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S02.E08: Legends Of Today

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Patty is a cop, which gives her access to be on the crime scenes with Joe and Barry.  Iris is a reporter, which means that if you don't write specifically for her, she hasn't got anything to do on this show.

Agreed on that.

The show spends so much time at the STAR labs and so little time at the station or the newspaper. That's fine up to a point.

If the characters who don't get much time, that includes the police chief and that DA, are busy doing their jobs then that would be good for all of the characters on the show. In fact, if they at least implied that everyone on the show was busy with their jobs then they could shift the story a bit from episode to episode by moving the centers where the story takes place. Say, there is a crime that needs to be solved and they involved more of the police then show more of those support characters working together, including Barry and Joe. (Right now, I wonder if Barry or Joe actually do their day jobs.)


Then when you bring in the STAR labs people and the journalists to help on whatever case, you could give all of the characters purpose in the story. For other episodes make the central location the newspaper and bring in the other characters to that location. Spread the love around to the rest of Central City instead of sticking most of it in that one location.


I know the balance is heavy on STAR and the people there but that's to the detriment of Iris and to Patty (even if she really seems like a shallow character so far), and to the other supporting staff.


The way I see it, a lot of these superhero shows have embraced tech support teams too much. While I really like Cisco because he's funny and keeps the show lively, STAR is kind of a crutch for Barry. He needs STAR to be a superhero. When Jay was announced to appear, I thought that would give him a chance to work with another superhero more often. That ain't happened. But if it had, it would have moved the story around and hopefully out of that lab.


Anyway, these support teams are usually filled main characters but we expect too much from them. So, when Iris was brought into the fold and then neglected, that was insulting for her character. It's like Diggle on Arrow being less of a peer and an equal to Green Arrow when there's too many characters on Team Arrow. You'd think Laurel on Arrow is fairly busy as a lawyer, but, she's at the Arrow cave!


So, the Team Such and Such really limits allowing some characters on other shows and on "Flash"flourish, like Iris, Patty, the chief and Linda.


Remember the episode that began with Iris investigating a story and Barry saving her? That was great for so many reasons. It would even work if Iris didn't know Barry's secret. She could have done her job and the character would have the chance to still be a love interest or crush for Barry, last season she could have still been involved with Eddie, too. It would have made Eddie dying a really difficult thing with Iris not knowing why or how he died but she didn't need to be brought onto the team.


But the show just had to bring her in on the team to make her character work. But once the team became crowded, they pushed Iris back by adding more characters to the team this season, with Jay and Harry. Then they had to set up the Legends spinoff show, too. So Prof. Stein and his dance partner were added.

And, then Patty began to sneak around the corners to eat up more time from other characters. Once Patty finds out Barry is the Flash she'll probably be a member of the team. That is just too many people "working" at the same place on the support team instead of doing their jobs and diversifying the stories the show tells. 



Let people do their jobs and not know Barry secret and everything is cool. But, for some reasons these superhero shows just expand the teams. That backfires by making some characters more prominent and others less prominent. Bad choices.


But, the show's still entertaining. Don't get me wrong. The villain of the week works well. However, the characters who viewers like and who don't get screen time deserve better. It's about balance, I'd hope. I hope it isn't about contracts with the actors. That would suck.

Edited by Hobo.PassingThru
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I'm seriously wondering why in the world they introduced Jay so soon, if they had nothing for him to do. An intro to Earth 2 and that's it? That could have been accomplished with Wells. If they're saving all his material for the back half it better be good. This half-assed romance thing with Caitlin is nonsense.


For Patty to be the most prominent new person AND most useless at the same time is quite a feat. And we know she's a one season character at most, while Jay could theoretically be recurring for seasons to come, so maybe they think with him there's no rush, but in that case...why didn't they just wait to introduce him in the second half, period? Wells could have told them all about the other speedster and built up this myth of him, for them all to finally meet him in episode 13 or something. It just feels like they totally mishandled another iconic character from the comics.

