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Like Sand Through an Hourglass: Behind the Scenes of DOOL


Message added by Door County Cherry

The Behind The Scenes thread is not a spoiler thread.  So spoilers, including casting information, do not belong in here.  The "behind the scenes" information specifically related to casting should go in either the spoiler thread or the Salem International thread which discusses. departures and arrivals thread. 

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On 11/17/2020 at 6:07 PM, Pearson80 said:

Why is that a bad thing? Bo had a nickname for the people that he loved.. I think either he or Steve called Shane the governor because of his regal presence and his British aristocracy roots...

Bo called Shane Governor and I think Kimberly called Shane Captain because when they met he was Captain Shane Donavon of the ISA.  I'm trying to remember what Steve called BO when the Victor reveal happened, it might've been Rich Boy or something to that effect. 

Bo and Hope both called Kimberly,  Kimber 

I didn't mind Fancy Face in the 80's because he didn't use it incessantly, but later on in the 90's it became grating. 

I know most of this because I've been watching old episodes. lol 

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2 hours ago, Mckinnonsgirl said:

Bo called Shane Governor and I think Kimberly called Shane Captain because when they met he was Captain Shane Donavon of the ISA.  I'm trying to remember what Steve called BO when the Victor reveal happened, it might've been Rich Boy or something to that effect. 

Bo and Hope both called Kimberly,  Kimber 

I didn't mind Fancy Face in the 80's because he didn't use it incessantly, but later on in the 90's it became grating. 

I know most of this because I've been watching old episodes. lol 

I am so jealous that you are watching the old episodes..  1986 is one of my favorite years..  

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32 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

I am so jealous that you are watching the old episodes..  1986 is one of my favorite years..  

Me too! If 2020 episodes ended tomorrow and they suddenly started airing 1986 in the same time slot I'd do a happy dance and then actually stay glued to my TV for an hour, mesmerized in a good story with actual background music. 

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38 minutes ago, Peanut6711 said:

Me too! If 2020 episodes ended tomorrow and they suddenly started airing 1986 in the same time slot I'd do a happy dance and then actually stay glued to my TV for an hour, mesmerized in a good story with actual background music. 

Don't forget people had homes and there were location shoots outside that added to the stories..

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1 hour ago, Pearson80 said:

Don't forget people had homes and there were location shoots outside that added to the stories..

Ah yes, the days when not everyone lived at either the Kiriakis mansion, the Dimera Mansion, and Salem Inn.  Grown adults had their own homes. And even when Orpheus blew up Roman/John & Marlena's in late '86, it was rebuilt before '87! lol

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1 minute ago, Peanut6711 said:

Ah yes, the days when not everyone lived at either the Kiriakis mansion, the Dimera Mansion, and Salem Inn.  Grown adults had their own homes. And even when Orpheus blew up Roman/John & Marlena's in late '86, it was rebuilt before '87! lol

The sets were big and luscious. We also had bars, restaurants, hang out places, the pier was also a great set... There were lots of extras and you got the sense that Salem was a big town... 

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2 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

The sets were big and luscious. We also had bars, restaurants, hang out places, the pier was also a great set... There were lots of extras and you got the sense that Salem was a big town... 

Yep, and when someone was in a scene at the hospital they didn't magically teleport to Shenanigans after the next commercial break. Now I'm always side-eyeing how people hop from one location to the other so fast. It's like everyone lives two minutes from town square, the park, the hospital, Brady Pub, Titan, Jake's garage, and everyone they know. I feel like the Christmas village under my tree is bigger than Salem some days.  I miss Neil Curtis's house, Blondie's, Kayla's loft, and Shane's house with the secret spy room.  I am so sick of Nicole's tiny apartment that supposedly houses her, Allie, Henry, and an invisible Holly. 

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Just now, Peanut6711 said:

Yep, and when someone was in a scene at the hospital they didn't magically teleport to Shenanigans after the next commercial break. Now I'm always side-eyeing how people hop from one location to the other so fast. It's like everyone lives two minutes from town square, the park, the hospital, Brady Pub, Titan, Jake's garage, and everyone they know. I feel like the Christmas village under my tree is bigger than Salem some days.  I miss Neil Curtis's house, Blondie's, Kayla's loft, and Shane's house with the secret spy room.  I am so sick of Nicole's tiny apartment that supposedly houses her, Allie, Henry, and an invisible Holly. 

We also had cars.. People drove in them and would have scenes.   I loved party scenes the most: Halloween, Christmas, New Year's Eve, engagement parties and weddings..

