Sweet Fellowship: Duggars and Friends (aka the Bates Family and Other Featured Families Thread)

[beckie]

2 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Including a short response from Moody, pointing out that, yeah, all the costs are available online and in the school catalog. 

Good stuff there all around. 

I wish I thought Jill'd learn something from this. 

I guess they've deleted or turned off the comments. I didn't see anything just the post with Jill's drivel asking them to respond. Anybody know what they were?

Edited June 7, 2019 by beckie

[Churchhoney]

2 minutes ago, beckie said:

I guess they've deleted or turned off the comments. I didn't see anything just the post with Jill's drivel asking them to respond. Anybody know what they were?

Try this link. Don't know exactly how it's connected, linkwise, to Jill's original post. But It's what I saw. It starts with somebody writing to Moody and asking them to respond about this, then it has some people talking about their experiences with Moody, etc. 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2256246504421587&id=127750490604543&_rdr

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, BigBingerBro said:

God I certainly hope Moody doesn't take this as "bad press" and back-peddle and offer him a full ride.

I hope not either.

But reading between the lines of their brief reply -- and its context of a bunch of people defending them by describing in detail their own quite different experiences -- my guess would be they're just pissed. And know that they have both the high ground and the faith of more people who matter to them. Maybe I'm reading in my own attitude, of course. But it sounds to me as if they don't have any hesitation confronting it head on. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Churchhoney

[beckie]

4 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Try this link. Don't know exactly how it's connected, linkwise, to Jill's original post. But It's what I saw. It starts with somebody writing to Moody and asking them to respond about this, then it has some people talking about their experiences with Moody, etc. 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2256246504421587&id=127750490604543&_rdr

That's the link I saw originally. For some reason all I see is the post and the drivel Jill wrote. At the bottom where the comments should be, it just gives the share option, but doesn't give the comments one. Maybe it's my phone. 

[farmgal4]

40 minutes ago, LilJen said:

Well, they *are* a fairly undereducated family. . . 

Ignorance is no excuse.

[Sew Sumi]

I just tried the link. It works for me on my tablet.

[Churchhoney]

2 minutes ago, beckie said:

That's the link I saw originally. For some reason all I see is the post and the drivel Jill wrote. At the bottom where the comments should be, it just gives the share option, but doesn't give the comments one. Maybe it's my phone. 

! Drat! Try another method of opening the link, I guess. The stuff is still there when I access if from my Chrome browser on the computer now. 

And ongoing. 

Somebody just suggested that Moody should file a libel suit. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Churchhoney

[beckie]

N/m           .

Edited June 7, 2019 by beckie

[Ohiopirate02]

6 minutes ago, beckie said:

That's the link I saw originally. For some reason all I see is the post and the drivel Jill wrote. At the bottom where the comments should be, it just gives the share option, but doesn't give the comments one. Maybe it's my phone. 

I had to use the app on my phone instead of the link.  This was one of the first posts I saw when I searched for Moody Aviation on there.

[Portia]

RE JillR...I never cease to be amazed at how quick some "sweet Christians" are to use social media to trash a business or service provider that rubs them the wrong way. I'm not saying I would never do that if something truly unjust had happened and I felt there were no other recourse, but as a general rule I find that sort of trash talk decidedly unchristian. Deal with your opponent directly. Go through proper channels.

Edited June 7, 2019 by Portia

[beckie]

18 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I had to use the app on my phone instead of the link.  This was one of the first posts I saw when I searched for Moody Aviation on there.

Thanks. That worked. 

Some of the people reached out to his parents directly and haven't gotten a response. I'll bet Jill is foaming at the mouth that someone dare call her out on her lies.

[Temperance]

11 hours ago, Marigold said:

Did I ever tell you guys that I have met the Maxwells twice? 

Both at homeschool conventions.  I spoke to the oldest Maxwell girl for about 15 minutes, just chatting. 

My friend wanted to speak to Teri. I didn't know who she was way back then...this was WAY back.  So I stood there while my friend and Teri talked. I'm quiet by nature and just listened. 

My husband met Steve at some event, many years ago. 

