S09.E23: The Line Substitution Solution

[shapeshifter]

Quote

Sheldon hires Stuart to spend the day with Amy when he’d rather go to a movie screening. Also, Leonard’s mother, Beverly, comes to town and Penny struggles to make a connection with her.

I haven't seen this yet, so I'm hoping the promo monkeys are just teasing a retcon and that Beverly remembers when Penny was her "home girl."

[CherryAmes]

I doubt it, which bugs me.  The episode where she is so nasty about Leonard's engagement to Penny completely ignored that  home girl eppie as well,

[Squirrely]

The only outcome I was looking for was Penny telling Beverly she's a mentally and emotionally abusive bitch, so of course Leonard wouldn't want her to ruin his special day. I've never found any of the Beverly episodes remotely amusing. And why are we to believe she visits so often? To see Sheldon? Because Leonard is not at all important to her.

[Latverian Diplomat]

I've liked previous Beverly episodes, but this was very rote. The Middle just did a version of perceived-past-slight with a mother-in-law that was much better done, and it was the C plot.

Raj's stick chair seemed practical to me (especially if you spend as much time in queues as these guys seem to) and the attempts to make fun of it were feeble.

Stuart may have been pathetic again, but at least he made some extra cash.

[msani19]

It does seem odd that Beverly shows up this much to see a son she clearly has no love/affection for, she hasn't had her quota of emotional abuse? The part I did like was when Penny hugged her on the couch. That was kinda cute.Although, yeah Penny should have thrown her out. I have ZERO tolerance for people openly disrespecting me. The guys plot line was ok. Sheldon as per usual is an exhausting PITA.

How long was that episode?

[anna0852]

While I'm not fond of Beverly and was hoping Penny would be telling her off more, I have to say loved the game Penny and Sheldon were playing at the beginning. Both teaching the other what they know!

[Chaos Theory]

I don't watch this show enough to care about continuity I just care if it makes me laugh.  Several parts did.  I loved the opening with Sheldon and Penny and their flash cards.    I actually liked Penny trying to get in good with Leornards mom.  I think my favorite line was by Bernadette i forget the actual wording but she said something about Leonards mom loving Sheldon like a son and her son not so much.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Chaos Theory
Seriously got to stop typing these things at night

[kat165]

Bernadette was actually a good friend in this episode (or at least she was trying to be). That was refreshing.

[K-9]

When the Kardashian brunette woman appeared on the flashcard, I was shocked that Sheldon was accurate. Penny is infecting Sheldon's brain with pop culture celebrities. With his eidetic memory, Sheldon will have them stuck in his head for the rest of his life!

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, msani19 said:

How long was that episode?

If you subtract the back-from-break swirling atoms, about 17 minutes.

I did laugh once: At Leonard's stick chair joke: "The aliens left the probe in."

And I liked the flash cards at the beginning. They could've run with that throughout, given the shortness of the episode. I wonder what Beverly would have guessed for the Kardashian card.

Penny joyously hugging Beverly was also worth the time of watching. 

Couldn't Stuart set up a cartoon portrait stand at one of those lines and make some decent money for the evening?

[Gulftastic]

Much better use of Stuart this week. He got some funny stuff to do.

I love Sheldon expecting a high five for one of his petty points during the cutting debate.

I too wanted Penny to tell Beverly off bug style. Maybe, if next week is the small ceremony, we can see her and Leonard doing so.

[buffynut]

I realize the show is getting long in the tooth now, but what an un-sweeps-worthy episode that was.  I'm not sure if I laughed at all.  I did like the guys at the comic bookstore, but kept thinking "aren't they getting a bit old for that".  And the lineup for the movie seemed like it had been done many times before too. Maybe it's just me getting "old", but I miss the days when I used to really enjoy this show. 

