S14.E09: Michael Ware, Sister Simone Campbell, Barney Frank, Rick Wilson, Esperanza Spalding

[GHScorpiosRule]

Journalist Michael Ware, Sister Simone Campbell, Former Mass. Rep. Barney Frank, Political Strategist Rick Wilson, Musician Esperanza Spalding

 

 

Yay! Sister Simone is finally on the panel! 

[Ruby25]

Haven't seen Barney Frank in a while. I'll be curious to hear what he has to say about Trump and the SCOTUS pick.

[Victor the Crab]

Really Bill? You're going to place the blame of the rise of Donald Drumph on Mr. Fumble, Hairy, and Bird? Cartoon characters I grew up with that I completely forgot about? The correct answer should be the mainstream media for not hitting this half orangutan hard on his proposals for America rather than slobbering all over his overrated overhyped self.

 

Someone should have mixed in some ground up Ritalin and served it in whatever they gave Michael Ware. He was totally annoying being his crazy self. But when he started being serious was someone worth listening to. Bill should have controlled him better.

 

Sister Simone was totally awesome in that show.

 

And those Bernie Sanders fans in Bill's audience showed why they are the most annoying and insufferable people in the country.

[shok]

I love Sister Simone! In her gently quiet way she espouses such truths. I loved the look of almost horror she had on her face in the early going when Rick Wilson was blathering on with his right wing points.

 

And I love Barney Frank in a completely different way. He was so effective in shutting Wilson up and not letting him interrupt. It was a master lesson that I wish many other guests would use with some of the right wing gasbags they're on with. Barney made a point that is missed by most pundits but which should be talked about more when he noted that Bernie Sanders has so far been able to skate by with an almost total lack of scrutiny and vetting. He also had some really good ideas about how to deal with coal jobs going away but his programs would never get through congress. They make too much sense.

 

Good show overall with interesting guests and some reasonable discussion. I enjoyed it.

[NextIteration]

Jesus, once again we get the childless Maher attempting to string together a nonsensical reason for the rise of tRump.  I'm especially peeved that he took a beautiful song about overcoming hardship and made it about the "everyone gets a trophy" movement.  There is no connection.  None.

 

New Rules was stupid, nonsensical and incoherent.  Maher is completely hit or miss lately.  His mid-section "joke" was dumb as well.

 

Aside from that, I enjoyed the show, once they smacked down Rick Wilson a couple times.

[33kaitykaity]

And I love Barney Frank in a completely different way. He was so effective in shutting Wilson up and not letting him interrupt. It was a master lesson that I wish many other guests would use with some of the right wing gasbags they're on with. .

Work of art, thing of beauty, pick your metaphor.  Poor Rick Wilson didn't know what hit him.  Whenever I see one of these gas bags on a freeform talk show like this, I invariably end up yelling "will you shut up and let other people talk" at the computer screen.  It was such a relief to see what Barney Frank did here.  

[HelenBaby]

Really Bill? You're going to place the blame of the rise of Donald Drumph on Mr. Fumble, Hairy, and Bird? Cartoon characters I grew up with that I completely forgot about? The correct answer should be the mainstream media for not hitting this half orangutan hard on his proposals for America rather than slobbering all over his overrated overhyped self.

 

Someone should have mixed in some ground up Ritalin and served it in whatever they gave Michael Ware. He was totally annoying being his crazy self. But when he started being serious was someone worth listening to. Bill should have controlled him better.

 

Sister Simone was totally awesome in that show.

 

And those Bernie Sanders fans in Bill's audience showed why they are the most annoying and insufferable people in the country.

And because he's totally in the bag for Senator Sanders, he ASKS THEIR PERMISSION to talk about Secretary Clinton. He repeated the lie that Sanders is the only one who can beat Drumpf when everything I've seen says exact opposite. I have nothing against Sanders, but surely his supporters see the writing on the wall.