No, you didn't. I would like to know more. Could you tell that Sarah (the oldest) was a stay-at-home daughter? She's finished the homeschool equivalent of high school, almost 20 years ago.  It could have been a while and she would have been an adult. 

Any other observations? 

Speaking of the Maxwells, buy Steve's books in time for Father's Day! Steve, the hypocrite, hates television, but always has quotes from the Duggars to sell stuff. This one is from JB and almost belongs in the Lonely J thread. 

“I think every family should read Buying a House Debt-Free, and I encourage you to catch the vision for your sons.” Jim Bob Duggar

[Churchhoney]

16 hours ago, Portia said:

RE JillR...I never cease to be amazed at how quick some "sweet Christians" are to use social media to trash a business or service provider that rubs them the wrong way. I'm not saying I would never do that if something truly unjust had happened and I felt there were no other recourse, but as a general rule I find that sort of trash talk decidedly unchristian. Deal with your opponent directly. Go through proper channels.

The calculus is probably different when, as in this case, the incident didn't happen and the sweet Christian (or whoever) made it up out of whole cloth.  You can't confront them directly because they know the truth!   😀

Why Jill thought she could get away with that big pronouncement regarding something entirely false is beyond me. 

ETA: Of course I say this, and in the larger sense I still think it's true that Moody wins this round.   But of course all her leghumpers are rallying round her to bash Moody for what they absolutely know is the truth -- Jill's lying, crackpot pronouncements.

How in the world does this stupid, venal, obnoxious, lying, child's-soul-destroying creepazoid have leghumpers??!! She isn't even on effing television! 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Churchhoney

[mimionthebeach]

12 hours ago, beckie said:

That's the link I saw originally. For some reason all I see is the post and the drivel Jill wrote. At the bottom where the comments should be, it just gives the share option, but doesn't give the comments one. Maybe it's my phone. 

Here's the link to Jill's post. 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2291788577726149&id=100006850878192

[TresGatos]

On ‎6‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 7:37 AM, OpieTaylor said:

However, we felt God leading to that end and had little to no other options for this line of work/ministry.

So God led them astray?

[EVS]

9 minutes ago, TresGatos said:

So God led them astray?

Maybe he did so because they are not Godly enough. I don’t think God likes Jill very much. Among other things, he sent her a demon in a green bean can and apparently led her to paint her face like a drag queen. 

Actually, even God must need a good laugh occasionally. I suspect God just messes with Jill for His/Her amusement.  Too bad the kids occasionally get dragged into things.  Hopefully God eventually leads each and every one of them far away from their selfish and narcissistic parents. 

[Churchhoney]

57 minutes ago, TresGatos said:

So God led them astray?

Well, there's always somebody else to blame....

....Today it's Moody Aviation. Tomorrow it's God. 

Watch your step, there, Jill. 

But, mostly, just give up your children to sane people who aren't selfish jerks. Please. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Churchhoney

[PradaKitty]

Hey Jill, 

You know where a good place to learn how to fly is?  The US military! Send your boy to a real college through their ROTC program. 

[Zella]

7 minutes ago, PradaKitty said:

Hey Jill, 

You know where a good place to learn how to fly is?  The US military! Send your boy to a real college through their ROTC program. 

No kidding! I had a friend in college who went through the ROTC program. He did a bunch of military training schools before he graduated, including jump school at Ft. Benning. He even got to do some basic flight training one summer, though he did have to get a scholarship for it since it wasn't guaranteed. He graduated, I guess 3 years ago, and he did another year or so of training. But he's a lieutenant in the Army and a pilot now. 

[Ohiopirate02]

I went back and read the comments on the Moody Aviation FB page.  I strongly suspect that there were 2 issues that held Tim back academically and neither one was the cost.  He was probably woefully ill-prepared for the math and science classes necessary for the degree.  The one poster alluded to homeschoolers showing up without the necessary math skills because their parents were not prepared to teach them.  This has always been one of my issues with homeschooling with parents like Jill.  I cannot believe that she is capable of teaching anything beyond multiplication and division (even this is a stretch).  Tim would need a firm grasp of algebra, geometry and trig for his program.  He probably needs at least a year of remedial math if not 2 years before he could even begin to comprehend his classes.

