Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[lascuba]

She's been doing the "look at all the sexy things we do!" instagram posts for a couple of years now. This isn't new. Jill was so blatantly horny when she was engaged that that asshole JB and the TLC producers joked about it.

JB and Michelle are fucked up about sex, but they seem to instill in their kids the idea that sex within marriage is awesome and something to look forward to. They aren't the brand of Christian that treat sex as something not be discussed ever (though they could do with talking about it less, because eww).

[SMama]

10 minutes ago, lascuba said:

Jill was so blatantly horny when she was engaged that that asshole JB and the TLC producers joked about it.

 

They what?! Please fill me in. JB has always been an asshole.

[lascuba]

1 minute ago, SMama said:

They what?! Please fill me in. JB has always been an asshole.

The one instance I remember most clearly is when the producer--with loads of innuendo--asked JB what he thought Jill was most looking forward to about getting married. JB laughingly responded something like, "I think you know," and the producer laughed.

There had been several small moments where people were hinting and/or joking about how eagerly Jill was looking forward to her wedding night. Jill herself said in christian virgin-appropriate language that she was getting married so quickly because she wanted to have sex. And she once described herself as being "boy crazy" and complaining to Michelle about how kept wondering if every boy she met was "the one" because she really wanted to be married already.

[Kiss my mutt]

I don’t need a lot of razzmatazz in the bedroom but go Jill if that’s your thing and don’t forget to buy this book!

[SMama]

36 minutes ago, lascuba said:

The one instance I remember most clearly is when the producer--with loads of innuendo--asked JB what he thought Jill was most looking forward to about getting married. JB laughingly responded something like, "I think you know," and the producer laughed.

There had been several small moments where people were hinting and/or joking about how eagerly Jill was looking forward to her wedding night. Jill herself said in christian virgin-appropriate language that she was getting married so quickly because she wanted to have sex. And she once described herself as being "boy crazy" and complaining to Michelle about how kept wondering if every boy she met was "the one" because she really wanted to be married already.

Thank you for the info. I wonder if part of her enthusiasm about marriage was the thought of not being a sister mom 24/7. I bet JB was braying like the jackass he is on that TH.

[awaken]

Also, a scene in what would be jills bedroom with JB talking about how they’d be fruitful and multiply on this bed 😩

[emmawoodhouse]

2 minutes ago, awaken said:

Also, a scene in what would be jills bedroom with JB talking about how they’d be fruitful and multiply on this bed 😩

That was so cringeworthy. Typical Boob, though. Yuk yuk.

[SMama]

1 hour ago, awaken said:

Also, a scene in what would be jills bedroom with JB talking about how they’d be fruitful and multiply on this bed 😩

Really? These people have no boundaries. IIRC Jill was reading a book on boundaries, good for her.

[SMama]

I thought there was a clip of Jana in the master bedroom bathroom stating Jill would or could be giving birth on that tub. I think it was the episode when they get the house ready for the future Dillards. What a messed up world. I don’t have a sister, but can’t imaging opining where she’ll give birth. 

[graefin]

9 hours ago, lascuba said:

The one instance I remember most clearly is when the producer--with loads of innuendo--asked JB what he thought Jill was most looking forward to about getting married. JB laughingly responded something like, "I think you know," and the producer laughed.

Actually, he said that about Derick, not Jill. According to JB, Jill was looking forward to the wedding itself and Derick was looking forward to what happens after the wedding.

[Tikichick]

7 hours ago, graefin said:

Actually, he said that about Derick, not Jill. According to JB, Jill was looking forward to the wedding itself and Derick was looking forward to what happens after the wedding.

As if that was in his purview to discuss as Jill's headship at the time!?!?!?!!!!!!

Can Not stand that arrogant ass!

[madpsych78]

There are fundie families that seem pretty tight-lipped about sex (e.g., the Maxwells come to mind). I don't see that with the Duggars. Yes, they have very strict rules about no premarital sex and all that, but they are VERY open about sex within marriage.

[Zella]

34 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

they are VERY open about sex within marriage.

It's almost to the point of being taunting.

I also do not at all understand the way they discourage perfectly normal crushes as "giving away pieces of your heart." I feel like that would actually help with some more realistic perceptions of the first guy that comes knocking. I was watching a Little House on the Prairie episode where Laura has a crush on some boy at school, and her parents were like, "Oh, yeah, puppy love, it happens. Carry on." And sadly the first thing I thought of when they were having that conversation is "No way Jim Bob and Michelle would react that way."

