S03.E07: Thirteen

[Izeinwinter]

The thing that really hurts is that both scenes - Lexa's death, and Clexa's love scene were in isolation, really amazing performances, but the fact that one lead right into the other made both of them very, very hard to take. Both events were baked into the narrative - Clarke and Lexa needed to reconcile and make up (and out) - and Lexa prioritized her greater goals over her own survival to a degree that meant her death was pretty darn inevitable.

So both events were very well done, and as obligatory as any part of the plot gets, but they should bloody well have been spaced out, because going right from one to the next in that way is just hurtful. 

[Jack Shaftoe]

 

Rothenberg ruined Bellamy's character to soften Lexa's betrayal. It's happened before in TV writing. You see it a lot in love triangles. Trashing one character is a really lazy way of building up another character.

 

I know it's happened before but I doubt this was the case here. Mostly because it would be completely unnecessary for Rothenberg to do so since one side of the triangle was going to be shot dead very soon anyway. I don't think he had Lexa betray the Arkers to prop up Clarke/Bellamy either. Sometimes characters just do shitty things which many viewers think are OOC, it's not always a shipping-related conspiracy. Not that I would put it past this particular showrunner to do stuff like that, mind you.

 

 

I honestly think Rothenberg is just not that bright and thinks that he can write a Great Redemption Narrative for Bellamy, and the 12-16 year old girls who watch the show for Bellamy will swoon over how much of "a tortured woobie that does the right thing when the chips are down even though he's messed up before" he is, and that's going to be that, Bellamy will be welcomed back with open arms as the sympathetic Male Lead, now with even more Manpain! Also, I think the writers wanted one of the 100 to side with Pike for ~dramatic conflict, and Bellamy made the least least sense (not that he made sense but everyone else made even less sense), and also has the male lead get out of jail free card. And, lbr...for a large part of this show's audience, that WILL be enough.

 

Exactly. Shows get away with half-baked redemption storylines all the time, I know I have been guilty myself of forgiving certain characters quickly on a number of occasions despite complaining loudly about other redemption storylines - of characters I never liked much, so  I wasn't willing to cut them any slack, So I don't think "12-16 year old girls" are the only group prone to falling for those tricks. I can't really blame a showrunner for thinking the trick might work because it has worked so many times before - including on this very show with Murphy, Kane, Bellamy himself, etc.

 

 

It has to do with total amount of screen time spent SHOWING the story, it has to do with the care taken in telling the story of Lexa and Clarke and totally blowing off the Bellamy and Monty sides of the story, it has to do with Monty getting ONE FUCKING LINE about how he's had it rough but like he's coping and stuff by killing little babies YO, even JASPER had more story than Monty or Bellamy who were just as emotionally impacted by their GROUP decision to gas Mt. Weather as goddamn Clarke. And yes I think Bellamy has been shortchanged of story, I think everyone in Arkadia has been shortchanged out of story because JR wanted to spend all his "real work" on introducing us to Polis, and that stuff has been great, but when you sacrifice 3/4's of your show for one small slice catering to one small piece of your fans, fans you plan to fuck over by the way by killing off said piece of the story than like get bent, you suck as a writer, but I guess we can only be critical of the writing if it negatively affects Lexa's character, and impacts representational issues?

 

The Polis part of the story also moved at a breakneck speed and it involved a lot more than just Clarke and Lexa flirting. All plotlines this season have suffered of lack of enough screen time for proper development. Might as well blame the ALIE plotline for Bellamy's largely off-screen development. Also, Rothenberg just won't shut up about his "brilliant" way of connecting the Polis storyline and the ALIE storyline but you make it sound as if he focused so much on Polis just to satisfy certain shippers.

 

 

IDK you seem shocked and  ticked off about Lexa dying, because you didn't recognize the story Jason Rothenberg was telling, I did and knew she was going to bite it, and here she is dead.

 

What gave me away? No, seriously - it was one of the most predictable storylines ever. The only reason I had a small hope Lexa might live was because I thought the writers might not go for the obvious course of action which was also guaranteed to result in a storm of controversy.

 

 

To me it was very obviously the story he was telling, that he down the line has plans for Clarke to "unite" the 13 tribes and yes in that case Lexa is quite obviously literally IN THE WAY of Clarke's journey.

 

Well, technically Clarke and Lexa could have united the 13 clans together - in fact they did unite them for about ten seconds before Pike won the election. But I sure hope that's not the direction the story takes because it's already bad enough that Octavia can train for a week and be considered Indra's second, making Clarke commander would really invoke the Mighty Whitey trope.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Jack Shaftoe

[kdm07]

When you look at this episode, without the death scene, it's actually not a bad episode at all and I was really enjoying it until those last 10 minutes. Now that the writer is openly admitting that he (and Jason since he's the showrunner) thought that his writing was so great it would surpass a trope, it's making me very, very leery about watching this show (and the Xena reboot since this particular writer is in charge of that) live ever again which I really hate because Clarke is my favourite character and I want to keep watching for her at least.

As for the death scene and everything else about it: at least people here seem to be clued in to what exactly the writers on the show have been doing. Other well-known sites have completely given them a pass and it's mostly because I think they're completely unaware of what Jason & co have been doing for the last couple of months. I may be straight but even I can tell that this all has been and still is a load of...cockamaney!

 

And now (according to spoiler images that came about because Jason invited people to come & watch them shoot part of the finale in downtown Vancouver) we have to watch Clarke completely finish the job by killing Lexa's spirit when she destroys the COL, as if watching her die once wasn't enough smh. I haven't felt this mad at a show's writing since Arrow killed Sara Lance in 3x01!

Edited March 7, 2016 by kdm07

[Gabe Torres]

I am still gathering my thoughts - and cooling my rage - as I am neck deep in fandom. I been seeing so much hopelessness and self-blame from so many young lgbt people and it just pisses me off. There been such a bone deep tiredness and too many of them believe themselves to be idiots for "not knowing better". Fuck that. They should not be expecting to see themselves die on screen. It should be perfectly fine for them to hope for better; they deserve better. The writers knew for almost a year that they were going to kill Lexa, and it was the biggest fear from lgbt fans. Despite of that they shamelessly reached out to lgbt fans telling them they should watch the show for the progressive lgbt relationships, and they were going to love the Clarke/Lexa story.

 

That is fucking ice cold.

 

Many didn't expect that they would do lgbt fans so dirty in such a way. While Lexa's death was expected in some ways, in others it wasn't, at least not this soon because 1: too many anvils, 2:

jason telling fans to come see them film 3x16 that features Lexa

, 3: because the writers were so on top of assuring lgbt fans. Like... they done some seriously fucked up things I won't post because despite of that I don't want to get one of them fired, but yall its fucked up. Even I thought they were going to be the show that would be better and im jaded as hell cuz media taught me well. But all the things they said and did made me and others expect that they wouldn't go there, and if they did, it wouldn't be this soon since they gone way far to assure lgbt fans about this season. So if it were to happen it would not be by episode 7 and not in such a idiotic and bullshit way.

 

I have seen a lot of messy shit with tv shows+lgbt fans, and this is the most dirty I have seen a show do its lgbt fans since Xena. This even surpasses Ryan Murphy of Glee fuckery fame and that is such a fucking high bar to pass that you basically gotta build a space ship to get above it.

 

There were a gazillion ways to kill Lexa, but the way they did it was basically on the very top of the Do Not List.

