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S01.E13: AKA Smile

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Jessica and Trish, sittin’ in a tree.... Sorry, I don’t know what came over me.

 

Absolutely love those two, and their friendship. And I’m so glad the show made the climax about them, rather than about Luke. Anyone could see who the most important person in Jessica’s life was, who the person she cared about the most was. Even Kilgrave, in his delusional belief that Jessica loved him recognised that. Such a sweet moment, where Jessica said “I love you” in the car, in the pretence of it being a code, and Trish’s understated reaction to it.

 

The trick with the headphones was an effective way of getting around Kilgrave’s powers, and I’ll bet that it was Trish who came up with it. She’s the thinker, in this relationship. Also, Patsy being the patsy made me laugh. Tennant does exasperated and disappointed so well. 

 

I’m still not feeling Jessica/Luke, though. He just doesn’t seem that special, to warrant the kind of depth of feeling Jessica has developed. Did we even see him again after he skipped out on Claire? Kind of sums up his presence in the show, which amounted to little more than ‘well he was in Alias so...’ and setting him up for his own show (which will need a heavy dose of strong secondary and guest characters to get me interested). Her monologue was good, but I just didn’t care about the guy she was delivering it to.

 

But I did love seeing Claire Temple again. Her matter-of-fact, almost ‘oh shit, this again?’ reaction to Jessica was amusing. I liked the nods to Daredevil, but didn’t quite buy that Jessica wouldn’t have heard of the Devil of Hells Kitchen. Her, Malcolm and Foggy need to form a 'stubborn-headed heroes of Hells Kitchen support group', as soon as they can. 

 

Really liked Malcolm sticking around and being that strong, moral presence. His desire to help people, coupled with Jessica’s abilities and smarts, should make for a fun and engaging partnership in season 2. And I’m so happy that he looks like becoming a pillar in Jessica’s life. How unexpected was that, after his introduction as the comedy junkie who made a habit of staggering into the wrong apartment?

 

I’m very glad that the writers of this show didn’t commit the cardinal sin of keeping a villain around too long because he’s charismatic. Too many shows (and the Marvel movies themselves) do that, and it ends up being ridiculous. If they hadn’t already begun the show with the ‘hero thinks the villain is dead but maybe he survived’ bit, then maybe they could have pulled it off here, but otherwise, death was necessary.

 

His death was anticlimactic, but fitting (and his face going purple as Jessica squeezed was a corny gag). He started off wanting to kill Jessica then downgraded it to hurting her for as long as he could, while abusing Trish, then he realised he might still be able to have Jessica and made the fatal mistake. She used his own obsession against him, and that passive approach was really the only way to get close enough to kill him.

 

Simpson was not a dead-end, going nowhere story, and I’m not sure why people think it was. Because season 2 will surely be about Jess and Trish investigating IGH and trying to find out how Jessica got her powers. I’m pretty sure Simpson will be one of the main villains in season 2. But I do think they’ll need someone else to be his boss. Not the non-descript ‘mad doctor’ Kozlov, but someone more nuanced and sophisticated.

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Me too. I enjoy the movies, but they're glib and cartoony (with the exception of The Winter Soldier, my favorite of the bunch -- but even that has a somewhat shallow message). They're definitely fun to watch, but they don't leave a lasting impression on me, and I have no desire to rewatch. I like S.H.I.E.L.D., but the ensemble is too large -- it's more about the stories than the people. It suffers from only being allowed to react to the movies, not to influence them in any way. I'm also disliking some of the choices they're making, like keeping Ward around long past his expiration date and hooking up Fitz and Simmons. Daredevil and Jessica Jones are both almost perfect, in my eyes, with Jess edging out Daredevil.

 

(Agent Carter is wonderful, too. I always forget about it for some reason, but I'd slot it in right below the Netflix series. I'm excited for season two.)

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Yay Tennant. I thought this was far more engaging villain-wise than most everything else in the Marvelverse.  It was also about 2x as long as it needed to be (6 eps would have been about right) and Jessica, bless her, really got on my nerves towards the end. 

