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The Duggars: In the Media and TLC

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1 hour ago, Chicklet said:

I wouldn't trust a Duggar or Bates with any amount of money and I would demand transparency which is not going to happen as Grift is their blood type.

My guess is that it's partly a fundraising scam and partly a clumsy attempt to deflect attention away from Josh and all the bad publicity he's brought down upon them: "See, no matter what Josh may have done, we're all really good people! We care about human suffering!".

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Next will be "we have seen the Duggars but we don't really know them and they aren't our type of Christian."

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They're probably looking for money to help with Josh's defense.

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12 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

Was Josh ever part of Medi Corps?

Not to my knowledge.

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3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I have no idea how legit (or not) the Duggar/Bates organization is, but what makes me suspicious is, for the last year many US states were suffering and clamoring for help. Where were they then?

I guess it could be because there wasn't enough supplies and donations to go around during that time, but it seems to me MedicCorps only show their faces when its other countries.

Or is it a white savior thing? Or maybe they 'help' unsuspecting countries that initially appreciate the help. Help that turns out to be a Mickey Mouse operation?

Or maybe they're legit?

Well, there are a fair number of fundamentalist mission hospitals in India. Countries like that with few Christians are considered big and important 'mission fields" for them.

My guess is that one of those mission hospitals has some connection to somebody these people know -- maybe from a church they've been in or run by a Gothardite. So mediccorps is collecting money that they'll send to that hospital (after taking "administrative fees," of course).

I think a lot of their co-religionists will quickly read this -- correctly -- as money going to a conversion mission in a "heathen" country. And since that's something they believe they're especially charged by God to do, that'll burnish mediccorps' image.

Whereas doing something in the U.S. about covid, they'd be unlikely to be able to channel any money through a conversion-mission-run health operation, since in the U.S. a lot of conservative Protestants have been on the Covid-isn't-real side. and hospitals here aren't often run by their ilk. 

So it's definitely white savior.

But the place where they're almost certainly directing their money isn't itself unsuspecting, exactly. I'm sure everybody in its neighborhood has long known that the hospital is run by American conservative Protestants looking to convert people, alongside whatever else they might do. So, you know, hard to tell how much individuals who get care there are bothered or not bothered by the conversion part. 

I think the idea of godbothering somebody when you're also extending "charity" of whatever kind is rotten. But I know that it's something they definitely see as commanded by the scriptures, so there you are. Just hope that the mediccorps grifters don't take too big a fee and that the hospital they're supporting is more about health and care than it is about pressuring people to convert. With this gang knowing them, though, that's probably not too likely. But you never know. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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JimBob needs to pay for a legal defense....then suddenly this?  We are all not as dumb as your children, Duggars.

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If you actually go to the Mediccorps website, the only Duggars/Bates represented are John David and Nathan Bates. The one who is actually listed at the top is Dr. E. Elias Gollapalli, DO who specializes in emergency medicine. He is named as the Medical Director for Mediccorps.

Interestingly, there are two MDs listed and they are both women.

And then you've got JD, Nathan, and Andrew Patton, with maybe some EMT training at most but otherwise are not presumably at the level of these other individuals.

https://mediccorps.org/who-we-are-2/

I don't know how much of a grift it is - they note they are a non-profit - but they clearly have a religious angle in their medical missions.

Edited by madpsych78
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2 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

Dr. E. Elias Gollapalli, DO

A little googling so is this guy has medical licenses in Florida Michigan, and Kansas. He seems to live very close to the SOS ministries people. Maybe a coincidence. Probably not a coincidence.

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53 minutes ago, JoanArc said:

A little googling so is this guy has medical licenses in Florida Michigan, and Kansas. He seems to live very close to the SOS ministries people. Maybe a coincidence. Probably not a coincidence.

It also seems that his actual first name is Esli although he uses Elias professionally.  Gollapalli is an Asian surname and there is a village called Gollapalli in India.