I think all the Duggar kids would be in a more emotionally healthy place if their parents accepted that crushes are normal and not sinful. Not that that's the only thing that needs to change, but still. 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Zella

[Ohiopirate02]

20 minutes ago, Zella said:

It's almost to the point of being taunting.

I also do not at all understand the way they discourage perfectly normal crushes as "giving away pieces of your heart." I feel like that would actually help with some more realistic perceptions of the first guy that comes knocking. I was watching a Little House on the Prairie episode where Laura has a crush on some boy at school, and her parents were like, "Oh, yeah, puppy love, it happens. Carry on." And sadly the first thing I thought of when they were having that conversation is "No way Jim Bob and Michelle would react that way."

I think all the Duggar kids would be in a more emotionally healthy place if their parents accepted that crushes are normal and not sinful. Not that that's the only thing that needs to change, but still. 

They could very easily spin crushes as God's way of illuminating qualities necessary for a future spouse, or God showing them the differences between shallow feelings like lust and deeper feelings like love.  The idea that one is completely closed off to the opposite sex until, bam, God reveals your True Love (TM) is absurd.  Not everyone gets a Saul on the way to Damascus, or Angel Gabriel randomly appearing, or burning bush, etc.  Usually God works subtly, a hint here or a hint there until you gradually realize his plan.  

[JAYJAY1979]

I love that BookIt is still a thing:)  I remember getting many a few pizza in 2nd grade.

When the pandemic calms down, you know Jill will so be a room mom or going on field trips as a chaperone, etc.

[Suzn]

I am of a dying breed of people who value privacy and maintaining boundaries.  I really, really don't want to hear about Jill's and Derick's sex life.  I think personal details should remain between the people involved and beyond that only medical people and and the people one is the closest to. 

I make a big distinction between talking about sex information in general and specific personal behavior.  Everything Jill shares is just squicky.

One thing she said was hilarious however - something about the sex games being "clean" fun.  She must not be doing it right...

[ouinason]

I can't see how knowing someone "plays games" in the bedroom is specific information.  They might be playing a modified version of the newlywed game for all we know.  And... she's promoting an app, we don't even know that she really uses it at all.  Massage and gin rummy aren't exactly "the best positions for hitting just the right spot" or anything.

[Suzn]

39 minutes ago, ouinason said:

I can't see how knowing someone "plays games" in the bedroom is specific information.  They might be playing a modified version of the newlywed game for all we know.  And... she's promoting an app, we don't even know that she really uses it at all.  Massage and gin rummy aren't exactly "the best positions for hitting just the right spot" or anything.

In other posts, she has been more specific, but regardless, I find what she has to say of a personal nature.  Sorry, that's my view - I said I was of a dying breed.

[BigBingerBro]

1 hour ago, Suzn said:

I am of a dying breed of people who value privacy and maintaining boundaries.  I really, really don't want to hear about Jill's and Derick's sex life.  I think personal details should remain between the people involved and beyond that only medical people and and the people one is the closest to. 

I couldn't agree more.  I honestly wonder if all this bedroom talk is some sort of way for Jill to release all the oppressive views she's been burdened with her whole life about sexuality.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, BigBingerBro said:

I couldn't agree more.  I honestly wonder if all this bedroom talk is some sort of way for Jill to release all the oppressive views she's been burdened with her whole life about sexuality.

I think it might be the opposite. The only oppressive views on sex Jill grew up with is, sex outside of marriage, and gay/lesbian sex. 

JB & M have shown no boundaries when obnoxiously alluding to their robust sex lives.

[rue721]

Jill is a weirdo and has no idea what normal is, so she has no idea how inappropriate some of what she shares actually is. I agree that it’s squicky and way more than I want to know lol

Like, normal PDA, like casual hand holding or just physical affection like that? Not gross. Recommending sex games and apps? Ugh, way over the line (for me).

[Growsonwalls]

Guys she;s an "influencer." She's getting paid to shill this mobile sex game. So its like a sponsorship and she's being paid to be a spokesperson. It's the way many smaller companies market nowadays.

