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Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

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13 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Thanks for sharing that. It was my understanding that the third party custodian referred to for Josh, wouldn't be just some patsy that JB picked out. The court's not playing, and neither is the US Attorney's Office. I'd expect that level of due diligence to be demonstrated before Josh would be released on bond - and especially with regard to the "no minor children in the home" statement. I'm sure his St. Louis lawyer is schooling the relevant Duggars (Josh, JB, and Michelle) on all this right now.

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6 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Here's a Western District of Arkansas search page on Project Safe Childhood. There are many similar cases. While the project deals with other crimes, too, possession and sometimes receipt of images are the most common, not surprisingly. The sentences tend to be between 6 and 8 years. But you can see for yourself in this list -- 

https://search.justice.gov/search?query=project+safe+childhood&op=Search&affiliate=justice-usao-arw

Thanks for sharing that. It seems that the federal prosecutors in that district have hardly been sitting on their butts just waiting to unfairly persecute a fine fundamental Christian like Josh. They've been actively prosecuting numerous folks in that part of the world for those crimes. So much for the "he's being persecuted unfairly because he's a Christian" argument. Not that the facts would dissuade some true believers, but I think the facts would show most people that there ain't no special persecution of Joshie going on here.

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4 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

It was my understanding that the third party custodian referred to for Josh, wouldn't be just some patsy that JB picked out. The court's not playing, and neither is the US Attorney's Office.

You're right, they are not playing. The only thing JBooger has control of in this whole thing is paying lawyer bills. Nothing else.

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When is his bail hearing again?

Or is that called something else, like an arraignment? #clueless

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8 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

Thanks for sharing that. It was my understanding that the third party custodian referred to for Josh, wouldn't be just some patsy that JB picked out. The court's not playing, and neither is the US Attorney's Office. I'd expect that level of due diligence to be demonstrated before Josh would be released on bond - and especially with regard to the "no minor children in the home" statement. I'm sure his St. Louis lawyer is schooling the relevant Duggars (Josh, JB, and Michelle) on all this right now.

I suspect in much the same way that Josh is used to being enabled and is about to get a very unwelcome dose of reality, Jim Bob--who is used to getting his way--is getting ready to be schooled big time on what a very small fish in the pond he is. 

1 minute ago, Oldernowiser said:

When is his bail hearing again?

Or is that called something else, like an arraignment? #clueless

It's his bond hearing and yes is on Wednesday. 

Edited by Zella
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1 minute ago, Jeeves said:

Thanks for sharing that. It was my understanding that the third party custodian referred to for Josh, wouldn't be just some patsy that JB picked out. The court's not playing, and neither is the US Attorney's Office. I'd expect that level of due diligence to be demonstrated before Josh would be released on bond - and especially with regard to the "no minor children in the home" statement. I'm sure his St. Louis lawyer is schooling the relevant Duggars (Josh, JB, and Michelle) on all this right now.

I for one would dearly love to observe the dynamic between JB, his regular legal stooges and the showstopper who really knows what he's talking about.   I know the regular stooges are attorneys and can handle some legal matters, but they're of JB's ilk, or at least enough where he's comfortable enough to call upon them to conduct business.   Are they smart enough to recognize that they need to shut up, get out of the way and let the showstopper do his job?  Will they convey that to JB if he has doubts and thinks he'd like to stick his oar in?

Contemplating this really amuses me because I know JB's personality doesn't take well to not being able to dominate and control how things are going to happen, or being face to face with the idea he's not the smartest guy in the room either.   

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1 minute ago, Zella said:

I suspect in much the same way that Josh is used to being enabled and is about to get a very unwelcome dose of reality, Jim Bob--who is used to getting his way--is getting ready to be schooled big time on what a very small fish in the pond he is. 

Oh, if only I could be a mouse in the corner in the room where that happens!  🤣

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2 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

Oh, if only I could be a mouse in the corner in the room where that happens!  🤣

Now see, that’s a fundraiser…sell tickets to THAT!

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1 minute ago, Zella said:

This is the only circumstance in which I would find it acceptable for Jim Bob to be back on TV, so we can all enjoy a very public display of it. 😇

Channel and time, please!

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4 hours ago, JoanArc said:

They'd never go after a 'star' without a guaranteed win.

Your air quotes around star made my eyeballs roll so hard that they fell out of my head and rolled across the floor under the couch....

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4 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

Your air quotes around star made my eyeballs roll so hard that they fell out of my head and rolled across the floor under the couch....

Use code JOANEYES at your ophthalmologist for 25% off laser surgery!