Best case scenario: Dr Gollapalli is either from India or has family there and has deep connections to the country and is better able to assist in this crisis than many other American fundamentalists/evangelicals.

Many Indian physicians in the US, Christian or otherwise, use some of their income to build and staff clinics and small hospitals in the areas where their family originated.  They often will spend their vacation time away from their US practices working in their clinics in India.

So, while I don't trust the Duggars or Bates; I believe they didn't hook up with this guy until after the disaster in the Bahamas (their behavior was the disaster); so maybe they now have someone in their organization who has some altruistic leanings.

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I may be wrong but I believe Mediccorps also helped out after the tornado in Nashville a year or two ago.  Still think they mostly get in the way of the real first responders though.

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the bates boys have been shown working on tornado clean up several times. clearing trees and such things. that seems to be something they can actually do and have equipment to accomplish.

that said they have done 0 of that since they got the charitable status and donations started coming in. they pose as this global charity taking donations they spend on skydiving training, scuba rescue training, instructor brought in to teach them all a basic level first aid course

In my opinion they are avoiding weather related disaster areas in the US because they cannot waltz in with meaningless constable badges and glocks and commandeer things like they apparently did in the Bahamas.

 

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The Duggar boys were in Lake Charles, LA helping with clean up after the hurricanes that devastated the area last year. I was there too and saw them working. No idea how long they stayed or how much they actually did, but they were there. 

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I'm upset this forty years shit is all over the media. People will be outraged and disappointed when Josh only gets 10 years. The media should be preparing people for more accurate sentencing.

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If Josh volunteers for the program for sexual offenders, this is where he could do  some of his time, if convicted:

FA369D96-9C84-49A4-8D20-6D5B41236910.jpeg

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I think that article is great, but what I still don't understand is how anyone who watched 19 Kids and Counting didn't see much of what is described.

The family was overtly religious, they talked about the buddy system and they talked about jurisdictions. They even talked about blanket training.

It didn't take long to notice this was a religiously nutty patriarchal family enforcing ridiculous rules. By maybe the second episode, one of my kids was outraged and never watched another episode.

Edited by GeeGolly
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21 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I think that article is great, but what I still don't understand how anyone who watched 19 Kids and Counting didn't see much of what is described.

The family was overtly religious, they talked about the buddy system and they talked about jurisdictions. They even talked about blanket training.

It didn't take long to notice this was a religiously nutty patriarchal family enforcing ridiculous rules. By the maybe the second episode, one of my kids was outraged and never watched another episode.

Yeah, I wonder that, too.

But I guess that if you lived in a similar situation and experienced a lot of interpersonal and internal strife and negative emotions from it  (which that woman clearly did), you might feel as if just hearing people on the show lay out the facts but not show much of the strife and struggle wasn't enough to communicate what it was really like? 

I mean "buddy system" might sound kind of cute, even, if you just heard it. But if you were a 10-year-old girl who was actually in full charge of changing a baby's diapers and lugging it around all day, that might lead to some awful feelings, family fights, whippings with plumbing line and so on......and if you'd been that 10-year-old (and 11, and 12, etc. year old)  all that would seem like the true essence of the thing.....And if you didn't see any of that on tv, then you might see the show as really sugarcoating something that was hell to you? 

I mean, if she's a Gothardite, for example, then she would know that people who worked for ATI/IBLP have said that virtually all the new families they picked up once the Duggar show started airing came in saying that they were attracted by the wonderful Duggars and their wonderful life.......And if you had experienced that life as horrible, not wonderful, as a child, that might bug you a lot, I think....And make you consider the show false advertising. 

I mean, it's the difference between "documentary" -- which will generally show the bad stuff, too -- and "reality show" -- which will show something edited and scripted to highlight fun and inspiration......The difference may seem subtle if you haven't experienced the thing, but if you have experienced it might feel like a very big difference. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I think that article is great, but what I still don't understand is how anyone who watched 19 Kids and Counting didn't see much of what is described.

