S04.E18: Eleven-Fifty-Nine

[Julie335]

 

Can not wait to quit this show after next week. She didn't even die a hero and she had to spend her last moments on Earth encouraging Oliver to get back with Felicity. 

I feel for the Laurel fans. I was not a Laurel fan, but this was a sh*tty way to go out.

 

Who the "love of her life" was has no bearing, as her life was cut short at a (relatively) young age. She just hadn't had the chance to meet the love of her life yet.

 

That was so unnecessary for them to make her say that. Plus he didn't even say "I love you" (back) like the rest of the team did. Ollie 1.0 in no way deserved Laurel, that felt like rubbing salt in the wound. 

 

I think my head canon will say Laurel knocked her head after getting stabbed and that's why she was saying that ridiculousness about Ollie being the love of her life... 

[johntfs]

Laurel will return as a demon named Ruby.  It turns out that Arrow is just the origin story for Katie Cassidy's character in Supernatural...

[Sakura12]

They handled Laurel's death the same way they've handled her character for 4 seasons. Meaning they didn't seem to care at all. She was basically an afterthought in her own death. They had Oliver and Laurel share a "moment" that we couldn't hear, then we went to the hallway with the rest of the characters, then the next scene she was flat lining. I'm not even really sure what happened. For a second there I thought Oliver killed her or something. That's how much sense it made. 

[Delphi]

There was no Oliver half. It was always a picture of just her. Maybe I'm weird, but I have ONE pic of just me, at the Rachel Nevada alien diner, and I can't imagine giving it to a dude to remember me.

I'm younger than Oliver and a bit older than Thea. Pictures used to be the thing until phones started making selfies a thing. Plenty of my friends, not me, had photos taken in duplicate to give to friends and lovers. It's stupid but fits.

[catrox14]

Rest in Peace, Laurel. 

Laurel will return as a demon named Ruby.  It turns out that Arrow is just the origin story for Katie Cassidy's character in Supernatural...

 

YOU SHUT YOUR FACE HOLE. LOL Jared Padelecki would never let Ruby not be his wife again LOL.

[Chaser]

So that was bad.

 

Super boring. I missed Felicity. I laughed when I probably shouldn't have. That send off to Laurel was terrible. Whoever said it was a checklist was so right and that just made it awful.

 

All the Oliver and Laurel scenes were terrible. SA looked like he was going thru the motions. He was checked out. So was KC for that matter. They showed some life at the end but it still didn't work. It was too much BS. I couldn't even feel anything in the hallway with Lance and Oliver because I was busy shaking my head.

 

I still have no idea what is going on with the flashbacks. 

 

I totally kind of called this. Grave: Laurel. Episode: 18. DD proving he was a Big Bag by making good on his threat to Lance and killing Laurel. Best game of Clue ever.

[catrox14]

Laurel definitely got the you're going to die episode. That stupid picture was mentioned more time in this episode than it has in 3 years. Why is Laurel carrying around a picture of herself? Shouldn't she have the Oliver half? Or I guess self involved until the end. 

 

Laurel died as she lived, pretending she was someone else. 

[A Cunning Stunt]

Finally Laurel is dead - a move that should've happened in season 1. Now it's just the burial to tick off the checklist so the show can move forward.

I appreciate callbacks, but it did seem a somewhat pathetic departure with the photo/love of my life comment. I think a father and daughter moment would have been much better placed there, and might have actually been moving as Paul would've knocked that out of the park.

Overall the episode dragged, and was somewhat underwhelming (especially the flashbacks) but I was glad to see a few more Diggle moments.

[AyChihuahua]

I thought she ripped off her half of the picture of the two of them? That must've been another show. So she carries around a bunch of pictures of herself? One she gave to Oliver and one she kept in her wallet all these years? The fuck? Who does that? A reminder of me and you together is a picture of me. 

Basically, yes. It was like a half glamour shot/half passport photo. Was always just her.

 

So, I am heartless, I guess, although I'd fight a mountain lion for my dogs. LL's death did zero for me. Everyone's reactions did zero for me. I'm a tiny bit embarrassed for her, in the sense that she's apparently been pining for Oliver this whole time, but that's it. And I don't give a flying fart about the lack of the ICONIC ROMANCE, because it was never there in the show. The very first thing she said to him in-show was that she hoped he'd spend more than five years in Hell. That's unforgivable, by which I mean truly IS NOT TO BE FORGIVEN. Add in the anti-chem and KC's absolute and total lack of physical coordination, and I couldn't be more meh. I'm far more irritated that Oliver's and Digg's ability to strategize went bye-bye.

