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5 hours ago, Brattinella said:

They changed the killers' names to protect them when they released them on parole.  They have since committed more crimes, and they are STILL protecting these monsters.  The murdered boy's name was Jamie Bulger.

I remember reading about this awhile back, I thought one of them hadn't committed anything more and one is in and out of prison? 

England (and Canada) seem to do this with a lot of criminals (definitely kids, not sure about too many adults). Didn't some writer commit a a murder with her childhood friend, the other girl's  mom, and when she got out she got a new name? And Karla Homolka got a new name when she got out too. 

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13 hours ago, callie lee 29 said:

Didn't some writer commit a a murder with her childhood friend, the other girl's  mom, and when she got out she got a new name?

 You might be thinking of Anne Perry.  She wasn't given a new name by the authorities, but she did change her name from Juliet Hulme.

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2 hours ago, Josette said:

 You might be thinking of Anne Perry.  She wasn't given a new name by the authorities, but she did change her name from Juliet Hulme.

Five years for premeditated murder? Jeez.

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2 hours ago, Josette said:

 You might be thinking of Anne Perry.  She wasn't given a new name by the authorities, but she did change her name from Juliet Hulme.

Ahh, okay. I knew there was a name change, didn't realize it was of her own volition. Thanks!

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I saw a show last night regarding a Canadian murderer.  His name was Shearer, and he ambushed a family group camping in the woods.  He executed mom, dad, grandma and grandpa, and put their bodies in their car.  Then he stole the grandparent's truck and took the two little girls away for 9-10 days for more fun.  Then he killed them, too, of course,  Put them in the trunk of the car and torched the car and the truck.  He received, for 6 murders and two lengthy rapes, 25 years minimum.  He has been up for parole several times, I hope he never gets out.  BTW, he changed his last name in prison to his mom's maiden name, Ennis.  Probably to confuse future parole boards.

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I was reading an article about Canadian and UK jails/prisons.   Good grief, apparently the system for truly evil rotten people is a problem everywhere!

As far as that miscreant from Colorado- the 2nd one recently!, wasn't it pretty obvious from the get go that the fiance who lived on 20 acres and took their baby from her right before her disappearance was the culprit?? 

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I checked my recordings to decide what to watch later.  I have 6 episodes of Crimes of the Century recorded which I've never seen ,  so I'm going to watch the episode on Andrea Yates.  I basically just remember how deranged she was and how SHOCKED I was at the time.  

Edited by Rdh1314 · Reason: Save for after dinner
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5 minutes ago, Jordan61 said:

I wonder if ratings drop when they start putting ASPCA commercials in heavy rotation? It sure as shit makes me change the channel.

Well, those commercials seem very long compared to most commercials, and they are just so depressing seeing the poor animals.   I could see someone changing the channel. 

Lol, I kind of feel the same way about the Subaru "feel the love" commercials- I'm so sick of them!  No offense to Subaru owners!

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52 minutes ago, Jordan61 said:

I wonder if ratings drop when they start putting ASPCA commercials in heavy rotation? It sure as shit makes me change the channel.

I always mute, then change the channel for a minute or so.  We donate regularly to animal causes.  I REALLY don't need or want to see animals in pain EVER.

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2 hours ago, Rdh1314 said:

I was reading an article about Canadian and UK jails/prisons.   Good grief, apparently the system for truly evil rotten people is a problem everywhere!

As far as that miscreant from Colorado- the 2nd one recently!, wasn't it pretty obvious from the get go that the fiance who lived on 20 acres and took their baby from her right before her disappearance was the culprit?? 

Oh, yes, definitely. He's the last one to see her alive, he has their baby, and the only time anyone hears from her after that is via text messages? Plus nothing in his demeaner showed he was worried, concerned or scared about what happened to his fiancée, zero signs he was looking for her, she was missing for 10 days and he wasn't the one who reported her missing. I'm sure he thought he was smarter then Watts by not going on TV and badly pleading for her return while showing all signs he killed her. But no, it still all points to you.

