BADTRICK October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I think Lash is a blast from the past the way he looked at Daisy. The monolith may have something to do with Lash appearing in the first place. Link to comment
DeLurker October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 Question: When they showed up at the Inhuman's apartment, there was a cocoon on the floor and the guy was hiding in the closet. What's the cocoon again? Is it the remnant of a body? If so, who was it? Link to comment
BADTRICK October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I think the cocoon belong's to the Inhuman hiding out in the closet It's the terrigen mist residual. Link to comment
paigow October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 If Andrew is Lash he may very well not know it. Lash could easily be an alternate personality in exactly the same way as someone with DID, on this alter has Inhuman powers. OK. But how does he know where all the quasi-assimilated Inhumans are living? They have special gmail domains? Why would the Kree program an Inhuman hunter if they were trying to create an Inhuman arsenal? One hunter is not much of a failsafe for thousands of experiments. Link to comment
ae2 October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I think Lash is a blast from the past the way he looked at Daisy. The monolith may have something to do with Lash appearing in the first place. A blast from the past... so Trip? :) 1 Link to comment
Tara Ariano October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode! Agents Of SHIELD Faces New Villains And OldNeither confrontation works out all that well for the Agents. Link to comment
xqueenfrostine October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I can't buy the theory that Strucker kid running scared because Andrew is secret badass who was trained by May. Jr. didn't show any obvious signs of being beat up, and it seems unlikely he'd be THAT scared of fight that he never even entered. If he was the kind of person who ran scared from a normal fight, Ward would have killed him instead of recruiting him. If Andrew = Lash, Daisy's mom would have known about him. Or Raina would have sensed him...Why would he start killing Inhumans now? Why would that be true? Nothing we learned in this episode implies that Lash was an Inhuman before the terrigen outbreak. (Not saying he's one of the people who was turned by fish oil, just that we don't know) Nor has it ever been established that Jiaying's group was only group on Inhumans on Earth and would therefore know everyone who had been changed. As for Raina, I don't think it's a given that she would have sensed him as we never were given a clear picture on how her clairvoyant powers worked and what kind of limitations they had. So I don't think it's a given she's see everything that might happen after her death. I'm not sure the timeline works for Andrew to be Lash. He was being attacked at the same time that Lash was attacking the truck. That is why Sk..Daisy could not back Hunter and May up, right? At the time Coulson said that, he hadn't heard back from May as to when things with Hydra were going to go down. He knew it was coming, but both he and May were waiting on Hunter to give them the signal to move forward. So there's no reason to believe these things were happening concurrently. The amount of daylight in each scene would suggest that they happened at different times. OK. But how does he know where all the quasi-assimilated Inhumans are living? They have special gmail domains? The guy he was working with that SHIELD and the ATCU came to apprehend worked for the Social Security Administration. He was the one, not Lash, who actually found the addresses (home, or in Lincoln's case work) of the Inhumans. Now how he was able to determine who was an inhuman based on SSA data is unclear, but that's a separate problem from who Lash may or may not be. Link to comment
maczero October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I'm starting to accept this "Andrew = Lash" theory. He already has inside intel on the Inhumans because he's a SHIELD consultant. He broke things off abruptly with May around the time new Inhumans started sprouting up. He also seemed to be particularly annoyed that Coulson was holding back info on another Inhuman that Andrew hadn't met. And like most, I noticed the look of terror on Strucker Jr.'s face when running out of the convenience store. That was more than "I can't believe a professor took out my men with Kung Fu" look. He looked as if he had seen...a monster. Link to comment
Bosman October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I am SO tired of the great, unkillable Ward. This show has plenty of other things going on without the resurrection of Hydra and its eeeeevil leader. 6 Link to comment
Lebanna October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 This whole show is based on a dead guy not actually being dead. So dead is not that important in this universe. I'm not even sure that Triplett and Isabelle are not coming back somehow, eventually. We've already had some flashbacks. So I think Andrew is probably going to be ok. He's more interesting alive. Link to comment
