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S21: Tamar Braxton: Dancing All The Way Home


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Boy was this woman annoying during her interview.  Since I have never seen her before, is she always that over the top and borderline obnoxious?

Sure she can be over-the-top but "obnoxious" is subjective. I find Nene totally obnoxious because she's talentless and fug whereas Tamar has a gorgeous voice and isn't nasty in her antics which I usually find funny. I also find the Taylor Swifts/Bindis of the world basic and phony and that's obnoxious to me. 

 

Val & Tamar E! Online Interview

 

Edited by anonymiss
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Sure she can be over-the-top but "obnoxious" is subjective.

I had watched Val on Tamar's show before the episode and had seen their vibe. They seem to like each other and are having fun. But, I definitely didn't get that from Tamar's package. If I hadn't already been introduced to Tamar via that other interview, I would probably have thought she was bratty. I do think the producers didn't do her any favors in her introduction. Hopefully, the hometown story will help.

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I had watched Val on Tamar's show before the episode and had seen their vibe. They seem to like each other and are having fun. But, I definitely didn't get that from Tamar's package. If I hadn't already been introduced to Tamar via that other interview, I would probably have thought she was bratty. I do think the producers didn't do her any favors in her introduction. Hopefully, the hometown story will help.

I agree. I think we all understand by now how influential the editing of the pre-dance package is. Look at Nastia and Derek from last season. I think she came off was way drier/cold than she most likely is in real life. 

 

It will be interesting to see how the hometown visit packages shape the celebrity's narrative on the show. Fans of celebs like Tamar and Nick already have a general idea of what is like for them growing up. Maybe one of Tamar's sisters will be in this. Most likely Traci since the other sisters are on tour with Toni. 

 

Here's a video of Tamar and Val in rehearsal. She said on The Real that she had Salsa and Charleston but I guess it's Cha Cha and Charleston. I hope we get to see her personality and their chemistry in these dances. 

 

https://instagram.com/p/7042bfD0Ze/?taken-by=dancingabc

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Tamar is my favorite.  She had the hardest dance and performed so well.  I don't have a problem with her personality.  Plus, I'm glad Val won last year.  He is so relaxed this season.  Whenever he talks about Tamar, he has this really big grin.  I'm sure he wants to win but he's not obsessed with the MBT.  I hope they stay a while.  I don't expect them to win because people are trying to turn others against her personality already.  I know how that works.  For instance, I don't care for Bindi's personality.  But, she did a great dance.

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I didn't find anything wrong with their first package. I found it funny and thought it showed their 'brother sister' vibe off well, but then again, I get that type of humor.

I can maybe get not understanding type of humor, but some of the comments I've seen of folk saying she is undermining/disrespecting Val's teaching seem to just have a problem with women with dominant personalties.

Tamar is strong willed & speaks her mind, and will that clash with vals own dominant personality in the future? Sure, maybe...but at NO point was she disrespecting his teaching. She did everything he asked her to do, and further more, thanked him for it.

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Thought their cha cha was really cute and a great homage to her sisters. She's got really long, but in controlled limbs...which you don't see much. If Val can fix a few tech issues as the season goes on, they are going to be really lovely.

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In regards to judges comments about her lack of chemistry with Val: 

 

If you watch Val and tamar together in interviews. I think you can tell they have fun with each other. I mean... I don't think Val would just anyone talk about how they're making him husband material and help find a wife. Despite the showmances and rumors he's had, he's never confirmed that he was in a relationship with anyone.

Ref: All Access Interview

They clearly have a good relationship. 

 

I think that Val is used to establishing an affectionate report with his partners. Everyone from Sherri, to Janel, to Zendaya, to Elizabeth he hugs & kisses after a performance. Not in an inappropriate way, in a "good job" sort of way. Val and Tamar don't do that. I think the judges and audience are very used to Val having a very specific relationship with his partner and since this doesn't fit into that, it shows in their dances. Tamar doesn't talk about it constantly like Kim Z does but she is married and Vince is literally always there(Ref: their afterbuzz TV interview upthread, you'll see Vince in the background). He's her husband and her manager and I get it. But as her manager you also let your wife sign up for the show.