Don't answer that. I know it's not that way at all, if my Facebook page is any indication.

[Queena]

And because he's totally in the bag for Senator Sanders, he ASKS THEIR PERMISSION to talk about Secretary Clinton. He repeated the lie that Sanders is the only one who can beat Drumpf when everything I've seen says exact opposite. I have nothing against Sanders, but surely his supporters see the writing on the wall.

Don't answer that. I know it's not that way at all, if my Facebook page is any indication.

I do! I think the problem is that people are hoping for a Obama like upset, like what happened in '08. It's not going to happen. I wish that it was, but sadly, it won't.

I adore Barney Frank. He's looking good! He hasn't changed, he's still funny and smart.

Sister Simone was very good too. There's something that I find admirable about ex-nuns, and ex anyone who were ultra religious. I find religion to be confining.

Esperanza has a very lovely voice.

Whatever was the first guest on? I know that I shouldn't have chuckled at Bill's 'quit touching me'.

The media is to blame for the rise of Trump. Plain and simple. However, you also must blame the Republican party, they've been saying the same things that he says, only not so coded. I'm against participation trophies, but I will teach my child to love himself. Bill totally missed the mark. I was slightly offended. Loving yourself doesn't mean that you have to be a narcissistic asshole!

Edited March 19, 2016 by Queena

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Rick went into full sulk after Barney chopped his interruptions off!  His body language and grip on his cup was enough evidence!  LMAO

[scrb]

Yeah it's not self-esteem that's the problem, it's narcissism.

Problem with Trump isn't too much self-esteem. In fact you might say the economically dispossessed who blames other countries and immigrant workers for their economic plight could use more self-esteem, not less.

There are well off people supporting Trump but the polling data shows less educated, blue collar people who've seen their incomes stagnate or worse are the ones supporting Trump.

[iMonrey]

 

Jesus, once again we get the childless Maher attempting to string together a nonsensical reason for the rise of tRump.  I'm especially peeved that he took a beautiful song about overcoming hardship and made it about the "everyone gets a trophy" movement.  There is no connection.  None.

 

I knew parents would get defensive over this. Bill is absolutely right about the way kids are being raised today IMO but it's a total stretch to say it has anything to do with Trump's behavior because he wasn't raised in that era.

 

I'd say the more accurate correlation is the way the young Sanders fans are behaving about Clinton, like if Sanders doesn't win the nomination they're all going to pick up their toys and go home. I've heard so many of them say they will NEVER vote for Clinton, as if they could care less if the result is a Trump presidency. They are as self destructive as the Republicans in that way.

 

And Barney made an excellent point - polls that show Sanders beating Trump or Cruz by a wider margin than Clinton are meaningless because Republicans have all but ignored him and have focused all their vehemence against Clinton. Imagine what they'll have in their arsenal if Sanders does somehow win the nomination, they're going to beat that whole socialist thing into the ground. On the other hand they've been attacking Clinton for the past 20 years and there's no new material there.

 

The other excellent point made by Barney was the fact that despite how it's all but destroyed their party the Republicans are doubling down on their pandering to their tea party base by refusing to consider the Supreme Court nominee. They will never learn their lesson to their own destruction.

 

I can't faut Rick Wilson too bad especially since Barney was so masterful at shutting him up. Wilson wasn't so much spouting right wing nonsense as he was talking political strategy. A losing strategy, grant you, but he sees the reasoning behind what they're doing without necessarily agreeing it will work.

 

Totally groaned at Bill's faux gay panic over Michael Ware touching him. Some people are just handsy like that. 

 

 

[NextIteration]

I knew parents would get defensive over this. Bill is absolutely right about the way kids are being raised today IMO but it's a total stretch to say it has anything to do with Trump's behavior because he wasn't raised in that era.