Just wait until he gets some prison nicknames.

Imagine his prison tattoo! Imagine his meals!

prison-food.jpg

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1 hour ago, JoanArc said:

Imagine his prison tattoo! Imagine his meals!

prison-food.jpg

The meals look better than the canned slop he was fed from the institutionalized  "home cooking" shown to us on TLC in the early days of the Dugg clan...the foods above  are nicely separated and not sliding into a puddle from a collapsing paper plate.

No saliva from Josie licking her fingers and jamming them into everything....

Edited by humbleopinion
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23 minutes ago, JoanArc said:

Use code JOANEYES at your ophthalmologist for 25% off laser surgery!

Just wait until he gets some prison nicknames.

Imagine his prison tattoo! Imagine his meals!

prison-food.jpg

 

He was raised on Tater Tot Casserole, I don't think he'll mind. 

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52 minutes ago, Zella said:

This is the only circumstance in which I would find it acceptable for Jim Bob to be back on TV, so we can all enjoy a very public display of it. 😇

Court TV, please!

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25 minutes ago, Oldernowiser said:

Kinda gives new potential meaning to the phrase, “breakout star,” now doesn’t it…

Somewhere Jeremy has literal steam coming from his ears!

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11 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Somewhere Jeremy has literal steam coming from his ears!

He must be so pissed right now that he can't promote his book.

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9 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

He must be so pissed right now that he can't promote his book.

since he was trying so very hard to make up for all that time he lost when he was promoting himself, his shoes and food and not promoting his book.....🤣

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Jeremy is the true breakout star it says so on his book description 🤣🙄

1 minute ago, crazy8s said:

since he was trying so very hard to make up for all that time he lost when he was promoting himself, his shoes and food and not promoting his book.....🤣

Yep for like whole 5 days that he was promoting his book !

 

Joshua the great stole Jeremy’s thunder 

Is it Wednesday so we know if Joshua the great made bail?

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

He must be so pissed right now that he can't promote his book.

I've started to wonder if they actually got looped into Josh's situation over the past month or two and that's helping propel this wild change in behaviors and attitudes, and lack of attempt to promote the book at all?

If you think about it, they're not the only married couple to make some unexplained changes of direction over the past couple months.   If it's true that charges were brought after a grand jury hearing I'm wondering if Josiah happened to be subpoenaed to testify -- leading to the abrupt disappearance from social media from their family? 

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In my humble opinion Josh would never turn on JimBob.  

I do wonder just how much money JB actually has.  I googled around and found 3.5 million to 5 million.  That's not a really huge empire considering....

I wonder how much he really has counting hidden assets.  This big shot attorney will be costly.

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1 hour ago, Oldernowiser said:

Kinda gives new potential meaning to the phrase, “breakout star,” now doesn’t it…

VOTE TO RENAME THREAD

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6 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

I've started to wonder if they actually got looped into Josh's situation over the past month or two and that's helping propel this wild change in behaviors and attitudes, and lack of attempt to promote the book at all?

If you think about it, they're not the only married couple to make some unexplained changes of direction over the past couple months.   If it's true that charges were brought after a grand jury hearing I'm wondering if Josiah happened to be subpoenaed to testify -- leading to the abrupt disappearance from social media from their family? 

I don't know much about the law or police work, but I don't think they would make it known to the family that Josh was about to be arrested weeks in advance. That you give him them to flee. It is strange that the Vuolos started hiding the girls, but maybe they recieve threats?

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3 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

I don't know much about the law or police work, but I don't think they would make it known to the family that Josh was about to be arrested weeks in advance. That you give him them to flee. It is strange that the Vuolos started hiding the girls, but maybe they recieve threats?

Maybe it hit them just how many sick people there are out there? 

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1 hour ago, Tikichick said:

Contemplating this really amuses me because I know JB's personality doesn't take well to not being able to dominate and control how things are going to happen, or being face to face with the idea he's not the smartest guy in the room either.   

He’s a wannabe king who created a kingdom so he could rule. From the very beginning, with the excessive hairspray, we knew he was all about JB and JB alone. Vanity is wrong but he could spend a can of hairspray at a time so he looked what he deemed handsome?

UO I know, but I think Michelle had it in her, somewhere, to be a loving and engaged mother. Maybe 30 years and 16 kids ago. She probably had true Christian leanings but ran into a husband who was haughty instead of humble.

Now the Crown Prince will take the whole kingdom down. 

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9 minutes ago, Arkay said:

UO I know, but I think Michelle had it in her, somewhere, to be a loving and engaged mother. Maybe 30 years and 16 kids ago. She probably had true Christian leanings but ran into a husband who was haughty instead of humble.

