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Tara Ariano

S03.E10: Lucky

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I could barely stomach Callie's whole "my moms taught me to stand up for what's right" spiel followed immediately by her perjury in court. Callie's adoption should've been such an earned moment for everyone in the audience, a real victory. Instead it was cut off at the knees by this cheap, destructive storytelling choice. Really imagine this episode if Braille sex hadn't happened. Imagine how good it would've felt for Callie to walk into the house and get that news and for her to see that sending Rita that recording was a good thing that didn't harm her in any way. Instead it became secrets, lies, and excuses. I was almost past it until Callie decided she was in need of a midnight nuzzle. That child is allergic to good decisions.

 

One of this show's recurring problems is trying to juggle too many stories. The show had plenty to deal with handling: adoption sex and marital troubles. All the other stuff (Nate's return, Jude/Connor, Mariana/Mat, a breast cancer scare) didn't need to be dealt with.

 

 

This show is starting to remind me of Parenthood and the Braverman family, in the worst possible ways.

 

I think they've got a long way to go before they get there but you're right, they're on the road. Can you imagine Stef going up again Kristina? LOL! it would be a mama bear standoff.

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and they finally got a shot at being happy under the same roof.

 

 

But for me, that's the biggest issue right now with the show and this storyline - that it won't be the happy family under the same roof. That got blown to bits the second the writers went full speed ahead with the Brandon/Callie romance. As I said before, the second I saw the glance in the Pilot, I knew the writers were risking writing themselves into a corner and they pretty much cemented that by going full speed ahead with the pairing to the point of having them have sex with each other.

 

At this point the only semi-believable way this mess works is if Brandon is written out like Jesus was and he goes off to some performing arts school. But of course that essentially means that he would have to leave his family and his home that he's had most of his life because the situation is not livable. And what, will they say he never comes home for holidays, family events, etc. And I guess one can argue that over time it'll pass as they grow up and date others and maybe even get married, etc.

 

Except in my opinion, the situation of Callie being adopted, the determination to have her be a family member is the very thing that ensures this situation with her and Brandon never truly goes away. Because neither will ever get a chance to truly put space and distance between them and the situation and truly move away from each other because being in the family means they will always be a constant presence to each other. Which yes, that's the problem with why they never should have gone there in the first place but the fact is it happened and once it did, this whole thing became unrealistic and not believable anymore, in my opinion.

 

I cannot buy that this will be some happy, great home when there will always be the awkwardness of Callie and Brandon's feelings, now compounded with the reality of them doing the deed. For as much as some dismiss the Brandon and Callie pairing as not being serious, a teenage phase, not real love or whatever else, I think it is unrealistic at this point to really believe that this adoption is the best thing for Callie and hell for anyone anymore in this situation. The whole happy Adams-Foster family is freaking bogus at this point in my opinion. 

Edited by truthaboutluv

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As I noted in last week's episode thread, I don't understand why it falls on Brandon to be wise and mature and make all the right decisions and Callie gets a pass. I'm sorry, I know I'm riding solo on this considering how hated Brandon is but I find Callie to be the major issue here, not him or I should say they both are to blame. As I said last week, it's all about Callie's issues and all what Callie has been through like Brandon's issues don't matter.

 

The kid was raised in a broken home when his mother left his dad to be with a woman, his dad is an alcoholic, everyone for years just expected him to be fine and okay with fostering a bunch of kids, he was sexually assaulted himself and physically attacked and all that was practically just swept under the rug. And added to that, he's still a kid as much as Callie. But somehow it falls on him to be the responsible one and all their dumb decisions made together is his fault. 

 

As I also noted last week, Callie's moronic decision to kiss AJ after everything with Brandon proves that the notion of her and Brandon being put all on him doesn't fly. Callie is a fucking mess, I'm sorry and yes she needs therapy. But in my opinion, part of her being a mess includes selfishness on her part, which includes jerking Brandon around repeatedly in my opinion. He is teenage boy who clearly has strong feelings for this girl whether one thinks it's real or not or will last or not. And to expect him to be wise all the time and say "no..." when she is reaching out to him is unrealistic. Callie and Brandon are both responsible for their mess and I'm tired of her getting a pass because "she's been through so much" and "he should know better."

I will also chime in to say you're not riding solo on this.  I don't really enjoy Brandon as a character, but that comes down to the way the writers constantly give him these half-baked storylines that always end with an out-of-nowhere second chance or an unearned reward -- if I consider him as a person, and not as a pawn in a bunch of terrible storylines, I actually find him quite sympathetic.  He had a lot of instability to deal with as a kid, and seems to have dealt with it without much complaint.  He dedicated himself to something (playing classical music) that most kids would not have the discipline to do.  When he gets attached to someone he's very loyal and protective -- maybe more loyal and protective than he should be.  And he has trauma as much as any other kid on the show -- his father was an alcoholic who did things like driving drunk with Brandon in the car, when Brandon was old enough to know exactly what was happening, when Brandon was old enough to understand he had to make a choice between protecting himself from this (very real and certainly terrifying) danger by telling his mom or staying in a scary situation in order to spend time with his dad.  That's a horrible thing for a child to have to go through, and it says a lot about Brandon that he made the choice that he did, to keep putting himself in a situation that he knew was wrong and was harmful in order to keep seeing someone that he loved.  And because he was so good at keeping that stuff quiet, and because his parents are total dumbos, nobody ever said "Hey, you know what, Brandon really needs some therapy or some support to help him deal with this" -- so, yeah, of course he's resentful now and feels like he should be getting rewards for his behavior now and keeps staying in situations where he knows it's wrong and harmful but he wants to keep seeing someone he loves now.  On top of that, he was raped by the woman his dad was dating, and nobody followed through to get him therapy after that (the way they did when they found out Callie had been raped by a foster brother).  He's also one of the few characters to actually face consequences for his bad behavior, getting beaten by his fake ID accomplice and losing his ability to play music at the level he had been working for.

 

I also think Callie's treated him like total shit.  She has serious problems, this is pathological for her more than anything else, and he was right when he said he couldn't trust her.  "I love you."  "I don't love you."  "I love you and I want to be with you."  "I only did it because I thought adoption was off the table."  "We can't tell anyone and we can't do it again."  "I love you, let me cuddle in your bed, because I need to find a way to torpedo this situation so I can get out of it without having to tell anyone what I did."  That's been their entire relationship.  As awful as this storyline is, there was one moment I found very sweet and sad -- when Brandon was standing with Callie at the kitchen window, and told her they didn't technically break any rules.  He had found a way for her to basically "take back" what they did -- to have done nothing wrong, to be able to be adopted with a clear conscience -- because he knew that being adopted was what she wanted.  He knows he's the second choice, the fallback option, and instead of being like "Well, screw you, you made your dumb bed now you can lie in it," he found a way to give her her first choice. 

 

But at this point, they're both so badly written, and all the kids besides Jude are such mediocre actors, that I'm really only hanging on for Stef and Lena and sometimes Mike -- they have their share of idiot storylines too, but at least it's adult stuff that  holds a little more weight for me, and more importantly the adult actors can all (especially Teri) act their way out of a paper bag so they kind of elevate the dumb shit.