 

I want to point out the most iconic scene of all time when it comes to the Dead Lesbian Trope

 

 

This is from Buffy showing Willow and Tara in 2002, the show that had the first really huge canon female gay couple. Consequently they had a huge lgbt following as they were the first positive and regular wlw couple. In that season Tara and Willow had broken up, then made up, had sex, were shown being snug in bed, and of course one of them got shot by a random bullet meant for the female lead character a little while after.

 

Does this sound just a little bit awfully familiar?

 

To quote this podcast http://abcsofthe100.podbean.com/: "They couldn't have tried harder to rip off Tara dying on Buffy if they tried... I mean, I guess if Clarke still had her red hair."

 

It is completely baffling. Javi that was the writer of the episode, is actually great friends with Amber Benson that played Tara in Buffy. Not only did they know they were going to execute the Dead Lesbian Trope, but they chose to do it in a manner that is a perfect homage to the scene that solidified the Dead Lesbian Trope of an entire lgbt generation (mine to be frank). It is so completely out there that I don't really know if to laugh or cry over how dumb it is.

 

Now the 100 has successfully managed to be the icon for the next younger generation for this trope.

 

Killing Lexa could had been done without stringing lgbt fans along. It could had been done without copy and pasting the definition of Death Lesbian trope. It could had been done without Jason Rothenberg continuously lying and changing his story in order to blame it on Alycia Debnam-Carey and her commitment to Fear The Walking Dead. It could had been done without Jason encouraging fans to come see them film. It could had been done without Jason looking a trans boy dead in the eye, and tell him "you guys read into things too much" when he verbalized thoughts about Lexa being dead based on what he was seeing.

 

There already been posts talking about how we die a lot on TV. I would like to point out on the CW of the 6 confirmed lesbian - this includes guest stars with only something like 3 episodes per season - characters, 3 have died within the past 10 or so months, and it might actually be 5/6 real soon.

 

When riful says we are tired of seeing ourselves dying, it aint no exaggeration yall. Some might feel like we pop up a lot more in media, and you aint wrong. We just still tend to die as well. Someone looked into all academy nominated lgbt movies spanning 1994-2013, and almost 60% of the lgbt character died. Only 4 of the lgbt characters got a happy ending. In those 4 lgbt character, 2 of those characters were lesbians with one of the "lesbians" repeatedly cheating on her wife with a man in the movie.

 

Well, technically Clarke and Lexa could have united the 13 clans together - in fact they did unite them for about ten seconds before Pike won the election. But I sure hope that's not the direction the story takes because it's already bad enough that Octavia can train for a week and be considered Indra's second, making Clarke commander would really invoke the Mighty Whitey trope.

 

A thousands blessings upon your soul for pointing this out. It seems likely the show will go that way with Clarke.

Adina said something about Clarke being the ultimate Commander, so there was some spec about it

. I was in the camp believing they wouldn't do it, but now Im thinking everything is possible. Even with fans making them aware of both racist and homophobic tropes, the writers are to arrogant. If we drop to some real talk, it is prob cuz they are to white and straight in there.

 

The Polis part of the story also moved at a breakneck speed and it involved a lot more than just Clarke and Lexa flirting. All plotlines this season have suffered of lack of enough screen time for proper development. Might as well blame the ALIE plotline for Bellamy's largely off-screen development. Also, Rothenberg just won't shut up about his "brilliant" way of connecting the Polis storyline and the ALIE storyline but you make it sound as if he focused so much on Polis just to satisfy certain shippers.

 

And it is an assumption that is based on zero facts. Polis first showed up end of episode 2, and wasn't featured in episode 5. So 3+4+6+7, while every episode has featured Arkadia minus 7 but 8 seems like it will be only Arkadia. The total time spent has been very much in favor of Arkadia, and it has massively dragged down the show. More time spent on it wasn't going to help the show one bit. Stretching out the development of the story would have.

 

About screen time, Bellamy has actually been in the lead until episode 6 where Clarke finally reaches about even. Many Bellarke shippers been very outwardly aggressive towards Clexa fans and Alycia Debnam-Carey about this, so in response some screen time measuring been done. The same also go for S2, because back then people also gave ADC shit, for "stealing screen time" while hard facts showed she wasn't the screen time stealer they made her out to be. It is also very telling that same fans didnt complain over screen time spent on MW characters or characters like Pike. In those cases they will say - if they do comment - they were necessary for the story to move forward. Funny enough the same never go for Lexa. Lexa that was the Commander of the 12 Clans, Clarke's love interest, and also someone that played a significant role in Clarke's development/exploration of her as a leader.

 

No then it was "catering to Clexa fans." It was so transparent and it still is.

 

The thing that really hurts is that both scenes - Lexa's death, and Clexa's love scene were in isolation, really amazing performances, but the fact that one lead right into the other made both of them very, very hard to take.

To be more precise, they were 1 minute and 10 seconds a part. You can tell the writers really wanted Lexa to die in this episode as it only gets more ridiculous when you look at the logistics. There were guards outside the door when Titus yelled for them to open them at the end, but when the shooting happened? Nothing. Apparently it was just Lexa that happened to be loitering around. This trained warrior heard gun shots as the only one and apparently and ran into the room like a moron. Others can be left to bleed out for half of day, but Lexa peaces out in a few minutes with Clarke suddenly not being 1/10th of the healer she typically is.

 

I've seen plenty of people be critical of the way Bellamy (and Pike, and S3) have been written in previous episode threads. But when the writing plays into a massively harmful, representationally awful, frankly utterly gross trope like it did in this episode, I also think it's only to be expected that people are going to be especially critical.

 

I agree that I've always thought Lexa was destined to die, btw. But imo the character had more story to tell at the point they killed her (and it goes without saying that the way they wrote her off was totally gross).

 

Yeah there been bucket-loads of criticism thrown Rothenberg's way over Bellamy and Pike. It has been on such a level that I think it is pretty impossible to miss. Even before the season started, several respectable critics were rumbling about it. 

 

With regards to Lexa dying, I think the biggest thing was no one expected it to be the way it happened and when it happened. Approx. 70 seconds after the sex scene is pretty unpredictable. Even back in the 90s they would give us at least like 2 minutes before killing us.

 

The writers could easily had killed Lexa and received only 5% of the current backlash if they had not gone out of their way to prop themselves up as super progressive, and telling lgbt fans they would love the story they were going to tell about Clarke/Lexa. Layne Morgan was told her first day on the job Lexa would die. That was April 1st. So they have known for ages they were going to kill her, and just relentlessly played the lgbt fans. It was completely unnecessary to do so. Fans would had giving them plenty of support and love even if they were ambiguous about what would happen with Lexa.

 

Several of the writers were even posting pictures of Lexa's bed on Twitter, and tagged the most popular Clarke/Lexa fan artist as giving her art reference. That is just operating at 0 Kelvin. They knew what fans would expect based on that, and also that they were likely to predict it happening in episode 7. Not to mention then later on clips of that "sex-scene" conveniently leaked in an advert, making it dead obvious it would happen in episode 7.

 

And christ I talked a lot about young lgbt, but I got to admit, I am also incredibly tired of this. I'm fairly involved with Clarke/Lexa side of the fandom and been talking to many of the really distraught fans. The sad thing is that there also been plenty of resigned sadness and exhaustion from the older gen, because this is just the same old shit over and over and over again. For many it brings them back to when they were younger and feeling like they were only destined to one thing - lead a miserable life and die.

 

I and everybody else realize there will be other lesbian characters, and there already is. But one is not interchangeable with another. It is rare to find just one that isn't a sub-par character involved in a lousy story line. Most importantly it is rare to find one that resonated with so many as Lexa did.