 

After Carlos and Alexa's first week, I think they paid attention to their critiques and established a deeper connection to Whitney and Mark respectively. In no way do I think their connections are inappropriate for their situation, but they realize they are on a show where this stuff matters. Val went from posting on IG almost on a daily basis with Rumer but if you look at his IG most of the photos he uses are stills from DWTS shoots, and not them rehearsing/hanging out. I think they have to "play the game" just a little bit more honestly. 

 

This is loving advice from someone who would like to see them in the finals lol. 

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Yes it's great that he gets a kick out of her and there's no phony showmance!

 

Also, I think that was Carrie Ann and Julianne using her initial reluctance to "thrust while thinking of family" as an easy base to construct their criticism and claim a lack of connection. As Tamar would say, "Lies!"

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I think it's interesting that Tamar seems to be getting Nastia's edit. She is outspoken/determined/not bubbly and gets a package that splits the viewers last week. This week they go a little softer but still not as fun/happy as others even though you know they're having fun. The producers even pick her talking about choreography because they know that causes a reaction. Then, she has a good dance, much better than most of the others, and gets a no connection critique. The whole thing feels very deja vu.

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Unfortunately, IMO the DWTS audience has always been rather sexist in its reaction to female celebs and it seems to me the producers know that and cater to those expectations. There's one way to be confident and forward that seems "accepted" for a woman on the show: Perky and perceived as "wholesome". If you're introverted and shy, you better be a Pollyanna and Bambi about it, none of that Bethany Mota "I look like I don't care all that much about a plastic disco ball" stuff. Notice how it's also usually the male mediocre dancers that outstay their welcome while a vast number of capable female celebs have gotten the boot relatively early because they "just didn't connect" with the viewers? Yeah. There are higher, often rather unfair and contradictory expectations for the female celebs while male celebs are often given a pass (exception: male ringers, there things can get quite brutal if they're not paired with Allison).

 

That's also why I think Bindi has a clear advantage over both Tamar and Alexa, the other two good female dancers so far. She's the kind of persona the DWTS viewers like, while reaction to celebs like Tamar and Alexa has always been more mixed.

Edited by katha
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Unfortunately, IMO the DWTS audience has always been rather sexist in its reaction to female celebs and it seems to me the producers know that and cater to those expectations. There's one way to be confident and forward that seems "accepted" for a woman on the show: Perky and perceived as "wholesome". If you're introverted and shy, you better be a Pollyanna and Bambi about it, none of that Bethany Mota "I look like I don't care all that much about a plastic disco ball" stuff. Notice how it's also usually the male mediocre dancers that outstay their welcome while a vast number of capable female celebs have gotten the boot relatively early because they "just didn't connect" with the viewers? Yeah. There are higher, often rather unfair and contradictory expectations for the female celebs while male celebs are often given a pass (exception: male ringers, there things can get quite brutal if they're not paired with Allison).

 

That's also why I think Bindi has a clear advantage over both Tamar and Alexa, the other two good female dancers so far. She's the kind of persona the DWTS viewers like, while reaction to celebs like Tamar and Alexa has always been more mixed.

 

I agree. I want to punch Carrie Anne every time she brings out the "no connection" card to some woman she is jealous of, just because she can't think of anything relevant to say. On the other hand, she gushes over mediocre male dancers because she thinks they are hot. I really miss Len. He didn't do any of that BS!

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First, I thought all the celebrities and pros came out the first two weeks and produced some fantastic dances.

 

Tamar's ability to hold the attention of the whole studio in her Quickstep, and to exude assured confidence in her solo opening number in her Cha Cha  (she must have some sort of artistic performing background), speaks volumes about her longvity on this show. 

 

Tamar showed great extensions throughout her arm, hands and fingertips, and produced nice hip actions in her cheeky and flirtatious Cha Cha.  Her assets (namely her graceful arms and long legs) should provide Val with a plethora of choreographic ideas and material to work with as the season progresses.

 

Nevertheless, its important to note that she's still a work in progress. 

 

Her New York technique in the Cha Cha needs to be more crisper in her legs and free arm.  Coming out of the Rolling off the Arm action, she could be tighter and a bit faster, and the Fan move needs more shaping in the legs and especially in the hips.

