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S02.E21: Connection Lost


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I am so sick of Henry. Then again, I just don't like Tim Daly at all, so maybe I would like the character more if it were played by an actor that didn't make EVERY. SINGLE. MOMENT. SO. EMOTIONALLY. EARNEST. After awhile, the overacting is distracting.

Edited by fivestone
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I am so sick of Henry. Then again, I just don't like Tim Daly at all, so maybe I would like the character more if it were played by an actor that didn't make EVERY. SINGLE. MOMENT. SO. EMOTIONALLY. EARNEST. After awhile, the overacting is distracting.

Hee. I like him well enough, but maybe we should be calling him Captain earnest Henry. Edited by shapeshifter
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I liked Henry when he was a college professor and not a CIA agent.  The chracters' personality, values and ethics are just so conflicting with what he's doing right now. 

 

I  half watch whenever Murphys Station, Russell, or the President is on the screen. It's all so dull. And, I like the actors that play Russell and the President.. 

 

Seriously,Matt is half Pakistani?

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I think I wouldn't mind if Henry were off the show but then I don't want a mopey, mourning Elizabeth so....

 

I just wish whatever the heck happens with this ginned-up dramatic storyline that Henry stops playing spy next season and goes back to showing up for only a few minutes each week; he's like the shark that zoomed in from under a rock at the bottom of the sea and is eating the show - sorry, I don't like TD either - but, still - it's to much with him at this point - for me....

Edited by roomtorome
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I think I would mind if Henry were off the show but then I don't want a mopey, mourning Elizabeth so....

 

I agree.  But I'd like to see a whole lot less Henry.  If necessary, they can fill up the minutes with more Stevie.  (And that is a suggestion I never saw myself making...)

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I like Henry (and Tim Daly) a lot and don't mind his struggles or his storyline. Sometimes likable people do unlikable things. That's how life rolls. I liked that he fessed up to Elizabeth almost immediately about lying to her and that she called him out for his pushing her to seek counseling but resisting for himself. Sounds about right to me. Henry's a great guy, but he's also a human being. I like that he's not perfect. He was too perfect early on anyway.

 

I had some trouble following this week's political story...probably because I was multitasking. So the foreign minister was in cahoots with the terrorists and the prime minister was killed by the angry mob? Why again?

 

Seriously,Matt is half Pakistani?

 

Sure. Why not? Geoffrey Arend is half Pakistani.

Edited by madam magpie
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I had some trouble following this week's political story...probably because I was multitasking. So the foreign minister was in cahoots with the terrorists and the prime minister was killed by the angry mob? Why again?

 

The Prime Minister was told about the Foreign Minister being in cahoots with the terrorists.  He said he would do something about it.  Whatever he did, it prompted the Foreign Minister to spill the beans (on Twitter) about the secret deal between the Prime Minister and the US to allow monitoring of the Pakistani nuclear weapons.  The Pakistani people saw this as a betrayal, and rioted.  When the PM foolishly drove out into the crowd, they pulled him from the car and killed him.

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I like Henry (and Tim Daly) a lot and don't mind his struggles or his storyline.   likable people do unlikable things. That's how life rolls. I liked that he fessed up to Elizabeth almost immediately about lying to her and that she called him out for his pushing her to seek counseling but resisting for himself. Sounds about right to me. Henry's a great guy, but he's also a human being. I like that he's not perfect. He was too perfect early on anyway.

Great perspective as usual. The Henry/Elizabeth back and forth this week should put them back on track. The early scene at the shooting range with the Murphy Station folks pretty much ensures that Henry will be the one that kills the terrorist target, Jibral Disah. IMO. Hopefully, there will be a realistic gun battle else why hide him in a residential neighborhood.

Edited by VinceW
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I had some trouble following this week's political story...probably because I was multitasking. So the foreign minister was in cahoots with the terrorists and the prime minister was killed by the angry mob? Why again?