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Oh yeah, the recap reminds me: Lena following Monte's "I had to say that out loud" with "Did you?" was the best line of the night.

 

For reals!  That shit was just rude, especially considering that Monte's gf is best friends with Lena and Stef.  Monte knew there would be fall out from that shit and didn't care.  All she had to say was that she thinks she has feeling for someone else, and leave it at that.  If I was Lena, I would have walked straight to HR after that conversation and get it on record.

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I might have to stop watching this show. Callie annoys me waaay more than a fictional character should. I swear, I want to reach through the screen and smack her as she makes each bad decision, seemingly worse than the last. This girl is just beyond "normal" teenage lunk-headedness, she's just, ugh!

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For a season finale, this sure was jam packed. I loved seeing Lena’s parents. They must’ve had to recast her dad, since he was played by Stephen Collins. Her Mom is awesome!  Also, I thought it was great that they brought Nate back, but I’m not buying the “All is forgiven” stuff.  Also, throwing it in there that Stef might have breast cancer was not cool. Glad she’s okay. That’s just what the show doesn’t need. Another character death.  Now that Callie is adopted, will Braille be able to rest in peace? I think they’ll find a way to keep it going.  The Jonnor scenes were too much. I felt so bad for them. I wish Stef and Lena could adopt Connor. His father needs some serious help. Also, nice job bringing in the new Jesus in the last episode, and thinking we wouldn’t notice. It was hard not to miss. Can’t wait for the new season.

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I'm sad that I did not feel the magic Al Lowe did for this finale. Mostly I just felt a lot of laughter/WTF. This show used to be so good at bringing the feels, but the rushing to tie up things in very pat ways (all this strife with Lena and Stef and now it's all fine just because Stef had a very brief --doctors that call at night to say the results were fine?--cancer scare?!) and the lack of subtlety almost to the point of parody (those kids clapping in the courtroom for Callie was sooo bad after-school special and totally unearned. I mean....after two web blogs? REALLY?). 

 

The new Jesus was kind of the icing on this shitshow of a cake. Lol. That whole scene with him was so unbelievably palpably awkward and tacked-on. I think this guy might be a worse actor than the previous.

 

I haven't cared whether Callie got adopted or not for ages now. The girl's gonna be 18 in a few weeks/months. She and Brandon already and always have had feelings in the context of this show. That's not gonna change. So I just gave it all a big shrug. Actually, no, I was glad for once she didn't sabotage herself by speaking up. I'm sure it'll be a mess next season but for now, I cheered her for keeping her damn mouth shut.

 

All this wasted time on Lena's brother and parents in this finale (and never did they explore the most interesting part of that--his black girlfriend. I'd like to know how she felt about hearing he'd said that!) and NOTHING on AJ and Mike and AJ's brother. Ridiculous.

 

And Mariana can suddenly sing? WTF? That's NEVER EVER come up before with Mat or her brother's band or anything?

 

I need this show to reprioritize.

Edited by taragel
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I am confused by one thing in the recap. Are there some really shipping or hoping for a relationship with Callie and AJ? Yes, technically AJ is Mike's foster kid but that makes him Brandon's brother so in what way would that not also be messy? Personally I say after Callie gets her much needed therapy, how about expanding her borders greatly when it comes to romance. 

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Glad the Nate thing was sorted out, though I wish it had happened in a less busy episode. Maybe I missed a scene but I didn't like how Nate's girlfriend had nothing to say about the ordeal. Obviously, they sorted it out but I wish we'd heard why she was fine with staying with him (again, I may have missed it, I was skipping around a little).

 

I assumed Nate's gf was able to feel compassion for teen Nate who had a sucky dad and worse mom, and was acting out, just like Lena and her mom were able to.  So good on them for being able to work through issues together.

 

Personally I say after Callie gets her much needed therapy, how about expanding her borders greatly when it comes to romance.

 

I'd like to see Calllie go to therapy and stop dating at all for a while until she gets a better handle on who she is without a guy/bf in her life or hanging around in the wings.  I'd like to see her actually make a choice to stop dating because she is so terrible at jumping into kissing the Most inappropriate guys she meets.

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I'm sad that I did not feel the magic Al Lowe did for this finale. Mostly I just felt a lot of laughter/WTF. This show used to be so good at bringing the feels, but the rushing to tie up things in very pat ways (all this strife with Lena and Stef and now it's all fine just because Stef had a very brief --doctors that call at night to say the results were fine?--cancer scare?!) and the lack of subtlety almost to the point of parody (those kids clapping in the courtroom for Callie was sooo bad after-school special and totally unearned. I mean....after two web blogs? REALLY?). 

 

I would agree with you about Stef's doctor but last Monday, while I was watching the Fosters on TiVo, at 10pm exactly my phone rang with an unlisted number.   I don't usually answer unlisted numbers but 10pm is sort of late for random calls.    It was my mom's surgeon saying that the test results were fine, no need to come in for her appointment Tuesday, see you in a couple of months for your next scan.

 

She'd called once before from her office at 5:30 and I thought that was a little later than office hours but a fine time to be doing paper work and making calls.    

 

This time it was 10pm from an unlisted number so probably from her house.   It was bizarre.   

 

I wasn't overjoyed by nuJesus's acting but there wasn't much to that scene so I'm passing judgement when we've seen more than 12 seconds with him.  

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I cannot buy that this will be some happy, great home when there will always be the awkwardness of Callie and Brandon's feelings now compounded with the reality of them doing the deed. For as much as some dismiss the Brandon and Callie pairing as not being serious, a teenage phase, not real love or whatever else, I think it is unrealistic at this point to really believe that this adoption is the best thing for Callie and hell for anyone anymore in this situation. The whole happy Adams-Foster family is freaking bogus at this point in my opinion.

 

I agree, maybe Callie and Brandon put the 'fun' in dysfunctional for a moment, but having siblings-with-benefits or previously-with-benefits just will never stop messing up the family dynamic, even if the secret never comes out.  But we all know it will, for maximum drama, and the person I feel sorriest for is Jude, it's going to be rough for him.  He is all too mature, but finding this out will be too much for a young adolescent, recently adopted and settling in, figuring out his sexuality.  Stef and Lena will feel responsible (they should, they should never have left those kids at the cabin), and the repercussions for everyone will be ugly.  What I most hate is that it sucks the oxygen out of the other stories/relationships. 

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And Mariana can suddenly sing? WTF? That's NEVER EVER come up before with Mat or her brother's band or anything?

 

I need this show to reprioritize.

 

Yes, this.  I would like to see these kids as more than kids who go on dates and get into relationships.  Mariana can apparently sing and dance and be a computer genius - great, let's see more of that confidence and less sex insecurity.  Brandon plays and composes music, Jesus is a wrestler, so what can Callie do?  We have no idea because she wasn't seen doing much in school except for her relationship with Wyatt.  Can she do anything besides kiss guys?  She learned how to drive, so I guess there's that.  Ok, she developed an app for foster kids (or did Mariana develop that for her?) - that's great, but it seems like it was only on the show as a forum for her to say mean things about the judge.