 

While getting off to a nice start, I thought Tamar's last two dances were still along the lines of “Look at me, look at me.”  She should remember that she has a partner and that she should include him, such that it's “Look at us” instead.  She doesn't want ambition to slowly crawl into the partnership and to influence the routine. 

 

While patience should be exercised before penciling her into the top 3, regardless of what may happen, I do see her making a deep run in the dancing competition.

 

Best of luck to all the celebrities, and looking forward to their upcoming dances.

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First, I thought all the celebrities and pros came out the first two weeks and produced some fantastic dances.

Tamar's ability to hold the attention of the whole studio in her Quickstep, and to exude assured confidence in her solo opening number in her Cha Cha (she must have some sort of artistic performing background), speaks volumes about her longvity on this show.

Tamar showed great extensions throughout her arm, hands and fingertips, and produced nice hip actions in her cheeky and flirtatious Cha Cha. Her assets (namely her graceful arms and long legs) should provide Val with a plethora of choreographic ideas and material to work with as the season progresses.

Nevertheless, its important to note that she's still a work in progress.

Her New York technique in the Cha Cha needs to be more crisper in her legs and free arm. Coming out of the Rolling off the Arm action, she could be tighter and a bit faster, and the Fan move needs more shaping in the legs and especially in the hips.

While getting off to a nice start, I thought Tamar's last two dances were still along the lines of “Look at me, look at me.” She should remember that she has a partner and that she should include him, such that it's “Look at us” instead. She doesn't want ambition to slowly crawl into the partnership and to influence the routine.

While patience should be exercised before penciling her into the top 3, regardless of what may happen, I do see her making a deep run in the dancing competition.

Best of luck to all the celebrities, and looking forward to their upcoming dances.

Responding to the bolded.

If you haven't read the entire thread, Tamar is a professional singer (like her sister, Grammy-winner & former DWTS contestant, Toni Braxton, & their other 2 or 3 sisters); she has a new CD out now or about to come out (or "about to drop", as they say in the entertainment industry). She's also 1 of the Co-Hosts of The Real, a syndicated (but also airing on the BET channel), mostly airing in daytime, talk show which is sort of like The View with all African-American Hosts. And, she also stars in 2 reality shows--Braxton Family Values, with her sisters, which airs on the WEtv channel, & Tamar & Vince, which is about her, her husband, & their family, & I think airs on the same channel as Braxton Family Values.

So yes, she has an artistic performing background.

Edited by BW Manilowe
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Responding to the bolded.

If you haven't read the entire thread, Tamar is a professional singer (like her sister, Grammy-winner & former DWTS contestant, Toni Braxton, & their other 2 or 3 sisters); she has a new CD out now or about to come out (or "about to drop", as they say in the entertainment industry). She's also 1 of the Co-Hosts of The Real, a syndicated (but also airing on the BET channel), mostly airing in daytime, talk show which is sort of like The View with all African-American Hosts. And, she also stars in 2 reality shows--Braxton Family Values, with her sisters, which airs on the WEtv channel, & Tamar & Vince, which is about her, her husband, & their family, & I think airs on the same channel as Braxton Family Values.

So yes, she has an artistic performing background.

 

Just a quick clarification. There's one Puerto Rican, one Asian, 2 African American, and 1 1/2 Afican American - 1/2 White co-host on The Real. It's basically a multi-racial The View. 

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Just a quick clarification. There's one Puerto Rican, one Asian, 2 African American, and 1 1/2 Afican American - 1/2 White co-host on The Real. It's basically a multi-racial The View. 

But The View is multi-racial.

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I agree that Tamar & Val had the best dance last night. Theyve done 3 really fun dances in a row, so I'm excited to see something slow lIke a waltz/rumba or moody like a tango/paso from them. Hopefully soon

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I agree that Tamar & Val had the best dance last night. Theyve done 3 really fun dances in a row, so I'm excited to see something slow lIke a waltz/rumba or moody like a tango/paso from them. Hopefully soon

Don't quote me, but I think Tamar said she was doing a Tango next week and that the theme is TV Theme Songs.