I will agree that she truly loved/loves Josh, but she's a much as user, maybe more than JB. It all for her personal power at this point.

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7 minutes ago, Arkay said:

UO I know, but I think Michelle had it in her, somewhere, to be a loving and engaged mother.

You’re too kind...literally. Michelle has admitted she “never had a heart for children” and YMMV, obviously, but I take her at her word.

I think they’re both narcissists but in varying degrees. Most teens are endlessly self-absorbed and JB and Michelle were just teens when they got together. After that, neither one matured much because they turned to Gothard’s cult and apparently never had an independent thought again.

I do think they’re very much alike and that’s probably both a blessing and a curse.

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15 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

I don't know much about the law or police work, but I don't think they would make it known to the family that Josh was about to be arrested weeks in advance. That you give him them to flee. It is strange that the Vuolos started hiding the girls, but maybe they recieve threats?

Now I'm wondering if they wouldn't have questioned him and others before the arrest. Everything I know about criminal law and investigation I learned from tv, so that seems like it would be part of the process.

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25 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

I don't know much about the law or police work, but I don't think they would make it known to the family that Josh was about to be arrested weeks in advance. That you give him them to flee. It is strange that the Vuolos started hiding the girls, but maybe they recieve threats?

I doubt law enforcement would inform the family per se.   I've started to consider if possibly Josiah was subpoenaed to testify in front of the grand jury, giving some insight into what was happening to the family as a whole, or parts of the family that were unaware, etc. 

ETA  That's awkwardly worded.   Not that Josiah would have testified as to the family, but being subpoenaed and testifying would have offered the family some insight into what was happening regarding the raid. 

With hindsight it's kind of noticeable that within the past couple months there have been some noticeable changes from several of the married couples, or tenseness.  And that last episode that aired, the "Easter" episode, was just Twilight Zone.  JD and Abbie were distinctly there to participate, but not a single comment aired from either one?   The awkwardness was palpable.   Jessa and Ben seem very tense.   Joy and Austin were discussed for a little while, although that also could have been related to their daughter needing to be examined by a specialist.   Jinger and Jeremy have been a trainwreck it seems no one can stop gawking at.

I doubt we'll ever know who knew what when, but it is interesting.      

Edited by Tikichick
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2 minutes ago, Arkay said:

Maybe it’s because I just can’t fathom it, but none of us knew of them before they became the Kardashians of Gothardism. I know M did say that about not having a heart for children. I agree she loves Josh and she certainly put all her attention on Josie when she was a fragile preemie. I know everyone will say that it was to keep her number up, trying to get to 20 kids, but IMO she did seem to have true love and concern for Josie back then. 
 
My minor grievance with Michelle (omitting for now all the obvious issues)  is another small thing that to me is telling, like JB and hairspray. It’s the many, many times she has displayed that bikini lawn picture of which she’s allegedly so ashamed. Needless to say, if you feel shame about that picture, you don’t periodically show it on TV to say how ashamed you are. 

Taking my response to the JB & Michelle thread. 

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On 5/1/2021 at 1:16 PM, doodlebug said:

This particular cult is based upon the notion that, while men are the only true leaders and decision makers, it is the woman's fault if her man should stray.  The Gothard teaching is that when someone is assaulted sexually, even a child, that person needs to own up to their responsibility for their own victimization. Even a child would be at fault for 'tempting' the adult man into sinning.  And, when husbands  commit sexual sins, it is because his wife is not fulfilling his sexual needs within the marriage.  So, he strays because she is a bad wife, not because of any inherent flaw he possesses.  It is likely that JB and Michelle are telling Anna that Josh' crimes are her fault, too and that Anna feels guilty and that she thinks that, if she had done something differently, Josh wouldn't have been interested in downloading photos of abused children.

The Gothardites also believe that even very young children, like pre-verbal, are capable of willful sinning and they do not distinguish between viewing salacious images of adults vs images of sexually abused children as far as the seriousness of the sin.  Even if the adult posing for pornographic images is doing so freely and is compensated and the child has no choice and is actually harmed emotionally and physically, those following Gothard seem to feel it is all the same.

It is, of course, all bullsh**, but it is what they believe.

Never understood how men can be leaders but so weak. How can you have a weak leader who needs their hand held every second 

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4 minutes ago, Darknight said:

Never understood how men can be leaders but so weak. How can you have a weak leader who needs their hand held every second 

That's why I never believed that Smuggar was a "diligent worker" or a leader of any sort. He's so weak and obviously can't be left to his own devices. What a loser Anna has stuck herself with. 