The second issue is also homeschool related.  Tim was raised to believe that there is only one way to be a Christian and to never think about this.  Even with an institution like Moody, there will be a lot of discussion about what it means to be a Christian, the merits of one version of the bible over another, all the way into specific points of doctrine.  I don't think that this will be all that nuanced, but there will be discussion.  Tim was not raised to be able to handle this kind of thinking.  He was raised to see faith as a black and white issue.  I do not believe that Tim's instructor actually threw away a perfectly good KJV bible, but in Tim's eyes that is probably what he imagined when the instructor told him that he prefers another version.  

I think that Tim will have a hard road ahead of him as long as he adheres to his family's beliefs.  He needs to grow emotionally and mentally before he can even try to succeed as a mechanic or pilot.

[GeeGolly]

4 hours ago, mimionthebeach said:

Here's the link to Jill's post. 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2291788577726149&id=100006850878192

Did you read the comments? My goodness the world is being overtaken by Fundies. We need to band together and all the young posters need to start pushing out blessings, toot-sweet. The rest of us need a plan. Who's willing to take the lead on this? @Churchhoney?

[Sew Sumi]

Jill is quick with her delete and ban buttons. She even bsns people who like "dissenting" views. I was banned in such a manner by John Shrader (Anna Duggar's BIL for those not playing fundie bingo at home). 

[Churchhoney]

28 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Did you read the comments? My goodness the world is being overtaken by Fundies. We need to band together and all the young posters need to start pushing out blessings, toot-sweet. The rest of us need a plan. Who's willing to take the lead on this? @Churchhoney?

I'm too baffled by it to have a plan!

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? 

[Ohiopirate02]

23 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

I'm too baffled by it to have a plan!

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? 

I think we Americans need to look at the ways organized religion is dying in Europe.  I do believe that economic anxiety and fear are great motivators for shady preachers.  If we were to develop a stronger social safety net, you would see fewer and fewer people attending and funding churches.  Medicare for All, stronger unions, Universal Basic Income, rent control, free college tuition would all go a long way to help lessen this anxiety.  We have a failing white birth rate in our country because younger Americans cannot afford a child after paying for student loans and exorbitant rents.  Our wages have stagnated and we cannot afford to live like older generations.  

There will always be people like the Duggars and Rodriguezs who live in fear of a changing world and double down on the hateful religion.  But the average American will no longer live in fear of paying for college or paying incomprehensible medical bills.  

[Libby96]

Not that it’s any of my business, and not that I wish anyone ill, but holy heavens why is Erin Bates so willing to play Russian roulette with her health?  And why isn’t the husband who appears to worship the ground she walk on willing to put on his big boy pants and protect her? My understanding of their beliefs is that if he wanted to limit their family size, she would have to comply.  

They have three beautiful children despite her clotting disorder.  I wish they would see this as an enormous blessing instead of a sign to continue making a baby every 18 months.

Even as a fellow Christian, I can’t wrap my head around this idea that using birth control means you aren’t trusting God.  Should I just give up seat belts because using them would mean I’m not trusting God to protect me on a wreck?  Should I throw my blood thinner in the trash since that would mean I’m not trusting God to prevent another mini-stroke?  God gave us medical science and a brain.  That is part of His blessings to us as well.

[GeeGolly]

17 minutes ago, Libby96 said:

Not that it’s any of my business, and not that I wish anyone ill, but holy heavens why is Erin Bates so willing to play Russian roulette with her health?  And why isn’t the husband who appears to worship the ground she walk on willing to put on his big boy pants and protect her? My understanding of their beliefs is that if he wanted to limit their family size, she would have to comply.  

They have three beautiful children despite her clotting disorder.  I wish they would see this as an enormous blessing instead of a sign to continue making a baby every 18 months.