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Ballroom Tango is one of those dances that the judges can get really picky. But, given that her hold in the Quickstep was superior for a first night dance, she's going to have great posture.  I think all she really needs to concentrate on is the footwork, the heel leads.  Val, yes you have a wonderful body, but if the theme is Mad Men I want you to look like Jon Hamm on this one-  Meaning shirt stays on with a 60's skinny tie (heh).  Cool that Mad Men went from early 60's to 1970, I can't wait to see the wardrobe choices for Tamar, she's got great legs so a skirt with a sky high slit would be perfect.  How about a glamour Audrey Hepburn Breakfast at Tiffany's dress with high slit for movement.  Lots of pearls, hair piled high, a cigarette holder! (So much smoking on Mad Men (heh)

Edited by Andie1
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That's also why I think Bindi has a clear advantage over both Tamar and Alexa, the other two good female dancers so far. She's the kind of persona the DWTS viewers like, while reaction to celebs like Tamar and Alexa has always been more mixed.

I think Tamar is a better dancer than Bindi, so I am hoping that Tamar will at least get the Mel B edit.  The vast majority of voters are white, and they want to see a white kid win.  Black girls just have to work harder.

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I think it's interesting that Tamar seems to be getting Nastia's edit. She is outspoken/determined/not bubbly and gets a package that splits the viewers last week. This week they go a little softer but still not as fun/happy as others even though you know they're having fun. The producers even pick her talking about choreography because they know that causes a reaction. Then, she has a good dance, much better than most of the others, and gets a no connection critique. The whole thing feels very deja vu.

I think maybe that, if she is getting the Nastia edit, Val/Tamar will rise above it or somehow work it to their advantage. What I see from the packages is a strong personality with enough of a performance background to know that there is more to a performance than doing all the steps right. I think that her artistic instincts were spot on with what she brought up with Val. She forced him to consider the lyrics and the message she wanted to convey for her hometown memories package.

 

This week, Tamar challenged Val artistically and he rose to the challenge. Both their dances this week were interestingly choreographed and well executed. I think that Val was able to strike a balance between cha cha cha partner work and the solo work she did with the girls. I also think that she was right to question the idea that she would dance a quickstep with a guy she caught cheating on her (maybe a paso or a tango, but a Lindy Hop, I mean, Charleston...What was Val thinking?)

 

I like that Tamar is insisting that Val to think more deeply about the dances he's choreography. Because she's so in touch with her artistic voice, she is most certainly better qualified to determine what she's capable of portraying successfully or, at least, what's she's interested in performing. That Val respects her vision, is a credit to him and makes their partnership a nice collaboration. (I just had a mental image of Tamar being paired with ultra control freak Derek.../chuckle). 

Edited by Glaadrial
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I think maybe that, if she is getting the Nastia edit, Val/Tamar will rise above it or somehow work it to their advantage. What I see from the packages is a strong personality with enough of a performance background to know that there is more to a performance than doing all the steps right. I think that her artistic instincts were spot on with what she brought up with Val. She forced him to consider the lyrics and the message she wanted to convey for her hometown memories package.

 

I like that Tamar is insisting that Val to think more deeply about the dances he's choreography. Because she's so in touch with her artistic voice, she is most certainly better qualified to determine what she's capable of portraying successfully or, at least, what's she's interested in performing. That Val respects her vision, is a credit to him and makes their partnership a nice collaboration. (I just had a mental image of Tamar being paired with ultra control freak Derek.../chuckle). 

Haha with Derek would have not been a good look. 

 

I like how she said on The Real that Val is actually very similar to her and they get along because he grew up in Brooklyn "so he gets her." (It's funny how Val pretended to be this soulless white boy, terrified of dancing hip-hop to prop Zendaya up even more than she was that season. But then his old rapper videos surfaced.) 

Edited by anonymiss
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Val doesnt know how to dance hip hop...at least not correctly. Although he is improved, he's still not great at it.

On topic,

I'm excited to see Tamar tango, will be a nice change in mood from her previous dances.

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Sorry, I'm over here giggling about how Val's not a control freak. Hahahahahaha. I like Val, but chill and easy going when it comes to dance is not how I would describe that dude. 

 

Also excited to see their tango, good mood shift from their past few dances, and I loved the bit of Argentine Tango Derek & Allison did to this song at the Emmy's, so it's a great song for it. 

