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Survivor In The Media

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38 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

I am amazed that there is no Elisabeth interview because damn. 

Sounds like Elizabeth wants to forget that she was on the show. Can’t blame her. 

I still think that the three of them were caught up in the ‘competition’.  Anyone that has competed can easily fall into that mode where they say and do things that they wouldn’t in ‘normal life’.  

I bet she is sick about this as are the other two.  

Dan ... I don’t know.  Can’t believe he is staying quiet unless ordered to do so due to the show.   Also I can’t believe ‘anyone else that was a victim’ hasn’t popped up to say so.   It doesn’t make sense to me.

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@Rachel RSL

Thanks for telling me that.  I don’t do social media and I didn’t realize. 

I’ve been trying to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.  Maybe I shouldn’t be. 

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22 minutes ago, Ellee said:

@Rachel RSL

Thanks for telling me that.  I don’t do social media and I didn’t realize. 

I’ve been trying to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.  Maybe I shouldn’t be. 

No you should. I will never understand the default position by some that this person be an evil and despicbnle human being because she made some questionable choices on a competetive reality tv show. This cast has been dealing with this issue amongst themselves months before the season even started. Apologies have been given and accepted long before anyone posted these apologies were posted on social media. The players also do not have control of their edit. They don't what is going to air and what is not going to air.  Last season a player used the n-word twice around camp. It never aired. So no, the fact that Elizabeth and others were promoting that they were on the season means nothing to me. I would also add based on the fact that not one person voted out of the game has had anything negative to say about Elizabeth at all.  In fact it has been the opposite.  I think the Ponderosa clips show this as well. Given that yeah it quite easy to come to the conclusion that she just got caught up playing the game and has Jamal has pointed out she had every reason to believe that Dan's "behavior" was already being used as a tactic in the game, namely by Kellee herself who all the time she was having her heart to heart with Missy was planning on blindsiding her. Lauren even told Missy she was doing that to make her "comfortable" and therefore make blindsiding her easier.

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1 hour ago, LanceM said:

I will never understand the default position by some that this person be an evil and despicbnle human being

Please don't put words in my mouth.  I said her behaviour was despicable, not that she was a despicable human being.  I also didn't say that Elizabeth was promoting the season, I said she was promoting that one specific episode, the one episode that she absolutely should not have been proud of.

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2 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Please don't put words in my mouth.  I said her behaviour was despicable, not that she was a despicable human being.  I also didn't say that Elizabeth was promoting the season, I said she was promoting that one specific episode, the one episode that she absolutely should not have been proud of.

You are right you made that distinction so I apologize. I have seen others though not make the distinction and that is more of what I was commenting on. I should have made that more clear. As far as the merge episode she tweeted a picture of the tribe flag and commented that it was "a beautiful name for our tribe flag"  That is it. The name of the tribe is a reference to Jack's father who passed away.  So I see nothing wrong with that (especially considering that it is rumored those two are dating)

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On 12/6/2019 at 6:50 PM, LanceM said:

Yep. It was in the context of playing a movie quote game and apparently it happened twice. Other players from that season have backed her up that this did happen.

https://www.realityblurred.com/realitytv/2019/06/julia-carter-survivor-edge-of-extinction-experience/

Yeah, Julia's story is pretty depressing. And it actually ties into Missy's calling out Jeff for not acknowledging that two people of color won immunity in that first week. I understand that people are burnt out on the race conversation in this country but the reality is that people think that it is ok to toss out the N word because it was a part of a quote or because it is used in rap music or any of those ridiculous excuses. That is a sign to me that there is a deep seated culturally ingrained issue that needs to be addressed.

From what Julia said and others seem to imply, she was made invisible by the editing that wanted to focus on Joe being so awesome. And she choose to not make a big issue over the use of the N word because she feared a backlash. Sound familiar to any one?

So while I understand that conversations of implicit racial bias and what is harassment and the potential blow back is problematic for son, it is needed.

