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Artistic Gymnastics: Stick the Landing!

HartofDixie

By HartofDixie
in 2016 Olympics

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GreyBunny
GreyBunny

Gabby has worked her ass off for years, has been a proud member of the US team, and is a great role model for young kids who are up and coming. To say that her not putting her hand over her heart nega

KBrownie
KBrownie

It's not about being "PC" as you put it.  He literally tried to erase her parents from her life to fit whatever narrative he has in his head about what family means.  It's not some trite quibble over

walnutqueen
walnutqueen

Protocol is not law, and has nothing to do with being an American.  Fortunately, Americans live in a free country where they have the right to disagree with your sentiments and still be Americans (and

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selkie

selkie

Performance-enhancing drugs go far beyond steroids and other drugs used to build muscle. The meldonium causing such problems lately is used so that athletes can train longer and at higher intensity than they could before.

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Minneapple

Minneapple

3 hours ago, MostlyC said:

I wonder if the Russian Gymnasts will be tested for steroids.  It's hard to imagine, because all of them are so tiny.

Romanian gymnast Andreea Raducan was stripped of her gold in 2000 because she took a pill with pseudophedrine (which I think is off the banned list now). It's not just the muscle builders at issue.

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topanga

topanga

1 minute ago, Minneapple said:

Romanian gymnast Andreea Raducan was stripped of her gold in 2000 because she took a pill with pseudophedrine (which I think is off the banned list now). It's not just the muscle builders at issue.

I remember that story. Very sad. The gymnast said (and I believe her) that the Russian team doctor prescribed cold medicine for her. Wouldn't he (or she) know not to prescribe banned substances to the athletes? And shouldn't an Olympic be hyper-aware of what they're putting in their bodies? Unless the gymnast did ask, and the doctor told her everything was fine.

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Indy

Indy

(edited)
1 hour ago, topanga said:

I remember that story. Very sad. The gymnast said (and I believe her) that the Russian team doctor prescribed cold medicine for her. Wouldn't he (or she) know not to prescribe banned substances to the athletes? And shouldn't an Olympic be hyper-aware of what they're putting in their bodies? Unless the gymnast did ask, and the doctor told her everything was fine.

Romanian team doctor.
And while you'd hope athletes would be hyper aware of what they eat and take, these are young girls who grew up in a centralized system, away from her family, where there was always an authority figure telling them what to do, when to eat, what medicine to take, etc. If a team doctor gave her a cold pill, she would take it. The doctor should have known what was in the pill but either didn't, didn't think it would test, or didn't care. 

Quote

Why "artistic"?

The official name of the sport is Artistic Gymnastics (Women's Artistic Gymnastics and Men's Artistic Gymnastics). It might be a bit of a misnomer with how the sport has evolved, but it's the real name. There is also Rhythmic Gymnastics and Trampoline & Tumbling, both fall under the same governing body. 

Edited by Indy
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Quilt Fairy

Quilt Fairy

Can someone answer a question that's been bugging me? When the men's and women's Olympic teams were being picked, everyone went through their routines, got their scores, and then the judges, team coaches, et al, went into a conference room and had 12 minutes to pick the teams. And my question is, of course, why 12 minutes? Who came up with that? It's such an odd and apparently arbitrary amount of time. And I think in the end, the woman's selection committee exceeded the 12 minutes anyhow, and I doubt they were penalized for it. Anyone?

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Indy

Indy

I agree that 12 minutes was an arbitrary number. It also might have been what NBC was allotting based on the amount of time they gave to the event.  X minutes for the competition + Y minutes for a live announcements = 12 minutes for the decision. It's just such a random number. 

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Quilt Fairy

Quilt Fairy

On ‎7‎/‎27‎/‎2016 at 7:22 PM, PoshSprinkles said:

@Quilt Fairy, I believe the 12 minutes is just an arbitrary number. From what I remember in the past, they've gone as long as 18-20 minutes picking members of the teams. Personally, I think they think that 12 minutes gives the illusion that they contemplated who should be on the team when those of us who follow the sport consistently know that the teams are pre-determined WAY BEFORE the trials. 

Thanks, Posh, that explains it better. It's not a "We managed to decide in only 12 minutes" as much as a "See, we took a whole 12 minutes to decide".