 

I'm a parent, but I don't think defensive is how I felt; it was just a stupid connection.  Believe me, I'm not a fan of everyone gets a trophy type thinking, far from it - but Bill tries to connect that mentality quite often to things that don't really make sense.  I think he misses the mark sometimes because he's not a parent, and is only making the observation from the outside, so his connection to it is tenuous.

[ganesh]

I think Garland is going to be confirmed by the end of the summer recess. I don't think they'll be able to wait till the lame duck period. 

 

Bill's point about kids was valid, but it didn't have anything to do with the 70s commerical, nor is it the reason for Trump, as Bill said on the show previously. 

 

The correct answer should be the mainstream media for not hitting this half orangutan hard on his proposals for America rather than slobbering all over his overrated overhyped self.

 

And for the party leadership for turning over the debates to the networks, who clearly intended to make them reality shows instead of actual political debates. 

The party itself is to blame for Trump too. They've been working at creating a "Trump" for decades, as Bill said on the show, but the only problem is they thought they would always be able to control their creation. And, not for nothing, the gop is completely disingenuous. If they can't stop Trump, and he's the nominee, it's not like they're not going to vote for him. I'm surprised that no one is saying Cruz is worse. Because he kind of is. 

 

It's funny how when you shut down the typical interruption tactic that the typical talking points kind of fizzle out because you can't keep just repeating them. Though to be fair, the middle guy made some good points on OT.

[b2H]

Along with all of you, I agree this was a great show, but did you notice that, pretty much until New Rules, not one f-bomb flew during the discussion phase? I suspect that may've been in deference to Sister.....

[SpiritSong]

 

I'd say the more accurate correlation is the way the young Sanders fans are behaving about Clinton, like if Sanders doesn't win the nomination they're all going to pick up their toys and go home. I've heard so many of them say they will NEVER vote for Clinton, as if they could care less if the result is a Trump presidency. They are as self destructive as the Republicans in that way.

 

 

 

Could you please stop denigrating people who intend to vote for someone other that YOUR preferred candidate? It's childish and divisive. If you want to vote for Clinton, vote for her. Nobody is saying you can't. Kindly extend the same courtesy to those who have a differing opinion of who would make a good president.

[IndianPaintbrush]

I don't think anyone is denigrating Sanders supporters.  They're denigrating the Sanders supporters who have vowed to stay home unless their candidate is the nominee.  

 

Look, I'm not a big Clinton fan.  But her political positions match my beliefs by 98%.  There is no doubt in my mind that she's qualified and she would make a competent president.  Voter turnout will be incredibly important in November.  It would be really, really stupid of me not to vote for her if she's the nominee, because look at the alternative.

[scrb]

Trump said his supporters would riot if he doesn't win the nomination.

 

Sanders supporters have said they'll throw a tantrum and go home if Sanders doesn't win.

 

Well Sanders isn't going to win, so now what?

[ganesh]

I don't think anyone is denigrating Sanders supporters.  They're denigrating the Sanders supporters who have vowed to stay home unless their candidate is the nominee.

 

At the last republican debate, everyone attacked Trump. "If Trump is the nominee will you vote for him." Unanimous agreement. Romney will publicly endorse Trump if he is the nominee. No one is going to suddenly vote for Clinton. 

 

It is patently naive and borderline dangerous to "go home" if Sanders isn't nominated. Especially if there is no one on scotus yet.

 

It would be really, really stupid of me not to vote for her if she's the nominee, because look at the alternative.

 

If this isn't part of Clinton's general election strategy, then she needs a new campaign team. 

 

I've heard so many of them say they will NEVER vote for Clinton, as if they could care less if the result is a Trump presidency.

 

With the subsequent canard that a Trump presidency would be so bad that a "real progressive" would easily win in 2020. Well, what about the ensuing 4 years first? What if they actually can repeal the ACA? Who else would have a national platform to push for raising the minimum wage? 

 

[Ruby25]

It's impossible to say what Trump would actually do once in office though. I think Bill's right- Trump doesn't really want to BE president, he just wants to be called president.

