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The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

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20 hours ago, Spencer Hastings said:

 

This looks like a "Show us how you styled it" entry on PierOne.com.

Ikat print reading chair. $359.99

Buffalo plaid throw. $59.99

Textured pillow. $34.99 (Buy one/get one 1/2 price)

Wood/metal end table. $159.99 (Sale price)

Teapot. $29.99

Oversized mug. $14.99

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#Materialistic Shilling  #Gospel  #Stealth Marketing #Glory  #Wannabe Fashionista Posing  #Grace

Come to think of it, I wonder if anybody in their circle has three daughters named Gospel, Glory and Grace?  .... Kinda works.

 

ETA: Somebody at least ought to write a novel starring a trio of sisters with those names.

Edited by Churchhoney
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32 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

It is common, and by and large while I'd feel squicky doing it myself (I'm old), it doesn't actually bother me when people do it.

I can't help but think it's inappropriate for a member of the clergy to do any of it, though. Jingle's only the clergyman's wife, so I feel that's a bit different (maybe not much, but a bit).

But it seems like at least a small ethical lapse -- and certainly tacky and in bad taste -- for an actual pastor to go around promoting/shilling goods of whatever kind (sometimes by pure stealth, too) for the purpose of getting any kind of personal kickback from doing it. 

His focus ought to be on other things.  What if his parishioners can't afford nice things at all? What if they follow him -- does he influence them to buy crap they can't afford? And should he really be sticking up posed pictures (or even having his wife stick them up) that call attention to his Brooks Brothers clothes -- in hopes that he'll get more Brooks Brothers clothes free? And should a pastor appear in or take photos-posed-to-advertise at all? Shouldn't his family photos have their focus on family and not goods? I know Jer annoys me just in general, but I'm pretty sure this would seem super-inappropriate and tacky to me even if a clergyperson I otherwise liked were the one doing it.

I agree. It's not like he needs to take a vow of poverty, but where's the humility and faith in what God provides for those who serve Him. And as a preacher, it's my opinion that he's modeling poor behavior emphasizing  luxury (for lack of a better word) rather than needs or more humble wants. ANd what about the money the parishioners contribute? They put their last five bucks in the pot and Jeremy is wearing a $80 tie?!

To share a very, very, very loose analogy, my kids' orthodontist remodeled his office and he was demonstrating this window/electronic white board/electronic mirror thingamabobby to myself and my kids. The entire time I'm thinking, well fancy that, a modern window that he'll never use and I basically paid for. And lo and behold the words that I and his other patients paid for that came flying out of my mouth before I could put the words back in. Well he squirmed a bit and then went into how he took out loans to pay for the remodel.

Anyway, yes, I think Jeremy is behaving in a tacky manner and he doesn't annoy me as much as he annoys you.

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2 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

But it seems like at least a small ethical lapse -- and certainly tacky and in bad taste -- for an actual pastor to go around promoting/shilling goods of whatever kind (sometimes by pure stealth, too) for the purpose of getting any kind of personal kickback from doing it. 

I disagree with this portion. So long as the pastor isn’t promoting things that harm people (like cigarettes) OR things that go against the doctrine of his church (like he shouldn’t promote a hookup app for casual sex), why shouldn’t he be paid for advertising? To me that’s morally no different than all the pastors that have second jobs or businesses, because the pastor salary isn’t enough to live on. If Jeremy were a craftsman, advertising the sale of his goods on Instagram I’d see nothing wrong with that either. 

 

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

To share a very, very, very loose analogy, my kids' orthodontist remodeled his office and he was demonstrating this window/electronic white board/electronic mirror thingamabobby to myself and my kids. The entire time I'm thinking, well fancy that, a modern window that he'll never use and I basically paid for. And lo and behold the words that I and his other patients paid for that came flying out of my mouth before I could put the words back in. Well he squirmed a bit and then went into how he took out loans to pay for the remodel.

Yes but, you and received orthodontia for your money. He didn’t take your money, NOT perform the service, spend it frivolously and then refuse you a refund (because he didn’t do his job)- so as long as he isn’t using his earnings to harm his patients why would it bother anyone how he spends his money?