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7 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

That's why I never believed that Smuggar was a "diligent worker" or a leader of any sort. He's so weak and obviously can't be left to his own devices. What a loser Anna has stuck herself with. 

Diligently looking up CP. 😡

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18 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

That's why I never believed that Smuggar was a "diligent worker" or a leader of any sort. He's so weak and obviously can't be left to his own devices. What a loser Anna has stuck herself with. 

Fully admit that I watched their wedding again today! Josh was convinced that he was set for life. He was king of the world. He sang "loyalty" at his wedding. The stage was set. Am sure he thought he was destined for easy, lifelong fame. He never learned to work diligently at anything. Poor Anna who looked up to him like a god, while her father discusses the transfer of authority from father to husband, was so starry eyed.

Edited by Tuxcat
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1 hour ago, JoanArc said:

VOTE TO RENAME THREAD

My thoughts, on reading the past few pages:

Anna and the M&M's; riding out a series of despicable events

Anna, the M&M's, and He Who Shall not be Named.

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More like

Anna and the M7 indentured servants to the Duggar family 4 ever 

I do not see her leaving the Duggar’s no matter what the outcome of this event is 

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3 hours ago, Tikichick said:

I for one would dearly love to observe the dynamic between JB, his regular legal stooges and the showstopper who really knows what he's talking about.   I know the regular stooges are attorneys and can handle some legal matters, but they're of JB's ilk, or at least enough where he's comfortable enough to call upon them to conduct business.   Are they smart enough to recognize that they need to shut up, get out of the way and let the showstopper do his job?  Will they convey that to JB if he has doubts and thinks he'd like to stick his oar in?

Contemplating this really amuses me because I know JB's personality doesn't take well to not being able to dominate and control how things are going to happen, or being face to face with the idea he's not the smartest guy in the room either.   

I especially admire your language "stick his oar in." That is all. 

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5 minutes ago, iwantcookies said:

More like

Anna and the M7 indentured servants to the Duggar family 4 ever 

I do not see her leaving the Duggar’s no matter what the outcome of this event is 

I have to agree, she won't. Even if he is away for several years, she will cling to the family. 

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1 hour ago, Darknight said:

Never understood how men can be leaders but so weak. How can you have a weak leader who needs their hand held every second 

Because your group's rules and definitions are entirely created by men who are weak as hell but still firmly believe that they're the only ones who have the right and ability to be the big-shot, right-there-next-to-god leadership? 

Edited by Churchhoney
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26 minutes ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

My thoughts, on reading the past few pages:

Anna and the M&M's; riding out a series of despicable events

Anna, the M&M's, and He Who Shall not be Named.

I can’t think of anything right now that would lead to a thread title. My mind keeps going to songs but they wouldn’t include Anna. “Bad to the Bone.” “Josh Fought the Law, But the Law Won.” 
 

I’ll leave this to the people who are more clever than I am. The original title was good, but sadly it’s way beyond “unfortunate” now. 

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34 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

 

 

Because your group's rules and definitions are entirely created by men who are weak as hell but still firmly believe that they're the only ones who have the right and ability to be the big-shot, right-there-next-to-god leadership? 

Maybe the better question is why don’t the women recognize the inconsistency and hypocrisy and stage a major revolt. Stop being joyfully available and whip those boys into line, a la Lysistrata. . 

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Scarlett45

Guidelines for the thread:

Charges have been made public that specifically name possession of Child Sexual Abuse Material, discussion of charges are allowed. However, discussion of victims, or possible victims (and their identities) related to these charges are NOT ALLOWED
We are not here to provide content for ghoulish rubbernecking- there is no need to discuss the graphic details related to these charges, the moderators are not going to police posts for graphic content- posts will be removed and violators will be warned. Do not attempt to circumvent this guideline with spoiler tags.

You MAY discuss the 2015 scandals, and any statement a NOW ADULT victim has made public as previously instructed, but speculation on unnamed victims or minor victims is NOT allowed. 

Jokes, asides, memes etc regarding the sexual assault of anyone, INCLUDING Josh Duggar are not allowed.

As of May 10, 2021: Please respect the privacy of the Reber family, discussion of their social media postings, public statements to the press/court testimony are acceptable. Discussion of their activities on their property, their schedule, where/how they run their errands not acceptable. Again, discussion of social media/court statements/public statements to the press- FINE, "So and So saw the Rebers standing in their yard/grocery shopping/getting gas"- NOT fine. 

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