[apinknightmare]

I'm younger than Oliver and a bit older than Thea. Pictures used to be the thing until phones started making selfies a thing. Plenty of my friends, not me, had photos taken in duplicate to give to friends and lovers. It's stupid but fits.

 

It's fine that she gave him a picture. What's weird is that he gave it back, and she carried it around with her, lol. 

[Sakura12]

This episode had Laurel in the spot of lead female and I was so bored throughout the entire episode. I'm glad the EP's realized early on that the Laurel character was not fit for that part. I remember being bored with her scenes in Season 1 as well. Nice to know my opinion would not have changed. 

[Gizmo321]

Both KC and LL deserved better than this episode. And I'm over Malcom versus Thea. Enough already...she's said she's done with way too many times. It's getting old. I'm also over Damien and HIVE. I think this was the episode that pushed me over the edge of no longer caring. I suspect I won't be watching next week or the rest of the season. Sloppy writing....lack of attention to detail....just ugh.....

[Midnight Lullaby]

Very boring episode, can't wait for 20-23 because I'm not that interested in the next one either.

The death was underwhelming, Laurel carrying her own picture she gave to Oliver just after he hid her sister on the Gambit was very cringeworthy, but never as her telling him he is the love of her life. He cheated on her with every available woman he could find, her sister included, now is in love with someone in a way he never was with her and she still told him that? Yikes. I thought since a fan of hers co wrote the ep she would have let her keep her dignity.

But Felicity and Dig hugged! So there's that I guess.

Poor Lance and poor Dig. They aren't going to take it well.

[grandemocha]

 

I'm glad the EP's realized early on that the Laurel character was not fit for that part.

Well, they wrote this iteration of Laurel Lance, and they obviously can't write for shit, so the blame partly lies with them. Shitty writers will inevitably produce a mess of a show. Stephen "wooden as hell" Amell isn't exactly lighting up the TV every week with his turn as Oliver Queen either, so its not like Laurel/Katie was the only issue on the show. There's plenty to go around.

 

Time for me to check out LOT and Supergirl. Hopefully those shows treat female superheroes better than Arrow. Good riddance to this hot mess of a show.

Edited April 7, 2016 by grandemocha

[A Cunning Stunt]

This episode had Laurel in the spot of lead female and I was so bored throughout the entire episode. I'm glad the EP's realized early on that the Laurel character was not fit for that part. I remember being bored with her scenes in Season 1 as well. Nice to know my opinion would not have changed.

This episode was like a glimpse into how monumentally dull the show would've been had they not fortunately stumbled upon a better dynamic. Praise the heavens for the Dig/Oliver/Felicity combination, because there is no way I would've stuck with it this far otherwise.

[quarks]

So that was underwhelming.

 

Also, as someone else noted on my timeline, the Star City hospital system is just terrible, isn't it?

 

Good things:

 

1. Thea.  Willa Holland's been upping her game all season, and this was a strong episode for her - her nice speech about realizing that Malcolm really wasn't her father anymore; her two fights with him and her inability to kill him, and then coming in and shooting Damien with two arrows. I also liked her muted performance at the end.  

 

2. Paul Blackthorne conveying Quentin's shock at the end. I also really liked his scene with Laurel at the Chinese restaurant.

 

3. Team Arrow was back to THINKING! Ok, that was mostly just Oliver, but still - taking the stone out of the idol! Realizing that Andy was playing them! Realizing that keeping an eye on the city/Ruve was more important than vigilanting - most of the time!

 

4. We got to hear Damien Darhk declaiming Shakespeare! YAY!  

 

I also loved his pointing out to Team Arrow just how terrible they are at concealing their secret identities.  

 

5. The commercial for the Star Wars DVD/Blu-ray, which I honestly forgot was coming out this week, so thanks, Arrow, for reminding me!

 

Questionable things:

 

1. Keeping Felicity mostly out of this episode mostly served to remind me how much more I enjoy Arrow when she's in it - as with "The Magician" episode last season. But I think it was the wiser move to keep her out of this - it allowed Arrow to focus on those fight scenes in the lair without worrying about how to handle the non-combatant, which in turn let Laurel have a shining moment and let Arrow give that Thea/Malcolm fight some emotional weight.