Even as a fellow Christian, I can’t wrap my head around this idea that using birth control means you aren’t trusting God.  Should I just give up seat belts because using them would mean I’m not trusting God to protect me on a wreck?  Should I throw my blood thinner in the trash since that would mean I’m not trusting God to prevent another mini-stroke?  God gave us medical science and a brain.  That is part of His blessings to us as well.

With treatment is she at a higher risk than typical pregnancies?  

[mynextmistake]

3 minutes ago, Libby96 said:

Not that it’s any of my business, and not that I wish anyone ill, but holy heavens why is Erin Bates so willing to play Russian roulette with her health?  And why isn’t the husband who appears to worship the ground she walk on willing to put on his big boy pants and protect her? My understanding of their beliefs is that if he wanted to limit their family size, she would have to comply.  

They have three beautiful children despite her clotting disorder.  I wish they would see this as an enormous blessing instead of a sign to continue making a baby every 18 months.

Even as a fellow Christian, I can’t wrap my head around this idea that using birth control means you aren’t trusting God.  Should I just give up seat belts because using them would mean I’m not trusting God to protect me on a wreck?  Should I throw my blood thinner in the trash since that would mean I’m not trusting God to prevent another mini-stroke?  God gave us medical science and a brain.  That is part of His blessings to us as well.

It was interesting to read Erin’s post. She said they had #2 (can’t remember her name) because they knew Carson needed a younger sibling and had Everly because they knew #2 needed a younger sibling but that Everly “just got lucky.” This makes it sound like #4 was unexpected. Similarly, I remember someone (her mother in law?) saying something to Alyssa about having three kids in three years and Alyssa replying “that wasn’t the plan” or something like that. I’m at a loss as to how they think they can avoid pregnancy without using some sort of contraception, but it’s possible they did intend to space their pregnancies differently. 

[Sew Sumi]

21 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

With treatment is she at a higher risk than typical pregnancies?  

Erin has to take daily heparin shots due to her blood clotting disorder.

[Westiepeach]

16 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Erin has to take daily heparin shots due to her blood clotting disorder.

I don’t know if things got better, but a friend of mine had the clotting issue thing during her last pregnancy like 32 years ago. It was brutal for her back then, and also stupid expensive (even with good insurance). She had to do the heparin thing on a very strict time schedule, plus they had to coordinate with the pharmacy to actually get the drug in a timely manner. 

Friend did not have another pregnancy after that one. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Westiepeach

[Marigold]

15 hours ago, Temperance said:

No, you didn't. I would like to know more. Could you tell that Sarah (the oldest) was a stay-at-home daughter? She's finished the homeschool equivalent of high school, almost 20 years ago.  It could have been a while and she would have been an adult. 

Any other observations? 

Speaking of the Maxwells, buy Steve's books in time for Father's Day! Steve, the hypocrite, hates television, but always has quotes from the Duggars to sell stuff. This one is from JB and almost belongs in the Lonely J thread. 

“I think every family should read Buying a House Debt-Free, and I encourage you to catch the vision for your sons.” Jim Bob Duggar

Teri was very friendly and engaging. When I later realized how Teri appears online and how she appeared in person, it was a little weird!  You would never guess from their blog and pictures but Teri was actually pretty charismatic. This is going back 20 years and she was teaching a course on scheduling, chores etc. I remember being entertained by her and not being bored or thinking she was nuts.  I know, surprising. Teri looks like a total bore.  That was not my experience meeting her. 

Years later, I met them again.  This time I had a basic knowledge of who the Maxwells were. (pre snark board addiction!)  I spoke to the oldest daughter for a while and truly thought I was talking to the youngest daughter.  She happened to say how old she was, I was completely caught off guard. I thought she was in high school. I played it off but I had a hard time recovering from that!  She did not have her mother's personality at all.  Teri had a personality. The daughter was like wet spaghetti.  Very nice and polite but very bland.  Plain.

I never met Steve. My husband said he was a snoozer. 

My opinion is that the reason the Maxwells are able to make a living with their books is because Teri is a decent speaker, warm, engaging and lively. 

Steve couldn't get anyone to stay in his talk and people kept walking in and out.  Teri is holding that shit show together. 

[GeeGolly]

2 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Erin has to take daily heparin shots due to her blood clotting disorder.