The family was overtly religious, they talked about the buddy system and they talked about jurisdictions. They even talked about blanket training.

It didn't take long to notice this was a religiously nutty patriarchal family enforcing ridiculous rules. By maybe the second episode, one of my kids was outraged and never watched another episode.

Did they really talk about blanket training on the show?   I can't believe that didn't get backlash.    Not saying I don't believe what you said, just shocked they didn't lose their audience and show right then.

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12 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Did they really talk about blanket training on the show?   I can't believe that didn't get backlash.    Not saying I don't believe what you said, just shocked they didn't lose their audience and show right then.

Yes they did, and demonstrated it, minus striking the child. They used to provide links to the Pearls on their website as well. I believe they described it as training a child to have instant obedience. Although I can't remember a particular scene, I think they also touted "spare the rod, spoil the child", on the show.

They also talked somewhat in depth about the buddy system, including Michelle passing off the babies at six months old.

Edited by GeeGolly
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30 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Did they really talk about blanket training on the show?   I can't believe that didn't get backlash.    Not saying I don't believe what you said, just shocked they didn't lose their audience and show right then.

I haven't watched the show but over the years I've read a number of descriptions of what she allegedly said in one of the very early shows (maybe before the actual series?) ....

The account I've most often seen is that she was describing -- or demonstrating -- the homeschooling and she said that she trained the kids below school age to sit on a blanket or in a chair and not move or make noise so she could concentrate on teaching the older ones.

But I don't think anybody ever alleged that she explained on tv exactly how she trained them. No mention of hitting, in other words. Just something about a quick correction ( or some such word) every time they broke the regulation, with people allowed to assume that meant something like shaking her finger and saying "No! Naughty!" or quickly picking the kid up and putting them back on the blanket or something. 

And if people don't know about the Pearls and are already in love with the "cute" "funny" Duggar brand with the superb mother of the year in charge, they would likely have believed that the omission told the whole truth....

I'm sure TLC wouldn't have included anything about hitting. Nor would the Duggars, since they were trying hard to win souls for Gothard (and a long-lasting TeeVee contract) at the time (and succeeding at both). 

To say that's explaining blanket training is really false, though, to me. The key to blanket training is not the blanket. It's the ruler, switch, paint-mixing stick or plumbing line. Not to mention the big tactic the Pearls use (and the Duggars, I'm sure, mimicked), which is to repeatedly try to lure the kid off the blanket by being smiley and waving favorite toys or treats -- and when the kid gives in to temptation, whack it with a ruler again. 

That's where the magic happens, obviously. So to say they actually showed blanket training when they didn't show that isn't really accurate, I don't think. As with so much else, they discussed a thoroughly whitewashed and castrated version of blanket training. So -- lie.   

Edited by Churchhoney
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14 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Yes they did, and demonstrated it, minus striking the child. They used to provide links to the Pearls on their website as well. I believe they described it as training a child to have instant obedience. Although I can't remember a particular scene, I think they also touted "spare the rod, spoil the child", on the show.

They also talked somewhat in depth about the buddy system, including Michelle passing off the babies at six months old.

Just when I think TLC cannot possibly get any mankier they manage to prove me wrong yet again.   You truly have to wonder if anyone at that network has any idea what ethics or scruples are -- or even a scrap of humanity for that matter. 

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12 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

I haven't watched the show but over the years I've read a number of descriptions of what she allegedly said in one of the very early shows (maybe before the actual series?) ....

The account I've most often seen is that she was describing -- or demonstrating -- the homeschooling and she said that she trained the kids below school age to sit on a blanket or in a chair and not move or make noise so she could concentrate on teaching the older ones.

But I don't think anybody ever alleged that she explained on tv exactly how she trained them. No mention of hitting, in other words. Just something about a quick correction ( or some such word) every time they broke the regulation, with people allowed to assume that meant something like shaking her finger and saying "No! Naughty!" or quickly picking the kid up and putting them back on the blanket or something. 