The Prime Minister was told about the Foreign Minister being in cahoots with the terrorists. He said he would do something about it. Whatever he did, it prompted the Foreign Minister to spill the beans (on Twitter) about the secret deal between the Prime Minister and the US to allow monitoring of the Pakistani nuclear weapons. The Pakistani people saw this as a betrayal, and rioted. When the PM foolishly drove out into the crowd, they pulled him from the car and killed him.

I thought Bess and the prez decided to leak info to see if there was a direct connection between the Pakistani govt and the not-Alquaida. And, sure 'nuff, there was. But I'm not sure. Edited by shapeshifter
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I thought Bess and the prez decided to leak info to see if there was a direct connection between the Pakistani govt and the not-Alquaida. And, sure 'nuff, there was. But I'm not sure.

Elizabeth gave the Foreign Minister bogus account number information to test the Pakistani government connection, but it was not until Dalton and Elizabeth confronted the Prime Minister with the surveillance video about the Hizb al-Shahid connection that all parties realized that the Foreign Minister was the traitor.

Edited by VinceW
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Over the top po'd with the Murphy team going out and acting like operatives when their mission from the start was to provide speedier access to information and advice to the president and his top agency people, like the Secretary of State. There are no CIA agents or Delta Force types in Pakistan who are capable of doing the dirty work Henry and the other guy took it upon themselves to do? I don't know why Elizabeth has a staff anymore. They never have to do any work, because Henry and his pals are sucking up all the oxygen on this show.

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Not the smartest PM on the block, was he?   That woman with the stick got hers in quick; looked like she went right for the family jewels.

 

Did anyone catch the look on Jane's face after the two guys decided on a pub crawl?  Sheer frustration, "You guys are going out and I have to go to a dinner?."

 

Dead Pool - Jane or Jose'?

 

Another scene I liked.  IN the WH, the group is debating the insertion of troops to safeguard the nuclear weapons.  The President says, "It will lead to widespread chaos."  As opposed to what's going on right now?

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Not the smartest PM on the block, was he?   That woman with the stick got hers in quick; looked like she went right for the family jewels.

 

Did anyone catch the look on Jane's face after the two guys decided on a pub crawl?  Sheer frustration, "You guys are going out and I have to go to a dinner?."

 

Dead Pool - Jane or Jose'?

ifee 

Another scene I liked.  IN the WH, the group is debating the insertion of troops to safeguard the nuclear weapons.  The President says, "It will lead to widespread chaos."  As opposed to what's going on right now?

 Jose - He told Henry at the bar not to worry because he will have his back in Pakistan.  Jose has kids too. Reminds me of Fred Cole losing his life in Iran while protecting Elizabeth during the coup attempt.

Edited by VinceW
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I like Henry (and Tim Daly) a lot and don't mind his struggles or his storyline. Sometimes likable people do unlikable things. That's how life rolls. I liked that he fessed up to Elizabeth almost immediately about lying to her and that she called him out for his pushing her to seek counseling but resisting for himself. Sounds about right to me. Henry's a great guy, but he's also a human being. I like that he's not perfect. He was too perfect early on anyway.

 

I had some trouble following this week's political story...probably because I was multitasking. So the foreign minister was in cahoots with the terrorists and the prime minister was killed by the angry mob? Why again?

 

<SO Matt is half-Pakistani?> Sure. Why not? Geoffrey Arend is half Pakistani.

Agreed - I so love their marriage. I was so glad he immediately fessed up.

 

The prime minister being dragged from the car was so awful. For whatever reason, it didn't bother me as much when they did it on Homeland. I had to close my eyes.

 

Not to speak for MYTHOUGHTS, but for me - I was surprised at this not because it wasn't believable, but because it is preposterous to me that we didn't know this until now. Or, at least if the audience didn't know, that Bebe was startled to learn it. At no time before now did this come up? If only anecdotally considering how much Pakistan has been part of the SoS's agenda?!?

