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S12.E10: The Men Tell All


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23 hours ago, CindyBee said:

The hosts didn't press Wells rugby team membership so I have a hard time believing that Wells was actually on it but there you go. 

He must have been the seeker.

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4 hours ago, Cynna said:

Oh come on, the dude is 45 - hardly AARP.

AARP kicks in at 50.  And, since he's 45 and trying to "bro"-down with guys in their early- to mid-twenties, I stand by the analogy.

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Best scenario for the most dramatic rose ceremony EVAH: JoJo (or fill in name) has one rose left. CH comes in to announce just that. JoJo (or whomever) picks up last rose and says, "Chris Harrison, will you accept this rose?" How cool would that be? As for CH being 45 and "trying to bro down with guys in their 20s" ... I'm pretty sure, when CH is off camera and in, you know, his real life, he is not "bro-ing down" with college guys. JMHO, of course.

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1 hour ago, Alapaki said:

AARP kicks in at 50.  And, since he's 45 and trying to "bro"-down with guys in their early- to mid-twenties, I stand by the analogy.

AARP is not like social security; it doesn't kick in. It's a group for retired people and you can join anytime after age 50. I don't know any people who are retired at 50 or even at 60, so I would say Chris Harrison does not fit in. In any case, I can't see Chris wanting to be with most of the women on the show who are usually between 23-30. It also would effectively end his job which is a pretty good gig where he gets to travel a lot and say a few words here and there. The most he talks is on The Men Tell All, the rest is just walk on stuff. 

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38 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

AARP is not like social security; it doesn't kick in. It's a group for retired people and you can join anytime after age 50. I don't know any people who are retired at 50 or even at 60, so I would say Chris Harrison does not fit in. In any case, I can't see Chris wanting to be with most of the women on the show who are usually between 23-30. It also would effectively end his job which is a pretty good gig where he gets to travel a lot and say a few words here and there. The most he talks is on The Men Tell All, the rest is just walk on stuff. 

I know what AARP is.  I'm hurtling towards 50 and can't wait for those discounts to kick in.

AARP in this sense is just short-hand for too fucking old to be trying to hang out and be "best buds" with the male contestants on this show.

Of course CH would never marry a contestant.  But I wouldn't put it past him, as a producer, to have dipped his wick.  

I think if you go back and watch from early on, initially CH at least pretended to be above the douche-factor that many of the male contestants brought to this show.  I think I used to describe his initial role as being "on the show, but not of the show".

But somewhere around the time he got divorced, he started trying to act like he is now "one of the guys".  And I just find it sad.

(possibly relatedly, if you can find cache'd somewhere the first season of blogs that CH did over at EW.com, he actually provided real insight into the behind the scenes of the show.  By the second or third season that he was blogging the episodes, he'd turned completely to selling the "narrative" of the show.

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On July 29, 2016 at 8:00 AM, GinnyMars said:

Loved Jojo standing up to Chad - I thought she'd never shown this much personality as in this episode - and seeing clearly through him, saying no one should give him the attention he so obviously craves. And loved the guys' standing ovation! Yes, they do seem to really like her.

I thought her response to him was rather weak. But then again, it's hard to defend her final two -- one most definitely dumped his ex to be on this show and is laughably insincere (ILY on the first date? Yeah... either he's not genuine or he's mentally unstable), while the other is, rather obviously, desperate for fame (wasn't he using that celeb-only dating app for a while, even though he's not a celebrity in any capacity and most people would never connect the dots between him and Aaron, unless he tells them?) and cheated on his ex? There's not much worth defending, and it felt like JoJo backed down when she realized that the crowd was actually expecting her to 'go off,' as she claimed that she could.

On July 29, 2016 at 3:46 PM, JudyObscure said:

I don't see why a death  in the   family would be an excuse to act like a jerk.  My husband's mother died last year, my mother died a few years ago, about half the people I know have lost either their mother or father in recent years -- none of them threatened to punch people or hassle anyone's friends.  Sadly, most of us lose out parents at some point in our lives, I've never seen any logical connection between grieving and behaving like an asshat.

I don't hate Chad. I found him entertaining and thought most of what he did made sense considering the flower quartet was talking about him all the time, but the violence and after-show behavior was uncalled for and I doubt if it was  connected to the death of his mother.

It's not just the death -- Chad's behavior was likely the result of a mixture of factors: (1) Probably being somewhat of a jerk/troll in real life and being willing to play a villain for fun (2) Not having any genuine interest in JoJo (3) Being stuck all day with guys he didn't like without TV, Internet, books, and other people to distract him (4) No other girls he might be interested in pursuing around (5) AND his mother's recent death. I can imagine all of those things might come together to create the "villain" we saw.