And if people don't know about the Pearls and are already in love with the "cute" "funny" Duggar brand with the superb mother of the year in charge, they would likely have believed that the omission told the whole truth....

I'm sure TLC wouldn't have included anything about hitting. Nor would the Duggars, since they were trying hard to win souls for Gothard (and a long-lasting TeeVee contract) at the time (and succeeding at both). 

To say that's explaining blanket training is really false, though, to me. The key to blanket training is not the blanket. It's the ruler, switch, paint-mixing stick or plumbing line. Not to mention the big tactic the Pearls use (and the Duggars, I'm sure, mimicked), which is to repeatedly try to lure the kid off the blanket by being smiley and waving favorite toys or treats -- and when the kid gives in to temptation, whack it with a ruler again. 

That's where the magic happens, obviously. So to say they actually showed blanket training when they didn't show that isn't really accurate, I don't think. As with so much else, they discussed a thoroughly whitewashed and castrated version of blanket training. So -- lie.   

Can't forget the saccharine, keep sweet, baby voice delivery.  

I can imagine what the reality of hearing her voice unleashed, echoing through the TTH and truly yelling at her offspring is really like. 

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10 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

I haven't watched the show but over the years I've read a number of descriptions of what she allegedly said in one of the very early shows (maybe before the actual series?) ....

The account I've most often seen is that she was describing -- or demonstrating -- the homeschooling and she said that she trained the kids below school age to sit on a blanket or in a chair and not move or make noise so she could concentrate on teaching the older ones.

But I don't think anybody ever alleged that she explained on tv exactly how she trained them. No mention of hitting, in other words. Just something about a quick correction ( or some such word) every time they broke the regulation, with people allowed to assume that meant something like shaking her finger and saying "No! Naughty!" or quickly picking the kid up and putting them back on the blanket or something. 

And if people don't know about the Pearls and are already in love the "cute" "funny" Duggar brand with the superb mother of the year in charge, they would likely have believed that the omission told the whole truth....

I'm sure TLC wouldn't have included anything about hitting. Nor would the Duggars, since they were trying hard to win souls for Gothard (and a long-lasting TeeVee contract) at the time (and succeeding at both)/

Right, they did not show Michelle striking a child, but most mainstream parents don't think its normal to train a kid under one year old to stay on a blanket. Nor would many mainstream parents think its cool to associate reading with punishment, which is what she did with her preschool aged kids. She sat them in a chair with a book when they were too rowdy or being disobedient.

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37 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Right, they did not show Michelle striking a child, but most mainstream parents don't think its normal to train a kid under one year old to stay on a blanket. Nor would many mainstream parents think its cool to associate reading with punishment, which is what she did with her preschool aged kids. She sat them in a chair with a book when they were too rowdy or being disobedient.

Yep. Totally agree. 

I still think, though, that when it comes to actually finding the Duggars objectionable enough to want them removed from tv (always my dream!) there's a difference in degree so major it's almost a difference in kind when you add hitting the baby --with objects!-- into the mix! 

I can see most people who disagree with making babies sit very still and so on still reluctantly saying about the no-hit scenario, "Well, I don't agree with this at all but, strictly speaking, it's probably not really abuse, although it seems to be unnecessary strictness...So I guess while I hate it it probably does qualify as a lifestyle difference or an ethical difference that's still somewhere within the realm of acceptability, if only barely. A lot of older people or very religious people do believe that children need to be a lot quieter and less boisterous than is okay with me. So I can't really boycott the network and the sponsors over it. Or say MOTY's an abuser." 

But if she whacked a baby with the paint stick just one time (even without evilly luring the child off the blanket first and even if she didn't whack very hard) that attitude of grudging acceptance of their presence on television would've done a 180 for a whole lot of people, I expect.

So, to me, what they showed was different from blanket training in the sense that adding one little element crosses what for many many people is a very significant line.......I guess we can tell that since the one little element did not appear on the "reality" show!  