 

I can't imagine him going to briefings, sitting in the situation room, actually DOING the job. In those situations in history the person tends to let his advisors/cabinet take over everything (like Ulysses Grant or even George W. Bush), but Trump's such a raging egomaniac that I can't imagine him doing that either. It would genuinely be really dangerous to let him hold that office, because he's be out of control and totally unpredictable. He doesn't even have a campaign staff, he's running this whole thing on free media coverage and he's got like two other guys with him.

[ganesh]

It's impossible to say what Trump would actually do once in office though. I think Bill's right- Trump doesn't really want to BE president, he just wants to be called president.

 

 

I don't know. I don't think Trump is an idiot. I think he got into this race, as many did, to up his brand. I think he was surprised how well he took off. At some point, he probably went "let's see how far this goes...wow, I'm seriously going to be the nominee? HA!"

 

Honestly, I think Trump would delegate a ton. Like Bush. Foreign policy would be awful though. He'd have the freedom to go one on one with other leaders and they'd laugh in his face. 

 

The problem is, to whom? Most likely, people who tout the same, "cut taxes for the rich to stimulate growth" garbage they've been peddling. I doubt Trump would let the gop leaders in congress push him around, but chances are we'd see a lot legislation that's just not good. They already got the ACA repeal all the way to Obama's veto. 

 

If they deny him the nomination, he has to run as third party. 

[Ruby25]

I love how the guy in the middle was flat out saying that the Republicans have good reason to block Garland because hey, we're talking about giving the Supreme Court a liberal majority for perhaps the next generation- well guess what, asshole? That's how it WORKS. The flip was going to happen someday and yes, that day is now here. Suck it up.

[33kaitykaity]

I love how the guy in the middle was flat out saying that the Republicans have good reason to block Garland because hey, we're talking about giving the Supreme Court a liberal majority for perhaps the next generation- well guess what, asshole? That's how it WORKS. The flip was going to happen someday and yes, that day is now here. Suck it up.

Yeah, it would've happened 16 years ago if the ReThuglicans hadn't used Fat Tony and Uncle Clarence and that group to steal the 2000 election.  We wouldn't have Roberts or Sammy the Fish if it weren't for the Felonious Five and their illegal ruling on Bush v. Gore.  

[Ruby25]

Another thing I think is stupid is why should they promise to confirm Garland in the lame duck session? I mean, fuck them, if they lose the election (which it already seems like some of them are conceding, since Trump's the nominee and they know he's going down), Hillary should get to make her own appointment with the new Democratic senate, shouldn't she?

 

I mean, that's ALSO how it works. They don't just get to say, oh we'll get him in after the election. Nope. Sorry, assholes. If you lose the election Hillary gets to make her own choice and it'll be very likely be a more liberal, younger person rather than this guy who none of you actually have any problem with (other than losing the majority on the court but boo-hoo for you). I hate the GOP.

[HalcyonDays]

People...you're killing me. Discuss the show, not politics. And yes, I wish we HAD a thread SOMEWHERE here on PTV to discuss politics, but we don't and never will. If we did, I would be ranting ad infinitum, and I'm not even an American. Please, please DO NOT slam others for their political beliefs (as hard as it may be). Also, this thread is to discuss the show, not the insanity of American Politics, aka CrazyDecision 2016. Thank you.

[attica]

My favorite moment of the ep -- hell, of the season so far -- was the end of the Ware interview when MW pulled Bill into a hug and whispered to him (into a still-live mic), "You fucking cunt" in that awesome Aussie bonhomie.

 

All of the points that Wilson was making about Trump and his overthrow, that there were better candidates in the wings (hah, but, whatev) overlooks the one and only salient point. The actual republican voters. Those voters don't give a shit about what Wilson thinks; they've absorbed all the coded messages fed to them by Wilson and his ilk for the past few decades, and now they want its apotheosis: Donald. And now Wilson is all 'we know better than the voters' as if they're an inconvenience to be worked around, but he's really too late. The ship has sailed.