Izeinwinter October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 It'd be a pretty funny subversion of tropes if the bullet Hunter put in him leads to Ward dying on the operating table a day later. Or just getting his ass kicked by some semi random mook because his shoulderblade got shattered, and the whole kung-fu stick doesn't work so well if you loose most of your articulation in one arm. Link to comment
blackwing October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 I wouldn't think Andrew is dead either, because it's Blair Underwood and he's somewhat of a "name" actor on TV. But then again, I didn't think Saffron Burrows would die either, and yet she appears to be as dead as her character that got eaten by a shark in the guilty pleasure movie "Deep Blue Sea". Am I the only one who couldn't stop looking at Coulson's hair. I know the guy is mostly bald, but it looked to me like he had a new toupee, or they dyed his hair or something. It just looked a bit different to me than it normally looks. Why isn't Daisy using her powers all the time? Why does she even need a gun? Does she lack stamina, can she only do one force wave before being exhausted? When she and Mack encountered Dragon Lady's forces, why was there all sorts of shouting? She should have taken them all out with one giant force wave immediately. 2 Link to comment
rubyred October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 Re: Hunter/May - she may realize that tactically his point was true, about saving more lives etc, but 1) he would NOT have been singing that tune if Ward was threatening Bobbi again and 2) she may understand it but she doesn't have to like it, or him. I look forward to May freezing Hunter out till the end of time. Hunter has always seemed bush league to me (would have liked to see Michael Socha in the role). So much so that I haven't been paying as much attention to his scenes, so assumed that somehow or other Ward had never met or seen him, which was another reason why he was the best person to go undercover with HYDRA. To find out that all along he knew Ward would recognize him -- wtf? He banked EVERYTHING on the 3 nanoseconds Ward might be taken by surprise? Are you freaking kidding me? Bush league. Daisy is continuing to erode the goodwill I had toward her at the end of last season. I don't know if it's the writing or the performance, but she's always simultaneously insubordinate and bossy. Who is also now pouting because "dad" may have a new girlfriend. I like the haircut but everything else is not a good look. And I don't like that Mack is in even more danger because her impulsive inhuman ass rushes into everything. 3 Link to comment
ElectricBoogaloo October 21, 2015 Author Share October 21, 2015 When we saw Lash's shadow transform into a human, I thought it might be Reina. 1 Link to comment
ProudMary October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 When we saw Lash's shadow transform into a human, I thought it might be Reina. I had the same thought. Link to comment
maczero October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 Why isn't Daisy using her powers all the time? Why does she even need a gun? Does she lack stamina, can she only do one force wave before being exhausted? When she and Mack encountered Dragon Lady's forces, why was there all sorts of shouting? She should have taken them all out with one giant force wave immediately. I'm going with two reasons: 1) Her powers are not indoor friendly. Too much and she could bring the entire building down. 2) She may not have fine control over her powers. We've seen her use her power lightly enough to knock down a door or level a good chunk of forest. But how good is she at finding that sweet spot with her powers where she's confident enough to knock out every single gun toting thug and limit the collateral damage. Link to comment
xqueenfrostine October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 Hunter has always seemed bush league to me (would have liked to see Michael Socha in the role). So much so that I haven't been paying as much attention to his scenes, so assumed that somehow or other Ward had never met or seen him, which was another reason why he was the best person to go undercover with HYDRA. To find out that all along he knew Ward would recognize him -- wtf? He banked EVERYTHING on the 3 nanoseconds Ward might be taken by surprise? Are you freaking kidding me? Bush league. Daisy is continuing to erode the goodwill I had toward her at the end of last season. I don't know if it's the writing or the performance, but she's always simultaneously insubordinate and bossy. Who is also now pouting because "dad" may have a new girlfriend. I like the haircut but everything else is not a good look. And I don't like that Mack is in even more danger because her impulsive inhuman ass rushes into everything. We've actually known this since the second episode. May asked him what he planned to do if Ward recognize him, and he said then that if Ward was close enough to see him, he was close enough from Hunter to take him out. It was a mortally stupid plan. Which may have been the reason May agreed to go with him on this quest instead of staying with her dad. She probably knew there was no way his plan could work but that he was determined to go with or without her help, so she decided to go along so she could both call for help if it was needed and/or be there to bail him out when things went south. As for Daisy's attitude, she's always seemed too big for her britches. It's why I've never been able to really like her as a character. There have been episodes where she's bugged me considerably less than usual, but she's never been able to make it out of my "least favorite characters" bracket. She's in need of a firm hand to rein her in, but Coulson favors her too much to do it. 4 Link to comment
