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S05.E16: Our Decay


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Regina is still being likeable 4 episodes in? I may now believe in real magic.

I noticed Regina wasn't so bitchy to Zelena in this episode. I do get annoyed whenever she repeats the "I used to be like you" bit, but I'm happy she wasn't trying to keep the baby away from her like Robin was. For some reason, Regina has changed a lot in 5B. Maybe that meeting with her father affected her more than we thought.

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After that terrible first scene where Toto defeated Zelena with a freaking curtain, I thought I was in for a rough ride. Thankfully, it improved a bit after that. The Rumpel truth bombs to Belle made this entire episode for me.

 

A few notes:

 

- There was a serious impotency metaphor going on with Hades/Zelena. Dear God. He sat down on the bike with her and got this look on his face and then later told her it made him feel something he'd not felt in a long time. No heart beat, my ass.

 

- That Rumpel/Belle scene was the best thing ever. I want to hug it and kiss it and call it George. Belle fell in love with the Dark One, not some tortured hero who is really a good man underneath.

 

- Zelena was speaking for me when she bitched about Robin ditching his baby to go on some heroic quest. Exactly. Also, you can't name the baby until you know her? She's a newborn. How well do you need to know her? Give her a damn name.

 

- Hook & Emma were pretty unimpressed with teen author Henry. I like that about them. If Henry wants to pretend he's an adult and play with the big boys, he needs to deliver, not pout like a two year old when people are disappointed that he can't.

 

- If Snow had haunted Baby Emma to tell her they loved her, she'd have ended up in the psych ward. It's a sweet idea, but would have seriously messed up their daughter.

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I am SO angry I teared up when Zelena was saying goodbye to her baby. I watch this show generally just to be irritated by all the wasted potential and to admire some eye candy, not to actually feel things. Score one for the writers and Mader, I guess. 

 

However, the pacing with the rest of the episode was so weird. Hook was completely back to normal after his ordeal last week and however long Hades was torturing him. Charming and Snow continue to be absolutely useless, just sort of wandering around instead of actually trying to get home. And, while I always enjoy Zelena, the thing with Hades could have been plotted out so much better. If we had gotten their backstory earlier and genuinely believed he was after her and her baby, tonight's episode might have felt less rushed. But why would you carefully plot out things when you can have an episode of Regina trying to kill Snow in the past for the millionth time? 

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I couldn't bring myself to care about this episode, and I don't think it did much to advance the overall story. I am still a bit conflicted about custody of Zelena and Robin's kid, though. Yeah, Zelena did some terrible things, but I think if Regina could raise a child, Zelena should at least get supervised visits with her own.

 

I think Zelena's birthday should have been a month earlier--the Ides of March seems appropriate.

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(edited)

I found this one just horrible.

 

The enjoyment of this whole episode hinged on whether one bought the Zelena sob story/baby bonding and the Zelena/Hades chemistry, and my heart was stone cold through the whole thing.  

 

They are really intent on ruining Emma's birthday with the cupcake, aren't they?  First they gave one of those scenes to Regina, and now Zelena?  Is nothing sacred?

 

I found Zelena as whiny as ever.  I'm sorry but after beheading a guard, and murdering a munchkin, everything she said was irritatingly self-indulgent.  But the love of a baby cures all... sorry, not buying the crocodile tears.

 

And could Dorothy be any lamer?  The performance was wooden as hell, and as abrasive as Merida, as KingofHearts said.  Why did Zelena need Rumple's "brain" in 3B, when she had the Scarecrow's?  What a waste of Dorothy's character.  The "love of the people" thing was stupid.  Dorothy had no magic, and yet she thought she had a chance against Zelena?  Why didn't Zelena just get up, chase Dorothy and freeze her?  Why didn't she summon all her Flying Monkeys?  Every time they do a flashback to the Wicked Witch, it's always the same problem (see Robin's escape from Zelena and long, long talk with Will on the Yellow Brick Road while Zelena "gave up" as another example).

 

Likewise, Hades making sad face holding the page with Zelena didn't do it for me either. Liam was in Underbrooke before Hades met Zelena, so where was he before Underbrooke was erected?  