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Not to speak for MYTHOUGHTS, but for me - I was surprised at this not because it wasn't believable, but because it is preposterous to me that we didn't know this until now. Or, at least if the audience didn't know, that Bebe was startled to learn it. At no time before now did this come up? If only anecdotally considering how much Pakistan has been part of the SoS's agenda?!?

 

Yes, this was my not-well-stated point.   Seems to me that something like that would have been established, and referred to in the show before. 

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I know this may sound a bit silly but I kept thinking about any of my old college profs going all CIA/Seals/Special Forces/boots on the ground.

 

Okay, I majored in drama but...crikey.

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Dead Pool - Jane or Jose'?

Jose, of course. His number was up from Early O'Clock in the episode.
For me it's José because in this episode he and Henry (nearly kissed and) made up. Once the Darth Vader character has turned into Andy Griffith, the end for that character is near. At least, most of the time.

I suppose it could be Jane if the writers are worried that she looks too other-woman-ish, and they want to nip those speculations.

ETA: It might be both. They have a bloated cast (see the rest of Dowel Jones' post), and it would be a good way to end Murphy Station and Henry's spy job.

Edited by shapeshifter
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Jose' is definitely dead.  He got along with Dr. Professor Nuclear Physicist Perfect Father/Husband Savior Henry AND provided tips of "Here's how you always make it home alive;"  as soon as he did, I was like "Yep, goner."

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I do think Jose is a goner, not just because he's gotten nicer in recent weeks but because he gave that whole speech about how acting out of passion will get you killed and then he acted out of passion. I also think Henry will kill Jibral Disah; that's fitting given his involvement in bringing the daughter to the US and it will allow him redemption for Dmitri and Talia. I don't think they'll kill of Jill Hennessey. She's not really any threat to the Elizabeth/Henry relationship, she's an established character, and I think she's fairly well-liked.

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Jose' is definitely dead.  He got along with Dr. Professor Nuclear Physicist Perfect Father/Husband Savior Henry AND provided tips of "Here's how you always make it home alive;"  as soon as he did, I was like "Yep, goner."

...just like Buttercup.

And interesting that neither Bess nor Henry can keep a fish tank alive. When Henry makes it home alive, he's gonna have some 'splaining to do. Also: leaving his phone in an open briefcase in an embassy that's being evacuated? Slick move.

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I do think Jose is a goner, not just because he's gotten nicer in recent weeks but because he gave that whole speech about how acting out of passion will get you killed and then he acted out of passion. I also think Henry will kill Jibral Disah; that's fitting given his involvement in bringing the daughter to the US and it will allow him redemption for Dmitri and Talia. I don't think they'll kill of Jill Hennessy. She's not really any threat to the Elizabeth/Henry relationship, she's an established character, and I think she's fairly well-liked.

The early scene at the shooting range with Murphy Station pretty much ensures that Henry will be the one that kills the terrorist target, Jibral Disah. Henry killing him will fast track the remaining therapy sessions in order to avoid dragging that issue on much longer. If Jose does get killed that would pretty much end the task force unless there is a plan by the writers to carry that element into season 3. Jane gives Henry some credibility  working with him in intelligence. He needs somebody to interact with outside of Elizabeth's command group.

Edited by VinceW
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So I think they should change the name of the show from "Madam Secretary" to "Madam Secretary's husband. This show has shifted too much away from her, her staff and their jobs. They are trying to shoe horn Henry and his team in too much they are taking over and I am not liking this turn! I must be an awful person because I was hoping Henry would bite it because he has been getting on my last nerve lately!

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What is it with Professor Tight Pants and his constant drinking? Not only alcohol but coffee. He must have to pee a lot because he's never without a beverage in his hand.

I agree that PTP has become far too much of a focus on the show. I'm wondering if it's because Tea is an executive producer and she's supposed to be in a personal relationship with Tim Daley?