 

I think I want Simone's glasses. Very fetch.

[iMonrey]

 

I'm surprised that no one is saying Cruz is worse. Because he kind of is.

 

He definitely is, and I was shocked to hear Bill say he'd rather have Cruz than Trump, given the way Bill rails against religion.

[alias1]

He definitely is, and I was shocked to hear Bill say he'd rather have Cruz than Trump, given the way Bill rails against religion.

I think Bill would rather have Cruz because he's the devil we know.  And Hillary would have no problem against him.  Trump is such a loose cannon, no one knows what lies and crudeness he would come up with if he's the nominee.  He already has an ad that shows Hillary barking.  I think she will beat Trump (if he gets that far) but I think she'd have an easier time beating Cruz (and that's probably why Bill said that).

[SpiritSong]

I know he did it for the joke, but I was pleased to see Bill highlight Hillary's latest sleazy campaign tactic, where she sarcastically asked where her opponent was in '93 when she was trying to get health care passed. Then she promptly got her ass handed her to her when the Sanders campaign put out a photo with the caption Literally, standing right behind you. What wasn't shown was her thanking Bernie, IN HER OWN WORDS, for all of his support.

 

This kind of distortion, innuendo and half truth is straight out of the Lee Atwater/Karl Rove playbook. What bothers me most about it is her fans don't seem to care. Anything at all to win. Then they act baffled when polls consistently show the majority of the country considers her dishonest and willing to do anything to gain power. Um, hello.

 

This was discussed on the show, so I hope it's fair game for talking about here.

[ganesh]

I also think Bill was saying that Cruz being the nominee would be better for the general election against potentially Clinton.

[shok]

 

polls consistently show the majority of the country considers her dishonest

 

Polls consistently show her in the lead too. Not only polls...actual votes too.

[lovinbob]

 

Sister Simone was very good too. There's something that I find admirable about ex-nuns, and ex anyone who were ultra religious. I find religion to be confining.

She's not an ex-nun, is she? She's still with the Sisters of Social Service. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

She's not an ex-nun, is she? She's still with the Sisters of Social Service.

She told Bill that she was ex-communicated/defrocked.

[attica]

Her twitter handle says she's still a Sister, so maybe it's just her RC-affiliation that's been revoked, not her standing in the sisterhood. Which, I admit I know nothing about, so don't mind me.

[lovinbob]

I didn't see the show, so I won't disagree with you about what she said, but from what I've read, the Vatican censured Nuns on the Bus and did an investigation, but they and she have been cleared. 

[Maherjunkie]

 

I'm especially peeved that he took a beautiful song about overcoming hardship and made it about the "everyone gets a trophy" movement.  There is no connection.  None.

Are you referring to that god-awful Whitney Houston song?

 

And while the self esteem movement may have gone too far in someways, since when are teachers always right?  Thank god my mother listened to me as a child when I  needed it.

[represent]

This kind of distortion, innuendo and half truth is straight out of the Lee Atwater/Karl Rove playbook. What bothers me most about it is her fans don't seem to care. Anything at all to win. Then they act baffled when polls consistently show the majority of the country considers her dishonest and willing to do anything to gain power. Um, hello.

 

 

 

Polls consistently show her in the lead too. Not only polls...actual votes too.

You got that right.

 

Hehe, and I don't care. As a fan, I really don't. Until they find the "dead" bodies she's supposed to be hiding, she's got my vote.

 

Please, no way in hell do I NOT believe there is as much blood if not more on all of the other candidates hands except Bernie. I do buy that he's as legit as it gets. But he's not taxing my retirement to help out the poor. Sorry, I get that Socialism evens things out but don't touch the middle class AT ALL to do it with that Wall Street Speculation bull, no, just no. The fat cats never pay enough and we in the middle what's left of us get screwed.