I feel the same way about Jeremy- he’s not forcing anyone to buy anything. As long as he isn’t stealing from his pashioners or exploiting them (physically or financially), and not being a hypocrite (like using the money for sex workers)- it’s his earnings to spend as he sees fit. 

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1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

I disagree with this portion. So long as the pastor isn’t promoting things that harm people (like cigarettes) OR things that go against the doctrine of his church (like he shouldn’t promote a hookup app for casual sex), why shouldn’t he be paid for advertising? To me that’s morally no different than all the pastors that have second jobs or businesses, because the pastor salary isn’t enough to live on. If Jeremy were a craftsman, advertising the sale of his goods on Instagram I’d see nothing wrong with that either. 

 

Yes but, you and received orthodontia for your money. He didn’t take your money, NOT perform the service, spend it frivolously and then refuse you a refund (because he didn’t do his job)- so as long as he isn’t using his earnings to harm his patients why would it bother anyone how he spends his money?

I feel the same way about Jeremy- he’s not forcing anyone to buy anything. As long as he isn’t stealing from his pashioners or exploiting them (physically or financially), and not being a hypocrite (like using the money for sex workers)- it’s his earnings to spend as he sees fit. 

I'm pretty sure what really set me off was the publisher ones (the journaling bible and some earlier ones he had) where it seems to me he clearly PRETENDS not to be doing this .... Strongly implying (it seems to me) that these books "contests" that he's running are actually being run by him, paid for by him, etc ... That he thought of a holy purpose for a book and wants others to participate, so he BOUGHT a bunch of books and they get to enter a contest and win a prize -- a book -- from HIM. 

Now, I'm 99-plus-percent certain that he didn't buy those books,  and he isn't running the contest, but that it's being run and paid for entirely by the publisher....I don't know whose idea the journal-about-my-baby thing was. But I'd say the odds are that even that is at least as likely to have been the publisher's idea as to have been Jer's idea. Seems very likely to me that the publisher saw a pastor with a big social media and tv following and a new baby, knew already that journaling for your kid was one of the things they hoped people'd use the books for, and gave Jer a call. That seems much more likely to me than him having the idea and calling them-- although obviously the idea part could have gone either way. 

Anyway, that leaves me viewing his first (I guess) affiliate-marketing activities as 100-percent lies. Things written in a certain way to mislead (perhaps benignly? but...still misleading...and he's a damn pastor) his innocent Christian brethren. They think he's cool on social media and now they think he's super-generous, too. 

 And I see ZERO reason for him NOT to have been straight up with his readers -- and simply said that he's working with the publisher to help promote these terrific books and this terrific activity, and if you enter the contest, he'll judge it but the publisher will send you free copies.

The only reason NOT to lay it on the line like that would be that both he and  publisher think they'll get a better ROI by using the pretense that this is ALL Jeremy. So .... if I'm right, the pastor AND the Christian publisher are flat-out lying to their Christian constituents for money (in the publishers' case) (or free books, or whatever, in Jer's.) 

That's where he crossed the line for me. ..... If he'd just been tagging ties -- and everyone can SEE that he is; it's not hidden -- I have a feeling I would have thought it was kinda vain and tacky but not necessarily inappropriate. ....

But since I'm pretty sure he fudged the truth bigly to his Christian brethren with his publishing "contests," I'm now casting a suspicious eye on all his marketing adventures. ....Possibly not fair....But I do think that pastors shouldn't lie to hide their marketing.  -- and if they do, then they're gonna seem sleazy to me.

And working a second job does seem quite quite different to me as an appropriate pastoral thing than somewhat sneakily marketing luxury goods. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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@Churchhoney if Jeremy is lying about his sponsorships/contests etc that IS wrong (and inappropriate)- I just didn’t interpret the Instagram posts as misleading at all. But I’m a millennial who speaks English as a first language, someone from a different cultural experience may see things differently.

I of course trust your opinion, especially as someone who grew up in this type social milieu- but social media marketing is morally neutral to me (again, so long as you aren’t selling things that hurt people or being a hypocrite) and like working a second job. People may think it’s a stupid or useless job, but I don’t think it’s morally inferior. 