This whole thing just sucks.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Gabe Torres

[Kate213]

Honestly, these show runners and writers just keep stepping in it. In their latest interview about this episode they literally said, “Clarke’s bisexuality was a phase, a sort of stepping stone towards her future relationship(s),” while hinting that Bellamy/Clarke was going to happen. A person's sexuality is not a phase and to say that is so irresponsible and disgusting. It looks like they're realizing that they're going to lose the Clarke/Lexa fanbase over how they wrote Lexa's death so now they're desperately trying to prop up the Bellamy/Clarke fans to keep them watching. The show runner also admitted that ADC could and wanted to come back for Season 4, contradicting his previous statements that she wanted to leave to film Fear the Walking Dead. She was committed to the character, which makes it even worse that the he's been throwing her under the bus as the reason Lexa was killed. I was wavering on whether I'd continue watching this show, but with each passing interview, my desire to support it dwindles significantly.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Kate213

[stealinghome]

Heh, yeah, if it wasn't so enraging/frustrating/kind of sad, the way the writers just keep putting their feet in their mouths would be hilarious. Every single time they try to do some (poorly thought out) damage control, they just add fuel to the fire and come up with new ways to be asses.

[blixie]

 

“Clarke’s bisexuality was a phase, a sort of stepping stone towards her future relationship(s),”

 

??? They need to watch Daryl Whitefeather's latest song:

 

http://perezhilton.com/tv/CRAZY_EX_GIRLFRIEND_Gettin_Bi/?id=140a9b3212de3&autoplay=false

 

Like I said JR is certainly pleased with himself (having destroyed both Clexa AND Bellarke) so I guess that's all that matters.

[Halliwell]

I hate the writers and all but I don't think they actually said that. Same with the Alycia wanted to come back thing since they deleted the periscope. People are really upset and angry and are just running with whatever they read without confirming things first.

 

But yeah, my respect for these writers is zero. I love Clarke but I don't know how I'm going to keep watching this show after what they pulled with Clexa.

Honestly, these show runners and writers just keep stepping in it. In their latest interview about this episode they literally said, “Clarke’s bisexuality was a phase, a sort of stepping stone towards her future relationship(s),” while hinting that Bellamy/Clarke was going to happen. A person's sexuality is not a phase and to say that is so irresponsible and disgusting. It looks like they're realizing that they're going to lose the Clarke/Lexa fanbase over how they wrote Lexa's death so now they're desperately trying to prop up the Bellamy/Clarke fans to keep them watching. The show runner also admitted that ADC could and wanted to come back for Season 4, contradicting his previous statements that she wanted to leave to film Fear the Walking Dead. She was committed to the character, which makes it even worse that the he's been throwing her under the bus as the reason Lexa was killed. I was wavering on whether I'd continue watching this show, but with each passing interview, my desire to support it dwindles significantly.

[Chris24601]

So does this mean that all the survivors on the ground had basically become illiterate cave-dwelling idiots -- after only two years ? I find it hard to believe that they reverted to cave paintings and god-like worship of a person that had "fallen from the sky" in such a short amount of time. Because they would have still been aware of the concept of space stations, technology and such -- it's not like one or two generations had already gone by and immense amounts of common knowledge had been forgotten. And adopting the name 'Polis' when Becca would have been right there to tell them that the actual name on the escape pod was 'Polaris' just seems incredibly stupid. Everyone would have still been speaking English -- since she landed in the Virginia/Maryland/D.C. area.-- and there would have been no reason yet to have .

The issue isn't the people two years after the bomb drops. There is nothing to indicate that the survivors didn't know exactly who and what Becca was.

But that was a hundred years ago. Becca and all the people who remembered the pre-apocalyptic world would have been dead (or nearly so) before Titus was even born. So in a post-literate society (being able to read isn't a high priority when you're struggling to find enough food to avoid starving) a lot would be lost as the first and second generation survivors whose only knowledge of high technology comes from stories told around the fire became the elders who had preserve the knowlege of the group.

Its probably in that second or third generation, as the original survivors are dying out that the 'cave paintings' of their history came about as people who never had any reason to learn to read had to go about recording their history so that those who came after them would learn it.

It is probably also around that time, once all the original survivors had perished that a lot of the cargo cult mythology came into the picture. How do you explain an implantable nanotech artificial intelligence device to someone who's never even experienced a lightbulb or internal combustion engine? It may as well BE actual magic to the grounders.

Sadly, as history has actually shown we're all no more than one generation from the stone age. The only thing the next generation knows is what we teach them and if you're struggling to survive a LOT of what we take for granted as permanent and lasting aspects of society would vanish like dust (like every last thing published in a digital only format... or the modern 'just in time' distribution systems of food and other commodities that rely on easy instant communications nearly anywhere in the world).

Heck, shut off all the power for a week and we'll be wishing we had it as good as the grounders (no power means no phones, no cell towers, no pumps for wells to provide fresh water or refuel our vehicles, no refridgeration of food in stores or at home, no credit card purchases or bank withdrawals... it would get very ugly very very fast).

[Kate213]

I hate the writers and all but I don't think they actually said that. Same with the Alycia wanted to come back thing since they deleted the periscope. People are really upset and angry and are just running with whatever they read without confirming things first.

I tried to find it again after your comment and it looks like the periscope was indeed deleted this morning, after fans started giving them backlash over the "bisexuality is a phase" comment. Obviously, it's impossible to verify now but if there wasn't anything inflammatory in it, why take it down?

Edited March 8, 2016 by Kate213

[Halliwell]

True. Why delete the proof. I thought maybe they meant she wanted to come back for season 3 but I really don't know anymore.  That periscope was a mess. 

 

Shawna said this after that: "I said she was contracted to be done by a certain date. She went to FTWD and her vacation after. No way she could come back."  

 

She didn't start FTWD until December and what about the finale? lol So many lies and lame excuses. And they are really contradicting themselves every time they speak. 

I tried to find it after your comment and it looks like the periscope was indeed deleted this morning, after fans started giving them backlash over the "bisexuality is a phase" comment.  Obviously, it's impossible to verify now but if there wasn't anything inflammatory in it, why take it down?  

[Kate213]

True. Why delete the proof. I thought maybe they meant she wanted to come back for season 3 but I really don't know anymore.  That periscope was a mess. 

 

Indeed, they're just making everything worse.  And regarding ADC, in the periscope they were definitely talking about her wanting to come back for Season 4.  

 

3x07 filmed back in September, and FtWD didn't start filming until December, so there were no scheduling conflicts up until then.  Then they were still able to get her to come back for at least the finale, maybe 2 episodes, right in the middle of FtWD filming in January.  The filming dates for a possible Season 4 wouldn't conflict much, if at all, with FtWD either.  It just seems to be a very weak excuse in a long line of weak excuses.

[piequinn35]

I really don't care about Clexa now or Bellamy/Pike they can both follow Lexa and die :))

I am now interested on ALIE 1.0 and ALIE 2.0 

and the possibility of ALIE 2.0 going inside Wanheda :>

[Jack Shaftoe]

 

But that was a hundred years ago. Becca and all the people who remembered the pre-apocalyptic world would have been dead (or nearly so) before Titus was even born. So in a post-literate society (being able to read isn't a high priority when you're struggling to find enough food to avoid starving)

 

But wouldn't some of the people most likely to survive be exactly those who have stockpiled food, equipment and handy survival manuals? Plus, those who have stockpiled guns and ammo, of course. Books can be a huge advantage in harsh environment, I don't see why the grounders would decide to just stop teaching their kids to read and write.

 

On an unrelated note, I am confused about the commander position - if Lexa was the first commander to unite the 12 clans what were her predecessors commanders of? Fewer than 12 clans? Just one clan? It just seems that there are so many procedures in place for choosing a new commander yet the coalition was only formed recently.

