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Love It Or List It

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Hilary destroyed that Craftsman house with by enclosing that front porch.  It didn't give them any more space for a viable room; she could have found room for that desk somewhere else.  How much work can be done there anyway when it's right in the middle of the main traffic flow?  I have to say, I was really shocked by how ugly she made the front of that home with that enclosure.

 

Other than for the sake of keeping children in the same school, I really don't understand this "I've got to live in the same neighborhood" mentality.  Is that more of a Canadian thing than an American one?  I mean, I consider it good if I'm in the same town or at least a nearby one.  I've never had a drive to work that was under a half hour, at the minimum, and closer to an hour most times.

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School districts I can understand, but a lot of these people don't yet, or no longer, have school-aged children.
It might seem to be a Toronto thing, but the Canadian shows seem to be so Toronto-centric, that you can't really generalize. 
They have now moved to Vancouver, but other than the old Buy Me, which was in Montreal, they sure hate to move anywhere new, unless they come down to the US.

Can't figure it, although I must admit that a lot, if not most of the shows I watch, are paid for by Ontario in part.
 

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For US folks, it looks like we're in for a Love It or List It marathon today from 12 PM - 6 PM central time on HGTV.  The 12 PM show will be a rerun of the infamous Desta-as-the-homeowner episode. 

Edited by Fabricationary

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The Toronto-centricity of many shows is because - and Torontonians hate when people say this but it's mostly true - Torontonians think Ontario begins and ends at the GTA border. Other than cottage country and maybe Ottawa, there is "nothing else" in Ontario. So that's why showrunners based there stick to that turf, it's all they know - or want to know. Going outside of Toronto means heading to another large Canadian city.

Which is too bad, because there are thousands of smaller cities and towns and rural areas within two hours of Toronto that would offer a mother lode of interesting architecture, grand homes and cute houses for a fraction of the price. But we outliers can't even audition for most Canadian HGTV-type shows if we're not in the GTA.

Edited by Shermie

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A thread to discuss Love It or List It's Vancouver spinoff (called Love It or List It Too in the US), starring ex-Bachelorette Jillian Harris and actor-turned-realtor Todd Talbot (apparently, he's had bit-parts on Young Blades, Smallville, Dark Angel, and Josie and the Pussycats as an actor/dancer).  Season 1 premiered in 2013, and season 2 is currently being produced.

 

What do you all think of this spinoff series?  It's missing a lot of David and Hilary, if you ask me.  I'm not a big fan of Jillian's designs (practically everything she designs has a nautical theme, from what I've seen), and I cringe at how she constantly asks homeowners to "inject" more money into the budget when problems arise, or refers to Todd as her "arch-nemesis."  There was also the particularly cringeworthy episode where she tore down the homeowners' carport, then realized she didn't have the money to build them a garage like was originally in the plans.    Todd just seems like he's playing the role of an overzealous realtor, which I guess fits into his acting background.  The banter between Todd and Jillian seems contrived and somewhat mean-spirited, and it isn't much fun to watch in my opinion. 

Edited by Fabricationary
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I like the Vancouver views and locations...that's about it. Still prefer Hilary and David (and Desta)., but it's nice to get a change of scenery. Jillian doesn't seem to have to knock off as many items due to unseen issues, but I guess it's early days.

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Not sure why this thread is called the ugly stepchild - Vancouver is beautiful; good homes there have views of the mountains and the ocean. 

I cringe at how she constantly asks homeowners to "inject" more money into the budget when problems arise

 

That's just part of the script, and Hilary does it too, because it's also part of her script.

 

Todd just seems like he's playing the role of an overzealous realtor

 

Because he is; it's all scripted and acting. Todd's an actor.

 

Frankly, I like Hilary and the other three are just *there*, a necessary part of the plot, I guess. I'm just there for the houses.

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I think it's funny that the producers try to play up the "tension" between Hilary and David, when it's clear they are BY FAR the nicest people on the show, and actually seem to respect each other, unlike some of the bobo homeowners.