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2 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

@Churchhoney if Jeremy is lying about his sponsorships/contests etc that IS wrong (and inappropriate)- I just didn’t interpret the Instagram posts as misleading at all. But I’m a millennial who speaks English as a first language, someone from a different cultural experience may see things differently.

I of course trust your opinion, especially as someone who grew up in this type social milieu- but social media marketing is morally neutral to me (again, so long as you aren’t selling things that hurt people or being a hypocrite) and like working a second job. People may think it’s a stupid or useless job, but I don’t think it’s morally inferior. 

Yeah, I basically agree with you about the social-media marketing stuff in general......

It really is what I take to be misleading stuff in those publisher ones that tainted his actions for me. If it'd just been openly tagging teapots and Brooks Brothers ties, I'd wonder why a pastor would spend his limited time and energy on  something that trivial and vain, but I probably wouldn't think it raised any bigger questions than that. But he raised big trust issues for me with the publisher ones. 

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26 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Now, I'm 99-plus-percent certain that he didn't buy those books,  and he isn't running the contest, but that it's being run and paid for entirely by the publisher....I don't know whose idea the journal-about-my-baby thing was. But I'd say the odds are that even that is at least as likely to have been the publisher's idea as to have been Jer's idea. Seems very likely to me that the publisher saw a pastor with a big social media and tv following and a new baby, knew already that journaling for your kid was one of the things they hoped people'd use the books for, and gave Jer a call. That seems much more likely to me than him having the idea and calling them-- although obviously the idea part could have gone either way. 

Yeah I agree with you- I went back to look at the post, but who would think differently? That’s how these social media giveaways operate- a company sponsors a giveaway and uses the following of the “social media personality” as advertising. And you win by doing xyz (comments, tags etc). I see these all the time but I would never think that it was the Social Media Personalities “idea” nor would I think they bought the product......I think our expectations about these types of posts aren’t aligning and that’s why I don’t see it as misleading. 

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2 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Yeah I agree with you- I went back to look at the post, but who would think differently? That’s how these social media giveaways operate- a company sponsors a giveaway and uses the following of the “social media personality” as advertising. And you win by doing xyz (comments, tags etc). I see these all the time but I would never think that it was the Social Media Personalities “idea” nor would I think they bought the product......I think our expectations about these types of posts aren’t aligning and that’s why I don’t see it as misleading. 

I actually saw it immediately the way you did...........But then I thought about what could be some VERY innocent, unworldly, unsophisticated-about-marketing people who might follow a conservative-Christian pastor married into a family of virgins. ....

And I thought, Why wouldn't you WANT to make sure that these innocent people who admire the heck out of you know what you're doing here? Why would you write it in such a way that they could easily read it as being wow-the-celeb-I-love-and-admire-is-doing-this-because-he's-so-wonderful-and-generous? 

And my answer was -- Well, of course, if I'm the publisher, I WANT as many of his social-media followers as possible to believe that it IS Jeremy doing all this ... Because that's the kind of feeling that'll bring them to the contest in droves AND really burnish my bibles in their minds (because of the connection with this wonderful generous man) so that they'll want to buy if they don't win. ..... 

That's clearly what the seller would think, in my opinion....And .I've worked a bit in marketing, and I know that these are the emotional tools a business is likely to want to use to drive sales..... 

But if I were the PASTOR in that situation, I wouldn't want my words and image and person to be used for marketing that didn't fully tell the truth. Because I think I'd worry that there were probably some innocent sheep out there that might well go out and spend $60 they can't afford on the journaling bible because they're devoted to me as a social-media presence and because the thought of my contest and my example with the bible burnished and shone that bible in their minds......And I -- as a pastor that they admire -- wouldn't want to be the cause of their doing that.

If you were involved in a marketing campaign, and you REALLY thought that everybody who read it would understand how it was actually working, why wouldn't you simply lay the truth on the line -- since they know it anyway? The only reason not to is to make it appear to be something different to the eyes of the most naive readers -- and thus possibly get them to buy! .... That's what most marketing tends to come down to, after all! ....But that doesn't sit well with me when it comes from a pastor (or a Christian publisher, actually.) 

