S20.E03: Latin Night

[dwtsgueststars]

And I get Carrie Ann was using it to take a swipe at Tony (which is also the hero's name in the song, & my Dad's name... not for nothing). However, she's seen at least 2 other performances of it on the show, & probably heard it innumerable times outside the show; maybe even danced to it herself, in a professional or non-professional context. So, whatever... I still don't get the "bad blood" between Carrie Ann & Tony (but I don't need it explained again, either) & I guess I wish they could just be professional when they have to work together, & not snipe at each other until they're offstage, off-camera, etc.

Mark mentioned something like Based on Their Past Relationship on AfterBuzzTv...whatever that means.

 

 

 

I was actually bored with Latin Night. It didn't have flavor. I can't tell anymore who's dancing what - and on top of that, they don't announce the dance anymore.

Edited April 1, 2015 by dwtsgueststars

[Guest]

Thanks, judemorrigan.  That makes more sense to me.  

 

Why Riker's not talking about that experience in interviews I don't know but my guess is it's orders from the show, not his own little deception.  Maybe the show is worried about people making a mountain out of a molehill.  

[saber5055]

Why Riker's not talking about that experience in interviews I don't know but my guess is it's orders from the show, not his own little deception.  Maybe the show is worried about people making a mountain out of a molehill.

 

 

Yes, because this show is SUPPOSE to be about taking "stars" who have never danced a ballroom step and turning them into dancers. The show told us Riker is a Hough relative, which is enough shadow to cast on his abilities; I am surprised that was revealed. But the show wants to keep a squeaky clean image of being all about "the journey" of learning ballroom, from Nobody NonDancer to MirrorBall Winner Most Excellent. It wants us to think even WE can do it if we get up off our couches.

 

I'm pretty sure the general viewing public cares little about whether so-and-so has a dance background, they want to be entertained on Monday nights and that's all. But the rest of us, those who post here and other places ... didn't TPTB know that we all are online and can Google stuff? There are very few secrets out there any more.

[truthaboutluv]

Mark mentioned something like Based on Their Past Relationship on AfterBuzzTv...whatever that means.

 

 

Carrie Ann and Tony have had many back and forths throughout the years. Most of it really stem from the fact that Tony rarely agrees with her criticisms and coupled with the fact that she's not a ballroom dancer/expert, I think he has even less respect for her opinions. There was a story many years ago, I think like Season 5 or something or even earlier where he apparently gave Carrie Ann a book about ballroom technique after she said something he disagreed because he said she clearly needed to learn her facts. It's quite negative between them and has gotten incredibly annoying at times, like this past week. It was even worse between her and Maks, although with Maks, he also had drama with Len as well. Now I hear he currently just throws shade on social media at Julianne's comments. 

[BW Manilowe]

Mark mentioned something like Based on Their Past Relationship on AfterBuzzTv...whatever that means.

I was actually bored with Latin Night. It didn't have flavor. I can't tell anymore who's dancing what - and on top of that, they don't announce the dance anymore.

I'm with you on them not announcing the couples/dances at the beginning of their dance anymore.

I don't usually look at whatever sites/social media feeds announce the dances & the songs being danced to before the show, & I can't position myself to actually *see* my TV (& the little thing they now supposedly put onscreen saying what dance the couple's doing) any longer, thanks to a recent medical/pain issue that I'm dealing with on the side I'd have to lie on to see my TV.

So I miss hearing the British voice saying, like, "Dancing the Samba... Tony Dovolani and Suzanne Somers!" before the music starts. Plus, I thought the before dance intros were kinda "classy", but still in the cheesy way that befits the show.

[tarotx]

Even Riker's 2009 jazz dances are partner dances since they have that feel. Then he went into hip hop 2010. And he performed on Sytycd With his little Boy Rage crew. Which had one of the worse receptions from that shows fans :p The he sung and danced on Glee and the Glee tour. Dance has been a huge part of his life and they should have it out there. People are harder on Nastia because of her dance background When she was an athlete.

Riker does seem to have focused on his band the last few years. They do seem to be actual musicians and not just a dance group deguised as a Band.

Edited April 1, 2015 by tarotx

[Andiethewestie]

 

Why Riker's not talking about that experience in interviews I don't know but my guess is it's orders from the show, not his own little deception.  Maybe the show is worried about people making a mountain out of a molehill.