 

 

It is completely baffling. Javi that was the writer of the episode, is actually great friends with Amber Benson that played Tara in Buffy.

 

So chances are he did copy Buffy. Intentionally. Maybe he and that genius Rothenberg wanted as much controversy as possible. Even if they didn't engage in trolling on a massive scale, they still need new PR people stat.

[catrox14]

 

You can disagree all you want and Lexa will still be dead, and she will still have died literally FOR Clarke how much clearer could it be? I'

 

Maybe Lexa was going to die all along but she did not die FOR Clarke. She died BECAUSE of her relationship with Clarke. That is a big difference IMO

 

If Lexa had jumped in front of a bullet that was meant for Clarke or if she had died on the battlefield defending Clarke then yes she would have died FOR her. Her death would have been heroic and commiserate with her role as a military leader.  But that didn't happen.Hell she didn't even get the gift of legitimate assassination as a method of regime change.  She was killed because she had sex with Clarke.

 

They had any other number of ways to kill off Lexa that kept her dignity as a warrior intact but IMO they did not do that.

[loki567]

True. Why delete the proof. I thought maybe they meant she wanted to come back for season 3 but I really don't know anymore.  That periscope was a mess. 

 

Shawna said this after that: "I said she was contracted to be done by a certain date. She went to FTWD and her vacation after. No way she could come back."  

 

She didn't start FTWD until December and what about the finale? lol So many lies and lame excuses. And they are really contradicting themselves every time they speak. 

 

The thing to point out: FTWD had a six-episode first season. The second season is going to be 15 episodes. So ADC's schedule is going to be crazy busy moving forward. Maybe she could have come back for two or three episodes in the fourth season, but I doubt it would be seven or eight that it was this year. And I just don't blame the writers for not feeling it would be worth it to essentially have to write around the Grounders and their leadership, for access to ACD a couple times a season. 

[MV007]

Maybe Lexa was going to die all along but she did not die FOR Clarke. She died BECAUSE of her relationship with Clarke. That is a big difference IMO

 

If Lexa had jumped in front of a bullet that was meant for Clarke or if she had died on the battlefield defending Clarke then yes she would have died FOR her. Her death would have been heroic and commiserate with her role as a military leader.  But that didn't happen.Hell she didn't even get the gift of legitimate assassination as a method of regime change.  She was killed because she had sex with Clarke.

 

They had any other number of ways to kill off Lexa that kept her dignity as a warrior intact but IMO they did not do that.

 

I get the trope criticism.  But I do not think its was the writer's intention to say Lexa had sex with a girl therefore she must die.

Edited March 8, 2016 by MV007

[Minneapple]

I liked Lexa too. But honestly I'm on the verge of "Lexa is dead. Get over it." 

[loki567]

I liked Lexa too. But honestly I'm on the verge of "Lexa is dead. Get over it." 

 

Me too. I don't want to sound insensitive, but when talking about equal representation for your fictional characters, well, that means you can't treat your gay characters like they're special or untouchable. Lexa's death resembled all the other deaths on The 100, i.e. incredibly brutal for maximum dramatic effect. 

[yellowfred]

On an unrelated note, I am confused about the commander position - if Lexa was the first commander to unite the 12 clans what were her predecessors commanders of? Fewer than 12 clans? Just one clan? It just seems that there are so many procedures in place for choosing a new commander yet the coalition was only formed recently.

 

My understanding was that the Commander used to only be in charge of Trikru, the same way that the queen was in charge of Azgeda and the other clans presumably have their own leaders.  Lexa was the first Commander who was able to unite all of the clans into a single coalition.  Also, given Titus' reaction to the idea of there being a nightblood from Azgeda, it was probably something that only ever showed up in Trikru children before.

[wevel]

If you are unclear about why the death of LGBT characters is not the same as straight ones, and why responses of sadness or outrage aren't coming from some unreasonable expectation that these characters be treated "like they're special or untouchable," it might be useful to take a look at some articles (mostly by straight commentators, as far as I can tell) that deal with the topic, some of which have already been posted in this thread:

 

http://variety.com/2016/tv/columns/the-100-lexa-dead-clarke-relationship-13-1201722916/

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/03/07/opinion-a-few-more-thoughts-on-the-100s-lexa

http://thetvwrap.com/post/140456815873/the-100-why-lexa-and-the-fans-deserve-more-jason

 

Even this Bellarker could write that "Clexa was a beautiful thing and should never have gone down like that. I was quite happy for it to sail on forever, because I realise that I have representation everywhere and you guys don't."

 

I'd like to request for less "get over it" sentiments here.  As several critics have acknowledged, even if they do not personally feel devastated by Lexa's death or poorly treated by the showrunners/writers, they are respectful of the responses of those that do, and are open to listening to why.

Edited March 9, 2016 by wevel

[Cranberry]

Someone pointed out elsewhere today that there aren't really lesbian fandoms. There's "the lesbian fandom," which migrates to any show with strong lesbian or bisexual characters -- and there aren't many of those. This fandom has seen too many lesbian characters die. And yeah, characters die on TV all the time. But lesbian characters die disproportionately often. That's where much of the hurt is coming from. It's difficult for someone outside that group -- someone who can see themselves in countless characters and not just a tiny handful of characters who almost never get a happy ending -- to understand.

 

The fact that the showrunner actively courted and misled this fandom isn't helping in this case. I can understand his storytelling decisions (sort of. I mean, how hard would it have been to have Lexa purposefully take a bullet to save Clarke?). I can't understand why he attempted to trick the fans into thinking his show would be different when all along he intended for it to be more of the same.

[Julie335]

I only recently started watching the 100, and was just a casual viewer, but 3x07 broke my heart. I was surprised that I physically felt heartache after watching a fictional character I hardly knew die!  

 

Two things came to mind:

- Clarke and Lexa had something magical. The chemistry, the way their characters were written, the acting skills of both actors.

- It (the characters individually and the love they started to share) could have become epic, and helped propel the show to new heights, in terms of critical acclaim and viewers. Now Jason Rothenburg no longer has that opportunity, he took that away from himself.

 

Not knowing anything about what was going on in social media regarding "Clexa" or even who Jason Rothenburg was, I initially had hope that they would do right by these characters and their stories, moving forward, even though Lexa died.

 

THEN after the episode, I found out about how he purposely gave the LGTB community false hope and even baited them ("Come see us shoot in Vancouver the season finale [showing Clarke and Lexa together]!"). Then I thought to myself, "Why would I trust his guy??" Not worth following his show...

 

p.s. I was impressed by the way the writer of the episode, Javier Grillo-Marxuach, reacted to the anger/hurt. I would have given him the benefit of the doubt.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Julie335

[Ravenya003]

So I've just found out that the writer of this episode is not only good friends with Amber Benson (who played Tara "lesbian killed by a stay bullet that wasn't meant for her" Maclay in Buffy the Vampire Slayer), but is going to be the showrunner for a recently announced reboot of Xena Warrior Princess (another LGBT-friendly show that ended with one of its would-be lesbians getting brutally killed).  

 

I think we've crossed from offensiveness into complete surrealism at this point. 

[stealinghome]

I get the trope criticism. But I do not think its was the writer's intention to say Lexa had sex with a girl therefore she must die.

Sure, but part of the problem is that that is so very rarely the trope's intention (theoretically), and yet...somehow it's still a trope that exists.* When it's a massive trope even today, it has to make you wonder about the cultural message it's sending and the cultural logic underpinning it. If we're so beyond the thinking underlying the trope, how is it that the trope keeps.being.repeated.over.and.over? And what message is it sending to queer youth today? (Hint: go on tumblr and look. It's not a positive one.)