[BigBingerBro]

16 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

Guys she;s an "influencer." She's getting paid to shill this mobile sex game. So its like a sponsorship and she's being paid to be a spokesperson. It's the way many smaller companies market nowadays.

Yet nobody is forcing her to advertising anything, at least I hope not.  She chose to shill the sex game.  That in itself says a lot.

[Cobb]

While I believe that very few people who view porn ever molest someone, it isn’t uncommon for molesters to use porn to groom kids. My first exposure to porn was at age 3. It wasn’t until I was much older that I realized what happened to me had anything to do with sex, I just thought I was being tortured. I also didn’t realize that my parents didn’t approve of what was happening and actually drew a false conclusion that they left me with the person to punish me. I remember what happened more than what was said, but it wouldn’t surprise me if my abuser told me they knew. Somehow in 1975 I decided there were cameras in our house that my parents were able to watch me through. I carried deep shame well into adulthood about not telling someone and confused silence with consent, even as I intellectually knew that wasn’t a realistic expectation for a 3 year old. I know I was too young to have the words to tell them, but do wonder if they made space for that conversation I would have been able to find a way to let them know.

So while I didn’t ever use porn as the label for what I was telling my kids, I did talk to them about it at a young age. If a book like this helps a parent facilitate those conversations, I’m not going to judge that. 

[BigBingerBro]

[ginger90]

11 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

What’s funny about this is, she posted that 6 hours ago, saying she’d post the video  ASAP. Video still isn’t posted. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[emmawoodhouse]

Derelict, get your feet off the coffee table. Ick.

[awaken]

3 hours ago, ouinason said:

I can't see how knowing someone "plays games" in the bedroom is specific information.  They might be playing a modified version of the newlywed game for all we know.  And... she's promoting an app, we don't even know that she really uses it at all.  Massage and gin rummy aren't exactly "the best positions for hitting just the right spot" or anything.

She has gotten pretty specific about what they do, and how often, plenty of other times!  

[Jynnan tonnix]

36 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Derelict, get your feet off the coffee table. Ick.

Um...doesn't pretty much everyone put their feet on the coffee table sometimes? Or do I need to slink away and hide?

[emmawoodhouse]

But do you do it and post about it to you million and a half followers? 

[Jynnan tonnix]

14 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

But do you do it and post about it to you million and a half followers? 

Honestly...I have no ambition or expectation of posting to a million and a half followers, but I don't suppose that if I did, and someone had their feet on a coffee table in one of the photos., I'd really think twice about it. 

[emmawoodhouse]

I just figure his feet are sweaty and smelly. 😁

[iwantcookies]

41 minutes ago, awaken said:

She has gotten pretty specific about what they do, and how often, plenty of other times!  

Brain bleach pleaseeee lol

[Zella]

I'm glad Izzy is reading and getting positive attention for it. I would prefer to never ever hear anything else about Jill and Derick's sex lives again. I feel the same way about anyone, including my closest friends. I. Do. Not. Want. To. Know. 

[DangerousMinds]

1 hour ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

Um...doesn't pretty much everyone put their feet on the coffee table sometimes? Or do I need to slink away and hide?

I definitely do.

[SMama]

On 11/19/2020 at 6:42 PM, awaken said:

Also, a scene in what would be jills bedroom with JB talking about how they’d be fruitful and multiply on this bed 😩

🤢🤮

[lascuba]

15 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I think it might be the opposite. The only oppressive views on sex Jill grew up with is, sex outside of marriage, and gay/lesbian sex. 

JB & M have shown no boundaries when obnoxiously alluding to their robust sex lives.

Exactly. If anything, it's Jill taking a page out of her parents' book and showing the world that married Christian sex is the best sex.

Someone on reddit described Jill as a very typical Bible-belt woman, in that she's super nice and normal-appearing, so a newcomer is charmed and happy to be friends with her. And then the talks about various topics take place, and super nice Jill sounds super reasonable about it all; then the church invites start, and newcomer meets all these other nice people. And next thing they know, they've been pulled into conservative christianity when that wasn't their belief system at all.

Jill's no brain trust, but I think people--in their delight in the ways that she's made different choices than her parents--severely underestimate just how calculated her posts are. She's not benignly sharing the things she enjoys with the public; she's not even just trying to make influencer money (thought that's certainly a motivation). Jill is, at heart, the same person she's always been who wants nothing more than to win souls for Jesus, and she's just smart enough to know that publicly pulling away from her family and appearing "normal" or posting "risque" content is a good way to lull people into a false sense of security.

