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Sweet Lady Jane Spoilers and Speculation

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16 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Imagine that the best part of a critically acclaimed show centered on three Latina women is the white guy. I can't relate. 

I'm glad Jennie Urman got the space from the network to tell her story her way and end it her way. Ratings be dammed. 

Jane and Michael were a part of the show that I loved, but the relationship between the Villanueva women was always the center of the show and my favorite. I felt manipulated when they killed off Jane’s husband so they can jump four years to the future and have her move on so quickly. The time jump was jarring and at first, and didn’t feel like the same show to me so I stopped watching. I caught some of the end of last season’s episodes and it was definitely better, but I don’t think that “the white guy” was the best part of the show. I enjoyed their journey together as a couple and will not apologize for being pissed off that the writers crapped all over them. And they are crapping on them again (and the Michael fans)with the upcoming episodes. I do pick the worst ships who never get together (Dawson and Joey, Noel and Felicity, Rory and Jess) so am used to being sad when a series ends.

Edited by twoods
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9 hours ago, Snapdragon said:

This has been my guess for awhile now.  What we're watching is actually Jane's novel, which is being read at a book reading by the narrator.  That's why he adds in all the little asides to the audience and why all the episodes are just chapter numbers.  Jane will end up with one guy in the "novel" version, then they'll cut to the "real world" and she'll be with the other guy.  That way everyone can get their preferred ending.  

I could accept that ending.  From your keyboard, to the writer's, please.  

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On 4/11/2019 at 8:06 AM, Phebemarie said:

If there's no twist, I'm disappointed.  Was it really necessary to bring Michael back just to prove Rafael and Jane are the real deal?  What about that lovely line that Michael would love Jane until his dying breath?  

Jennie said, "There's no twist ending and it's the ending she wrote before the CW even picked up the series." Now, showrunners do lie, but she has talked about her planned ending multiple times and always says she's not changing it. She also recently said the love triangle will not take over the season. It will come to an end and Jane pretty much made her choice in the season premiere. Two endings is a cop out and isn't a love letter to telenovelas. 

Edited by Simba122504
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I think at this point, I hope Jane chooses HERSELF and neither Michael nor Rafael.  I was always on Team Michael, but I was okay with Jane ending up with Rafael until they brought Michael back.   Now it all feels screwy and I just can't imagine being happy with Jane ending up with either man.    Of course, Jennie can do whatever she wants cause it's her show and her dream and all.  I just don't have to be happy about it.

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I think the ending is no surprise if you’ve read this thread at all.  Kind of a shame as a change from Jennie’s initial ending might have spiced things up. 

 @funnygirl—I’m a fan of Michael with Jane because yes, I do love me dorky cute white guys. I’m a Latina, too, and married one such dude. It’s been fantastic to hear Spanish on a show so regularly and to feature Hispanic culture in all kinds of different ways, both big and small.  But don’t hate on me just ‘cause I think Brett the gringo is hyper-adorable.  I don’t find Baldoni attractive in the least. And he’s not Hispanic, so I don’t feel guilty for preferring Michael, lol.  Plus, my first crush ever was a blondish, blue eyed South American— old habits die hard, man! 

Edited by BAH · Reason: Add name
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Pictures from final day on set. We see the dress (partially). After tonight's episode, I honestly can't even imagine this fairytale ending. Here's to hoping we get a twist that makes this less annoying.

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9 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

I'm hoping Brett Dier pre-filmed his scenes due to scheduling conflicts but with the way this season has been going, who knows?

Maybe there's a small chance that they pre-filmed a scene with Michael/Jane for the finale but I'm finding it harder to believe. There's been NO behind the scenes on Brett. We know he's alive so them hiding Michael for whatever reason is ridiculous when they're blatantly going as far as showing Jane in a wedding dress in one of those pictures. They're showing characters like Lina and Darcy and Esteban in the finale but nowhere in sight is Michael, which means he doesn't even get to be at Jane's second wedding like Rafael got to be at Jane's first.

This is probably what's the most frustrating about all of this. They're treating Michael in this last season as some guest star, as if he wasn't an important character for the first three seasons. We already expected Jane/Rafael to get together and be the endgame. We didn't need them to bring back Michael for the first eight episodes (I believe) to get that confirmed. 

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On 4/17/2019 at 8:37 AM, funnygirl said:

Imagine that the best part of a critically acclaimed show centered on three Latina women is the white guy. I can't relate. 

I'm glad Jennie Urman got the space from the network to tell her story her way and end it her way. Ratings be dammed. 