*Although in fact, the roots of the trope lie in the EXPRESS DESIRE to explicitly to equate homosexuality with Bad Things. The trope springs from '50s censorship laws that essentially said if you depicted homosexual behavior, bad things had to happen to the homosexuals to send a "positive moral message" by "discouraging bad behavior." So actually, the entire point of the trope is to punish queer people for being queer.

I can't understand why he attempted to trick the fans into thinking his show would be different when all along he intended for it to be more of the same.

That's the truly baffling thing, and again, where I actually think more of the fandom's ire is coming from. It's not (just) Lexa's death, it's the massive and intentional misleading/manipulation of the fandom. The only things I can think of are that a) the creators genuinely thought that their writing was SO GOOD that it would magically overcome their cliche and frankly unimaginative use of the trope (which, uh, no) or b) they believed queer people, particularly youths, were so desperate for representation that they would be thankful for crumbs, so to speak? I honestly don't know which is worse, or more offensive. Either way, the level of delusion is pretty impressive.

I'm starting to think Rothenberg's self-insert character is Jaha. ;)

So I've just found out that the writer of this episode is not only good friends with Amber Benson (who played Tara "lesbian killed by a stay bullet that wasn't meant for her" Maclay in Buffy the Vampire Slayer), but is going to be the showrunner for a recently announced reboot of Xena Warrior Princess (another LGBT-friendly show that ended with one of its would-be lesbians getting brutally killed).I think we've crossed from offensiveness into complete surrealism at this point.

My only hope is that this backlash makes him less likely to completely fuck up the Xena reboot--even if it's not because he gets what he did wrong on The 100, but just because he doesn't want more backlash like this on Xena. But I'm not holding my breath. Though if the guy has the common sense God gave a housefly, he'll hire some VERY tuned in LGBT+ advisors/consultants, like, yesterday. Or, you know, anyone on this board who has no problem diagnosing the massive problems with everything relating to this episode? :)

Me too. I don't want to sound insensitive, but when talking about equal representation for your fictional characters, well, that means you can't treat your gay characters like they're special or untouchable.

But then why is it that gay characters (particularly lesbians, hence the Dead Lesbian cliche) die at a highly disproportionate rate, and get non-happily-ever-afters at a highly disproportionate rate, across TV in general? That's like the opposite of special or untouchable! Edited March 9, 2016 by stealinghome

[lovemytvshows]

So clearly they can't go back and change the past (307) but what about the finale where they have Lexa back only to presumably kill her off again? Especially since many of you have pointed out that the finale was one of the specific episodes where Rothenberg tried to bait the fans to go down to Vancouver to watch them film certain Lexa/Clarke scenes.

 

It's probably safe to assume now that whatever Lexa/Clarke scenes there will be, won't end well because Clarke will have to say goodbye to Lexa all over again. Who knows if it's going to be just as gut-wrenching or even moreso than the one in 307?  Are they (the writers, Rothenberg, etc) gearing themselves up for "307 Backlash Pt. II"??? Because at the moment I'm sorta expecting this whole thing to boil over again come the finale. And I daresay Rothenberg and co. deserve it more than than what they copped for 307.

[stealinghome]

Yeah, you know, I think it's interesting--given the backlash to 3x07, you have to imagine that Rothenberg and co are seriously tempted right now to find a way to cut all of Lexa's scenes in the finale if that's at all possible. Except precisely BECAUSE they made such a point of making the Clarke/Lexa scenes public, if they cut her out of the episode, that would create an equal backlash. It's actually oddly impressive how the creative team has put itself between a rock and a hard place.

[Jack Shaftoe]

If ADC had not been cast in FTWD, I would have been inclined to believe the writers were playing the long con and would eventually resurrect her character. Not because of the backlash that they really should have seen coming but because they seem to enjoy tricking fans very much. The showrunner of Pretty Little Liars did something like that not so long ago.

 

 

My understanding was that the Commander used to only be in charge of Trikru, the same way that the queen was in charge of Azgeda and the other clans presumably have their own leaders.  Lexa was the first Commander who was able to unite all of the clans into a single coalition.  Also, given Titus' reaction to the idea of there being a nightblood from Azgeda, it was probably something that only ever showed up in Trikru children before.

 

That's how I remember the introduction of Lexa and her position back in season 2 but in season 3 it sure does seem like Commander is a bigger title than just leader of Trikru and has been like that for a long time. I can't check right now but I think it was said that the nightblood kids come from all clans and the Ice Queen hid Ontari because she wanted to install her as the next Commander.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Jack Shaftoe

[Delphi]

It was in Watch the Throne, the nightbloods are supposed to be sent to Polis to be trained when they are discovered. I think before Lexa, even though the Commander was HBIC of the grounders, the clans only had a loose association with one another outside of Polis.

[GinnyMars]

Hi everyone! This is my first time posting about the show.

 

I'm wondering if there are more surprises in store. Are we sure Lexa and Alycia are gone for good? Earth-Lexa may be dead, but I think they could keep Alycia pretty easily if they wanted to.

 

There's the City of Lights and flashbacks/visions, of course, but I'm also curious about the eighth natblida. Lexa wouldn't talk about them. She said the other seven noviciates at her conclave "died when the Commander chose [her]", and I saw on a writer's blog earlier that she killed them in a "trial by combat". So obviously, what happened with the eighth Nightblood was worse; or at least, different.

 

If all Nightbloods are descendants of Becca, there can't be that many after 3 or 4 generations... Could it be that two of the noviciates were siblings? Could there have been a twin sister Lexa spared somehow? I know it's out there, but... I don't know, what do you think?

[kdm07]

No, Lexa is definitely dead. Jason already stated that her death was necessary to show the AI/Becca stuff. She isn't coming back ever again.

Her spirit shows up in the COL in the season finale only to be killed again when Clarke destroys the COL.

 

As for the 8th Nightblood? I think it's this Luna person they keep eluding to and my thought is that she managed to escape/run away which is why she's separated from the other clans so much.

Edited March 9, 2016 by kdm07

[Taryn74]

 

If all Nightbloods are descendants of Becca, there can't be that many after 3 or 4 generations... Could it be that two of the noviciates were siblings? Could there have been a twin sister Lexa spared somehow? I know it's out there, but... I don't know, what do you think?

 

I don't think the Nightbloods are necessarily descendants of Becca herself, I think they're descendants of the first group of people she encountered (and injected with the black substance, whatever it is).  So either the Nightbloods are all descendants of that first exclusive group, and there's just not that many of them because the initial group was not very large, OR the black blood sometimes passes on to the child and sometimes doesn't.  (To me it makes more sense for it to be the second scenario, because they never seem to know who is going to be a Nightblood until they are discovered within their own clans.  I would think if this is a gene that automatically passes from the parent to child the Nightbloods would all come from one, separated, clan.  I also don't think the clans would be so accepting of a Nightblood being in a relationship that is not going to produce a biological child, if the gene is automatically passed down thru that special group of people.  Since the only disapproval for Lexa's relationship with Clarke seemed to be that love was making her "weak" it doesn't seem like the others cared that they were both female.  Just my opinion based on my observances.)

 

And I wondered about the eighth Nightblood possibly being Lexa's sibling myself.  Or, Titus' child.  Whoever it was, they didn't die as part of the ceremony (hence, no tattoo honoring them) and the situation bothered Lexa.  Interesting.

 

I know people are upset over Lexa's death, but the CoL/ALIE/Becca/Nightblood storyline has just slammed itself into the most interesting thing going on in this show for me, and I am fascinated to see where it is all leading.