 

I'm pretty sure that  from time of my first vote at eighteen years of age, I've been voting for a ton of criminals, in their fancy, proper, classy suits, they wrote the laws, don't trust them. never have, never will. That being said, why the hell should I hold the first woman who I happen to have ALWAYS liked, more than her husband quite frankly, to a higher standard? No, I don't think so, they all need to be side eyed.

 

What it was, was another stupid move by her camp not watching her back.

 

Seriously, this is NOT a hard lie to keep up with, she already played it.

 

When I heard it again this time around I was WTF?  

 

What in the hell is the Hillary camp doing? Do they not remember MSNBC covering this lie already, earlier in the campaign when she first said it?

 

I even remember the Bernie camp posting the note that she wrote thanking Bernie with her signature, then the picture with them sitting on the couch, LOL. 

 

Karen Finney and Robby Mook need to wake the fuck up and do your job, watch your candidate's back. Before she goes out to open her mouth run through the points, my goodness.

Edited March 22, 2016 by represent

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

I even remember the Bernie camp posting the note that she wrote thanking Bernie with her signature, then the picture with them sitting on the couch, LOL.

 

 

 

She aught to fire her campaign manager. Josh Lyman would never make this stupid mistake. Twice.

 

But I quoted you to note the fact that she leading the so called radical "revolution" way back when she was a public official is lost in the shuffle.

 

I am frustrated she can't surround herself with the right people who can highlight her handwork, instead of always being on the defensive. 

 

The Republicans have done a major number on her reputation and her team have let them. 

Edited March 22, 2016 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[tenativelyyours]

She aught to fire her campaign manager. Josh Lyman would never make this stupid mistake. Twice.

 

But I quoted you to note the fact that she leading the so called radical "revolution" way back when she was a public official is lost in the shuffle.

 

I am frustrated she can't surround herself with the right people who can highlight her handwork, instead of always being on the defensive. 

 

The Republicans have done a major number on her reputation and her team have let them. 

 

I've heard a rumor that the NY Times is crafting a piece on her should she get the nomination that goes to that point.  Mainly that the Obama campaign machine is still out there in pieces ready to be re-formed.  But that not only did the Clintons piss many of these people off in 2008, but even when she was part of the Obama administration as State, she still offended many instead of working to make sure such an apparatus shifted to her more fully when she moved into the race. 

 

I think part of the problem is what, as often with incredibly intelligent people, they end up always assuming they are the smartest people in the room or that whatever conclusion they have formed is the best or even just the only one.  There is something so awkward about the woman and her approach that is odd since it seems to have grown in my opinion.  For all her gaffes as First Lady, watching the raft of interviews and in depth stories of those days and she actually seems much more savvy and at ease with what she wants to accomplish as a leader.

 

I don't blame her handlers because Bernie's presence back then should have been in her mind.  Just as I don't blame her handlers for the Nancy Reagan comments.  I plan on voting for her but for the love of gawd, Bob and Frank, she needs to step up her game.  Having good handlers is necessary.  I get that.  But she needs to adopt a stronger leadership mode.  Because no matter how tough this is, her first 100 days (an insanely stupid metric but then so is pretty much everything Washington employs) is going to be a whole lot worse.

 

Damn I am so going to miss President Obama.  I knew that on my own, but I hate Bill for having so strongly re-enforced that lately. 

[33kaitykaity]

There are so many examples of Hillary not thinking before speaking on this campaign, it just boggles the mind.  This was on March 13 at a CNN Democratic town hall.  It was ghastly, or as Mediaite columnist Alex Griswold said, a ready-made Re[Thug]lican campaign ad.  

I’m the only candidate which has a policy about how to bring economic opportunity using clean renewable energy as the key into coal country. Because we’re going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business, right Tim?