 

What about Jude?  Is there anything more to him other than Connor?  Has he overcome his past and caught up with the rest of the kids at the school he couldn't  have gotten into if Lena hadn't fudged his test results?  Let's see who Jude is besides his developing sexuality.

Edited by izabella
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I would agree with you about Stef's doctor but last Monday, while I was watching the Fosters on TiVo, at 10pm exactly my phone rang with an unlisted number.   I don't usually answer unlisted numbers but 10pm is sort of late for random calls.    It was my mom's surgeon saying that the test results were fine, no need to come in for her appointment Tuesday, see you in a couple of months for your next scan.

 

She'd called once before from her office at 5:30 and I thought that was a little later than office hours but a fine time to be doing paper work and making calls.    

 

This time it was 10pm from an unlisted number so probably from her house.   It was bizarre.  

I didn't think the doctor calling at night was unrealistic -- that's happened to me a few times, I just assume they prefer to catch up on reading results and whatnot at night, when they're less likely to be distracted -- but Stef getting the call from her doctor, going in for the mammogram, and getting the results back all in a matter of hours?  No way.  I mean, I guess I admire the writers' commitment to unrealism, since it wasn't any less WTF than anything they've written about how foster care, custody, termination of parental rights, treatment of mental illness, or what happens when you commit felonies works.  But it's so odd to me how they consistently go for these completely inaccurate, hairpin-turn plotlines when they actually could mine a lot more drama from the situation if they just portrayed things accurately.  Imagine if Stef had gotten the call from her doctor before they went to Idyllwild for Brandon's performance, decided not to tell anyone just then because she didn't want to ruin the big day, then found out about Lena and Monte, and gone through the whole several-days-long process of scheduling the mammogram, going to the appointment, and waiting for the results in private.  It would have been way more affecting for us as an audience to have gone through that for a few episodes instead of just a few minutes, it would have added a lot more depth to her being so upset about Monte, and it would have made her line about how she was so angry at Lena that she didn't want to need her ring a little more true. 

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so what can Callie do?  We have no idea because she wasn't seen doing much in school except for her relationship with Wyatt.

 

Isn't she into photography? I recall an early episode where Lena praised the photos she took on her phone. She also took photos of foster kids at an event at the School.

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Isn't she into photography? I recall an early episode where Lena praised the photos she took on her phone. She also took photos of foster kids at an event at the School.

 

And she plays guitar.

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I think Callie's app to help foster kids is actually fantastic and I like it a lot--only wish they had featured it more/not just as an avenue to show Callie badmouthing the judge. And she used to play music too in S1 didn't she? Wasn't that one of the ways she and Brandon bonded early on? I seem to vaguely recall a guitar.

 

I really liked Mariana's coding prowess (even though that too came out of nowhere) and would've liked to see more STEM-based stories for her. 

 

None of the romantic relationships on the show aside from Stef and Lena's have been all that interesting IMO. They should focus more on sibling relationships as those pair-ups are often quite nice. Let's see Brandon being a big brother to Jude and more Callie/Mariana awesomeness or some such.

 

Kudos to those of you with doctors who will call so late at night to let you know everything's fine. That's awesome...and rare. 

Edited by taragel

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I don't have a huge problem with the Brandon/Callie sex. They knew each other and were attracted to one another prior to becoming foster siblings, let alone adoptive siblings. But obviously, that's not the story the show is telling. It is being portrayed as a problem. While I realize that's the nature of drama tv, it's unfortunate the show basically chose to cast a dark cloud over Callie's adoption. Why not just let it be this happy, joyous occasion? I don't follow twitter, but I understand from the previously.tv review that the showrunners were saying it would end in a satisfying place. Sorry, no. The journey matters as much as the destination. Callie just got adopted with a big 'ol lie hanging over her head. Gross. Not happy. Not satisfying.

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This show! I'm into it like crazy. I actually plan my schedule around viewing it and I haven't done that since Buffy the Vampire Slayer. People know better than to call me, have an emergency, or need me for anything.

I am equal parts shocked and amazed that Callie hasn't gnawed open her wrists and taken a hot bath. It's like every good thing she tries to accomplish morphs into something bad and boomerangs back on her. Such is the lot for many a young ingenue in formulaic television but I think what makes Callie interesting is that she knows how flawed she is and just accepts it. 

I could watch Teri Polo act out those dramatic scenes Sherri Saum alllll daaaay long. Their back and forth the past few eps and in this one here has been so well done. The dialogue felt real, the emotions came across as raw as they are, and then the slow dance back to each other --- wow. I've watched several of their scenes of late repeatedly. 

I really hope Mariana starts singing more often. She has a great voice.

 

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The more I think about it, the more I really feel like the show is being written by two separate warring factions.

 

On the one hand, they underscore how adoption is really what Callie needs and wants the most. Throwing in Connor choosing a more supportive mom over a basically OK but not great dad, and Jude endorsing it, to drive home that parents are more important than the love of peers and even the cutest and most adorable of romantic peers who love you know it, and that makes it clear the show roots for family over romance.

 

On the other hand, they give us the ridiculous first time sex between the grieving girl with PTSD and her mopey brother to be, as though it was too good to just not go there, and that they want us to believe anyone would be conflicted about giving it up.

 

I wonder if it's a case of network demands vs showrunner preferences, and they basically negotiated a compromise that makes no sense, just to get out of stalemate.

 

By coincidence, Slate has an advice column which today advised step-siblings who became spouses: http://www.slate.com/articles/life/dear_prudence/2015/08/dear_prudence_i_married_my_stepbrother.html?sid=5388d19edd52b8417a011953&wpsrc=prudence_newsletter .

 

I thought Mariana singing for her grandparents was a pretty normal family thing for a kid to do at a party for her grandparents, and didn't expect them to make it about the actress actually having any ability. It was a way to bring the Mariana/Mat story into the anniversary party, and I'm hoping they don't make it be about Mariana being a singer going forward. I like her as a coding genius and a dancer. That's enough talent for one character.

 

I agree with the person who said upthread how much Brandon's character has the potential to be interesting, but they squander it on silly things like the terrible piano player trying to sabotage him, instead of focusing on his legitimate reasons to be as traumatized as every other kid on the show. I think they have wanted to make him the "normal" one, but they gave him plenty of backstory with Mike's alcoholism, and then Dani raping him, to make a case for him being as messed up as the rest of the bunch. I like him so much more when he's actually acting out than when he's just moping, so I hope they do something with him that's interesting, and not just more of the hangdog looks. I really don't think it's his acting that's the problem, so much as the writing and direction. When they allow him to be something other than the bland mopey but well-behaved kid, he's interesting.

 

As for what Callie does, I think she's an activist. The website, and her constantly getting involved even at her own peril, and sometimes when she could be easily expected to look the other way-- first protecting Jude, then AJ, now Rita.... she's consistently been shown to have that "fight for what's right" streak, even when she's also messed up and sabotaging herself. She will become a social worker or community organizer or something like that, I think. She also had stories about helping Daphne and Kiara.

 

One thing I want them to get back to is showing more of the Callie-Jude relationship. That's been pretty much totally sidelined since Stef and Lena took over as his parents. It's like the fact that they are original siblings is hardly even in the show's memory any more. I thought when she went into Brandon's room this week, that she was going into Jude's and I was so hopeful they would finally have a scene together, until I saw it was just another Callie-Brandon fluctuation.

