S04.E10: Blood Debts

[Tara Ariano]

Oliver seeks revenge and goes on a brutal manhunt to find Dahrk, after dealing with the devastating consequences of Dahrk's latest attack.

[EmeraldArcher]

NOOOOO.

 

Her ring was gone, and they're heavily suggesting it's Digg in the grave with their reaction in the limo.

Edited January 21, 2016 by EmeraldArcher

[janeta]

Love me some Felicity. :-)

OK, so who are we thinking is in the grave so far?

Maybe her mother? (Donna?)

Edited January 21, 2016 by janeta

[calliope1975]

First, haaaahahahahaha on Oliver throwing Sara back in Laurel’s face. That was amazing. And mean. And awesome.

 

I can’t believe I rushed home for this. If this was my introduction to Arrow, I would not continue watching. I will never take Felicity Smoak for granted again. I now know that her departure would absolutely make me quit. As much as I love Diggle and Thea, it’s not enough.

 

Flashbacks were snoozeworthy again though we got underground prison achievement unlocked.

 

I get Oliver avoiding Felicity because that’s what I think he was doing. And that was a really nice scene between the two when he finally did show up. This Show would be moronic to throw that away for whatever contrived bullshit they’ll dream up.

 

Thea’s adorable. I am actually interested in her story this year. WH is doing a great job. I’m glad Anarchy got away. He’s a decent enough villain. I wouldn’t mind seeing him return one day.

 

My stream crapped out right at the end, dammit. What I miss? Nevermind, I saw Emerald Archer's post. I'm calling shenanigans unless they really are going to substitute one black dude for another with Mr. Terrific. I'm not buying it. I still say it's one of the Lance's in the ground.

[dtissagirl]

SWERVE!

 

That was a good way to end a mindnumbingly boring filler episode, Arrow. Props to that?

[KenyaJ]

I had shit to say, but now all I wanna do is delight in the tears of all the fanboys who were hoping it was Felicity in the grave. 

 

Felicity's ring was just at the jeweler's for cleaning, though. Right?

[Lantern7]

Wow. The favorite in the dead pool is off the board. Totally would have expected Felicity to have bought the farm. Granted, paralysis isn't much better, but I'm glad to see she'll live. I wonder if Ray could whip up a solution for her, but I understand he's going to be very busy soon.

 

Totally forgot about Anarky, as well as Dark's family. And, apparently, Mrs. Dark may be as bad as her husband. Did not see that coming.

 

Any reason for the flashbacks? I'm asking because the prior seasons had a reason for the "five years ago" sequence. The only reason I can think of is bringing in the British guy who couldn't hold his own series.

[Delphi]

Eh. I was right to be nervous. I'm underwhelmed.

Though note I'm pratty sure it's

Roy

in the grave. Because I don't think it could be Thea and no one else makes sense.

I guess I figured Felicity would end up paralyzed but still meh. Emily rocks the hell out of the little she was given. Which is a huge disappointment. It should have given more focus to that.

But I loved Anarky and I loved Thea. That was good. But I thought it would have been better in a different episode.

[Angel12d]

That ending was worth sitting through that hella boring episode. 

[apinknightmare]

SWERVE!

 

That was a good way to end a mindnumbingly boring filler episode, Arrow. Props to that?

 

Seriously. And anyone could still taking a dirt nap, yay!

[AyChihuahua]

I paid attention on Twitter, and hearing that she definitely dumps him has made my night. Thank God for no-doormat Felicity.

Edited January 23, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[tennisgurl]

Most important thing? Felicity is OK! Very good news! Not good news? I am now convinced that the person in the grave is Dig. I am SO not even close to OK with that. 

 

DDs wife is just as crazy as he is. I like it better than her being an innocent. 

 

Island stuff is pointless. I am still waiting for the "Oliver joins the Russian mob" stuff to start. That at least sounds like it might have potential. 

 

Thea is great as always. 

[Jediknight]

NOOOOO.