marceline October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 My $.02. I don't believe that Andrew is dead. You don't kill off a guest star like Blair Underwood without a list dramatic shot of his lifeless face. Plus you don't give us that hint at what went wrong between him and May just to kill him a few minutes later. (Yeah, I know this show has Whedon DNA but when the Whedonverse kills, we usually get to see it.) I also don't think he's Lash. Andrew seems awfully comfortable in his skin to be - mutating into an Inhuman assassin on the regular, knowingly or not. I think the dead body is the guy who was carrying the gas can behind Strucker. IMO, something or someone intervened to kill Gas Can and scare the shit out of Strucker. Is Andrew a secret badass? Possibly but I kind of hope not. I like having a normal character for all these others to bounce off of. Is there a character out there somewhere we haven't seen in a while who could swoop in to save him? Perhaps Joey Guttierez? I could see Coulson giving Joey the low level duty of shadowing Garner as a way to start bringing him into the team. Link to comment
Lantern7 October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 DVRed the episode while watching Mets/Cubs last night. Wound up putting up with news cut-ins that took away from the episode. I don't think I missed anything major. I cannot see Andrew as Lash. It just seems too farfetched for me. Intriguing theory, and Blair Underwood wouldn't be forced into makeup for four hours, but I'm not feeling it. On the other hand I'm hoping Gemma didn't leave anybody (or anything) behind from her sojourn. Unless Chris Pratt decides to slum It on TV, I don't need to hear about a love connection. When I think of Ward dying, I imagine the stunt guy getting worked over by the women at the end of Death Proof. May, Gemma and Skyesy taking turns beating him to death? Don't tell me that doesn't give y'all a warm fuzzy feeling. 2 Link to comment
Lost Girl October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 Re: Hunter/May - she may realize that tactically his point was true, about saving more lives etc, but 1) he would NOT have been singing that tune if Ward was threatening Bobbi again and 2) she may understand it but she doesn't have to like it, or him. I look forward to May freezing Hunter out till the end of time. I think May is smart/tough enough to know that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. I'm guessing her beef is more going to be that Hunter's plan was incredibly stupid and she told him it was stupid and then it was someone that she cared about who was "killed" because of it. Link to comment
paigow October 21, 2015 Share October 21, 2015 The guy he was working with that SHIELD and the ATCU came to apprehend worked for the Social Security Administration. He was the one, not Lash, who actually found the addresses (home, or in Lincoln's case work) of the Inhumans. Now how he was able to determine who was an inhuman based on SSA data is unclear, but that's a separate problem from who Lash may or may not be. I thought Lash gave a list of names / aliases to Virus Spam Man... Lash knew who to look for, not where.... 1 Link to comment
paigow October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 I think May is smart/tough enough to know that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few... ... or the one! Wrath of Khan must be required viewing at SHIELD training.... 5 Link to comment
Raja October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 (edited) OK. But how does he know where all the quasi-assimilated Inhumans are living? They have special gmail domains? Why would the Kree program an Inhuman hunter if they were trying to create an Inhuman arsenal? One hunter is not much of a failsafe for thousands of experiments. Somehow he cracked a code finding the survivors from Jaiying's group of Inhumans. But now that Lash has killed his own "Gordon" who's power saw Raina and Skye go through the temple we are more in the dark until future episodes reveal more about him. As far as an Inhuman hunter we are potentially hundreds of generations removed from the Kree experiment and I think the changes are more in the nature of random mutations and Lash came about the mission to hunt others either on his own or part of another sect of Inhumans. With the movie still set a few years down the line Marvel probably wants to introduce the ideal that there is not one single monolithic Inhumans society Edited October 22, 2015 by Raja Link to comment