 

Why didn't Hades appear to Zelena, to hatch the plan to help her hold on to the baby during 4B or 5A?  

 

I did like the use of mythology to draw a parallel between Hades/Zeus and Zelena/Regina.  

 

Belle is in the library, and Robin and Regina are tramping through the lake in the forest.  Great tracking.

 

I'm glad Rumple told Belle everything, but I hate him more than ever.  It was presumptuous of him to say that Belle loved him partly because he was a beast, or that she can take him back.  What if she doesn't?  Is he saying he will leave their baby alone?  "You wanted me to be a better man.  And you've done that."  That is total BS.  If this is where Rumple lets Belle go, and we never see their coupling again, then I might think differently of this speech.  But I expect them to be back together again, and there is no way that Belle liking a bit of beastiness is the same as Belle wanting to be with a mass murderer.  

 

The phone booth business was fun, especially them asking the man behind them how it works.  That's the type of quirky sci-fi/fantasy stuff that intrigues me.

 

Not the overwrought, zero chemistry, star-crossed crybabies of evil who practically put me to sleep with their tedious pity parties.

Edited by Camera One
  • Love 2
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I am SO angry I teared up when Zelena was saying goodbye to her baby. I watch this show generally just to be irritated by all the wasted potential and to admire some eye candy, not to actually feel things. Score one for the writers and Mader, I guess.

That part of the episode got me going. Zelena is just a fantastic character, imo. From her scoffing at Belle stopping her with her bookstudyin' powers, to her bitching about Robin being in the Underworld, and bringing up Marian again--she's just gold, when it comes to both humorous and serious moments. I fell for Hades and Zelena's chemistry hook, line, and sinker.

 

I'm realling hoping Hades is being legit. Tbh, it explains why he would go to the bother of owning Rumpel's contract. Perhaps he plans to sacrifice Rumpel's baby for his and Zelena's spell since Rumpel chose Regina over Zelena, too.

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When Hades was standing by the clocktower, we saw it advance another minute. Does this mean that another soul moved on and (unless I missed something) we didn't see it happen or was it still catching up from last week's sailors? Maybe Snow and Charming helped the guy waiting in line who had been haunting his family for 30 years move on offscreen. I actually thought that using the telephone booth to haunt the living was a rather clever idea on the show's part.

Since Snow and Charming now have a regular order at Undergranny's, I'm guessing they've already been there for about a week? Yet Belle is bringing the babies formula instead of the nuns having food for both babies available on the premises? I hope Neal 2 (who was being breastfed but obviously that's not an option now unless Aurora or one of those other mommy and me ladies are willing/able to nurse him) wasn't depending on Belle for his next meal. Neal should also not be the same size as Zelena's week old newborn. Since I don't believe they showed his face, they could have just used a bigger doll.

With the mansion unavailable, I wonder where Regina and Robin are sleeping? I'm guessing the CS house as there's no room in the loft and I don't see Regina going to camp in the (probably already occupied by Owen's father) Underworld woods, which would most likely be Robin's first choice.

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When Hades was standing by the clocktower, we saw it advance another minute. Does this mean that another soul moved on and (unless I missed something) we didn't see it happen or was it still catching up from last week's sailors? Maybe Snow and Charming helped the guy waiting in line who had been haunting his family for 30 years move on offscreen. I actually thought that using the telephone booth to haunt the living was a rather clever idea on the show's part.

 

Ooh, that's a nice idea.  I thought that idea was pretty clever too.  I actually thought we would get to see the ghostly visitation first-hand.

 

I did find it funny how the fake Blue Fairy was all flustered, and then the real one walked in and looked as uptight as ever.

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(edited)

 

I did find it funny how the fake Blue Fairy was all flustered, and then the real one walked in and looked as uptight as ever.

Belle could figuring out Blue was Zelena makes Robin look even dumber for believing she was his own wife. Zelena couldn't trick one of the dumbest people on the show for 2 minutes, yet she was able to masquerade as a dead person for weeks without anyone noticing. Mmhm.