 

Her ring was gone, and they're heavily suggesting it's Digg in the grave with their reaction in the limo.

It's not going to be Diggle, it's going to be a Lance.  If it was Diggle, Barry wouldn't have been the only one from Team Flash there.  Cisco and Caitlin would have been there since they liked Mr Diggle.

 

Anarky has, well had a crush on Thea.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Jediknight

[Scribbles]

So the flashforward elimination game is well underway.... not Barry, not Felicity....more to come.  Can I say how worth it it was for them to get the Felicity is in the grave talk over and done!!!!  That alone is sooooooo worth it.

[foreverevolving]

Love me some Felicity. :-)

OK, so who are we thinking is in the grave so far?

Maybe her mother? (Donna?)

I want it.. No I NEED it to be buckles, but it's probably Donna or Roy, could be Curtis too.

FYI the grave was too big for a child, so it's certainly not William. and am I mistaken or Felicity wasn't wearing her ring in the car scene?

[pivot]

NOOOOO.

Her ring was gone, and they're heavily suggesting it's Digg in the grave with their reaction in the limo.

I think Felicity seemed angrier than Oliver. I think it is her mom in the grave, which is moronic.

As is the break-up.

[apinknightmare]

I get Oliver avoiding Felicity because that’s what I think he was doing. And that was a really nice scene between the two when he finally did show up. This Show would be moronic to throw that away for whatever contrived bullshit they’ll dream up.

 

Their two scenes were nice, although the first one was way too much about Oliver. 

[KenyaJ]

Seriously, though, that was such an underwhelming hour of television. Loved Diggle, loved Olicity, loved Oliver pointing out that Felicity is a total badass. But other than that, I was supremely bored.

 

And I have a headache from all the “Laurel can take care of herself” anvils that have fallen on my head this season.

[jay741982]

Love me some Felicity. :-)

OK, so who are we thinking is in the grave so far?

Maybe her mother? (Donna?)

Diggle would garner that reaction from her I don't think Lance or Laurel would

[Primal Slayer]

Overall, I enjoyed it. Was surprised by how much Laurel had to do lol. Her finding out about Q/D was awkward but nice to know she has his back in finding love. If she isn't the one in the grave, they really need to stop this whole "Laurel is last to find out" shtick they have going on since S1.  Laurels/Olivers temporary difference in "justice" could've been such a good storyline to play out for about 2 episodes but oh well.

 

I really wish they would learn that they can split up the team and send them on different missions instead of everyone tagging along all the time. It would've been real easy to have Oliver/John focus mainly on DD while Laurel/Speedy deal with Anarky.

 

Speedy/Anarky storyline was good, though I would love it if he would've stalked her for a hot minute and get a creepy storyline out of that. But it was good to

finally get away from so many Ghosts.

 

The flashbacks as usual, I wish they weren't there and that we just kept to the present to explore more of all the storylines going on.

 

Felicity being completely paralyzed is just stupid, unnecessary drama and I rather they just have her in recovery and it take like 3 episodes for her to recover. 

 

All these New Gods references, wonder if they will go full throttle and actually introduce some of em.

 

And now everyone can rejoice that Felicity isn't in the grave and we can continue on with the annoying "Laurel is dead! Thea is dead! Quentin is dead!"

[EmeraldArcher]

I liked the little beats between Oliver and Felicity, even though she should have been a little less understanding.  Surely Felicity's entire life isn't about the mission--nobody deserves that kind of life. And, it was framed more as her understanding Oliver's need for vengeance than seeing him as an instrument of her own. The more I think of it, the more I feel manipulated into liking those little beats.  They just used Felicity to sell Oliver's abandonment of her to us.  At least Donna chewed on him some.

 

Honestly, my favorite parts were Anarky's digs at Laurel. I also enjoyed Oliver's willingness to throw Sara back in Laurel's face.  Basically, anybody being mean to Laurel made me happy.

