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Tara Ariano

S01.E01: Pilot

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The overt racism (Hip-hop sucks, but blues, which white folks stole from black folks is great! And the only black humans we see are "hip-hop thugs".) really pissed me off.  That's not from the character -- that's from the show.  One more display like that and I'm out.

 

Agreed, and so glad you mentioned it. I was just saying today that I don't trust anyone who rules out entire genres of music, you mean to tell me THE DEVIL of all non-people can't find some common ground in hip-hop? Crap! I think the problem here is that the show is trying to have its cake and eat it too. It wants to go the whole Anne Rice, Memnoch the Devil "God is making me be evil and I'm tired of this game" route and say things like "you humans" and such but at the same time it makes it clear that Lucifer sees himself as a British white man as opposed to that simply being a vessel to carry his angelic (now demonic) form. 

 

I was wondering if the episode would get around to explaining why Lucifer chose a white, British guy as his vessel/human form. The body, the accent etc but it seems the show believes that he IS that man. I prefer the way Supernatural does is with angels and demons possessing bodies because their true forms are such that human eyes would go blind if they saw them, this way is rather cheap and procedural (much like the show) and he does lack a certain ambiguity. He doesn't have to be evil as many upthread pointed out but he could at least be ambiguous. I agree with the poster who said that Mark did it better although my Mark is Mark Pellegrino (also from Supernatural), but that guy is always working so no chance in hell of getting him (pun intended).

 

I also agree with whomever said that they weren't feeling the female cop, it's all very paint by numbers in that respect. I like Maz and of course I always love DB Woodside and that Doc can stay all day long but the female cop and the fact that Lucifer (as a white guy as opposed to a demon) has to explain that he doesn't hate black people just some of their music just pulls me right out of the show and into a narrative written by a Julie Plec or something. I was with it until then but that coupled with the boring sidekick cop and the soon to be procedural drama crap tells me it's probably not for me. I'd rather go dig up Rosewood and start watching that show,

 

Wrt the "Father" questions. God is Lucifer's father because Lucifer is said to be a fallen angel and yes (as someone upthread asked) he was the favourite, preferred angel before he "fell from grace" and created hell. So when he says father he refers to God as Lucifer was said to be the most beautiful angel in the heavens before he fell.

Edited by slayer2

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In that scene with 2 Vile Lucifer isn't dissing hip hop. He goes out of his way to make clear he doesn't like 2 Vile, specifically. At that moment Lucifer thinks Vile had Delilah killed so he gets very pointed with him.

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In that scene with 2 Vile Lucifer isn't dissing hip hop. He goes out of his way to make clear he doesn't like 2 Vile, specifically. At that moment Lucifer thinks Vile had Delilah killed so he gets very pointed with him.

He makes a point to say he doesn't like hip-hop but does like blues.

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I believe it's a 1958 or 1959 Chevy Corvette Convertible. And is an absolutely gorgeous car.

That what I thought it was also! 

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 think the problem here is that the show is trying to have its cake and eat it too. It wants to go the whole Anne Rice, Memnoch the Devil "God is making me be evil and I'm tired of this game" route and say things like "you humans" and such but at the same time it makes it clear that Lucifer sees himself as a British white man as opposed to that simply being a vessel to carry his angelic (now demonic) form. 

 

 

Yes, and thank you.  I can't help but wonder who thought that scene (with physically threatening the black guy -- the only time Lucy physically threatens someone) was a good idea.  Any bets that the writer's room is all white?

 

I miss Reaper.

 

I like this show, but I miss Reaper too.

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Lucifer slams pasty-white murderer Jimmy into a mirror hard enough to shatter it before doing whatever it is he does that drives the guy into a straightjacket, so I hardly think he's demonstrating a kid gloves approach to Caucasians.

 

As for his choice of appearance/accent, it occurs to me that through the 19th and early 20th centuries there were hundreds of millions of native residents of the British colonial empire who, if asked to put a face to Evil, would picture an affluent white British man with a posh accent. That might not be coincidental.

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I enjoyed this. I'm not a fan of procedurals, and don't pay much attention to the trite details whenever I watch them, so I'm really here for the characters.

 

Lucifer was a lot of fun. He's witty, snarky, charming, superior, and fascinated with humanity. I've always liked the trope of angels/demons who develop a soft spot for humans, á la Good Omens. It was done quite well here. I particularly enjoyed his blunt judgement on 'Trixie' being "a hooker's name." He's not good, he's not bad, he just is. In terms of theology, I find the idea of the devil and his origins to be pretty interesting, and as an atheist and a historian, the fact that humanity took such pains to give backstory and explanation to the existence of evil in the world is intriguing. Especially when you unpick all the various entities and stories that have come to be attributed to him. Lucifer asking questions like "was your offspring planned or a mistake?" really establishes his otherness well. Does he know questions like that are inappropriate? Maybe. Does he give a shit? No.

