Divorce - General Discussion

[luna1122]

Yeah, I actually quite liked this episode but there is a bizarre shift from season one and season two, especially in regards to Robert. I'm happy with the new Robert, but it's kind of jarring, the difference, and yes, his ability to hand over a check for more than I make a year without blinking, and take the kids to Italy for two months (not to mention, be able TO just take off for two months). It does all seem very unrealistic. And yeah, kind of like Carrie and the chicks were all more fiscally realistic in the first season or two of SATC but then all wound up in nothing but outrageous pricey designer wear later on. I know we want escapism, but I like some realism too, and I hope the show doesn't go too far down that path.  I mean, if it comes back.

Molly Shannon continues to bug.

I understood Frances' initial reaction to not wanting to let the kids go. It's a long period of time for them to be away, and it's something she wanted to do for/with them herself. It would sting--more than sting--to watch them be able to do that with the new woman in your ex's life, no matter who you are. She came around and let them go, which she really didn't have to do. I didn't think she was being selfish, or if she was, it was very human of her.

[scrb]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I'm trying to figure out what this show is trying to say - about divorce, or just in general. And I'm not really sure. There was a jarring shift in the tone between Season 1 and Season 2. Frances is the one who wanted out of the marriage but Robert is the one who got to move on and be much happier and more successful with someone else. Frances, on the other hand, has had one beat down after another - the guy she was having an affair with didn't want to be with her and that was her main reason for wanting a divorce. She finally got her dream artist to show and then promptly got dumped by her. Her dating prospects have turned out to be jerks. The kids are leaving and she's in empty nest territory and even her friends are starting to turn on her. And after all is said and done she keeps turning to Robert just for the comfort of it.

What I'm getting out of this is that Frances should never have gotten divorced and should have appreciated her lot in life because now she's worse off but everyone else is better off. And I honestly don't think that's what the show is trying to say but that's what I'm seeing play out.

If nothing else this show just seems to be character study for the sake of character study without any real story to tell. In which case I see no reason for them to make another season.

That's quite a leap, no? Robert went from living in an unfinished house with no running water and working construction jobs just to get by to suddenly having 75 grand to hand over to his ex. Now, I get it - he sold that house. But still. I can't imagine he got that much profit out of it considering how long he had to sit on it. In fact I'd be surprised if he wasn't still in the red, just less so. If nothing else, this speaks to how little the writers have given thought to the realities of finances.

There's an article with the show runner for season 2 in the Media thread.  Basically she explains that she made the show about relationships between these characters.

The original show runner left over creative differences.  So one can surmise that he wouldn't have taken the show in the direction they did in season 2.

Basically it was rebooted, with them putting the divorce quickly behind them  rather than drawing it out more than they did in season 1.

 

As for Robert's finances, I think some months have supposedly passed between episode 7 and 8.  I thought they referred to "months" of them flipping houses with Robert remodeling them.  So the profits are from more than one flip, so they could take the kids to Europe for two months.  That is serious money, unless they all plan to stay in hostels and rarely eat out.  But of course we know that's not how Jackie will travel.

Still, as I noted above, they're still way too casual with passing a $75k check around.

[txhorns79]

Quote

As for Robert's finances, I think some months have supposedly passed between episode 7 and 8.  I thought they referred to "months" of them flipping houses with Robert remodeling them.  So the profits are from more than one flip, so they could take the kids to Europe for two months.  That is serious money, unless they all plan to stay in hostels and rarely eat out.  But of course we know that's not how Jackie will travel.

Didn't Robert say they were staying in a villa owned by a friend of Jackie's?  While I'm sure they will do mini-trips around Europe, I think the main focus of the trip is Italy. 

[Mindthinkr]

14 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

Didn't Robert say they were staying in a villa owned by a friend of Jackie's?  While I'm sure they will do mini-trips around Europe, I think the main focus of the trip is Italy. 

Yes! That is what Robert said. Having traveled quite a bit I’d say there’s a big difference cost wise when you are in a hotel and have to basically eat all of your major meals out vs staying where you have a kitchen and can dine out once per day (sometimes lunch where you get the same great food but at less cost than dinner). That way they can save their coins for a rail pass and can do a lot of day trips. 