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topanga

topanga

On 8/1/2016 at 7:38 PM, choclatechip45 said:

Very good interview with Jordyn Wieber http://www.theskatinglesson.com/tsl/perspective-a-conversation-with-jordyn-wieber.

I liked the questions in this long interview. The interviewer didn't shy away from asking Jordyn the tough questions: how it felt not to compete for the all-around in 2012, how it felt so see Gabby Douglas become the It Girl wen Jordyn was supposed to be the It Girl at the London Olympics. She asked how it felt to see Aly and Gabby going back to the Olympics, whether she thought Gabby should have made the team. She asked her how she feels about Simone Biles, Martha, the Ranch, and hanging out--but not competing--with the UCLA gymnastics team. Jordyn was always a mystery to me, but this interview definitely helped me get to know her a little better.  

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
1 hour ago, topanga said:

I liked the questions in this long interview. The interviewer didn't shy away from asking Jordyn the tough questions: how it felt not to compete for the all-around in 2012, how it felt so see Gabby Douglas become the It Girl wen Jordyn was supposed to be the It Girl at the London Olympics. She asked how it felt to see Aly and Gabby going back to the Olympics, whether she thought Gabby should have made the team. She asked her how she feels about Simone Biles, Martha, the Ranch, and hanging out--but not competing--with the UCLA gymnastics team. Jordyn was always a mystery to me, but this interview definitely helped me get to know her a little better.  

I agree. I really liked her answer when she was asked about her, Aly and McKayla whispering after Gabby won trials. I always thought the Internet really blew that out of proportion even though I understand the speculation.  I wonder if Jordyn and Gabby trained together briefly when Chris Waller coached both of them. The only thing that annoys me about Jordyn is how she thinks it's unfair she can't compete in NCAA.  I'm really happy for Jordyn that she has clearly found happiness after elite gymnastics. I can't imagine how hard it is for some of these girls to fully move on. I wonder if Jordyn will go into coaching after she has graduated. 

Also, Laurie went pro. Her agent put it on their website yesterday and took it down. Today they made a statement. If I were Laurie I would have chose a different agent. Can't believe they screwed up like that. Granted I work in PR and that's a big no-no. 

I've been following Ashton on snapchat it looks like her, Ragan, Akash (sometimes Donell) have all been hanging out in the alternate village and exploring. Glad the four of them are finding ways to  try to make the best of being alternates.

Edited by choclatechip45
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topanga

topanga

5 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I agree. I really liked her answer when she was asked about her, Aly and McKayla whispering after Gabby won trials. I always thought the Internet really blew that out of proportion even though I understand the speculation.  I wonder if Jordyn and Gabby trained together briefly when Chris Waller coached both of them. The only thing that annoys me about Jordyn is how she thinks it's unfair she can't compete in NCAA.  I'm really happy for Jordyn that she has clearly found happiness after elite gymnastics. I can't imagine how hard it is for some of these girls to fully move on. I wonder if Jordyn will go into coaching after she has graduated. 

Also, Laurie went pro. Her agent put it on their website yesterday and took it down. Today they made a statement. If I were Laurie I would have chose a different agent. Can't believe they screwed up like that. Granted I work in PR and that's a big no-no. 

From what I understand, Jordyn's parent's (and maybe her manager) encouraged her to go pro after the Olympics, emphasizing that she only had a small window to earn money and do endorsements before she was out of the spotlight. It sounds like she might regret that decision in light of how short a gymnast's professional career really is.  I wonder how much money she made as a professional.

I agree with her that the NCAA should reconsider its policy on banning professional athletes of all sports from competing at the collegiate level. I understand the logic, that it isn't fair that professional gymnasts are competing against collegiate gymnasts. But how is it different if an Olympic athlete never goes pro then goes to college? Isn't that still unfair for the collegiate athlete? Can you imagine being a college gymnast competing against Simone Biles? (Although I'm sure she'll turn pro after the Olympics). 

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Mittengirl

Mittengirl

I think for women's gymnastics in particular, the age of the athletes make a huge difference.  For the most part they are done competing on the elite level by the time they reach college age.  I wouldn't have a problem if the NCAA prohibited pro athletes from accepting scholarships.  That seems too much like double-dipping.  