 

Anyway, that character alone is enough to make me give this show a chance. And I did like the cop as well. She's very much the 'buttoned up, professional woman' that we see too often on television, but she had enough snark that she didn't come across as a debbie downer. The inevitable 'will they, won't they' will probably drive me away fairly quickly, but until then I'm going to enjoy this for what it is. A sexy, irreverent, silly show.

 

If the show moves beyond procedural and creates a broader narrative focusing on Lucifer's potential renewed conflict with God, then the show could get really interesting. I kind of doubt that Fox would allow that to happen, though. I mean, making a show about a bored devil who solves crimes is one thing. Making a show where God is the villain? They'll leave that to Preacher.

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He makes a point to say he doesn't like hip-hop but does like blues.

Of course Lucifer likes the blues, Robert Johnson sold his soul to him at the crossroads.

This is also a nod to the fact that the blues and hip-hop have had an, at best, contentious relationship over the years.

 

Agreed, and so glad you mentioned it. I was just saying today that I don't trust anyone who rules out entire genres of music, you mean to tell me THE DEVIL of all non-people can't find some common ground in hip-hop? Crap!

 

While I am sure he appreciates the seamier end, the one that promotes misogyny, violence and boasting, I don't see why he should necessarily like the music. Taste aside, he is the Devil, and he has been around since the beginning of time, I don't necessarily see why he should care about any music in particular. After all, he has heard it all. I honestly don't see the likes of 2 Vile impressing him. Biz Markie, yeah, But 2 Vile? I don't think so. 

Edited by reggiejax
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While I am sure he appreciates the seamier end, the one that promotes misogyny, violence and boasting, I don't see why he should necessarily like the music. o. 

 

If he had said that, I wouldn't have had a problem with it.  The problem with hip-hop is that it has stagnated and rotted, and that's the music so many people hate (me among them).

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ETA: I liked the soundtrack music.

 

I did too, though a tiny part of me was hoping to hear Rolling Stones' "Sympathy for the Devil" as the theme song.  *GRIN* Maybe it's too expensive.

 

I've watched the first two episodes and so far I'm enjoying it. I don't really care terribly about Chloe yet (and it took me to the end of the episode to learn her name, so she really didn't make the strongest impression on me at first), but the rest is really entertaining. Tom Ellis is hilarious (he has the best lines!), alluring (as he should be, in such a role) and soooo silky smooth (I laughed so hard at the way he glides up to Trixie's bully, gets in her face and says with a wicked smile, "Helloooo, mean girl"), yet also manages to convey something interesting underneath - a boredom and dissatisfaction with the usual stuff in life, and an underlying sadness or something he doesn't yet even see himself which I feel like they will uncover over time. I also like that he's intrigued and vexed by complex people who don't so easily fall prey to his charms.

 

I also think they're building up his intensity, rather than having him be Pure Evil All the Time. Instead we see it emerge in rage-filled split-seconds, before he controls himself again, and I think that's really interesting to watch. I don't think he'll always be able to keep that contained.

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CTV aired the Pilot this evening, and while I loved it the first time around, I loved it even more this time.

 

I think it was a pretty strong Pilot overall, it featured great music, interesting characters, and it was a nice mix of funny and drama. And, I love that Lucifer scared Trixie's bully. I thought that was fun and sweet of him, hah.

 

The scene between Lucifer, Dr. Linda and Chloe was even more hilarious than I remembered.

 

I liked re-watching this but I'm also happy next week will be a new episode. Now I just need Fox to renew this show and everything will be perfect.

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I finally saw that scene with the schoolgirl in high enough definition to tell what was going on with Lucifer's eyes. The irises/pupils snapped open sideways like camera shutters and revealed a screaming toothless mouth in each eye. Creepy effect, utterly ruined on first viewing by a blurry Fox feed that made the images too indistinct.

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I wonder what exactly happened to the bully? Is it all proportionate to their crimes, so seeing the devil's face (somewhat) when your major crime is childish snapchat spats is just not worth anyone losing their mind over just having a scare over what they did (I can't imagine we're going to ever find out that girl went insane like Jimmy, they're working over time to make him not too bad and that would be a lot), or was that just a neat trick they let him do with his eyes that had no ''power" behind it other than freaking someone out and the show just can't be bothered (or doesn't want to spend the money/time on) using that effect again? I'm shocked our Luci still wants to good deeds after he accidentally won himself the unrelenting affection of Trixie for putting the bully in her place, surely he must consider that one under "no good deed goes unpunished"? Or has he not put that one together yet?

 

Watching last night it stood out Lucifer called Chloe by her name twice. But also, her last name was Dancer? I'll just write Lucifer's use of "Chloe" off as the show not having figured out it's naming system fully yet? Though, Dan remained a douche and Luci (thankfully) stuck.

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Now it's definitely Decker but in the Pilot she clearly said "Dancer". I googled it and it has come up as being Dancer in that episode, why it was changed I haven't seen.