Minneapple October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 (edited) I am SO tired of the great, unkillable Ward. This show has plenty of other things going on without the resurrection of Hydra and its eeeeevil leader.Agree. Ward isn't even a fun villain, he's charmless and boring and the whole Hydra plot seems tacked on and out of place. Like "Oh yeah, now we have to go deal with Hydra." Rosalind is a better villain this season. Well. I had a theory that perhaps she is Lash. No? Too out there? Be amusing to see Coulson's face if that was the case.Other than Ward I'm really enjoying this season. The inhumans plot is well done and I like the mystery of where Simmons was and what happened to her. I love all the dynamics on the team. Daisy/Mack, Bobbi/Simmons, etc. I even like Daisy's "soldier with a bit of sass" personality when she's with Coulson. "She's sharp, attractive, head of a big shady organization." Lol. And it was really good to see May and Coulson together again. I love how deadpan May is, like she just strolls in and Coulson and Andrew are staring at her, and she's all, "yeah, what's up." Edited October 22, 2015 by Minneapple 1 Link to comment
enness2000 October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 (edited) On Andrew: I do think he's dead. They showed the blood and then the explosion. They never showed Victoria Hand's face when Ward shot her, and some, myself included, thought she could still be alive at the time. But I think the indication here was that he's gone, a price paid for Hunter calling his audible, incorrectly assuming Ward was bluffing. To be fair, they showed Victoria Hand's face when she got shot, at which point she fell offscreen and was shot twice more, and they later showed a hand that was identifiably hers (in context) covered in blood. There, the off-screen death seemed more about discretion and 'what you can show on TV' than about a misdirect. Here, they don't show any attack on Andrew, and the shot of 'his' body starts low enough down that you can't even see his hand. I can't imagine they wouldn't mine his death for a lot more drama, and I can't imagine that they're unaware enough of how these things work that they're not intentionally hinting that he's not dead. (I think they'll use it to get some excellent scenes out of Ming-Na Wen, and to develop tension between her and Hunter, but I don't think he's gone for good) As for why/how he's still alive - I don't think he's Lash. It makes a lot of sense plot-wise, but none character-wise unless we're going with "total disassociative Inhuman side, who still also recognises and likes Daisy", and even then Andrew seems smart enough to notice if he's regularly losing hours of his life. If he's keeping it a secret, or if he's knowingly killing Inhumans, then it's very much a 180-degree turn from what we know of him already. And while that's admittedly not much, everything we've seen points to him being a good, conscientious doctor who cares a lot for his patients. His total lack of guile or secrecy makes him a really interesting contrast to May, which is a big part of what makes their relationship interesting. Ditching that to have a big "Ooooh, Andrew's actually a bit of a bad guy!" reveal seems cheap, and unnecessary in a show that's already had 11 million "One of team is keeping secrets from the rest of the team, potentially murder-related" plotlines. (I mean, I know the Ward one in season 1 worked well, but surely they have to stop going back to that well at some point?) Also, on a totally logistical note, Lash's power seems to be some kind of matter disintegration thing, judging by the way he makes holes in doors/vans, and the way his attacks leave a burned out hole in the person. What we've seen so far is that it very definitely doesn't leave the kind of massive pool of blood that we saw at the end there. So I'm rooting for Andrew being an Inhuman, and May knowing this, but not Lash, just someone else with freaky and violent powers to save himself and scare mini Von Strucker. (Or, alternatively, given that May clearly suspected Ward was going to hunt down her family, that she's had Deathlok watching him, and when she said "Coulson, you need to get to Andrew", she wasn't hoping he'd re-route his support team halfway across the country in 20 seconds, but calling in the terrifying cyborg she already knows is on hand) I'm going with two reasons: 1) Her powers are not indoor friendly. Too much and she could bring the entire building down. 2) She may not have fine control over her powers. We've seen her use her power lightly enough to knock down a door or level a good chunk of forest. But how good is she at finding that sweet spot with her powers where she's confident enough to knock out every single gun toting thug and limit the collateral damage. Exactly this. In this episode alone, she flipped the ACTU van because she blasted Lash while inside it. I know it's TV, where no one ever dies from a minor vehicle flipping, but she could easily have killed herself, Mack and the ACTU team by using her powers in a confined space. (Also, on the point of her specifically arming herself while searching Frye's house, she's seen already in the hospital that Lash seems marginally more phased by being repeatedly shot than he does by being hit with her blasts, so makes sense to have that weapon ready on a Lash hunt) ETA: The repeated mentions of Offscreen Joey give me hope that he's coming back at some point. If they actually introduced the first openly LGBT MCU character to make a strained point about intolerance in two scenes before disappearing forever, I would be mildly ticked off, to say the least. Edited October 22, 2015 by enness2000 1 Link to comment