 

2. But, that said - uh, Team Arrow. You're about to go into Iron Heights prison, which includes bad guys from TWO DIFFERENT SHOWS and Damien Darhk and Malcolm Merlyn, and you don't think to either call Felicity to ask her for backup just this one time, or, if that's really such a problem, Curtis? Or even Cisco? Bad move, Team Arrow. Bad move.

 

3. And that's before we even talk about having a secret lair that the League of Assassins can just hop into whenever. And I was just starting to praise your intelligence here, Team Arrow!

 

4. I thought the League of Assassins was disbanded? I feel I have missed part of the plot.

 

5. The Iron Heights library lets a guy who SEWED HIS OWN LIPS SHUT hand out the library books and nobody has a problem with this?

 

6. Star City offers 24/7 protection service to its DAs? a) Since when, and b) why were they not doing this back in at LEAST season two, given that we'd had about three DAs dead and/or kidnapped at that point?

 

7. Well, at least the flashbacks got sorta relevant this episode and people died and things went bang. Unfortunately, Arrow, you have yet to make me care about any of these prisoners or the guards that got shot, and since I now know that the glowy idol does things, I'm not overly concerned about Reiter's survival either. But I do have a question: just how often do you have to kill people to feed the glowy idol thing, and many prisoners/guards does Reiter have left that he can kill off?

 

Bad things:

 

1. Arrow, Flash, any chance we can all get together, as a group, and decide what the entrance to Iron Heights prison looks like? This is entrance number eleven, at least, and this particular entrance was not improved from its previous use as an entrance to a Russian prison on Arrow and in a couple of Flash scenes last year.

 

2. While we're at it, Arrow, Flash, given the high injury rate on your shows, any chance of letting your doctors have an actual ER that patients can be brought to, instead of forcing poor Oliver and Barry to rush through the hospital looking for the one patient room and then making the doctors rush in to conduct surgery there? Or maybe - this is a radical thought, but work with me here - have an actual surgical room so we can be spared these ongoing scenes of doctors trying to conduct surgery in the one hospital room in Star and Central City? 

 

3. Though I can sorta see why no one wants to spend a lot of money building hospitals in either city. The doctors on this show suck. As evidence, I point to the stickers ON TOP of the hospital gown. What was that?  Can the Lances sue the hospital for malpractice? 

 

4. Andy's "going evil" turn felt incredibly telegraphed, partly because - not to remind you of previous plots, Arrow - we saw virtually this identical plot in the first season.

 

5. My bigger problem, however, wasn't that it was a repeat of the plot, but that Diggle was so insistent on believing in his brother, despite plenty of pretty strong evidence to suggest otherwise. In the first season, at least, Arrow had the excuse that Diggle correctly thought that Oliver was off his rocker and the guy in question had previously been a standup guy. In this case, Diggle knew that Andy had screwed up frequently before joining the army, and had then joined H.I.V.E. and failed to tell his wife and kid he was alive - and that was before Oliver caught Andy searching Diggle's apartment and the suspiciously easy save at the beginning of the episode. So, Oliver and Laurel figured it out, the audience figured it out, and Diggle, who has generally been a lot brighter than this and who didn't trust Andy when Andy initially returned, didn't? Not buying it, Arrow, even if Andy did get shot by an arrow.

 

6. I really didn't like the subplot that kept Quentin away from Laurel's bedside in the end. I realize the show wanted to make that an Oliver and Laurel moment, and this is Oliver's show, but Laurel's richest and most interesting relationship on this show has always been with Quentin, and I think that failing to take advantage of that in the end was a mistake.

 

7. I now kinda wish that Barry Allen had just told Supergirl and her friends about Oliver Queen's secret identity since now everyone on three different shows knows, and I feel kinda bad that the Supergirl cast has been left out of this secret. Very unfair.

 

8. Arrow, let's avoid any reminders of this Samantha and the secret kid plot, ok? Even when the reminder is from Damien Darhk.

 

And now, Laurel:

 

I obviously haven't been one of Laurel's biggest fans (she says, in perhaps the greatest understatement ever made on this forum.) But I've always wanted to like her. In fact, the single most frustrating thing about Laurel, for me, was always that she did have some great moments, suggesting that at last Katie Cassidy and the writers had figured out how to make her work - and then, the very next episode, she'd lose that.