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On 12/6/2019 at 6:50 PM, LanceM said:

Yep. It was in the context of playing a movie quote game and apparently it happened twice. Other players from that season have backed her up that this did happen.

https://www.realityblurred.com/realitytv/2019/06/julia-carter-survivor-edge-of-extinction-experience/

I remember that well. Not only because he used the word in her presence, but how disturbing that someone's two favorite movie quotes would contain that word. People don't realize how much they reveal about themselves by what they find funny.   We're always talking about the show's casting, but how could they possibly predict something like that?  That's another case like Dan's where I'm disappointed he wasn't voted out at the very  next tribal council.

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44 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

From what Julia said and others seem to imply, she was made invisible by the editing that wanted to focus on Joe being so awesome.

And from common sense, the use of the word and that very storyline were intertwined. I maintain production had no reason to sweep that under the rug if it was a nobody newbie who used racist language, but plenty of motive if it was one one of their returning "stars."

And they certainly couldn't do an edit focusing on how awesome he was if they showed him using that language. He's the right demographic for liking that media, and it would explain a lot of things (Ron's targeting him early on, Julia's coolness about him in her essay).

It's another instance of players being muzzled because they fear retribution from a show that not only controls their edits, but any potential returning opportunities. Meaning nobody who has a prayer at getting back on Survivor will ever speak the whole truth to power.

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1 hour ago, omophagia said:

A bit more information here regarding Dan's ejection from the game: 

https://people.com/tv/why-survivor-contestant-dan-spilo-removed-from-game/

Also of note: The reunion is being pre-taped, rather than aired live.

Honestly, that's about the last thing I would have expected.  Seriously, all this vagueness makes it sound worse than it is.  I would have bet money Dan was saying something sleazy or getting Feely with a camera woman or producer or some female staff member.  

All of this could have been avoided.  Hell, this could have been an accident, yet this is what they remove Dan for.  I continue to get upset with how this has been handled.  They go from making it a big talking point, to totally ignoring it when the girl who was mainly accusing him got voted off (and making him seem like a victim), to this.  I hope there's some changing of the guard behind the scenes before the next seasons start filming (assuming there are seasons past 40).

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15 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

A bit more information here regarding Dan's ejection from the game: 

I just googled him and I was surprised. He part owner of a management company and Jared Padalecki's manager. I wonder how many actors/actresses are going to jump ship. It's not good for any actor to be associated with him or his company.

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4 hours ago, innocuouspuff said:

Jeff Varner is on twitter claiming Dan was railroaded and that the cast members of 39 have told him this, and that's the reason for no live finale, that people would try to defend Dan. Ok, boomer.

https://twitter.com/JEFFVARNER/status/1204944490139672576

I wouldn't be shocked if this is true. One of the interesting things about Big Brother and its live feeds, is when they have a season where a contestant does something awful, racism or sexism-wise, and the audience sees it play out live.

Most of the time, people who were supporting said racist or sexist in the house, would end up supporting them on the outside as well, usually with arguments of, "You don't know what really happened." 

But I charge it's the players in that situation don't know what really happened because they're so in "game mode," that they can't have proper perspective on everything. They don't want to admit to themselves that they supported bad behavior, bad behavior that sometimes had nothing to do with game, and so they excuse that bad behavior outside the game as well. 

I have no doubt that Dan would have his defenders from the cast. But the only people I want to hear from about the situation is Kellee, Missy, or anyone else who might have direct knowledge of his behavior. 

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6 hours ago, Al Herkimer said:

Not allowing Dan to be at the reunion does seem wrong to me, if they're going to talk about him at all.

Well, maybe they are not going to talk about him? It looks like the show wants to sweep this all under the rug.

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9 hours ago, innocuouspuff said:

Jeff Varner is on twitter claiming Dan was railroaded and that the cast members of 39 have told him this, and that's the reason for no live finale, that people would try to defend Dan. Ok, boomer.

https://twitter.com/JEFFVARNER/status/1204944490139672576

I doubt if his age has anything to do with it, plus he's too young to be a boomer, but Varner has always thought he was the smartest person in the room and now, apparently, he knows all about what happened while admitting he didn't even watch the episodes with Kellee.

The producer who had her leg touched really should step up and tell everyone about it.  The Dan defense is picturing Dan losing his balance and a flailing hand accidentally touching her calf.  Others are thinking he might have been in the process of sitting down and put his whole hand around her inner thigh.  It all makes a difference and it would help to have some facts.