jah1986 October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 Finally saw this last night and thought it was a good episode. Like others I don't think Andrew is dead. All we saw were feet and a gasoline can on the ground. What happened to the other two guys, why didn't they run out of the building too? Those feet could belong to one of them. I hope Andrew is not dead but I also hope he's not Lash, I want May to find some kind of happiness not more heart break. It would be cool if Lash were Tripp, but I think that's highly unlikely. I hope there's real resolution with Gemma next week, don't want this dragged out anymore. I just want Ward gone for good, no mind wipes, no double agent etc. just gone. 1 Link to comment
DeLurker October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 Rosalind is a better villain this season. Well. I had a theory that perhaps she is Lash. No? Too out there? Be amusing to see Coulson's face if that was the case. Don't see how Rosalind could be Lash, but she has all the makings of a good villain or just being a major pain in the ass. I'm eagerly awaiting a May - Rosalind scene where they look expressionlessly at each other and Coulson needs to be Tahaite'd again. Also, on a totally logistical note, Lash's power seems to be some kind of matter disintegration thing, judging by the way he makes holes in doors/vans, and the way his attacks leave a burned out hole in the person. What we've seen so far is that it very definitely doesn't leave the kind of massive pool of blood that we saw at the end there. So I'm rooting for Andrew being an Inhuman, and May knowing this, but not Lash, just someone else with freaky and violent powers to save himself and scare mini Von Strucker. (Or, alternatively, given that May clearly suspected Ward was going to hunt down her family, that she's had Deathlok watching him, and when she said "Coulson, you need to get to Andrew", she wasn't hoping he'd re-route his support team halfway across the country in 20 seconds, but calling in the terrifying cyborg she already knows is on hand) <snip> ETA: The repeated mentions of Offscreen Joey give me hope that he's coming back at some point. If they actually introduced the first openly LGBT MCU character to make a strained point about intolerance in two scenes before disappearing forever, I would be mildly ticked off, to say the least. If Andrew is Inhuman, I don't think May knows - she wouldn't have been worried about him. Deathlok as his appointed guardian angel? I would love that! I missed the mentions of Offscreen Joey - what were they? Link to comment
OakGoblinFly October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 The only storyline(s) that I like and I think are well executed are everything involving Gemma. I only like the Hydra storyline when Ward is on screen (Brett Dalton sells the heck out of his lines/scenes). Despite how well Gregg and Zimmerman work off each other, I'm not liking the Inhumans storyline; I don't like that so much of the plot is dependent on character stupidity (I hate when stupidity becomes a key plot point). This season is feeling a little too disjointed to me; I think there are too many subplots within the subplots and because of that there seems to be little focus. 4 Link to comment
enness2000 October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 I missed the mentions of Offscreen Joey - what were they? When Daisy brought the information about the virus to Coulson, she said that she asked Offscreen Joey (in his Offscreen solitary confinement cell where I assume he's just been hanging out, staring at the walls and slowly going insane) if he'd gotten the same e-mail as two redshirts from the opening sequence; he hadn't, thus ending his plot involvement for this week . 2 Link to comment
xqueenfrostine October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 Agree. Ward isn't even a fun villain, he's charmless and boring and the whole Hydra plot seems tacked on and out of place. Like "Oh yeah, now we have to go deal with Hydra." Rosalind is a better villain this season. Well. I had a theory that perhaps she is Lash. No? Too out there? Be amusing to see Coulson's face if that was the case. Unless one of Lash's powers is the ability to be in two places at once, Rosalind can't be Lash. She's on the very short list* of people we know have alibis for at least one of Lash's appearances. Both she and her top lackey were on the train with Coulson while Lash was attacking Lincoln and Daisy at the hospital during the season premiere. And we know those events were happening concurrently because both Rosalind and Coulson got phone calls alerting them that there was an Inhuman attack in progress. *this list includes Coulson, Rosalind, Rosalind's top lackey, Daisy, Mac, Lincoln, Alisha and Hunter. I may be forgetting someone, but those for sure people whose whereabouts we can account for while Lash was onscreen. Link to comment
kitlee625 October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 Joey also has an alibi since he was locked up in that chamber at SHIELD, under constant surveillance, when Lash was attacking the hospital. Link to comment