 

And in that way, this was the hands down most quintessential Laurel episode ever.  The first half was filled with Laurel at her best - a great fight scene with the League of Assassins, immediately realizing that Oliver was bothered by something and asking him what was up, seriously considering what was best not for her, but for Star City, giving Oliver solid advice, facing Damien in her lawyer mode - and finding heroin while doing so, nice, Laurel!  It was all great. I had genuine hopes that Laurel was going to go out on a great note.

 

Alas.

 

This show.

 

Number of ways this episode failed Laurel:

 

1) Killing her off with one of Oliver's arrows, like, really show?

 

2) Not letting her die saving people or in a fight scene, and worse, having her be the least effective fighting member of Team Arrow in that scene.

 

3) Effectively killing her twice - once by arrow, once by....uh, actually I am not sure how she died at the end? Seizure? 

 

4) Forcing her to spend her last moments giving Oliver and Felicity her blessing, like, Arrow, I get that you wanted to make it clear that Laurel was fine with Oliver and Felicity, but we'd already seen that back in 409 when she applauded and smiled during the proposal, and when we saw her being friends with both of you after the engagement. No need to repeat this at her deathbed. 

 

5) Following that up with the horrible line that several soap operas would have avoided, about how she wasn't the love of Oliver's life but he was of hers, especially since, at that moment, Laurel thought she was going to be fine, so why on earth would she choose to say that right after telling him that she hoped he and Felicity would get back together?

 

At least she got to die with Team Arrow around her. But even I have to say I would have been happier to have her go out fighting. 

[johntfs]

Rest in Peace, Laurel. 

 

YOU SHUT YOUR FACE HOLE. LOL Jared Padelecki would never let Ruby not be his wife again LOL.

 

That's true.  She's actually coming back as the Puce Hummingbird.

[AyChihuahua]

I guess episode 18 is too early for Oliver (and now Digg) to be smart. That really is my #1 complaint about this show. Stop making the protagonist dumb as a non-functioning doorknob PLEASE.

[lion10]

I didn't believe they'd actually go through with it until it actually happened.  For the writers to kill off Black Canary and have her with her dying breath ship Olicity is so disrespectful to the character.  I get the feeling that Arrow will have lost more than a few fans after this episode.  

 

What Diggle said to Oliver was harsh but fair about why Felicity left him.  I hated the flashbacks and I still don't know what "Genesis" is.  

[KirkB]

Well, okay. I wasn't expecting that. I try my best to be unspoiled, I have ever since the Xena season three finale got all but ruined for me when I found out in advance what was going to happen. So while the anvils were falling quite heavily (I may have even gotten a concussion from one) I genuinely bought into the swerve when she came out of surgery and they said she was going to be fine. I kind of figured maybe Quentin was going to show up and get shot in the back at the last second or something. So, Laurel Lance is dead and I know I should feel something (relief, glee) but I don't. On one level I'm glad she's gone because they never seemed to know what to do with her and hopefully they can use this as on opportunity to focus on the characters they understand better. But I also feel bad for Quentin (and the fact no one can get in contact with Sara to tell her) and the team, since Laurel obviously meant a great deal more to them than she ever did me. Plus as been said the Laurel and KC fans got pretty much as screwed as Laurel herself did in the end.

 

Why, oh why were they holding on to Dark's idol? And why were they keeping it in the world's most well known and easily accessible secret lair? I get that the thing is supposed to be nearly indestructible, so they can't melt it down or whatever, but are you telling me they can't encase it in concrete and bury it so there is no possibility of...oh, THIS happening? And while keeping a piece of it separate was a smart move why was it even in the same time zone as the idol? Mail the damn thing to the arctic or something.

 

Diggle being blinded to Andy's duplicity doesn't bother me. I would always be inclined to think the best of my sister and to side with her first, especially if I walked in on my best friend torturing her. It's not stupid it's natural. He'd never want to think the worst of his brother until he had to.

 

Poor Quentin. Damn, did Blackthorne act the hell out of that scene at the end. Just collapsing like that is hard to do. It did occur to me if he was going to have a heart attack he was in the right place.

[catrox14]

That's true.  She's actually coming back as the Puce Hummingbird.

 

LOLOL

[Actionmage]

DD proving he was a Big Bag

 

I love this more-than-appropriate typo!

