S01.E10: Future

[b2H]

I agree! Almost like it was originally supposed to be a two hour finale but then got cut back to one hour. I was very confused by the timeline. They are supposed to meet at night... but Adam sneaks out of bed with Anna, hadn't he already snuck out of bed to have that conversation with Rachel? So then the next morning she proposes. But then they all fly to London and the NEXT day have Granny for tea and then THAT evening have the wedding?  I vaguely remember Rachel saying something in the confessional that amounted to "last night we slept together." But at this point, them sleeping together happened several days ago didn't it?

 

And then Anna makes her statement about Adam being too dumb and walks off and then what? They still have a live show to produce don't they?  Next scene we have Quinn and Rachel in the garden talking as if it is all over.  No post being stood up interview from Adam, no mention of playing a clip reel to kill the rest of the hour (or most likely two hour) time slot they had for the live wedding, nothing. 

 

I have loved this show and can't wait for the 2nd season, I just hate that this last episode was so sloppy.  

 

I was sincerely confused by the opening scenes of this show, because it seemed like I missed something.  I was also confused by the closing scenes of the previous episode as being entirely unfamiliar to me until I remembered that I'd watched last week's episode on my iPad on Lifetime on Demand (BTW, hey, Lifetime - if you're going to put the show on On Demand, could you please re-broadcast the ENTIRE show?  Both times I did this, I missed the last 90 seconds, which led to my confusion last night!).

 

As others have posted above, I think too much of the final episode ended up on the cutting room floor.  We lost out on the discussion, apparently, between Adam and Quinn that led Adam to break it off with Rachel.  We were missing some other background as well (which is eluding me just now).

 

I will be happy with a second season, if they pick up right where they left off and don't smother the exposition.

[woodscommaelle]

I'm glad this season is over bc I still can't decide if I loved the show or hated it.

[Bort]

I vaguely remember Rachel saying something in the confessional that amounted to "last night we slept together." But at this point, them sleeping together happened several days ago didn't it?

It was Grace that Rachel told about sleeping with Adam the night before. Which was definitely untrue as far as the timeline goes but I think that was how that scene was supposed to be: classic Rachel manipulation.

[Earl Is Dead]

I loved this finale.  I was so afraid they'd drop the ball and it would suck and ruin how much I've enjoyed this show and I was so grateful that wasn't the case.  I don't know why I even noticed this, but I even loved how it came full circle.  Rachel's last scene talking to Quinn, she's lying, wrung out, flat on her back on the chaise lounge, exactly how we first met her in episode one, flat on her vulnerable back on the floor of the limo.  Another season of Satan's Asshole concluded, and she's right back where she started.  I hope that S2 is as good as this season was, but if it goes all Heroes on us, I'm still happy to have been on the S1 ride.  

[xqueenfrostine]

It was Grace that Rachel told about sleeping with Adam the night before. Which was definitely untrue as far as the timeline goes but I think that was how that scene was supposed to be: classic Rachel manipulation.

Given how much we didn't see of what had to have happened between the end of episode 9 and the beginning of episode 10, for all we know a Rachel and Adam quickie might have happened after all and that's yet another scene that they either cut and forgot they cut it or just felt they didn't have to show.

I loved this finale. I was so afraid they'd drop the ball and it would suck and ruin how much I've enjoyed this show and I was so grateful that wasn't the case. I don't know why I even noticed this, but I even loved how it came full circle. Rachel's last scene talking to Quinn, she's lying, wrung out, flat on her back on the chaise lounge, exactly how we first met her in episode one, flat on her vulnerable back on the floor of the limo. Another season of Satan's Asshole concluded, and she's right back where she started. I hope that S2 is as good as this season was, but if it goes all Heroes on us, I'm still happy to have been on the S1 ride.

The pilot ended with Rachel on a chaise lounge after her scene with Britney. And I'm pretty sure the same song playing in the background of the finale was playing at the end of the pilot. Edited August 4, 2015 by xqueenfrostine

[Bort]

Given how much we didn't see of what had to have happened between the end of episode 9 and the beginning of episode 10, for all we know a Rachel and Adam quickie might have happened after all and that's yet another scene that they either cut and forgot they cut it or just felt they didn't have to show.

This is true. Rachel and Adam could've banged out at the pond for all we know. Although, if they did, I'm mad to have missed it!

[Jessi]

Did anyone else think Rachel was trying to get Quinn to say she murdered someone on tape so that the recording could be used against her in the future? I was expecting the police to drive up as Rachel was saying, "You know, I love you." Dude--this show pushes all my old Soap Opera suspicion triggers.

[Readalot]

Did anyone else think Rachel was trying to get Quinn to say she murdered someone on tape so that the recording could be used against her in the future? I was expecting the police to drive up as Rachel was saying, "You know, I love you." Dude--this show pushes all my old Soap Opera suspicion triggers.

YES ME! honestly I was kind of shocked that did not happen.

[Earl Is Dead]

The pilot ended with Rachel on a chaise lounge after her scene with Britney. And I'm pretty sure the same song playing in the background of the finale was playing at the end of the pilot.

That is also awesome. What I meant was more that the very first shot we saw of Rachel and the very last one were the same, on her back, shot from above. Great catch about the song - that's even more cool if it's true.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Earl Is Dead

[adhoc]

Just saw the episode online.  Jeez, the Quinn/Chet/engagement plot point ended up being so stupid. She tells him why she's upset and is breaking off the relationship, and he just accepts it.  Now, I'm thinking, he gave his ex a gigantic settlement so he could marry Quinn. That means something. Why do they not at least have a heartfelt convo before wrapping up the story line?  Oh, yeah, that's right--because that's not what this show is about. It's about doing nasty (or mean, or inconsiderate) things to others and then moving on to the next sick plot point.