Yeah, it's no way a mole hill, here's a couple of quotes from a Pro Derek and Hough family fansite from a mod who was in competitive dancesport:

 

"If he and Rydel were just dancing at bronze or silver, I wouldn’t call it a big deal – but it takes years of intense training to be able to dance at an open level in the youth or junior age group. It’s usually dominated by the Russians and the Mormons. Oddly enough, Riker actually competed against Lindsay and Jenna in the Junior & Youth Latin Championship division back in 2006"  

And this: 

 

"I actually like Riker, and I still wish he would come clean about his dance experience. People harped non-stop on Alfonso’s “extensive professional dance experience” last season, and the dude did tap about 25 years ago; Riker competes at a high level in a youth Latin dance competition less than 10 years ago? Nobody bats an eye. Double standards drive me nuts." 

 

And finally 

 

"The three open levels of ballroom competition are novice, pre-championship, and championship. And although I’m rusty on my USABDA regs, I believe a couple is eligible to compete in their current age bracket, as well as the bracket right above them; they are also only eligible to compete in two consecutive skill levels. So back in 2006, Riker would be eligible to compete in the youth and junior age levels, and either the novice & prechamp or prechamp & champ skill levels. And unfortunately, it’s not as simple as “Win at this competition, and you compete at this level at the next competition” – each competition is a separate set of events, and there’s a point system in place that determines when one should advance to the next skill level. It’s actually a complex formula that takes into account how a couple placed in a certain event, how many couples were in the event, and several other factors. For example, while I was in college, I amassed enough points from placing high in certain events that I pointed out of novice and into pre-champ. This was actually a bad thing, because the difference in skill level and competition between the two levels was big – and I went from getting mostly 1st and 2nd place trophies in novice to just feeling lucky to have made it to the semifinal in prechamp.

As for how long he competed – dancesportinfo is good, but there are gaps. I know that not all of the comps report their final standings, and smaller ones get altogether omitted sometimes. He may have competed more – there’s no way to know for sure. But the fact that he was able to place in some open-level youth Latin events seems to indicate he had some degree of mastery."

 

I went back and checked out the Dancesport Rules and definitely, OPEN classes are for those who have increasingly levels of difficulty.   Here is the table:

 

PROFICIENCY CLASSIFICATIONS

4.7.2.1 There are six general competitive classifications for each age group and style that

relate to proficiency. There are two independent subsets of proficiency

classifications – Syllabus and Open. Only syllabus figures may be danced in the

Bronze, Silver, and Gold Syllabus levels (noted below in the highlighted part of the

table):

 

Syllabus                  Open

Bronze Silver Gold  Novice Pre-Championship Championship

 

    Increasing Level of Proficiency    

 

So if Riker competed in OPEN Novice or OPEN  Pre Champ, he has already surpassed the qualification for Bronze, Silver, and Gold. 

 

Edited April 1, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[judemorrigan]

For what it's worth, those are the USA Dance rules you're quoting.  Riker's results are for NDCA competitions.  For the purposes of this discussion, the levels are pretty much the same, but it's worth noting.

 

As far as point systems go, they vary from sanctioning body to sanctioning body.  It USA Dance has one system, the NDCA has another and the YCN has yet another.  It's important to keep in mind that none of the sanctioning bodies in the US have a "point-in" system.  They're all "point-out" systems.  (And USAD's is currently on hold entirely.)  That is, they limit how long you can stay in a level, they don't dictate when you can start competing in a given level.  (Although certainly one can use them as a guide.)  But in all sincerity, you could find a partner, register with USAD or the NDCA and compete in Adult Championship Latin tomorrow.  Well, the next time your chosen sanctioning body has a competition.  

 

That said, I agree that he certainly has more than a couple of months of training and certainly wouldn't have been bad with those results.  I think "some degree of mastery" is probably a fair statement.  Exactly what that degree of mastery was would be much harder to say though.  It would be really interesting if someone were able to dig up video.

Edited April 1, 2015 by judemorrigan

[Abra]

Has Brittany been in the troupe the whole season? I can't believe I just noticed her for the first time last night - Brittany, of Brandon and Brittany from several years ago! Their paso was so amazing...I'm going to have to go watch it again.

 

What in the sweet hell goes on in Mark's brain? That Cold Miser getup and the "Irish jig" he did in the middle of the dance, I just...

 

I can't even call Patti's outfit last night a costume; she totally looked like she was checking into a hotel. 'Bye Felicia' had me rolling. I wonder if she made Artem watch Friday with her.

 

I want someone to offer Michael a shot of whatever his poison is before every performance. He looked so robotic last night with that pasted-on grin, and it was painful to see him so far ahead of the beat. I actually wasn't scared for Peta at all with the lifts, I felt like he was overly careful with her and it disturbed the flow of the dance. I just really like him though, and I want him to do well.