 

All I'd do is echo how Katie and Laurel got screwed over, but still? I was totally unspoiled, fell for the swerve, cussed the show for Quentin's reaction ( certain they were going to kill him too) and just was not happy with much of anything this outing.

 

Yeah, Digg is the kind of ride-or-die for family guy we love, but when it comes to Andy, he had to be convinced. I was wondering for the greater portion of this episode whether everything was a "test"/set-up by Ollie and John to see how Andy would handle situations. Apparently, that would be too subtle and smart. Especially for this point in the season. *sigh* I really hate when the stoopids hit a cast, especially if it's Just For The Plot/s/z.

 

I will hang in for the rest of the season, but man, the writing is going to have to be really great to keep me. 

 

Here's hoping that Katie gets a show that wants her and wants to highlight what she's good at doing. She's more than earned it.

[NumberCruncher]

Poor Quentin. Damn, did Blackthorne act the hell out of that scene at the end. Just collapsing like that is hard to do. It did occur to me if he was going to have a heart attack he was in the right place.

Paul B. was pretty fantastic in how he played his reaction. I truly hope they keep him on the show because even if his character is infuriating at times, his acting is the best among the cast.

[blixie]

That sucked, except for Diggle reading Oliver, even if I wish he'd done that when Felicity actually broke up with him to support her rightness, instead of waiting until Oliver stepped in his business, and even if he was ultimately wrong about Andy. Oh writers you suck so much.

 

I always forget Thea's outfit is ombre. 

 

Can someone explain to me how Felicity gets from where she's at in this episode to acting livid with Oliver at the funeral? I basically only watch this show while I'm doing other things because I care so little. 

[La Dee Da]

I thought there were some powerful moments but that's largely attributable to the acting - I believed the immense loss the team was feeling. I believed Dig's conviction and anguish about Andy. And Quentin, from the the moment he realized Laurel was hurt .... gahhhhhh! And I was mostly in on the episode (minus a few "come onnnnnn!" Moments) ... Right until Darkh said he needed a sacrifice to power the idol. I thought "ooooooh, Laurel's going to break free and she's going to put up a valiant fight!" But she dies because she's someone's daughter, not because she's a lawyer unafraid to prosecute a known evil, not because she's the Black Canary. I wish they had kept all her thoughts on these dual roles until the end - I thought Laurel's belief in her contributions should have been her final defining moment, not her relationship with Oliver.

On those "come on" moments - reassembling the idol in a museum quality display box? Oliver just revealing he's saw the idol on the island? Damian just figuring out the team's identity? Not knowing Oliver almost won on a write-in? The lax security at the prison? I was hoping that the idol was at least being smuggled in by a hollowed out massive dictionary.

Edited April 7, 2016 by La Dee Da

[apinknightmare]

Can someone explain to me how Felicity gets from where she's at in this episode to acting livid with Oliver at the funeral? I basically only watch this show while I'm doing other things because I care so little. 

 

I don't think she's livid with Oliver at the funeral. They both just seemed really sad and upset. And not together anymore. 

[anamika]

Well, they wrote this iteration of Laurel Lance, and they obviously can't write for shit, so the blame partly lies with them. Shitty writers will inevitably produce a mess of a show. Stephen "wooden as hell" Amell isn't exactly lighting up the TV every week with his turn as Oliver Queen either, so its not like Laurel/Katie was the only issue on the show. There's plenty to go around.

 

Time for me to check out LOT and Supergirl. Hopefully those shows treat female superheroes better than Arrow. Good riddance to this hot mess of a show.

 

Pretty much. I can't believe that Laurel Lance's last dying moments were about Olicity, Felicity and Oliver. Like Really? What about her frigging dad? But no, the guy who treated her like shit gets to spend the last moments with her. Oliver is the love of her life? The hell? After the womanizing asshole consistently cheated on her, they still made Laurel spout that BS?! Way to treat LL and the BC like shit. Though I guess I should not be surprised that a C grade TV show on the CW made the BC's death be all about Oliver's love life. They pretty much took an iconic female super hero character and shit on her till her dying breadth. No wonder her comic creators and writers are pissed. If one can't or does not want to do the character justice, write for a made up character like Felicity. Don't shit on BC and her fans.

 

And Amell's acting was terrible in that scene. Not that he is all that great anyway.  The guy can't even muster up a proper response. Maybe they realized how horrid that scene was.