What added risks come with heparin shots? A possible bleed? And the disorder is only during pregnancy? 

[Ohiopirate02]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

What added risks come with heparin shots? A possible bleed? And the disorder is only during pregnancy? 

For what I can remember from being a pharmacy technician,  heparin would make her blood thinner so she would have to be careful about bruises, cuts and her diet would change.  It is very cumbersome to have to inject it on a daily basis and she would have to have more doctors appointments to monitor.  This is not something that a doctor would encourage on a long term basis after 2 pregnancies.  Of course, Doodlebug is more knowledgeable about this.  I could see her doctor pushing for a more permanent fix like tubal ligation or a vasectomy for Chad. 

Blood clots are no joke and I lost my best friend to one 12 years ago.  Erin should not be going down this road for the next decade.  The risk of permanent damage or death is too great.   

[Temperance]

Lawson has been judgmental and political on Twitter about a variety of issues. On Instagram, someone basically said that fundie women were raised to try to have as many kids as possible. That it seems like a contest and not even health risks will stop them. Lawson replied to this person saying something like you can't judge people you don't know.  That seems somewhat hypocritical for him. 

[Churchhoney]

9 minutes ago, Temperance said:

Lawson has been judgmental and political on Twitter about a variety of issues. On Instagram, someone basically said that fundie women were raised to try to have as many kids as possible. That it seems like a contest and not even health risks will stop them. Lawson replied to this person saying something like you can't judge people you don't know.  That seems somewhat hypocritical for him. 

I'm pretty sure irony's 100-percent lost on these guys. 

[doodlebug]

On ‎6‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 9:36 AM, OpieTaylor said:

Great idea about asking the Duggars about JD's pilot training.

Re: Tim's professor, I had to re-read that part a couple of times, but I think the professor told Tim that he had thrown his own KJV bible away, indicating the professor's disdain for that version.

If you read through the responses on the post to Moody, you'll see someone who claims to have been a student in Tim's class presents a perfectly reasonable account; the professor was discussing  various versions of the Bible and how they are similar and how they differ.  He specifically said that he personally found the Old English language of the KJV to be confusing and hard to follow. That he personally found a modern translation of the Bible which he found to be much more understandable for him and that he then stopped reading the KJV himself because he just didn't find it as spiritually satisfying.  According to the other student, at no time did anyone tell Tim that the KJV was wrong or that he couldn't use it.  Apparently, even the suggestion that another translation of the Bible could be more spiritually uplifting and useful than the KJV is blasphemous.  Or Tim is just as big a liar as his Momma.

[doodlebug]

2 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

What added risks come with heparin shots? A possible bleed? And the disorder is only during pregnancy? 

I don't know Erin's specific history or diagnosis.  However, if she needs to use a blood thinner daily, she is probably using Lovenox, not heparin, which only needs to be given once a day, not 2-3 times like heparin and generally has a lower risk of complications.

Pregnancy is a condition that increases the risks of blood clotting.  Obviously, this can be good in normal woman in that it will help prevent hemorrhage at the time of delivery.  However, women with clotting disorders are more likely to have things like placental abruptions, strokes, pulmonary emboli and thrombophlebitis in pregnancy and the blood thinners decrease that risk.  Doesn't eliminate it, but decreases it.  It also increases the risk of hemorrhage to a degree, but, in general, it is easier to handle excessive bleeding than clotting.

Depending on what her actual condition is, Erin could also have some risks when she isn't pregnant.  Since I don't know her history or diagnosis, I cannot comment on the specifics.

And, yes, most women who need to inject blood thinners daily during pregnancy and for 6 weeks postpartum do not tend to have large numbers of kids and tend to use reliable contraception.  Of course, many conditions would make hormonal contraception like the pill contraindicated since it also increases the risk of clotting; but there are non-hormonal methods available.

Edited June 8, 2019 by doodlebug

[galaxychaser]

Erin is playing Russian roulette with her life. Her kids need a mom not a dead martyr. 

[farmgal4]

6 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Erin has to take daily heparin shots due to her blood clotting disorder.