[vibeology]

Maybe the reason Leonard didn't invite his mother to his wedding is because she has always acted like a hateful woman who has treated every milestone is his life like it is completely beneath her. For a smart woman, it seems strange that she can't figure that out. I hate, but understand why Penny wants to make her happy, but I do wish Leonard would have had the chance to call Beverly out instead. 

I loved the flash card game. That is exactly how I remember which Kardashian is which too. Also it makes me happy to see both Penny and Sheldon trying to grow. 

[MissLucas]

I actually enjoyed Stuart this episode. He was introduced back in the day as an artist, someone with imagination and creativity. He certainly delivered on those fronts as stand-in for enraged Amy. I also laughed at his impromptu insult of Raj and Howard promising him a reference.

I like Christine Baranski but that was certainly not her best episode. Still she was right to call out Penny on the wedding. Or maybe I'm just projecting. My brother went to Las Vegas to get married without telling anyone (hell, we live on another continent) and I thought him a ******* for doing that.

And I loved Howard's bathroom interview. Nobody will admit it but I'm pretty sure the majority of us have been doing stuff like that too.

[Gulftastic]

1 hour ago, buffynut said:

  I did like the guys at the comic bookstore, but kept thinking "aren't they getting a bit old for that".  . 

I'm older than the guys, and Wednesday is still 'New Comic bok day for me.

And this Saturday is 'Free comic book Day'! Get yourself down t your local store and sample some.

[adhoc]

Always dislike it when Beverly is on. Why on earth would Leonard want her at his wedding? So she could tear it down and toss out insults about it?

Sheldon's "cutting in line" rant was silly. Jeez, the character has to be approaching forty. Acting like a 12-year-old is not funny and not cute. The writers couldn't come up with anything else?  

But what actually bothered me the most was that Leonard, when talking to his wife, just refers to her as "Penny". Not "Sweetheart". Not "Honey".  In fact, watching the opening breakfast scene--or pretty much any scene this season--you would not have reason to believe they're newlyweds.  Would it have hurt him to say, "Come on, honey, please pick up my mom from the airport so I don't have to", for example? 

[CherryAmes]

Haven't seen this episode yet but I don't understand why Leonard and Penny should have even thought about inviting Mommy Dearest to their wedding.  She was a total bitch when Leonard told her was engaged and she has shot down every milestone in his life that we know about.  Leonard being in California has to be at least in part a way of putting a lot of miles between himself and his toxic mother.  Aside from all else it's not like they planned a wedding, they ran off to Las Vegas and got married.  If they'd had a big traditional wedding with all Penny's family there I could get the anger, as it was, it was just another excuse to be a bitch.  Oh and by the way where was Leonard's invitation to his mother's 60th birthday party again?

Edited May 6, 2016 by CherryAmes

[Driad]

Quote

Couldn't Stuart set up a cartoon portrait stand at one of those lines and make some decent money for the evening?

Yes.  It is disappointing that they have Flanderized the characters into one joke each.  If Stuart has to be a sad sack, why can't he be a sad but talented artist who might be discovered in one of these episodes?

[jmonique]

Wow. This was trying.

Sheldon pitching a bitch fit over the line cutter felt like it went on forever. It wasn't funny at all; it was obnoxious, overbearing and I still fail to see why Leonard hangs out with him, much less continues to let Sheldon dictate his living arrangements.

[Trey]

Just now, jmonique said:

Wow. This was trying.

Sheldon pitching a bitch fit over the line cutter felt like it went on forever. It wasn't funny at all; it was obnoxious, overbearing and I still fail to see why Leonard hangs out with him, much less continues to let Sheldon dictate his living arrangements.

Even though I agree with Sheldon 100%, it went on far too long. 

Best use of Stuart in a long time.

[MaryMitch]

1 minute ago, Trey said:

Even though I agree with Sheldon 100%, it went on far too long. 

Actually, I think it would have been pretty funny if the crowd got behind Sheldon on this one, because he was absolutely right.