Really, HIllary?  Then there was the comment at Nancy Reagan's funeral about how the Reagans were so good about the HIV/AIDS issue that Hillary had to issue a long mea culpa for later on when she realized that the only reason Ronald Reagan ever did anything about HIV/AIDS was when his friend Rock Hudson got the disease.  She said she confused Nancy Reagan's stance on stem cell research with HIV/AIDS. Riigghhtt. 

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll vote for Hillary if and when the time comes, but she'd better shape up and fast.  These are the kinds of unforced errors that can become increasingly more costly the further we get into this shit storm of an election season.  

This was discussed on the show, so I hope it's fair game for talking about here.

Ditto.  ;)

Edited March 23, 2016 by 33kaitykaity

[NextIteration]

I've heard a rumor that the NY Times is crafting a piece on her should she get the nomination that goes to that point.  Mainly that the Obama campaign machine is still out there in pieces ready to be re-formed. 

 

A fair majority of the Obama election machine started this cycle on Clinton's team.

 

There are so many examples of Hillary not thinking before speaking on this campaign, it just boggles the mind.  This was on March 13 at a CNN Democratic town hall.  It was ghastly, or as Mediaite columnist Alex Griswold said, a ready-made Re[Thug]lican campaign ad.  

Really, HIllary?  Then there was the comment at Nancy Reagan's funeral about how the Reagans were so good about the HIV/AIDS issue that Hillary had to issue a long mea culpa for later on when she realized that the only reason Ronald Reagan ever did anything about HIV/AIDS was when his friend Rock Hudson got the disease.  She said she confused Nancy Reagan's stance on stem cell research with HIV/AIDS. Riigghhtt. 

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll vote for Hillary if and when the time comes, but she'd better shape up and fast.  These are the kinds of unforced errors that can become increasingly more costly the further we get into this shit storm of an election season.  

Ditto.  ;)

 

I think the intent of what she said about coal mining jobs was good but jeebus, she served up an ad for the GOP in the fall.  I also think that her Nancy Reagan moment was a conflation in her memory of HIV with stem cell research.  I know that it caused an uproar in the LGBTIQQ community, and that was a good thing because it forced her out with a correction almost immediately.  I think it's hard to fault her for trying to find a nice thing to say about Nancy Reagan at her funeral.

 

I really thought that Karen Finney would have served Clinton better, especially since she had a stint on MSNBC with her own show.

 

And @Maherjunkie, we'll have to agree to disagree, I have an abiding love of that song - my daughter danced a solo to it and won big back in the day. ;)

[Maherjunkie]

I am sure she brought some life to it, unlike Whitney herself.

[iMonrey]

 

I think Bill would rather have Cruz because he's the devil we know.  And Hillary would have no problem against him.  Trump is such a loose cannon, no one knows what lies and crudeness he would come up with if he's the nominee.  He already has an ad that shows Hillary barking.  I think she will beat Trump (if he gets that far) but I think she'd have an easier time beating Cruz (and that's probably why Bill said that).

 

Cruz would bring the evangelicals out to vote in full force and Bill has to know that. He may be the "devil we know" but what we know about him is far scarier than Trump, so I can't believe Maher would really rather have a creationist sitting in the Oval Office with his itchy Armageddon finger on the red button. Trump has proven he knows next to nothing about the bible.

 

And polls show Hillary beating Trump by a much wider margin than Cruz (some polls show Cruz beating Hillary). 

[ktwo]

Jennifer Granholm and Sen. Cory Booker tomorrow! Squeeee!

[IndianPaintbrush]

Cruz would bring the evangelicals out to vote in full force and Bill has to know that. He may be the "devil we know" but what we know about him is far scarier than Trump, so I can't believe Maher would really rather have a creationist sitting in the Oval Office with his itchy Armageddon finger on the red button. Trump has proven he knows next to nothing about the bible.

I don't know.  I'm more scared of Trump's trigger finger than I am of Cruz's.  Even though I loathe him deeply, I feel like Cruz could probably make it through a meeting with a foreign leader without insulting them and starting World War III.  I can't say the same about Trump.