If I remember correctly, she had a problem with the placenta during her labor with the first child that could’ve been fatal had she not been in the hospital.  She’s playing Russian roulette with these pregnancies.  SMDH

[Misslindsey]

2 hours ago, doodlebug said:

According to the other student, at no time did anyone tell Tim that the KJV was wrong or that he couldn't use it.  Apparently, even the suggestion that another translation of the Bible could be more spiritually uplifting and useful than the KJV is blasphemous.  Or Tim is just as big a liar as his Momma.

I know it is not the case, but is it wrong that I am hoping Tim threw his bible out and is blaming it on the professor? Though I could also see Jill taking Tim saying that his teacher preferred a different version than the KJV and twisting the truth to the teacher threw out Tim's bible. Sigh....Jill is the worst.

[Albanyguy]

8 hours ago, Misslindsey said:

Though I could also see Jill taking Tim saying that his teacher preferred a different version than the KJV and twisting the truth to the teacher threw out Tim's bible. Sigh....Jill is the worst.

I think that's very likely. She's all about the drama and she loves narratives that involve her family being persecuted in some way by "unbelievers", or in this case by a supposed "Christian" who isn't as righteous as she is. I also think that she's one of those people who believe their own lies. As soon as one of these invented or embellished stories comes out of her mouth, it becomes absolute truth, something that she's convinced actually happened. In a strange way, she's not lying, she's delusional.

[BradandJanet]

I read JRod's post as the professor threw away his own bible, not Tim's. And I doubt he dumped it in a trashcan. Jill writes for drama not clarity. 

Jill twists the truth about everything to fit her ego, and I'm sure she's teaching the kids to do the same thing. I wouldn't depend on Tim for the truth about what went wrong at Moody. He won't go against Best Mama's version. While I feel sorry for these children, as they get older, it becomes difficult to like them. 

[MargeGunderson]

On 6/6/2019 at 8:01 PM, Sew Sumi said:

Jill learn something? When pigs fly!

Flying pigs are clearly from Satan, so we’d just be treated to another one of her ridiculous, rambling posts.

[Guest]

On 6/6/2019 at 9:12 PM, Ohiopirate02 said:

On 6/6/2019 at 9:03 PM, BigBingerBro said:

God I certainly hope Moody doesn't take this as "bad press" and back-peddle and offer him a full ride.

Judging by the comments,  it sounds like Moody tries to work with student to get their education funded. 

There was a comment on that link from someone who was the wife of a fourth-year student who claimed that "god provided" the funding for the entire four years so far. Much like Jill, this person seemingly claims that magical hundred dollar bills have fallen from the heavens instead of actually thanking the HUMAN BEINGS who are giving her husband (and their THREE KIDS!) a free ride through life. 

[ginger90]

7 pictures:

[ginger90]

Jill has posted about Timothy’s change of plans on, Facebook, their blog, and linked to the blog on Instagram. Is this using her time for good? 🤷🏼‍♀️

Edited June 9, 2019 by ginger90

[galaxychaser]

They have less than 2000 followers? Kirk Cameron is a funny?  

[Churchhoney]

38 minutes ago, galaxychaser said:

They have less than 2000 followers? Kirk Cameron is a funny?  

Best news I've heard all week. 

[Madtown]

Call me crazy, but I would think grifting and making a million social media posts to get followers and maybe some advertisement gigs, a hell of a lot more work than actually getting a real job. I would be completely exhausted doing that all day every day.

[louannems]

5 hours ago, ginger90 said:

7 pictures:

I listened to the full video of Kaylee singing. Not to be mean, but I was cringing with embarrassment for her.  The judges were very generous.  But Kaylee did try extremely hard and did give it her best.

[stephabeth]

On 6/7/2019 at 6:41 PM, doodlebug said:

Depending on what her actual condition is, Erin could also have some risks when she isn't pregnant.  Since I don't know her history or diagnosis, I cannot comment on the specifics.

Erin has Factor V Leiden, which was diagnosed after she miscarried her first 3 pregnancies. I presume due to a blood clot disrupting blood flow in the placenta.