 

Jeremy is your garden-variety putz, compared to others on the show, IMO. I have no anger, vitriol, etc. toward him, and I do not want to see him castrated, killed, or any of the other suggested tortures in this thread.

 

Finally, this was an interesting experience, but I won't be back next season.  This show is about unhappy people who work in a soul-crushing environment, humiliating and manipulating others, fall-out be damned. Life is too short for me to invest even 43 minutes in more of that.

Edited August 5, 2015 by adhoc

[AnnaRose]

Did anyone else think Rachel was trying to get Quinn to say she murdered someone on tape so that the recording could be used against her in the future? I was expecting the police to drive up as Rachel was saying, "You know, I love you." Dude--this show pushes all my old Soap Opera suspicion triggers.

 

But didn't Rachel say "we" when she brought it up?  If so, she would have been implicating herself too if she were wired.  That was the only thing that made me think they weren't going there with that conversation.

 

... And then Anna makes her statement about Adam being too dumb and walks off and then what? They still have a live show to produce don't they?  Next scene we have Quinn and Rachel in the garden talking as if it is all over.  No post being stood up interview from Adam, no mention of playing a clip reel to kill the rest of the hour (or most likely two hour) time slot they had for the live wedding, nothing. 

 

That's what I was thinking while I was watching it, but when they cut to Rachel and Quinn talking after that, I decided I must have been mistaken in thinking that it was supposed to be an entire Everlasting episode of the wedding.   I think Everlasting had one episode left, which would normally be the finale ending with a proposal, but since Adam agreed to a wedding... I think they made the episode they had planned with everything leading up to and including the proposal, and shot and edited all of that ahead of time, and then left enough time to cut to a live short wedding segment at the end.   I think the plan was to use that as a tease for Royal Renovations which was still supposed to happen at that point. 

The wedding, of course, blew up and didn't happen, but they only had a small amount of time to fill, not a full episode.  I'm not sure if I'm explaining this clearly, but I think that's why Adam left at the alter and Anna the Runaway Bride was enough to close out the live portion of the episode.

 

Anyway, stellar finale from all involved.  I would love it if this show receives some award nominations and are not forgotten by the time they are eligible.  Especially Shiri and Candace who were amazing throughout the season.

Edited August 5, 2015 by AnnaRose

[CalamityBoPeep]

It just occurred to me tonight that as sorry for Faith's dashed hopes as I felt last week, I'm relieved as hell that she wasn't in this episode.  I think grinding Faith's... well... faith (sorry) in her fellow humans... into the dust would have been really depressing to watch.  And I have no doubt that if she had been present when Rachel and Quinn sought their revenge, Faith would have been collateral damage.  At least we saw Anna have some strength and recognize her opportunity to figuratively shove her stiletto between Adam's ribs.

 

(It's sounding so biblical for a revenge plot... Faith, hell, dust, ribs...)

 

I kind of loved how Quinn was walking back with Anna, prompting her to talk, and at first Anna wasn't having it.  Then she looks up the stairs and notes the cameras at the ready, and you can see her shake off her internal monologues and resistance and just embrace the reality-show-suckiness of it all.  The actress displayed that transformation moment beautifully.

[xqueenfrostine]

That is also awesome. What I meant was more that the very first shot we saw of Rachel and the very last one were the same, on her back, shot from above. Great catch about the song - that's even more cool if it's true.

 

They actually did the same shot twice in the pilot, once in the limo and once on the lounger.  I think it was meant to book-end Rachel's despair on both ends on the episode, so it makes sense that they would do it on both ends on the season.  I also don't think it's an accident that Rachel's last big conversation with another character (Quinn) is in a similar setting (a pair of loungers) to the one in which we first witnessed the extent of her talent for manipulation.

 

 

It just occurred to me tonight that as sorry for Faith's dashed hopes as I felt last week, I'm relieved as hell that she wasn't in this episode.  I think grinding Faith's... well... faith (sorry) in her fellow humans... into the dust would have been really depressing to watch.  And I have no doubt that if she had been present when Rachel and Quinn sought their revenge, Faith would have been collateral damage.  At least we saw Anna have some strength and recognize her opportunity to figuratively shove her stiletto between Adam's ribs.

 

Agreed, plus I don't think the conflict in this episode ever would have worked had Faith been one of the two finalists.  The stakes would have been so different since Faith, even in her crazy-eyed proposal from last week, was never as invested in winning the show as Grace or Anna was.  For this episode to work, they needed two contestants left who really wanted to fight for Adam, not fight for the chance to acquire a beard (or whatever the lesbian term for that is).  And Faith was too nice for there to have been any real tension between her and the either finalist, be it Anna or Grace.  

[Irlandesa]

Yes, he did: "I think you guys know—a little bit too much, probably—about, uh, this woman's and my relationship. You know that I love you, always will, and you'll never find anybody who loves you more. So, while we're in this incredibly romantic place, I was just wondering if I could ask you…"

Thank you.  That's what I get for not going back far enough. I rewatched the fake proposal part but not the intro to it. 

 

As for the end, perhaps they ate up all the time with Anna not showing up and Britney's freakout.  Anna's last words do feel like a perfect way to end the season of Everlasting.