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
4 hours ago, topanga said:

From what I understand, Jordyn's parent's (and maybe her manager) encouraged her to go pro after the Olympics, emphasizing that she only had a small window to earn money and do endorsements before she was out of the spotlight. It sounds like she might regret that decision in light of how short a gymnast's professional career really is.  I wonder how much money she made as a professional.

I agree with her that the NCAA should reconsider its policy on banning professional athletes of all sports from competing at the collegiate level. I understand the logic, that it isn't fair that professional gymnasts are competing against collegiate gymnasts. But how is it different if an Olympic athlete never goes pro then goes to college? Isn't that still unfair for the collegiate athlete? Can you imagine being a college gymnast competing against Simone Biles? (Although I'm sure she'll turn pro after the Olympics). 

Simone went pro during the summer of 2015. I think it's a risk for every Olympic gymnast. Would Courtney Kupets, Sam Peszek or Bridget Sloan have made that much money going pro? They were all successful in NCAA. I know Bridget has said multiple times in articles she is happy she didn't go pro because she would have only made enough to pay in state tuition and would not have been able to afford housing . Plus NCAA helped renew her passion in gymnastics. I am pretty sure Kyla Ross is the first Olympic Gold Medalist to compete in NCAA.

In the interview Jordyn  said that Tasha Schwikert of all people convinced her to go pro by telling her the negative aspects college gymnastics because Tasha wanted to be her agent. Which is interesting because Tasha competed for UCLA. Jordyn also said she would still go pro. I know celebrity net worth is not always accurate it says Jordyn is worth $3 million. I remember the articles about the tour in2012 said the girls would make $100,000.

I can't find it now, but I remember reading Jordyn's mom saying that Jordyn made enough to pay for college on her own. This was before the Olympics plus John Geddert said how thr Wiebers gave him a kickback from Jordyn's endorsements.  I would have more sympathy if this came from Rebecca Bross or Jana Bieger who both wnt pro but didn't have  the success that Jordyn had.  To me it seems like Jordyn wants both and unfortunately she can't have both.

Edited by choclatechip45
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Minneapple

Minneapple

(edited)
10 hours ago, topanga said:

I agree with her that the NCAA should reconsider its policy on banning professional athletes of all sports from competing at the collegiate level. I understand the logic, that it isn't fair that professional gymnasts are competing against collegiate gymnasts. But how is it different if an Olympic athlete never goes pro then goes to college? Isn't that still unfair for the collegiate athlete? Can you imagine being a college gymnast competing against Simone Biles? (Although I'm sure she'll turn pro after the Olympics). 

It's not about Olympians competing in college (many schools have athletes in the Olympics), it's about allowing collegiate athletes to use their names and likenesses to make money, which the NCAA does not allow. That's really the only difference between pro and amateur in the eyes of the NCAA (well, that and a few million more ridiculous fine print rules). The issue with women's gymnastics is that their prime earning potential comes long before their collegiate careers. Jordyn took the risk of going pro after she won worlds, thinking she would be the Next Big Star in the Olympics and it didn't work out for her. She's lucky that she made enough to cover college, but I'm sure she misses competing even though she still gets to spend time in the gym. 

Simone had committed to UCLA. The coach begged her to reconsider going pro, but for Simone, financially it only made sense. She's endorsed a bunch of stuff now, Kellogg's cereal and one of the airlines and whatnot.

Edited by Minneapple
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Scovies

Scovies

I'm watching the women's podium training, and it looks like the three women going for an all-around spot will be Simone, Gabby, and Aly. They're on bars right now and have Laurie going in the 5th "alternate" position.

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

Quote

I'm watching the women's podium training, and it looks like the three women going for an all-around spot will be Simone, Gabby, and Aly. They're on bars right now and have Laurie going in the 5th "alternate" position.

Definitely looks like that way. I wonder if Aly or Simone will be doing bars in the team final. Usually they try to avoid having Simone doing bars because of her shoulder.

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Scovies

Scovies

15 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Definitely looks like that way. I wonder if Aly or Simone will be doing bars in the team final. Usually they try to avoid having Simone doing bars because of her shoulder.

Aly won't be doing bars in the team final unless two other people get injured. I'd personally put up Laurie, Gabby, and Madison up.

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
9 minutes ago, Scovies said:

Aly won't be doing bars in the team final unless two other people get injured. I'd personally put up Laurie, Gabby, and Madison up.

