self-working trick was the one we heard about where Penn couldn't decide if he should just let the force work as intended or interfere with it.

[Amarsir]

Dear Alyson. I know forgetting their names isn't a great joke (which I don't blame you for). But you can help it a lot by selling it with a an extra iota of acting. You were in teleprompter mode and it showed. (But you did fine in the post-performance chats so it's OK.)

I loved the simplicity of Xavier Mortimer flying around with a jump rope. Clean and beautiful. But I did feel the stage was overly darkened. It actually looked better in one of the side angles where we could see his hand moving against a side-stage background. The audience didn't get that view. Now obviously they can't have all bright lights on him or it shows too much, but too dark undermines the accomplishment.

Fielding West (with the bird) seems like your typical workday magician. Which I hope doesn't come off too harshly, but he seems more at home doing children's events than on a Vegas stage. And that's less about the trick and more about the patter, IMHO.

I'm with you @theatremouse in that Caleb's trick was really great, with that obvious flaw. If he could either come up with a reason to take the cards more compelling than "just because", or better yet rig up an auto-shuffler or something, it would be even better. Even when he didn't have to, he was hands-on with pointing like he couldn't help himself.

Magic Maniac was funny. Reminded me of The Amazing Johnathan, a Vegas legend in his own right.

[SomethingClever]

19 hours ago, Monty said:

I'm guessing the self-working trick was the one we heard about where Penn couldn't decide if he should just let the force work as intended or interfere with it.

I don't think so. If I'm right on the method (and I'm about 95% sure, I just haven't rewatched it yet to deconstruct it), that's not a force he could've refused. 

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Timon, Kyle Marlett, The Evasons and Chef Anton.

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Christopher Tracy and Jim Leach, Neil Croswell, Ben Young and Henok.

[Amarsir]

I enjoyed all of these acts. Normally there's at least one that feels like they're on via generosity, but all were well done both in terms of effect and presentation.

[tominboston]

Can anyone explain in the spoiler thread how the mentalists communicated their information? I did notice that P&T didn't bother to check the woman's blindfold since they clearly knew how it was done. Were the audience members plants?

[Xantar]

They are not allowed to use plants in the audience, and Alyson is never in on the act when she's called up to assist. At first I thought there was electronic assistance going on with the Evasons, but Penn said it was done in the old style. Which is mind bogglingly difficult, and the more you re-watch it, the more amazing it gets.

[marketdoctor]

I really liked the egg trick.

Also, MrsMarketdoctor wondered why Alyson Hannigan always wears the same blue dress.  I think it's so they can magically edit shows together if they need to.

[The Crazed Spruce]

15 minutes ago, marketdoctor said:

MrsMarketdoctor wondered why Alyson Hannigan always wears the same blue dress.  I think it's so they can magically edit shows together if they need to.

That, and they probably tape multiple episodes in one night.

[Amarsir]

6 hours ago, marketdoctor said:

I really liked the egg trick.

It's a very cute trick. And without giving anything away, it's easy to learn the calculator prediction part. (Changing the napkin into an egg is harder and was uniquely his finish.)

Traps is such a great routine that they haven't done in ages. It feels really special that they brought it back for this show and we get to see it in such clarity.  (There's an old version on YouTube if you want to see the slight differences, albeit much blurrier.)

Edited September 10, 2016 by Amarsir

[SomethingClever]

I loved Henok. Like Penn said, that's the first time I've ever cared about a confabulation routine. He didn't solve the fundamental issue with confabulation, which is "why do you, the magician, have to write anything down?" but he was so charming and entertaining that I just didn't care. It was smart and funny, and it felt like a routine very much inspired by the spirit of what Penn and Teller do. 

[Xantar]

10 hours ago, marketdoctor said:

I really liked the egg trick.

Also, MrsMarketdoctor wondered why Alyson Hannigan always wears the same blue dress.  I think it's so they can magically edit shows together if they need to.

Penn & Teller are also wearing the exact same suits, ties, and shoes in all the episodes. I suspect the editors are trying to put together one successful fooler in each episode. 

[nat-fthc]

5 hours ago, Amarsir said:

Traps is such a great routine that they haven't done in ages. It feels really special that they brought it back for this show and we get to see it in such clarity.  (There's an old version on YouTube if you want to see the slight differences, albeit much blurrier.)

They did it when I saw them in June, too.

[opus]

33 minutes ago, Xantar said:

Penn & Teller are also wearing the exact same suits, ties, and shoes in all the episodes. I suspect the editors are trying to put together one successful fooler in each episode. 

Yeah, I think it's something like this, instead of multiple show tapings,  because things like game shows tape multiple episodes at a time, and there are always wardrobe changes there.