ETA: For the record,  I don't conclude from this that Jer is some terrible person. I conclude that he's just what he looks like -- a fairly self-centered, somewhat greedy, semi-dumb-ass, who wouldn't actually think of any nuances in a situation like this because he's largely lazy-minded...........In other words, not a terrible person or a great person, and just exactly the kind of guy who's likely to marry into the Duggar family.    Religiously, he's clearly a pure parrot, just like the Duggs and the other Duggar adjacents are. All you have to do is try to listen to one of his vague, garbled sermons to see that....So when a publisher who shares his theology asked him to write X, he wrote X. Didn't give it a second thought because I doubt that he gives a second thought to anything that comes from inside his own bubble. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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58 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

98DF636B-9D1D-4707-AF9C-8CF1BF10882E.jpeg

Not staged or pretentious at all .  .  A fucking bottle of ink!

Is that a fountain pen?

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1 hour ago, Lunera said:

Is that a fountain pen?

I use the same ink.  Great stuff, not inexpensive.  I need to work for that church.  Jeremy and Jinger seem to the doing pretty well for themselves.

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6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I agree. It's not like he needs to take a vow of poverty, but where's the humility and faith in what God provides for those who serve Him. And as a preacher, it's my opinion that he's modeling poor behavior emphasizing  luxury (for lack of a better word) rather than needs or more humble wants. ANd what about the money the parishioners contribute? They put their last five bucks in the pot and Jeremy is wearing a $80 tie?!

To share a very, very, very loose analogy, my kids' orthodontist remodeled his office and he was demonstrating this window/electronic white board/electronic mirror thingamabobby to myself and my kids. The entire time I'm thinking, well fancy that, a modern window that he'll never use and I basically paid for. And lo and behold the words that I and his other patients paid for that came flying out of my mouth before I could put the words back in. Well he squirmed a bit and then went into how he took out loans to pay for the remodel.

Anyway, yes, I think Jeremy is behaving in a tacky manner and he doesn't annoy me as much as he annoys you.

Figured out how to take my response to Small Talk. Witness me!

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What is their income?  Does Jeremy have hockey money?  Does his 10 person congregation support his family?  Are they living off Dugger tv appearances?

Things I ponder!

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20 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

What is their income?  Does Jeremy have hockey money?  Does his 10 person congregation support his family?  Are they living off Dugger tv appearances?

Things I ponder!

Did you see Jeremy's pre-TLC apartment building? It looked like Section 8 housing from the 1970s. 

I don't think he makes jack squat at the church. They're living off TV money. Probably not the wisest decision either, considering the gravy train will (at some point) end.

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Wait, is Jer still pastor of that Looks-like-a-former-crackhouse Church? The modest old converted house? He's too damn pretentious for his station in life. No wonder he wanted a girl like Jing, everyone else can see right through him.

17 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

She travels all over, she has stylish clothes and apparently stylish and hip furniture and accessories. She gets to take photos, she has a piano, she socializes with people other than her siblings..... Yes, she is stuck in a fundie marriage but if I had to be, I'd rather be where she is at than Jill or God forbid Anna. 

I agree with your statement, but she traded in a crappy, used, bought-at-a-thrift-store cage for a gilded one. Long term, I doubt Jer is gonna be the best partner. Shes an adult and could've done all of this herself.

No one wants to be Jill or Anna...

Edited by JoanArc
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9 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

What is their income?  Does Jeremy have hockey money?  Does his 10 person congregation support his family?  Are they living off Dugger tv appearances?

Things I ponder!

Well he played soccer, so if he has hockey money that would really be a surprise! ;)

From what I've read, it's not like you make big bank as a goalie for a pro soccer team, but I'm guessing that Jeremy and Jinger negotiated a way better TLC deal than the others. If nothing else, Jeremy had contacts in contract law and agents he could consult with before he signed anything. Yes, they live pretty nicely for a young family, but it could be that they pay living expenses with his church salary and all the "fun stuff" is covered by TLC money. Plus they live in Texas in a low cost of living area. 