 

My theory on why many of the homeowners don't give Hilary more money is because cash loans are more difficult to come by than larger mortgages, right?  Like, if the show guarantees them $10K in cash towards either the repairs or the new mortgage, the money goes farther towards a higher home price tag than it does as cash...I think.

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I can't figure why you'd buy a house with 2 br and 1000 sq ft, and ever expect it to work.
The guy was jerk, finding his "pantry" usable.  And nothing was stopping him taking his instruments to the basement as it was.

In cases like this one, I root for David.

And what has become of Eddie?

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Heard recently that they're currently airing Season 3 in Canada.  Was kind of surprised they'd shot it.  Anyone know when we'll see it in the U.S.?

 

P.S.  Don't ask me why I care, lol.  I do enjoy seeing the Vancouver scenery and can always skip ahead to the reno -

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Wow, you thought more of the homeowners' acting skills than I did shlbycindyk!  The homeowners know exactly which items will be completed long before the on-camera talent (e.g. Hilary and David) ever step foot on the set!  There's also no "decision" to be made - it's predetermined.  WRT the nastiness, it's however much tptb encourage for their desired level of drama and then edit to -

 

Anybody ever wonder how they magically only demo the rooms that are ultimately completed?  In addition, after you adjust for the Toronto and Vancouver labor rates, the budgets are also about right.

Edited by BearCat49
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Although, sometimes she spends her budget on ridiculous upgrades, such as top-end toilets for $1,000. I'd rather have a regular toilet and a new closet, as would most people, if the budget is limited.

I suspect that many of the upgrades are product placed and are either cheaper than budget options without the product placement  if not actually free. You'll notice how at the end of the show their are always a string of logo's for things like flooring and tile.

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If anyone's interested, LIOLI, Too showed up automatically on my dvr with a "new" episode.  It's Season 3, Ep 1 so they're apparently beginning to air S3 in the U.S.  It was on 8/1 at 9:00 pm ET/PT so perhaps tptb gave them a Friday night timeslot, going forward.  We'll see -

 

Nothing's popped up for LIOLI, the mothership so that's still in reruns.

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My theory on why many of the homeowners don't give Hilary more money is because cash loans are more difficult to come by than larger mortgages, right?  Like, if the show guarantees them $10K in cash towards either the repairs or the new mortgage, the money goes farther towards a higher home price tag than it does as cash...I think.

 

Let's pretend its not staged.  I think the more likely factors are that you can only throw so much money at a house before you out price your neighborhood and you don't get a dollar for dollar return on renovations.  Both of which make the repair mortgage more difficult as well.

 

You can spend 1.3 mil on a house and expect to get it back when you sell.  If you do a renovation and add 0.4 Mil to a 0.9 Mil house, you aren't getting an increase in home value to anywhere near 1.3 mil.  Plus if one person wants to go, even the person who wants to stay may be less willing to spend more because they don't get full return on the renovation in terms of home value and they ma not be around long to enjoy it.

 

But that so many people are finding major structural problems means that they failed a home inspection so the real reason is that they are spending the least amount possible to get out.

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But the show is staged.  The outcome is predetermined and known in advance to all parties, i.e. the hosts and participants.  There is no "decision".  If you look at the work done when it's a "list it" episode, I believe it's the items you'd need to update and/or repair in order to sell that home - nothing more, nothing less.

 

The show provides free design services plus certain product placements.  I believe that's why the completed rooms have a certain sameness to them.  I've never read/heard that they provide any cash and certainly don't contribute to the mortgage on a new home - based on the articles I've read over the years. 

 

The problems over the punchlist items are completely staged.  All parties know in advance what work will be completed.  The show comes in with inspectors long before Hilary and David ever set foot on the set so there are no surprises.  Production companies won't take the risk of flying blind.  Ever notice that only the areas that the team ultimately completes are demo'd?  Gee, how do they always get that right, lol?

 

The above is JMHO based on my reading/understanding of various articles and other info about the show.