 

When I see Tamar get compared to Bindi (and Alexa), and not Carlos and Nick, it reminds me of this Tina Fey quote

 

“This is what I tell young women who ask me for career advice. People are going to try to trick you. To make you feel that you are in competition with one another. "You're up for a promotion. If they go for a woman, it'll be between you and Barbara." Don't be fooled. You're not in competition with other women. You're in competition with everyone.

 

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I'm suprised that some fans have equated Tamar's attitude with disrespect. She has a history in the industry and is juggling many different projects. So far the producer are showing a very smallpart of their relationship.

 

https://instagram.com/p/8DX44PS3Ix/

 

https://instagram.com/p/8FNe8EhTRo/

 

Val's issue with hip hop during Zendaya's season wasn't about the acutal dancing, but about the choreography.

Edited by Avidviewer
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I don't think it's so much comparing Tamar with the other women as it's just pointing out the (IMO rather sexist and reductive) voting patterns of the DWTS core audience. They like a certain kind of female celeb and if you don't adhere to that, you just have to do extra work to convince them to root for you. I also think someone like Mel B, as Andie1 mentioned, is an example of how this can work and not work at the same time: Far as I remember she was (real) bottom two at one point, so they had problems rallying votes for her to some degree. And yeah sure, Maks flubbed the freestyle, but she was fighting an uphill battle in the finals anyway because it seemed quite clear that Helio had more voter backing than her, no matter that she was a much better dancer.

Edited by katha
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I don't think it's so much comparing Tamar with the other women as it's just pointing out the (IMO rather sexist and reductive) voting patterns of the DWTS core audience. They like a certain kind of female celeb and if you don't adhere to that, you just have to do extra work to convince them to root for you. 

 

Fair, and to clarify, my irritation is with the phenomenon in general, not necessarily discussion of it here. Especially when it gets into comparisons of "personality," like there's some sort of Tamar/Bindi personality binary that women have to fit into (and like others have pointed out, it's not like Tamar isn't cheerful and funny, so it's not really a great binary anyway) while the one whose kinda forced cheerfulness and over the top personality is starting to work my nerves a bit is Carlos. 

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I think people vote for if I like a pro, I like a star, I hate a pro, I hate a star, I like the connection of pro&star or I don't see any connection between pro&star-which usually really is a comparison of pro with other stars or stars with other similar stars than a real connection issue. 

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From what I hear, Switch-Up Week is week 6. I've seen some tweets about it, people pulling for Tamar to be with Derek. If you think about it, with Kim Z dropping out there are only 3 male pro's left. Tamar could only go to Derek or Mark. Height and personality wise, I'd like to see her with Derek. Bindi can go with Mark and Alexa could go to Val. Ideally in my world, that's how it will play out. 

 

I feel like a lot of people don't like Switch Up week but I do. Looking forward to see who "phones it in" this season. 

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From what I hear, Switch-Up Week is week 6. I've seen some tweets about it, people pulling for Tamar to be with Derek. If you think about it, with Kim Z dropping out there are only 3 male pro's left. Tamar could only go to Derek or Mark. Height and personality wise, I'd like to see her with Derek. Bindi can go with Mark and Alexa could go to Val. Ideally in my world, that's how it will play out. 

 

I feel like a lot of people don't like Switch Up week but I do. Looking forward to see who "phones it in" this season. 

 

I like this switch, but don't forget, theres an outside chance Paula/Louis are in the mix. I mean, you wouldn't think so, but given how long it took to shake off Michael Waltrip, not sure I'd rule it out. I could see the next 3 elims going: Kim, Gary, then Hayes or Andy (in a "shocker"), leaving Paula around to be switched, if I did my math right. (I mean, I don't want it, but it could happen. Val/Bindi - would be interested in that one, Derek/Paula, Louis/Alexa, Mark/Tamar?) 

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I actually completely forgot there were even on the show LOL. I like Louis but could careless about Paula. This is very true, Paula could stick around, even though her performances have been inconsistent. 

 

I think the show always enjoys mixing up the top performers, even though this is by popular vote, I have a feeling that it will go like this. The first choices will be the ones I think they will be paired with... 