I like episodes with Beverly, because I like Christine Baranski, but she is a horrible person. I sure wouldn't put up with her rudeness. I'd love to see Penny stand up to her.

[DarkRaichu]

Best use of Stuart in a long time.  I bet he made more money that night than from his comics store

Beverly did not get to guilt trip Penny&Leonard for not inviting her to the wedding due to how she treats Leonard all of his life.  Plus, the wedding must not have been very important to her since she would not have come anyway had she been invited. 

 

1 hour ago, whimsey98 said:

The thing about this episode and the last two is that they seem rather---hmmm--lacking in energy.  I don't mind them repeating tropes (waiting in line) and some things work pretty well (Howard pretending to be interviewed in the bathroom),  but there's no sense that they are doing anything but waiting for retirement. Their storylines are pretty much tied up.  Romances have been settled.  Jobs have been settled.  No one seems to be doing new research.  We're just waiting around (I guess for the baby).  It's just a little flat for me.  

sarcasm begins:

You need to give the writers a break.  They only had 17 minutes of show to do all that.

sarcasm ends

I am pretty sure next season BBT will have 14 minutes of actual show plus 16 minutes commercial

Edited May 6, 2016 by DarkRaichu

[LoneHaranguer]

4 hours ago, vibeology said:

I loved the flash card game. That is exactly how I remember which Kardashian is which too.

I loved the game too. That explanation actually doesn't fit someone with an eidetic memory, but that's consistent with the fact that eidetic memory is almost nonexistent in adults. I wonder if he's confronted the fact that he's losing one of the things that made him special; on some level he must have noticed.

[Bronzedog]

There were so many ads I almost gave up trying to watch this week.  When watching a show becomes tedious waiting for the show to continue, it's time to stop watching.

[Chaos Theory]

1 hour ago, whimsey98 said:

Sarcasm noted, but actually they've had several weeks to do all that (and they did), which is why I thought the show lacks any tension.  Really, most of the problems they come up with now are easily resolved.  Mother angry about not getting invited to wedding; okay, we'll have a second wedding just for her; problem solved.  Really?  My mother could hold a grudge for decades.  

But this isn't a drama it is a comedy hell its a sitcom.  I give sitcoms far more leeway for easy answers then I do dramas.   Unless the show decides to go dark or real like Mom does then I don't mind the "Lets throw another wedding so mother in law likes me" answer.

[holly4755]

I think of this show as a set up for next week. I can hardly wait to see Leonard's Father and mother interact. Are they divorced?  For some reason I thought they were still married. Anyways it will really be interesting to see Leonard's relationship with his father.

[caligirl50]

What a bad episode.  Nothing was funny.  I watched on my dvr and erased immediately after watching.

holly4755 - a few seasons ago, Beverly tells Leonard that his father cheated on her with a waitress and she was divorcing him.  The joke was Penny was a waitress at the time.

[theatremouse]

18 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

And I liked the flash cards at the beginning. They could've run with that throughout, given the shortness of the episode.

If they ran with it throughout that would've left even less time for the rest of what went on, given the shortness of the episode.

Of course I could have done with Sheldon's rant being halved...

10 hours ago, adhoc said:

But what actually bothered me the most was that Leonard, when talking to his wife, just refers to her as "Penny". Not "Sweetheart". Not "Honey".  In fact, watching the opening breakfast scene--or pretty much any scene this season--you would not have reason to believe they're newlyweds.

I don't find this at all unbelievable. Not everyone does petnames. And sure they're newlyweds but they've also been together for eons. I would've found it more distracting if they suddenly started acting much differently with each other. I don't usually associate the stereotypical "newlywed" behaviour with people who get married 8 years in.

[Chaos Theory]

I think it would be a great idea to have an actual on camera wedding just to see Leonards mother and Penny's father interact.  Considering Penny's father loves Leonard and well Leonards mother doesn't.    