 

Bringing in Nuke wasn't necessary, too heavy handed, and not sure why they even had the Luke Cage subplot, when he disappeared for the middle 10 eps. Would have been much better with the same plotline -- her obsessed with the guy whose wife she killed -- but no reconciliation, and him dying in the bar, no night-nurse, etc..  Forcing stuff into to the Marvelverse always ruins things. 

 

That said, David Tennant should have been named with some "uke" name, not Kevin. Duke, Luke, and Nuke?

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I ditto the Broadchurch recommendation and the UK versus US suggestion, as well.  

 

But, to be honest, Broadchurch is much more "Murder, She Wrote" than, say, The Killing or Top of the Lake.  Both, imho, are better at what they do.

 

(This is not a David Tenant Fandom HQ thread but I thought Broadchurch recommendations might crop up.)

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The problem wasn't the number of episodes, per say. The problem was that thirteen episodes of Kilgrave was a bit much, hence the repeated escapes. Not sure how that could have been fixed  - Both the ending and beginning were made very strong by that tight focus - Hope shooting her parents and Jessica killing Kilgrave were very powerful scenes. A bigger flashback plot to pre-killgrave Jess / Trish shenanigans in the middle? 

In any case the inevitable second season will not have this problem because making it about one villain in that way would not make sense. 

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Sweet Christmas.

 

Another insufficiently thought-out plan by Jessica allows Kilgrave to almost get away. At least she finally killed him this time because I was getting tired of her plans falling apart.

 

I know this isn't a procedural or show about cleverness of the investigators or a caper show.  Its focus is on characters and it's Kilgrave's character that gets him in the end.  Still I get frustrated when they almost get the bad guy but he escapes.

 

Anyway, good show.  I will recommend it to friends.

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I watched the last two last night and I thought the final showdown worked well for me. On the Jessica/Trish side sure there plan was flawed, but these women (while badass) aren't Peggy Carter they are a PI and a talk show host. I don't really expect them to be master tacticians capable of coming up with a perfect plan for a building they have never been in on super short notice. Their plan was basically "you pretend to be me and distract him and I'll sneak up on him". How much better could they be expected to do?

 

On Killgrave's side I think his obsession with Jessica had kind of peaked, which I think is why he didn't have an "in case I die contingency plan". I mean this was a guy who took a drug that had a 60% chance of killing him,just because it might make his powers work on Jessica. I think he was tired of blackmailing her into giving him attention and either wanted her to really love him, or at least for his powers to work on her. So once she was able to fake it so well that was all he focused on.

 

As for the death itself, I think she just wanted to whole ordeal over with and wanted him dead in the quickest and least messy way possible. A big showy dramatic death scene wouldn't have really fit with that.

Edited by Kel Varnsen
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For me the fact that she couldn't just kill him is what I liked about Jessica. She's human, she's flawed and can't just straight up murder someone even if he's a bad guy. She was trying to save Hope and yes other people were getting hurt because she wouldn't take him out. But again that's a human response, most of use would not be thinking of the rest of the world, we'd only be thinking about the people we care about. She wasn't going to let Hope spend the rest of her life in prison for a murder she wasn't responsible for. Hope then took herself out of the equation so Jessica wouldn't have to worry about her anymore. Without Hope, Jessica could kill him. 

 

If Jessica is going to be a hero, she should struggle with the decision to take a life. If she did it easily then what would make her different than a villain? 

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So I definitely think I'm the only person who actively hated all of that. The entire show felt like two hours of story dragged out to 13. I just can't believe they had so little to say episode to episode, I'm...just, I have no words.

Boy do I hope Luke Cage is good and done by a completely different creative team.

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I'm glad Kilgrave died, but have to agree that the plan was a mess and a bad risk.  I also agree with the posters who said this season should have been shorter.  It really stalled in the middle to me, with the repeated attempts and failures to bring Kilgrave to justice.  I also found the tone inconsistent.  It started dark noir, then got lost in superheroing, and then in the final scenes nudged back toward noir.  I think Daredevil had a better overall structure.  I'm still mulling the first season of JJ over.

 

I've only seen season 1 of Broadchurch but thought it was a good dark detective story.

 

I have to say, I think Trish is my favorite character. She could have easily been a passive, best-friend type role on the sidelines, so I was happy to see her in the action and WANTING to be a part of it.