 

Tamar: Derek or Mark  

Bindi: Louis or Val

Alexa: Val or Derek

Paula: Mark or Val

 

Derek and Lil Kim is one of my fave couples from Derek. I think they have a similar sense of humor and work ethic. So I think Derek and Tamar would go well together. Plus since I want her to stick around, Derek would hopefully give her the choreo and scores to do that. 

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I think height wise Derek is the only one of the three that will match up nicely bc louis & mark are a Lil short.

I would like to see

Tamar- 1) derek 2)mark

Bindi - 1) mark 2) val

Alexa - 1) louis 2)val

Paula - 1) val 2) mark

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I like this switch, but don't forget, theres an outside chance Paula/Louis are in the mix. I mean, you wouldn't think so, but given how long it took to shake off Michael Waltrip, not sure I'd rule it out. I could see the next 3 elims going: Kim, Gary, then Hayes or Andy (in a "shocker"), leaving Paula around to be switched, if I did my math right. (I mean, I don't want it, but it could happen. Val/Bindi - would be interested in that one, Derek/Paula, Louis/Alexa, Mark/Tamar?)

Wasn't it actually Michael Andretti & not Michael Waltrip?

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I don't think it's so much comparing Tamar with the other women as it's just pointing out the (IMO rather sexist and reductive) voting patterns of the DWTS core audience. They like a certain kind of female celeb and if you don't adhere to that, you just have to do extra work to convince them to root for you. I also think someone like Mel B, as Andie1 mentioned, is an example of how this can work and not work at the same time: Far as I remember she was (real) bottom two at one point, so they had problems rallying votes for her to some degree. And yeah sure, Maks flubbed the freestyle, but she was fighting an uphill battle in the finals anyway because it seemed quite clear that Helio had more voter backing than her, no matter that she was a much better dancer.

Thanks for the shout out.. well Maks' messing up of the freestyle gave the judges the out, basically to agree with the voting for Helio. Helio won the thing a week prior when he did his Banana Man Quickstep, even though dance enthusiasts thought Mel B. bagged and tagged the competition even earlier especially with the Free Your Mind Paso.... But up until the free, the Mel B edit kept her dancing. When you had Helio who was camera friendly, and Marie Osmond a household name in the final three, you had to at least have another who had superior dance skills.  The Mel B edit was one that said, holy crap you're a great dancer, here's another 10, even though the voters weren't backing her.

 

I feel Tamar is getting the "attitude" label which is the "code" that has been handed to other good dancers like Brandy or Mya.  Early on, Tamar is not necessarily getting the "ringer" edit, but she's been given the "attitude" edit.  A little different than the cold gymnast ringer edit, but in the same ball park in that voters may like a dance, but hmmm that attitude....  Brandy's attitude was "desperate" when all she wanted to do was do well,  and Mya was given the "attitude" edit when she disagreed with Dmitry in rehearsal.  Tamar's ability has not really been given the scores it deserves because the "attitude" edit undermines it.  For example week 1 the showrunners put that Quickstep second on the dance order which is suicide for voters to remember when it comes time to vote almost 2 hours later and almost a dozen dances later.  That Quickstep looked like a week 5 dance.  It should have been scored in the top of the night, and yet a dance so difficult to master was just okay?  Really now. Imagine that same dance in that last 30 minutes of hour 2 when the producers are pushing for a magical ending that makes everyone want to vote? 

 

I agreed that the Cha Cha was a little ordinary (but it is week 2 and already Tamar is dancing on her own,) but the Charleston needed at least one other 9.   IMHO

 

For me, Tamar is the best dancer in the competition, but the scores aren't reflecting it. So that's not the Mel B edit.  She's also not getting the media headlines that you would expect for a dancer to get top score in week 2. I hope she is doing better than Mel B did in the voting, but the media backs who gets the biggest buzz, and it's not Tamar at this point. Google DWTS news at any point, and it's heavy on the  Bindi mundane minutia, or Gary being crazy or Kim's stroke.  We know 2 out of the three won't make the finals.  Tamar gets top score and  she's an afterthought. 

Edited by Andie1
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I am surprised by the edit she's getting simply because it doesn't seem to be going over well but tptb are staying the course.

I feel like there's a whole lot of bland and paint by the numbers this season. Tamar brings some fun and packages that are different than the rest. Plus, she's, arguably, turning into the best dancer. That's good enough for me to hope she sticks around.

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