Edited by BearCat49

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There used to be a poster on TWoP who posted that over and over again. I think most people realize by now that the show is staged and they just tune in for the houses David shows, and to see Hilary's renovations and design work. Of course, it's sometimes difficult to remind ourselves that the drama on the show is totally manufactured. That's what the show is banking on; just like House Hunters, even when people know it's all a bunch of fakery, they still tune in. I'm at the point that when I pay any attention to the drama between the couple, or between the couple and Hilary, I'm watching only to assess their acting abilities and have a laugh.

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I didn't base my post on a mb opinion.  Have read articles about the show.  Sorry, I don't have any of them handy or would post a link.

 

I watch it the same way - mostly just by skipping ahead to the reveal b/c I enjoy checking out the renos.  Not trying to burst anyone's bubble or spoil the fun but am just surprised when people post about reality television as if it were actually, real. 

 

I feel a tad sorry for Hilary when people constantly post for pages and pages on mb's about how incompetent she is, even though she completes the predetermined, agreed upon in advance, undisclosed list.  Same thing about David - they wonder why he always selects 2 lousy homes followed by a glorious 3rd.  Agree, LB - to me, he's just following the script and we know he isn't their actual realtor, anyway!

 

Same thing for the participants - for those 44 minutes, they're actors, too, IMHO!

Edited by BearCat49

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For I know about the fakery, I still find myself annoyed at the antics. The fakery also make what this couple did to their home worse.

It was the episode when the couple brought a house when the wife was 7 months pregnant. By the time they got on the show, they'd only been in the house a year. It only had 2 bedrooms, 1 nice size and another way smaller, on the 2nd floor. They wanted to move because they wanted to have more children. They had a big bathroom. So Hilary takes room from the bathroom and the 2nd bedroom to make a 3rd bedroom.

Bad decision! Neither room had a closet and they were so small, unusable for any one over 8. The money would've been better spent fixing the kitchen and rearranging the laundry upstairs. That show just annoyed me to no end.

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A dance "studio" and a "create music room" and talk to the heart all combined into one of the fakest full-of-shit eps I can remember. Five minutes in and there wasn't an iota of doubt these two were out of their tiny house that looked like a tumor growing out the house next door. I guess this creative couple felt like performing to the max.

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buttersister, I remember that episode being hilarious.  Although one does wonder how much added property value a house with a fully-decked out dance studio would have had, had those renovations actually been made. 

 

I remember Hilary and David walking up to the house for their tour, and Hilary mistaking the house to be renovated for the much nicer, much larger one next door.

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The thing that irritates me most about this show is the 'characters' of Hilary and David. There's too much 'acting' going on. *Psst* Hilary, Mercedes Ruehl called -- She wants you to stop ripping off her character from Frasier.

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I don't understand why this is called the Ugly Stepchild spinoff thread either. I like Love It or List It Too a lot, many times, I like it more than the original. That tends to have more to do with the homeowners than the cast. I like Jillian on this one, but don't think they play off one another as well as Hilary and David, but there's less drama and bickering too and that's not necessarily a bad thing. But the main thing is, Jillian does some amazing transformations on the homes and Vancouver has some great looking homes and amazing views and landscapes, so I like this one a lot.

 

In terms of the homeowners, I like the ones on Love It or List It Too so, so much better. On average it seems that the homeowners have much more realistic budgets for both looking for a home and for fixing their home. I haven't seen many who give a laundry list of things to do and offer up a $40k budget on their $900k house, which I've seen too many times on LIOLI and of course, they give that budget and want a brand new kitchen with all the bells and whistles in that amount.

 

On the Vancouver episodes, I've seen more often than not a decent budget that matches the home value to offer up some decent fixes that aids in really transforming the home to make it workable for the family. Also, I've seen many times where Jillian runs into a problem - asbestos, heating/cooling, plumbing, etc - that was unexpected and she tells the homeowners and they homeowners are unaware of the problem and include additional money to cover the problem. On LIOLI, they give Hilary that $75k budget, want the world, she tells them they need a new furnace and new plumbing, they say oh, we know, she says, you didn't tell me that it's not up to code and needs to be fixed, and they say, you need to work it out in the budget we already gave you and we don't want to lose a thing you already told us we're getting. Ugh! I've found the Vancouver homeowners to be much more reasonable all around. That's not a hard and fast rule but yeah, it's a welcome change for the most part.