[CherryAmes]

I agree -- I really hope the writers remember how much Penny's father loved Leonard though but I'm not counting on it.

Edited May 7, 2016 by CherryAmes

[anna0852]

I would absolutely love to see Penny's family giving a big old 'we love Leonard, you have no idea what you missed out on' f-you to Beverly. 

[hnygrl]

I only watched like the before the theme song part and the end. Middle? I changed the channel and forgot to change it back. Hey, Lip Synch Battle's on at the same time. And these days? It's Lip Synch Battle. I could watch it online but...why...?

Know what I think is gonna happen next week?
Sheldon's Mom and Leonard's dad are gonna knock boots.

And get caught.

In Sheldon's Bed.

By the whole damn crew. Hilarity ensues.

Geeze. Somebody SHOOT this horse already.

[Snarklepuss]

I have to admit it's never sat well with me the way they make Beverly's behavior humorous at Leonard's expense.  I know people with abusive mothers that put them down like that and there's nothing funny about it.  I've tried to lighten up about it but I can't.  And I think Leonard himself would not be anywhere near as well adjusted as he appears to be if he had a mother like that in "real life".  He'd be far more damaged goods than he is shown to be on the show.

[CherryAmes]

I don't get as annoyed about Beverly as I would if this wasn't a Chuck Lorre show.  In his world there are mighty few women older than 40 who aren't petty, manipulative shrews.  Sheldon's mother is a shining exception.  For me Beverly is just another version of Evelyn, Judith and Berta.  I sometimes wonder if Lorre hates his mother or if it's that he is paying alimony to a bunch of avaricious ex wives.

Edited May 7, 2016 by CherryAmes

[DrSpaceman73]

I always thought the reason Leonard seems to put up with and find a way to deal with Sheldon is because he is so much like his mother.  I doubt there was any forethought that went into it from the beginning.  That is giving Chuck Lorre and his creative team far too much credit for character development.  But it makes sense

 

I didn't feel too sorry for Beverly missing the wedding and was suprised it bothered her.  It's been made clear on multiple occasions she rarely informs Leonard of major events in her life (divorce, surgery, family events, etc), so turn about is fair play if you ask me.  

 

I don't see Bernadette being as bad as Beverly

[wendyg]

Cherry  Ames: I can only assume you haven't seen MOM. The array of women over 40 on that show is breathtaking.

[vibeology]

See I disagree. It's not the same thing. If I'm 10th in line and the guy in front of me swaps places with someone, I'm still 10th in line. But if the guy in front of me lets his friend join him, I'm 11th. One doesn't impact anyone else's place in line while the other does. What Sheldon did was cool and what the guy in front of him did was wrong. 

[shapeshifter]

7 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

Sheldon cut into the line just as much as the dude did in front of him, who wasn't replacing anyone in the line.  There aren't any swappsies in a line that by its very nature is first come first serve.  I have a feeling Sheldon would have complained if someone else pulled the same stunt he did, having someone used as a holding place in Sheldon's case Stuart, while that person went off to do something else, then have that person come back and take that spot they left.

 

4 hours ago, vibeology said:

See I disagree. It's not the same thing. If I'm 10th in line and the guy in front of me swaps places with someone, I'm still 10th in line. But if the guy in front of me lets his friend join him, I'm 11th. One doesn't impact anyone else's place in line while the other does. What Sheldon did was cool and what the guy in front of him did was wrong. 

Both of these make sense to me. I think the writers failed to articulate why Sheldon would have thought "swapsies" are okay (which vibeology does).

Icemiser69's post leaves room for the argument that those who can financially afford to pay someone to wait have an unfair advantage.

Edited May 8, 2016 by shapeshifter

[One Tough Cookie]

On ‎5‎/‎6‎/‎2016 at 9:17 AM, adhoc said:

But what actually bothered me the most was that Leonard, when talking to his wife, just refers to her as "Penny". Not "Sweetheart". Not "Honey".  In fact, watching the opening breakfast scene--or pretty much any scene this season--you would not have reason to believe they're newlyweds.  Would it have hurt him to say, "Come on, honey, please pick up my mom from the airport so I don't have to", for example? 