 

I just watched Nastia's samba again, and while I loved the choreography and thought her technique was really good, there's that indefinable something that prevented me from enjoying it and wanting to bookmark the video to watch over and over again. Probably that elusive "chemistry" with Derek is missing. I would love to see her perform with Henry to see their connection (and admittedly because I just adore him and want to see him highlighted as a dancer outside of the troupe). Oh, and the hypermobility in Nastia's knees really freaks me out. It's like they bend backwards.

 

Tony is way too damned sensitive. Why take CAI's comment so personally? Sheesh. And did any of the judges comment on Suzannes total lack of hip movement?

 

Chris barely moved at all in his AT, and when he did he lurched around like a human math compass. Witney's amazing spinning lift thingy was the only good part of that dance.

 

I don't have much to say about Noah's piece except my admiration for Sharna grows every week.

 

Rumer's dance was good (if oddly intense at times; she needs to just relax and enjoy the performance), but I still can't root for her since I saw that video where she claimed she didn't have any competition. I mean, come on.

[Serendi]

Michael and Peta said in a postshow interview that there are four clicks before the dance starts to cue the music and they couldn't hear the clicks; it threw them both off.

I've heard this sort of thing too often. Maybe the dancers should wear earbuds in one ear.

Edited April 2, 2015 by Serendi

[Budgita]

Co signing with the others that aren't feeling anyone in particular this season. As stated Nastia's got the moves, Patti's got the razz, and Rumer and Riker have some of each but something's still missing for me. Maybe it's authenticity..idk though cause I don't consciously think about Rumer performing as her current career for the last few years at FTR or Riker's past dance history and saying they have no experience when I watch them perform. It's about on par with omitting Janel's name from how she and Val met. At least when she said she had no competition it seemed like she was keeping it real. Wish there was more of that. Except with Bruno the douche canoe.

[truthaboutluv]

Michael and Peta said in a postshow interview that there are four clicks before the dance starts to cue the music and they couldn't hear the clicks; it threw them both off.

 

 

Interesting because Mark talked about this very thing on Afterbuzz, about the clicks and how sometimes if you don't hear it, it throws the celebrity off. He even mentioned that that's one of the reasons it's worse to go first no matter what week of the competition it is. Because the crowd is still screaming and the video package is playing and before the celebrity knows it, they're already counting down and then sometimes they can't hear the clicks and it just throws them off.

[Rrrhumba]

FWIW, Mark's "Irish jig" was actually genuine flamenco steps. Some interesting arm styling going on but hey, it's Mark. I'd actually really like to see that dance again without the whole theme going on, it was fairly pure in terms of the choreography. I suspect if Derek or Val had done it (with their usual dark and intense styling/production), it would have got raves, whether or not Rumer or Nastia had danced it better than Willow did.

This is an interesting season: so far nobody's out and out crowd favourite but nobody's noticeably the dead weight either. Even Patti and Suzanne are bringing it as best they can. The judges are actually going to have a lot of say in who goes home.

[Kromm]

Hmm, Erin.  Jealous much of Rumor?  I mean you went out of your way to act like she must have paid for it or something with that line about how "stars aren't like us" (or whatever the exact phrasing was).

[kitcloudkicker]

Pretty par for the course for Erin though, she makes comments like that to most of the really fit celebrities. And dancers. Off the top of my head she makes those comments to Peta all the time, and did with Amy when she was on.

[spanana]

I suspect Riker will get asked about his background next week.  That Jessica Radloff who does interviews for Glamour will likely ask.  It's been the talk of DWTS this past week and the woman generally has no shame when telling the pros/celebs what she thinks.  I still don't think he's maliciously keeping it quiet or anything.  If you watch Riker's interviews, the dude is so laid back.  And it's not like his hardcore fanbase is going to stop voting for him if he competed in a few competitions when he was younger.  If anything they will vote harder if he gets backlash.

 

I also am certainly not taking quotes from users at PureDWTS (a Hough based site) as proof of anything.  Basically those people will hate on anyone that isn't Derek.   As it is I'm sure they were livid this past week based on the edit Derek got.

 

I am generally in the boat though that I like a lot of these people as people, but I'm not overly inspired by anybody on the dance floor. I do think Rumer/Val are going to win and the judges are deliberately scoring them down a tad right now so she can have her big huge comeback and they can pretend like she wasn't going to win all along.  But if she wins I think it's more going to be because people want Val to win, she's likeable and talented enough, and she doesn't have much competition.  In a more competitiive season I don't think she'd have a real shot.