[blixie]

 

I think it's this Luna person they keep eluding to and my thought is that she managed to escape/run away which is why she's separated from the other clans so much.

I've been looking forward to this Luna for a two seasons now, Lincoln mentioned her very early on, because he was already disenchanted with Trikru/Grounder coalition. I hope they get someone really good to play her, and hopefully will be the one to connect with her before Ricky is out there.

[stealinghome]

Another good article.

Also, a strongly worded but not inaccurate examination of/note on what equal treatment in media means.

Edited March 10, 2016 by stealinghome

[Lion]

Another good article.

Also, a strongly worded but not inaccurate examination of/note on what equal treatment in media means.

That tumblr is spot on and needs to be shared everywhere.  I get red in the eyes when someone ignorantly says "but equality blah blah blah".  

[loki567]

Another good article.

Also, a strongly worded but not inaccurate examination of/note on what equal treatment in media means.

 

Oddly enough, it was actually in the comment section of the article there was a comment that summed up my thoughts:

 

 

 

I don't get how anyone who's actually been watching this show could be surprised by Lexa's death. Yes, she's an amazing character, played by a wonderful actress, and her chemistry with Eliza Taylor is fantastic. However looking at this through the lens of plotline, how could Lexa NOT have been killed this season? I was expecting one of her people to assassinate her from the moment this season started, and that's not because I knew the actress had been cast in another show. She has antagonized her people, challenged their traditions, and worst of all her actions will APPEAR to be motivated by her emotional connection to a foreigner. I know that Lexa as a character is much more complicated than that, and she genuinely wants a legacy of peace, but her people would certainly see this as Clarke exerting undue influence over their Commander's decisions.

I thought the "accidental death" trope was a bit silly, but I was honestly surprised that it took seven episodes for Lexa to be killed, based on the political situation that this show has presented us with so far.

[Jack Shaftoe]

 

However looking at this through the lens of plotline, how could Lexa NOT have been killed this season?

 

Pretty much all main characters in this show have had many miraculous escapes, including escaping the consequences of huge political blunders. We might as well ask how could Kane survive culling 300 people on the Ark which turned out to be unnecessary. Also, an argument can be made that Lexa was acting OOC to facilitate the plotline that led to her death (sort of like Finn's sudden turn to ruthless killer in season 2). And in in any event, the man who eventually killed Lexa wasn't even aiming at her, so it's not like her people turned against her so strongly that her survival would have beggared belief.

 

 

I think before Lexa, even though the Commander was HBIC of the grounders, the clans only had a loose association with one another outside of Polis.

 

Maybe the clans were sort of like the German states before the unification of Germany in the 19th century and Lexa united them like Bismarck did in real life. The Iron Commander, I like the sound of that.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Jack Shaftoe

[blixie]

 

That tumblr is spot on and needs to be shared everywhere.

 

Good thing they deleted after being up for a whole seven hours. I am so glad fandom and it's ways have passed me by.

[Delphi]

Well, that's impressive.

https://www.classy.org/fundraise?fcid=625415

[catrox14]

Well that's disappointing that they took the post down. I thought it was pretty spot on explanation of representation in general.

[blixie]

 

Well that's disappointing that they took the post down.

 

I mean I know comments + internet are horrible, but wow. Maybe they just moved it....to a safe space? Which defeats the purpose but eh. 

 

As for the second article the claim that Lexa was killed to further the arc of straight characters (except in the broadest effects the entire canvass way, straights will be impacted is not straights will be benefited) doesn't hold a lot of water for me, since I see Lexa's death as servicing primarily Clarke's story and she is still a LGBT character, indeed she is the LEAD character and thus has as much if not more representational worth than Lexa. It doesn't excuse or justify HOW they went about sweeping a really great and meaningful character, off screen but I also think the trope as respects this show and these writers isn't as flagrant, given the context that this show still has a vibrant LGBT woman at it's center, and it still has another gay character in Miller, and Miller does have an on screen boyfriend, who I hope he gets to do more than hug at some point.  It feels like being an out Bisexual character IS in fact being treated as lesser kind of representation than being an out lesbian.

[yellowfred]

Regarding the predictability of Lexa's death, I actually am in the camp that's been expecting it for a while (for me, the big tip-off was the introduction of Ontari, followed by the explanation that we wouldn't see her again until after Lexa died), but I'm starting to understand a bit more about why so many people were caught off guard by it.  Like, I can respect that the whole reveal of the spirit of the Commander being an AI chip is a huge part of the story that they want to tell, but there's really not any good excuse for being fully aware that there's this damaging trope out there, reassuring your fans that you're aware of it, and then playing right into it anyway.  

Edited March 10, 2016 by yellowfred

[myril]

Well that's disappointing that they took the post down. I thought it was pretty spot on explanation of representation in general.

 

If I remember it correctly it was this short post about representation, right? It didn't disappear, just a different URL. To explain: When someone changes their Tumblr name, aka subdomain it results in a change of the url. While on Tumblr you barely will notice, when you go to your likes for example you still should find it, it effects any links posted elsewhere, like for example here in the forums, those links then are broken.

 

Have been lurking in this thread curious how reactions would be about the episode. The show didn't keep my interest at the beginning, but recently took a look at it again, when noticing the talk about Clexa. Had hoped for a different outcome, as seems many did, but after decades in TV show fandoms, and with view at things as a bisexual non-conforming woman, expected pretty much what unfortunately did happen.

 

As much as I can understand the development from a story telling point of view, even the choice of making the impact even more brutal by making the death rather random instead of heroic, there is this bury the gay / the lesbian trope. Much has already been said here about it. If you have only a very limited number of characters you feel represented by at all, then every single character lost is a significant loss. I get that it might not be easy to understand for those, who don't pay that much attention to lesbians or bisexual women on TV, because it's just not that important for them, that's okay, but maybe try a little thing: Write down spontaneously the first, let's say minimum 10 TV show pairings coming to your mind who had a happy ending or lasted for a longer time at least. Maybe add another 10 even, and 10 more then. And then take a look, how many same sex pairings are among them. 

 

 

As for the second article the claim that Lexa was killed to further the arc of straight characters (except in the broadest effects the entire canvass way, straights will be impacted is not straights will be benefited) doesn't hold a lot of water for me, since I see Lexa's death as servicing primarily Clarke's story and she is still a LGBT character, indeed she is the LEAD character and thus has as much if not more representational worth than Lexa. It doesn't excuse or justify HOW they went about sweeping a really great and meaningful character, off screen but I also think the trope as respects this show and these writers isn't as flagrant, given the context that this show still has a vibrant LGBT woman at it's center, and it still has another gay character in Miller, and Miller does have an on screen boyfriend, who I hope he gets to do more than hug at some point.  It feels like being an out Bisexual character IS in fact being treated as lesser kind of representation than being an out lesbian.

 

Indeed, Clark is still there, and a main character, and maybe it is hard now to forget that she was in love with a woman, I hope, but there is something that is known as bisexual erasure or invisibility. Indeed, it can look and sound in discussions about representation in media and fiction as if a bisexual person or character is taken as a kind of lesser representation. Bisexual men are the rarest unicorns of all, barely existing, a reason why I will love Torchwood and Captain Jack Harkness forever. For bisexual women the situation is a different one, they even appear quite often in fiction, but they have an uncanny habit to "lose" their bisexuality, in the perception of the audience at least or sometimes even in the narrative. Problem is, we believe what we see: A woman kissing a woman and ending up with her is a lesbian, a woman kissing a man is a heterosexual, a woman kissing a woman but later ending up with a man had a phase, a woman kissing a man and later ending up with a woman becomes a lesbian. Because we believe what we see, many often enough forget about the character being still bisexual regardless whoever they end up with as happy ending. Unless you explicitly let the character say again and again that she, or he, is bisexual. And even then there are people doubting, saying it was just a phase, either way.