 

I'm really worried that we're supposed to think Digg is in the grave, judging by Felicity's reaction in the limo.  Would she really be that upset about Laurel?  I don't think Thea is a real candidate, but Donna might be. I certainly don't think Lance would warrant that reaction. 

 

Felicity's missing ring in the limo seems to indicate that she and Oliver have broken up.  They weren't comforting each other, and they seemed really tense with each other, which is SO WEIRD to see. Ugh.

 

The flsahbacks were awful.

[Delphi]

For the record, though I'm not sure, I don't believe the women of Jewish faith are supposed to wear jewelry to mourning events like funerals or shivah.

[jay741982]

I don't like how Cold Felicity seemed in the Flash Foward I really hope they don't make her darker she's the light of the show! Did anyone notice in the preview Felicity was popping pills? Please don't make her get a drug problem!

NOOOOO.

 

Her ring was gone, and they're heavily suggesting it's Digg in the grave with their reaction in the limo.

Could be Donna :(

[GirlvsTV]

I massively disliked this. Sorry, but Oliver not being able to get over himself long enough to be there for Felicity on top of the totally stupid Baby Mama bull is just . . . And then SHE gave HIM a pep talk?! She should've punched him in his face. I think they've finally made me done with his character for good. I just don't care anymore. I hope Felicity throws that ring in his face and takes his eye out with it.

Tbh, I don't really care enough about the other stuff to comment on it. I didn't realize until watching tonight how detached I'd become to most of the other characters. I was happy to have Lyla back, but thought her speech to Digg was kind of nonsensical, "Just be his brother! Show him how you love people!" What?

I'm afraid my spec that instead of making Oliver miserable in 3b they'll be doing it to Felicity is going to come true. I was hoping for a Lance, but I won't be surprised if it's Donna in the grave.

[apinknightmare]

I'm really worried that we're supposed to think Digg is in the grave, judging by Felicity's reaction in the limo.  Would she really be that upset about Laurel?  I don't think Thea is a real candidate, but Donna might be. I certainly don't think Lance would warrant that reaction. 

 

Since these FFs are mainly to get people talking and speculating, much like Barry showing up in the first one, I'm not sure that we can take the reaction as a definite indicator of who it is. I think anyone could garner that reaction depending on what exactly it was they were doing when they died. Did they save someone? Did they keep something terrible from happening? That probably matters.

[Velocity23]

If that scene from the sizzle promo is true. Thea is also out for FF. Since she is in a hospital. And Oliver weraing the same suit as in the FF.

[jay741982]

For the record, though I'm not sure, I don't believe the women of Jewish faith are supposed to wear jewelry to mourning events like funerals or shivah.

That may be true but I think we are to believe they aren't together at that moment at least

[Delphi]

Uhm in regards to Felicity in the promo

it looks like she just left treatment early to help the team after a bullet broke her spine. She can take all the oxies she wants, that's not a drug problem.

[AyChihuahua]

I liked the little beats between Oliver and Felicity, even though she should have been a little less understanding.  Surely Felicity's entire life isn't about the mission--nobody deserves that kind of life. And, it was framed more as her understanding Oliver's need for vengeance than seeing him as an instrument of her own. The more I think of it, the more I feel manipulated into liking those little beats.  They just used Felicity to sell Oliver's abandonment of her to us.  At least Donna chewed on him some.

 

..

 

Felicity's missing ring in the limo seems to indicate that she and Oliver have broken up.  They weren't comforting each other, and they seemed really tense with each other, which is SO WEIRD to see. Ugh.

Wait, you mean Felicity being paralyzed was not about her, but was about Oliver and his manpain? Say it ain't so!

 

Confirmation of the hardcore dumpage is the only reason I may tune back in. (They can get back together after he learns to stop lying all the time.)

[jay741982]

Uhm in regards to Felicity in the promo

it looks like she just left treatment early to help the team after a bullet broke her spine. She can take all the oxies she wants, that's not a drug problem.