 

I've been married to the same man for 30+ years and we have NEVER called each other honey, sweetheart or any of the other nicknames.

I hate Beverly so much.  It's not funny it's cruel.

And I see absolutely no chemistry between Penny and Leonard.  None whatsoever.

[needschocolate]

On 5/6/2016 at 7:48 PM, msani19 said:

How long was that episode?

I don't know how long the episode was, but, during the middle-of-the-show commercial break I emptied the dishwasher, put away three loads of laundry, and repainted the bathroom.   Just kidding - I never watch the show live.  I can't because the my attention span is too short for their too long commercial breaks - i would wander off and not return.

On 5/6/2016 at 9:42 PM, K-9 said:

When the Kardashian brunette woman appeared on the flashcard, I was shocked that Sheldon was accurate. Penny is infecting Sheldon's brain with pop culture celebrities. With his eidetic memory, Sheldon will have them stuck in his head for the rest of his life!

Unfortunately, I think we are all doomed to have them stuck in our heads the rest of our lives.

On 5/7/2016 at 7:36 AM, DrSpaceman73 said:

I didn't feel too sorry for Beverly missing the wedding and was suprised it bothered her.  It's been made clear on multiple occasions she rarely informs Leonard of major events in her life (divorce, surgery, family events, etc), so turn about is fair play if you ask me.  

I thought that Beverly was going to say "I was joking" about the wedding, like she was joking in the car ride about asking Penny "How does it make you feel?" when Penny said she doesn't like to be psychoanalyzed.  Leonard never had a birthday party, doesn't get invited to her parties, etc...it would be in character for her not to care about being at the wedding.  Leonard is just one big research project to her

3 hours ago, vibeology said:

See I disagree. It's not the same thing. If I'm 10th in line and the guy in front of me swaps places with someone, I'm still 10th in line. But if the guy in front of me lets his friend join him, I'm 11th. One doesn't impact anyone else's place in line while the other does. What Sheldon did was cool and what the guy in front of him did was wrong. 

I thought the line cutting situation should be resolved by having the guy go to the end of the line, then, when the gang gets into the theater, they can't sit where they want, because Sheldon's movie theater spot is being saved for the line-cutter by his friends.  

But i guess the show run time wouldn't be long enough for that 

Edited May 8, 2016 by needschocolate

[SmithW6079]

22 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Icemiser69's post leaves room for the argument that those who can financially afford to pay someone to wait have an unfair advantage.

Welcome to the human race.  Those who can financially afford it always  have an advantage. I don't have an issue with Sheldon (or anyone) paying someone else to do a task for them. That's why there are assistants. 

I've reached the point where the sight of Raj and his sweater vests repulse me, even before he opens his mouth. 

[LoneHaranguer]

23 hours ago, needschocolate said:

Leonard never had a birthday party, doesn't get invited to her parties, etc...it would be in character for her not to care about being at the wedding.

She didn't, but not being invited meant that she didn't get the satisfaction of turning them down.

[hnygrl]

LoneHaraguer is right. Beverly said so at the end of the episode. Penny asked her if she'd sent her an invite would she have come and Beverly said "of course not"

And I think Bernadette WAS being passive/agressive about the wedding being live-streamed.

If you remember, NOBODY SAW the live stream since Sheldon and Amy were broken up and Sheldon was stalking her. When they got back to the computer, Leonard/Penny were holding up their wedding rings saying "we got married!"

Nobody saw them get married. I'm sure everyone wants that do-over.

I see why the show wants a do-over - great ending for the season, but in reality it would be a case of 'too damn bad. This was how WE wanted to do it and this is how we did it. Get over it."  I'm seriously hoping/praying that this coming season is the last.