 

I'm looking forward to new episodes. There were some on a week or so ago on a day I was off and I caught a few I hadn't seen. Not sure if they were new episodes, but new to me.

Edited by JasmineFlower
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It's been all reruns for several months on LIOLI and longer than that on Too.

 

It's all drama, as we know.  The production teams have the homes thoroughly inspected long before any of the talent/actors/homeowners arrive on set.  None of the unexpected problems are truly unexpected.  The homeowners have signed off in advance on the work to be completed.  But, that's reality, or faux-ality television.

Edited by BearCat49

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I think the OP's original intention of using "ugly stepchild" was to refer to Jillian and Todd being Hillary and David's ugly stepchildren and not a dig on Vancouver or western Canada in general.  I'd be happy to modify the thread title - any suggestions?

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If anyone's interested, LIOLI, Too showed up automatically on my dvr with a "new" episode.  It's Season 3, Ep 1 so they're apparently beginning to air S3 in the U.S.  It was on 8/1 at 9:00 pm ET/PT so perhaps tptb gave them a Friday night timeslot, going forward.  We'll see -

 

Nothing's popped up for LIOLI, the mothership so that's still in reruns.

Thanks for the info that a new episode airs on Friday night.

Also, if anyone is interested in catching episodes they've missed, I see that HGTV is running a Love it or List it, Too marathon that day starting at 1 pm.

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Is it just me or are the reveals of Hillary's final results rather short and you never get a good long wide shot of what she's done?  They tend to zoom in on accessories, etc.  The final "perfect" home that David find seems to always get the most coverage no matter if they end up loving it or listing it.

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Is it just me or are the reveals of Hillary's final results rather short and you never get a good long wide shot of what she's done?  They tend to zoom in on accessories, etc.

 

If the unfrozen caveman watched the show, he's be forgiven for thinking humans revere light fixtures above all else.

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What's with these people that absolutely must stay in their current neighborhood?  Often times I feel more sorry for David for only this alone.  I know moving can be a painful process and there are school zone and commuting issues, but I'd love to see an episode where the people would be happy to start fresh in a new area.

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Just a note:  After checking with @Fabricationary - the title of this thread has been modified and the "ugly stepchild" reference has been removed.  In no way was that to be taken to indicate that Vancouver is an "ugly" place to live or visit.

 

We like to have something funny or witty after the show name in our titles.  If anyone has any suggestions for this one please post here or send me a private message. 

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I think the "stay in their current neighbourhood" people usually have school-age kids and they probably really like the school/teachers/friends the kids have. Why give your children problems unnecessarily? They don't HAVE to move, they just want to. I know kids adjust, but they shouldn't have to because of parents' whims. 

 

Or maybe they have a really great park nearby or they have lots of friends. I wonder why people with too-small houses don't add on - permit issues?

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The producers must have come up with the "same neighborhood" standard plotline b/c otherwise David, even though we all know he isn't their realtor IRL and they're not moving, i.e. they signed up for the LIOLI discounted reno, could (supposedly) find everyone a stupendous, within budget, replacement home out in the 'burbs.  

 

In the RE world, that is, real life - not reality television, adding on/expanding the size of an existing home, adds value but at a declining rate as you price your home out of the market.  In the LIOLI faux-ality television world, adding on would be cost prohibitive b/c only the items on the actual (real world), predetermined, agreed upon in advance list are completed.  So, usually, adding on gets crossed off the faux-ality, fakity-fake, made for television, list.

Edited by BearCat49

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Someone can probably do better on a thread title but here's one suggestion:

 

Love It or List It, Too (Vancouver) - Stunning Scenery Plus a Bachelorette, What more could anyone need?

 

I made a minor change on the show name.  IIRC, it's technically "LIOLI, Too", with LIOLI spelled out (naturally).

 

WRT scheduling, it does appear to have the Friday night 9:00 ET/PT time slot, going forward.