[TheodoraK]

my stupid cable cut off just as jeremy got to the mother's house. can someone tell me what happened with her? and i don't remember the scene with Rachel and Olive from earlier. any help with these scenes would be so great. i would be so grateful. or are there private messages?

[MuuMuuChainsmoker]

He tells Rachel's mother: "Rachel is really sick again and we need to do something about it."  Rachel's previous interactions with her mom suggest that the mom has boundary problems as she keeps wanting to diagnose and treat her own daughter for whatever mental illness the mom thinks she has that week.  There was also the suggestion that she was treating and way over medicating Rachel's dad.  

[Zuleikha]

I just had a chance to watch the finale. Since I always watch delayed, I'm usually spoiled for what's going to happen. I managed to hold out this time, and I'm glad I did because while I guessed the major beats with Adam and Jeremy, I didn't guess much of anything else. 

 

I thought it was perfection. The writers know these characters so well. Every time I question their choices, they pull it together. I agree that Adam's about face could have used more time and development, but at the same time, I don't have a problem filling in the pieces. Adam's a mess, and he's only known Rachel as incredibly, emotionally competent. Quinn is the master at using the truth to lie. I have no problem believing that she used the truth of Rachel's breakdown and Adam's contractual obligations to terrify him into breaking things off with Rachel. The giveaway was Adam's line about the relationship being heroin and he could handle it if it was him, but not Rachel. Adam accepted--maybe even embraced--that he could get hurt as a result of his relationship with Rachel, but he hadn't ever considered that Rachel was at real emotional or mental risk. Quinn made him think that Rachel was.

 

And of course, the beauty of Quinn is that Quinn was using the truth: Rachel was at real risk. Rachel/Adam running away would have had horrible ramifications for Rachel's life. Rachel is in legal and financial debt to Everlasting, and we know Quinn wouldn't have forgiven it. Adam couldn't really give Rachel the world because Adam is the tabloid fodder, disgraced, and if I remember correctly, actually disinherited son of the Cromwell family. Maybe Adam has enough money in a trust fund or the like that he could finance a year or even five years, but not enough money that he can keep the real world at bay. (and Adam did finally sign contracts, so he may be in legal and financial debt to Everlasting as well)  

 

I don't think Chet/Quinn or Rachel/Adam are done, though... at least not if Freddy Stroma decides to sign on for another season. There are genuine feelings in both couples. I think with less time pressure, Rachel/Adam may be able to move on and forgive each other. Chet/Quinn are harder to say. 

 

Jeremy's problem is that he's a lying, cheat who neverthless thinks that Rachel's note was right and she doesn't deserve him. I could not believe that ending. But it did give me confidence that the show's staff is ready to commit to the full-on Jeremy is a douchecanoe POV, which I am on board with. Even as a villain, I don't find him that interesting, so I don't want a huge amount of next season taken up with him. But I do want Rachel to get one good speech to his face where she calls him out on his self-centered BS. 

 

I still wish we got a bit more of who Grace was outside of their show roles. Grace demonstrated so much pain, anger, and resentment at how she was cast. I wish we got see the full three-dimensional picture of who she is.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Zuleikha

[TheodoraK]

muumuu, thank you sooo much for the reply. that makes so much sense. it explains Rachel's behavior so well. and jeremy is a raging asshole. you just do NOT stoop that low now matter how much you're been hurt.

[pennben]

 

Quinn wasn't lying when she says Rachel can seduce anyone, this is why she loves having her as her right hand.

 

 

I also don't think it's an accident that Rachel's last big conversation with another character (Quinn) is in a similar setting (a pair of loungers) to the one in which we first witnessed the extent of her talent for manipulation.

 

I agree with both of these points, it's why Rachel's declaration of love to Quinn was so scary in the same sense as when Michael kissed Fredo right before telling him "I know it was you".  Things are going to happen next season!  Bring it on!

[Crisopera]

Doesn't The Bachelor/Bachelorette do some kind of post-mortem episode where the rejected candidates bitch about each other?  I would love to see something like that.

[Black Knight]

After all the lies Rachel told her I'm surprised Anna didn't recognise Rachel's reveal of Adam for the connivance it genuinely was. Anna could have used the live broadcast to not only skewer Adam but also the producers. Missed opportunity. And I thought she was supposed to be the smart one.

Britney had called the producers - well, Chet specifically - out earlier in the episode, and I think that showed why skewering producers doesn't really work that well. Viewers tend to feel that if you are going on an established reality TV show, you know what you are getting yourself into, so don't cry about it if you get a bad edit, etc., because you knew that could happen when you agreed to come on. Someone like Anna, who comes off as very smart and worldly, especially can't get away with this type of complaining. If you notice, when she was skewering Adam she knew not to plead naivete or a broken heart, because again, viewers tend to think that "Duh, he has a reputation as a playboy, and then he comes on this show where he dates a bunch of women, and you're surprised that he's still a playboy? Don't tell us you only had this realization ten minutes before the wedding." Instead she said that the final straw was that he turned out to be dumb.

 

The only contestant who could maybe call out the producers without having it blow back on her is Faith, because Breeda Wool was excellent at conveying the baby bird aspect of Faith, where she's clearly truly naive and yet people, even very hard-bitten people, don't fault her for being that way and instead feel protective. But Faith is also about the only one who had anything approaching a decent experience on the show - other than the virgin stuff early, she wasn't subjected to the same producer hijinks and of course Rachel really went out of her way to help Faith - so even if she had been in this episode and in a position to call out producers, I doubt she would have.