 

Part of the reason I actually enjoy Riker the most on the dance floor so far is not because he's the best technician (he's not), but because he actually has some flair and performance quality.  Something that is missing from a lot of the others.  Patti is the only other person who has any real performance chops and obviously her dancing is limited.

[truthaboutluv]

But if she wins I think it's more going to be because people want Val to win, she's likeable and talented enough, and she doesn't have much competition.  In a more competitiive season I don't think she'd have a real shot.

 

 

I think she has a lot of competition in Nastia and Riker. Honestly, I think she has more competition than Alfonso did - Sadie just had the likability factor but she was actually not that great of a dancer in my opinion, okay but not great. Janel was good but so far I think both Rumer and Nastia seem better than she was and she unfortunately turned people off very quickly in the season with the whole showmance thing with Val. 

 

This season I put Nastia on par if not better in my opinion than Rumer. The thing is one, I do get a deja vu feeling with Val, like we're seeing a repeat of Maks' "magical" Season 18 that was all about how he'd never won in 10 years or whatever the story was. Coupled with that is now this stuff about Riker which sucks because ringer guys have always had it harder on this show than the female ringers. And with Nastia there's the whole "she's cold, she's not connecting" coupled with the fact that she's dancing with Derek which automatically makes a celebrity a turn off for some and there's the whole Henry and Derek debate/issue, etc. 

 

So I think these factors will come into play and probably will help Rumer and Val ultimately win but I can't say it would be all about the dancing. Nastia especially I think gets a little unfairly nitpicked at times, almost like people treat her as a ringer. And that's why I liked what Mark pointed out on Afterbuzz, that while these gymnasts have flexibility and an advantage in that, they don't exactly learn how to count music or do their movements to music. Yet I think some hold her to some standard and almost dismiss what she is doing as "well so what, we knew she'd be good and whatever she's a ringer." I rewatched that Samba and that was some difficult choreography that she nailed but because she nailed it so well, again there's the feeling by some that it looks so easy it must be easy for her. 

Edited April 2, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[crowceilidh]

I really enjoy Rumer's intensity.  You can be intense and relaxed.  Her amazing dominance in that beginning trio was delicious to watch.  I've always liked Val's dancing and choreo (except last season when I just couldn't tolerate watching Janel at all).  I wanted him to win with Zendaya.  But I wish Rumer would win because she's the bomb, not because people want Val to win.

[spanana]

 

I think she has a lot of competition in Nastia and Riker. Honestly, I think she has more competition than Alfonso did - Sadie just had the likability factor but she was actually not that great of a dancer in my opinion, okay but not great. Janel was good but so far I think both Rumer and Nastia seem better than she was and she unfortunately turned people off very quickly in the season with the whole showmance thing with Val.

 

When I said I didn't think Rumer had a lot of competition, I didn't necessarily mean from a dance perspective.  DWTS has never been all about the dancing and never will be.  I think most would agree that so far Rumer, Nastia and Riker seem to be ahead of everyone else in terms of overall skill and talent level and are the frontrunners in that regard.

 

Where I don't think Rumer has much competition is that I don't think the other frontrunners have much chance of scoring a win.  Nastia would have to be the most amazing dancer and have the best personality ever to win because at this point half the audience is practically rooting against Derek.  Nobody is itching for him to have another trophy.  His partner would have to win in spite of him.  On top of that he has more backlash than normal because even some of his own fans are questioning why he came back this season and TPTB aren't giving him a great edit.

 

Riker has plenty of fans and I think they can get him to the final, but he needs more than that to win.  Is he picking up support from the general audience?  On top of that throw in backlash because he's related to the Houghs, being judged by his cousin and now his performance background.  Plus again, nobody outside of Allison's hardcore fanbase is itching for her to win.  If anything, a lot of people don't think she deserves her spot on DWTS in the first place.

 

I also suspect the show realizes they came out a little too strong the first week talking about Rumer being the potential winner and so the last few weeks they have scored her down a bit just to make it look like it will be a horse race to the finish and that anybody can win.  They can't make it look like a one horse race on week 2.

 

The only other possible spoilers IMO are Willow and Noah.  Noah because his story is going to keep him around for a long time no matter how he dances and Willow because she will continue to improve and unlike his buddy Derek, Mark hasn't seen a trophy longer than Val has even been on the show.  So no audience faction is likely to be anti Mark winning.  For all of the stuff about how Val deserves a trophy, and I'm not arguing he doesn't, Mark hasn't seen a trophy since S8.  Val didn't even join the show until S13.