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And in the LIOLI faux-reality world, buying new furniture that is part of your reno budget, but you would take with you when you move, still adds to the value of the home.

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And in the LIOLI faux-reality world, buying new furniture that is part of your reno budget, but you would take with you when you move, still adds to the value of the home.

 

True, the post-reno values are always inflated.  However, I think there is value in properly staging a home for sale with tasteful furniture and decor.  When my parents sold their last home during the recession a few years ago, it was on the market for months without selling.  To be fair, though, my parents never decorated, and their furniture was quite plain and not particularly tasteful.  They switched realtors, who recommended they repaint a few rooms, and she also brought in a stager who added decor pieces and a few small furniture items to key rooms (i.e. the living room, the master bed and bath, etc., while leaving the secondary bedrooms alone).  Shortly after this, the home finally sold.  You might not need staging done if your home's already in pretty good shape (but this is not the usual demographic of LIOLI homeowners), or if you live in an in-demand area where homes fly off the market, but I think in general staging a home will add some value and help get it sold.

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I agree that staging helps sell a home, but on LIOLI they buy entire rooms of furniture, even toys and knick-knacks. I assume this comes out of the budget, which is added to the value of the home. Yet, I assume the family takes it all with them. 

 

Plus, I think buying new stuff is a waste of the budget, which is always too tight. Unless a room is new (a reno-d basement that was formerly storage, or one bedroom divided into two, or something), Hilary shouldn't waste precious budget $$ on furniture when the homeowners usually have decent stuff already.

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In some of the HGTV shows, including Income Property, we know with 100% certainty that local designers and stagers loan furniture to film the final scenes of each episode.  In fact, IIRC, I've seen the items featured on Pinterest.  (Income Property allows homeowners to photograph the staged homes for use if/when they offer them for rent but removes the items shortly thereafter.)

 

When I roughly calculate the LIOLI construction budgets, adjusting for high Toronto and Vancouver labor rates, it always sounds to me as if the budgets are about right, considering the rooms completed.  I do not believe the budgets include staged furniture.

 

Both Hilary and Jillian (IIRC) are designers IRL who would have contacts with design houses and other vendors to obtain temporary, loaned, staging furniture to film the final scenes.  Besides that, the production company itself would have contacts.  IMHO most homeowners, even if they enjoy viewing their home with newly decorated items, would prefer having their favorite chair or the lamp that Aunt Sophie gave them for their wedding returned to enjoy in their updated home, going forward.

 

So, on balance, even though I've never read an article confirming it, for the reasons listed above, I believe that LIOLI also obtains temporary, loaned furniture to film each episode, returning it to the local sources after production is complete.

 

From a RE standpoint, IMHO, staging does not add value.  Yes, it helps homeowners sell homes faster.  When they sell their homes, however, the homeowner sells them at market value, i.e. not an overinflated value based on (temporary) decorating. 

 

Now, selling faster can reap rewards if a homeowner saves money by eliminating the monthly carrying costs of a property.  That's typically only true, however, if a homeowner has already relocated or was using that particular property as a rental and must offer the home free of tenants during the selling period.  And, that's expense reduction, i.e. not real estate value added.  The home itself, the real property, was not worth any more or less.

 

Homeowners may also benefit from market timing differences.  If the RE market declines while you offer an unstaged, wreck of a home for sale, then selling faster might have resulted in a higher selling price.  True, but again, that's not RE value added.  The home sold at its market value on the date of sale, when the seller ultimately sold it. 

 

Incidentally, from an accounting/finance standpoint, the fix-up expenses (e.g. painting, minor landscaping to improve curb appeal, etc.) incurred when offering a home for sale are considered selling expenses, not improvements.

 

 

 

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Or, here's a slightly different variation of that possible thread title:

 

Love It or List It, Too (Vancouver), Stunning Scenery Including a Bachelorette, What more could anyone want?

 

Anyone else following this program, lol?