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It occurred to me that perhaps one reason why Survivor/Probst/CBS, etc haven't said anything further about what happened is that Dan has an attorney who has threatened litigation.

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1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

I love that Varner expects us to believe that the whole cast has decided to talk to him, of all people lol, about the situation. Sure, Jan.

LOL. For real, are we supposed to think that the cast is sitting around saying to themselves, "I really need the support of a well-respected former player. Hope I can get that guy who outed Zeke!"

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47 minutes ago, Hanahope said:

It occurred to me that perhaps one reason why Survivor/Probst/CBS, etc haven't said anything further about what happened is that Dan has an attorney who has threatened litigation.

That wouldn't surprise me. I'm sure the players sign all manner of non-disclosure agreements and waivers of their rights to sue, but that wouldn't stop Dan from first suing to have all of that nullified as a precursor to a defamation suit. It's basically a nuisance action to keep CBS quiet, but I hope they call his bluff and say, okay, let's have a civil trial and then unroll the hours of footage they have of him groping Kellee and the other women.

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11 minutes ago, Kaiju Ballet said:

Ugh.

From the Daily Mail. First sightings of Dan since the episode aired. "I already apologized on the show."

Ugh is right. If I was Mrs. Spilo, the only place we would be "out and about" would be to see the divorce lawyer. 

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People will tell you, I'm usually the clumsiest person in any situation. Yet I've never accidentally groped someone in the midst of my many daily stumbles. If I'd gotten an official warning after repeatedly being told to stop touching people, I'm sure I would be hyperaware of what my hands were doing at all times. Especially in a situation with virtual strangers and camera's. The weirdness of being on Survivor probably wears off after a while, but I can't imagine being that unaware of myself and my surroundings.

I don't care if all he did was pick a cochroach out of someone's hair. After all that came before that, keep you effing hands to yourself. It's really not that hard. And if it is that hard, you have a problem.

All the fan outrage really confuses me. All I thought when the announcement appeared on screen was 'good riddance'. People seem to either be mad that he wasn't removed earlier or that we didn't get more information. Well, my outrage about his non-removal happened when Kellee was booted. By the time this episode rolled around I was mostly over it and just glad that production followed through on their warning. There's not much they could do about not removing him earlier because they can't rewind time. But they took action when it happened again. As for not getting more information...I really don't care what he did. I was just glad that he wouldn't be in the final three as I feared the longer the season went on.

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4 hours ago, Hanahope said:

It occurred to me that perhaps one reason why Survivor/Probst/CBS, etc haven't said anything further about what happened is that Dan has an attorney who has threatened litigation.

I’m certain Dan did hire an attorney as soon as he got home - considering he just took a boot to the ass so hard he left the ground in Fiji and landed back in the U. S., I expect he was feeling a not-inconsiderable degree of butthurtiness.  😄  No doubt as soon as he landed stateside, Dan has been pulling out all the stops trying to keep this season from ever even airing - or, failing that, to get  all the incriminating bits cut out.

I don’t care if he’s 48, Dan is exactly the sort of self-absorbed shithead who never matured enough to see other people as discrete entities separate from himself; to Dan, life is one long continuous episode of The Dan Show (“starring me - I’m DAN!!!”).  People like Dan are one of the reasons I like dogs better than humans.  And the notion of Dan getting a Doc Marten cardiac massage via anus just fills me with a warm, happy glow inside....

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A Tinfoil Thought: What if production willfully chose/hired Dan, an important Hollywood talent playa, with a whiff of Howard Weinstein. His criminal trial has just been concluded, essentially in his favor. Survivor TPTB knew all the Dan brouhaha months ago, and now, for ratings, did they decide to highlight their own woke Me Too? I can't wait to find out more of what happened with Dan. And the girls. 

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22 minutes ago, Rt66vintage said:

A Tinfoil Thought: What if production willfully chose/hired Dan, an important Hollywood talent playa, with a whiff of Howard Weinstein. His criminal trial has just been concluded, essentially in his favor. Survivor TPTB knew all the Dan brouhaha months ago, and now, for ratings, did they decide to highlight their own woke Me Too? I can't wait to find out more of what happened with Dan. And the girls. 