Edited by possibilities
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I could watch Teri Polo act out those dramatic scenes Sherri Saum alllll daaaay long. Their back and forth the past few eps and in this one here has been so well done. The dialogue felt real, the emotions came across as raw as they are, and then the slow dance back to each other --- wow. I've watched several of their scenes of late repeatedly. 

 

Word.

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Today is Maia Mitchell's (Callie) 22nd birthday. Now the same age as David Lambert. Maybe that's why the adoption intrigue became boring to me. I think Stef and Lena's conflict mirrors a lot of lesbian couples that I have known--the more dominant (butch-ish) one becomes super threatened and tries to clamp down on the more passive one--seen it many times, and always comes across as ugly to me, kind of bully-ish and at the least unfairly controlling. Callie could use some therapy--she keeps making the same mistakes and trying to self-sabotage over and over. The second coming of Jesus--seems like he grew six inches and aged four years. Mariana--grab your dessert spoon--you are getting your just desertion from Matt--although I sympathize with her realizing her mistake, and need to move on without beating herself up further.

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Someone on Twitter (and possibly upthread here) pointed out that Lena was wearing the same outfit in the court for Callie's adoption as she was wearing in the Pilot when she met Callie outside of juvie. I hadn't caught that but it was a nice move.

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allows for Lena to be flattered by attention from Monte.

To be fair, being a cop isn't exactly like Lena's 9-3 job with built in holidays. But my main point is that Stef shouldn't be put at fault at all for Monte falling for Lena and/or the kiss. That is on Monte and Lena. It is ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

 

 

Because neither will ever get a chance to truly put space and distance between them and the situation and truly move away from each other because being in the family means they and always will be a constant presence to each other.

I hate Callie/Brandon but...they are 16. They can still get over it. It's not Romeo and Juliet. Plus, with college coming up how likely is it they will constantly be around. I completely hate the relationship and they should have just teased it (if they had to) rather than do anything - but the idea two 16 year olds will always be together is for Dawson's Creek. I hope this show can fix it and do better.

 

 

I think Stef and Lena's conflict mirrors a lot of lesbian couples that I have known--the more dominant (butch-ish) one becomes super threatened and tries to clamp down on the more passive one--seen it many times, and always comes across as ugly to me, kind of bully-ish and at the least unfairly controlling.

That is a pretty awful stereotype and IMO not what the show is going for. I don't see Stef as clamping down on Lena. I saw her as pissed because he wife/girlfriend of 10 years, was kissed by another person, kissed her back (or didn't stop it) and didn't tell Stef about it and it took a mutual 3rd party friend. I think, despite some other shonky fights, that is pretty valid.

 

I agree with someone upthread - the breast cancer should have been drawn out a little longer or saved for next season. Unless it was a false negative, which maybe.

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I hate Callie/Brandon but...they are 16. They can still get over it. It's not Romeo and Juliet. Plus, with college coming up how likely is it they will constantly be around. I completely hate the relationship and they should have just teased it (if they had to) rather than do anything - but the idea two 16 year olds will always be together is for Dawson's Creek. I hope this show can fix it and do better.

 

I completely disagree with your point. Normal teenagers get over each other largely because there's space and distance. Think about all the drama that ensues when two members of the same close friend group break up, and they want their friends to choose sides. And that's just among kids who hang out together during and after school. These two live in the same house. And are now brother and sister. And have to repress the whole thing rather than talking it out with their parents, siblings, friends, whomever. How the heck are they are supposed to get over it under those circumstances? The best outcome I can see if they do actually keep it under wraps is both of them landing in extensive individual therapy 10 years from now when they can't figure out why they can't keep a relationship together. Things like this have to be addressed in one way or another. They just do, IMHO.

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Think about all the drama that ensues when two members of the same close friend group break up, and they want their friends to choose sides. And that's just among kids who hang out together during and after school.

Sure, and that is over in two weeks, maybe three tops.

 

 

And have to repress the whole thing rather than talking it out with their parents, siblings, friends, whomever. How the heck are they are supposed to get over it under those circumstances? The best outcome I can see if they do actually keep it under wraps is both of them landing in extensive individual therapy 10 years from now when they can't figure out why they can't keep a relationship together.

Except they are talking it out - or at least Callie is with a friend. Also, Callie should be in therapy anyway with her myriad of issues. And if Brandon going to therapy sorts him out and makes him less whiney - I am for it. But my point is they are young, stupid and 16. Nothing lasts when you are 16 and they will be separated in less than a year. It's why I agreed with Stef when she was talking with Brandon that honestly - they need to get over it.

 

I do hate that they went there with the sex and that it will be used to overturn the adoption or as fodder for another teen preg storyline.

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I hate Callie/Brandon but...they are 16. They can still get over it. It's not Romeo and Juliet. Plus, with college coming up how likely is it they will constantly be around. I completely hate the relationship and they should have just teased it (if they had to) rather than do anything - but the idea two 16 year olds will always be together is for Dawson's Creek.

 

 

blackrose602 explained a bit what I was saying. For the record, I am not acting like Brandon and Callie have some forever and ever romance. My point is, most teenage relationships or hell any relationship (or romance because this was never even a relationship), when it ends, the two people have the luxury of having time away from each other, with their friends and family, to get over the relationship. They get to put have that space and distance that makes them realize, "okay, that's over and maybe it was for the best."

 

And sure sometimes the whole thing is over in like a week or two. But you still need that time and space and distance. Callie and Brandon don't get that and so it doesn't allow them to ever truly put the space and distance to the relationship to gain that perspective and be okay and realize, "yeah it was just a teenage fling" or whatever. And in fact, that may be the reason they never fully get over it. Because that continued forced closeness only exacerbates that feeling of longing and probably believing that they are some tortured, star crossed couple who are doomed by fate or some other stupid dramatic thing teenagers tend to believe. 

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People do get over things, though. I've worked closely with people I was very attracted to, and no one was permanently damaged by it. I've also gotten along with exes without drama. It's possible. People deal with their feelings one way or another, unless they're predators like Monte or Dani. In a way, showing that it's possible to move on could be a good thing here, if only I thought the show could be trusted to actually do that.

 

The stakes are high for Callie and Brandon, and both of them have dealt with things that are difficult, even life-threatening, and much more important than their night in the sack or any lingering feelings they may harbor.

 

I think TV exaggerates the epic unmanagability of sexuality, and that we probably will see some kind of overblown fallout, and I think it was stupid and annoying that they set it up this way, but my own life observations lead to different conclusions than the idea that it's inherently or permanently damaging to be around someone you love, or loved, or had sex with, or want to have sex with, and that it's this universally dire situation. Obviously, mileage varies on this, as evidenced by the conversation we're having. But Callie and Brandon have already been living together for a while, and they've both been able to cope, and both have had sexual feelings and experiences with other people, so I don't think a huge repression is at stake here just because they feel stuff or have felt it in the past. For a long time they did not act on it, and they only did so when they thought there was nothing to lose, so both have shown their self-control is greater than their desire.