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Over the weekend I saw an episode that was new for me. I missed the wish-list part, but it's the one where Jillian put all three bedrooms in the basement, and they ended up buying a house with access to a beach, or at least with beach views. Maybe it's different in Canada, but I cannot fathom anyone designing a remodel such that the main living space and the bedrooms were in a basement. It doesn't matter to me how cute the decor, it's still a basement. And I don't want to live halfway underground, unless I can't afford anything better than a garden flat. I want daylight. There was no suspense in this one at all - I just couldn't buy that the couple would be happy with that arrangement.

 

This version of the show is refreshing because the housing stock is more varied than on the original. I'm glad it's back. Having said that, you could still watch the first 15 minutes and the last 15 minutes and see everything important.

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@peggy06, I remember that one. I think it was an early one in this series. I agree with you about it being a strange decision to move all the bedrooms to the basement. I wonder how long it took them to sell that house after that.

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Interesting conversation about value. I've always found LIOLI to be fairly irresponsible in this regard. We are not far removed from a major real estate recession where homes were way overvalued, and plenty of people are still sitting on over-improved properties that they would be underwater if they tried to sell. So it always gets me when LIOLI tries to convince the audience that the $50k spent on improvements turns into $75k in equity.

What really bothers me most about the valuations is the formula of this show always routes a substantial part of the budget to an unforeseen structural issue. Fixing a leaky roof does not add value to your home. It brings your home to what the pre-renovation valuation was. Unless it is disclosed, a buyer is going into a house expecting that the roof doesn't leak. A house with a new roof is unlikely to sell at a premium compared to the comps. The house with a leaky roof can be expected to have money knocked off. But nobody is going to pay more for something that they expect.

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What bothers me - and maybe I'm missing something - is that the show always implies that the post-reno versus pre-reno valuation is pure profit for the homeowners, allowing them to go over budget on a new house. But isn't the largest part of it (in some cases, all of it) actually cash out of their bank account to fund the removations? Isn't the show basically counting that twice?

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I would never buy a house with all the bedrooms in the basement. We had a basement with the guest bedroom in it and slept in it when my parents came to visit because my dad couldn't go down the stairs. I couldn't sleep for feeling the entire house over me.

 

Of course, I'm always surprised when people ask for or the designers give them a house with the master bedroom in a completely separate part of the house from the kids' bedrooms. I always wonder about when their kids are sick or when they're little, wouldn't you want to be closer to them to hear them? And when they're teenagers, wouldn't you want to be closer to know they're not sneaking in or out?

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LOL I always think of that! I convinced my parents that as the only girl in the house I needed the bedroom furthest from my brothers. Guess who snuck people in and left at night? ;)

*i was a terrible child!

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hkit, I always check out the valuation adjustment when it's shown on screen in each episode.  I believe they've become more conservative the last few seasons.  As viewers, we're not privy to the actual calculations so we don't know how they're treating specific items.  (Do you know of a website containing those calculations and detail, hkit?) 

 

In general, their figures seem reasonable.  For example, if they've only done a basement renovation, the LIOLI positive adjustment is typically lower than a bathroom or kitchen adjustment.  Can't recall seeing an episode recently with a 150% adjustment like your example, hkit. 

 

WRT your leaky roof example, although I agree that no positive valuation adjustment should be given, it wouldn't be considered a negative valuation adjustment, either.  Why not?  Well, a roof leak, if repaired within 4 months of sale, would be considered a selling expense - like staging, as mentioned above.  Normally, it's R&M (Repairs & Maintenance) expense to a homeowner.

 

Homeowners need a R&M budget 100% of the time - not just as they prep for a sale.  That's one item that most homeowners wouldn't defer, IMHO.  If deferred, a home inspector would probably notice evidence of the leak and call it on the inspection report.  So, the sellers would be required to repair it prior to sale and it would be considered a selling expense. 

 

The roof repair does reduce a sellers net proceeds, if you look at it as one huge transaction.  But, technically, it's not a valuation adjustment.  And, it's something that any homeowner would be required to do in order to maintain their property.  Agree, the buyer expects, deserves and pays for a property in working order, albeit with depreciation on major systems.  Yes, that's reflected in the standard market value of the property and no positive adjustment should be given when LIOLI diverts budget funds to perform R&M.