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Totally agree on the totally ridiculous revelation about Matt's ethnicity. There is NO way that wouldn't have come up well before this and that the rest of the staff wouldn't know about it.

 

So whatever happened to Russell? He's been MIA in the last two episodes, right? I hope he didn't end up like Buttercup.

Edited by J-Man
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Quote

So I think they should change the name of the show from "Madam Secretary" to "Madam Secretary's husband.

 

Now see, I would fight for the show's name changing to "Madam Secretary and Blake, Her Trusty Assistant."

 

Quote

Totally agree on the totally ridiculous revelation about Matt's ethnicity.

 

Agreed...do we have to worry about sparks flying between Matt and Nadine?

Edited by MaryHedwig
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So I think they should change the name of the show from "Madam Secretary" to "Madam Secretary's husband. This show has shifted too much away from her, her staff and their jobs. They are trying to shoe horn Henry and his team in too much they are taking over and I am not liking this turn! I must be an awful person because I was hoping Henry would bite it because he has been getting on my last nerve lately!

If you are awful, I must be some kind of crazy [anyone can fill in hip, snarky, or scholarly term here] fan, because even though Henry's plots invariably bug me, and even though I would rather see more of the other main characters who work with Bess, I still don't think it deserves a title change, and, more importantly, I still like Henry.

I think the word "denial" fits somewhere into my fan type description for this show.

Now see, I would fight for the show's name changing to "Madam Secretary and Blake, Her Trusty Assistant.

Agreed...do we have to worry about sparks flying between Matt and Nadine?

Argh. Hope not. Good line for Nadine:

Blake, Matt, if I had a son, I would hope he would be like you.

Edited by shapeshifter
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Great perspective as usual. The Henry/Elizabeth back and forth this week should put them back on track. The early scene at the shooting range with the Murphy Station folks pretty much ensures that Henry will be the one that kills the terrorist target, Jibral Disah. IMO. 

Right. Because that's exactly what we need to see. Captain Superhero personally being the one who saves the day/has the meaty storyline rather than the show's title character.  At least this time the asshole is putting himself in danger for a different reason (peer pressure) rather than more basic angst/selfishness.

 

Also, isn't it jarring when Russell Jackson is there bossing everyone short of the President around one week and is totally absent the next week?

 

"Pictures or it didn't happen". What a totally Millennial thing for Elizabeth to say (not saying she IS one, just that someone who is maybe put words in her mouth).

 

It's a 23 episode season, not a 22 episode one, otherwise I'd be assuming something really bad with Captain Douchebag (or a cliffhanger) would be next. But with an extra episode to play with that seems unlikely.

Edited by Kromm
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On 4/26/2016 at 11:49 PM, Texasmom1970 said:

So I think they should change the name of the show from "Madam Secretary" to "Madam Secretary's husband. This show has shifted too much away from her, her staff and their jobs. They are trying to shoe horn Henry and his team in too much they are taking over and I am not liking this turn! I must be an awful person because I was hoping Henry would bite it because he has been getting on my last nerve lately!

Brace yourself. The early spoiler for the finale suggests that Dalton considers replacing Elizabeth as SoS which portends that the show title might be changed to 'Murphy Station' for season 3. Elizabeth then becomes a recurring character. Dalton creates a new cabinet position for Henry. Henry gets his own security detail including Secret Service protection.

Edited by VinceW
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On April 26, 2016 at 11:31 PM, shapeshifter said:

So I think they should change the name of the show from "Madam Secretary" to "Madam Secretary's husband. This show has shifted too much away from her, her staff and their jobs. They are trying to shoe horn Henry and his team in too much they are taking over and I am not liking this turn! I must be an awful person because I was hoping Henry would bite it because he has been getting on my last nerve lately!

If you are awful, I must be some kind of crazy [anyone can fill in hip, snarky, or scholarly term here] fan, because even though Henry's plots invariably bug me, and even though I would rather see more of the other main characters who work with Bess, I still don't think it deserves a title change, and, more importantly, I still like Henry.
I think the word "denial" fits somewhere into my fan type description for this show.
 