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6 hours ago, JoanArc said:

Wait, is Jer still pastor of that Looks-like-a-former-crackhouse Church? The modest old converted house? He's too damn pretentious for his station in life. No wonder he wanted a girl like Jing, everyone else can see right through him.

 

 

The church has moved out of the house into a commercial building, actually. Looks more upscale and bigger now, although it's hard to know whether it is or whether the move was mainly an attempt to grow it. I assume that the pregnancy center moved with it, but I didn't look that up so I don't know if it did ...........The new place is in a little business-and-retail area and has a normal parking lot, which I'd think would catch more people's attention because they'd be going there to the dentist or something. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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33 minutes ago, Normades said:

On the issue of Jeremy being a pastor and pimping out products, I see it as the wrong thing to do.  Pastors hold sway over people, right or wrong.  If a pastor or his wife are selling or schilling things it could make some people go out and spend money they cannot afford just to curry favor or emulate the pastor.  That's my problem with it and none of the Duggars who want to call themselves pastors should do it in my opinion.  To me, it's taking advantage of a position of authority. 

I don’t see what they are doing as wrong.  They are not extorting anyone to buy it. It’s not as if they are beggiong  for donations to the Crystal Cathedral, the Saddleback complex, the Jim amd Tammy Faye ministries, the Joel Osteen make-up fund .... under the guise of using that money to feed the poor.  They are advertising a product. 

 Unless they are somehow implying you need to buy this for your immortal soul. 

Edited by mythoughtis
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19 minutes ago, mythoughtis said:

I don’t see what they are doing as wrong.  They are not extorting anyone to buy it. It’s not as if they are beggiong  for donations to the Crystal Cathedral, the Saddleback complex, the Jim amd Tammy Faye ministries, the Joel Osteen make-up fund .... under the guise of using that money to feed the poor.  They are advertising a product. 

 Unless they are somehow implying you need to buy this for your immortal soul. 

But they are like Jim and Tammy Faye.  Do you think those people would have purchased timeshares from Joe Blow down the street?  No.  They purchased because they wanted to be like their favorite preacher and his wife because “those people are definitely going to heaven and gosh darn it, I want to go with them!!”  They preach that they hold the keys to the kingdom, so of course sheeple will want to follow and please them.  They have fame and that’s how they use it.  True religious leaders don’t care about Brooks Brothers and fancy trips, they care about souls and the good of humanity.  If these people have money, good for them, but they shouldn’t use their sway to get people to waste money.  To me, that is wrong.  If Jeremy wants to actually work and flip houses like Austin does, then I won’t give him side eye for selling crap, but until then he’s abusing his power.  Look, I’m not even religious, but I think they need be held to a higher standard and treat soul saving as something special and holy and not just a way to part people from their money.  To me, they are acting like Jim and Tammy only on a smaller, less entertaining scale.  At least I liked to watch Tammy for the camp!!

JMO

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8 hours ago, JoanArc said:

Wait, is Jer still pastor of that Looks-like-a-former-crackhouse Church? The modest old converted house?

This is the new location. It used to be an Adult Day Care facility. 

Screenshot_20190117-130702_Maps-720x1232.thumb.jpg.1b100fff65a3030c08a266d6dea5c4b4.jpg

Screenshot_20190117-125951_Google_crop_719x515.thumb.jpg.fb36ed0782240673c5a1de30df04a7b8.jpg

A lot nicer compared to the tiny house.

Screenshot_20190117-125939_Google_crop_720x954.thumb.jpg.4327f872659da5733495bffaac2a6519.jpg

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15 hours ago, galaxychaser said:

Jeremy needs a pair of glasses to complete his look!

And a pipe.

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1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

Jeremy seems to have some script he's going by. An office filled with wooden shelves, hard cover leather bound books and a large desk with a leather insert. Old school, but very new and upscale pen and ink. A wooden and metal book holder. Brooks Brother's clothing, v-neck sweaters, suits, ties, colorful socks and nice leather shoes and we can't forget the hats.