 

==============

peggy06, I understand why the $$$ are confusing but it makes sense to me.  Perhaps it's easier if you think of it as 2 separate transactions.  The sellers prep their home for sale and theoretically expend their cash/savings (let's say $50K) for renovations.  Then, at a later date, they list their home and sell it, i.e. the second transaction.

 

So, first, they expend $50K.  If all goes well with the renovations and their $$$ aren't diverted to routine R&M (hkit's example), let's say the value of the property did increase.  At that point in time, the value adjustment is unrealized b/c the property hasn't been sold. 

 

Assuming they receive a 20% return on their renovation $$$, perhaps they eventually receive $60K more when they sell it.  So, that's the 2nd transaction, completed at close of escrow - they receive their previous market value plus $60K.  I would consider the $60K to be proceeds, not profit.  (BTW, I'm ignoring the fact that the LIOLI participants may receive comps from certain vendors in exchange for promotional consideration or services provided by the show.)

 

Of course, these figures are all subjective.  If we had these properties appraised both before and after the renovations by several different appraisers, we'd probably receive 3 different opinions of value.  Also, do we know that LIOLI uses an actual appraiser or do they simply have a local realtor give an estimate of value, i.e. not an actual appraisal?  We don't - at least not that I've ever heard.  On the plus side, David/Todd's standard script line is "appraised" so I assume/hope tptb had the figures professionally done.  (IMHO a realtor's opinion is not an "appraisal".)

 

When I examine the LIOLI $$$, I simply think of it all as funny money!  

Edited by BearCat49
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A dance "studio" and a "create music room" and talk to the heart all combined into one of the fakest full-of-shit eps I can remember. Five minutes in and there wasn't an iota of doubt these two were out of their tiny house that looked like a tumor growing out the house next door.

That is a perfect description of the house! And I think it was located near the train tracks too. I'm still surprised at what people are willing to pay/put up with to live in Toronto. My parents live in the suburbs (half hour from downtown by train ) and houses on their street, which are the smallest in the neighbourhood (under 1800 sq. ft.), are going for $500,000 to $625,000.

Edited by funkymunky

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Just saw again the episode with Kasia and Patrick, the artist couple who had no insulation in the 2nd floor and had a baby on the way.  Kasia got all nasty with Hillary when she had to take stuff off of the list (major issue encountered, of course).  She then said since the first floor was off the list, they were insisting on updated furniture done by real crafstmen, only first rate stuff.  The next scene showed more issues with a ceiling or something.  The whole furniture deal had to be producer shenanigans because why wouldn't you say ok well use as much to fix up the structure of this house, the layout.  Furniture, you can always add later.  

 

There's a marathon on today (watching while working at home), and it's structural issue upon structural issue.  I guess my new build had one benefit, lifetime guarantee for structural issues.  If it's not right, it's on their dime and transferable to a new owner.  (Should have a benefit as they put in cheap carpeting, etc. that is wearing out quickly).

 

Since it seems like the furniture on the reveal may be just used for staging, I would be rather upset if they painted the walls like a day glow fuschia, yet I was still furnishing with my furniture (which is taupe and wine colored).  I would hope they'd take in consideration what the homeowner is actually going to use for furnishing the homes.

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I like LIOLI 2 because of the more varied scenery and the wider variety of home styles.  Though I have to wonder WTF kind of jobs those people have to afford the prices there?  I never watched The Bachelorette, so I never had any pre-conceived notions about Jillian.  I think that she's improved somewhat as the show has progressed; her color palette has broadened a bit more.  I like Todd; he's sort of like a happy puppy and he has a better variety of homes and usually a larger budget to work with than David does.

 

I also really wish that both shows would say, exactly, how far away the drive time is from the homeowners' "preferred area", so we could get a clue as to how reasonable/unreasonable it is to expect them to drive that distance.  Of course it's all subjective, but for me for example, 40 minutes outside my "preferred area" wouldn't be too far.

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