 

 

That part of the episode got me going. Zelena is just a fantastic character, imo. From her scoffing at Belle stopping her with her bookstudyin' powers, to her bitching about Robin being in the Underworld, and bringing up Marian again--she's just gold, when it comes to both humorous and serious moments. I fell for Hades and Zelena's chemistry hook, line, and sinker.

 

I love Zelena. Haters gonna hate. Before this episode, she was more of a caricature. Now some level of depth has been added to her character and it's great. I totally buy how she feels like an outsider and that she's redeemable. One of her biggest flaws was her lack of humanity and that's been resolved. I've always been a fan of hers (even in 3B), so I'm very happy the quality of her writing went up. #TeamZelena

 

 

I fell for Hades and Zelena's chemistry hook, line, and sinker.

There's definitely chemistry. I just wish it wasn't so rushed.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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I'm really hoping Hades is being legit. Tbh, it explains why he would go to the bother of owning Rumpel's contract. Perhaps he plans to sacrifice Rumpel's baby for his and Zelena's spell since Rumpel chose Regina over Zelena, too.

 

It also explains why he punished Cora so severely for failing to get rid of Regina and the others.  Since he had really fallen in love with Zelena and knew that Cora had abandoned her in order to satisfy her own quest for power, it was only natural that he should avenge Zelena by condemning Cora to being the Miller's Daughter for all eternity.

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Once again this show uses "true love" like it really means "mild initial attraction". We said hello and rode a bicycle for two! Be mine forever! Good Lord. No wonder Zelena didn't buy it. I didn't either.

 

For that matter, if somebody could choose a personality, agenda and/or motivation for Hades that'd be good. Any second now. Each episode he seems to be pursuing a different agenda. Or maybe he was torturing Hook to get Zelena back. I'm not sure how that works but...

 

Once you get past that, I enjoyed the romp of this episode. Although not nearly enough Emma and Hook for me.

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I get that Snow and Charming miss their new little baby, but he is a BABY. If he doesn't hear their voices for a few days, he will be fine. It was ludicrous for Snow to compare that to Emma being without them and saying, "If you had heard our voices, you would have felt loved." Not hearing their voices wasn't the major thing for Emma. It was being an abandoned kid who had no idea who her parents were or why they left her on the side of the road and then bouncing around the foster system. A spooky phone call when she was less than a year old would not have fixed any of that.

 

I wanted to know how intrepid forest tracker Robin was going to track a baby who's not ambulatory. Anyone could be carrying it (did Zelena tell them it was Belle who had it?). Can he tell from someone's footprints on a street that they're carrying a baby? Was he expecting the baby to break open her rattle and leave a trail of rattle beads behind so he could find her?

Heh, I know, right? Based on that, I thought that the only way for him to track her would be to start sniffing the air like a dog.

 

Once again this show uses "true love" like it really means "mild initial attraction". We said hello and rode a bicycle for two! Be mine forever! Good Lord. No wonder Zelena didn't buy it. I didn't either.

For reals! I totally get that sometimes you just click with someone right away AND you're attracted to each other, but that is NOT the same thing as love at first sight or true love. I mean, seriously, Hades, you had known Zelena all of ten minutes and you're telling her that it's true love? No wonder Zelena ran like hell.

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Why did Zelena need Rumple's "brain" in 3B, when she had the Scarecrow's?  

I wondered about that too, but decided that maybe she needed a fresh brain - maybe the Scarecrow's brain went past its expiry date?

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Well it's good to know that the creepy haunting of Snowflake wasn't actually as creepy as it seemed.

Hook needs a haircut asap.

How am I supposed to care about a love affair that happens in one episode? Hard to understand why Zades is even a storyline. Or if it's supposed to be touching or creepy.

Can't believe they went there with Belle! About time some truths were told.

Regina didn't irritate me. I like that she sees the Charmings as her family despite the general bizarreness of them accepting her.

Loved Charming's arm clasp of Henry when he showed the Snowflake page.

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Looks like in OUAT's OZ, Munchkinland is a stone's throw from the Emerald City, you could see it clear as day.   I guess they never had to tell Dorothy to follow the Yellow Brick Road, they could have just gone "Go there" and pointed.