I don’t think Michael is the best part, but I believe his characterization highlights a larger problem with the writing for some. Michael adds a balance to the narrative that gets bogged down by other thing and I believe that would be true regardless of his race.

Jennie can end it her way all she wants, but being too married to an idea is actually what has hurt the series several times. 

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At this point, I kinda wish they kept Michael dead. I get why they wanted it but this is just making a mess. It sucked when Michael died but they made their bad storytelling choice, and now they're making it so much worse.

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3 hours ago, thelegacies87 said:

I get why they wanted it

I still can't understand why they brought him back unless it's to have Jane choose Rafael over Michael while the latter is alive. Is that why Michael was brought back? If so, that's some poor storytelling...

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3 hours ago, arty said:

I still can't understand why they brought him back unless it's to have Jane choose Rafael over Michael while the latter is alive. Is that why Michael was brought back? If so, that's some poor storytelling...

Apparently Rafael is such a baby that he never got over the fact that Jane from 5 years ago chose Michael over him and it is not enough that Jane of now is choosing Rafael.

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Was Michael's brother Billy supposed to be a "dreaming demon of Dexter" for Michael, so to speak. He didn't seem like he's a real person, anyhow.

Rafael's "be brave" is referenced as the big influence for Jane's decisions in general in the pilot episode already. Jane says she's "being brave" when she proposes to Michael and decides to give the baby up to Rafael. Also, it's interesting how Jane is affected by Rafael while being completely in love with Michael in ep.1.

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Over in the episode 88 thread, MajesticMariposa posted a link to an interview with Jennie Urman.  She said that Michael would return this season and be in a "better place."  Having met Charlie, I'm sure we know that this place will be sharing her bullpen.  

But as mad as I am about Michael's treatment this season, the comment that infuriated me the most was her saying they didn't have time for a Brogelio moment.  Not only that, there won't be time for one in Michael's last appearance, because the arc is about Jane, and not Michael and Rogelio going off for a romp.  I don't know about you, but I didn't need a romp.  A hug.  A Brogelio hug would have been nice.  

I have deleted Jane again from my DVR.  I will probably watch the last episode because it is the last, but I have absolutely no interest in Jane's True Love Interest.  

Edited by Thalia
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19 minutes ago, Thalia said:

Over in the episode 88 thread, MajesticMariposa posted a link to an interview with Jennie Urman.  She said that Michael would return this season and be in a "better place."  Having met Charlie, I'm sure we know that this place will be sharing her bullpen.  

But as mad as I am about Michael's treatment this season, the comment that infuriated me the most was her saying they didn't have time for a Brogelio moment.  Not only that, there won't be time for one in Michael's last appearance, because the arc is about Jane, and not Michael and Rogelio going off for a romp.  I don't know about you, but I didn't need a romp.  A hug.  A Brogelio hug would have been nice.  

I have deleted Jane again from my DVR.  I will probably watch the last episode because it is the last, but I have absolutely no interest in Jane's True Love Interest.  

Yeah, because apparently, the only way Michael and Rogelio can interact is through mani-pedis. 

No, Jennie. All we wanted was a scene with the two talking. That's it. It's not that hard.

I used to think Jennie was brilliant when it came to this show. But between whatever the hell's happening on Charmed, her other show, and what they've chosen to do here, it just makes it easier to quit this show. I'm definitely done for the season now. And it's a real damn shame because I used to love this show, even last season when I wasn't watching anything more than mere clips. 

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There have been so many spoilers released (supposedly) that reveal that Jane and Rafael are the 'endgame' but I am really surprised that there have been no spoilers or 'sides' released about the narrator. That's the only mystery remaining, in my opinion.  So c'mon people in the know, who have it all figured out, tell me about the narrator!   I want to know! 

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9 hours ago, cardigirl said:

I am really surprised that there have been no spoilers or 'sides' released about the narrator. That's the only mystery remaining, in my opinion.  So c'mon people in the know, who have it all figured out, tell me about the narrator!   I want to know! 

Unfortunately, that information didn't appear in the sides.  Grr. 

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On 5/14/2019 at 7:30 PM, Irlandesa said:

Unfortunately, that information didn't appear in the sides.  Grr. 

It would be hysterical if it was the ghost of Mateo Sr. 

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So the big plot twist this season is either Mateo not being J/R biological child due to Rose's shenanigans, or Raf's biological parents reveal. I wonder if the writers are actually ballsy enough to do "Mateo is not J/R child" thing in the last five episodes, though.

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At this point, I don't think either of those things are happening.  I don't think Rose cared one whit about Raf at the time Mateo was conceived. Much of her interest seems to be tied to the fact that Luisa is starting to choose her brother over her lover.