[DangerousMinds]

23 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

 I liked the show also .. It's the cast I wasn't crazy about especially SJP and Shannon.   Yes, SJP is not Carrie anymore, and it annoys me that she still acts like her at her age.  I would have liked to see more of the divorce problems, but it went from not getting along to practically besties overnight.  That's why I think this show is done as they wrapped everything up.  I wouldn't want to see Carrie come back in the dating scene.  She's too old for that and not cutesy anymore.  Maybe Andy Cohen will make her a New York housewife and she could continue skipping around the city and the Hamptons.

Women of all ages do continue to date when they are single.

[Corgi-ears]

From certain angles, Skip -- or the actor who plays him, Marton Csokas -- looks like a younger and more fancypants version of Chris Noth. Which really helps the show distinguish itself from being Sex and the City: the Suburbs Years.

[iMonrey]

Quote

There's an article with the show runner for season 2 in the Media thread.  Basically she explains that she made the show about relationships between these characters.

This is just a personal preference, obviously, but Character Study for the sake of Character Study is about the least compelling kind of writing I can imagine. There has to be some story to tell otherwise I feel like the writing is self-indulgent and pretentious like all those emo movies about teens in the 80s. 

[msrachelj]

On 3/5/2018 at 12:22 AM, scrb said:

Well they might as well call this Post-Divorce, because they seemed to have both settled into their separate lives.  Show was originally suppose to be about the drawn-out process of a messy divorce but maybe they kind of rebooted it to make it about life after divorce for these middle-aged upper middle class characters.

Frances has taken several jumps on the trampoline and has landed on her feet.

At the beginning of the season, they both faced financial as well as emotional uncertainty.  Now, Robert can write $75k checks and casually give it to Frances, who can casually endorse it to Diane, who can drunkenly lose it at some dive bar.

Frances says she didn't get into the art business to make money yet it just happens to be a potentially lucrative field.  So she can afford to sanctimoniously reject Skip's rather generous offer?  Maybe she will wise up next season, though I haven't heard of an official renewal.

Good for Diane to go back to the cosmetics counter at the department store rather than back to Boca but can you live in New York these days working retail?  Maybe if there's another season, they'll explore that.  I think they're good comic relief so I hope they and the show returns.

Another possible title:  Money and the (rich upstate) Suburbs.

as a normal, sane person who values money, i was outraged at the handling of freakin' $75,000!!! what the hell???

[CaliCheeseSucks]

Well that explains why this season has been almost completely the product of SATC writers - and unsurprisingly, completely insufferable in the ways that SATC was prone towards. 

[CaliCheeseSucks]

I've only made it halfway through this episode so far (completely forgot about it with the Oscars last Sunday). I made it as far as Diane drunk in the dive bar and I'm not sure I can even tolerate the next fifteen minutes.

The VERY first thing I thought about with "Jackie and Robert taking their kids to Europe for two months was" what about all the drama with the son and daughter hooking up? That just didn't happen, or didn't amount to any continuing overriding concerns about them being in close quarters suddenly? I mean... it was played for a rather big deal in an episode or two.  Frankly, even without that, I wouldn't let my children spend 2/3 of the summer in Italy with their dad and his jumpoff.

It's a shame Sharon Horgan seems to have completely abandoned this project; it's an utter mess without her. 

[candall]

Ah!  New showrunner for Season 2--that explains a lot.  I posted somewhere earlier that SJP needed a firm hand to overrule her ingrained mannerisms--as Redford did with Mary Tyler Moore in Ordinary People--but that will never happen with SJP as an Executive Producer.  Score!

 

The first time I liked self-centered, superficial Diane was in this episode, when she had a pragmatic inkling and marched herself back to the glove counter to start again.

 

I'd definitely watch a third season.  These characters may have developed in questionable ways, but I've already invested in the development and I'd happily snark about where they go next.  (I have ten hours of Here & Now and Counterpart waiting for me and the thought makes me tired.)