I don't know about that, but clearly they were betting on this for ratings and some big story narrative.  They've already had some moments this season, and deep discussions about some social justice issues, as well as giving some castaways their own moment of reflection (Karishma on her husband, Elaine on the past few months of her life).  So they were probably foaming at the mouth when the Dan incident happened, thinking it would go like other controversial issues have in the past-it'd cause outrage, Dan would get bashed, Jeff would make the media rounds and look like a hero, it'd be a big talking point at the reunion where Jeff would again look like a hero, and people would remember but move on to next season.  Eventually it'd be another blip like Dan Foley, Will Simms, and the Ugly Brotherhood of Tattoos Jason and Scot.  

Except they clearly misfired on how people would react.  I doubt they ever anticipated there would be such as strong of a reaction and the push back to the situation it received.  As others have noticed, what's even more baffling, is that after the initial episode where Kellee got voted off, it was talked about briefly in the next ep (with Missy, Aaron, and Elizabeth throwing Janet under the bus), but hasn't been mentioned since.  Then this next incident happens, which I think the show expected to be like the first-outrage, they'd get credit for removing Dan, and Jeff would get to puff his chest out next week and direct the conversation.  Again, a total misfire of the situation.

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12 hours ago, LanceM said:

Angelina Keeley has some thoughts in an article for Time.

https://time.com/5749735/survivor-contestant-removed-cbs-sexual-harassment/

"I’m calling for Survivor and its host Jeff Probst to label Dan Spilo’s behavior as what it is: sexual harassment."

Very interesting.   It also confirms that Dan isn’t allowed  to speak with the press. That usually means something legal is afoot. 

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On 12/12/2019 at 7:15 PM, innocuouspuff said:

Jeff Varner is on twitter claiming Dan was railroaded and that the cast members of 39 have told him this, and that's the reason for no live finale, that people would try to defend Dan. Ok, boomer.

https://twitter.com/JEFFVARNER/status/1204944490139672576

I am honestly appalled at how many reputable media outlets have had stories about what Varner thinks when he flat-out says on Twitter that he has not watched the majority of the season (including the early episodes with all of the footage of Dan being handsy and Kellee telling him to stop and him continuing).  

His Twitter is appalling, too. He's all "If you knew what I know you would understand" while refusing to actually say anything of substance. It is such a pathetic, blatantly attention-seeking behavior, and he's getting exactly what he wants - attention. I have zero tolerance for people who post shit like "worst day ever!!" on their social media just to get people to beg them to elaborate. That is what Varner is doing, and it is gross.

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20 hours ago, Rt66vintage said:

A Tinfoil Thought: What if production willfully chose/hired Dan, an important Hollywood talent playa, with a whiff of Howard Weinstein. His criminal trial has just been concluded, essentially in his favor. Survivor TPTB knew all the Dan brouhaha months ago, and now, for ratings, did they decide to highlight their own woke Me Too? I can't wait to find out more of what happened with Dan. And the girls. 

It's been reported that they tried to cast Dan at least twice prior to this season. (He was postponed when they got Mike White, and then had to postpone again due to a broken foot or other injury)

I think if anything, they were hoping his presence would be Emmy-bait. But that would give another motive on their part to keep him in the game for as long as they did. (Not an excuse, but possible reason for why they collected all this footage yet did nothing.)

Your thought did make me wonder: If it weren't an industry bigwig, but an applicant from the middle of nowhere, would production have been so slow to intervene?

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5 hours ago, RescueMom said:

I am honestly appalled at how many reputable media outlets have had stories about what Varner thinks when he flat-out says on Twitter that he has not watched the majority of the season (including the early episodes with all of the footage of Dan being handsy and Kellee telling him to stop and him continuing).  

His Twitter is appalling, too. He's all "If you knew what I know you would understand" while refusing to actually say anything of substance. It is such a pathetic, blatantly attention-seeking behavior, and he's getting exactly what he wants - attention. I have zero tolerance for people who post shit like "worst day ever!!" on their social media just to get people to beg them to elaborate. That is what Varner is doing, and it is gross.