[mansonlamps]

On 9/10/2016 at 8:55 AM, marketdoctor said:

I really liked the egg trick.

Also, MrsMarketdoctor wondered why Alyson Hannigan always wears the same blue dress.  I think it's so they can magically edit shows together if they need to.

I thought I was the only one who noticed that!  I thought it was because of filming on the same day at first (although, costume changes, come on) until it was the entire season.  Plus I really don't care for the dress and she seems a tiny bit unsteady on the heels IMO.  Regardless, she has become a very appealing host and has a great rapport with both the guests and P&T.

Edited September 11, 2016 by mansonlamps

[McKinley]

I’m late to the party, because our family is enjoying watching episodes together on Hulu, but unfortunately it’s not very often that we can all watch at the same time!

Anyway, I wanted to say that I really enjoyed Arthur Trace’s performance.  Low key, thoughtful, and it really drew me in.  But I was disappointed with the camera angles and cuts for his performance, which is not a complaint I’ve had with most of the acts.  In fact, I think the camera angles and cuts are generally well thought out on this show and allow you to feel like you’re getting a pretty complete view of what’s happening as if you were seated in the audience.  But for Trace’s performance, I was astounded when he revealed the bite in the apple.  I went impressed that I was so misdirected that I missed the change, and went back to see when he did it, and the fact is that you can’t see it happen.  There are portions with a wide-angle view of the stage with the apple with no bite, cut to some close ups including close ups of Alison when we can’t even see Trace (which is, I assume, the key moment), and then back to a wide angle view of the stage and you can see the bite.  

[Kromm]

It was well done, but that Timon guy didn't really fool P&T, I'd say (he didn't even fool me) as much as they chose the wrong explanation of two possible ones and had to give it to him because of that. 

It could be argued he "won" because he played a mind-game with P&T (convincing them the ring was important when it was not). But really the entire trick was literally the power of suggestion.  He implanted the idea of where to put the coin each and every time (including the last time) via key phrases. 

[The Crazed Spruce]

Featured magicians include Joseph Reohm, Brent Braun, Chris Rose and Charles Bach.

[The Crazed Spruce]

Season finale!

Featured magicians include Anthony Asimov, Angela Funovits, Ivan Amodei and Vince Charming.

[theatremouse]

36 minutes ago, Kromm said:

But really the entire trick was literally the power of suggestion.  He implanted the idea of where to put the coin each and every time (including the last time) via key phrases. 

That's what I thought he was doing too, but wouldn't that necessarily have a risky-ish potential for failure? I mean, I get that just because he succeeded four in a row on this attempt with AH doesn't mean he always does, but I thought his suggestions were clunky and obvious and it seems to me his chances were comparable to rock-paper-scissors in terms of whether someone takes the reverse-reverse-psychology bait. Or does he have an additional method to tell whether they took the suggestion or not? Is that part of it?

(What I really mean here is, as I was watching and instinctively imaging as they went along which hand I'd put it in if it were me, they wouldn't have matched.)

Although I also wondered if during his explain spiel at the end he messed up or if it were also part of the effect that at one point when he was explaining why AH chose a particular thing at one point...he said it backwards. If I'm remembering right, the thing I'm thinking of happened after he was done so it shouldn't have have been part of the suggestion, just patter. But now I'm so conditioned to look for anything out of place I feel like I'm always second guessing myself on what might or might not be relevant on this show.

[Amarsir]

There are tells give have significantly better than average chances, but I don't think anyone claims they are 100%. If he went on TV with a method that isn't foolproof he deserve to win on guts alone. But then I don't know what he did do, so don't listen to me.

[SomethingClever]

I loved the Brent Braun trick. So many clever subtleties that made it feel so incredibly fair. Like Penn said, I thought the staging of it and the presentation was just wonderful. Really strong piece of card magic.

I thought Joseph Reohm was fine, and certainly major props to him for coming back from a severe hand injury, that's crazy scary for a magician. There were some really nice parts, but I thought on the whole he lacked the smoothness which characterizes great manipulation acts, like things are just effortlessly appearing at their fingers.

I was a little puzzled by Chris Rose at the beginning, and I didn't think I was going to like him, but it all came together quite nicely. A fun little routine, and a great example of how surprise and properly motivated actions can hide method. That might be the simplest method that's fooled P&T in 3 seasons. 

[Totale]

I think P&T were none too pleased at the judge's ruling that said Ivan (?) had fooled them.  I watch with subtitles because my ears are shot, but this is the first time I remember that any of the P&T discussions were subtitled.  I couldn't actually hear it, but after the decision when they went back to their seats the subtitles said one of them said to the other "He only had to control six cards".