 

Anna's reaction when she looked up the steps and saw how Quinn had set up the cameras was just amazing. Fantastic job on the actress's part. It was a blend of rueful resignation (that the show is what it is, the cameras are there and the producers want their reaction and they're going to get it no matter what, she can't escape until she gives them one) and vindictive glee (because she knew she was going to be able to have her say and portray herself and her situation exactly how she wanted and give Adam a huge helping of humiliation). I also loved Quinn's "Ugh, I'm too old for this" as she chased Anna.

 

And we get confirmation of the real OTP of this show, but of course not in a happy, hopeful sort of way, instead a very UnREAL-ish vibe: Quinn and Rachel, exchanging "I love you"s, but both so depressed and resigned at how terrible they and their lives are. Rachel's ILY especially was perfect, in the way it came about - here Quinn is, a horrible person who has continually fucked Rachel's life up (although Quinn is also correct that Rachel has made plenty of her own mistakes, and Rachel also knows that Quinn's actions doesn't excuse Adam's reaction), and yet...there's no doubt Quinn means it when she says she will have Jeremy's head if he fucks with Rachel. (RIP Jeremy - since of course we see that he's...fucking with Rachel.) No wonder Rachel's feelings are so completely conflicted when it comes to Quinn. She wishes she could have Quinn's protectiveness and approval without the manipulation and control. And Quinn sees Rachel too much as an extension of herself to ever stop those latter two things. These two will never quit each other, and I love it.

 

I don't know where Jeremy gets the nerve to humiliate Rachel for cheating on him in front of the same crew that was working with the fiancee he was cheating on with Rachel. Is that really the audience you want to have for your big stance as the good-guy-who's-been-done-wrong? I guess his ex-fiancee quit the show after being dumped - if only she had been there to witness that and get her two cents in!

[portfino]

 

The giveaway was Adam's line about the relationship being heroin and he could handle it if it was him, but not Rachel. Adam accepted--maybe even embraced--that he could get hurt as a result of his relationship with Rachel, but he hadn't ever considered that Rachel was at real emotional or mental risk. Quinn made him think that Rachel was.

This is true. I'm still not sure I buy all of Adam's actions 100%. He wouldn't tell her this at the plane or the confessional? Or when he asked if there were no hard feelings between them? I do think they could fill in that Quinn told him that Rachel could get suicidal which would tie in with the Mary thing.

 

Also, I'm less impressed with Anna's final speech than everyone else. She was there for Adam's money and the dig that Adam was dumb came out of nowhere.

Edited August 5, 2015 by portfino

[xqueenfrostine]

I don't know where Jeremy gets the nerve to humiliate Rachel for cheating on him in front of the same crew that was working with the fiancee he was cheating on with Rachel. Is that really the audience you want to have for your big stance as the good-guy-who's-been-done-wrong? I guess his ex-fiancee quit the show after being dumped - if only she had been there to witness that and get her two cents in!

TVline.com actually asked the creators about the fate of Lizzy and whether or not she still worked for Everlasting and they confirmed that Lizzy is still on set and that we don't see her because she's avoiding Rachel. So I guess Lizzy's been hiding out in the same spot Dr. Wagerstein hides when the plot doesn't need her. So we can count airing his dirty laundry while his ex in still on set as yet another way Jeremy is a douchebag.

Also, I'm less impressed with Anna's final speech than everyone else. She was there for Adam's money and the dig that Adam was dumb came out of nowhere.

I've never gotten the impression that Anna was a gold-digger (she seems to come from privilege herself). I think she was just in love with the fairy tale. Edited August 5, 2015 by xqueenfrostine

[Neurochick]

I'm trying to figure out and process who did what to whom. 

 

So, Quinn figured out that Chet had screwed her when she realized the network didn't want to talk to her, even though they'd told her earlier they liked her idea.  Was it then that she and Rachel decided to fuck with the whole show?  

 

I think this is what happened:

 

Rachel wanted Anna because Grace was willing to marry Adam despite him being a man/whore/child.  All she wanted was publicity for her swimsuit line.  Rachel and Quinn didn't want that, they wanted a bombshell.  So they got Adam's grandmother to say racist shit about Grace (and I didn't appreciate that nasty, racist shit either) to Adam, to steer him back to Anna.  Then Rachel drags Adam into the confessional to ask him what she did to make him not want to run off with her, knowing Anna was in the next confessional.  That made Anna say, "fuck all of you," and she left Adam at the altar.  

 

I'm confused.  Why did Rachel and Quinn want to screw Adam, tell him there would be no "Royal Renovations?"  At that time Rachel didn't know that Quinn told Adam that she was "crazy" so what was her motive then, revenge?  Or was she just following Quinn?  

[pennben]

Both were unsettled recent dumpees (if you will) when Rachel proposed to Quinn to blow up the finale.Quinn wanted to screw Chet and show the bigwig that blew her off that she was the one who made the show work.  Rachel wanted to screw Adam because he dumped her.  Neither cared if it was Grace or Anna that screwed up Adam, Anna became the default when Grace wouldn't buy into what Rachel was selling. Grandma was brought in to make Adam back away from choosing Grace (who had proposed, shall we say, an open marriage, which Adam was prepared to accept) and steer him to Anna. Rachel knew she could manipulate Anna, unlike Grace. 