Good board; thanks for the thoughtful comments.  Cheers!

[qtpye]

Quote

Fances is somebody who's always wanted to live in the city. What would happen, if she moved to the city, now that she's single? What does that look like? What does Robert's success look like, now that he has money? He's never had money. He's a complete f*ck-up. For him, money is a challenge

Quote

 

Although their kids, Tom and Lila, are still in school in the suburbs, previews for the Season 2 finale show that Frances may be joining professional forces with Skip Zakarian after he poached Sylvia from her. That could possibly lead her to relocate to New York City. And Robert and Jackie's real estate partnership appears to be moving forward, which will give Robert that cash flow that Bicks mentioned.

 

 

Uh, does the showrunner know we have already had a show where SJP was single living in the city and dating millionaires? Also, the biggest problem Robert will have is being rich?

Will it also include fabulous apartments they could never afford in real life and designer clothing?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

S2 blooper reel:

[LilaFowler]

I love THC. I wish this were a better show for him.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Hollywood Reporter comedy actress roundtable with Molly Shannon (Divorce), Rachel Brosnahan (The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel), Frankie Shaw (SMILF), Drew Barrymore (Santa Clarita Diet), Debra Messing (Will & Grace), Alison Brie (GLOW), and Tracee Ellis Ross (Black-ish):

Edited July 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[BingeyKohan]

The word on a Divorce Season 3 coming out of HBO's TCA presentation was: they are working on season 3 but it hasn't been renewed:

https://deadline.com/2018/07/divorce-season-3-renewal-sarah-jessica-parker-hbo-comedy-series-canceled-or-renewed-1202433569/

I find this sort of bizarre. They are going to let the writers write scripts, then they'll read the scripts and decide if the show is worth continuing? If that's true, I'm not sure they should be publicizing that. If they still end up cancelling the show before they start filming, then a lot of people will be out of jobs with the perception it's the writers' fault. It feels like the show is more or less cancelled but they wanted to create a scenario to stroke SJP's ego, so they created this narrative where she herself might read the scripts and say, no, I think we're done here.

[scrb]

Well second season they kind of rebooted with a new show runner so maybe they want to see which direction they'd go.

I don't think the ratings were great but HBO still shows clips from the show when they have these promos of all their shows.

 

Probably depends also on other shows they have in the pipeline.

[LilaFowler]

S2 was terrible and it's no doubt due to the fact that SJP brought in someone from her SATC days to be showrunner. The whole season felt very Carrie Bradshaw to me. I'm not shocked that HBO wants to see some scripts first before they continue with SATC 2.0 Divorce S3. They should just cancel it and move on.

[qtpye]

On 7/26/2018 at 5:05 PM, LilaFowler said:

S2 was terrible and it's no doubt due to the fact that SJP brought in someone from her SATC days to be showrunner. The whole season felt very Carrie Bradshaw to me. I'm not shocked that HBO wants to see some scripts first before they continue with SATC 2.0 Divorce S3. They should just cancel it and move on.

Right down to the zillionaire falling head over heels for her.

[LilaFowler]

Season 3 has a green light. It will be an abbreviated season, though.

[cpcathy]

I liked season 2, but I agree, it was very Carrie Bradshaw-y. Funny, my husband brings up this show all the time, wanting to know when it's coming back. And he got up and walked out on the pilot episode!

[scrb]

Just saw trailer for season 3, at the end of which it said it’s air8ng this Monday at 10 pm EST.

So check your DVRs.

Not much advanced warning and the fact that they’re airing on Monday may mean they’re burning these new episodes.

So last chance maybe.

[scrb]

Ok so they rebooted.   They burned down the gallery and now Frances will work for some bird nerd and his sister.

Guess more comic potential in that situation than art, since they already played the golden turd card?

Robert and that Ugly Betty blonde are expecting.

Diane appears to be destitute, living with Dallas, who’s missing her son.  Diane forces Nick, who’s in prison, to sign divorce papers.  Hope that’s not the end of him because he’s a funny character.  They have to spring h8m out of prison so he will have more to do than to make animal figurines out of toilet paper.