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The Greek and Roman gods were renowned for their rampaging libidos and spying on humans. Wouldn't put it past Hades to have been creepily watching/spying on Zelena and 'falling in love' as per mythology often said they did...i mean have you read some of those. Getting human woman pregnant via shower of gold for one... hmm..maybe Zelena got off lightly!

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(edited)

It's hilarious how this show doesn't even attempt to explain huge plot holes anymore.

 

Belle: "Zelena, your sister sent you to Oz! How can you be here?"

Zelena: "Never mind important details like that, just know that my sister can't keep me down and these writers are incredibly lazy."

Rumple: "Can I offer anyone a random vial of magic? It has the power to give back Dark One magic and do whatever the plot calls for!"

 

Yeah, Zelena did some terrible things, but I think if Regina could raise a child, Zelena should at least get supervised visits with her own.

 

And this is where the REC comes in to play. If these people treated Regina the same way they've been treating Zelena and her baby back in Season 1 and 2, Regina would have been tarred and feathered for attempting to raise Henry all by herself, especially after she accidentally killed him. Now Regina has the audacity to tell Zelena that her enemies became her family and that's why she's happy? Hey Regina, guess who did all the heavy lifting there? Snow and Emma. So if Regina has truly turned over a new leaf, shouldn't she be the one doing the heavy lifting with Zelena and bending over backwards to help become friends with her sister? Not gloating to Zelena's face about how someone must have killed her after she got sent away on the tornado that Regina forced her into after separating her from her baby? Sorry Regina, you may be "redeemed" now, but you're still a huge hypocrite.

 

Oh, and of course Henry is also a fantastic illustrator on top of being a fantastic writer. He is the writers' self-insert after all. As a graphic artist, Regina's line telling Henry "the illustrations are lovely" made my blood boil. (P.S. That isn't an illustration, Regina. That's just a crappy Photoshop filter of a screenshot.) We've never been shown Henry having any huge artistic abilities, but now he can draw amazing illustrations in his sleep on top of writing a New York Times Best Seller? Screw you, Henry Sue. 

Edited by Curio
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The Greek and Roman gods were renowned for their rampaging libidos and spying on humans. Wouldn't put it past Hades to have been creepily watching/spying on Zelena and 'falling in love' as per mythology often said they did...i mean have you read some of those. Getting human woman pregnant via shower of gold for one... hmm..maybe Zelena got off lightly!

Zeus was the worst!

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(edited)

And could Dorothy be any lamer?  The performance was wooden as hell, and as abrasive as Merida, as KingofHearts said.  Why did Zelena need Rumple's "brain" in 3B, when she had the Scarecrow's?  What a waste of Dorothy's character.  The "love of the people" thing was stupid.  Dorothy had no magic, and yet she thought she had a chance against Zelena?  

 

Dorothy was lame. She kept telling Zelena that she is not afraid of her. Well... she should be. She gives Snow a run for her money on motivational speeches. But I think there's more to come on Dorothy's backstory. What happened in Kansas. How she got back to Oz, etc.. She probably ended up recovering the Scarecrow's brain from Zelena at some point. 

With the mansion unavailable, I wonder where Regina and Robin are sleeping? I'm guessing the CS house as there's no room in the loft and I don't see Regina going to camp in the (probably already occupied by Owen's father) Underworld woods, which would most likely be Robin's first choice.

 

Robin probably is sleeping in the forest. Didn't he say that that was the only place he ever felt "home'? I felt kinda sad for him at that point.

I actually thought we would get to see the ghostly visitation first-hand.

 

I was disappointed we didn't get to see Snow and Charming singing a lullaby to Snowflake via phone. 

Hades is like that bad date guy you meet online. You are thinking you want a drink and he is naming the kids and planning a wedding.

 

He also got angry and threatening when she rejected him. True Love material, indeed.

Edited by Rumsy4
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How did Rumple become The Dark One again?