Agreed.

[apinknightmare]

That may be true but I think we are to believe they aren't together at that moment at least

 

They aren't together at that point. The body language, terse conversation, and distance between them points to it.

[jay741982]

Wait, you mean Felicity being paralyzed was not about her, but was about Oliver and his manpain? Say it ain't so!

 

Confirmation of the hardcore dumpage is the only reason I may tune back in. (They can get back together after he learns to stop lying all the time.)

You'll be tuning in for that episode ready to dance when she does it lol

[AyChihuahua]

Did I hear correctly on Twitter that Felicity in the FF also says she's quitting the team?

[SleepDeprived]

This was such an eye-opening episode in that I truly, finally, definitively realized that without Felicity, this show is not something I would regularly watch. I didn't really react much and just watched unmoved about anything until Felicity showed up on the screen. EBR did great with what little time she was given. Donna felt a little wasted in this episode, too. I feel like Donna's hallway scene with Oliver should've been something more but I was kinda annoyed with Oliver, by that point, so all I could muster was a sigh of half-boredom/half-frustration. I know that avoidance is Oliver's MO but man...

 

Oh, wait. Lyla made me happy. And Diggle's anger about Felicity's condition. The Diggles are legit the BEST. And NO, the Diggles (except for, possibly, Andy) are absolutely not in the grave/dying. Also, Thea continues to be awesome. Love her.

[kismet]

Seriously, I had a shitty day at work... followed by a shitty 45min of what used to be a good show. I'm catching up to the first 15min, but I doubt it will make any difference.

 

I disliked this episode. Way too much FB. Way too much LL. Way too much predictable crap. Way too little TA & FS. Not even DD or Anarky could save this episode with their deviousness.

Even the lack of ring at the end was predictable. I don't even care that they made her so cold in the end... it sorta fits where I think that are taking the show which is down the crapper. 

 

I feel like OQ... I just don't know what the point of it all is anymore?? Seriously, why do I watch this show... there is no point.

[apinknightmare]

Did I hear correctly on Twitter that Felicity in the FF also says she's quitting the team?

 

No, she says that in the teaser for next week's ep.

[AyChihuahua]

You'll be tuning in for that episode ready to dance when she does it lol

Absolutely. What he is doing is absolutely hideous, and he damn well knows better by now. No excuses. His manpain is just bullshit now. He can't visit his FIANCEE who could DIE because of HIS pain? Seriously, you fucking asshole, get over yourself for an HOUR.

[Angel12d]

I thought the episode was so boring. Seriously. 

 

Laurel and her self-righteousness can just go away. Thank god they had Oliver bring up what she did to Sara. In her words "It's the hypocrisy I can't stand."

 

Diggle had a good scene with Andy, when he finally got through to him, but I need more. Where is that going? Is he just gonna keep him locked up forever? And I was so certain that Andy was the older brother, not the other way around.

 

I'm kind of intrigued by the Anarky/Thea thing. Is she going to be lured to the dark side by him? 

 

Oliver was a bit of a dick not being at the hospital. I mean, I get it. He's GA so he can't just sit by her bedside the whole time. He's also the master at denial and he was devastated. But this wasn't about him. This was about being there for Felicity. The fact that she had to comfort him wasn't great at all. I love their scenes together though. Highlight for me. And the only time I felt any kind of emotion. 

 

As for the flash forward, I'm so happy that we can end all the talk of Felicity being dead. Is it wrong that I want to get a cup for some fanboy tears? Yes. Probably. 

 

And it's obvious that O/F break up at some point. They seemed to be pretty tense in that limo. So I really want to know how that unravels. But I do still want them to be together again eventually. 

 

Super worried about Diggle in that grave now though. *Bites nails*

Edited January 21, 2016 by Angel12d

[jay741982]

They aren't together at that point. The body language, terse conversation, and distance between them points to it.