[rue721]

I agree about the weird DL proselytizing, trying to slowly but surely suck people into their specific brand of religion. It’s creepy but very common.

But I don’t think the family rift is for clicks. I think now that they have seen that people are interested, Derick and maybe Jill want to talk about it more in interviews or Q&As and play up their differences from the Duggars. But I think the rift itself is for real, and I don’t doubt that it takes or at least took up a lot of Jill’s headspace. Estrangement isn’t easy, especially for someone who legitimately believed that their relationship with a parent was loving and genuine, and I think Jill and JB actually are estranged. YMMV.

[DangerousMinds]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

Exactly. If anything, it's Jill taking a page out of her parents' book and showing the world that married Christian sex is the best sex.

Someone on reddit described Jill as a very typical Bible-belt woman, in that she's super nice and normal-appearing, so a newcomer is charmed and happy to be friends with her. And then the talks about various topics take place, and super nice Jill sounds super reasonable about it all; then the church invites start, and newcomer meets all these other nice people. And next thing they know, they've been pulled into conservative christianity when that wasn't their belief system at all.

Jill's no brain trust, but I think people--in their delight in the ways that she's made different choices than her parents--severely underestimate just how calculated her posts are. She's not benignly sharing the things she enjoys with the public; she's not even just trying to make influencer money (thought that's certainly a motivation). Jill is, at heart, the same person she's always been who wants nothing more than to win souls for Jesus, and she's just smart enough to know that publicly pulling away from her family and appearing "normal" or posting "risque" content is a good way to lull people into a false sense of security.

I see what you mean, but as an ebil atheist, I know I would never accept any church invitation, so I don’t look that far into it. As an extremely liberal pro choice, very sex-positive fan (and former employee) of Planned Parenthood, a quick glimpse of her posts makes them seem very sex positive. I know SHE doesn’t believe in sex outside of marriage, but those games could be used by anyone!  My focus would be on SAFE sex, though.

Edited November 21, 2020 by DangerousMinds

[Growsonwalls]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

She's not benignly sharing the things she enjoys with the public; she's not even just trying to make influencer money (thought that's certainly a motivation). Jill is, at heart, the same person she's always been who wants nothing more than to win souls for Jesus, and she's just smart enough to know that publicly pulling away from her family and appearing "normal" or posting "risque" content is a good way to lull people into a false sense of security.

Except the rift with her family is real. When was the last time JB and Jill were ever in a frame together? She has some contact with her siblings and mother but we never see her in those big house gatherings and JB and Michelle's.

[ginger90]

[lascuba]

34 minutes ago, rue721 said:

I agree about the weird DL proselytizing, trying to slowly but surely suck people into their specific brand of religion. It’s creepy but very common.

But I don’t think the family rift is for clicks. I think now that they have seen that people are interested, Derick and maybe Jill want to talk about it more in interviews or Q&As and play up their differences from the Duggars. But I think the rift itself is for real, and I don’t doubt that it takes or at least took up a lot of Jill’s headspace. Estrangement isn’t easy, especially for someone who legitimately believed that their relationship with a parent was loving and genuine, and I think Jill and JB actually are estranged. YMMV.

Oh, I don't think the rift itself is fake or for the clicks. But, a) the rift isn't as deep as deep as people think, since Jill herself has said that some relatives are fine with her changes, and b)the fact that they've talked about it publicly is the part that calculated. She's been very careful in talking about how some family isn't okay with what's she said but still making it very obvious that she's as conservative as she ever was ("everything we do is bible-based" etc.).

30 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

I see what you mean, but as an ebil atheist, I know I would never accept any church invitation, so I don’t look that far into it. As an extremely liberal pro choice, very sex-positive fan (and former employee) of Planned Parenthood, a quick glimpse of her posts makes them seem very sex positive. I know SHE doesn’t believe in sex outside of marriage, but those games could be used by anyone!  My focus would be on SAFE sex, though.

Oh, the likes of you and me are beyond redemption, but the general non-religious types who aren't conservative but also don't give a lot of thought to what exactly conservative christians are up to are prime for the picking. The sex-positive stuff is a great way to signal to susceptible people that they're totally chill and normal.