 

The somewhat sad thing is, if Clark as a bisexual has a relationship with a man she is simply not representing an alternative to the still dominant happy romantic heterosexual relationships on screen, but is disappearing in rather more of the same. If she is in no relationship then her bisexuality is as invisible for representation. Clark as bisexual makes only a significant difference in visibility, in representation, when she is in a relationship with a woman. 

[Riful]

I would urge anyone that is still scratching their head over this shit storm to entertain reading the donation comments on this fundraiser that was made in response to all of this:

 

https://www.classy.org/fundraise?fcid=625415

 

The next is probably also the best tackling I have read about the use of tropes, the backlash etc.

 

http://www.fandomfollowing.com/an-open-letter-to-jason-rothenberg-of-the-100/

 

Re that periscope: I read a summary from someone that I feel no reason to mistrust, and it sounds like it was the messiest mess ever. Several people also commented that they think the writers were drunk.

 

Apparently the writers babbled about that they have been listening to what people been saying, and that they were even writing a show with a trans lead, BUT they couldn't actually remember the word for a trans individual when trying to talk about it. That is just insane. Also one of the writers started drunk girl crying, and the other teased Bellarke.

 

Train-wreck feels like it doesn't even cover it. Oh they also let it slip Jason is under advisement regarding social media or something in that vein.

 

You can tell they got their party line now. They are saying they are listening, which is exactly what a wronged party hungers after. However it is clear it is just what they been told to say. Also Javi was initially defensive about the whole she-bang, but then the shit storm grew and he flipped around.

 

Also the TrevorProject donation LGBT* people have set up has reached 16K $ and people are gearing up to trend in relation to this with intent to spread the link, so it is likely to grow. However it will probably get messy because other sides of fandom consider it negative PR for the show, and want to counter trend and try to drown it out. Which sometimes I honestly think I can't be more grossed out by the acts others are willing to do in order to undermined LGBT* but then there is shit like this. I also recognize some of the front runners for the counter trend were after episode 5 trying to trend #BoyCottThe100, but now when Lexa is dead the tune has changed.

 

Respected critics such as Mo Ryan have donated, and even Devon Bostick (Jasper) and Layne Morgan (Writers Assistant) have donated. Not sure if that is subtle shade towards their bosses or they are trying to throw water on the fire.

 

quarks The thing is, I am not even advertising a standard happy ending for Lexa, and I didn't mean it as such when talking about it. I'm sorry for being unclear, I think am used to people taking it for granted that when talking about this, it is meant as "happy by the standards of the 100". That is also what I seen in fandom, and also honestly most of fandom never expected Lexa to get a happy ending per say. The best was a bittersweet one, and most would then hope for the "happy by the standards of the 100". My impression is most at least wanted a send off or ending worthy of the character. That was definitely one thing she didn't remotely get. Furthermore due to the blatant courtship like behavior the writers employed and the things the writers said, many didn't expect it to happen so soon. There is no way any one in their right mind could honestly think this story was satisfying or a story we would be happy with.

 

I would say I feel you can to a certain extent make a case for the show giving the underlying message that romantic/sexual F/F -> pain/tragedy/death. And even link Lexa's death to being related to her same sex relationship with Clarke.

 

We have 4 female characters so far that are confirmed as being romantically/physically interested in women. We got Costia whom was kidnapped, tortured, her body mutilated and her head placed in Lexa's bed because she was romantically involved with Lexa. There is Niylah that after sleeping with Clarke got the crap beat out of her

the actress is also listed to return in 3x11 if I remember right but should be taken with a grain of salt. So her survival is up for grabs

 

Then we have Lexa. Why was Titus trying to kill Clarke? It was because he considered Clarke and their relationship a negative and dangerous influence to Lexa. The killing of Lexa also happened within 2 minutes of them giving into their feelings and having made love. Now that Clarke and Lexa are two women don't factor into the mindset of the people in the world of the 100, but it does into the minds of people in the real world. Be it on a conscious or subconscious level.

I don't think it is remotely intentional of the writers to send this message, but I can't fault anyone if that is the take away for some.

 

I can't recall a single straight character so far has died because of their romantic relationship to another character. So far the score is 2 - 0. Even with Gina being an obvious case of fridging for Bellamy's character, the things that lead to her death was completely unrelated to her romantic involvement. The same can't be said for Lexa or Costia. (By the way not saying I feel like this. I am however putting out the argument because yeah I can't fault the people I have seen making it as there are some basis for it)

I would had also very much preferred they didn't have sex this episode either and developed things better, but the writers felt Lexa had to die in that episode for the sake of the ALIE plot. Or that is the impression I am getting, because Lord knows the writers still haven't been able to settle on one singular story. You would think at least Jules, Kim, Shawna, Javi and Jason would make an effort to sync up their stories but no.

 

As a more general thing with Lexa it seems like the writers truly had no clue just what they could had achieved in certain aspects. Lexa's character appealed to so many LGBT* people and also had a border appeal outside of that. With the LGBT* community how a LGBT* character received often has to do with factors such as quality, uniqueness and most importantly, how many identify with the character. Lexa was hitting very hard on all 3 and honestly was still in the early to middle growth phase in regards of fans.

 

Lexa's character moved the fabric of entire societies in the TV settings she was operating within. Lesbian characters never ever get to be that person. That is a privilege that belongs 99.9% exclusively to straight people. Likewise does other larger than life roles such your standard super agent in an action drama (e.g. Jack Bauer) or superheroes.

 

I cannot stress how important it is for LGBT*, particularly the young ones, to see themselves represented in characters that are world movers. Characters that get to be brilliant and leads lives that have a huge impact on the TV scenery they exist in. By removing Lexa they effectively removed the sole lesbian representation they had on the show, so logically there is focus on that right now. it has nothing to do with somehow undermining what Clarke represents.

 

There is another thing underpinning all of this from my perspective. The Big Count Down to them going into a much dreaded bisexual trope. The show already with full awareness went into the Death Lesbian Trope, and they did it with reproducing the scene that helped burn the trope into the minds of many LGBT* in a decade ago.

Female bisexuals? Have a high tendency to be shown to always go back to men and never shown to be interested in females afterwards. That is the bookend to the Death Lesbian Trope by the way. The lesbian dies while the bisexual cries over their body, and skips back to men if they want a life of happiness (and therefore it is implied yet again that for a person to be happy, they must lead a life of being straight). That is the in the top 3 if not the number 1 when it comes to tropes and offensive portrayal. It also goes hand in hand with undermining female bisexual romantic relationships to other women, insinuates or at time outright calls it a phase, and crowns the M/F relationship as the real one. The one that leads bisexuals to not have a tragic life or die like the lesbian. To make it more messy an annoying aspect of media and audience perception in the eyes of many is always that the bisexual character will often automatically be considered to be straight if M/F relationship and vice versa. There is however a heavy favouritism for a female bisexual to find her "happily ever after"/be at the end of a show, in the arms of a man.

 

Female bisexuals die as well, though at a lower rate than lesbians, and it is a rate that goes down if in a relationship with another male character. I am not even joking, the survival rate of a female bisexual character increases if her character is in a relationship with a male character vs a female character. It is that grotesque.