 

Edited by Churchhoney
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Blanket training, aside from the cruelty of hitting a baby 😲 would put a stop to the natural curiosity, the thirst for knowledge that babies naturally exhibit. It's a baby's job to explore and learn about their surroundings. Does blanket training lead to incurious, inactive adults? Observing the adult Duggar children and their dependency on JBoob and lack of education, one would certainly think so. 

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On 5/21/2021 at 10:21 AM, BetyBee said:

Blanket training, aside from the cruelty of hitting a baby 😲 would put a stop to the natural curiosity, the thirst for knowledge that babies naturally exhibit. It's a baby's job to explore and learn about their surroundings. Does blanket training lead to incurious, inactive adults? Observing the adult Duggar children and their dependency on JBoob and lack of education, one would certainly think so. 

Add in the part about being tempted by smiles, treats, toys and being punished for responding to that? You end up with lifeless automatons who are too frightened to try anything new or to trust anyone, nor can they feel that they can trust their own instincts.

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1 hour ago, LilJen said:

Add in the part about being tempted by smiles, treats, toys and being punished for responding to that? You end up with lifeless automatons who are too frightened to try anything new or to trust anyone, nor can they feel that they can trust their own instincts.

You just described the Duggars and the Rods to a “T”...

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well that is sort of a misleading article. From the pic shown and the green highlighted. the green is the supposed new purchase directly next to their compound - that is not true.

in the pic shown, the big house/compound are the upper most one shown saying Duggar. the one adjacent/below  that says duggar is across the street and is pasture land, 40 acres or so i think.. JB and Michelle also own property to the right all the way to rd on the right, except for the little corner lot that is owned by Jed's Thomas Lakeview Bible Class LLC.(aka the Jana and howler schoolhouse reno)

there seemed to be some survey work being done along that area involved JB, meech and like 4 or 5 other folks. developers it seemed.  But JB has been buying up a lot of the vacant property on their street for years. So yes, JB and meech trust did buy that piece of land adjacent to vacant land they have already owned for years but it is not really a part of the actual compound house, warehouses, Jana,s garden etc)

 

Edited by crazy8s
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1 hour ago, Chicklet said:

Well well my house boasts a fireplace and 3 porches so I am very fancy.

I only have one porch (and a back deck) but I do have a fireplace, 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms (if you count  the room in the basement that also doubles as storage) I guess even mansions need extra storage space 😄!  

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I think its so interesting to see the many different perspectives and interpretations of the Duggar married couples.

The Vuolos with their 'hip' posts and writing a faith based book. The Seewalds with their ho-hum posts and occasional sightings of the Bible and the Dillards 'normal' posts and occasional invitations to church.

Which couple do y'all think is the deepest religiously, cultishly and hatefully?

 

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38 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Which couple do y'all think is the deepest religiously, cultishly and hatefully?

 

All three combined describe Jessaben & the feral children.  Hands down.   

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16 minutes ago, leighdear said:

All three combined describe Jessaben & the feral children.  Hands down.   

I agree. All these people share the same beliefs to a certain degree, but only Jessa and Bin are living the hardcore cult lifestyle. Derick/Jill, Joy/Austin and Jeremy/Jinger get out and have fun, travel, do family outings and generally enjoy life. I don't think Jessa has a world outside her grimy Mold Casa and the TTH. 

Edited by BitterApple
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1 hour ago, leighdear said:

All three combined describe Jessaben & the feral children.  Hands down.   

I think it is spilt within couples. I think Derick, Ben and Jinger have deeper beliefs. Jessa wins cult hands down, with Jill having some lingering remnants. I think they all share the hateful beliefs, but I think Ben and Derick pridefully hate others. Jeremy, to me anyway, seems very superficial on all fronts, like he's just along for the ride.