 

Then there was the Claire/Malcolm talk. That was just magical. I loved every single part of it and I loved that Malcolm was there at the end picking up the phone: Alias Investigations. How can we help you?

 

I agree whole-heartedly with both comments.  Claire and Malcolm's scene was perhaps my favorite of the series.  Supporting characters really made this series more engaging, and having Malcolm around long term is a very good idea.

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So I definitely think I'm the only person who actively hated all of that. The entire show felt like two hours of story dragged out to 13. I just can't believe they had so little to say episode to episode, I'm...just, I have no words.

Boy do I hope Luke Cage is good and done by a completely different creative team.

 

I can't really believe that you took so little from it, episode to episode. But each to their own. I absolutely think this is the best television Marvel has done, and it's better than most of their movies. Certainly better than the movies in terms of character work and mature storytelling.

 

As for Luke Cage, I think he was a bit of a dud, and Mike Colter is not going to draw me to his own show. The guy doesn't have enough charisma to carry anything where he is the primary lead. If they get good guest stars and secondary characters, I might be into it. Otherwise, I'm just not that interested in seeing Power Man beat up thugs.

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I can't really believe that you took so little from it, episode to episode. But each to their own. I absolutely think this is the best television Marvel has done, and it's better than most of their movies. Certainly better than the movies in terms of character work and mature storytelling.

 

As for Luke Cage, I think he was a bit of a dud, and Mike Colter is not going to draw me to his own show. The guy doesn't have enough charisma to carry anything where he is the primary lead. If they get good guest stars and secondary characters, I might be into it. Otherwise, I'm just not that interested in seeing Power Man beat up thugs.

 

I'm surprised at how well it's being received! Structurally this did not work for me at all, it was far too repetitive. Chasing Kilgrave, finding Kilgrave, losing Kilgrave for 13 episodes, I felt like I was watching a Wile E. Coyote and the roadrunner cartoon. I found Daredevil much more compelling.

 

I agree on Mike Colter, I'd go so far as to say he is a bad actor. When he was on The Good Wife I always wanted to see more of him but after this I want to see less. At the same time I want the series to do well, just as I'm glad this is doing well even though I hated it.

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I guess it depends on what you watching for the show for. I wasn't watching a show about Jessica vs. Killgrave. I was watching a show about the characters. And I wish we had more than 13 episodes to get to know them.

 

I loved this show because it wasn't a typical superhero show with a larger than life villain hellbent on taking over the world or a city. This was a show about an everyday monster that happens to have powers and an everyday woman that also happens to have powers. This show was street level show from the get go. You can even tell from the camera angles, everything was shot from the street, even Jessica's flying was shown from the our level.  

 

What drew me to this show was that it was about a failed super hero. Too many shows or movies are like person gets powers, person becomes an insta hero. Just because they get powers doesn't mean they can be a hero. I also like the heroes that don't think of themselves as one. That shows me they are not in it for the glory. They do what they do because it's the right thing to do and are not expecting anything in return. Daredevil fits this as well, which is why I enjoyed his show too. But for very different reasons. Daredevil was very much a story about a hero and villain. 

 

On Jessica Jones, Killgrave was the catalyst. The real story I was watching was about Jessica and Trish, Jessica and Hope, Malcolm, Luke and even the Jeri, Pam and Wendy story tied into the story eventually. I watched this show to see a story about trauma and how the characters each dealt with theirs differently. Trish turned her childhood abuse into something positive, she wants to save the world, while Jessica retreated into herself but does want to help as long as no one knows about it. Jeri was a shark that learned first hand what her arrogance and ignorance could cost her, Hope was broken and lost and knew that her death would set her and Jessica free. Her from a life of nothingness and for Jessica to finally kill Killgrave. 

 

This was a show about people in a super hero setting. I get that it's not for everyone, I don't think any show really is. It's a good thing we have so many options to choose from. As for me I probably won't be watching Luke Cage because he doesn't interest me. If Jessica shows up for an episode I might watch it then. 

Edited by Sakura12
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This was a show about people in a super hero setting. I get that it's for everyone, I don't think any show really is. It's a good thing we have so many options to choose from. As for me I probably won't be watching Luke Cage because he doesn't interest me. If Jessica shows up for an episode I might watch it then. 