blackwing October 22, 2015 Share October 22, 2015 It does seem like Lash spared Daisy. When it changed back to human, the shadow looked like a man. But I suppose it could be a woman. What if it is Jiyang? 1 Link to comment
Bryce Smith October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 One thing I loved was Hunter throwing Kara's Ward-caused death in Ward's face. That sure hit him hard. Question is, how did he know about that? That happened while he and May were dealing with Bobbi after she'd been shot by Ward's trap. No way they could've seen it. 1 Link to comment
KirkB October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 If memory serves, didn't May set Ward up to kill Kara? So even if she wasn't there to actually see it she could have told Hunter. 3 Link to comment
xqueenfrostine October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 One thing I loved was Hunter throwing Kara's Ward-caused death in Ward's face. That sure hit him hard. Question is, how did he know about that? That happened while he and May were dealing with Bobbi after she'd been shot by Ward's trap. No way they could've seen it. If they figured out that Kara was dead by the time they left the compound, then they *had* to have known Ward killed her. May knew she was still alive when the SHIELD rescue team had been culled down to only 3 people, so if the three of them hadn't killed her that would only leave Ward. Hunter also would have heard the fake orders May gave through their SHIELD communicators that were really meant for Kara and could have figured out that May was baiting her into using her mask. We never saw May or Hunter discover Kara's death obviously, but they could have made their own assumptions from the gunshots. Ward shot Kara at least 3 times before realizing his mistake. 2 Link to comment
Raja October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 If memory serves, didn't May set Ward up to kill Kara? So even if she wasn't there to actually see it she could have told Hunter. I didn't see it as setting her up to be killed rather just a combat deception to send Hydra to the wrong place. So Ward was set up expecting May at a location and Kara stumbled into it. 2 Link to comment
Bryce Smith October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 If they figured out that Kara was dead by the time they left the compound, then they *had* to have known Ward killed her. May knew she was still alive when the SHIELD rescue team had been culled down to only 3 people, so if the three of them hadn't killed her that would only leave Ward. Hunter also would have heard the fake orders May gave through their SHIELD communicators that were really meant for Kara and could have figured out that May was baiting her into using her mask. We never saw May or Hunter discover Kara's death obviously, but they could have made their own assumptions from the gunshots. Ward shot Kara at least 3 times before realizing his mistake. The only way that'd make sense for them to have found out about it afterwards is if Ward escaped without Kara's body, they found it, and then realized that he was the only one who could've done it. I'm gonna assume that that was what happened. I didn't see it as setting her up to be killed rather just a combat deception to send Hydra to the wrong place. So Ward was set up expecting May at a location and Kara stumbled into it. I agree. I think May was simply trying to cause some confusion, but not outright get Kara killed. The fact that she was killed, though, was a bonus for them. Too bad it's the main reason Ward wants/wanted Andrew dead. 3 Link to comment
jhlipton October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 Love how the look on Ward's face went from "We've got this" to "Oh crap, it's May, we can't win this fight there's less than 50 of us." It would have been smarter for Ward just to run, instead of having his mooks kill Andrew. And on that point, I'm on Hunter's side. It's one life against a lot of lives. You've gotta choose the lives of many, over the life of one. You couldn't let Ward get away with those weapons. It doesn't make sense. If Ward knew May might come, why not tell her about Andrew and soon as he knows she's there? If he doesn't know, why have the mooks follow Andrew? Oh Hunter, I like you but that was incredibly selfish, and May is going to make you PAY. I disagree that it was selfish. I think that Hunter would have at least paused if it was Bobbi. But throwing down their guns would have been exceedingly stupid and May knows it. 2 Link to comment
KirkB October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 It wasn't selfish. If they had laid down their guns Ward would have just killed them, then killed Andrew anyway. Surrendering wouldn't have accomplished anything. All they had was to keep fighting. 2 Link to comment
laddibugg October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 Am I the only one who couldn't stop looking at Coulson's hair. I know the guy is mostly bald, but it looked to me like he had a new toupee, or they dyed his hair or something. It just looked a bit different to me than it normally looks. I knew SOMETHING was different. That's probably it! Link to comment