 

I do agree 100% that the show manufactured this situation for the purpose of drama and therefore is going to blow it up, and actually if they talked about it in therapy the therapist would probably be a mandatory reporter so that would blow it up even more than if they just talk it over with each other or a friend.

 

A small part of me wants to believe they decided to tackle this issue because it's a real thing that happens for teenagers in foster care, and that they actually have some constructive commentary to make about it. Sadly, I no longer trust the team to write in that direction, but if they do, I'll gladly eat all the crow available, and be duly impressed by their superior showmaking.

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An adoption being held up because your foster mother took out a restraining order against her own son (and then used her connections as a cop to try to cover it up) to keep him away from you is not a symptom of the system being broken.

 

The adoption hasn't mattered to me at all since Robert came into the picture. But honestly, it's always been hard for me to see Callie's adoption as all that meaningful anyway. It's different for Jude, because he's younger. But for better or worse, Callie already has a family -- the Jacobs. It would be great to be able to just wipe the slate clean and all, but that's not how life is. Also, it's hard for me to believe that integrating herself as a child within this new family is really what Callie's priority is at sixteen.

 

I think that the show is actually handling AJ and Mike's relationship a lot better than they've handled Callie's with Stef and Lena -- because they're not trying to say that Mike is actually AJ's new dad. They're just trying to say that Mike is a father figure to AJ, imo, and that's something they both need and that's good for both of them. I can completely buy that Mike and AJ would have that kind of bond (with Mike basically trying to be AJ's mentor). And I can completely buy that AJ and Mike's relationship would be complicated by the relationships they each have with their respective families. But, in contrast, I can't really buy that Callie, as a sixteen-year-old, is able to see Stef and Lena as her moms. I can't really buy that Callie would be so gung ho about this adoption, and apparently not at all ambivalent, even though it means basically denouncing her birth mom and the family she grew up with, and I can't really buy that her biological family is all for this adoption, too (even Robert). It's all too neat and tidy and not really that appropriate for the stage of life that Callie is in.

 

But for me, that's the biggest issue right now with the show and this storyline - that it won't be the happy family under the same roof. That got blown to bits the second the writers went full speed ahead with the Brandon/Callie romance. 

 

I doubt they're going to stay under one roof. It feels inevitable to me that, yet again, Callie will soon use Brandon to try and blow up her relationship with the Adams-Fosters, and yet again, the Adams-Fosters will find out that Brallie lives on, and yet again, they're going to put the blame/responsibility on Brandon and push him away from the family while doubling down on their commitment to Callie. I bet that Brandon is sent off to live with Mike and AJ before the end of the 3b season premier.

 

I figure that Callie probably needs to see Lena and Stef be protective and forgiving of her, and that's why she keeps playing out this same psychodrama. Plus, I think that whenever she feels alone or rejected, she tries to get a committment from Brandon because it makes her feel more secure to know that he still has her back (and she goes back to Brandon in particular because he won't ever reject or abandon her, and he's basically the only person who won't). I don't have a huge problem with that as a storyline because I feel like it's realistic enough that I can deal.

 

But I still feel awful for Brandon at this point. When it comes to Brallie, it seems to me like Stef and Lena become so singleminded about looking out for Callie that they really forget to look out for Brandon, too. The first time anyone in the family found out about Brallie, they acted like Brandon was a predator. Jude, Mariana, and Jesus all said he was just like Callie's rapist (aka, like Liam). One of the first things Lena and Stef asked Brandon was whether Callie had run away because Brandon had made her feel unsafe. Mike told him that Callie didn't really care about him and she made that clear by basically leaving him behind. Then Lena, Stef, and Mike decided to take out that restraining order against Brandon, which I still think was really extreme and bizarre.

 

And once the whole family had made it crystal clear that they saw Brandon as a threat to Callie, and Callie made it clear that she needed to move back into the house (from Girls' United), what choice did Brandon really have but to move out? Brandon had said before that he didn't want to move in with Mike, and it quickly became obvious why it actually was a bad idea for him to live with Mike (because Mike was still having a lot of trouble staying sober and was making a lot of irresponsible, erratic decisions), but it was like everyone decided that Callie needed the family more than Brandon did, so Brandon had to open up a space at the Adams-Foster house for her by moving in with his father regardless of what was best for him (and it seemed like Stef and Lena weren't really considering what was best for him at that point anyway?). So then Brandon moved in with Mike, and Dani promptly started isolating him, grooming him, and finally raped him.

 

In this episode, when Callie came into Brandon's room and told him she loved him and then snuggled up with him, I actually felt *terrible* for him because it seems to me that he can't really escape living in a place where there's some semi-family-member trying to seduce him. And it's different when it's Callie (rather than Dani), because at least Callie isn't in a position of power over him and they're roughly the same age. Callie is just a screwed up kid and I don't really blame her for not knowing better or for treating other people poorly, and Brandon has more agency in his relationship with Callie than he did with Dani. (Though I will say that at least he asked for Dani's help with his dad and was pretty frank with her. He actually was more assertive with Dani than he's been with Callie imo. For whatever that's worth). But even when it comes to Callie, it's still kind of like, Brandon is also a kid and should also have a safe place to sleep at night where nobody is going to try to sneak into his bed. He also should have someone being sweet and telling him they love him even when they're 1. not drunk 2. not trying to have sex with him 3. not trying to use him to destroy their own lives.

 

Oh, also, I think that the show was sort of paralleling Callie and Brandon for a long time, especially in the way that Callie will do really misguided stuff to "help" Jude and Brandon would do really misguided stuff to "help" Mike, and in the way that Callie and Brandon both have trouble being alone and are pretty prone to pairing up (like with Wyatt/Talia) but still seem pretty lonely, and in terms of the Liam/Dani situations (I don't think they're anywhere near the *same* kind of situation, but I think Callie/Liam and Brandon/Dani were meant to parallel each other). So I guess I'm kind of blase about Brallie because I think the show links the characters thematically anyway, so I think of the characters as linked or paired regardless of whether they're literally in a relationship or not.

 

The Jonnor scenes were too much. I felt so bad for them. I wish Stef and Lena could adopt Connor. His father needs some serious help.

 

I was happy to hear that Connor was moving, because all I basically know about his father is that he beats him and is controlling and hard on him. But wasn't Connor's mother really checked out? I think it's very possible that by the time 3b rolls around, Connor will be back from LA. Not that taking the train between LA and San Diego is actually all that big of a deal anyway, so I don't see Connor moving in with his mom as a sure death knell for Jonnor. But I find it hard to believe that Connor's mom won't send him back to San Diego pretty soon. His dad has always been the more involved parent, even in the first season (iIrc?) when his mom still lived with them.

 

Also, I thought it was great that they brought Nate back, but I’m not buying the “All is forgiven” stuff.

 

Lena's family is really interesting and fun to watch imo, because I think that they all have pretty complex relationships with each other and are pretty complex characters in general. I hope that this isn't the last of the Nate storyline. When they showed how Nate broke down when his father hugged him, I thought, "there must be more to this story." (I agree with another poster above who wants to know more about how Nate and Faith talked this out, too).