 

Which is exactly what Alias was designed to be, as a comic book. And The Pulse, which came after it. And Gotham Central. The idea of exploring the world beneath your flying, world-saving superheroes is always really interesting. Getting to know what Joe the cab driver thinks about Captain America or Superman, seeing how people adapt and survive in a world where aliens might try to destroy New York, or Doctor Doom might hatch a new plan to take over the world. It's what I hoped Agents of SHIELD would be, until the creative minds behind it proved to be so very limited.

 

Yes, Jessica has superpowers and so did Kilgrave, and Trish wants to be a hero, but they're all still a far cry from Iron Man and Thor, even from Black Widow and Hawkeye. The scope and scale is much smaller, and it makes for a far more intimate, character-driven story.

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Despite going against the opinion of nearly the entire Internet, I was really happy that Robyn was part of this story. No superpowers, no "heroism", just taking care of a disabled relative 24/7 and being crap at her responsibilities. Probably could do with a carer of her own. It's not a character you often see. Adding to Trish's mom and Jessica's Kilgrave PTSD, Robyn's story painted another layer of twisted pain to connect to. Hopefully in heaven there are lots of giraffes and the angels remembers to serve seedless-crusts.

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I didn't hate Robyn. She was annoying but I think that added another layer of realism to the show. Everyone knows that really annoying person whether it's a neighbor or a co-worker or friend of a friend that you hope you never run into but they keep popping up. 

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I was so pleased with this finale...it left me feeling satisfied at where the characters started versus where they ended, set up some interesting dynamics going forwards, didn't leave Jessica magically fixed by the cathartic power of head-snaps, and capped a fantastic first season run. 

 

I liked this more than Daredevil (I'm only about halfway through Daredevil) because I liked how tightly focused this was on Jessica, Trish, Kilgrave, and the people orbiting them. On paper, it's smaller stakes, but because the characters were so fleshed out it made the stakes feel incredibly high. 

 

And it can't be said enough-Krysten Ritter rocked that leather jacket like nobody's business. How Kilgrave thought that she had "appalling fashion sense" just shows how delusional he was, because she looked HOT in her jacket, flannel shirt, and jeans. 

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I like this show better than Daredevil too. It got better towards the end. It took me 3 weeks to finish. I finished Jessica Jones in 3 days. I guess I like the smaller scope story that focused on characters. 

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My mileage certainly varied. I think it's the best thing Marvel's done yet, including all the movies.

you may not like it but the show is not a flop. Not critically or commercially. It will be back. It will just have one less viewer I guess.

Eta: that was to the person saying this was a misfire. Maybe it is some people but it's still a resounding success.

Edited by Racj82

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I personally think it was a Marvel mis-fire and doubt it will get a second season. it doesn't deserve it.

 

 

It will get a second season. I think it had a couple of problems, but it was fucking excellent overall. Diverse cast, plenty of female characters with very different personalities/backgrounds, great dialogue, a couple of interesting twists (like Pam killing Wendy), and well-developped supporting characters (not all of them, but still good).

 

Would have been much better with the same plotline -- her obsessed with the guy whose wife she killed -- but no reconciliation, and him dying in the bar, no night-nurse, etc..  Forcing stuff into to the Marvelverse always ruins things.

 

 

I'm not sure what do you mean, by "forcing stuff"; Luke and Jessica

are actually married and have a kid in the comics.

This said, I think the whole Luke part was... not heavy handled per se, but it did no favors to the character that he just disappeared for a few episodes and then, right back on your face. I'm willing to see how it will play out in The Defenders.

 

The acting was pretty great, IMO. Krysten Ritter nailed it, and Rachael Taylor was a big surprise – sure, Trish was well-written, but the acting made the character work. Mike Colter is really easy on the eyes and hot hot hot, but I wasn't impressed with his acting - when Jessica confessed killing Luke's wife, he couldn't sell this scene for me at all. But he was good in a couple of others, and maybe it is one of the cases  where someone is so physicallly impressive (because of good looks or size ore whatever) that it comes before everything else. We'll see.