 

My expectations for the writers have also plummeted and I am expecting a rekindling after the finale. I am half way towards placing my bet that Lexa will urge Clarke to move on, maybe even quote the line that is very much connected to Clarke/Lexa with "life should be about more than just surviving". The writers will probably consider that a nice (bitter)sweet send off, when anyone with a functional brain would know it is basically pouring gasoline on a fire.

Edited March 11, 2016 by Riful

[wevel]

Regarding the predictability of Lexa's death, I actually am in the camp that's been expecting it for a while (for me, the big tip-off was the introduction of Ontari, followed by the explanation that we wouldn't see her again until after Lexa died), but I'm starting to understand a bit more about why so many people were caught off guard by it.  Like, I can respect that the whole reveal of the spirit of the Commander being an AI chip is a huge part of the story that they want to tell, but there's really not any good excuse for being fully aware that there's this damaging trope out there, reassuring your fans that you're aware of it, and then playing right into it anyway.  

 

Yeah, I think anyone who was watching S3 with any level of attention was wondering when Lexa would die.  But there was no indication that she would die from one of the worst lesbian-death tropes ever.  Mo Ryan in her Variety article that I linked to upthread wondered about four other scenarios - not have Lexa return at all, have Lexa return but not get together with Clarke, have Clarke and Lexa get together earlier this season before Lexa dies in 3X07, or have them get together in 3X07 and Lexa die later in the season.  Frankly, I would have preferred the first option, but any of the other three would have been better than what we got.  Even if the reunion and her death were separated by one episode, it wouldn't have been such a replication of Tara's death on Buffy.

 

When Shaw fell in 4X11 of Person of Interest, it was also just after she had kissed Root for the first time.  Shoot fans were both elated and shocked, but we did *not* feel like this.  Because the showrunners had not hyped the episode, had not hyped the show as promising a groundbreaking f/f storyline that would make us happy.  And also because Shaw got a hero's "death" - she fell saving the lives of the rest of the team.  Like ADC on The 100, there were off-screen reasons for writing Shaw out at that moment (Sarah Shahi was several months pregnant by then), so viewers understood why.  But the showrunners left it open for Shaw to return, although we didn't know for several weeks that Shaw was in fact still alive.

 

either the Nightbloods are all descendants of that first exclusive group, and there's just not that many of them because the initial group was not very large, OR the black blood sometimes passes on to the child and sometimes doesn't.  (To me it makes more sense for it to be the second scenario, because they never seem to know who is going to be a Nightblood until they are discovered within their own clans.  I would think if this is a gene that automatically passes from the parent to child the Nightbloods would all come from one, separated, clan.  I also don't think the clans would be so accepting of a Nightblood being in a relationship that is not going to produce a biological child, if the gene is automatically passed down thru that special group of people.  

 

This is an interesting speculation that I hadn't thought about until you mentioned it.  I agree that it probably isn't a definite thing that is passed down to every child; it doesn't seem that predictable.  I don't think it would even be a simple recessive gene, because then there'd still be a familial clustering of the trait.  I wonder if they'll try to explain this aspect of the Nightbloods, or simply focus on the Commander succession proceedings.

Edited March 10, 2016 by wevel

[stealinghome]

If I remember it correctly it was this short post about representation, right? It didn't disappear, just a different URL. To explain: When someone changes their Tumblr name, aka subdomain it results in a change of the url. While on Tumblr you barely will notice, when you go to your likes for example you still should find it, it effects any links posted elsewhere, like for example here in the forums, those links then are broken.

Yup! That was the post.

 

Also Javi was initially defensive about the whole she-bang, but then the shit storm grew and he flipped around.

Javi grew a brain and saw the viewership numbers for his Xena reboot going down...and down...and down...and realized if he wants to have an even moderately successful show, he better at least give the appearance of listening.

Edited March 10, 2016 by stealinghome

[Jack Shaftoe]

 

Lexa's character moved the fabric of entire societies in the TV settings she was operating within. Lesbian characters never ever get to be that person. That is a privilege that belongs 99.9% exclusively to straight people. Likewise does other larger than life roles such your standard super agent in an action drama (e.g. Jack Bauer) or superheroes.

 

I never thought about it that way but you are so right about that.

 

 

Shoot fans were both elated and shocked, but we did *not* feel like this.

 

I usually hate portmanteau couple names but Shoot sounds so cool that it makes me feel bad for dropping Person of Interest as early as episode 3.

[Cranberry]

Person of Interest is the best show on TV right now, in my opinion. It got extra good after the first season when it became more serialized (and added Root and Shaw, whose relationship is the icing on the cake). At this point, I have enough faith in PoI's writers to believe that even if they do kill Root or Shaw in the fifth-season finale, they'll do it in a fitting way.

 

I agree that Shaw's earlier "death" was much better-handled than Lexa's, as she went out of her own accord while actively saving the rest of her team. I think that Lexa's death would have gone over badly in any case, but I suspect that it wouldn't have gone over quite so badly if she'd fallen in battle (or even just died saving Clarke) and if it hadn't happened literally minutes after her first sex scene. Certainly most of the fans I know expected her to die at some point. But like I said earlier, the way the showrunner treated the fandom (both pre-and-post-death) didn't help, either.

[Kate213]

https://www.reddit.com/r/The100/comments/49v31y/s3_spoilers_tumblr_users_are_trying_to_run_a/d0v7ae6

 

Interesting commentary from a PR professional on how The 100's show runners have handled the fallout of Lexa's death. 

 

Mainly:

"If Jason (Rothenberg) was Coca-Cola and 10% of buyers reported getting urine in their cans of Coke after a certain shipment and all Coca-Cola did was post rave reviews about their new recipe, then COCA-COLA WOULD HAVE A PR PROBLEM that would systemically grow for as long as it remained unaddressed.  Jason, categorically, has a big-ass problem, which he is choosing to avoid and dismiss. This is something you CAN'T do when you are in his position over a product (The 100).  And while the disenfranchised group has become overly aggressive at times and crossed lines, I think their core movement is sound.

Their message is: It's 2016 and we will no longer support shows that turn them into a trope for the sake of plot. They deserve better."

 

And:

"How can these people NOT feel used? They categorically were, by definition. In PR, they're called a "street team"--which is a group of passionate volunteers who work out of love for the project and really get no other payoff, other than the occasional thanks, shout out, or access to the product.  Jason had two active street teams in Clexa and Bellarke shippers. He encouraged them both to trend for him even as he disavowed shipping.

In short, Jason played a dangerous PR game and he lost. Hard core."

[Agent Dark]

I think that while they fumbled with the mechanics* of how she died, the fact that her death was shown as a big huge event with serious ramifications for the wider universe and the deep personal effect it has on Clarke, is what makes it ultimately OK by me.  Yes it sucks Lexa dies and if they were to go back and retcon that, then I will have zero problems.  But what's done is done, and I am keen to see how this plays out especially with Clarke.  Clarke is probably the biggest reason I watch this show, because she's such a fantastic character.  I actually think she's the one character the show can't kill off, because she is the protagonist of this story.  Everyone else, including Lexa, are playing parts in her story.

 

*The way I would have handled it would be to use Emerson.  Have Titus approach him after Clarke exiles him, with an offer to let him get revenge on Clarke for the genocide of his people, if he makes it look like Skaikru was the assassin.  But Lexa interrupts and dies, heroically protecting Clarke.  Then there's not quite as direct an unfortunate implication of a disapproving father figure killing his lesbian daughter.  Bonus points for getting a scene where Clarke goes full Wanheda and utterly destroys Emerson in revenge, thus getting a 'have our cake and eat it too' resolution to Emerson's story.

Edited March 11, 2016 by Agent Dark