Edited November 21, 2020 by lascuba

[lascuba]

42 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

Except the rift with her family is real. When was the last time JB and Jill were ever in a frame together? She has some contact with her siblings and mother but we never see her in those big house gatherings and JB and Michelle's.

The fact that she still has a relationship with Michelle "Women Must Follow their Headship in Everything" Duggar despite JB being pissed at Jill and Derick's loose lips prove that the rift, real as it is, isn't as deep or serious as people fantasize.

[Growsonwalls]

5 minutes ago, lascuba said:

The fact that she still has a relationship with Michelle "Women Must Follow their Headship in Everything" Duggar despite JB being pissed at Jill and Derick's loose lips prove that the rift, real as it is, isn't as deep or serious as people fantasize.

I don't agree. Michelle is an awful mother in many ways but she can not want to cut off her own child, rift or no rift. 

[Zella]

On a purely pragmatic level, cutting off your estranged child is the easiest way to drive them away. It wouldn't surprise me if Michelle realizes the best damage control is having some relationship with Jill versus no relationship. And just from my personal experience with family and friends, I think women in families are more likely to realize this and act accordingly than men. Sometimes, it is maternal instinct, and sometimes, it's just pure pragmatism. My guess would be Michelle is in the latter category. 

Just my 0.02: I think Jill's break with her family is real, but I also do think she is getting more savvy at marketing, though she's still no rocket scientists at it. In that sense, she's a better learner than most of her siblings or in-laws. 

[Growsonwalls]

11 minutes ago, Zella said:

On a purely pragmatic level, cutting off your estranged child is the easiest way to drive them away. It wouldn't surprise me if Michelle realizes the best damage control is having some relationship with Jill versus no relationship. And just from my personal experience with family and friends, I think women in families are more likely to realize this and act accordingly than men. Sometimes, it is maternal instinct, and sometimes, it's just pure pragmatism. My guess would be Michelle is in the latter category. 

Just my 0.02: I think Jill's break with her family is real, but I also do think she is getting more savvy at marketing, though she's still no rocket scientists at it. In that sense, she's a better learner than most of her siblings or in-laws. 

I also think the reason her siblings haven't all cut her off is because she raised them. Like, actually raised them -- fed, clothed, changed diapers, etc. So that bond I think is probably stronger.

[emma675]

10 minutes ago, Zella said:

On a purely pragmatic level, cutting off your estranged child is the easiest way to drive them away. It wouldn't surprise me if Michelle realizes the best damage control is having some relationship with Jill versus no relationship. And just from my personal experience with family and friends, I think women in families are more likely to realize this and act accordingly than men. Sometimes, it is maternal instinct, and sometimes, it's just pure pragmatism. My guess would be Michelle is in the latter category. 

Just my 0.02: I think Jill's break with her family is real, but I also do think she is getting more savvy at marketing, though she's still no rocket scientists at it. In that sense, she's a better learner than most of her siblings or in-laws. 

Agree. I think the rift is real (Jill was truly a mess after the Smuggar scandal was revealed) and I don't think Jill is smart enough or devious enough to be that calculating with her posts. Derrick, yes, and I can see him influencing what she posts to be calculating. I just don't believe Jill has the brains to do it. 

[Zella]

3 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

I also think the reason her siblings haven't all cut her off is because she raised them. Like, actually raised them -- fed, clothed, changed diapers, etc. So that bond I think is probably stronger.

Yes good point. Also family estrangement alliances can end up being weird, even without the added Duggar weirdness complicating things. Even if you know the family dynamics as part of the family, it can be hard to predict who sides with who. 

[Nysha]

I applaud Jill's progress in breaking free from the cult beliefs that she was raised in, but I also realize that she is probably never going to progress beyond traditional evangelical christianity. I spent most of my life in that lane and many of my family members are still there, so the beliefs don't shock me or make me think less of her. Which I realize is privilege on my part, since it's not my very existence they're trying to violate and legislate against.

[Zella]

5 minutes ago, emma675 said:

Agree. I think the rift is real (Jill was truly a mess after the Smuggar scandal was revealed) and I don't think Jill is smart enough or devious enough to be that calculating with her posts. Derrick, yes, and I can see him influencing what she posts to be calculating. I just don't believe Jill has the brains to do it. 

It's certainly possible that Derick is playing a bigger role in the content. Someone has adjusted something, for sure.