 

I'm reaaaallly on the fence about David Tennant. I love him, he is a terrific actor, but  I'm not sure if he was supposed to be evil or just completely amoral, tying with the scene where Killgrave says they weren't around to teach him about right and wrong. I don't know if his acting was brilliant and I'm dumb enough and didn't see the subletness or if I'm conditioned to villains who are a tad more... evil in the way they are portrayed, if it makes any sense.

 

I enjoyed all the pop culture references, like Jessica calling herself Dr. Carter and saying she was from a hospital called Seattle Grace, and many others lines here and there, not to mention the whole Patsy Show stuff, which seemed, oh, so right. Speaking about it, in a show which we saw a woman blow up and her mutilated members scattered on the sidewalk, as well as tons of other violence, nothing was more brutal for me than Trish's mom shoving her fingers down her daughter's troat. Rebecca de Mornay was scary, and downright evil. Also, the two actresses playing young Jessica and young Trish were really good and convincing as the younger version of the adult characters.

 

One side plot I  liked, even though it didn't get the serioussness it deserved was the woman who hired Jessica so she could kill her as a retaliation for her mother's death during the alien invasion. It was a glimpse of what an average human being endures while thrown, so to speak, in a super hero world: everytime a building's wall goes down or there is some major car pilling, there are dozens of people dying, but nobody takes responsibility for those deaths. I really wish that scene had a more serious tone from Jessica's end than saying "oh there are 99 of us only in this neighborhood".

 

Speaking about Jessica, yes, I do get it, some people had it worse, much worse than others, but there were at least a couple of moments I wanted to tell her to shut the fuck up about people needing to get over whatever problems they had. Also, I do ge that she wanted to prove Hope was innocent, but at what cost? Assuming her plan about being sent to supermax worked, how many people could possibly die or get hurt while Killgrave breached those seven security levels? Simpson did it all wrong, but he had a point, and that point was stronger by the end of every single episode Killgave scaped. I think the show failed at bringing to the table a good Spock’s 'the need of many outweighs the need of few discussion', which is was very mucyh needed there, IMO.

 

My biggest question is how Jessica didn't realize Killgrave didn't have any power over her until much later? Since Reva's death was something that crushed her a million times and she couldn't stop remembering how come she didn't realized it sooner?

 

Simpson's story was all over the place, like some background that should have been better explained but wasn't and it was up to the audience to guess he was part of some especial op group, and all. Of couse a first season always introduce plots for future years, but it could have been better handled.

 

The best relationship in this show is Jessica and Trish. A mature adult friendship between two grown up woman without one enabling the other or siding with the other even it was wrong, with the correct use of flashbacks. Well done, show.

 

My favorite scene of the entire 13 episodes was Jessica climbing the Brooklyn Bridge to watch the New York skyline saying that was the thing she was going to miss the most while in prison. What a love declaration to a city and to freedom, one embeded in the other.

 

RAPE. Repeat aagain and again and again all you show writers out there: RAPE. What a powerful lesson for the idiots who still don't get it.

Edited by Raachel2008
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I'm not sure if he was supposed to be evil or just completely amoral, tying with the scene where Killgrave says they weren't around to teach him about right and wrong

Isn't that what Kilgrave was saying to Horgath when he was in the transparent prison and trying to talk his way out: some people have special abilities, but the abilities themselves aren't good or bad, just how we use them?

 

I can see the argument, but I still wanted him dead.

 

I rarely find villains as scary as I found Kilgrave.  Having your mind controlled is the ultimate violation.  It's scarier than physical torture because if removes your agency and makes you less than human.

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Isn't that what Kilgrave was saying to Horgath when he was in the transparent prison and trying to talk his way out: some people have special abilities, but the abilities themselves aren't good or bad, just how we use them?

 

 

 

Yup, and I too think mind controlling is the ultimate violation, Tennan't acting is what somehow didn't work for me, and I can't really point exactly why.

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you may not like it but the show is not a flop. Not critically or commercially. It will be back. It will just have one less viewer I guess.

Eta: that was to the person saying this was a misfire. Maybe it is some people but it's still a resounding success.

Has it been a commercial success? I'm asking because i have no idea snd i thought netflix didn't release viewership data. I know it has gotten tons of buzz, but that doesn't always equal viewers.