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 I’m not sure if linking is OK, but Reddit found Medic corps 2019 Taxes.  I only made $23,000 that they reported. I’m pretty sure they still stole that $20,000 of fuel, though....

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13 minutes ago, JoanArc said:

 I’m not sure if linking is OK, but Reddit found Medic corps 2019 Taxes.  I only made $23,000 that they reported. I’m pretty sure they still stole that $20,000 of fuel, though....

Are they a nonprofit or not for profit org?

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6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I think it is spilt within couples. I think Derick, Ben and Jinger have deeper beliefs. Jessa wins cult hands down, with Jill having some lingering remnants. I think they all share the hateful beliefs, but I think Ben and Derick pridefully hate others. Jeremy, to me anyway, seems very superficial on all fronts, like he's just along for the ride.

I agree, and to me Jeremy is worst than the others. They at least believe they doing their best to follow the rules of the god they worship. Jeremy is mouthing whatever he thinks will get him where he wants to go and he doesn't care if it's hateful or harmful. If someone offered to make him the super rich influencer he believes he's destined to be but he'd have to embrace a loving and diverse religion, he'd be all over that. I don't think Ben, Derick, or Jill will change their views unless/until they have a personal epiphany.  Jessa just wants her world to be safe and right now that means doubling down on whatever JB says.

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4 minutes ago, Nysha said:

I agree, and to me Jeremy is worst than the others. They at least believe they doing their best to follow the rules of the god they worship. Jeremy is mouthing whatever he thinks will get him where he wants to go and he doesn't care if it's hateful or harmful. If someone offered to make him the super rich influencer he believes he's destined to be but he'd have to embrace a loving and diverse religion, he'd be all over that. I don't think Ben, Derick, or Jill will change their views unless/until they have a personal epiphany.  Jessa just wants her world to be safe and right now that means doubling down on whatever JB says.

I actually think Jeremy buys into the hatefulness more than he gets credit for. It's always really stood out to me that when he loses influencer opportunities for their beliefs, he never argues that he's being unfairly depicted. I think he's actually really fine with every hateful thing the Duggars think and that MacArthur teaches. I just think he is also one of those people who also is obsessed with being liked, and he knows owning those beliefs are bad optics, so he doesn't publicize them on social media, but he endorses them in other ways, like that infamous petition he signed a few years ago. 

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4 hours ago, Zella said:

I actually think Jeremy buys into the hatefulness more than he gets credit for. It's always really stood out to me that when he loses influencer opportunities for their beliefs, he never argues that he's being unfairly depicted. I think he's actually really fine with every hateful thing the Duggars think and that MacArthur teaches. I just think he is also one of those people who also is obsessed with being liked, and he knows owning those beliefs are bad optics, so he doesn't publicize them on social media, but he endorses them in other ways, like that infamous petition he signed a few years ago. 

No he didn't say he was being treated unfairly nor did he ditch MacArthur. The latter which may have lead to them keeping endorsements and getting more. But he didn't. He believes what MacArthur teaches but also wants all the fame he thinks he should have. Its like all their social media. Instead of picking a lane its just Jeremy eating, and doing things. He thinks he comes off as the coolest of cool. He doesn't. He comes off exactly as he is. Someone so completely in love with himself that everything he does is awesome. 

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When I think about the Duggar players and their hate, I think about them in real world situations. Things like, would they make a robocall, would they refuse service to someone or would they quit their job, to uphold and spew their hateful beliefs. And are they even capable of having an epiphany and realizing what the hate is and does.

Like, who of them could attend a "Pro-Life" rally on a Monday, but the following week meet a real life person who needed to terminate a pregnancy and boom - epiphany. Who among them could, upon having a gay child, become an LGBT+ advocate?

Don't get me wrong, believing in hate, even on the surface, is wrong and I'm no fan of Jeremy. And Jeremy is choosing to openly represent these beliefs. But if your beliefs are superficial, when push comes to shove, you're behaviors may be different. 