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1 hour ago, andromeda331 said:

Oh, yes, definitely. He's the last one to see her alive, he has their baby, and the only time anyone hears from her after that is via text messages? Plus nothing in his demeaner showed he was worried, concerned or scared about what happened to his fiancée, zero signs he was looking for her, she was missing for 10 days and he wasn't the one who reported her missing. I'm sure he thought he was smarter then Watts by not going on TV and badly pleading for her return while showing all signs he killed her. But no, it still all points to you.

It just makes it even worse- if possible! - because he was allowed to take "care" of the baby.  I don't get that.  Wasn't there anyone else who could have cared for the child during that period of time?

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Something that I think of when hearing about sentencing, is that sometimes when someone is charged with multiple crimes, a decision will be made that because the perp has been convicted of one of the crimes, that they don't need to prosecute the others (especially when the murders took place across multiple jurisdictions).   And I think about how you never know what will happen with that conviction -- some get overturned, some people get released because of overcrowding, some people get early release for good behavior, and some get parole on the early side of the sentence.  Likewise with agreeing to offer concurrent sentencing rather than consecutive.  These decisions can really backfire.

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8 hours ago, callie lee 29 said:

Ahh, okay. I knew there was a name change, didn't realize it was of her own volition. Thanks!

They gave her a name change of Anne Steward (in New Zealand) but she later changed her surname to that of her stepfather when she moved to Scotland.

Edited by Sile
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12 hours ago, Sile said:

They gave her a name change of Anne Steward (in New Zealand) but she later changed her surname to that of her stepfather when she moved to Scotland.

That's interesting, but I can't find any reference to it. I only found mention of both of them changing their names via deed poll, which seems to simply be a personal choice.  Maybe I'm wrong.

Edited by Josette · Reason: added link

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20 hours ago, Brattinella said:

I saw a show last night regarding a Canadian murderer.  His name was Shearer, and he ambushed a family group camping in the woods.  He executed mom, dad, grandma and grandpa, and put their bodies in their car.  Then he stole the grandparent's truck and took the two little girls away for 9-10 days for more fun.  Then he killed them, too, of course,  Put them in the trunk of the car and torched the car and the truck.  He received, for 6 murders and two lengthy rapes, 25 years minimum.  He has been up for parole several times, I hope he never gets out.  BTW, he changed his last name in prison to his mom's maiden name, Ennis.  Probably to confuse future parole boards.

I hope that investigating officer lives a very long and healthy life.  He attends every parole hearing, even since retirement, and did the show just to keep the horror of these crimes fresh in the Canadian public's minds.

BTW, the show was "The Case that Haunts Me".  

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I don't intend to blame the families of victims, but, I really do get frustrated when I see stories of murder victims that include, 10 year-old children who go to with parent's permission to play at the river, 13 year-old girls walking alone on secluded nature trails at night, 5 year old children on their own roaming throughout a neighborhood playing, etc. I just don't get it. 

I've heard that Court TV is returning to some stations in some cities.  I don't think it includes my area though.  

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3 hours ago, Josette said:

That's interesting, but I can't find any reference to it. I only found mention of both of them changing their names via deed poll, which seems to simply be a personal choice.  Maybe I'm wrong.

Hmmm...interesting link..

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42 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I don't intend to blame the families of victims, but, I really do get frustrated when I see stories of murder victims that include, 10 year-old children who go to with parent's permission to play at the river, 13 year-old girls walking alone on secluded nature trails at night, 5 year old children on their own roaming throughout a neighborhood playing, etc. I just don't get it

I've heard that Court TV is returning to some stations in some cities.  I don't think it includes my area though.  

I know.  That's one of the horrific things about the little 2 year old in England.  His mom just let go of his hand for a couple of seconds.  And look what happened.   It only takes a few seconds for someone to be abducted.  You would think that caring, loving, responsible adults would NEVER let their kids do the things that apparently many kids are allowed to do. 

I heard that Jerry Springer is going to be the Judge for Court TV.  THAT should be quite the zoo.

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8 minutes ago, Rdh1314 said:

I know.  That's one of the horrific things about the little 2 year old in England.  His mom just let go of his hand for a couple of seconds.  And look what happened.   It only takes a few seconds for someone to be abducted.  You would think that caring, loving, responsible adults would NEVER let their kids do the things that apparently many kids are allowed to do. 