He became the dark one in the winter finale.  When Emma stabbed Hook with the dagger it took away all the Dark One powers from Hook, Emma, Nimue and the others.  Emma thought that she had destroyed the Dark One's power but Rumple had manipulated things so that instead of destroying the dark power, all of the power of every Dark One who ever lived was channeled into him.  He is now, not only the Dark One but the most powerful Dark One that ever lived.

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(edited)

Who cares if Hades uses Pistachio for the time travel spell? Zelena used Snowflake and he's fine,

 

Yes!  That's what I was thinking.   All these characters also need to find their Memories.

 

Oh, and of course Henry is also a fantastic illustrator on top of being a fantastic writer. He is the writers' self-insert after all. As a graphic artist, Regina's line telling Henry "the illustrations are lovely" made my blood boil. (P.S. That isn't an illustration, Regina. That's just a crappy Photoshop filter of a screenshot.) We've never been shown Henry having any huge artistic abilities, but now he can draw amazing illustrations in his sleep on top of writing a New York Times Best Seller? Screw you, Henry Sue. 

 

I thought that was just supposed to be half a cheeky joke that the new Henry-written pages look EXACTLY the same as the stories in the real book.  Like Emma and Regina were trying to give Henry half-hearted compliments to hide their disappointment... "You write SO beautifully" and "And what beautiful illustrations".

 

So it looks like Henry is just writing the present-day... Snowing eating breakfast, Baby hearing their message, etc.  So he can't write past events, then, maybe?  I suppose he could just write Hades and Zelena's conversation on Main Street, and everyone would get the gist of their relationship.

 

A&E were also trying to use Henry as their surrogate to show how they feel, with the whole "Everyone is a Writer now?  Everyone is full of ideas", etc.  Wink, wink, not.

 

I didn't appreciate the episode trying to validate that Zelena had really changed by giving random lines like when they had Hook say that he thinks Zelena was genuine this time.  Even though she had tricked them four million times before.  Yes, Zelena was crying pitifully but "boy who cried wolf" should apply for a bit longer in this case.

Edited by Camera One
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- If Snow had haunted Baby Emma to tell her they loved her, she'd have ended up in the psych ward. It's a sweet idea, but would have seriously messed up their daughter.

 

I swear I saw that thought flit through Emma's mind before she decided to just go with the sweet intention behind the idea.

 

I did like that Emma was the one reading the story, that they played a variation on the Snowing theme music, and that they emphasized the flower tattoo on Emma's wrist that matches Charming's coat of arms. (Can I get a conversation about how she chose that tattoo sometime before the show ends? Or even a flashback to teen!Emma getting herself inked?) 

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(Can I get a conversation about how she chose that tattoo sometime before the show ends? Or even a flashback to teen!Emma getting herself inked?) 

 

Why do that when they can show Round 1873843 of Snow vs. Regina? Or Zelena and Hades riding a bike?

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I did like the use of mythology to draw a parallel between Hades/Zeus and Zelena/Regina.  

I didn't like the Devil reference. If they're going to reference Christian theology, then they should go the whole nine yards.

 

Either it's Zeus or it's Jahovah. They've already mentioned the Holy Grail for crying out loud! Old Scratch should make an appearance.

 

The religious aspect is annoying.

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So this...was not as lame as I thought it was going to be. I actually liked Zelena, at least more than I have in the past. Which, considering I have always found her to be a waste of space, is pretty impressive. 

 

So Henry has turned into an A & E self insert character? Or he is just becoming a moody future English major. As much as moody teens annoy me on TV, its better than a clearly teenaged kid still going on about dreams and heroes like a 10 year old. Now, his dreams and heroes speeches sound more like your average narcissistic teenager! Progress? 

 

Has no one in this multiverse heard of a second date? They sure declare One True Love really damn fast, right? That being said, Zelena and Hades did have some chemistry, so this might actually be kind of interesting. Dorthy was pretty lame though. Do they have to re-imagine every famous female character from literature into some kind of speech giving freedom fighter? Who hardly even does anything? 

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One other thing I thought I noticed... did Zelena call the munchkin she did away with Boq? I'm not super versed in the original Oz books, but isn't that just 'Wicked' canon? They are seriously all over the place if so. I did appreciate the Quadling reference though, because I believe that is original Oz.