 

At the point of the decision to have an epic finale, Rachel didn't know Quinn was the cause of Adam dumping Rachel, otherwise I doubt she would have teamed up with Quinn.  She didn't learn of Quinn's involvement in Adam backing away from her until, I believe, the confession in the confessional.

 

ETA:  I'm a little embarrassed that I just typed all of that with a straight face, oh, this show.....

Edited August 5, 2015 by pennben

[Athena]

While the acting from Shiri and Constance were really good in this episode, I'm not sure I loved the finale. In retrospect, it almost felt anticlimactic. I didn't like Jeremy before and I like him less now so I look forward to his downfall next season. As for Adam, I'm not surprised either, but I agree there was something flatter about him in this episode. Is this really the end of Adam/Freddie on this show? Doubtful, but they just sorta wrote him dangling there. Oh, well.

 

I understand that the OTP in this show is truly Rachel/Quinn. That is the central relationship, but it really is like watching a slow trainwreck. I find the relationship toxic. In her own way, Quinn enables Rachel's bad qualities. Rachel seeks approval from a loving mother figure and friend and she gets Quinn. Quinn sees herself in Rachel, but I don't buy that they are exactly the same at all. Rachel is very manipulative, and she does have issues being invested in people. However, it doesn't mean she's bipolar or mentally ill as her mother thinks. I'm not sure I love watching the two women like this. I see how they do care for and love each other, but is it really healthier than the relationship they have with the men in their lives?

 

In any case, I will watch next season if not for Shiri Appleby's continued come back. I knew she had this kind of talent in her on "Roswell" and I'm glad she's getting a chance to lead a show.

[xqueenfrostine]

I'm confused. Why did Rachel and Quinn want to screw Adam, tell him there would be no "Royal Renovations?" At that time Rachel didn't know that Quinn told Adam that she was "crazy" so what was her motive then, revenge? Or was she just following Quinn?

She wasn't following Quinn because it was Rachel's idea. I think it's obvious that she was initially devastated that Adam blew her off given the raccoon eyes she was sporting when she walked in Quinn's office for the first time after being dumped. Now whether she was devastated because of her feelings for Adam or because she blew up her life for an opportunity is up to interpretation, but either way I don't think Rachel wanted to be EP on a show focusing on the man who spurned her next year and she probably didn't want to watch him play happy fiancée or husband to a contestant either.

I think Quinn bought into the idea because she knew Brad would be on set and that this would be a great opportunity to prove that she's the real player in the game, not Chet.

[bref]

Hey, can someone help out a sister with increasingly bad eyesight and a smallish TV? What did Rachel's note to Jeremy say?

 

Thanks in advance. :)

[dubbel zout]

Basically, "I'm sorry, I can't, don't hate me."

[xqueenfrostine]

I think it just said "I don't deserve you."

[Bort]

Hey, can someone help out a sister with increasingly bad eyesight and a smallish TV? What did Rachel's note to Jeremy say?

 

Thanks in advance. :)

I don't deserve you!

…is what the note said.

[basically]

Heaven help the the woman who "deserves" Jeremy lol.....

[Glade]

I think it was pretty obvious that Quinn/others would have gotten to Adam, if not with lies, then real threats of lawsuits for breach of contract.  Adam was in a heavily monitored place when he tried to escape.  So I don't buy that it took Rachel the whole episode to figure this out.  Apparently the charges/lawsuit that was pinning Rachel against the wall have now vanished into thin air?  It wasn't really spelled out.

 

I had been picturing that Rachel would step into the frame and marry Adam at the live wedding instead of the other girls, and that next season she would act as star/producer of that spinoff show which apparently won't happen?  Color me disappointed if there's no Adam and no different show being covered next season; more everlasting would get old really quickly.  In that last scene, after the talk of murder, when Quinn's lip started to quiver I was waiting for her to drop the glass and go into convulsions due to the poison that Rachel slipped into it.  That would have been more fun.  But I can see that the relationship with Quinn would feel familiar/loving, given the emotionally abusive family relationships Rachel grew up with.

 

Apparently the character Quinn is supposed to be younger then the actress playing her.  I don't buy that she looked like Madison fifteen years ago or that it's so easy for her to get pregnant she needs emergency contraceptives.

Edited August 6, 2015 by Glade

[rubyred]

Jeremy is so trifling I don't think they even need to show him next season, just namecheck his downfall. He's not interesting enough to weave a plot around.

 

And unfortunately we've seen that Quinn isn't always great at the long game; she showed her hand with Madison too soon which gave Chet time to protect himself. I was surprised that she did that, I had been hoping to see an epic showdown but it went flat because she was in a rush, I guess.

 

My guess for Quinn's spiel to Adam: lawsuit, Rachel wuz hospitalized, Mary just killed herself are you sure you want to take on a psychologically volatile relationship, lawsuit, say goodbye to the vineyard ,lawsuit, Rachel broke down last year, I will grind you into the dust on national television you limey piece of shit. Paraphrasing.

[Zuleikha]

I don't buy that she looked like Madison fifteen years ago or that it's so easy for her to get pregnant she needs emergency contraceptives.

If she hasn't gone through menopause, she can potentially get pregnant. Sure, the odds are against it, but Quinn's not the type to take chances. 

 

I was surprised that she did that, I had been hoping to see an epic showdown but it went flat because she was in a rush, I guess.

I think Quinn correctly estimated Madison but didn't consider the Dr. Wagerstein complication (and really, why/how could she?) but also Quinn's emotions were making her off her game. We saw that happen before with Chet and the lawsuit, where it took the pep talk from Shia to get Quinn to realize what she should do. 