I heard that Jerry Springer is going to be the Judge for Court TV.  THAT should be quite the zoo.

Oh, I didn't realize it was THAT kind of court tv. I thought it was like the old court tv where they air live criminal trials.  They used to have spokesman outside the courtroom interviewing various people and a studio person who gives updates too. like Beth Caras and Dan Abrams. 

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19 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Oh, I didn't realize it was THAT kind of court tv. I thought it was like the old court tv where they air live criminal trials.  They used to have spokesman outside the courtroom interviewing various people and a studio person who gives updates too. like Beth Caras and Dan Abrams. 

From what I've heard,  it's going to be like Judge Judy.  Like that's what the world needs right now....more Judge Judy-type shows. 🙄

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1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Oh, I didn't realize it was THAT kind of court tv. I thought it was like the old court tv where they air live criminal trials.  They used to have spokesman outside the courtroom interviewing various people and a studio person who gives updates too. like Beth Caras and Dan Abrams. 

This news, if true, may change my mind about watching it.

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The older crime I find hideous is the Paul Bernardo and Karla Homolka, case where together they kidnapped, raped, tortured and murdered women, including Karla drugging her own little sister as a 'present' for Paul to rape and kill.    Bernardo after 25 years in prison was up for parole in October, but wasn't approved.   

 Homolka turned state's evidence, and claimed to be terrified of Bernardo, and unfortunately, the state made a deal with her that resulted in very little time in prison.   After the deal was made, videos were found that showed that she was just as involved in everything as her husband.     Since the deal had gone through, she served about 12 years, was released in 2005, married the younger brother of her attorney, and had three kids.   

She lived in the Caribbean for a while, then returned to Canada, where it was discovered that she was volunteering at her kids' private school.      The school is a private religious school, and at first refused to stop her access to volunteering there.   Several parents who questioned her presence were told their children were not welcome back for the next school year.  The school finally released a statement that those with a criminal record couldn't volunteer there, but I really don't believe that.      The neighbors were upset when they found out who they were living next to, but I'm sure they have zero chance of selling and moving with a murderer living next door.  

It disgusts me that Bernardo's attorney had the videos for over a year before giving them to prosecutors.       

There used to be a webpage tracking Homolka, but people who posted on it were advised it was infringing on her rights, and they could be held responsible if something happened to her.   

Edited by CrazyInAlabama
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10 hours ago, walnutqueen said:

I hope that investigating officer lives a very long and healthy life.  He attends every parole hearing, even since retirement, and did the show just to keep the horror of these crimes fresh in the Canadian public's minds.

BTW, the show was "The Case that Haunts Me".  

One thing I noticed when watching the episode...there was a point where they started receiving tips about people across Canada having seen the missing truck/camper, and they immediately put great credence in the accuracy of these reports.  After having seen so many shows about missing people, and almost every supposed sighting of the missing person was false, I basically said out loud, how do you know the sightings are correct?  And sure enough, after making that big project of tracking the truck/camper's reported progress across the country, and all the publicity around the site visits, they found out that it had never left the area 

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14 hours ago, Josette said:

That's interesting, but I can't find any reference to it. I only found mention of both of them changing their names via deed poll, which seems to simply be a personal choice.  Maybe I'm wrong.

 

I read it in a book, I'm trying to remember the name or author and will update if I can find it.  The author (I think it was a she) had actual interviews with Hulme/Perry and attempted a few with Parker/Nathan.  It was very in depth and interesting.  Both of them still have some very odd situations all these years later, no matter their various denials.  There is a photo of a huge wall mural that P/N painted of H/P in her home that was found when she vacated that was equal amounts fascinating/disturbing.  Maybe even more disturbing than painting it would be why she chose not to paint over it before she left.

ETA  It was either The Search for Anne Perry or Anne Perry and the Murder of the Century.  The second title seems more familiar, but the first was written by a woman, so that was most likely the one I'm remembering.  I'm almost certain I've read of both of them and both books focus more on Perry, so it could have been mentioned in both, but I think it was probably the first one just because the author was a female.  (Of course, if you follow the 50/50/90 rule it will probably be the other one!)

