S01.E01: Three Card Trick

[A Boston Gal]

Isn't Henry supposed to be the "hunk" in this version?

[kieyra]

Generally speaking, the books are more cerebral and less hunk-based than The Tudors or The Other Boleyn Girl.

[turbogirlnyc]

I love historical British drama but this show lacks one key ingredient. Hunks. This appears to be a hunk free zone. I may come around eventually but I wish the casting agent had thought about this before hand.

Lol. The Tudors was only tolerable overall but it had Henry Cavill so...

Edited April 9, 2015 by turbogirlnyc

[Dirtybubble]

 

I am really enjoying this show and thank God for wikipedia and special that aired on PBS about the court of Henry VIII or I would be lost!  20 + years out of school has not been kind to my memory. 

 

And I like that this is airing on PBS.  Nothing against Tudors or something HBO would put out but dang all the sex, sex, SEX and violence is crazy.  I don't need to see 2 people boining every 10 mins to get the idea that they are a sexual couple.  I know it sounds prudish but I prefer the intelligent dialogue and story telling that PBS brings to their shows.  The cheekiness of the conversations between the characters is enough for me.

[kieyra]

After the positive responses from US viewers, I tried again with the pilot and the second episode. I just cannot warm up to Rylance. I think this partially a personal problem--the books got so far into my head I have my own image of how book-Cromwell talked/moved/emoted, and it's just not aligning with show-Cromwell, who at times seems even elderly and frail.

 

And the eyebrows. 

 

(That said, I'm really glad to see so many people here, and I'll be doing a rewatch as the US airing happens so I can participate.)

Edited April 9, 2015 by kieyra

[Dirtybubble]

 

Cromwell, who at times seems even elderly and frail.

 

I am a little surprise that they cast an older man as well.  At the beginning of the show, when he was a lawyer under Thomas Wolsey, I would have expected him to be younger; I thought this was at the beginning of his career.  Enh what do I know; I don't know how old he was when he himself finally becomes Lord Chancellor.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Dirtybubble

[MichelleAK]

After the positive responses from US viewers, I tried again with the pilot and the second episode. I just cannot warm up to Rylance. I think this partially a personal problem--the books got so far into my head I have my own image of how book-Cromwell talked/moved/emoted, and it's just not aligning with show-Cromwell, who at times seems even elderly and frail.

 

And the eyebrows. 

 

(That said, I'm really glad to see so many people here, and I'll be doing a rewatch as the US airing happens so I can participate.)

 

Yeah, that's my problem with Rylance as well.  I think the acting is fine, and I am enjoying his portrayal (so far) more than I thought I would when I saw the previews.  But Cromwell was supposed to look like a thug; in the books, even those who loved him thought he looked like a murderer.  Rylance is just a bit too delicate for me; they needed someone who appears more menacing, even while being polite and smiling.

 

I do have to say that Mark Gatiss as Bishop Gardiner is inspired casting. That's exactly how I pictured him!

 

Still, I did enjoy the first episode, so will definitely be watching the whole thing.  I do hope we see more of Richard and Rafe, though. They were both very prominent in the books, and so far they are just Cromwell's bookends. 

[kieyra]

Yeah, that's my problem with Rylance as well.  I think the acting is fine, and I am enjoying his portrayal (so far) more than I thought I would when I saw the previews.  But Cromwell was supposed to look like a thug; in the books, even those who loved him thought he looked like a murderer.  Rylance is just a bit too delicate for me; they needed someone who appears more menacing, even while being polite and smiling.

 

I do have to say that Mark Gatiss as Bishop Gardiner is inspired casting. That's exactly how I pictured him!

 

Still, I did enjoy the first episode, so will definitely be watching the whole thing.  I do hope we see more of Richard and Rafe, though. They were both very prominent in the books, and so far they are just Cromwell's bookends. 

 

Yes, he is eating up that role. 

 

I was hoping for something slightly different for Norfolk--he's described as gaunt in the books, but the actor is still having a great time with him. 

 

I was apprehensive about Damien Lewis, but it's working for me, and so very different from JRM. (I had no problem with JRM, FWIW.) 

 

Claire Foy, too. Really, inspired casting overall, with Rylance the only head-scratcher for me. And Rylance improves when he's acting opposite Lewis, Foy, and Mary B / Norfolk (unsure of actors' names). 

 

I keep meaning to look up the name of the actress playing Johane and see if she's part of the Richardson/Redgrave dynasty. EDIT: Nope, I guess she's just giving me Joely Richardson from certain angles. 

Edited April 9, 2015 by kieyra

[blackwing]

I am a little surprise that they cast an older man as well.  At the beginning of the show, when he was a lawyer under Thomas Wolsey, I would have expected him to be younger; I thought this was at the beginning of his career.  Enh what do I know; I don't know how old he was when he himself finally becomes Lord Chancellor.

According to Wikipedia he was born around 1485.  His wife and children die in 1528.  So at the beginning of the series it appears he is supposed to be around 43.  Mark Rylance is 55 and looks like he is 60.  He definitely doesn't look like someone who is commanding and authoritative.