Edited April 2, 2015 by spanana

[truthaboutluv]

Where I don't think Rumer has much competition is that I don't think the other frontrunners have much chance of scoring a win.  Nastia would have to be the most amazing dancer and have the best personality ever to win because at this point half the audience is practically rooting against Derek.  Nobody is itching for him to have another trophy.  His partner would have to win in spite of him.  On top of that he has more backlash than normal because even some of his own fans are questioning why he came back this season and TPTB aren't giving him a great edit.

 

 

I don't deny the stuff about Derek, as I noted above that there are some who root against a celebrity no matter what they do just based on their being paired up with him. That said, I think some may be underestimating Nastia's fanbase. Per a friend who has followed Nastia's career and is very sports oriented, apparently she's actually way more popular and loved than people realize. The girl apparently has her own Gymnastics Cup that's actually very prestigious and highly ranked and by that token many young gymnasts who look up to and love her. 

 

She has the U.S. Olympic Team, U.S. Gymanastics Team, Subway (one of her main sponsors) all stumping hard for her on a social media along with many former gymnasts and medalists. And as much as it may seem like many hate Derek, he does still have a decent fanbase. And I don't see Nastia's scores ever being really low. Again, I'm not saying that Rumer doesn't look really good for the win but I do think some may be underestimating Nastia's voting base.

 

Not to mention that Rumer has turned some people off with her comments and her demeanor.  Just like Nastia, some think she's too serious, doesn't seem like she's having fun. Also, I'm not sure how big her voting base is even with who her parents are. All I'm saying is I could very easily see this becoming another Zendaya vs. Kelly situation, hopefully without the iffy computer glitch that put a damper on the finale. I can very easily see Nastia storm ahead in the final weeks and win, after weeks of it looking like it's Rumer's to lose.

 

But I wish Rumer would win because she's the bomb, not because people want Val to win.

 

 

For the record, that comment was not directed at any one on the board. Like I said, it's just a feeling I get about the editing and narrative so far. 

Edited April 2, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[Guest]

Pretty par for the course for Erin though, she makes comments like that to most of the really fit celebrities. And dancers. Off the top of my head she makes those comments to Peta all the time, and did with Amy when she was on.

I give Erin a pass for the ab envy comments.  Erin and most other women working in tv are under tremendous pressure to be tiny.  

 

And to be honest a lot of us at home are thinking the same thing-- "damn, girl, your abs."  I said the same thing about Sharna and Noah last week here.  

 

FWIW, Mark's "Irish jig" was actually genuine flamenco steps. Some interesting arm styling going on but hey, it's Mark. I'd actually really like to see that dance again without the whole theme going on, it was fairly pure in terms of the choreography. I suspect if Derek or Val had done it (with their usual dark and intense styling/production), it would have got raves, whether or not Rumer or Nastia had danced it better than Willow did.

Mark's probably my least favorite pro but I kind of liked that dance and that icy look.  It was head and shoulders above some of his past looks-- all the spats and the skinhead years, for example.  

[saber5055]

For all of the stuff about how Val deserves a trophy, and I'm not arguing he doesn't, Mark hasn't seen a trophy since S8.

 

 

This talk cracks me up since it's DWTStars and it's the amateur who is suppose to be winning the MBT. However, I would be all for a season where the pros dance together and get voted on, like Val w/Karina, Tony w/Cheryl and so forth. Now THAT would be good tv worth watching. It'd be DWTP.

[anonymiss]

I might be the only female viewer who was disappointed to see Charlotte go this early. I'd rather watch her beautiful form pose than...say, be "inspired." And I do believe she had an influx of inquiries from her debut on the show and naturally she'd have to act quickly or they'd go to the next inflated blonde.

 

I'm glad to read Robert is winning people over. He's likeable, but he's also not entirely the wholesome ultra-nice guy he presents himself as. He's not above the cliche of leaving his wife and kids for a much younger woman. I still like him but just put him in the box of "Typical" now.

[spanana]

I'm glad to read Robert is winning people over. He's likeable, but he's also not entirely the wholesome ultra-nice guy he presents himself as. He's not above the cliche of leaving his wife and kids for a much younger woman. I still like him but just put him in the box of "Typical" now.

 

Robert didn't even know Kym when he split from his wife, so are you talking about another woman?  He split from his wife last summer.

[Guest]

This talk cracks me up since it's DWTStars and it's the amateur who is suppose to be winning the MBT. However, I would be all for a season where the pros dance together and get voted on, like Val w/Karina, Tony w/Cheryl and so forth. Now THAT would be good tv worth watching. It'd be DWTP.

 

Funny, I was going to illustrate how little I care anymore about anyone's dance history by saying I'd be fine with say Tristan and Kym competing.  So yeah, I'd watch a DWTP season.