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On 5/20/2021 at 6:47 PM, Churchhoney said:

Well, the Duggar name is sure getting dropped here, there and everywhere thanks to this horror. And some attention does seem to be going to issues with their type of belief. Just saw a piece on Salon quoting several women from sister-mom backgrounds. ... Excerpt including some thoughts about and one alleged sighting of Duggars. The stuff upfront here about sister-mom guilt reminds me of the fundie faith crises and kid guilt we've heard a lot about in the past year or so --  

'She continued: "I'm tired of getting mad at my brothers and sisters, I wish I were perfect. I absolutely abhor the thought that every idle word will be judged . . . lately I have been doing some self-analyzing, or examining—I'm trash . . . I'm sick of disappointing God." 

'That concept of disappointing God runs heavily through Quiverfull families. In many cases, there aren't enough hours in a day or resources, emotional and financial, to go around and it's burdensome; but as Vyckie Garrison, a former Quiverfull wife told Salon in an interview last week, many mothers approach it as a spiritual challenge or a backyard mission field. 

'"The [fellow Quiverfull] women would tell me, 'Missionaries risk their lives every day and they do it because it's their calling,'" she said. "'When they get to heaven, they'll get their martyr's crown.' There's a huge martyr's mentality."  

'Over the last decade, the concept of parentification has gained enough mainstream traction that former viewers of the now-cancelled TLC show "19 Kids and Counting" have started to question whether the network's framing of the family as an oversized "Waltons" was shielding something more sinister, especially as the family's eldest son, Josh, has fallen into scandal after scandal, and has now been arrested for the possession of child pornography. 

'Throughout the years, there have been numerous web forums and subreddits dedicated to going back and watching old footage of the show while advocating for the "freedom" of some of the Duggar family's daughters. Former Quiverfull daughters are now speaking out as well while the family is under increased scrutiny. 

'"One time, my family attended a talk by the Duggar parents and my baby brother was crying, so I had to take him out to the hall where all the other older daughters were handling their parents' babies, including Jessa and we all shared this exhausted look that I remember to this day," one Twitter user wrote. 

She continued: "Looking back now, it's so f**king funny that you had all these families who worshipped the Duggars and their way of life and all these daughters were in the hall with their parents' babies just like… f**k this, I'm tired." 

Ruth felt this acutely while growing up. Most nights, she would only get five hours of sleep — between staying up late to finish chores, waking throughout the night to feed or comfort one of the babies, and getting up early — and was always exhausted. 

"Since I was so tired, I would lash out at my parents and siblings and then I would get reprimanded," she said. "While I was being punished, I would angrily pray to God, 'Why are you doing this to me? I'm just trying to serve you.'" 

'Ruth ended up running away when she was 17 after watching "Now, Voyager," a 1942 film starring Bette Davis. Her parents were strict about what she and her siblings watched, but most "black and white classics" were deemed acceptable. 

'The film takes its name from the Walt Whitman poem "The Untold Want," which says, "The untold want, by life and land ne'er granted, Now, Voyager, sail thou forth, to seek and find."

"In it, Bette Davis' character lives with a controlling mother who always puts her down and then she has this mental break," Ruth said. "She ends up moving away, getting healthy, becoming fashionable and then she comes back. I thought that I could do that, too. All I really wanted was a break." 

Her break was a little less glamorous than Davis'. She got a job at a local convenience store and split rent with an elderly coworker. At night, she studied for her GED and on weekends, she'd eat cereal in her pajamas and watch television — trashy reality shows and Animal Planet, mostly. 

'It was the first time in Ruth's life that she didn't have a schedule; it was also the first time that she really watched the Duggars on television. "I watched this sanitized version of what Quiverfull life was like and I was hurt, I was disgusted," she said. "I can't even look at them to this day without getting angry." 

'Ruth said she hopes that the Duggars' crumbling facade in the face of Josh's scandals will make the public question other aspects of the family life they modeled for years on TV. 