Oh yes I noticed it all too. Knowing these writers they probably won't get back together until last 10 to 5 minutes of the season. Though I really don't want that last season still gives me mental scars though Oliver deserves to have Felicity dump him for a little while

[Delphi]

Sorry, random but who the fuck makes out with their new boyfriend on their daughters hospital bed while said daughter is in surgery! Priorities Donna!

[jay741982]

Did I hear correctly on Twitter that Felicity in the FF also says she's quitting the team?

She says it at the end of promo for next week

[Coop33]

I never once believed they would kill Felicity, but it's nice to have it confirmed, and a good thing since I thought this episode proved that the show needs her. Her diminished presence was felt through the episode for me. It was mostly a snooze fest.

 

Outside of the Olicity scenes, Oliver pointing out Laurel's hypocrisy with regards to Sara was my favorite part. Someone should have pointed that out to her much, much sooner, but I'll take what I can get. I enjoyed watching the back and forth between Thea and Anarky. Willa is really doing a great job this season. The Andy/Diggle stuff fell flat for me, don't know why. Lyla is awesome and I want her around all the time.

 

i think what we're mostly supposed to take away from the flash forward is that Felicity and Oliver are broken up. She's not wearing the ring, and they are sitting as far apart from each other as possible. I don't know if we can really read into their reactions as to who is in the grave as, with the premiere, I'm not even sure the actors knew when they filmed this. I still Lance is the best bet.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Coop33

[dtissagirl]

Oh. The "four months from now" in the new flash-forward puts the death at the really real end of the season now. We were speculating as early as 418, now it might be later.

[jay741982]

Absolutely. What he is doing is absolutely hideous, and he damn well knows better by now. No excuses. His manpain is just bullshit now. He can't visit his FIANCEE who could DIE because of HIS pain? Seriously, you fucking asshole, get over yourself for an HOUR.

Hey like I told ya before I'm right there with Oliver getting deservedly dumped. I love Olicity but Oliver needs to fucking learn

[kismet]

Wait, you mean Felicity being paralyzed was not about her, but was about Oliver and his manpain? Say it ain't so!

I have a feeling they paralyzed FS to make OQ's withholding seem less horrible. Because if they can overcome paralysis, then they can overcome a little keeping secrets with silly ultimatums by Bitchy ex-lovers.

 

I hate that they are doing this paralysis story and I hate that in the end I know it will not be about FS at all. It will be about OQ. It will be about Curtis. And it will be about saving a company that really serves no purpose on the show.

 

I just hate it... because you just can't fix paralysis and yet this show will do it with a snap of their fingers. It's just sickening that this is the best these writers can give us.

Edited January 21, 2016 by kismet

[apinknightmare]

Sorry, random but who the fuck makes out with their new boyfriend on their daughters hospital bed while said daughter is in surgery! Priorities Donna!

 

She's always wanted to have hospital sex, okay?!

[jay741982]

Oh. The "four months from now" in the new flash-forward puts the death at the really real end of the season now. We were speculating as early as 418, now it might be later.

This episode picked right up from where last one ended so the time is probably different but that being said UGH Oliver and Felicity being miserable apart made last season suck hard. Now I'm getting fears of ending like season 1

Edited January 21, 2016 by jay741982

[apinknightmare]

I have a feeling they paralyzed FS to make OQ's withholding seem less horrible. Because if they can overcome paralysis, then they can overcome a little keeping secrets with silly ultimatums by Bitchy ex-lovers.

 

I doubt it considering they're broken up in the FF. 

[jay741982]

I doubt it considering they're broken up in the FF.

We don't know if they get back together soon after though im getting fears of a bad season ending

[Morrigan2575]

This episode picked right up from where last one ended so the time is probably different but that being said UGH Oliver and Felicity being miserable apart made last season suck hard. Now I'm getting fears of ending like season 1

Nope, they pointed out in 409 that Oliver almost proposed 3 months ago (401). Title card should have said 3 month later to keep with 6 months timeline. They either pushed it back a month or suck at math.