Not sure of the roots of this script but I'm sure it includes a male heir mini-me, an upscale car and probably a maid. He best have solid plans to continue financing this script or before you know it he'll be following a script he never wrote and will be studying on the living floor with a kid climbing on his back.

Right! If he were a cardiologist, I would find it kind of quirky and cute. As a pastor who tells everyone to be "modest," it's hypocritical and nauseating. As someone who will probably be back to poverty in the next few years (or at least not riches), it's downright stupid. Still think his family has old money. It's the only explanation for his behavior that makes sense!

Edited by Christina87
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9 hours ago, JoanArc said:

Wait, is Jer still pastor of that Looks-like-a-former-crackhouse Church? The modest old converted house? He's too damn pretentious for his station in life. No wonder he wanted a girl like Jing, everyone else can see right through him.

I agree with your statement, but she traded in a crappy, used, bought-at-a-thrift-store cage for a gilded one. Long term, I doubt Jer is gonna be the best partner. Shes an adult and could've done all of this herself.

No one wants to be Jill or Anna...

Yep, I see her being the next member in Jill and Anna's club. I could see him desperately trying to hold onto the vestiges of his wealth, trying to keep up appearances while his family does without. I wonder how far it would go. Would he buy a thrift store suit and tie if buying a new one meant they could only afford Ramen? It's an interesting question. I feel like Austin and Bin have too much pride for that, and would work at McDonald's if they had to, but Jeremy has too much pride to work just any job in order to get by. Joe would work hard IMO to not let Kendra go hungry, and I see lauren blantantly pushing Josiah into an okay job, or just being like, "to hell with it!" and taking one herself once the money dries up. Lauren will not live in poverty, and I think she'd fail to keep sweet to prevent it. Jinger, however, would just keep eating ramen and saying, "whatever you think is best, babe!"

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While I cannot begrudge Jeremy for trying to monetize his social media presence (this really is the new normal and won't be going away anytime soon),  I do wonder if he is thoroughly researching what companies he is partnering with.  They seem to fit his aesthetic,  but do they fit his politics?  He really does need to think about how these fit into the image he is creating and not just about his bank account.  Also, as a pastor he does need to remain neutral or risk losing parishioners.  If you have 3 plumbers in your church, then you need not recommend only one.  

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2 hours ago, farmgal4 said:

And a pipe.

And a tweed jacket with elbow patches.

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Wow, they seem to have increased the Sunday audience.  I'm a bit surprised.

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4 minutes ago, Absolom said:

Wow, they seem to have increased the Sunday audience.  I'm a bit surprised.

Or they did for this picture. Who know what the truth is.

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1 hour ago, Oldernowiser said:

I so look forward to the day when “influencer” is no longer a career path.

This to the nth.

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1 hour ago, Oldernowiser said:

I so look forward to the day when “influencer” is no longer a career path.

And the word monetize is stricken from the English language. 

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4 hours ago, Lunera said:

This is the new location. It used to be an Adult Day Care facility. 

Screenshot_20190117-130702_Maps-720x1232.thumb.jpg.1b100fff65a3030c08a266d6dea5c4b4.jpg

Screenshot_20190117-125951_Google_crop_719x515.thumb.jpg.fb36ed0782240673c5a1de30df04a7b8.jpg

A lot nicer compared to the tiny house.

Screenshot_20190117-125939_Google_crop_720x954.thumb.jpg.4327f872659da5733495bffaac2a6519.jpg

Why is that woman outside by the water cooler when there is empty chairs inside? Has she sinned? It actually looks a bit like a  Mechelle outfit and she has the straggly hair too.

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5 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Seems like he really really loves those kind of 40s and 50s New Yorker magazine and movie images of "the intellectual." ....

I wonder if he knows that Alan Ginsburg and William Burroughs are considered intellectuals??  

Also, those people in his church look like they can totally afford Brooks Brothers ties and Jingle's foodie website.  

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I would be more interested in his intellectual posturing if he had aspired to earn a doctorate and become a professor.

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Aethera

If your post is not PRIMARILY about the Duggars, it will be removed. Please stick to the topic or take it to Small Talk, thank you.

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