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I think jessica didn't realize he couldn't control her because she thought she'd just shrugged off one command "come here jessica" and not that ignoring one command meant full immunity. There were maybe 30 seconds, if that, between his yelling the command at her and him getting hit by the bus. Considering she'd hesitated on the roof and still got sucked back in, I could see her assuming it was temporary, not permanent.

 

Is it totally ridiculous that the one thing that kept striking me was that there was no way someone as successful as Trish Walker would drive a Hyundai?

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Noticed the car too, figured that Trish was either really practical when it came to cars, or she doesn't make that much as a radio talk show host and spends an above average amount of her income on her home/security system. Also her mom probably stole/squandered all her Patsy money.

Also speaking of Patsy, if we get a season 2 i need to see some clips of the Patsy Show, since it sounds hilarious. It was extra funny that even Killgrave called her Patsy. Wonder if he was a fan of the show?

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I have a very mixed reaction to the finale. It seemed lackluster in some crucial way I'm not sure I can articulate. The showdown with Killgrave seemed to rely way too heavily on the hero having so much blind luck it's bordering on ridiculous; like all those cops missing while she was running, Killgrave not having any contingency plans to the possibility of Jessica not being under his control.

 

In a way it seemed too easy for Jessica to just reach out and snap his neck. It brought up the question of why she didn't do that like 30 fatalities ago. Or more importantly once she decided to kill him why she didn't get a gun and shoot him instead of this elaborate nonsensical plan that only worked due to plot contrivance. 

 

Also Jessica seems sort of unbelievable with her violence. She throws people against walls with super strength, you'd think she'd be slightly concerned about deaths or people noticing her flinging people across rooms. 

Edited by wayne67
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Noticed the car too, figured that Trish was either really practical when it came to cars, or she doesn't make that much as a radio talk show host and spends an above average amount of her income on her home/security system. Also her mom probably stole/squandered all her Patsy money.

Also speaking of Patsy, if we get a season 2 i need to see some clips of the Patsy Show, since it sounds hilarious. It was extra funny that even Killgrave called her Patsy. Wonder if he was a fan of the show?

 

Yea, she's probably practical, because until Jessica's Kilgrave crisis Trish probably wasn't driving all that much.

 

I figured he either was a fan of the show or he knew how much it annoyed her to be called Patsy, so that's why he always did it. 

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Has it been a commercial success? I'm asking because i have no idea snd i thought netflix didn't release viewership data. I know it has gotten tons of buzz, but that doesn't always equal viewers.

its literally been the only subject of TV talk for two weeks straight. Of course it's a success. It's the same process as Daredevil which already had a season 2 greenlit ahead of schedule.
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It seems like everyone I know is watching it. This is anecdotal, obviously, but I rarely see this many posts about a specific show from so many different people on my Facebook feed. Only Game of Thrones comes close, really, and maybe The Walking Dead. I noticed that Jessica Jones was still trending on FB several days after its release, too. There seem to be a lot of articles and recaps online, and the Tumblr and Twitter tags seem fast-moving. I assume it's enough of a success for a second season; it's just a matter of fitting that in somewhere.

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its literally been the only subject of TV talk for two weeks straight. Of course it's a success. It's the same process as Daredevil which already had a season 2 greenlit ahead of schedule.

That's sort of my point though, being the subject of TV media and internet chatting doesn't always translate to loads of viewers actually watching. There have been countless shows like say Mad Men which get tons of buzz and critical attention but not really high viewership numbers, on the other hand there are always shows like Two and a Half men, where you hardly read anything about it when it was on, but it had crazy high ratings. I know the business model for Netflix is not the same, but I was just curious if they had released any information about the number of people who had watched it.

 

I am curious about season 2. If this show is going to get season 2 and so is daredevil, then if the Iron Fist and Power Man shows are big hit is Netflix going to have 4 different series running every year?

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All the shows are supposed to lead up a The Defenders Netflix movie. If Jessica Jones gets a season 2 it will be after that. 

 

I wouldn't mind them running all 4 series throughout the year. I watch a bunch of different shows on Netflix. 

Edited by Sakura12
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When people critique Jessica's plans, I keep getting this nagging feeling that damaged heroes of the female gender are held to higher standards in their 'try/fail' cycles than damaged heroes of the male gender.