[Glade]

They should have cast someone younger as Cromwell; Rylance is definitely not in his late twenties/early thirties, as he was supposed to be upon his return to England when he began working for Wolsey.  And the actor doesn't project a great deal of power either.  Personally, I'm glad for the eye candy in the way of Rafe, Mark, and other such young men.  This version of Suffolk is more historically accurate in his age/looks then in the Tudors. 

[sugarbaker design]

I'm hoping as the plot progresses, time elapses, and as Cromwell's quest for power and thirst for revenge grows, that Rylance's performance will reflect these changes.

[Dirtybubble]

And the actor doesn't project a great deal of power either

 

I kinda disagree--the actor portrayed steadfast loyalty to Wosley and stood his ground with Thomas More and Anne Boleyn (LOVED the scenes with them) so IDK maybe he isn't suppose to show that authoritative side just yet *shrug* 

[Jolie]

I just wanted to chime in that I thoroughly enjoyed  Episode1--enough to hunt down the last three minutes that were cut off on my recording (Thank you PBS for posting the entire episode). I didn't read the books, didn't watch The Tudors, and only made it through about half of The Other Boleyn so I really don't have a good point of reference for comparison. I quite liked all the actors, at least so far.

 

I did quickly read up on Henry VIII in my English Kings and Queens coffee table book. I did get a little confused with all the jumping around. Anyway, I'm looking forward to the next episode.

[turbogirlnyc]

They should have cast someone younger as Cromwell; Rylance is definitely not in his late twenties/early thirties, as he was supposed to be upon his return to England when he began working for Wolsey.  And the actor doesn't project a great deal of power either.  Personally, I'm glad for the eye candy in the way of Rafe, Mark, and other such young men.  This version of Suffolk is more historically accurate in his age/looks then in the Tudors. 

 

James Frain as Cromwell, FTW!!

 

I understand what you're saying about The Tudors' Suffolk. But let's be honest, is there a better reason to watch than Henry Cavill?

[doodlebug]

 

I'm not sure if modern doctors have ever figured out what "the sweats" actually was. One of those horrible diseases where you are fine in the morning and dead by supper.

 

Modern medicine still hasn't figured out The Sweat, to my knowledge.  It was a disease that appeared rather suddenly in England right around the time Henry Tudor, Henry VIII's father, took the throne.  It's been theorized that it was brought from Europe by Henry's followers who traveled with him from exile there to defeat Richard III.  It would appear rather suddenly, kill a majority of its victims and then disappear just as suddenly.  It continued to appear off and on for about a century and then disappeared altogether.  As in the episode, it struck out of the blue and a previously healthy person would die within hours.

 

The time jumps didn't bother me, I got the context pretty quickly.  However, I'm a lover of all things Tudor and familiar with the timeline and sequence of events from reading both of the books as well as a lot of others. 

 

As for the episode, I wish we'd gotten more of Cromwell's backstory as that, for me, is what made the books so interesting.  Cromwell's past does a lot to illuminate the man he became and I found his early years to be fascinating.  Most books of this era don't explore the history of anyone other than the royals and I liked the glimpses the book provided into Cromwell's early life and the sort of lives lead by commoners of the era.

 

I didn't mind Rylance as Cromwell although he was not as charismatic as I would've expected.  He is also significantly older than Cromwell of this era which was a bit bothersome, too.  I do hope the series gives full attention to the relationship between Cromwell and Thomas More as I found the book's take on it to be fascinating.

Edited April 11, 2015 by doodlebug

[MrsE]

I think it likely that the first appearance of Sweating Sickness in 1485 is coincidental.  It wasn't recorded in Europe before then and appeared there later, which doesn't suggest, to me at least, that it was imported by the invading army.

 

There have been a number of theories about what it was, including hantavirus, but it disappeared entirely which might mean that it mutated into something less lethal.

[M. Darcy]

 

has it been verified that Henry VIII fathered Mary Boleyn's kids and not her husband Henry Carey?

 No one still knows for sure.   Her two children did look a lot like Henry VIII but he never acknowledged them as he did his Illegitimate son by Bessie Blount.

[Notwisconsin]

I loved Mary's snark. Who can blame her since she did bear Henry's son and now is acting as her sister's lady in waiting. I am glad that she can snark and gossip.

 

I thought this was just a rumor--has it been verified that Henry VIII fathered Mary Boleyn's kids and not her husband Henry Carey?

 

All her children were legitimate and were born after Henry dumped her. Her two children from her first marriage lived long and prospered and their descendents are still alive

[Hecate7]

All her children were legitimate and were born after Henry dumped her. Her two children from her first marriage lived long and prospered and their descendents are still alive

 

Actually, Henry Carey, First Baron Hunsdon, probably WAS Henry VIII's son. He looked enough like Elizabeth to be her twin brother, and had fiery red hair. Portraits of his father, William Carey, show a broad-faced, attractive young man with laughing eyes. Elizabeth was very careful in her favors to Baron Hunsdon not to call too much nor too little attention to him, and on his deathbed he refused a promotion to Earl of Wiltshire, saying "Madam, as you did not count me worthy of this honor in life, I shall not count myself worthy of it in death."

 

I get the feeling both of them believed that he was Henry VIII's son.