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(edited)

Jasus, another villain with a fucking sob story. Spare me.

Our Decay is a perfect title for this episode.

It describes the writers.

A throw away episode with very little substance, depth, wit or progress.

It could have been awesome with some color-commentary by Cruella.

I dont know or care how, have her watching things on a crystal ball she found or have her standing there; who has time for such pesky plot considerations.

ETA: I cant, read: can, believe Snow and Emma get another 15-second scene, while Hades and Rump get minutes each to cry about their man pain. I wish Cruella would just obliviously mow them both down while trying to light a ciggarettte.

Edited by Tiger
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I was dreading this episode, but in the end it was tolerable. Not good, but not terrible either. Dorothy was a total waste of time, but I love her outfit. I don't trust Hades, and I'm not sure if his love for Zelena is real or not.

 

Rumbelle is so unhealthy, and such a bad example. I know it's not going to happen, but I hope Belle leaves Rumple for real this time.

 

 

So Henry has turned into an A & E self insert character?

Lol, yeah. First Isaac, now Henry. But Colin's face was great during Henry's tantrum.

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Are they even trying with the timeline anymore? When exactly did the OZ scenes happen? Zelena was an adult when she was with kid Dorothy and now Dorothy is all grown up and Zelena isn't 15 years older.

 

It's like last week with the witch doctor. He's middle-aged when they go to get help with Bae's snake-bight and he's still alive hundreds of years later when Rumple wants to have a baby with Cora (about 30 years before the curse) so he's still around for Rumple to kill him?

 

I like that Zelena interrupted Regina's hypocritical speech about how she needs to let love into her life to inform her that she is trying with her baby, but Regina keeps taking her away. Zelena does seem to honestly care about the child. Didn't we see the classic King Solomon Maury Povich test? King Solomon is asked to decide who the mother of a baby is and decides to simply cut the baby in half to give part to both of them. One of the women immediately decides to give the baby to the other woman revealing that she is the real Mom and Solomon gives the baby to her (she'd rather the child live).  Zelena made the choice to give up the baby to keep it safe (from a spell that doesn't even harm babies or brain donors or heart donors - they are fine).

 

Rumple told way too many truths to Belle - truths he went to hell to avoid telling her. I'm not buying that it was him. I think Hades was just having fun. For all his talk about admiring Rumple, I don't think Hades likes him at all.  Hades tells Rumple that Belle isn't going to like finding out he sold their baby and that he is still the Dark One? The next moment he sees Belle, he spills everything like he's telling her he just won the lottery? He tells her she's pregnant with her first child and his opening is that he already sold it to the Devil? "BTW I'm the Dark One. Oh, and I'm never going to change. Even when you thought I was good and my heart was white, I was just plotting to be evil again. I know you love it!" Er....has he learned nothing about women in the last 300 years? When did Rumple ever tell the truth when a lie works better? Totally OOC for him, so I'm convinced it's not him (maybe it was Cora).

 

I bet a lot of teenagers would be thrilled if they could take a nap and find that they had written an essay while sleeping.

 

All of Henry's stories are about Snowing. Maybe he should move out of their loft if he wants to get some new inspiration. Hang out with Auntie Zelena and find out what she is up too.

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I liked this episode more than I thought I would.  Rebecca Mader knocked it out of the park this week, she really sold that Zelena's loves for her daughter.  Not sure what to think yet about a Hades and Zelena romance, but I do like it that Zelena didn't trust Hades in Oz. I'm liking teenager Henry - at long last he's acting his age, and I did laugh at Emma and Regina complimenting Henry on his writing!  Some nice Charming family scenes as well.  All in all not a great episode but not a bad one either.    

  • Love 1
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I think a big difference between last week's episode and this week's is that the writers finally allowed the A-Plot to have some fun. I love me some Hook, but it's emotionally draining when the entire A-Plot is devoted to angst and sad faces, and a few funny B/C-plots bringing occasional funny lines isn't enough to shift the entire tone of the episode. At least this week, Hades and Zelena got to ride a bike and giggle, a dog got to drop a curtain on Zelena, and people fell through portals. This show is much more entertaining when they don't take themselves so seriously and they allow the main plot to have some excitement and energy.