And I feel like the show has forgotten that Raf isn't biologically related to Luisa.  If anything, the DNA twist I'd expect is that Rose doctored those--even though they started to tell his origin story but then backed off. I thought learning who he was might have been something they'd have him do while Jane was dealing with Michael but no.

I don't think there are enough episodes left to make finding out who his parents are of any significance unless it's something weird like Jorge being the dad.  Or Michael's dad making them brothers.  And there's definitely not enough time to deal with the fallout of Mateo having a different biological father.

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On 6/3/2019 at 3:01 PM, Irlandesa said:

I don't think Rose cared one whit about Raf at the time Mateo was conceived. Much of her interest seems to be tied to the fact that Luisa is starting to choose her brother over her lover.

I just walked in here so I have no idea why you guys are even speculating about this, but Rose did kidnap Mateo right after he was born. If they wanted to they could say she switched babies. It would explain why he is so different from Jane.

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2 hours ago, natyxg said:

I just walked in here so I have no idea why you guys are even speculating about this, but Rose did kidnap Mateo right after he was born. If they wanted to they could say she switched babies. It would explain why he is so different from Jane.

That's true.  She could have done that.  If they go that route, they're going to have to pick up their storytelling pace to wrap that up.

But I still don't think she particularly cared about targeting Raf at that point.  She only kidnapped Mateo to get her hands on police evidence. 

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If Rose did switch out Mateo with another baby, I don't get why we're having the reveal a few episodes before the finale, which makes me feel like this is just contrived drama that will go nowhere. I know, with Rose, she could have done it. But revealing it so late in the series just doesn't make any sense to me. The only storyline that should come out of it, then, is Jane wanting to find the real Mateo. I doubt she'll just say see ya to this Mateo, but she also wouldn't say 'well, the son I gave birth to is gone and this is my real son so I'm just gonna accept what Rose did' so this is all going to turn out to be for nothing.

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35 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

If Rose did switch out Mateo with another baby, I don't get why we're having the reveal a few episodes before the finale, which makes me feel like this is just contrived drama that will go nowhere. I know, with Rose, she could have done it. But revealing it so late in the series just doesn't make any sense to me. The only storyline that should come out of it, then, is Jane wanting to find the real Mateo. I doubt she'll just say see ya to this Mateo, but she also wouldn't say 'well, the son I gave birth to is gone and this is my real son so I'm just gonna accept what Rose did' so this is all going to turn out to be for nothing.

That would be the logical thing, but this season has been so bad that I wouldn't put anything past them. But still, what prompted this speculation? Is there evidence for it or it is a 100% spec? I feel a little lost.

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12 minutes ago, natyxg said:

That would be the logical thing, but this season has been so bad that I wouldn't put anything past them. But still, what prompted this speculation? Is there evidence for it or it is a 100% spec? I feel a little lost.

Some spoilers about the rest of the season have come out. One of them is about Jane feeling like Mateo isn't her biological son and that Rose might have switched her son for another baby at birth. I think that's supposed to be episode 15 or 16? 

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Specifically, the spoiler says that Jane sees another boy with a birthmark that looks like the birthmark Mateo had when he was born, but Mateo no longer has a birthmark, and she wonders if birthmarks could just go away. 

It does seem like an odd thing to bring in at the very end of a show, without any reference to it in past seasons. 

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9 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Some spoilers about the rest of the season have come out. One of them is about Jane feeling like Mateo isn't her biological son and that Rose might have switched her son for another baby at birth. I think that's supposed to be episode 15 or 16? 

I see. If Jane suspects that he's not her son, then he is, I think. Big reveals like that are usually used as shocking plot twits, people don't see them coming.

2 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

Specifically, the spoiler says that Jane sees another boy with a birthmark that looks like the birthmark Mateo had when he was born, but Mateo no longer has a birthmark, and she wonders if birthmarks could just go away. 

It does seem like an odd thing to bring in at the very end of a show, without any reference to it in past seasons. 

Thanks.

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I think the show laid groundwork for the potential Rafael's parents reveal. No sure of they'd use it but either Jorge his bio father, or JR's mom is his bio mother (or both!). I mean, Jorge is the most useless character in the history of ever, so he at least would have a purpose apart from being Alba's boring storyline.

I'd be hilarious if River is randomly Raf's mother, though.

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5 hours ago, CooperTV said:

I'd be hilarious if River is randomly Raf's mother, though.

That's genius and I kind of hate myself that I didn't think of it.  Brooke Sheilds is about 19 years older than Justin Baldoni so it could track that she had a secret baby while she was young and ambitious who she gave up for adoption.