[theatremouse]

I was really intrigued by this ruling, specifically that Penn was interrupted midsentence and ruled fooled after the guy told him to elaborate. So I wonder if there's effectively an "only one guess" rule (I think I remember that right?) and the judges determined that Penn's elaborating was veering toward not-exactly-what-his-initial-masked-remark implied so they stopped him, even if he were maybe about to say it? Because he'd already "guessed wrong"? Or something? Because it was weird to me they earpieced Alyson to interrupted him and rule it over. And I think Penn sort of seemed like he would've expected the guy to sort of give up the ghost and acknowledge they were onto him from the first comment? I don't know. It's unfair of me to speculate since I don't know what method the guy used, but this seemed like maybe another technicality fooler? Or I'm biased against the dude. He lost me about 10 seconds into his patter. The word you're looking for is multiply, dude. I am not always a grammar pedant, but some things just rub me the wrong way.

I really enjoyed the puzzle trick.

I loved the bit at the end, especially Teller's expressions to Penn's "guessing" and how they basically made fun of the most common reactions from the attempted foolers when they're up there.

[Amarsir]

I sometimes feel like Penn has gone too far to the extreme with not giving away tricks, to the point that he maybe feels he can just say "You didn't fool us". With Anthony Asimov and the walnuts, they did indeed know precisely but I understand him wanting more explanation.  With Ivan Amodai, I'm not sure what that was about. Probably have to keep it to the explanation thread to speculate further. (But thanks for the subtitle tip, @Totale.)

Was this the last episode of the season? It was good, but I think I would have picked another one to end on. And like I said last year, Penn & Teller blew out a lot of their big stage tricks in a short time during season 2 so it was pretty evident they had to put together some stuff to show. Not that it wasn't fun - judging themselves (and revealing the method) was very cute here, and the newspaper patter was fun on the prior episode. But neither is near the quality of Cell Fish, Invis-Ball Thread, or Bullet Catch - all of which were done right in a row at the start of season 2.

[Monty]

I agree, Penn definitely feels that some tricks are so obvious that he shouldn't have to explain them. Like if someone does cups and balls, they know perfectly well that Teller knows everything they did. And if the magician is good-natured and trusting (I'm thinking of Mac King here) they'll accept Penn at his word.

[SomethingClever]

11 hours ago, theatremouse said:

 Or I'm biased against the dude. He lost me about 10 seconds into his patter. The word you're looking for is multiply, dude. I am not always a grammar pedant, but some things just rub me the wrong way.

He seemed kind of nervous up there. His patter wasn't nearly as polished as I'd expect from a guy who has almost certainly done that trick hundreds of times, and who gives off the air of a dude who has a really polished show. He also just had really weird inflection in his voice, putting emphasis at odd places. Once he actually got into the flow of the trick and naming everyone's card, he was much better, which is why I'm thinking it was nerves. It did kind of put me off though.

1) Vince Charming is a terrible name, and it made me want to dislike that guy immediately.
2) That's an awesome trick in search of a presentation. Seriously, it's such a clean, powerful, crystal-clear effect. You can make a career off an effect like that...and the presentation was so flat. It was so anticlimactic. Like, it was still a good trick because the effect is so strong, but it could have been so much better! He's taken a plot that is inherently packed with meaning, and rendered it trivial. It actually made me kind of mad, because I think in the right hands that trick is a masterpiece, and he just didn't put in the work to find a presentation for it. 

[SVNBob]

1 hour ago, SomethingClever said:

1) Vince Charming is a terrible name, and it made me want to dislike that guy immediately.

It was either a bad stage name, or his parents, The Charmings, thought it was a clever idea at the time.

 

1 hour ago, SomethingClever said:

2) That's an awesome trick in search of a presentation. Seriously, it's such a clean, powerful, crystal-clear effect. You can make a career off an effect like that...and the presentation was so flat. It was so anticlimactic. Like, it was still a good trick because the effect is so strong, but it could have been so much better! He's taken a plot that is inherently packed with meaning, and rendered it trivial. It actually made me kind of mad, because I think in the right hands that trick is a masterpiece, and he just didn't put in the work to find a presentation for it. 

Agreed.  Which might have been one of the hard parts for Penn and Teller too, since Penn said they'd worked on the same effect and scrapped it.

The better way to present that trick would probably be to work on the blank sides of everything instead of the faces.  Then you get the added beat of revealing the completed picture to everyone.  Might have to add a moment of having the audience member add a sticker with a "signature" to the face of the piece to "prove" they added it in...if that's even possible for this trick.