 

If the hero gets it right the first time, the story is over in chapter one. 

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All the shows are supposed to lead up a The Defenders Netflix movie. If Jessica Jones gets a season 2 it will be after that. 

 

I wouldn't mind them running all 4 series throughout the year. I watch a bunch of different shows on Netflix.

Daredevil season 2 comes out in 2016 along with Power Man season 1. If you assume 2017 for Iron Fist and maybe Defenders movie, are they really going to have people wait until 2018 at the earliest for Jessica Jones season 2?

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That's what it sounds like the plan is. They are trying to be like Marvel movies for TV. 

 

Daredevil is like Iron Man where he gets 2 movies/seasons before the release of the team up movie. 

Edited by Sakura12

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When people critique Jessica's plans, I keep getting this nagging feeling that damaged heroes of the female gender are held to higher standards in their 'try/fail' cycles than damaged heroes of the male gender.

 

If the hero gets it right the first time, the story is over in chapter one.

I don't really get the criticism of Jessica's failed plans. Is it any surprise her plans failed? She is not a shield agent or an experienced super hero or anything like that and was basically making things up on the fly. Why would she be able to come up with the perfectly detailed plan with every contigency?

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Plus -- Marvel's genius from the very beginning was to have fallible super-heroes.  Peter Parker was an ordinary kid who stumbled into a spider bite.  That's the beauty of Marvel.  (I'm an old head with the Marvel-verse-- I'm not speaking of the new movie version of the franchise.  I don't know how Stan Lee deals with Thor and folks who are "to the super-hero manor born".)

 

But, originally, Stan Lee's genius was to put an "any man" into "super hero" shoes and watch him/her struggle to come to terms with it.

 

I think Jessica Jones falls squarely into that category.

 

I really enjoyed this series on a lot of levels.  Really, really enjoyed it. 

Edited by Captanne
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It all seemed to be contingent on hoping that Kilgrave won't command any of those other people, including Trish, to do something terrible

 

I think that Jessica took Hope's last act for what it was- sometimes, you have to ignore what else is going on and stop the main problem.  Yes, others- including Trish and Luke- may have had a suggestion of 'if I die...', but Jessica couldn't think about that in the moment or Kevin would never have been stopped.  As Jessica has been telling folks all season though, the deaths would not be on Jessica's head. Those deaths would have gone onto the extensive list that belonged to Kevin, the man who actually demanded/ requested/ oh-so-politely asked for those folks to horribly mutilate and kill themselves and others.

 

Or more importantly once she decided to kill him why she didn't get a gun and shoot him instead of this elaborate nonsensical plan that only worked due to plot contrivance.

 

 

She did not bring a loaded weapon into Kevin's vicinity because there was always the chance that his power was amped up enough to take her over again and then most likely some more innocent folks, like Trish, would be dead. So while Jessica didn't think of every contingency, she kept to reasonable outcomes and tried to plan ways to minimize the collateral damage as much as she could, on her part.

 

Trish/Jessica are like Oliver/Diggle on Arrow and  Foggy/Matt on Daredevil. I think that Alex/Kara could be good, but it's still early going on Supergirl.

 

Eka Darville/ Malcolm needs to get some shiny trophies when the time comes. His turn as Malcolm was dramatic and moving, as much as Jessica's. It just played out in yet another layer of the MCU, the unpowered level. 

 

I am glad that this series was made and that there is a chance to get a second season. I'd like to hang out with these folks again, except for Simpson and Ma Walker.

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I don't really get the criticism of Jessica's failed plans.

I don't get the criticism of characters making bad decisions in general.  Is it out of character for an alcoholic, severely emotionally damaged person faced with a rehash of their worst nightmare to make some bad decisions?  Not in the slightest.  I get irked when characters act out of character.  If they didn't make bad decisions we'd have no story, usually.  If she was thinking clearly she'd have made sure he was dead after he got hit by the bus and we'd have had a completely different series.

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Thank you! Why didn't he tell Trish to kill herself immediately if he died? BEFORE he stupidly walked up to Jessica? It's a gigantic plot hole and it didn't make any sense.