Frances seems shook that Robert is going to have another child, even though he looks like a mummy next to a toddler.

Was going to say maybe she should look up Jermaine from Flight of the Conchords but he’s busy making some campy TV show about vampires or something.

But turns out Frances has a boyfriend with an apt. With a sick view of the Brooklyn Bridge and Manhattan.  Must be loaded to have a pad like that.

[Armchair Critic]

Why did Robert say "Goddamnit" at the end? Does he feel he is in over his head starting out with a marriage with a new baby or was he feeling bad about telling Frances about the pregnancy or was it something simple I didn't pick up on?

[LilaFowler]

Frances moved her kids into what appears to be another unrealistically spacious apartment in NYC. Why? To make the show resemble SATC as much as possible? Even when Frances loses, she has to be shown as winning (she won't get the job with Skip but his employees all admire her? sure) IDK. This series was a dud to me. It had potential but then SJP mucked it up creatively in S2. Too bad.

[TV Diva Queen]

19 hours ago, LilaFowler said:

Frances moved her kids into what appears to be another unrealistically spacious apartment in NYC. Why? To make the show resemble SATC as much as possible? Even when Frances loses, she has to be shown as winning (she won't get the job with Skip but his employees all admire her? sure) IDK. This series was a dud to me. It had potential but then SJP mucked it up creatively in S2. Too bad.

I don’t think it’s unrealistic, they had a pretty nice house in the Hudson and I don’t think they’re poor. Well at least the husband isn’t. The apartment didn’t look like anything special to me. What I couldn’t get pass was her uprooting the kids like that. So very Carrie to do that  

and who was the guy she was making out with at the end?  I don’t recall from S2

[scrb]

Listening to SJP interview on Fresh Air now:

https://www.npr.org/2019/07/03/738328959/sarah-jessica-parker-on-sex-divorce-marriage-and-metoo

They are talking about her childhood.

They said this is the 3rd and final season of Divorce.  Says THC was her first choice to play Robert.

[chocolatine]

On 7/2/2019 at 9:47 AM, LilaFowler said:

Frances moved her kids into what appears to be another unrealistically spacious apartment in NYC. Why? To make the show resemble SATC as much as possible? Even when Frances loses, she has to be shown as winning (she won't get the job with Skip but his employees all admire her? sure) IDK. This series was a dud to me. It had potential but then SJP mucked it up creatively in S2. Too bad.

14 hours ago, TV Diva Queen said:

I don’t think it’s unrealistic, they had a pretty nice house in the Hudson and I don’t think they’re poor. Well at least the husband isn’t. The apartment didn’t look like anything special to me. What I couldn’t get pass was her uprooting the kids like that. So very Carrie to do that  

Her new place seems to be in Inwood (it said Inwood something above the entrance), i.e. the very outskirts of Manhattan; it's a walkup with no laundry facilities and only seems to have one bathroom, so I can hand-wave that it would be comparatively cheap as far as NYC apartments go. I do wonder about her job at the avian society though, I can't imagine it being well-paid, and even if she sold the Hastings house at a profit, that money won't last forever.

I do agree that the show is becoming more and more like SATC, and I don't like it. SJP trying to play a Carrie-esque character at her age is just sad, and it would serve her much better as an actress if she were able to show that she can play other kinds of characters as well. 

[msrachelj]

On 7/3/2019 at 8:27 AM, TV Diva Queen said:

I don’t think it’s unrealistic, they had a pretty nice house in the Hudson and I don’t think they’re poor. Well at least the husband isn’t. The apartment didn’t look like anything special to me. What I couldn’t get pass was her uprooting the kids like that. So very Carrie to do that  

and who was the guy she was making out with at the end?  I don’t recall from S2

and she was sleeping on a pull out couch in the living room.

[scrb]

Not much happened in episode 2, S3.

They’re there for each other.  Frances doesn’t seem too sad that her ex is getting married and having a baby.  She has to coax Lila into going to the wedding?

Diane thought she was going to make huge commissions, rang up over $130k for some woman!