mac123x October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 Or, alternatively, given that May clearly suspected Ward was going to hunt down her family, that she's had Deathlok watching him, and when she said "Coulson, you need to get to Andrew", she wasn't hoping he'd re-route his support team halfway across the country in 20 seconds, but calling in the terrifying cyborg she already knows is on hand Alternatively, a ninja squad of Agent Koenigs were watching over him. Strucker Jr. would certainly be freaked out by 8-10 identical twins swarming the place to rescue Andrew. LOL 5 Link to comment
SocaShoe October 23, 2015 Share October 23, 2015 (edited) It looks like there's a new haircut for Coulson. Almost like they're clipping the sides of his hair for some sort of pseudo military look.... Edited October 23, 2015 by SocaShoe 1 Link to comment
Jeezaloo October 24, 2015 Share October 24, 2015 Andrew is probably dead. They killed off Lucy Lawless pretty abruptly too. But: didn't May go to Coulson and spill the beans on Hunter's erratic behavior before the fateful gun battle? Couldn't Coulson have deduced that May's cover would be blown because Hunter was so unstable, and come up with a contingency plan to keep Andrew safe (like a Koenig-esque Life Model Decoy)? 1 Link to comment
KirkB October 24, 2015 Share October 24, 2015 But they showed Lucy's face when she died. There was no question of it. We didn't SEE Andrew die. Link to comment
sinkwriter October 24, 2015 Share October 24, 2015 But they showed Lucy's face when she died. There was no question of it. We didn't SEE Andrew die. Agreed! After all, if you're going to have a popular actor like Blair Underwood playing the role, you should give the man his death scene. If he's truly dead. Link to comment
Jeezaloo October 25, 2015 Share October 25, 2015 give the man his death scene. I agree? But I'm not sure the writers do. Anyway, my whole point was that SHIELD had time to find a way to protect Andrew, and maybe even fake his death at the hands of HYDRA so they'd stop coming around looking to kill him. Link to comment
SnoGirl October 25, 2015 Share October 25, 2015 I'm jumping on the Deathlok train. I wish I had thought of it during the episode. They've met right? Andrew's done an eval on him right? I'm hoping that Lash is not Triplett. I'm definitely a believer that he'll be back and make a huge save sometime down the line (hopefully during the final fight with Ward). I can't help it, I loved his character and I was definitely shipping him and Daisy. For the record, I want Lucy Lawless back too. Can this be the show that no one really dies if they're the good guys? I'd be okay with that! I think the whole Ward storyline is a case of "The Writers like the actor too much and don't want to get rid of him." Dalton's been around since the beginning and I think they're all having a hard time letting him go. I liked the Ward storyline of him being a rogue without loyalties, but I wish they weren't wasting time with Hydra. I have no desire to watch the villains build their evil empire. It frankly makes Coulson look like a fool for not immediately stomping what was left of the Hydra factions into the ground. I want justice for FitzSimmons, well, justice for everyone, I don't want to see Ward get away by the skin of his teeth every time. 1 Link to comment
xqueenfrostine October 25, 2015 Share October 25, 2015 (edited) It doesn't make sense. If Ward knew May might come, why not tell her about Andrew and soon as he knows she's there? If he doesn't know, why have the mooks follow Andrew? He waited to tell her until he had proof. Since Ward wasn't expecting May right that moment, he didn't have things with Andrew set up and ready to roll. As soon as he figured out May was there, you see him signalling his right hand guy to call whoever it was besides Strucker that was tailing Andrew to set up a video feed. Even as he's talking to May, we see him fussing around with his phone, presumably connecting to the live video feed from Andrew's location. As for why have his men follow Andrew, I think it was because he knew that May might come for him. Since he couldn't predict when that might happen, he always wanted to be able to grab Andrew at a moment's notice. If May hadn't come for him or at least hadn't come for him until he planned for her to, he probably would have kidnapped Andrew whenever he was ready to enact his revenge. Edited October 25, 2015 by xqueenfrostine Link to comment
kminfinity October 25, 2015 Share October 25, 2015 I'm not sure how much the writers are lifting ideas from other successful Whedon shows, but Ward's arc has a lot in common with Spike's right now. He's the enemy, he has lots of connections with the good guys, he's attracted to The Chosen One Daisy. I agree if they are going to use him he would be much better without the Hydra rehash. For a minute, back in S2, I thouight they were going in a different direction and would have him somewhat redeemed, with SHIELD grudgingly needing his help but never really able to trust him. Link to comment
romantic idiot October 25, 2015 Share October 25, 2015 I think they just need to find a good twin and kill off the current one. As I like Dalton too. Link to comment
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