Even though it doesn't make sense with the whole "it's a virus and wears off after 12 hours" spiel, they seemed to have implied all along and in this episode that Kilgrave=dead => control stops. Now, since he never died before, no one really had any way of knowing that. But, if his death means all control stops immediately, then a command to kill yourself in the event of his death, while it may have been a contingency he actually had in place, wouldn't have mattered because they wouldn't have done it. That's how I read it anyway.

I didn't find the neck-snap anticlimactic so much as stressful. She thought he was dead once before and he wasn't. I dig the not bringing a loaded weapon to the scene with him there, but after the neck-snap my first reaction was "wait, are we sure he's really dead? Really sure? Really really? Someone shoot him in the head to be sure!". Sort of like the don't believe a character's dead until you see the body kind of thing. Even though his body was there, it was a quick cut to the aftermath. I know it wouldn't be good to linger or hammer it too hard, but it left it ambiguous enough for me that he might not be really most sincerely dead that I was tense about it. In a soap-opera-don't-believe-it-until-the-body-is-buried kind of way. Which I'm guessing was at least somewhat intentional, even if they do mean he's really dead no question. It was done it that ever so teensy tiny ambiguous way. I think it fits. With Kilgrave, you can never relax.

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Article  

I also believed in Hogarth's appreciation of Jessica's talents, Jessica's sick and sad attraction to Luke, and Ruben's guilty turn from addicted Judas to frustrated but ultimately loyal assistant. I
 (Italics mine)

 

Malcolm.

 

I think you meant Malcolm?

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Jessica's sick and sad attraction to Luke,

Why was it sick and sad?  I thought Luke was one of the positives in her life.

 

Luke lives in her neighborhood.  He owns a bar (and she likes to drink).  He's as strong as she is so they have something in common.  He's got big muscles.  (I'm not attracted to men, but that actor has some notable musculature.)  Plus they are sexually compatible and he seems like a decent guy (before Kilgrave controlled his mind).

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I think people think it's sick because she was forced to murder his wife and that's the whole reasons she was following him around in the first place. Then she slept with him without telling him what she did. Which I don't really don't know how she'd start that convo off. 

 

"I'm sorry, I've been following you because I feel guilty for being forced to kill your wife by a man that was raping my body, mind and soul for months."

 

No one believed Jessica and Hope about Killgrave's powers until they experienced them first hand. Even Trish didn't truly understand until she sat there trying to put a bullet into her head. If she flat out told him before she slept with him, he probably would've tried to kill her because he'd think she was lying. Yes, she could've left him alone but that was her guilt taking control of her. It wasn't her fault, but she still did the deed and it was tearing her up inside that she killed an innocent woman. 

 

However I think their attraction to each other was real, especially when they both found out they were both "gifted" and could have no holds sex for the first time ever. 

 

I know people don't find Jessica likable. Jessica is messed up and needs help to get over her many issues but the fact that she's not perfect and makes mistakes is what makes her likable to me. I like that she's open about being an asshole, that she doesn't hide what she can do, that she's broken and tired but keeps on going because she's in a position to help people. I like that she has Trish to push her when she wants to give up. She won't give up though because her need to help outweighs her need to help herself. It was after Killgrave that she became a PI. She could've run and left the city, but she stayed and started a business that's sole purpose is to help people.

 

Trish is the popular one and I like her and love the Jessica and Trish frienship. Jessica is my favorite character though. I'm always drawn to the broken, messed up ones. Faith on Buffy, Sara on Arrow/LoT and now Jessica. 

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Late to the bandwagon, but just wanted to join in saying I bingewatched the hell out of this show and was completely riveted by Krysten Ritter's gutwrenching performance as well as David Tennant's terrifyingly amazing turn as supervillain. I desperately hope for a second season, because I have not been this excited about a superhero show since....well, ever, I guess. Pure brilliance on every level.

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I think I'm one of the few who liked Luke's character and the actor's portrayal.  Although I understand that Jessica's attraction to him was problematic (why it began and then why it continued) it's complicated and I like complicated.

 

I think he was/is genuinely handsome and charismatic so -- (with or without the "I killed your wife" baggage) -- I totally understand why she kept hovering around his bar and him.

Edited by Captanne
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