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Some thoughts about this episode:

1) JoJo seems like a sweet girl, but she is dumb when it comes to relationships.  She is not ready to date anyone, much less marry them. As obnoxious as Chad behaves, she would be wise to listen to his perception of Robby and Jordan.  He's a jerk, but he is honest.  She is only 25.  She can easily find another guy.  I'm sure any of the guys she rejected would be more than happy to date her after the show.  

2) Chad is obnoxious, but definitely entertaining.  I like that he is straightforward, but he is definitely not someone I would date.  Can you imagine breaking up with him? Yeesh...

3) I find Wells to be the most physically attractive by far, but he was very annoying during the Men Tell All.  He needs to learn that he doesn't need to add his two cents to every conversation.  I did, however, like that he isn't afraid to defend his friend (even though his friend is Alex) and stand up to Chad.

4) Luke definitely auditioned for the bachelor and performed well. The only way Chase is going to be the bachelor is if Luke turns down the gig.

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13 hours ago, PhysNerd said:

She is not ready to date anyone, much less marry them.

Definitely this. We know she was still hurting from her past relationship during Ben's season, and if we're prepared to accept that at least some kind of feelings do develop during these things, that's two relationships/situations in rapid succession from which she could probably really use some time to recover from. Bouncing straight into this, ending with, theoretically, a relationship seems like a just straight up terrible idea.

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On July 29, 2016 at 0:59 PM, MakeMeLaugh said:

I had to stop and laugh at imagining Wells on a rugby team. Ross Geller's team?

Lol and thank you for jogging my memory. For some reason, I read "rugby" and yet my mental picture was of lacrosse, which Wells could be good at and I couldn't figure out why people were so shocked. Yeah, rugby is not the sport for 5' guys who weigh 90 lbs, yikes! 

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I didn't say it excuses it, nor did I use the term "carte blanche". I said that grief can make people act out of character or just act out. I've seen entire families broken apart by the death of a single person. Most likely because one or more were acting like asshats. It's not unheard of, especially when two people are very close and then one is suddenly gone. It can rock your world like nothing else and everybody responds differently. I don't know if that's Chad's problem. It was just a theory as to why he let the men get to him as much as they did. 

A good example of this would be on the Real World/Road Rules Challenge where a contestant came on the show only a month or so after his brother had been murdered. A should-have-been minor fight escalated into one of the most terrifying scenes I've seen on a reality show where I really believe another contestant would have been killed if not for the 20 or so people trying to hold this guy back.

Said guy does have a history of fighting, but this was off the charts behavior that could be directly related to the recent loss. 

In Chad's case, I see him more of a socially awkward guy who was cut off from anyone who knew and supported him (plus having lost his mother), so he couldn't brush off the guys' treatment of him. 

On the edited show, it looks like Chad is the one who started shit because they featured tons of talking heads with him mocking the other guys, but if he wasn't saying any of that to their faces, then Wells' assertion that they "Piggy'd" him and ostracized him first is probably correct.

Honestly, on first sight, he was probably viewed as a huge threat to a lot of the guys there. He's one of the biggest guys, very good looking and well dressed. If he'd kept his mouth shut more, he'd probably have coasted to the final 4 on looks and mystery alone. But he took the bait and all the others had to do was sit back (in the safety of large numbers, lol) and watch him implode.

Now BiP is going to be a different story, he's clearly relishing the role of villain so he's going to be playing it up, but I'm not sure his original plan was to become a super villain. There are scenes here and there (thinking of maybe the pool party way back) when it seems like he's trying to just hang out and be part of things, but people were still calling him out by name, like "it's fun, even if Chad is here" etc.

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Chad is a meathead. An aggressive macho man, with an occasional good one-liner.

I thought Evan's observation that Chad would have been dealing with a reaction to sudden cessation of steroid injections c/- coming on the show, as obviously he couldn't continue to use steroids on the show (as even Chad pointed out innocently to Chris H at one point!), rather pertinent. And I think in his line of work, Evan would probably know a thing of two about the side-effects or post-usage effects or whatever of the use of artificial testosterone.

Didn't mind Wells. Read all these comments before watching the show, so was surprised to not see anything I found too highhanded.

Poor JoJo... Who would want their mistakes in love filmed and played out to a zillion viewers. Usually the final two are not that dubious.

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