Now see, I would fight for the show's name changing to "Madam Secretary and Blake, Her Trusty Assistant.


Agreed...do we have to worry about sparks flying between Matt and Nadine?

Argh. Hope not. Good line for Nadine:
Blake, Matt, if I had a son, I would hope he would be like you.

I don't see why Matt and Nadine can't be friends or why it's unbelievable that his mother's ethnicity didn't come up before. I don't sit around discussing ethnicities with people at work, and yes, mine is a pretty political office.

 

I also don't get the intense hatred of Henry. Good lord. He's just a spy character on a TV show, and it's not like his wife is suddenly relegated to the background. She is still the Secretary of State, after all. The title isn't going to change. Elizabeth won't be replaced. This is still Tea's show. Dang.

Edited by madam magpie
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28 minutes ago, madam magpie said:

He's just a spy character on a TV show

Yep, he's just a Pilot Religion Professor of Ethics NSA Handler Islam Expert Arm Candy Extraordinaire. Anyone could do what Henry can do. They are just not trying enough to be the Gary Stuest Gary Stu ever.

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1 hour ago, CooperTV said:

Yep, he's just a Pilot Religion Professor of Ethics NSA Handler Islam Expert Arm Candy Extraordinaire. Anyone could do what Henry can do. They are just not trying enough to be the Gary Stuest Gary Stu ever.

And Elizabeth is a gorgeous former CIA analyst professor genius great mom with spectacular clothes who married before she graduated college, maintains a relationship many people would kill for, somehow got a PhD while working as a spy, and then went from teaching college at UVA to being a Secretary of State...and is always the one who comes up with the winning plan to solve the president's problem of the week. Henry is no different from his wife or most other TV characters in his over-the-top accomplishments. That's how TV shows work most of the time.

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14 minutes ago, madam magpie said:

And Elizabeth is a gorgeous former CIA analyst professor genius great mom with spectacular clothes who married before she graduated college, maintains a relationship many people would kill for, somehow got a PhD while working as a spy, and then went from teaching college at UVA to being a Secretary of State...and is always the one who comes up with the winning plan to solve the president's problem of the week. Henry is no different from his wife or most other TV characters in his over-the-top accomplishments. That's how TV shows work most of the time.

And yet she had a pass many many many career oriented women have in real life, because career women who want family have to be superheroes or they're slobs (by our society's standards). She's not a Mary Sue. Henry definitely is a Mary Sue, and he was deliberately pushed in the foreground this season at expense of Elizabeth and her storylines. That's an actual fact we're seeing with our own eyes, and it's as indefensible as it could be at this point.

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22 hours ago, VinceW said:

Brace yourself. The early spoiler for the finale suggests that Dalton considers replacing Elizabeth as SoS which portends that the show title will be changed to 'Murphy Station' for season 3. Elizabeth then becomes a recurring character. Dalton creates a new cabinet post position for Henry. Henry gets his own security detail including Secret Service protection.

And I'll be tipping my hat to you all, and departing by the closest exit.

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3 hours ago, Netfoot said:

And I'll be tipping my hat to you all, and departing by the closest exit.

I knew that would get your attention....

Edited by VinceW
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23 hours ago, madam magpie said:

I also don't get the intense hatred of Henry. Good lord. He's just a spy character on a TV show, and it's not like his wife is suddenly relegated to the background. She is still the Secretary of State, after all. The title isn't going to change. Elizabeth won't be replaced. This is still Tea's show. Dang.

A voice of reason; A successful, principled woman would want the same for her husband; Normal

Edited by VinceW
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2 hours ago, VinceW said:

I knew that would get your attention....

What?  I signed up for Madam Secretary.  Not Hardcore Henry One-Ups The Little Woman.  I watch shows that I like.  If TPTB change the show into something that I don't like, I stop watching.  