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Are they even trying with the timeline anymore? When exactly did the OZ scenes happen? Zelena was an adult when she was with kid Dorothy and now Dorothy is all grown up and Zelena isn't 15 years older.

Dorothy's arrival in Oz as a child takes place chronologically before the flashbacks in The Doctor when Rumple sent Jefferson to get the slippers and they were already gone. Snow was still a child at that time and Regina had just started training. This flashback takes place closer to the casting of the first curse. Dorothy aged at the same rate Snow did. Regina and Zelena, being portrayed by the same actresses in both time periods, did not appear to age as much.

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Regina and Zelena, being portrayed by the same actresses in both time periods, did not appear to age as much.

At least with Regina, they make an effort to change her appearance to show where she is in time, and her acting changes. Young Regina -- from Daniel to early marriage -- has long hair, softer makeup and acts more wide-eyed and girlish. The hair goes up and the makeup gets harsher while her wardrobe gets crazier as she gets older. There's no discernible difference between the Zelena who met child Dorothy and the Zelena who met adult Dorothy. So either green skin doesn't age or the magic pendant has anti-aging properties (Glinda also didn't seem to have aged at all from the child Dorothy era to the present, when Snow and David visited her).

 

Rumple told way too many truths to Belle - truths he went to hell to avoid telling her. I'm not buying that it was him. I think Hades was just having fun.

 

That would make so much sense, and it would give us a really fun scene in the future, in which Belle runs into real Rumple, who's still trying to hide all this stuff from her, but she already knows the truth and catches him lying to her even more. Because otherwise it makes his decision to go to the Underworld to avoid her learning about him seem rather silly. If he was just going to spill it all right away, he could have removed himself entirely from Emma's power by just telling Belle about being the Dark One again.

 

One thing that wasn't mentioned in all the truth telling and that Belle apparently didn't figure out for herself: this wasn't just a case of Rumple scheming to get his powers back or taking them from an evil person. Hook sacrificed himself -- and Emma had to kill him -- to try to end the Darkness for good. Rumple co-opted that sacrifice by keeping the Darkness in this world, and used Hook's death to cover the fact that he had his powers back. The reason Hook had to die was to take the Darkness with him. He couldn't hold onto all the power that had gone into the sword. If he'd known Rumple was siphoning the power off, he wouldn't have had to die. That neck wound might still have killed him, but Emma wouldn't have had to run him through with Excalibur. But then they'd have known what Rumple was up to if he'd done it before Emma ran Hook through with the sword. So Rumple let Hook go through a pretty terrible death and Emma go through the traumatic experience of killing him to cover up his stealing the power. Does it not matter at all to Belle what Rumple let her friends go through? If she stays with him after this, she's not allowed to be called a hero. She's condoning evil.

 

The writing of this show is so scattered that I can't be sure if Hades was genuine in his romantic gestures to Zelena and we're meant to see them as good and sincere, if he was genuine but kind of lame, or if he's playing her. Or if they've forgotten their own continuity yet again and this was their weak attempt at handwaving the reason they used existing locations and sets for the Underworld. Zelena didn't give a damn about creating Storybrooke. I don't think she ever even knew what the curse would do. She just wanted to be the one chosen to cast it because it would have been the one time she was chosen over her sister. So creating the Underworld to be Storybrooke wasn't exactly a romantic gesture.

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One other thing I thought I noticed... did Zelena call the munchkin she did away with Boq? I'm not super versed in the original Oz books, but isn't that just 'Wicked' canon? They are seriously all over the place if so. I did appreciate the Quadling reference though, because I believe that is original Oz.

 

I heard Boq. I haven't read the Oz books in years, but I believe he was the Munchkin who offered Dorothy shelter on her first night in Oz. So he is Oz canon as well as Wicked.