 

But on this show, it's hard to tell what is an actor just really selling a scene, and what's the continuation of a storyline. A lot of stories just seem to get dropped, even though they don't feel over. If I had a complaint about this show in general, that would be it -- I wish they would do more to mine the stories they have, rather than just dropping them and picking up new stories.

 

Speaking of dropped storylines:  I wish we'd gotten more of a glimpse of AJ! I'm interested in him and Ty, and I hope that there are plenty of stories about AJ/Ty/Mike/Brandon in 3b. They make a pretty interesting family.

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People do get over things, though.

 

 

And I never said otherwise. I was simply expressing that a situation like that makes it harder. I even stated in another comment that I'm sure they could go off to college, meet other people and get married. But the fact that they're now family means they will always be in each other's lives and connected - every family holiday, wedding, special occasion, graduation, etc. And that history will always remain. Sure they may be able to get to a point where it will just be a memory but I'm just pointing out that the nature of the situation makes it a lot harder and a sort of unhealthy for both, in my opinion.

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But Callie and Brandon have already been living together for a while, and they've both been able to cope, and both have had sexual feelings and experiences with other people, so I don't think a huge repression is at stake here just because they feel stuff or have felt it in the past. For a long time they did not act on it, and they only did so when they thought there was nothing to lose, so both have shown their self-control is greater than their desire.

 

I absolutely agree with this. They *can* live in the same house. They *can* repress their desire. They *can* exercise self-control. My contention is that they *can't* be siblings. Can they role play? Sure. Can they suck it up and play into everyone's fantasies of a big happy family? Absolutely. Families keep secrets much darker than this every day of the year. But it seems like everyone in the house, and more than a few fans, don't see it as play-acting. They see it as Callie and Brandon genuinely getting "over it" and their feelings changing to brother-sister. And that's the part I don't think will ever happen. Friends, maybe. With time. But never family. Just my opinion.

 

The adoption hasn't mattered to me at all since Robert came into the picture. But honestly, it's always been hard for me to see Callie's adoption as all that meaningful anyway. It's different for Jude, because he's younger. But for better or worse, Callie already has a family -- the Jacobs. It would be great to be able to just wipe the slate clean and all, but that's not how life is. Also, it's hard for me to believe that integrating herself as a child within this new family is really what Callie's priority is at sixteen.

 

I only quoted a paragraph, but I actually agree with every word of this post. Like I've been saying for weeks, Callie was desperate when she arrived on the scene in Season 1. She and Jude had been through hell, she had to go get him herself at great personal peril, and she needed for both of them to be safe--especially Jude. I could absolutely see her feeling like these nice people were her and Jude's last chance, and the stakes were huge. I think anybody would have repressed practically anything under those circumstances. See Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

 

But after Jude got adopted and Robert came into the picture, everything changed completely. I actually had to suspend disbelief a bit when the judge didn't immediately order to Callie to live with the Quinns, at least for a provisional period. IME, that would have been automatic. I can buy Callie and Jude not being ordered to Donald Jacob, with the history there...but not so much with the Quinns. But for whatever reason the Adams Fosters have magical powers and Callie got to keep living there. Fine. But why didn't HER priorities change? There's no way that a 16 (17?) year old girl should be that attached to a family she's lived with for a few months, or that eager to chuck her entire past (the mom that she loved) and get adopted. Adoption is a big deal, it's an entire renouncement of who you are/were, and most kids don't go into that lightly. Throw in a bio dad who loves her and has the means to give her the earth, moon, and stars, AND a major attraction to her now-brother, and the whole thing really screws with credibility.

 

I also feel horrible for Brandon, for all the reasons mentioned in this post. He's kind of the afterthought of the entire family, even though, or maybe because, he's biologically related to one of the moms. His problems are constantly shunted to one side in favor of the other kids. He's expected to be the good guy, and bear the weight of everyone else's bad decisions, and is the only one who has really gotten consequences for his own bad decisions--although the fake IDs and hand crushing were actually the result of him making a bad decision in the effort to remedy someone else's bad decision. And now he's in love with someone totally screwed up in the head who he will never, ever be able to either be with or get away from--because she effectively moved in and took over his home and family. They're all going to be pretty surprised when what he yelled at Stef comes true--he takes off for college in another state and never bothers to visit. I wouldn't be surprised if he runs off and gets married and has a few kids young, trying to build his own family.

 

The whole mess is pretty tragic, and it's definitely casting a shadow over the other (really interesting!) storylines, as well as the picture we were originally sold of this big, happy, healthy family. Maybe that's what we're supposed to learn? That even the "happiest" families run deep with secrets and lies and intrigue? It's certainly a different show than I thought I was watching....

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After all these seasons waiting for her to be adopted, it finally happens and it's tainted.

This is exactly how I feel.

 

Have hated Brallie since the pilot; my only wish was for Callie to be adopted by the Fosters, particularly after they adopted Jude. It finally happens - I'll admit that I teared up at the #FinallyaFoster moment - and it feels cheapened by the Big Lie.

 

I still see no chemistry at all between the two actors/characters.

 

ETA: At least the adoption went through. If they had scuttled Callie's adoption due to the Brallie sex, I would have been gone.

I agree with all of this except the last bit. I have been hoping for the adoption since the beginning and have always found Brallie bland, chemistry free and un-rootworthy even without reference with wither Callie became a legal Adams-Foster.

 

But the adoption going threw this way for me is the WORST CASE SCENARIO. I wanted Callie to be adopted, I wanted them to drop the bullshit Brallie stuff, and, especially, really address Callie's self-destructive patterns.  Instead they not only kept Brallie alive, but had them cross a line that makes the adoption untenable for me.  Basically, I was pretty sure I was gone once that happened save for a miracle.  This tainted adoption wasn't that miracle for me.

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But I still feel awful for Brandon at this point. When it comes to Brallie, it seems to me like Stef and Lena become so singleminded about looking out for Callie that they really forget to look out for Brandon, too. The first time anyone in the family found out about Brallie, they acted like Brandon was a predator

 

Re: the above, it seemed like they behaved that way due to circumstances at that time. Callie had been a maternal figure and protector for Jude since their mom died, esp. after he'd been abused by a foster father. And they know that Liam raped Callie. At that time point in time, they also knew that Brandon had been sexually active with his gf (Talia?). So you have this teenage girl who's lived with abusive situations, and their teenage son with some sexual experience who's declaring he's in love with Callie and telling his moms defiantly 'you can't keep us apart.' They also know he has seen reckless behavior from his dad; kids take that in and  repeat that behavior, but in different ways. I can see why his attitude had Stef and Lena worried. He said he kissed Callie, but they had no idea what he might have said to her, i.e. "We belong together" or "We're right for each other" and if he might possibly cornered her into a kiss. Unless Jude told them he witnessed it? I don't think he did.  If you don't see what actually happened, I can understand asking 'Are you into her way more than she's into you and you didn't get that, so she got scared and ran?'

 

ETA: I've thought that the biggest reason Callie was determined to get adopted is love of Jude. That kid looked heartbroken when Callie wasn't getting adopted with him, and beamed with joy when the judge declared Callie an Adams-Foster. He has wanted them to be together under the same roof, safe, with the same parents for years. He was hurting and insecure upon finding out she had a father and sister who wanted to get to know her, I assume because it had been them against the world for so long. I clearly remember Callie trying to reassure him that the existence of this other family didn't change things between them at all - that he and the Adams-Fosters were absolutely her family and she wasn't going to live with the Quinns.