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Patty is a cop, which gives her access to be on the crime scenes with Joe and Barry.  Iris is a reporter, which means that if you don't write specifically for her, she hasn't got anything to do on this show.


Barry had a crush on Iris in season 1 but from Iris, all that came was sibling affection. Even after the massive anvil of the newspaper from the future, she still chose to be with Eddie.  Patty, on the other hand, is romantically crushing back on Barry and that is much more pleasant to watch for many people than Barry's unrequited feelings for his adoptive sister who is in love with and living with another man..


I understand the frustration that Iris fans have when she gets sidelined but IMO race has nothing to do with it.  This show has trouble writing women and even more relationships women have with each other and with the men in their lives. (If there were a burning building, I bet Joe would have saved Barry first and only afterwards remembered about Iris.)  But I think it does a disservice to both sides to blame it on race.


Do you mean the writer's treatment of Iris has nothing to do with race? That's a hard argument to buy, considering how racist stereotypes are the flavour of the season as far as the writing for Iris and her mother. 


However, you're not wrong about Iris receiving undo hate because of her lack of romantic interest in Barry. Misogyny plays a big part in how female characters are perceived. It's completely predictable that while Iris and Patty are both kind and sweet, one is immediately written off as annoying and a bitch and the other as likeable simply down to their romantic interest/lack of it in Barry. But it's not an either/or situation for WoC. Granted it's not as noticeable, but the only way racism wouldn't also play a factor is if viewers were aliens, unaffected by race relations that tend to distort human perception.

Edited by driedfruit
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Do you mean the writer's treatment of Iris has nothing to do with race? That's a hard argument to buy, considering how racist stereotypes are the flavour of the season as far as the writing for Iris and her mother.



Well, Joe seems to be doing okay in the writing department. If anything I'd say the larger issue isn't race but gender. Barry is the star so obviously he's going to get the most attention but Joe, Cisco and Wells are at the forefront too. Henry's a bit player and Jay, well, I think they expected Jay to get a better reaction than he did so they have toned him back. But Iris has nothing to do most of the time and Caitlin usually just seems to be there to help Wells or Cisco with whatever issue they are going through.

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For Patty to be the most prominent new person AND most useless at the same time is quite a feat. 

False. Even if it's been only a line or two, she's been contributing to the plot. Be it King Shark, or mentioning Dr. Light's powers, investigating Grodd or shooting Dr. Wells. 

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Hard to take Savage seriously with that accent.

Accent? I couldn't take him seriously at all. Savage, to me, is supposed to be this...huge, powerful guy. This guy just looks puny in comparison to the Vandal Savage that I "know." Granted, the ones I know were in animation--Justice League and Justice League: Doom, but Phil Morris gave him a menace that this guy just lacked.


And for goodness sakes! Must EVERYTHING be tied into because of some twisted wuv? No, we couldn't just have Vandal Savage be an immortal because of the "strange glowing rocks" when he was a fucking neanderthal, but he had to be tied to Shayera and Carter, with this Savage wanting Shayera for himself and then the rocks coming down to give him immortality. Whatever.  And I'm going by what I know of the character based on my shows.


Also, this Khufu/Carter Hall? zzzzzzzz. Came off as an arrogant fratboy. After Michael Shanks's portrayal on Smallville (say what one will about the show, but Shanks's Carter/Hawkman KICKED ASS and was AWESOME), my standards were set pretty high.


But to continue, instead of keeping to his origins as "I" know them, they had to make it about some stupid, fucking triangle where this show's Savage wanted Shayera for himself and couldn't have her.


I am so sick.and.tired. of stupid "love" triangles on the superhero shows I'm watching. I'm not sure how much longer I can stick with this show.


The whole crossover was a boring snoozefest for me.


Now this guy? He's Vandal Savage:



But what do I know?

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