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I finally saw that scene with the schoolgirl in high enough definition to tell what was going on with Lucifer's eyes. The irises/pupils snapped open sideways like camera shutters and revealed a screaming toothless mouth in each eye. Creepy effect, utterly ruined on first viewing by a blurry Fox feed that made the images too indistinct.

 

Thank you! Another excuse to rewatch the pilot yet again! I have an HDTV (42") but still didn't notice that.

 

I wonder what exactly happened to the bully? Is it all proportionate to their crimes, so seeing the devil's face (somewhat) when your major crime is childish snapchat spats is just not worth anyone losing their mind over just having a scare over what they did (I can't imagine we're going to ever find out that girl went insane like Jimmy, they're working over time to make him not too bad and that would be a lot), or was that just a neat trick they let him do with his eyes that had no ''power" behind it other than freaking someone out and the show just can't be bothered (or doesn't want to spend the money/time on) using that effect again? I'm shocked our Luci still wants to good deeds after he accidentally won himself the unrelenting affection of Trixie for putting the bully in her place, surely he must consider that one under "no good deed goes unpunished"? Or has he not put that one together yet?

 

Watching last night it stood out Lucifer called Chloe by her name twice. But also, her last name was Dancer? I'll just write Lucifer's use of "Chloe" off as the show not having figured out it's naming system fully yet? Though, Dan remained a douche and Luci (thankfully) stuck.

 

I think it's more than just the face. There must be some psychic/mental thing going on that dictates the degree of influence, kind of like the reverse of carnal fascination.

 

With the carnal fascination, some women like Dr. Linda go all carnal with little or no effort from Lucifer at all. Others like Chloe's mom, just get a little flirty. And others, like the sous-chef and heroin junkie in "Pops" showed no attraction to Lucifer at all, so presumably he would have to make some effort if he wanted to attract them.

 

With the devil face, Jimmy saw it and went head-banging crazy. The street preacher got scared and ran away and the fates of the crazy ex-girlfriend and the shoe designer are unknown, but I doubt they all went as nuts as Jimmy. The street preacher and girlfriend never murdered anyone, so it wouldn't be fair for them to have the same punishment as Jimmy since Lucifer is all about just punishment.

 

I imagine the eyes are less potent than the full devil face, so my guess is the bully girl just got scared straight with no lasting mental damage.

 

Another thing is apparently Lucifer can control who sees the devil face. Only the street preacher saw his devil face, not anyone else in the crowded street. Yet with the crazy ex-girlfriend, how could Chloe then accidentally see the devil face. Did Lucifer want her to see it (maybe subconsciously) to prove he's the devil to her, similar to asking her to shoot him? Or did he not know she was there, so he didn't know to "block" her from seeing it. (More likely, the writers are just not consistently defining his powers, leaving it open to fanwanking...)

 

I noticed the use of "Chloe" twice too, instead of "Detective". It's probably just a pilot vs. series difference (like her name being Dancer in the pilot and Decker in the series) but it works as symbolic of him keeping a bit of distance from her. As long as she doesn't believe he's the devil, no matter how close they become as friends, she will never really know his true self and he can never be completely open with her. It would be neat if him starting to call her Chloe again (at least when not on the job) coincides with her finally coming to believe that he really is the devil.

Edited by vampdetective

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I also noticed that Lucifer was upset when he thought Jimmy was dying because without him ruling Hell, there wouldn't be any follow-up on the apropriate punishment. A worry I think he could put out of his head, because I don't see a world full of demons and traumatized damned souls setting up a peaceful, love-filled society in his absence. It might be more Lord of the Flies than poetic justice, but it probably wouldn't be noticeably more pleasant for anyone there.

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I must be crazy, beginning to watch this now that it has been officially cancelled but...I originally saw this when it first came out and really enjoyed it, just didn't have time to go back and continue with the season. I love the charming leads, a little different from your usual romantic leads, and I am looking forward to the journey. Maybe we'll get lucky and it will be renewed on a different network a la Brooklin 99. I have a feeling I am going to be very invested in the show by the conclusion, so I hope so.

Edited by PreBabylonia · Reason: Wrong title for that other show I haven

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On 12/18/2018 at 10:36 PM, MorganSte said:

Just re-watched the pilot on Netflix, and I miss Lucifer with the darker edge to him. 

When I saw that someone had posted in here my very first thought was "ah, the good old days". I remember how quickly and how much I fell in love with this show that first season. Damn was it good back then.

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On 12/20/2018 at 6:50 PM, Mabinogia said:

When I saw that someone had posted in here my very first thought was "ah, the good old days". I remember how quickly and how much I fell in love with this show that first season. Damn was it good back then.

The first two seasons of this show were great. The third season just went off the rails. (The same thing happened with the O.C., which then managed to redeem themselves with a great shortened 4th season.)

Edited by methodwriter85
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