 

I might be the only female viewer who was disappointed to see Charlotte go this early. I'd rather watch her beautiful form pose than...say, be "inspired." And I do believe she had an influx of inquiries from her debut on the show and naturally she'd have to act quickly or they'd go to the next inflated blonde.

 

I'm glad to read Robert is winning people over. He's likeable, but he's also not entirely the wholesome ultra-nice guy he presents himself as. He's not above the cliche of leaving his wife and kids for a much younger woman. I still like him but just put him in the box of "Typical" now.

Well, for all we know his wife left him.  But yeah, they were done-zo before he met Kym.  And he's not all that much older than Kym.

[anonymiss]

Lol not Kym and this phony showmance, but this other woman he's had for awhile and now they've gone public.

http://dailyentertainmentnews.com/tv/danielle-vasinova-shark-tank-robert-herjavecs-rumored-mistress/

[calipiano81]

This talk cracks me up since it's DWTStars and it's the amateur who is suppose to be winning the MBT.

IMO, it's the pairing who wins the mirrorball. The amateur in no way could win by her/himself and, as we've seen, the assigned pro can be a major factor in how far the amateur goes.

Also, after 10 years on the air, I think the designation of "Stars" could be up for interpretation at this point. Some of the long-term dance pros are now more famous and beloved than a lot of the celebrities they bring on.

[Alapaki]

I don't really have a dog in the fight over Riker's past dance experience.  But I do have an honest, non-snarky, non-rhetorical question:

 

To what extent, if at all, does a "star's" prior dance experience really affect the outcome at this point?

 

Because, it seems to me that the vast majority of the votes are probably coming from fans of the "stars" (or of their pros) and that they are ginned up over social media by the pro, the star, and the star's celebrity friends.  I think those people are voting regardless of what they see on Monday nights.

 

Concealing a star's dance experience/training mainly has the effect of lowering expectations about their performance.  When they exceed those artificially lowered expectations, it might influence the people who vote based upon actual the actual performances.  But I'm really not sure what proportion of the vote total that populations makes up.

 

(as far as the judge's scores, having run the numbers pretty closely for the last couple of seasons I'm convinced that with the exception of the nights with gimmick extra dances, the Judge's scores have relatively little ability to overcome the viewer vote.)

[sinkwriter]

 

To what extent, if at all, does a "star's" prior dance experience really affect the outcome at this point?

 

Because, it seems to me that the vast majority of the votes are probably coming from fans of the "stars" (or of their pros) and that they are ginned up over social media by the pro, the star, and the star's celebrity friends.  I think those people are voting regardless of what they see on Monday nights.

 

 

That's an excellent question, especially considering how many dancers have made it really far because of fan votes instead of true skill. Case in point: Michael Waltrip, Tommy Chong, Bill Engvall, etc.

[crowceilidh]

 

 

QUOTE

But I wish Rumer would win because she's the bomb, not because people want Val to win.

 

For the record, that comment was not directed at any one on the board. Like I said, it's just a feeling I get about the editing and narrative so far.

 

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing with your take, I was just wishing.

[truthaboutluv]

To what extent, if at all, does a "star's" prior dance experience really affect the outcome at this point?

 

 

It matters in that it can ensure at least a mid-season or further placement but it doesn't guarantee a win. Because you're right about voters and I've said this, that the show really is won on viewer votes/fanbase. Now some casual viewers do vote just on dance ability but I get the impression many don't. Some like the "journey", some vote for who they think is just the most fun, some believe the show should be about people with no experience period and so they get behind a star who maybe struggles in the beginning, etc. And we have seen many really good celebrities go home earlier than expected and people not as good make it a lot further. 

 

Now that being said, typically whoever wins is always fairly good. I mean the last two seasons we've had the people with the most ability and some might say the biggest ringers of the season, both win, in Meryl and Alfonso. However, Kelly Pickler won over Zendaya who had far more dance ability and background than Kelly. In fact Kelly had no dance experience far as I knew. She was flexible and strong and fit but she wasn't a dancer. Amber Riley beat Corbin Bleu who was the better technical and better trained dancer. Helio Castroneves, one of the weakest winners, if not the worse in my opinion, beat Mel B., the far better dancer and the list goes on. In fact that season with Helio also saw Sabrina's boot in Week 5 because she clearly didn't have the fanbase despite how good she was. 