 

I wish Katie Cassidy all the best for the future. Hope she goes on to bigger and better things. She is okay as an actress, but she deserves a good TV show after everything she had to go through being in this show. The fact that the writers/EPs told the actress that her character was being written off two episodes before, just before she had her lawyer scenes shows how inconsiderate these hacks are.

Edited April 7, 2016 by anamika

[apinknightmare]

Pretty much. I can't believe that Laurel Lance's last dying moments were about Olicity, Felicity and Oliver. Like Really? What about her frigging dad? But no, the guy who treated her like shit gets to spend the last moments with her. Oliver is the love of her life? The hell?

 

That's Katie Cassidy's actual head canon. Maybe the writers let her ad-lib that stuff? That's the only thing I can think of. 

 

 

 

The fact that the writers/EPs told the actress that her character was being written off two episodes before, just before she had her lawyer scenes shows how inconsiderate these hacks are.

 

Is there a good time to fire someone?

[InsertWordHere]

I thought she ripped off her half of the picture of the two of them? That must've been another show. 

You might be thinking of The Parent Trap.

[DigitalCount]

Is there a possibility that Laurel isn't dead? Like, she asked Oliver to promise her something, she seems fine, and then we never see what he promises her but she then dies? I know the fakeout would seem pulled from some orifice, but I couldn't help but think that Laurel isn't really dead here. Maybe it's because this season has seen the best writing for her in the entire series, but I was actually warming up to her. Little did I know that they were about to drop a Frigidaire on her face.

[calliope1975]

I don't know when it's a good time to tell someone they've been fired. At the beginning of the season, so they have that in their mind? A week before so it's sudden and acute? I think The Walking Dead also does 2 - 3 weeks out, IIRC. It's going to suck however and whenever it's done. Unless we get some The 100/Ricky Whittle bitterness, I don't know that we'll get KC's actual thoughts though I would love it if it were so. I'm waiting on my CW Lifetime BTS trashy movie. 

[quarks]

 

Poor Quentin. Damn, did Blackthorne act the hell out of that scene at the end. Just collapsing like that is hard to do. It did occur to me if he was going to have a heart attack he was in the right place.

 

And see, I thought the exact opposite. I mean, just within the past year, they failed to save Thea, forcing Oliver to bring her to a magical hot tub, and then they failed to fix Felicity's spinal cord injuries, even though a guy with no medical background whatsoever was able to fix those just a few weeks later.  If he'd been at Star Labs with Caitlin, maybe, but I don't trust the Star City hospital that much, and still less after this.

[Angel12d]

I don't really have much else to say about the episode. I did find it weird to watch without Felicity. She just adds something extra to the show for me personally and the mood/dynamic just never felt right without her. But I did understand why she wasn't there and I'm glad she was kept away from the death. I was worried they'd try to suggest she was responsible in some way so I'm pleased they didn't go there.

 

Most of all though, everything was just so heavy handed. It's like they had a checklist and were ticking things off. Bring up the long lost picture. Check. Have Quentin tell Laurel he's glad she's BC. Check. O/L scene. Check. I don't know, it was just so like they were going through the motions.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Angel12d

[apinknightmare]

I don't trust the Star City hospital that much, and still less after this.

 

They give up pretty damn easily, that's for sure. 

[johntfs]

I don't know when it's a good time to tell someone they've been fired. At the beginning of the season, so they have that in their mind? A week before so it's sudden and acute? I think The Walking Dead also does 2 - 3 weeks out, IIRC. It's going to suck however and whenever it's done. Unless we get some The 100/Ricky Whittle bitterness, I don't know that we'll get KC's actual thoughts though I would love it if it were so. I'm waiting on my CW Lifetime BTS trashy movie. 

 

What makes you think she's fired?  This is a comic book reality.  You know who was dead/gone for like 20 years or so?  Barry Allen.  From The Flash we know that there's at least one universe that has dopplegangers of people from the Flarrowverse.  Damien Darkh as of last season stole water from the Lazarus Pit prior to leaving the League of Assassins.  There's a powerful magical item in play.  This one particular character of Laurel Lance may be dead but I have no reason to assume that Katie Cassidy is actually leaving the show.