'"I think back to how my mom said, 'God made you for this,' and I finally had to say, 'No, God made me for more,'" she said.'

The article's actually longer than this. Kind of interesting stuff about women looking back on their Duggar-daughter-like experiences. 

https://www.salon.com/2021/05/20/the-parentification-trap-how-evangelical-daughters-like-the-duggar-girls-become-mothers-in-training/

 

Wow, this was really interesting. Rachel Dolezal (white woman who believes she’s black) was also raised in a strict Christian fundamentalist home and took care of the three younger children her parents adopted. Her biological brother is also accused of molesting her younger sister and the children accused the parents of physical abuse. Dolezal is considerably older than the Duggar kids, but I do wonder if her parents ever crossed paths with JB & M at one of these conferences and if they follow the same parenting methods. The adopted children are now young adults. Now that I think back on it, “Oversized Waltons” is a very accurate description of how TLC marketed this family.

Edited by charmed1
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6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

And are they even capable of having an epiphany and realizing what the hate is and does.

I think that would require a self-awareness and empathy for other people that Jeremy doesn't have. To me, he has even less of an excuse to be entangled in this than some of the others. He went to a secular college, and he's lived overseas. He's not sheltered and can't claim that he doesn't know better, but he still chooses to be affiliated with the Duggars and MacArthur. He's had opportunities to have these epiphanies about other people, and he seems to have drawn the opposite conclusion. Actually, I think he's already had his epiphany--that he shares these hateful beliefs but that he doesn't want to be raked over the coals for it. 

Edited by Zella
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On 6/8/2021 at 8:45 AM, BitterApple said:

I agree. All these people share the same beliefs to a certain degree, but only Jessa and Bin are living the hardcore cult lifestyle. Derick/Jill, Joy/Austin and Jeremy/Jinger get out and have fun, travel, do family outings and generally enjoy life. I don't think Jessa has a world outside her grimy Mold Casa and the TTH. 

Could be because the Seewald baby train has been going full force while the others have fewer kids with more reasonable spacing.  The other couples also seem to have an income stream from a source other than Duggar LLC.  Jimboob obviously is super stingy with the purse strings.  I mean who know when he will have to bail out, provide an atty/housing/food for Josh and his kids?  The 1st born is turning out to be a shitty investment.  

I think Jessa and Ben will be the Cousin Eddy and Catherine of the Duggar bunch.  Although I see Jessa more as the Cousin Eddy type while Ben is more long suffering wife Catherine.  Shitters full!

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1 hour ago, Natalie68 said:

Could be because the Seewald baby train has been going full force while the others have fewer kids with more reasonable spacing.  The other couples also seem to have an income stream from a source other than Duggar LLC.  Jimboob obviously is super stingy with the purse strings.  I mean who know when he will have to bail out, provide an atty/housing/food for Josh and his kids?  The 1st born is turning out to be a shitty investment.  

Josh's brood is definitely sucking up a disproportionate piece of the pie. I can't imagine the amount of resentment that causes amongst the siblings. 

With regards to Jessa and Bin, I agree it's harder to move around as the number of kids starts piling up. Alyssa Bates was just on Instagram whining about having to wrangle four kids plus shopping bags, so I can't imagine Jessa will do much better. 

Edited by BitterApple
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9 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Don't get me wrong, believing in hate, even on the surface, is wrong and I'm no fan of Jeremy. And Jeremy is choosing to openly represent these beliefs. But if your beliefs are superficial, when push comes to shove, you're behaviors may be different. 

I don't think Jeremy's hateful beliefs are due to his religious beliefs, I think that he hides his true self behind MacArthur & his version of the bible. Right now he may not be a very successful influencer, but he still has a nice house in LA, enough money to buy all the shoes & restaurant meals he wants, and a certain degree of fame that he didn't have to work very hard to get.  

I think if/when this all dries up he'll happily hide his racist, homophobic, misogynistic beliefs if that's what it takes for it all to come back.  

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