[queenanne]

I thought that was a little over the top in disbelief.  It would be one thing if we had more reason to believe the crew would do that to Chet, than them simply cheering at the party when Jeremy said Rachel was snubbing him [Chet] – the head of the network (? at least, I think that's Brad) is there, who’s going to do the passive-aggressive nonsense of pretending they think Chet means to shoot the actual actors’ toes on the red carpet? – and during the episode, it became a real sincere question for me, why any of these actor-contestants would continue to believe any word that fell from Rachel’s lips, even if she told them turds were brown.

 

Also, I don’t know if this accounts for some folks’ registering of differences, but I felt like they did something special with lighting, makeup, or similar to make Freddie Stroma look particularly young (and thus, I guess, vulnerable) in this episode.  Which they might very well do nothing with next season – just thought it was interesting. 

Edited August 6, 2015 by queenanne

[dubbel zout]

emergency contraceptives.

Better safe than sorry. And the earlier she takes care of it, the better.

[Neurochick]

I can't believe Rachel wanted to screw with Adam because he dumped her.  What a witch.  She was, after all cheating on her boyfriend.  Rachel was just plain stupid if she thought Adam would run away with her.  I mean the guy was a whore, and Rachel thought she was "the one."  I thought she was smarter than that.  

[algebra]

Watching it last night I felt like I was watching Emma Woodhouse on steroids.

Better safe than sorry. And the earlier she takes care of it, the better.

[algebra]

The thing is, she's 45 years old and childless. (Or is she supposed to be in her 30s? )Anyway, by that age, if you do or do not want children, your decision has nothing to do with your relationship with the sperm donor. Mostly because by the time you are in your forties, very few of your friends are still married to the fathers of their children anyway. So it seems she had previously told Chet she wanted a baby, but after deciding he's a jerk she changed her mind.

Not that anything else on this show makes sense, but that's my opinion of the emergency contraception thing. Chet being a jerk she doesn't want to be married to should have any effect on her decision.

[Neurochick]

Why do people say child-less rather than child-free?

 

I never really thought Quinn wanted a baby.  Some people have children because they feel they're "supposed" to.

Edited August 6, 2015 by Neurochick

[Black Knight]

I understand that the OTP in this show is truly Rachel/Quinn. That is the central relationship, but it really is like watching a slow trainwreck. I find the relationship toxic. In her own way, Quinn enables Rachel's bad qualities. Rachel seeks approval from a loving mother figure and friend and she gets Quinn. Quinn sees herself in Rachel, but I don't buy that they are exactly the same at all. Rachel is very manipulative, and she does have issues being invested in people. However, it doesn't mean she's bipolar or mentally ill as her mother thinks. I'm not sure I love watching the two women like this. I see how they do care for and love each other, but is it really healthier than the relationship they have with the men in their lives?

Of course not, but this is UnREAL. I like the fact that the OTP is messed up in a way that is in keeping with the spirit of the show.

 

Neurochick, I don't have children because I don't want children, but I don't say either childless or childfree. The former implies I find my life lacking as a result, the latter makes it sound like I think my life is superior to the lives of those who have children. So I avoid both terms, as neither is how I feel. The question of whether to have children is objectively neutral in my eyes - it's no better to choose one than the other. Everyone should just choose what works for themselves. And I agree, Quinn does not want children, even before she found out about Chet and Madison. She looked decidedly lukewarm/noncommittal every time Chet brought it up.

Edited August 6, 2015 by Black Knight

[xqueenfrostine]

Of course not, but this is UnREAL. I like the fact that the OTP is messed up in a way that is in keeping with the spirit of the show.

Neurochick, I don't have children because I don't want children, but I don't say either childless or childfree. The former implies I find my life lacking as a result, the latter makes it sound like I think my life is superior to the lives of those who have children. So I avoid both terms, as neither is how I feel.

So much agreed. I've never liked the us vs. them quality of the childfree label. As someone who is happy without having kids of my own as well as an extremely doting aunt to two small children, childfree has been as poor as a fit to me as childless.

As for Quinn taking emergency contraception being unbelievable, come on now. Unplanned pregnancies can happen in your late 30s and 40s. Chet just unexpectedly knocked up his ex-wife earlier this season, who we know is a few years older than Quinn. Of course she's not in the mood to take any chances on that front, especially not right as she was planning on leaving Chet.

[aradia22]

I was super curious about what Quinn told Adam.

 

Does Anna sleep in that much makeup?

 

Quinn pretty much spelled out everything that's been said on the boards for weeks. She didn't expect total fidelity but she'd started falling for the fairytale and what Chet did was a much more dramatic betrayal than he considered it to be.

 

That interaction where Adam was talking to Rachel about Britney coming back... he seemed so shallow and oblivious. For all the depth they tried to build it seemed to reaffirm that he was the same guy from the first few episodes. Also, those lines seemed weirdly ADR'ed.

 

For all of Rachel's superpowers, it's interesting how quickly the girls turn on her. Grace is holding strong now but how many times this season have we seen someone resist her because they know how manipulative she is. I don't know how you sustain Everlasting as a show that airs week to week where these girls get burned repeatedly and yet the machine keeps going. 

 

LOVED Adam's grandma.

 

Wait, is Anna still the villain?