[wonderwall]

What makes you think she's fired?  This is a comic book reality.  You know who was dead/gone for like 20 years or so?  Barry Allen.  From The Flash we know that there's at least one universe that has dopplegangers of people from the Flarrowverse.  Damien Darkh as of last season stole water from the Lazarus Pit prior to leaving the League of Assassins.  There's a powerful magical item in play.  This one particular character of Laurel Lance may be dead but I have no reason to assume that Katie Cassidy is actually leaving the show.

 

I think a big indicator was MG talking about contracts ending etc. earlier this week. 

[InsertWordHere]

Is there a possibility that Laurel isn't dead? Like, she asked Oliver to promise her something, she seems fine, and then we never see what he promises her but she then dies?

Either that or he killed her, because that's seriously what the editing made it look like. 

[Xenith22]

Why, oh why were they holding on to Dark's idol? And why were they keeping it in the world's most well known and easily accessible secret lair? I get that the thing is supposed to be nearly indestructible, so they can't melt it down or whatever, but are you telling me they can't encase it in concrete and bury it so there is no possibility of...oh, THIS happening? And while keeping a piece of it separate was a smart move why was it even in the same time zone as the idol? Mail the damn thing to the arctic or something.

So very much this!  Plan number one should have been to grind as much of the thing into fine powder as possibleFailing that plan two should have been to dispose of the dam thing.  Palmer Tech still has a jet right?   Take a trip to visit a volcano or to scatter the pieces across the ocean.   

Heck Vixen could have taken a piece as a souvenir to dispose of in Detroit, throw some in the bay, bury some in Sara's empty grave.... Anything at all just to keep the pieces as far away from each other as possible so that they could never be assembled again.   There is seriously not one single defensible reason for why you would not only put the dam thing back together but to have it sit out in the open (in a place which they knew Malcolm....who they knew was working with HIVE knew about did Oliver learn NOTHING from the William incident?!?) instead of hidden away in a locked vault somewhere.   I mean the only possible reason to assemble it was to use it.   And that requires killing someone and thus I do not believe Oliver was actually planning on murdering anyone especially since Darkh was in jail.   It is just mind fumblingly stupid that not one of these characters thought this was a terrible idea...

 

2) Not letting her die saving people or in a fight scene, and worse, having her be the least effective fighting member of Team Arrow in that scene.

I think the worst part about it was that Darkh didn't even kill Laurel because of Laurel.  It was not because of animosity towards her for the trial or anything she had done...no instead Darkh announced he was killing her because her father betrayed him.  Ugh a classic Fridge scenario...  She deserved so much better.   (On a different note...can anyone provide a plausible explanation of why DD would kill Laurel and not kill Oliver?   I mean there was no urgency to his escape and he had to know that Oliver would be both trying to stop his future plans and out for blood...   So much stupid again.)

 

Next plot point....48% of the population of Star City wrote in Oliver's name.  Where to begin... *sigh*  I mean ignoring the improbability of that many people ever doing a write-in let's start with the fact that something like this is not usually spontaneous.   If that many people still wanted Oliver Queen to be mayor...it would not have been a surprise.  The media would have been all over this movement ages ago, and even more so it would have been all over social media.  Hey remember how the show made a point to remind us that Thea is a social media queen last episode?   Would she really have not noticed a large outpouring of support was still around for her brother and brought it to his attention?    Heck would freaking Alex have not noticed it and brought it to his former employers attention in an attempt to get his job back on a restarted campaign.   Aaaaaargh.   Such a blatantly obvious set-up for Oliver to become the mayor next season after Ruve is outed...

 

And now it hits me that Laurel's story about becoming the DA and the difficulty of being Black Canary was not even her own story,  no it was just leading the groundwork for Oliver to be faced with the same issue of Mayor vs Green Arrow.  HAAAAATE!

Edited April 7, 2016 by Xenith22

[apinknightmare]

Either that or he killed her, because that's seriously what the editing made it look like. 

 

Marc Guggenheim actually addressed that in an interview with Variety, haha.

[dtissagirl]

The biggest impression about this episode that I got is that I feel like I've been told, in a very condensed manner and at hyper speed, a whole bunch of things about Laurel that they should have showed me in the previous couple of dozen episodes. It was like watching a storyline get WinZipped on televison.

[Chaser]

I felt nothing. At all. 

 

Which actually surprised me because a father losing his daughter should have got me, but I felt like I was watching cardboard make nice.

[Sarcastica]

Bye Laurel. 