Edited by Bringonthedrama

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Good for Conner in getting away from his abusive father, from the 'we had a talk alright,' I can imagine there was probably more violence involved.  I'm glad the two are in love, whether they can stay together or not is up for them to find out.  If they do break up, someone better call Wyatt, as there's another available foster...

 

I do wish both Jude and Wyatt could rejoin the main cast, though.  I've been waiting all season for the 'baywatch shot' of Wyatt running down the beach in his bathing suit, ever since I heard he was a lifeguard.  I don't watch 'finding carter' anymore, so I really hope AS does more on this show.  Though Callie and Marriana did both use him, and Callie used Brandon too imo.

 

Rita was so great in the opening of this episode.  And yes, it's going to take a long time for B/C to work through this mess in later years.  But it was never going to be normal anyway, there was always going to be this messed up past between B/C that was swept under the rug before.  But then again with traumatized foster kids, there's a lot of messed up stuff to be worked through.

 

I'm glad Matt isn't taking Marriana back; that was a pretty self-righteous non-'apology' she made to him.  'I've forgiven myself!' well good for you...no need to work on your selfishness, insecurities and poor impulse control, because it's all self-forgiven.

 

That was quite a WTF? moment when the new Jesus appeared in the kitchen.  I knew it was going to be like that, though, that he would secretly get thrown out of the boarding school and have to come back home.  I'm not eager to return to the dance team/wrestling team storylines, though.

Edited by Glade

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I thought Mariana's I've forgiven myself was pretty much the badass moment of the episode.   So much slut shaming that girl heaped on herself and a girl should never slut shame herself, ever.   So good for her for getting over it.  She made a mistake with a boy because she was lonely and insecure.  She didn't kill anybody.

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I think it's good that Mariana's not beating herself up over it anymore, but I also don't see why she felt the need to announce it to Matt either. She's been processing this all season, he literally only found out the day before.

 

The extent of their interaction that we've seen since she told him that she had sex with another guy while they were dating is her wanting to sing a song with him and Brandon, and Matt rather politely bowing out. Where was all this begging and groveling that she says she's not going to do anymore?

 

It's not his fault if she's been shaming herself, we've not seen him do anything to shame her or guilt her or set any condition for his forgiveness.

 

"I forgive myself for cheating on you. So do you want to get back together?" Maybe it was meant to come off as self empowerment, but saying it to him the day after she told him that she cheated on him just comes off as incredibly self-centered and dismissive of his feelings and need to process what she told him.

Edited by Perfect Xero
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I was quite suprised  by this episode. I thought the whole show is about Callie not getting adopted until the final episode.....And than NewJesus. I had no idea Jesus was recast. Why is that? This new guy seems to be even worse actor then original actor (i know it is too soon to judge, but....). I am not really impressed by new casting choices. Initial casting was quite good - Mums, Mike, Callie, Mariana, Jude, but new additions like AJ and NewJesus are horrible.

 

Others posters got me an idea where the show could go next. There is need for more drama afterall now when we got a happy ending. So Mariana will move for Wyatt, everything will go fine there until Callie and her Mums discover that she is pregnant. Callie will ofcourse lie and say that its Wyatt´s kid. Than she will quickly bang him to make it believable for him too.

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"I forgive myself for cheating on you. So do you want to get back together?" Maybe it was meant to come off as self empowerment, but saying it to him the day after she told him that she cheated on him just comes off as incredibly self-centered and dismissive of his feelings and need to process what she told him.

 

I agree with this.  Had I been Matt, I'd have been a lot more sarcastic in replying - Yeah, that's awesome you've forgiven yourself for cheating on me; so glad you feel better about yourself now.  That will really help me sleep better at night.

 

WTF?  Why did she tell him she had forgiven herself?  Why would Matt, of all people, be concerned about that rather than how he feels to discover she had cheated on him?

Edited by izabella
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Good for Conner in getting away from his abusive father, from the 'we had a talk alright,' I can imagine there was probably more violence involved.  

 

I honestly didn't get that feeling. Through most of this Connor's dad has come across to me as someone who is just in over his head. If there was going to be violence, I think it would've happened when he found J&C making out and Jude would've said something about it. I just think it's become exhausting for Connor to have to educate his dad and he's going to give his mom a try.

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Regarding whether or not the Callie/Brandon thing is "forever" or "brief infatuation that they'll get over", it looks like the showrunners have a definite opinion on that:

 

'The Fosters' Producers on Callie and Brandon's Journey: "They're Star-Crossed Lovers"

"Callie and Brandon just have that thing. You know how you encounter those people in the world who just get you and from the beginning? There is a profound and deep understanding. They compliment each other so beautifully."

 

Interesting. Seems like they view the romance as important/integral to Callie's journey as her adoption. The other bits about next season sound intriguing too.

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"Callie and Brandon just have that thing. You know how you encounter those people in the world who just get you and from the beginning? There is a profound and deep understanding. They compliment each other so beautifully."

 

Oh, please - the producers must think Callie and Brandon are adults instead of teens.  Have they met teenagers?  They fall in and out of love every few weeks, very intensely.  The only crushes that last are the unrequited ones, and only because they've built up a fantasy of their crush object.

 

Yes, Callie and Brandon clicked.  Like Callie and AJ clicked?  Like she thought she clicked with LIam before realizing he was manipulating her before he raped her? 

 

Callie is going to recreate her relationship with Liam, always trying to do it better so it turns out differently, always seeking validation from a brother figure who she thinks "gets her," unless she addresses the issues she has because of Liam.  Girl needs therapy, or more Rita, if only she'd listen to anyone.  Callie always thinks she knows best.

Edited by izabella
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Oh, please - the producers must think Callie and Brandon are adults instead of teens.  Have they met teenagers?  They fall in and out of love every few weeks, very intensely.  The only crushes that last are the unrequited ones, and only because they've built up a fantasy of their crush object.

 

That's really unfair and demeaning to teenagers. I have a star-crossed lover in my own past, whom I met when I was 15 and he was 19. For a lot of reasons it was never meant to be, and we were both really screwed up from the breakup for a long time. 20 years later, with time and distance between us, we're Facebook friends and contemplating a visit soon. Neither of us could any more have just turned it off and been siblings than anything, and neither of us would have been heal while living under the same roof. Maybe it doesn't happen often, but it does happen in the real world.

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Regarding whether or not the Callie/Brandon thing is "forever" or "brief infatuation that they'll get over", it looks like the showrunners have a definite opinion on that:

 

'The Fosters' Producers on Callie and Brandon's Journey: "They're Star-Crossed Lovers"

"Callie and Brandon just have that thing. You know how you encounter those people in the world who just get you and from the beginning? There is a profound and deep understanding. They compliment each other so beautifully."

 

Interesting. Seems like they view the romance as important/integral to Callie's journey as her adoption. The other bits about next season sound intriguing too.