Edited by Sile · Reason: to add book titles
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On ‎11‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 10:02 PM, Calamity Jane said:

So many things to wonder about in this case, but it's clear Dee Dee was a master of manipulation and knew just how to pull the strings.  

After the HBO documentary, I felt only pity and sorrow for Gypsy, and I still do, but mixed now with a feeling she really was the driving force and brains behind her mother's death.  What pushed me over to that was when she said that Nick "ordered" her to do various things during and after the attack.  He just did not have the force of personality for that to be credible to me.  If anyone was issuing orders, it's pretty clear it was Gypsy and she's trying to mitigate her responsibility for what he did.  

It doesn't change the horror of what her demented monster of a mother put her through, but it does make her more culpable than I thought after Mommy Dead and Dearest, and she's obviously more intelligent and capable of planning than she ever showed before prison.  I'm glad she's getting care and socialization in prison (who would ever think of that being possible??), and I hope she can have a somewhat normal life after she is released, but I think she will need massive and consistent care and guidance for that to happen.  On her own, I think she would just connect with grifters like her mother and continue down that path.  

I do feel sorry for Gypsy because if someone had taken her away from her mother as a child she'd be free today. Gypsy's dad didn't seem to want to confront DeeDee her own family knew that DeeDee had been raised to be manipulative but people were too passive.

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5 hours ago, Rdh1314 said:

Thank goodness I was wrong about that...I just couldn't see Jerry Springer being the spokesperson for Court TV!

I can't TELL you how happy this makes me!

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Watching Forensic Files on HLN, and right now, it’s the Hope Hall case(aspiring journalist murdered in VA).  One segment rubbed me the wrong way:  as he’s describing Hope’s body being discovered in her apartment, Peter Thomas* says “One important item was missing:  her child.”

First off, a child is not an “item.”  And it turned out to be a red herring, because after the commercial break, it’s mentioned that he was spending the summer with his dad.

*I’m obviously not faulting Mr. Thomas here, as he was reading a script.

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When I was at the grocery store waiting in line, the latest issue of In Touch Weekly was displayed with the "news" that finally authorities know who killed JonBenet Ramsey.  I tried to quickly look at the article,  but I didn't recognize the name of the alleged killer.   Is this truly something new or is that magazine just re-hashing all the speculation because of the time of the year coinciding with her murder? 

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My guess is In Touch has articles about poor JonBenet every year at this time.      It's not the first time the tabloid style magazines have 'solved' the case.   

The Anne Perry case disgusts me.    She and her friend murdered a woman because she wanted to separate them, and Anne Perry gets to have a life, and that poor murdered woman is virtually forgotten.    In a magazine interview Anne Perry said that it was as if the murder happened to someone else.    What a heartless statement, because it was someone else that was murdered, and she's lived without this being known for years.   

Edited by CrazyInAlabama
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That was at the time that the juvenile authorities considered all kids as able to be changed into solid citizens.     It should have been first degree murder, they beat the woman to death with a brick, and it was because she was sending her daughter off to a relative during the parents' divorce.   My guess is the mother thought the girls were developing a same sex relationship, and she thought that separating the girls would stop it, but that's only my personal guess.     And it wasn't just one blow, but at least 20 by both girls.    They served five years, and were released.   When Heavenly Creatures was filmed, no one connected the murderer to Anne Perry, and then it was found out where she was, and who she changed her name to.         Here's the wikipedia about it:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne_Perry

Edited by CrazyInAlabama
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I gather from google, that the Lake Erie murders, of Amy Mihalivec(?) remains unsolved.  I'll delete this unwatched.
After watching a lot of archaeology shows, on land and underwater, I wonder if police have access to, or can afford, GPR and sonar, to locate bodies?
It seems like in cases like the mesa girls, and people dumped in lakes, and buried in woods, it seems like it would help.

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There are two movies or mini series coming out about Gypsy and DeeDee. One on Lifetime stars Marcia Gay Hardin as DeeDee and will air at the end of the month. 

The other has Patricia Arquette as DeeDee, not sure when that will come out . I think it will be on premium cable. Arquette was very good as "Tilly" Michell in Escape at Danamorra.

I am looking forward to them. I hope we get some new details.