 

UGH. Now that Shia's gone, Jeremy is THE WORST. Whatever they were hoping for in the beginning, they screwed it up. I'm more inclined to believe the psychiatrist that he's bad for her. Their relationship seems entirely about sexual chemistry. And he repeatedly makes her feel awful about herself. The stunt with the fake proposal in front of everyone they worked with was enough but going to her horrible mother? UGH. What did she ever see in him?

 

So it was clear that Rachel was faking with Adam in the confessional but why didn't he try to explain or comfort her? They're writing Adam very differently all of a sudden. 

 

The wedding sequence made no sense. Even with a delay, there's no way they could coordinate that much chaos as a live show. That said, I expected a bigger explosion. I wanted Empire. UnReal always pulls their punches.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about the weird tense bonding ending with Rachel and Quinn. It's a more neutral place to go into season 2 but I kind of wish they'd give me more to anticipate like having Adam still in the picture or knowing what show Rachel and Quinn will pitch to the network.

[Black Knight]

I'm not sure how I feel about the weird tense bonding ending with Rachel and Quinn. It's a more neutral place to go into season 2 but I kind of wish they'd give me more to anticipate like having Adam still in the picture or knowing what show Rachel and Quinn will pitch to the network.

I'm guessing this was filmed before they knew they'd get a S2? It wrapped things up enough that if there hadn't been a S2, we wouldn't have been left hanging - we'd be feeling that it would have been good to know what happened next for Rachel, Quinn and others, but not critical. We know that they both realized their guys are garbage, we know that they're stuck working reality TV for at least another year, we know that their dysfunctional OTP will continue. Adam is back at the point he started this season, a scandal-ridden playboy, so it's not hard to guess that he'll continue his womanizing ways while working to make a go of his resort spa winery gig. It's wrapped up well enough. Yes, there was technically a "cliffhanger," but viewers know well enough that Jeremy is totally out of his depth with Quinn. So while it'll be fun to see that play out, and I'm glad that we're going to get to see that, it's not like we would have lost sleep wondering if Jeremy might actually triumph in his attempt to destroy (what's left of) Rachel's life.

 

So it was clear that Rachel was faking with Adam in the confessional but why didn't he try to explain or comfort her? They're writing Adam very differently all of a sudden.

 

He was mere minutes away from the start of his live TV wedding - nobody, even someone a lot nicer than Adam, who is minutes away from their live TV wedding is going to expend any time on the conversation with Rachel because there's no way to wrap that shit up quickly. You engage, you're letting yourself in for an hour, minimum, of drama. (Of course Rachel wouldn't have actually allowed it to go that far, because her goal was to get Adam dumped on live TV, but Adam didn't know what Rachel was really up to.)

 

I don't think they wrote Adam differently at all. I think, rather, that much like Quinn with Chet, there are people who thought Adam might be more than what he is, who started buying into the idea of some kind of fairytale between him and Rachel, because that's what we're used to getting from TV, the good-looking bad boy with a heart of gold who turns out to be an awesome partner for the female lead. But in reality he's basically Chet Jr. (Chet has had his good moments too.)

[Zuleikha]

I don't think they wrote Adam differently at all.

I think they did in at least one regard: Adam's demeanor with Jeremy. I don't think Adam would have been so meek and apologetic with Jeremy. I don't think that's Adam's character, but also Adam really didn't do anything wrong and I don't think he would have seen himself as having done so. Adam and Rachel started while Jeremy was engaged to Lizzie.

 

And even when Rachel initiated sex with Adam, Rachel and Jeremy weren't really together. Jeremy assumed they were because he had decided they should be, but as I recall, Rachel never said they were. She didn't really respond to Jeremy's instructions to meet him in the truck. So IMHO, Adam did not wrong Jeremy in any way. If anything, Jeremy wronged Adam since Jeremy was fully aware there was some kind of thing going on between Adam and Rachel at all of the times Jeremy initiated things with Rachel.

 

So I think Adam as previously written would have been snarky and defiant with Jeremy, not all I deserve-to-be-punched-by-you. 

 

In one of the writer interviews I saw (Marti Nixon, I think), she said she thought Jeremy deserved to humiliate Rachel because of all the sh*t Rachel put him through. I really hope the writers watch or rewatch the series before starting S2 because I don't think Rachel put Jeremy through anything. Jeremy behaved badly and torpedoed his relationships all on his own. IMHO, Jeremy really is the worst. He's so entitled. He's such a classic Nice Guy.

[AnnaRose]

I think they did in at least one regard: Adam's demeanor with Jeremy. I don't think Adam would have been so meek and apologetic with Jeremy. I don't think that's Adam's character, but also Adam really didn't do anything wrong and I don't think he would have seen himself as having done so. Adam and Rachel started while Jeremy was engaged to Lizzie.

 

And even when Rachel initiated sex with Adam, Rachel and Jeremy weren't really together. Jeremy assumed they were because he had decided they should be, but as I recall, Rachel never said they were. She didn't really respond to Jeremy's instructions to meet him in the truck. So IMHO, Adam did not wrong Jeremy in any way. If anything, Jeremy wronged Adam since Jeremy was fully aware there was some kind of thing going on between Adam and Rachel at all of the times Jeremy initiated things with Rachel.

 

So I think Adam as previously written would have been snarky and defiant with Jeremy, not all I deserve-to-be-punched-by-you. 

 

In one of the writer interviews I saw (Marti Nixon, I think), she said she thought Jeremy deserved to humiliate Rachel because of all the sh*t Rachel put him through. I really hope the writers watch or rewatch the series before starting S2 because I don't think Rachel put Jeremy through anything. Jeremy behaved badly and torpedoed his relationships all on his own. IMHO, Jeremy really is the worst. He's so entitled. He's such a classic Nice Guy.