I'm a Brallie person and even I was surprised by this. The last thing I expected if they went through on having Callie adopted was for the showrunners to the very next day give an interview proclaiming Brallie star-crossed lovers. "We have to continue to cross those stars." It reads almost like the adoption is just a roadblock/latest crossed stars for Brandon & Callie rather than the relationship being an obstacle to the adoption.

 

They are really never picking a lane on this. Never. The Pretty Little Liars will probably long have their issues with A resolved but Brandon and Callie will be giving each other tortured looks in Season 5. And like a sucker, I'll keep watching because they won't close the damn door on this pairing. Which I guess is their whole point.

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Yes, Callie and Brandon clicked.  Like Callie and AJ clicked?  Like she thought she clicked with LIam before realizing he was manipulating her before he raped her?

I have issues with this only because the Liam thing is not like either Brandon or AJ. From the sounds of the story Callie was several years younger than she is now AND the show was clear that Liam groomed the hell out of her. It was why the story of his current foster sister resonated with Callie and made her want to do something - because it was what happened to her, there was nothing sexual about his actions at that point and she knew what would happen to that girl.

 

Otherwise, I agree with you about intense teenage relationships that fizzle out fast - Brandon/Callie would be over in a hot flash. But I don't think Callie is reliving Liam over and over again - otherwise her relationship with Wyatt would have been very very different

 

That said - Brandon/Callie and AJ/Callie can be compared because all are the same age and there is nothing abusive going on. And I thought they both clicked. If forced to choose, I prefer Callie/AJ because there is no legal sibling relationship and they have something, other than the Foster-Adams - to connect to eachother (i.e. foster-kids plus a love of a brother).

 

I also hate what the producers have said about them being star-crossed lovers. That is crap. They are two 17/16 years olds. Nothing lasts at that age - except in special circumstances. I hope the story soon ends with them realising it isn't a good thing and that being adopted/siblings is for the absolute best.

 

Also, I feel it in my waters that Stef's breast cancer thing was a false positive - meaning I think she will end up with cancer but I don't think she lied to Lena about it. I think doctor mix-up. Otherwise - it was way too random for an already packed episode.

Edited by SparedTurkey
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I have issues with this only because the Liam thing is not like either Brandon or AJ. From the sounds of the story Callie was several years younger than she is now AND the show was clear that Liam groomed the hell out of her. It was why the story of his current foster sister resonated with Callie and made her want to do something - because it was what happened to her, there was nothing sexual about his actions at that point and she knew what would happen to that girl.

Otherwise, I agree with you about intense teenage relationships that fizzle out fast - Brandon/Callie would be over in a hot flash. But I don't think Callie is reliving Liam over and over again - otherwise her relationship with Wyatt would have been very very different

That said - Brandon/Callie and AJ/Callie can be compared because all are the same age and there is nothing abusive going on. And I thought they both clicked. If forced to choose, I prefer Callie/AJ because there is no legal sibling relationship and they have something, other than the Foster-Adams - to connect to eachother (i.e. foster-kids plus a love of a brother).

I also hate what the producers have said about them being star-crossed lovers. That is crap. They are two 17/16 years olds. Nothing lasts at that age - except in special circumstances. I hope the story soon ends with them realising it isn't a good thing and that being adopted/siblings is for the absolute best.

Also, I feel it in my waters that Stef's breast cancer thing was a false positive - meaning I think she will end up with cancer but I don't think she lied to Lena about it. I think doctor mix-up. Otherwise - it was way too random for an already packed episode.

While I agree that some young romances don't last, this is a more complicated case with Brandon and Callie. I think that some are forgetting that Callie was raped. As someone with experience on this issue, it shouldn't be easy for her to just forget about it and move on and pretend that Brandon is just a brother to her.

Edited by ModestBeauty92

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I'm a Brallie person and even I was surprised by this. The last thing I expected if they went through on having Callie adopted was for the showrunners to the very next day give an interview proclaiming Brallie star-crossed lovers. "We have to continue to cross those stars." It reads almost like the adoption is just a roadblock/latest crossed stars for Brandon & Callie rather than the relationship being an obstacle to the adoption.

 

They are really never picking a lane on this. Never. The Pretty Little Liars will probably long have their issues with A resolved but Brandon and Callie will be giving each other tortured looks in Season 5. And like a sucker, I'll keep watching because they won't close the damn door on this pairing. Which I guess is their whole point.

I love your posts and I always agree with them. I was happy to see the adoption scene, but I was also slightly uneasy. Callie's adoption is built on a bunch of secrets and lies. She has this dark cloud looming over what was supposed to be her fresh start. I read all of these comments and I see that most are downplaying Brandon and Callie's sex scene as another teenage driven impulse and I can't really fault them because the show made it seem as such. I'm disappointed in the way that Callie's first consensual time and Brandon's rape was handled. Both issues were treated as an afterthought. This should have been a bigger issue for Callie and not something that they just sweep under the rug.

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The Callie we met in Season 1 needed adoption. Remember her? She was brittle and closed off and she didn't trust that anyone could ever have her back for anything and she desperately needed to keep Jude safe and she would do absolutely anything to protect or help him. I loved that character. I wanted to see that character get a redemptive forever family story arc.

 

The Callie we have now does not have the same desperate need for a family and I hate that the show surrendered the opportunity to tell that story about foster teens. The one about the teenagers who still need a "soft place to land" even if they don't want to actually sever their biological ties. (There's something called permanent guardianship that can actually accomplish both those things, by the way, if the teen can find a stable family willing to work with their biological family.) I also hate that they are feeding into the stereotypes about fostering teens that scare away potential foster parents -- the ones that think they can't want to foster a teen girl with a teen boy in the house because what if they fall in love!

 

I also hate that they couldn't give a better example of how the foster system was broken than by imagining scenarios that would actually, legitimately delay Callie's adoption. If they need examples, there's a court case in New York City they could mine for ideas. When Callie said she wouldn't apologize to the judge for calling him out for not paying attention to what she wanted? I so wanted him to explain some reality to her. That being that he has to look at not just what she wants, but the larger picture of what is safe and stable. Abused and neglected children do not always have their own best interests in mind when they tell the judge what they "want."  Kiara didn't want to leave her pimp, remember? But you, Callie, made her leave him by calling in reinforcements when she tried to run back to him. 

 

I also hate the concept of "star-crossed lovers." Romeo and Juliet is a tragedy, not a romance.

 

Other storylines: Disappointed that Carmen's story is apparently "your actions have consequences and you may have lost out on your life goals because of one big mistake" while Callie's is "your consequences are irritating delays of major life events, but in the end you get to decide what you really want."

 

The Jude/Connor storyline was good and well-played. Connor needs a supportive family more than he needs a boyfriend right now. It'll be interesting to see how they play this out -- will the mother actually be any better?

 

Mariana/Mat was strange. She thought forgiving herself meant he would be over it? It doesn't work that way, honey. Sometimes, when we hurt someone, it's too big to take back. And Mat gets to decide whether he can move forward with a relationship with her or not. I'm not sure Mariana sees it, but the way things played out has to look to Mat like she just wanted to have sex with someone that night, not specifically with him. And that -- feeling like maybe you were just a means to an end when you thought you were more than that --  got to hurt almost as much as the cheating itself.

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