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This was an okay episode.  I liked that Robin explained not giving the baby a name so that Hades couldn't put her name on a tombstone; I just wish he would have said that to Zelena.  I felt bad for Zelena giving the baby back.  If she's going to stay on the show, I'm hoping that she will stay somewhat a villain, but able to be a part of her daughter's life.

 

Is Cora still in the underworld?  He mentioned taking care of her, but the last I remember was that she once again became the Miller's Daughter.  I don't remember her ending up anywhere else during the other episodes.  If she's still around, I'm hoping that we will get a scene with Zelena and Cora (and possibly even Regina in the mix).  

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Rumple told way too many truths to Belle - truths he went to hell to avoid telling her. I'm not buying that it was him. I think Hades was just having fun.

 

I think you may be on to something, kili. Between the uncharacteristic straightforwardness of it and the vaguely ominous background music, I could totally buy that it was Hades in disguise. 

 

Alternatively, it was an anvil. Generally, when a character gives a speech like: "Sorry, snookums, but this is how it is. I'm going to have my cake and eat it too, and that's never going to change. Nopetty-nope, never, no, no #HellToTheNope" it means we're anywhere from one to five episodes from a scene where the only possible choice is to give up the cake and change. 

 

What I don't think it was was the sign of any change in the basic Rumbelle relationship. That will continue to make only as much sense as the rest of Rumpel's story, which is to say: very little.

 

I guess we'll find out if it was a case of Faux-Rumpeling in the next episode.

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EVERY villain has to be related/involved with the main characters in so Hades is Regina's almost brother in law.  sigh.  They really had to tack it on in a quick way.  I think it is "true love" or the show's version of it because Zelena didn't trust him - if she had, then it would totally be a trick.  I don't care either way but I thought Mader did a pretty excellent job in this episode being evil and being a sad mother.

 

Yes, hear the truth Belle!!  Just accept it and shake off the Stockholm Syndrome for the love of all that's holy!! You've always loved Rumple for who he really is - embrace your inner Lacy!  

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(edited)

 

So either green skin doesn't age or the magic pendant has anti-aging properties (Glinda also didn't seem to have aged at all from the child Dorothy era to the present, when Snow and David visited her).

This works for me. The pendant kept Zelena from dying.

 

I'm kind of wish this episode would have explained Zelena's weakness to light magic. Apparently it's Hades' weakness as well. I thought perhaps Hades would teach her some sort of magic that worked like that. Guess not.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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(edited)

EVERY villain has to be related/involved with the main characters in so Hades is Regina's almost brother in law.

I still have to shake myself every time Henry's on screen and I have to remind myself his adopted mother is the Evil Queen, his grandparents are Snow White, Prince Charming and Rumpelstilskin, his (almost) stepfather is Captain Hook and his great-grandfather is Peter Pan. Oh, and Hook was with both his mother and Grandmother.

Edited by AudienceofOne
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I liked Hook's floofy hair. :P

 

My favorite part of the episode was probably the scene in the diner with Snow and Charming, just because the whole level 1 haunting, or whatever it was called, reminded me of Beetlejuice. I also thought Munchkinland looked cool. I also didn't really mind Henry in this episode. I thought him ranting like a teenager, and everyone's reactions, were amusing.

 

I was actually surprised at how self aware so many of the characters were, like they all had some kind of psychological breakthrough. Not the greatest episode, but it was nice to get away from the torture and torment.

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AudienceofOne, on 04 Apr 2016 - 2:46 PM, said:

I still have to shake myself every time Henry's on screen and I have to remind myself his adopted mother is the Evil Queen, his grandparents are Snow White, Prince Charming and Rumpelstilskin, his (almost) father-in-law is Captain Hook and his great-grandfather is Peter Pan. Oh, and Hook was with both his mother and Grandmother.

 

Stepfather, not father-in-law.  He's not marrying one of Hook's daughters.

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I heard Boq. I haven't read the Oz books in years, but I believe he was the Munchkin who offered Dorothy shelter on her first night in Oz. So he is Oz canon as well as Wicked.

 

Ah, whoops. Thanks for that. Makes me feel better that they may leave Wicked unscathed!

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