 

 

Maybe Adam was thinking back to the way Jeremy pummeled Mary's ex-husband and didn't want to be next.

 

I think I read the article you're referring to regarding the Marti Noxon quote, and I too was taken aback that she seemed to see Jeremy as a much better guy than he is, implying that Rachel deserved the fake proposal crap.  Marti really needs to go back and watch the whole season again.  I felt like Jeremy was The Worst even before Shia left the show... so that is saying something!  

 

I also hated how Jeremy behaved after breaking up with his fiance, telling Rachel to meet him back in her truck and it was going to be good or whatever.  She never even agreed to get back with him.   He was so assuming and arrogant.  Yuck.   I was so glad when Rachel stood him up, especially since she never even agreed in the first place.  It seemed incomprehensible to "Nice Guy" Jeremy that Rachel wouldn't be falling all over herself to get back with him.

 

I thought Jeremy's fiance seemed to be a very sweet person, and I hated how callously he cheated on her.   I hated the way he seemed to string Rachel along, only to put her down every chance he got.   He is a future abusive husband in the making.   I will be really pissed off if the show takes the stance that he is morally superior somehow.  He is not.  And it's so much worse because he thinks he is.

[aradia22]

 

I'm guessing this was filmed before they knew they'd get a S2? It wrapped things up enough that if there hadn't been a S2, we wouldn't have been left hanging - we'd be feeling that it would have been good to know what happened next for Rachel, Quinn and others, but not critical.

That's a good point. I forget if this was supposed to be a limited series. I forgot to keep up with the Lizzie Borden Chronicles so I never saw the last episode. I guess I'm just used to shows that are on the bubble or are just trying for a season 2 to swing for the fences (e.g. Empire, Alphas, Chuck). I wonder if they would have done things differently (particularly with Adam) knowing they'd have a second season.

 

I don't think they wrote Adam differently at all. I think, rather, that much like Quinn with Chet, there are people who thought Adam might be more than what he is, who started buying into the idea of some kind of fairytale between him and Rachel, because that's what we're used to getting from TV, the good-looking bad boy with a heart of gold who turns out to be an awesome partner for the female lead. But in reality he's basically Chet Jr. (Chet has had his good moments too.)

Agree to disagree. I didn't believe they'd be good together but I thought the actors had chemistry (acting chemistry vs. Jeremy who is a plank of wood) making me root for them to have scenes together, romantic or otherwise. I just feel like from a writing standpoint and as someone who has watched many inconsistent soaps (Glee, Ugly Betty, Nashville, Empire) this felt like an abrupt turn. I think they could have sold it if they'd had time to develop it (like a 13 episode season vs. a 10 episode season) but I also think it wouldn't have happened this way because having this rushed confrontation in the confessional made no sense except to have Anna overhear it. It was cheap and expedient as a device when they've been selling Rachel to us as a master manipulator.

 

In one of the writer interviews I saw (Marti Nixon, I think), she said she thought Jeremy deserved to humiliate Rachel because of all the sh*t Rachel put him through. I really hope the writers watch or rewatch the series before starting S2 because I don't think Rachel put Jeremy through anything. Jeremy behaved badly and torpedoed his relationships all on his own. IMHO, Jeremy really is the worst. He's so entitled. He's such a classic Nice Guy.

Agreed. If they feel that way I hope they take a hard look at the characters they actually wrote. Jeremy can say the word "love" a million times but he cheated on his fiance, he constantly makes the woman he supposedly loves feel bad about herself, and the rest of the time he either reacts with violence or by thinking with what's in his pants. It makes the relationship Rachel thought she had with him (i.e. all the stuff in the video) seem like a delusion.

[portfino]

 

 

I don't think they wrote Adam differently at all. I think, rather, that much like Quinn with Chet, there are people who thought Adam might be more than what he is, who started buying into the idea of some kind of fairytale between him and Rachel, because that's what we're used to getting from TV, the good-looking bad boy with a heart of gold who turns out to be an awesome partner for the female lead. But in reality he's basically Chet Jr. (Chet has had his good moments too.)

I disagree completely. I don't think anyone thought Adam was perfect. He banged the investor's wife in front of Chet. He's a narcissist. Anyone who thought he and Rachel would have a functional relationship without A LOT of work is fooling themselves.

 

But he always wanted to get out of his family's shadow, he was willing to do a wedding so Rachel's relationship with Jeremy wouldn't be blown up, he doesn't trust Quinn, and he wouldn't think that a mentally unstable woman whose heart he just broke had "no hard feelings." There is no way to reconcile that character with his actions in the finale.

[Black Knight]

But portofino, as you said, Adam is a narcissist. This is what happens with a narcissist. They have their moments of sacrifice and love and all - they can have pretty big moments, in fact - but they revert back to type easily. It can seem abrupt if one doesn't have a lot of experience with a narcissist, but this is pretty classic.

 

As Rachel pointed out, the reason Adam fell for what Quinn said is because at bottom he wanted to believe it. He made a big fairytale speech to Rachel in the heat of the moment, but he started thinking better of it. He didn't want to give up everything that he would've given up by leaving with Rachel. He's certainly not all bad, but his good moments influenced a lot of people to think he was better than what he is. I never said that anyone thought he was perfect - just more than what he is, which is Chet Jr.