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2 hours ago, auntjess said:

I gather from google, that the Lake Erie murders, of Amy Mihalivec(?) remains unsolved.  I'll delete this unwatched.
After watching a lot of archaeology shows, on land and underwater, I wonder if police have access to, or can afford, GPR and sonar, to locate bodies?

 It is unsolved, but they are retesting some DNA and there is a possible unnamed suspect.  I thought it was interesting.  It was tragic the way her mother let her grief consume her.

There will be other murder cases covered in future episodes of the series, but Amy Mihaljevic's unsolved case was three episodes long. 

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2 hours ago, auntjess said:

I gather from google, that the Lake Erie murders, of Amy Mihalivec(?) remains unsolved.  I'll delete this unwatched.

Same. I started watching partway through the first episode and then Googled the case and saw it was unsolved, so I didn't watch the rest.

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I thought the Lake Erie series was pretty interesting and well-done. Not a lot of the "gotcha" bullshit where they build something up and then it turns out to be nothing. I think one thing the newscaster woman said at the end resonated - this is a case many are not familiar with, and something like talking about the little horsehead earrings the killer kept as a trophy could lead to something. Maybe the killer has passed on and someone came across the earrings and wondered why this person would have them, or maybe old newspaper clippings about the crime were kept by the killer and someone saw them among their possessions and found it odd. Might jog some memories. You never know.

I'm super curious about the DNA. This case seems ripe for some good DNA evidence.

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Eee gads....just saw a commercial that ABC is doing a show on Lorena Bobbitt.  The woman who decided that instead of just killing her husband,  it would be a much better idea to simply cut his penis off. 

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OMG, did anyone watch last night's Body Cam?

Spoiler

I cannot believe Trooper Cederberg lived! That guy STOOD OVER HIM and fired shot after shot after shot into him. It was chilling to watch.

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29 minutes ago, Jordan61 said:

OMG, did anyone watch last night's Body Cam?

  Hide contents

I cannot believe Trooper Cederberg lived! That guy STOOD OVER HIM and fired shot after shot after shot into him. It was chilling to watch.

Yes, that was a horrifying thing to see!

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14 hours ago, Jordan61 said:

OMG, did anyone watch last night's Body Cam?

  Reveal hidden contents

I cannot believe Trooper Cederberg lived! That guy STOOD OVER HIM and fired shot after shot after shot into him. It was chilling to watch.

When was it on?  All I kept seeing was Kenda shows. Boy. I'm sick of that show. They run TOO MANY marathons of that show, imo. 

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4 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

When was it on?  All I kept seeing was Kenda shows. Boy. I'm sick of that show. They run TOO MANY marathons of that show, imo. 

Body Cam is on Tuesdays at 9 pm.

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Did anyone catch the season premiere of Evil Lives Here with John Wayne Gacy’s sister? I realize he was her brother and she loved him but there were times it felt like she was trying to make you feel sorry for him. 

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Yeah, I saw that. I got that feeling at times, too...and given the rough upbringing Gacy had, with his dad constantly beating on him for the hell of it and the troubled household they seemed to grow up in, I can understand where her sympathy would come from in that regard. The abuse doesn't excuse or justify his crimes in any way, obviously-plenty of people have grown up with shitty parents and didn't turn out to be serial killers. She grew up in the same house and turned out very differently, after all. But I can see her still wondering if there was any way for her brother to follow a different path, have a different outcome, too, the "what ifs?" that no doubt have run through her mind god knows how many times. 

And it's also clear she was deeply shaken and horrified by his crimes, too. Her reaction to both his mug shot photo and her attempting to take some pills when the news broke of his murders was powerful and heartbreaking. 

I also felt for her when she talked about how her family was being harassed by people and getting threats after Gacy was arrested. That's awful and just not right. I found the crowds standing outside eagerly awaiting Gacy's execution and turning it into some kind of party really creepy and unsettling. I get people not shedding any tears for his death in and of itself, I especially get his victims' families being relieved/glad to see him go, but I just don't get the public spectacle aspect of executions at all. It's no different than the people who went to see public hangings back in the day, in my opinion, and it just all feels very...grotesque and disturbing. Plus, it just gives the criminal even more attention and further fuels their egos right up to the time they die, which they frankly really don't need. 

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