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6 hours ago, CooperTV said:

I think the show laid groundwork for the potential Rafael's parents reveal. No sure of they'd use it but either Jorge his bio father, or JR's mom is his bio mother (or both!). I mean, Jorge is the most useless character in the history of ever, so he at least would have a purpose apart from being Alba's boring storyline.

I'd be hilarious if River is randomly Raf's mother, though.

Lol and it would parallel Jane's own famous lost dad.

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So, what's left? Rose will probably be captured with Luisa's help. Petra and JR will get back together. There will be some sort of Mateo's true parentage issue (misdirection?).

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On 6/6/2019 at 9:08 AM, cardigirl said:

Specifically, the spoiler says that Jane sees another boy with a birthmark that looks like the birthmark Mateo had when he was born, but Mateo no longer has a birthmark, and she wonders if birthmarks could just go away. 

It does seem like an odd thing to bring in at the very end of a show, without any reference to it in past seasons. 

Jane has that fear because her book agent or editor (not sure about the job title) suggests Jane put that in her book to "juice it up" so to speak. There's also some Rose stuff, she wants it the book to "juice it up." Now, the Rose stuff is meta because what she wanted actually ends up happening in reality later on in the episode.  5x16.  5x16 is a big Rose/Luisa episode. 

Edited by Simba122504

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On 6/14/2019 at 4:07 PM, CooperTV said:

So, what's left? Rose will probably be captured with Luisa's help. Petra and JR will get back together. There will be some sort of Mateo's true parentage issue (misdirection?).

I don't know.  So many spoilers and photos have been released that I don't think there are any big surprises left to come out.  Does anyone think there will be anything that happens that we don't know about?  Someone is supposed to die.  But do we really think that there is going to be any last minute twist that will surprise us and leave us gasping? 

"I know! Just like a telenovela!"

I mean, I hope and pray for something that hasn't been revealed by the spoilers and the sides, but I doubt that there will be anything.  What does everyone else think?

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4 hours ago, cardigirl said:

I mean, I hope and pray for something that hasn't been revealed by the spoilers and the sides, but I doubt that there will be anything.  What does everyone else think?

Michael will be back with some unexpected news (Raf's parents reveal? Mateo's parents reveal?), Magda will probably die. I think the last minute the LLN reveal would be either Mateo or Jafael's new baby? IDK

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2 hours ago, CooperTV said:

Michael will be back with some unexpected news (Raf's parents reveal? Mateo's parents reveal?), Magda will probably die. I think the last minute the LLN reveal would be either Mateo or Jafael's new baby? IDK

What new baby?

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https://toofab.com/2019/06/20/haley-lu-richardson-and-brett-dier-talk-relationship-secrets-tease-emotional-ending-to-jane-the-virgin-exclusive-video/

I enjoyed this article.  No real, "new," information, but lots of enthusiasm for the show.  (I want to read so much into what Brett is and is not saying, but I won't. Therein that way lies madness and regret.  LOL.) 

Edited by cardigirl

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Just found out there is no new episode on July 3, and that for the series finale, on July 31 (edited due to funnygirl's info), one of the two hours is a series retrospective, so I have less and less of hope of a "twist" that will turn things around (to my way of thinking #teammichael).  It's okay.  I have enjoyed the show, and the one surprise, the narrator, is still to come.  

#silentlyresolved

Edited by cardigirl

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2 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

Just found out there is no new episode on July 3, and that for the series finale, on July 24, one of the two hours is a series retrospective

The series finale is July 31st. 

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1 minute ago, funnygirl said:

The series finale is July 31st. 

Oh, thanks for that!  But it's supposed to be 2 hours and one hour is a retrospective, so . . . not new material.  

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OK, speculations for the final 5:

Petra's Assistant Krishna reveals she actually owns the Marbella since she never actually transferred the shares to Petra.

Jane is miraculously pregnant even though Raf is supposedly sterile from previous bout of cancer.

Raf's clumsiness is a sign of a cancerous brain tumor or some such. They marry. He dies. Or maybe not. Recovers, but he has amnesia. Or maybe not.

Petra dies in the crash (I hope momma dies too) or is in a coma or a PVS. Raf and Jane raise the twins.  Or maybe just Jane. 

Michael and Charlie are a couple. (That one is too easy.)

Still not sure who the Narrator is. It's not Mateo (the kid) due to heavy accent. None of the family, including Mateo himself, have heavy accents other than Abuela (and Jorge) and Ro. Unless it has something to do with the baby switch? 

OK, knock 'em down!