[catrox14]

Well, upon rewatch...I'm not convinced Laurel is really most sincerely dead.

 

I'm sorry. I think the way the doctor was the ONLY one in the room with her and Oliver and she was like get out of here and let me do my work...was weird. And she spent all of 3 seconds working to revive her and she just seemed...off to me. If I'm right,  I don't think Oliver has anything to do with it. 

 

 

Either that or he killed her, because that's seriously what the editing made it look like. 

 

There is no way he killed her. NO WAY .

 

Maybe it's a fake out and my  theory is wrong about Oliver not being involved and he gave her something to make her seize and the doctor and staff are in on it. 

Edited April 7, 2016 by catrox14

[apinknightmare]

Maybe it's a fake out and my  theory is wrong about Oliver not being involved and he gave her something to make her seize and the doctor and staff are in on it. 

 

MG confirmed that it's not a fake out in the Variety interview I posted in the spoilers thread. 

[grandemocha]

 

I wish Katie Cassidy all the best for the future. Hope she goes on to bigger and better things. She is okay as an actress, but she deserves a good TV show after everything she had to go through being in this show. The fact that the writers/EPs told the actress that her character was being written off two episodes before, just before she had her lawyer scenes shows how inconsiderate these hacks are.

Yeah, pretty much my thoughts. She's not like some once in a lifetime talent (I'm not delusional enough to think that, 90% of the actors on the CW are average and were hired for their looks), but she's decent enough to hopefully land on another show that I would watch because I feel like she got majorly fucked over here. 

 

 

Is there a good time to fire someone?

 

They could learn to be good writers and showrunners and perhaps know who the major death of the season is at the beginning of the season and inform the actor then, not two episodes before it happens. That's sloppy as hell. The fact that Katie found out so recently indicates to me that they don't have a long term plan and just write as they go with no well-thought out plots. Losing a character like Laurel Lance is big, despite the illogical pretending like Black Canary doesn't matter at all..and they should have solidly decided who would die at the beginning of Season 4. Not halfway through.

[EmilyBettFan]

Quentin not being there is the price he pays for aligning himself with Darhk. I know it was to protect LL but it backfired on him.

Anyway, this death wasn't nearly as horrific as Sara's. She had already died but they decided to not only throw her off the roof but smashing into a garbage.

The episode was boring. All I saw was fighting and it only started getting good when Oliver followed Andy to Diggle's home. You can really tell that when Felicity is missing the team is in shambles.

[wonderwall]

Bye Laurel. 

I applaud your brevity :)

[NumberCruncher]

They could learn to be good writers and showrunners and perhaps know who the major death of the season is at the beginning of the season and inform the actor then, not two episodes before it happens. That's sloppy as hell. The fact that Katie found out so recently indicates to me that they don't have a long term plan and just write as they go with no well-thought out plots. Losing a character like Laurel Lance is big, despite the illogical pretending like Black Canary doesn't matter at all..and they should have solidly decided who would die at the beginning of Season 4. Not halfway through.

That's standard procedure for most shows though. They rarely give actors months of notice that their character will meet their end. Read interviews w/ any of the Game of Thrones or Walking Dead actors and they'll say the same thing--most of them find out maybe 2 episodes in advance. I don't think this is a case of them being shady. YMMV of course.

Edited April 7, 2016 by NumberCruncher

[catrox14]

Okay, well I guess Laurel is really most sincerely dead after reading Guggie's comments (but I reserve the right to say "SON OF A BITCH" if she shows back up again not as a ghost or a different character LOL)

[apinknightmare]

Yeah, pretty much my thoughts. She's not like some once in a lifetime talent (I'm not delusional enough to think that, 90% of the actors on the CW are average and were hired for their looks), but she's decent enough to hopefully land on another show that I would watch because I feel like she got majorly fucked over here. 

 

 

They could learn to be good writers and showrunners and perhaps know who the major death of the season is at the beginning of the season and inform the actor then, not two episodes before it happens. That's sloppy as hell. The fact that Katie found out so recently indicates to me that they don't have a long term plan and just write as they go with no well-thought out plots. Losing a character like Laurel Lance is big, despite the illogical pretending like Black Canary doesn't matter at all..and they should have solidly decided who would die at the beginning of Season 4. Not halfway through.

 

Not sure that informing someone that they're being fired and then expecting almost a whole season of committed, emotional work from them is very fair, either.