[Victor the Crab]

They're both disgusting in their own ways. Neither one should be anywhere's near the White House.

[alias1]

Cruz would bring the evangelicals out to vote in full force and Bill has to know that. He may be the "devil we know" but what we know about him is far scarier than Trump, so I can't believe Maher would really rather have a creationist sitting in the Oval Office with his itchy Armageddon finger on the red button. Trump has proven he knows next to nothing about the bible.

 

And polls show Hillary beating Trump by a much wider margin than Cruz (some polls show Cruz beating Hillary). 

Cruz's appeal seems to be limited to the die hard evangelicals.  At this point I think other people are voting for him only as part of the Stop Trump thing.  I haven't seen a poll where Cruz beats Hillary, but she does beat him by less than she beats Trump.  

 

I don't know.  I'm more scared of Trump's trigger finger than I am of Cruz's.  Even though I loathe him deeply, I feel like Cruz could probably make it through a meeting with a foreign leader without insulting them and starting World War III.  I can't say the same about Trump.

I agree with is.  And I think that was Bill's point.  We all hate him, but Cruz is a little more predictable 

Edited March 25, 2016 by SierraMist

[tenativelyyours]

A fair majority of the Obama election machine started this cycle on Clinton's team.

 

 

I think the intent of what she said about coal mining jobs was good but jeebus, she served up an ad for the GOP in the fall.  I also think that her Nancy Reagan moment was a conflation in her memory of HIV with stem cell research.  I know that it caused an uproar in the LGBTIQQ community, and that was a good thing because it forced her out with a correction almost immediately.  I think it's hard to fault her for trying to find a nice thing to say about Nancy Reagan at her funeral.

 

I really thought that Karen Finney would have served Clinton better, especially since she had a stint on MSNBC with her own show.

 

And @Maherjunkie, we'll have to agree to disagree, I have an abiding love of that song - my daughter danced a solo to it and won big back in the day. ;)

 

Going by Finney's own comments and David Axelrod weighing in, it sounds like there are still a lot of key personnel at county levels still focused on state campaigns.  No doubt willing to wade in and support whoever gets the nomination.  But trying to overcome the perception of "voting against a candidate on the Republican Ticket" as Finney admitted the last time on MSNBC and instead falling in to support Hillary now has apparently been frustrating since they want a much greater wave and a more dynamic appearance than what they have had so far in my opinion.  According to what I gathered from Finney these people are often the same people tapped into positions of influence in big local union chapters and particularly in the local school districts.  PA, NY and MD are going to be the key according to Axelrod to see if she can bring those people over since those are states that have that tendency --- Obama's gun comment still comes to mind. 

 

I'm not sure what the other what and see states are.  I think OH and VA are as well.  They were the same people who seemed to support Hillary and then swerved to Obama.  They aren't a huge deal as a local entity in state races but when they shift on en masse is when they make a difference.  Clinton's campaign wooed them in NJ and it seems to have worked.  Especially, as you say, on a national level that Obama apparatus has shifted to work for Clinton.  But the big names sadly didn't have the galvanizing pull in midterms and it doesn't seem they are the lock for a new if known candidate. 

 

I know some of this is heavily tainted by the perception that I'm not a huge Clinton fan.  I feel she has been forced on us.  I don't say this in support of Bernie at all mind you.  I'm not a huge fan of his either.  And I get that for the most part we have little choice in who our national candidates are.  I think that is what attracts people to Bernie and to President Obama.  And yes Drumpf and even some of the other Republicans who have inexplicable rises in polls these last two elections.  anyone who seems to buck the "anointed" candidate perception can be very attractive simply for the fact that many of us contrarians don't like it when we feel we have no real choice.

 

But I will be interested to see the analysis if this story turns out on who ended up shifting to Clinton on local levels in some of the larger more progressively voting states in national campaigns before the convention and nomination.

Edited March 26, 2016 by tenativelyyours