If they want a show about SuperHenry so bad, why not spin him off into a show of his own?

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19 minutes ago, Netfoot said:

What?  I signed up for Madam Secretary.  Not Hardcore Henry One-Ups The Little Woman.  I watch shows that I like.  If TPTB change the show into something that I don't like, I stop watching.  

If they want a show about Super Henry so bad, why not spin him off into a show of his own?

Elizabeth has not lost any stature in the show because of Henry's spy adventures;Exaggeration;Besides, the ABC network is doing just that now on the Castle series with Nathan Fillion at the expense of Stana Katic. Pathetic.

Edited by VinceW
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4 minutes ago, VinceW said:

Elizabeth has not lost any stature in the show because of Henry's spy adventures

She now gets less airtime than Henry, and her airtime is mostly about chocolate chip cookies, while his is about single-handedly finding and eliminating the World's Baddest Terrorist.  And if there is any substance to your "Brace yourself" post...

7 minutes ago, VinceW said:

Besides, the ABC network is doing just that on the Castle series with Nathan Fillion at the expense of Stana Katic. Pathetic.

You do realize that the show is about Nathan Fillion, right?  The show's name is Castle, not Beckett...

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23 hours ago, Netfoot said:

She now gets less airtime than Henry, and her airtime is mostly about chocolate chip cookies, while his is about single-handedly finding and eliminating the World's Baddest Terrorist.  And if there is any substance to your "Brace yourself" post...

You do realize that the show is about Nathan Fillion, right?  The show's name is Castle, not Beckett...

Typical network talking point. From the beginning, the Castle series was about a writer and his muse; the story was never just about Fillion. Viewers watch for the Caskett relationship. Since last season, the network has forced changes in the story line which emphasize frat boy humor and sexism resulting in a big drop in the ratings.

Edited by VinceW
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The thing that bugs me about Jose Deadmeat is that he has informants who give him extremely accurate information...except when it doesn't serve the plot. And he often says they are not the most trustworthy people. So on the sayso of one of his informants, Murphy Station is off to capture the bad guy...in the midst of what seems to be a civil war. 

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The whole purpose of sending your secret think-tank Murphy Station into a country on the border of civil unrest escapes me. Don't they have folks on the ground to do their bidding? Why did they have to be there?

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1 hour ago, kwnyc said:

The thing that bugs me about Jose Deadmeat is that he has informants who give him extremely accurate information...except when it doesn't serve the plot. And he often says they are not the most trustworthy people. So on the sayso of one of his informants, Murphy Station is off to capture the bad guy...in the midst of what seems to be a civil war. 

Jose (Rambo) is going to get the team killed. It is hard to imagine a religious professor in a gun battle. I look for Jane to keep Henry safe for Elizabeth and the kids. David Grae is the writer which gives me hope for a good ending. The season finale next week must be an all Russian episode. Neither Jane or Jose are listed as recurring in the finale.

Edited by VinceW
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3 hours ago, thewhiteowl said:

The whole purpose of sending your secret think-tank Murphy Station into a country on the border of civil unrest escapes me. Don't they have folks on the ground to do their bidding? Why did they have to be there?

The purpose is to put Henry in danger so that either Bess has to worry about him, or Bess can get mad at him for brekign his promise, or both, and to give Henry an action hero story line, and ... Oh wait, I bet you meant what is the purpose in a real life sort of way.  There isn't one.   

3 hours ago, VinceW said:

Jose (Rambo) is going to get the team killed. It is hard to imagine a religious professor in a gun battle. I look for Jane to keep Henry safe for Elizabeth and the kids. David Grae is the writer which gives me hope for a good ending. The season finale next week must be an all Russian episode. Neither Jane or Jose are listed as recurring in the finale.

It was hard to imagine a religious professor as a spy handler, or as a spy, or as the guy who runs into the radiation filled building, or, even, as a guy who could fix his own washing machine.

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