Turns out she was there to give Diane false hope.  What a bitch!

Hmm, so coparenting is going to be a thing this season?  Yawn.

[txhorns79]

21 hours ago, scrb said:

Diane thought she was going to make huge commissions, rang up over $130k for some woman!

Is Diane supposed to work at Macy’s or Bloomingdale’s?  I thought she would have been more suspicious of such a ridiculously large purchase.

I see they are also repeating the Sex and the City theme by dressing Frances in a style that could only be called: “Bag Lady Chic.” 

I think the best I can say for Divorce now is that I don’t mind watching, but I also don’t think it has any reason to continue existing as a show.    

[Armchair Critic]

22 hours ago, scrb said:

Diane thought she was going to make huge commissions, rang up over $130k for some woman!

Turns out she was there to give Diane false hope.  What a bitch!

HA I loved it! Diane gets on my nerves.

[qtpye]

On 7/3/2019 at 11:08 PM, chocolatine said:

Her new place seems to be in Inwood (it said Inwood something above the entrance), i.e. the very outskirts of Manhattan; it's a walkup with no laundry facilities and only seems to have one bathroom, so I can hand-wave that it would be comparatively cheap as far as NYC apartments go. I do wonder about her job at the avian society though, I can't imagine it being well-paid, and even if she sold the Hastings house at a profit, that money won't last forever.

I do agree that the show is becoming more and more like SATC, and I don't like it. SJP trying to play a Carrie-esque character at her age is just sad, and it would serve her much better as an actress if she were able to show that she can play other kinds of characters as well. 

I really hate her extensions with the lowlights around her face. It’s a little too Carrie.

[love2lovebadtv]

On 7/2/2019 at 12:47 PM, LilaFowler said:

Frances moved her kids into what appears to be another unrealistically spacious apartment in NYC. Why? To make the show resemble SATC as much as possible? Even when Frances loses, she has to be shown as winning (she won't get the job with Skip but his employees all admire her? sure) IDK. This series was a dud to me. It had potential but then SJP mucked it up creatively in S2. Too bad.

I didn't think the apartment was unrealistically spacious, especially not for that neighborhood.  It looks like Inwood, which has a lot of large prewar buildings with walkups or old elevators.  I wish they had kept the previous setting because it was prettier for me to look at lol. 

[love2lovebadtv]

On 7/3/2019 at 11:08 PM, chocolatine said:

Her new place seems to be in Inwood (it said Inwood something above the entrance), i.e. the very outskirts of Manhattan; it's a walkup with no laundry facilities and only seems to have one bathroom, so I can hand-wave that it would be comparatively cheap as far as NYC apartments go. I do wonder about her job at the avian society though, I can't imagine it being well-paid, and even if she sold the Hastings house at a profit, that money won't last forever.

I do agree that the show is becoming more and more like SATC, and I don't like it. SJP trying to play a Carrie-esque character at her age is just sad, and it would serve her much better as an actress if she were able to show that she can play other kinds of characters as well. 

I just posted about the apartment before I saw your post. It does look like Inwood, which is one of the least expensive Manhattan neighborhoods (might even be the cheapest - not sure about Washington Heights). I was actually thinking how unrealistic it is for them to move and not hear the kids complain about the lack of amenities they had in their house. 

Where is Robert living now? It seems to be a different place from the prior seasons. And it's also part of why I don't care for open floor plans. Where is Jackie's daughter? Was there any mention of her?  

[txhorns79]

20 minutes ago, love2lovebadtv said:

Where is Jackie's daughter? Was there any mention of her?  

I don't think there was any mention of Jackie's daughter, or where she might be. 

[chocolatine]

25 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't think there was any mention of Jackie's daughter, or where she might be. 

The daughter was mentioned in the latest episode (but not shown). Jackie instructed Robert to pick her up at the airport and take her to the salon to get ready for the wedding. The daughter is a year or two older than Tom, so assume she's away at college.

On 7/8/2019 at 8:04 PM, scrb said:

Diane thought she was going to make huge commissions, rang up over $130k for some woman!