Same. I am surprised she is having Simone do bars in Team Finals because of her shoulder.

Edited by choclatechip45
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Jillibean

Jillibean

I went to Yahoo for a different news story and happened upon this article about Martha reportedly choosing Aly over Laurie to try to qualify for the All-Around. I'm sure the media will find their controversy where they want to, but I honestly thought the article was a bit unfair. It mentioned that Laurie was in second place both days of Trials, but did NOT mention that Aly beat Laurie a couple of weeks earlier at Nationals. I also thought it was a bit misleading to say that Hernandez's scores have been consistently higher than Aly or Gabby's, given that Aly was doing a comeback and that Gabby's spot in the all-around likely has a lot more to do with the necessity of using her on all the events. Furthermore, none of us were at training camp and have no idea what either girl's consistency was like. The article implies that Martha will do whatever she wants because she's been so successful in the last few Olympics and is retiring, but I doubt Martha would give Aly the spot, low bars score and all, if she didn't feel Aly merited it. I like both ladies a lot, and one was bound to be very disappointed here. That doesn't mean it's necessarily controversial. 

I'm really stunned that Laurie's coach gave them a quote about it, as well. I absolutely understand her disappointment, but going into a team competition, I would think the coaches would try to put up a more diplomatic front. "Check the scores" is not a diplomatic answer. I wonder if Laurie's team were banking (literally) on her being the second AA gymnast when they made the decision to go pro. Even if she had the qualifying spot, it would be far from a done deal--if Gabby hits she could take that second slot. 

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choclatechip45

choclatechip45

(edited)
31 minutes ago, Jillibean said:

I went to Yahoo for a different news story and happened upon this article about Martha reportedly choosing Aly over Laurie to try to qualify for the All-Around. I'm sure the media will find their controversy where they want to, but I honestly thought the article was a bit unfair. It mentioned that Laurie was in second place both days of Trials, but did NOT mention that Aly beat Laurie a couple of weeks earlier at Nationals. I also thought it was a bit misleading to say that Hernandez's scores have been consistently higher than Aly or Gabby's, given that Aly was doing a comeback and that Gabby's spot in the all-around likely has a lot more to do with the necessity of using her on all the events. Furthermore, none of us were at training camp and have no idea what either girl's consistency was like. The article implies that Martha will do whatever she wants because she's been so successful in the last few Olympics and is retiring, but I doubt Martha would give Aly the spot, low bars score and all, if she didn't feel Aly merited it. I like both ladies a lot, and one was bound to be very disappointed here. That doesn't mean it's necessarily controversial. 

I'm really stunned that Laurie's coach gave them a quote about it, as well. I absolutely understand her disappointment, but going into a team competition, I would think the coaches would try to put up a more diplomatic front. "Check the scores" is not a diplomatic answer. I wonder if Laurie's team were banking (literally) on her being the second AA gymnast when they made the decision to go pro. Even if she had the qualifying spot, it would be far from a done deal--if Gabby hits she could take that second slot. 

Yeah plus technically Gabby beat both Aly and Laurie in Jesolo. Aly finished ahead of Laurie at Pacrims. which I also think was in March might have been April.  I thought Laurie's statement about going pro was odd. I can't remember any gymnast saying they would defiantly compete the next 4 years before the current Olympics has started. I understand Maggie's frustratation she was really trying to get Laurie to be consistent on bars. I don't think she should have made that comment. Everyone knew Gabby was going to do the all around in qualifications that is the only reason you take her to be honest. If she is on she will score pretty well on every event and international judges score Gabby very well. I don't think Aly or Gabby should be attacked for the decision. Martha will always favor gymnasts who have an Olympic Gold Medal in the team and all around competitions over those who don't. Martha was telling the press after the Worlds 2011 when Nastia announced her comeback that she was already on her Olympic team with Jordyn and Gabby. It is the one consistent thing about Martha over the years IMO. 

Edited by choclatechip45
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Jillibean

Jillibean

18 minutes ago, Elsydeon said:

News just came out a few minutes ago that Laurie has suffered a pulled hamstring. It could be severe enough to knock her out of competition altogether.

Laurie and Maggie just tweeted saying that the information is false, happily. 

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Harry24

Harry24

(edited)

Anyone watching the NBC stream?  Why isn't Kohei (sp?) competing with the Japanese team?  