I am so over this show.

[theatremouse]

On 5/8/2016 at 8:53 AM, needschocolate said:

I thought that Beverly was going to say "I was joking" about the wedding, like she was joking in the car ride about asking Penny "How does it make you feel?" when Penny said she doesn't like to be psychoanalyzed.  Leonard never had a birthday party, doesn't get invited to her parties, etc...it would be in character for her not to care about being at the wedding.  Leonard is just one big research project to her

I don't have it recorded to check the exact phrasing, but I didn't get the impression his mother was actually upset about not being invited to the wedding. I thought the structure of the exchange was something to the effect of Penny calling her out for being insulting and basically asking if she even knows what people generally find insulting, so Beverly cited not being invited as an example. It doesn't matter whether she would've wanted to attend. It is true that not inviting one's mother to one's wedding is often deemed offensive by most people. I buy that as a reasonable retort Beverly would give to give Penny pause. That's the thing about Beverly, she can cite any number of things that she personally doesn't give a shit about and personally wouldn't react to, but she knows what an average reaction is and will comment on it.

[caligirl50]

Whoever said Leonard and Penny have no chemistry, was correct.  I think it’s the way the characters are written.  They dated in real life and are good friends.  Penny used to be my favorite character. Not anymore. Also, they used to have character based stories; one character is the focus of an episode.  Now because there are so many characters on the show, the writers have too many stories to tell so no one gets a good story any longer.

The Barbarian Sublimation was my favorite episode.  Kaley was terrific as was Jim in the cafeteria.  

[rab01]

Whenever I see Leonard's mother now, I really really wish they continued with the therapist that Leonard saw who hated the mom's theories.  It would also be honestly interesting to me to put Jane Kaczmarek and Christine Baranski in the same scene because they usually play characters almost in different universes (Baranski is usually icy while Kaczmarek is usually warm on screen).  I know is not a realistic interaction for an actual therapist but could happen in sitcom land.

Also, I would like to meet Leonard's siblings. Were they treated much better by their mom? Were they just more resilient? Or, are they just as messed up as Leonard but they've been hiding it over the years?  (I'm guessing the last one is the route that Lorre would choose but I'd still like to see it.)

[caligirl50]

I think her visits are to see Sheldon. It is just sad they have written a character of a mother who truly doesn’t like her son....FOR NO REASON. He’s a good person but she doesn’t care about him. At all.  This is a comedy.  How is this a funny storyline?

[hnygrl]

Know what I think?

I think Leonard may have been an oops.

She's got the obligatory male and female children, conceived on purpose, and in the right order, acceptably smart and obedient.

I picture them having an extra glass of wine with dinner and making Leonard. She's pissed. But a psych so let's make the most of it. I should be able to get at least 5 books and an academic thesis out of this miska---errrr----kid...

Thus all the "experiments" from the time he was born (needy baby, greedy baby? Really?)

I don't think she ever really saw him as a man with emotions or thoughts worth noticing until very very VERY recently.

It shows in how Leonard acts. He can't take any rejection on any level from anyone for any reason. Thank GOD he never became a teacher. He'd kill himself if even one student didn't absolutely love him.

[Jobiska]

It's too bad Penny's flashcards didn't have some "which governmental agencies are most hated by the populace?" info in them, because I was anticipating Sheldon trying to get the crowd all worked up by the line jumper, with them not caring, and then him adding "and he works for the DMV!" and them turning on him (heh, just thought about it, no line jumping would be tolerated at the DMV!)

[LoneHaranguer]

15 hours ago, caligirl50 said:

It is just sad they have written a character of a mother who truly doesn’t like her son....FOR NO REASON.

He's the disappointing child. In a family where everyone has a PhD and is high-achieving, the kid who doesn't stop searching for Easter eggs until June isn't going to get any respect. I'm sure by that point, she'd already given up on him and that was a "just how dumb is he?" experiment.