And that woman was Bitsy Von Muffling! Finally, a SATC cameo I didn't mind.

[qtpye]

13 hours ago, love2lovebadtv said:

I didn't think the apartment was unrealistically spacious, especially not for that neighborhood.  It looks like Inwood, which has a lot of large prewar buildings with walkups or old elevators.  I wish they had kept the previous setting because it was prettier for me to look at lol. 

Their old house and neighborhood was really lovely.

[cpcathy]

I wish they hadn't jumped so far ahead in time, with Robert and Jackie already pregnant and Frances already with this new guy. Do we know where/when she met him? It feels like they are burning off storyline in order to get the season overwith.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I really hate her extensions with the lowlights around her face. It’s a little too Carrie.

SJP's hair is really a mess. Somebody please tell me that's not considered stylish. It's brown from the roots to about six inches down then straw-like blonde the rest of the way. It looks terrible. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

So I watched 301 and 302.  And I realized I was like WTF?  So I went back and watched Season 2.  How the hell did SJP's character meet James Lesure's character?  Was it ever explained?

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 7/9/2019 at 8:44 PM, txhorns79 said:

I think the best I can say for Divorce now is that I don’t mind watching, but I also don’t think it has any reason to continue existing as a show.    

I've been working at home.  I realized I kept pausing shows because I couldn't concentrate on both the show and work.  So I needed a show that I didn't need to pay attention to.  "Divorce" is perfect.  Nothing ever happens.  But to be honest, I liked season 2 though.  Season 1 made me temporarily give the show up and I don't remember ANYTHING that happened so I think Season 2 was an improvement.  A lot of unrealistic things happened, though, but I don't mind it.  

Edited July 11, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 3/10/2018 at 11:12 PM, CaliCheeseSucks said:

The VERY first thing I thought about with "Jackie and Robert taking their kids to Europe for two months was" what about all the drama with the son and daughter hooking up?

Very, very good point.  Is Jackie going to bring the daughter to Italy or not?  And shouldn't Robert and Frances have a say to the daughter and Tom f***ing all over Europe?  Geez.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[Lifesabeach]

Watched S1; pretty good.  S2; Ok, S3 good so far.

wondering, where did the sexy bf come from?

[scrb]

Just a time jump I guess.

And kind of a half reboot, as they decide to make Frances move to the City and look for a new job (the gallery was her dream but they burned it down I guess to move her into the City).

So new place, new job and new boyfriend, didn't bother explaining how she met him, just dealing with him, his ex, her ex, etc.

Last season, just 6 episodes, enjoy it while you can.

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, scrb said:

Last season, just 6 episodes, enjoy it while you can.

Is that right?  That's so sad.

[msrachelj]

On 7/9/2019 at 9:28 PM, Armchair Critic said:

HA I loved it! Diane gets on my nerves.

I can't stand the actress in anything. 

[msrachelj]

On 7/10/2019 at 2:11 PM, iMonrey said:

SJP's hair is really a mess. Somebody please tell me that's not considered stylish. It's brown from the roots to about six inches down then straw-like blonde the rest of the way. It looks terrible. 

She looks terrible. Cut and color SJP. Not everything you wear or do is considered "stylish" by everyone. Get over it.

[scrb]

I can’t recall if Robert’s sister Cathy has been on previously.  Her poor husband.  So much is said withdrew words indeed.

Jackie and Frances have words about Tom’s college plans.  Kid mocks Frances for working at bird store.

Diane going to adopt that shoplifter even though she doesn’t have money?

Now Robert and Frances are going to have a couples dinner with each other so Robert could ask awkward questions about race?

Well I guess they’ve always tried mining comedy from upper middle class people socializing with each other.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I can’t recall if Robert’s sister Cathy has been on previously. 

Yes, although I can't remember if it was Season 1 or 2. Robert and Frances bonded over having to deal with her, it's what led to them sleeping together later that night. I do like Amy Sedaris, I have to admit she is pretty funny in this.

The subplot with Diane felt utterly superfluous. I really don't know why she's even on this show.