Well...while I agree with you in theory, the reality is that posts likes yours only add fuel and legitimacy to his fire... If people - everyone who felt as you do - unfollowed his Twitter account and stopped reading and reacting to him, he wouldn't be trending or even on any reputable media outlets.

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30 minutes ago, gingerella said:

Well...while I agree with you in theory, the reality is that posts likes yours only add fuel and legitimacy to his fire... If people - everyone who felt as you do - unfollowed his Twitter account and stopped reading and reacting to him, he wouldn't be trending or even on any reputable media outlets.

I was feeling a bit sheepish while posting that for exactly this reason... But I don't actually follow him, and never react to or comment on any of his posts. I see them when I am searching Survivor tags. Then I do what we do best here in MN - read them and silently judge 🙂 The news articles do get a click from me, but other than that, the only thing I have done is post here a few times to vent to some like-minded people. So unless he is on these forums, I shouldn't be feeding that particular troll. Hope not, anyway.

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So do we think anyone else will not show up for the reunion?  The people who were most affected negatively by Dan-gate, besides Dan, were Missy, Elizabeth, and Aaron.  I guess Lauren to a lesser extent, and I know Tommy apologized but we never saw anything from him when the first incident happened.  

I think there's a chance maybe Elizabeth doesn't show.  She may figure she doesn't need anymore added negative press.  

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Andy Dehnart of Reality Blurred's piece in Vulture.com lays out the timeline and what we know to date, with useful links.

Highlights:

• The interview where Kellee was asked by a producer to speak up IF there was an issue comes in three weeks after she talks to Dan (first episode). The "If" is unconscionable, the "three weeks after the fact" for me only reinforces why Kellee answered the way she did to a question that she should never have been asked in the first place.

• Castaways not directly involved (e.g., inappropriately touched by Dan) were unaware of the true extent of the situation. The scene we were shown of castaways laughing about it only helped reinforce the idea that it wasn't serious at all to the people Dan didn't touch.

• The talk producers had with each castaway did not link the reason for the talk to Dan in any way, nor did it even make clear that complaints had already been made about inappropriate touching. 

• Probst had tried to quit Survivor after Gabon. He became more of a showrunner and --more tellingly-- a "storyteller" afterwards.  The inference is that continuing conditions for high drama/conflict is more important to Peachy than risking a safe and possibly "boring" season.

I was especially intrigued by this last point, so I went to the link provided for the New York Times article: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/01/business/media/survivor-defies-gravity-to-hang-on-as-cbs-ratings-stalwart.html

"Years later, though, the show was drifting, Mr. Probst said; he said the low point was Gabon, which was broadcast in 2008. He said he felt burned out and was also a little self-conscious about being known as the “Survivor” guy.

“My Achilles’ heel for a lot of my life was that nobody saw me as a storyteller, that they saw me as a white guy with dark hair who was just a game show host,” Mr. Probst said. “And that in terms of my own self-image was the thing that could gut me. It was like a kidney punch.”

The frustration and exhaustion were enough that in 2009, Mr. Probst went to Mr. Moonves and quit, he said.

Mr. Moonves told him to take a break, and Mr. Probst took a few months off, returning to the show re-energized. Some changes were made to the production team, he said, and then he focused squarely on the show’s success formula: serving the loyal audience and not worrying about doing more than that."

Both pieces add that Survivor was and has consistently been one of CBS's reliable workhorses, costing much less than other shows, and with one of (if not the most) sizeable audiences.

Given that, it sort of explains (for me, anyway) why they went ahead and put this season on air and edited it the way they did, with Peachy clinging to this season as proof of Survivor's cultural relevance in the #metoo and #woke era. It also explains why they seemed completely surprised at the backlash but still remained silent, forcing us to endure THs with Dan and treating him as if he were likely to end up as a Final 3 up until the last few minutes of the penultimate episode.

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Yeah, the backlash they received was the most shocking thing to them. It wasn’t the actual touching incidents. Then after all that time and 35 Days in a production staff member was the last straw. It was such an epic fail by Jeff (who wanted to be in charge & CBS). If they don’t come out with the 411 on everything at the reunion they are totally screwed. 

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