 

Again, the obvious ringers have certainly won before, aside from Meryl and Alfonso, Nicole Scherzinger won, some thought Kristy Yamaguchi was the ringer that season (I didn't really agree with that too much though she was really, really good) but the fact is this show gets won on viewer votes and often the best technical dancer isn't the one with the biggest voting base. And I've found that it's also especially difficult for the male ringers - Mario Lopez didn't win, Corbin Bleu didn't win, some thought Joey Fatone was a ringer and he didn't win. Alfonso might have been the only one. So going by that I'd be surprised if Riker won this. 

Edited April 2, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[RetailTherapy]

I don't really see Riker as a ringer, simply because he's just not that good.  And if they really wanted him to win, he certainly wouldn't have been paired with Allison.

 

There have been a few ringers on the show.  Aside the randomness of Maks being tossed a bone in the form of Meryl and Witney getting Alfonso likely by reason of being as small as he is, there really is only one that seems to get the regular ringer-type celebs.  No need holding one's breath to eventually see him saddled with a Patti, a Cloris, a Valerie, a Nancy Grace or a Kate Gosslin.  That's when the rubber will meet the road.  Or we'll see dances in a smoke filled, pitch black dark studio, standing in a refrigerator box.

[Avidviewer]

Even if you don't qualify Riker as a ringer, it clear that he is not a ballroom novice.  Riker/Allison is pairing that makes sense for the show. A contestant with ballroom experience paired with the pro with no ballroom training.  He has a dance background so he will pickup choreography easier. Allison overdances (frenetic at times)  but Riker can balance that with his performance factor. Allison does not have a strong fanbase but Riker does. Allison gets a partner that can dampen the outcry from her first season. Yet, someone like Henry still hasn't gotten a second chance.

[spanana]

Even if you don't qualify Riker as a ringer, it clear that he is not a ballroom novice.  Riker/Allison is pairing that makes sense for the show. A contestant with ballroom experience paired with the pro with no ballroom training.  He has a dance background so he will pickup choreography easier. Allison overdances (frenetic at times)  but Riker can balance that with his performance factor. Allison does not have a strong fanbase but Riker does. Allison gets a partner that can dampen the outcry from her first season. Yet, someone like Henry still hasn't gotten a second chance.

 

Allison has a strong fanbase.  It's just not a DWTS fanbase.  She has far more of a fanbase than most newbies pros on this show by virtue of her history on SYTYCD. In the contemporary world, she's quite known.  Not to mention of course that she is married to another fairly high profile dancer.   For instance, not that twitter followers are the be all end all of things, but Allison has more than twice the number of twitter followers that Sharna does, despite the fact that Sharna has been on DWTS for several seasons now.  She also has more than Witney.   Also Allison and Keo started DWTS at the same time.  Allison has more than 100k followers.  Keo has 8k.  So Allison has a leg up on most newbies pros.  

 

Also while I'd like to see Henry get a second chance, Allison getting a second chance really has nothing to do with that situation.  Allison getting a second chance means that Jenna or Lindsay didn't get a call up, but the main thing standing in Henry's way was Derek returning.  And as someone that can't deal with Jenna's overmugging even in the troupe, I'm pretty okay with her not getting promoted.

Edited April 3, 2015 by spanana

[luvthepros]

 

I know Patti Labelle won't last long, but I enjoy her zestfulness. And holy mother of god, her outfits at rehearsal! no sweats for Miss Patti!  That orange shirt she was wearing looked like raw silk. It cracked me up. Everyone else is in hard working dance gear, and she's impeccable and elegant in a silk shirt! Respect.

Patti doesn't move enough to break a sweat so why not wear a silk blouse?

[designing1]

Lol not Kym and this phony showmance, but this other woman he's had for awhile and now they've gone public.

http://dailyentertainmentnews.com/tv/danielle-vasinova-shark-tank-robert-herjavecs-rumored-mistress/

 

I'm not saying it's not true, but where in that link have "they gone public"? There are two photos of them at two events, two years apart.

[Andiethewestie]

Lol not Kym and this phony showmance, but this other woman he's had for awhile and now they've gone public.

http://dailyentertainmentnews.com/tv/danielle-vasinova-shark-tank-robert-herjavecs-rumored-mistress/

 

She's even younger than Kym.  

[Andiethewestie]

 

Coupled with that is now this stuff about Riker which sucks because ringer guys have always had it harder on this show than the female ringers

 

It didn't have to be "harder" on Riker if he would have just come clean. It's not the strong latin ballroom experience and the perception of nepotism in the judging per se, it's the lying that gets people feeling like they're being duped. Nobody likes being outplayed by a hustler.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[truthaboutluv]

Honestly, I really don't care one way or the other, seeing as I don't vote. My point was simply that ringer guys already rarely win this show, so with this news about him out there now, I'd be really shocked if he does.