Edited by Ms Lark

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2 hours ago, Ms Lark said:

OK, speculations for the final 5:

Petra's Assistant Krishna reveals she actually owns the Marbella since she never actually transferred the shares to Petra.

Jane is miraculously pregnant even though Raf is supposedly sterile from previous bout of cancer.

Raf's clumsiness is a sign of a cancerous brain tumor or some such. They marry. He dies. Or maybe not. Recovers, but he has amnesia. Or maybe not.

Petra dies in the crash (I hope momma dies too) or is in a coma or a PVS. Raf and Jane raise the twins.  Or maybe just Jane. 

Michael and Charlie are a couple. (That one is too easy.)

Still not sure who the Narrator is. It's not Mateo (the kid) due to heavy accent. None of the family, including Mateo himself, have heavy accents other than Abuela (and Jorge) and Ro. Unless it has something to do with the baby switch? 

OK, knock 'em down!

OooOoOoh, not what I was thinking at all.  😉   Jane is acting like Michael so much with Rafael and we all know how that turned out for Michael, that I wonder if they are leading up to something BIG.

Krishna just might be playing a long game of some sort, but I don't see that.  However, I think the Marbella might bring Raf and Petra closer together. 

I hope Petra survives, I think she will. I want a happy ending for her. 

Michael and Charlie probably ARE a couple but that is TOO easy in my eyes.  I hope Michael is actively working to bring Sin Rostro down and reaches some sort of hero status. 

I know, I'm thinking way too hard about what the Narrator is really saying or not saying, but his little line about someone does change their mind later makes me W O N D E R 

Or you could be right, MS LARK.  Thanks for your speculations!

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2 hours ago, cardigirl said:

OooOoOoh, not what I was thinking at all.  😉   Jane is acting like Michael so much with Rafael and we all know how that turned out for Michael, that I wonder if they are leading up to something BIG.

Big like Raf's and Jane's wedding in the finale? That one is pretty much a given.

5 hours ago, Ms Lark said:

Petra dies in the crash (I hope momma dies too) or is in a coma or a PVS. Raf and Jane raise the twins.  Or maybe just Jane.  

2 hours ago, cardigirl said:

I hope Petra survives, I think she will. I want a happy ending for her. 

The promo pictures for the 5.15 show that Petra had some sort of a brace on her arm, otherwise she's perfectly fine.

5 hours ago, Ms Lark said:

Raf's clumsiness is a sign of a cancerous brain tumor or some such. They marry. He dies.

He had the same scene as Petra this season, with him being a car crash and the scene cutting to black (the same "GASP! Something terrible happened! *cut to black*" happened now with Xio, Ro, Petra and Raf).

3 hours ago, cardigirl said:

However, I think the Marbella might bring Raf and Petra closer together. 

I don't think they could get even closer at this point, she's a mother of his children and his future best man (and BFF). Petra/JR is going to be the endgame for Petra, because JR is coming back.

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3 hours ago, CooperTV said:

I don't think they could get even closer at this point, she's a mother of his children and his future best man (and BFF). 

I think Louisa will end up being his best man (after she helps take down Rose) when he remarries Petra.  *giggles hysterically*  I really do believe that Louisa will be standing next to Rafael at the wedding. 

Here's a link to some currently running theories.  

https://www.bustle.com/p/8-theories-about-how-jane-the-virgin-ends-so-you-can-mentally-prepare-for-the-worst-18142893

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I read the article, and some of those theories sound plausible. Although after reading the spoiler sides for the episodes that turned out to be 100% correct so far, I can just say that Rafael will marry Jane in the finale. There are going to be obstacles but it will happen.

My speculation is that Jane will not choose Michael and won't leave Raf at the altar (contrary to that Twitter theory from the article), nor she will leave Raf post-five-years time-jump to be with Michael. Because Jane and Michael is a story but Jane and Rafael is and always will be the story.

I agree Petra will get back together with JR. Luisa possibly will be Raf's second best man or whatever after she deals with the Rose situation (I'm assuming, along with Michael, since he's coming back with some unexpected news).

I think is that Raf/Jane's new baby will be the LLN (that will be shown in the time-jump or the last several seconds of the series finale). Although I'm still convinced Mateo is the LLN.

About season 5 being Jane's new book and the telenovela. I'd think that Michael/Jane fans would be more opposed to the idea of Jane writing herself into a perfect (yet complicated) romance with handsome, troubled but kind and generous man who looks exactly like her baby daddy Rafael while she's supposedly married to Michael in the real world. It's interesting idea, for sure. But not particularly... kind to Michael/Jane as a couple.

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