ETA: Never mind, I see him, but he doesn't appear to be competing on the vault at least.  But if any kind soul would like to explain the qualification process and implications, I would be massively grateful.

Second question: is that other Japanese gymnast, Kato, actually wearing a wig?  Or has he inexplicably but rather impressively managed to style his hair to look as wiggy as possible?

Edited by Harry24
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AuntieDiane6

AuntieDiane6

Here's the apparatus order:

Floor  

Pommel  

Rings

Vault   

Parallel Bars  

High Bar

So, the Japanese team started on Pommel, they go next on Rings and end with Floor.  

This is important because each apparatus has its own NBC feed so if you are following a particular team, you need to know their competition order.

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Harry24

Harry24

(edited)
Spoiler

If you want to qualify for the vault final you have to compete two vaults from different "families"

So it looks as though Uchimura only did one vault.  So therefore he won't qualify to do the vault finals, right?  Is he not scoring high enough on the vault these days to have a legit shot for a medal in the event finals or was this a strategic decision so he won't have to 1) spend time on the second vault, 2) expend extra energy at the event because other events are a priority?

ETA: Thanks Posh and Auntie for the info/explanations.

Edited by Harry24
Politeness
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Daisy

Daisy

Just now, Harry24 said:
  Reveal hidden contents

If you want to qualify for the vault final you have to compete two vaults from different "families"

So it looks as though Uchimura only did one vault.  So therefore he won't qualify to do the vault finals, right?  Is he not scoring high enough on the vault these days to have a legit shot for a medal in the event finals or was this a strategic decision so he won't have to 1) spend time on the second vault, 2) expend extra energy at the event because other events are a priority?

That's right - if he only did one vault, he is not eligible to to do vault finals. 
it could be either of those things. he could simply not have a 2nd vault that's high enough to challenge for a medal this go around or someone else on Japan is better, so he's stepping back. who knows. 

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Harry24

Harry24

(edited)

Do the prelims have a bearing on the team competition?

Oh, no.  Poor Yamamuro is having a disaster.  He just scored in the 12s on parallel bars (and he was the anchor guy), and IIRC he fell on his vault.

Edited by Harry24
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Harry24

Harry24

Quote

the Japanese team is not looking particularly good.

Yes, they had a 13 and a 12 in the parallel bars.  And even Kohei looked kind of shaky for him (to my untrained eye).

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Daisy

Daisy

also have to say - i am loving the BBC call of the tournament. they are funny, they are smart, they tell you what the moves are (and why they are difficult). and why deductions would/would not be taken off.

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Harry24

Harry24

(edited)
Quote

I can't watch prelims at the moment, but did they fall off the bars? Or did they just have a lot of bent arms and bad handstands? 

Tanaka Kato had a big break where he bent over backwards while in a handstand on one of the bars and clearly had to do several moves to get himself back into the routine.  Yamamuro had the same problem twice AND came off the bars.  He was the 12.

And now Kohei has fallen off the high bar on his first release. :-(

Edited by Harry24
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Daisy

Daisy

(edited)

Holy smacks that was a fall from Kohei. that was such a beautiful move, and then, it's like the force just ripped his palm from the bar and down he went on his back. I hope this doesn't knock him out off finals - but it might be close.  - 14.3 was his score, so no  highbars for Kohei

and Brazil is kicking all kinds of behind. this floor routine was amazing (and then Diego starts crying and so i start crying. I <3 the Olympics LOL)

Edited by Daisy
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Harry24

Harry24

(edited)

At least Yamamuro stayed on the bar.  He fell off in his warm-up.

How high does an individual have to finish to qualify for the AA?  Is Kohei in danger after the fall off the high bar?

Is it possible that the huge crowd responses to the Brazilian team are affecting the Japanese?  I would have thought they'd be inured to that  with all their experience.

Whoa!  Brazil is now leading Japan by over a point!

Edited by Harry24
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Daisy

Daisy

Just now, Harry24 said:

At least Yamamuro stayed on the bar.  He fell off in his warm-up.

How high does an individual have to finish to qualify for the AA?  Is Kohei in danger after the fall off the high bar?

it truly depends on how everyone does - but the BBC guy was like 14.3 (Kohei's score), was totally not going to be high enough. so who knows. 

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