Edited April 3, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[Andiethewestie]

To win this you need a fanbase. Ringers of both genders have not won this, but Ringers with a fanbase that appeals to the demographic are pretty unstoppable; The first night portrayal is essential. The show carefully crafts what they want to show the audience. As soon as I saw the package for Charlotte I knew she was fodder. Middle America is pretty conservative, and the producers know it. Not that Charlotte was particularly good, but Better dancers have been sent home because of bad edits, not ability. The producers are more interested in keeping the people around who the audience wants to see, regardless if they're good dancers or not. 

 

 Alfonso was perfect for nostalgia appeal and dance ability.. Plus, there's not a lot of males that have dance background, this show usually gets the athletes and the war heros who typically aren't dancers, but they have the fanbase.  Riker probably has a decent fanbase but for this show you need an enthusiastic fanbase that the demographic will vote for. That's why the heavy lean on the Hough family, he wants their vote.  Allison has a fanbase, but so did Chelsie and Lacey when they were on and SYTYCD had better viewership. They only went deep into the competition if their celeb partner had the fanbase. They didn't have the luxury of being partnered with a pro who fans will vote for regardless of the partner or teaching ability.  

Edited April 3, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[NikSac]

I can't get into Nastia.  I know everyone keeps saying that gymnasts are stoic, but the best floor ex'ers had lovely expression and emotion.  It's just that the sport has beaten out any beauty and grace that once existed and replaced it with endless bouncing and tumbling.

 

So glad I'm not alone in thinking this. I used to love the floor exercise part - now it seems like they finish their incredible tumbling, flip their head around to make sure they didn't hit the line, then do some kind of flip and start the next tumbling run. The only facial expression anymore is "hooray I made it!" Don't get me wrong I'm way impressed by their tumbling, but I can see how emoting during a dance could be hard when they're so used to focusing on the technical part.

[Forrealforreal]

As someone who never votes, but thinks about it from time to time I'm all about making excuses for not making the effort to pick up my phone. Having said that, I don't appreciate my "potential votes" being manipulated by production. Think Rumer's in it to win it, although my non vote pre show was for Micheal. Too bad it's not Dancing with the Robots.. 

[Guest]

Lol not Kym and this phony showmance, but this other woman he's had for awhile and now they've gone public.

http://dailyentertainmentnews.com/tv/danielle-vasinova-shark-tank-robert-herjavecs-rumored-mistress/

I stopped reading after the second typo.  They can't even spell the guy's name.  

[spanana]

I stopped reading after the second typo.  They can't even spell the guy's name.  

 

Exactly.  There might be some truth to it.  I have no idea.  I don't have any deluded ideas that Robert is a saint.  But I'm not basing opinions on whether or not he cheated on his wife off of some hole in the wall website I've never heard of where the writing looks like it was done by a bunch of children.  I can also start a website and write that so and so cheated on his wife and post a few pics, but that doesn't make it true.   Plus those pics are all from like 2013 so I don't really get the part about how he went public with his girlfriend.    Also in context of DWTS I don't care.  Most of these people have done shady things at one time or another, but I base my opinions of them based on how they conduct themselves on DWTS.

[Guest]

Liars and ringers and cheats - oh my!  

[Andiethewestie]

Exactly.  There might be some truth to it.  I have no idea.  I don't have any deluded ideas that Robert is a saint.  But I'm not basing opinions on whether or not he cheated on his wife off of some hole in the wall website I've never heard of where the writing looks like it was done by a bunch of children.  I can also start a website and write that so and so cheated on his wife and post a few pics, but that doesn't make it true.   Plus those pics are all from like 2013 so I don't really get the part about how he went public with his girlfriend.    Also in context of DWTS I don't care.  Most of these people have done shady things at one time or another, but I base my opinions of them based on how they conduct themselves on DWTS.

No but I looked at her twitter feed and they were at the Superbowl together this year she hangs with him, and that sob story about almost ending it all was a bit too melodramatic for my taste. The guy is a goof . If he insists on telling the world he contemplated suicide, he needs to tell the whole situation, because the bits and pieces he conveniently leaves out is just trying to draw sympathy. And that's the story he's trying to portray on DWTS. Oh please, Robert, the kids were disgusted because you took up with some woman 20 years younger and closer to their age. The story isn't new. 

Edited April 3, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[Guest]

Noah kicks puppies.  

[kitcloudkicker]

Noah kicks puppies.  

 

 

My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Patti LaBelle kill a guy. 

[RemoteControl88]

insert smiley crying emoji.

[Wings]

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!! to both of you!