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3 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

Don't forget people had homes and there were location shoots outside that added to the stories..

I saved hundreds of VHS tapes of some soaps from the 80s and 90’s and a while back I bought a machine to transfer them to DVD. My daughter was watching some of the episodes and she was taken aback when she saw some of the location shoot episodes like Bo and Hope in New Orleans, the England wedding etc. She looked at me and said "I guess was before the show was broke"? It was really so jarring lol

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After reading these last few comments, I need to bring out my 1986 DVD's.  I miss the emergency center, the pier, Shenanigans. I miss the location shoots.  I miss a couples getting to know each other slowly (too slow sometimes LOL).  I remember screaming at the TV during the will Steve and Kayla EVER get to kiss (much less anything else) without being interrupted?  I miss when Roman was Chris K,  John was Roman and the Brady siblings had relationships with each other.  I miss seeing storylines like Steve learning to love - both Kayla and rebuilding his relationship with Jo and learning he had a sister. Even the rape storyline with Jack and Kayla versus Allie and Tripp. Of course Kayla knew who raped her and there was no baby (thank goodness).   I know they don't have the budget they did in the 1980's, but the writers just don't seem to put the same effort into the storylines that they used to.  

Edited by Lisa418722
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On 12/3/2020 at 12:01 PM, DisneyBoy said:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/mayor-of-l-a-issues-emergency-covid-19-order-to-county-its-time-to-cancel-everything

 

Will this affect filming?

How far ahead is the show now? I assume they've finished December/January...so are they filming February, or are they further head?

I think they can still film if they want to. There was a viral Instagram reel yesterday of a restaurant owner who was closed super pissed off she spent thousands on outside dining that a film set was feet away shooting and had craft services tables set up. 

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3 hours ago, chediavolo said:

Are any old episodes online somewhere?

Sometimes you can find things on youtube but they pull a lot of it down due to copyright. 

Just for fun, here's an old clip from Dec. '86.  It amazes me that most things improve in 34 years, but not Days. It's gone downhill big time. Just in this clip segment alone, there's multiple background music that changes with the mood, suspense, and special effects, not to mention the camera angles, scenes cuts, and story telling are a much higher quality.  Oh and damn Orpheus was good looking! I mean if you like that dark and mysterious type that whisks you off to a tropical island. 😀

 

 

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Thank you @Peanut6711 for posting that clip above. Orpheus was the show's best villain. He was not obsessed with Marlena, he wanted to hurt Roman for killing his wife and leaving his children without a mother.. I always thought that Orpheus being the catalyst for Marlena leaving the show was a great exit for Marlena who was beloved. I know people on this board hate Marlena but at that time she was the show's most popular heroine..

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6 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

Thank you @Peanut6711 for posting that clip above. Orpheus was the show's best villain. He was not obsessed with Marlena, he wanted to hurt Roman for killing his wife and leaving his children without a mother.. I always thought that Orpheus being the catalyst for Marlena leaving the show was a great exit for Marlena who was beloved. I know people on this board hate Marlena but at that time she was the show's most popular heroine..

You're totally welcome! I wish there was a channel that ran old episode so we could binge watch the good old days of Days!  I loved Orpheus and his revenge storyline so much too. The actor did a great job with making a distinct character and villain who had this heartbreaking backstory that made him the way he was rather than some silly obsession.  Plus he was smart and always two steps ahead of them. 

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3 hours ago, Peanut6711 said:

It amazes me that most things improve in 34 years, but not Days.

Do they, though?  Do they really?  Some things do. Some things get worse.  Other things that last that long have better years and worse years and then better years again.

DOOL in the 80s was amazing.  A lot of soaps in the 80s were much better than what we have now but I just don't get the comparison knowing what we know about what happened behind the scenes.  TV shows had better ratings in the 80s as the options were pretty concentrated.  Soaps made a lot of money in the 80s.  Their budgets reflected that and they spent that money.  That's why they had better sets and better music.  The fact that there weren't tons and tons of shows for writers to go to meant that soaps had a better pick of the writing crap than they do now.

 

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12 hours ago, chediavolo said:

Are any old episodes online somewhere?

There was a purge in 2015 of so many episodes on youtube, it was a travesty.  Some people have private youtube channels where you have to have a code to join.  

8 hours ago, Peanut6711 said:

You're totally welcome! I wish there was a channel that ran old episode so we could binge watch the good old days of Days!  I loved Orpheus and his revenge storyline so much too. The actor did a great job with making a distinct character and villain who had this heartbreaking backstory that made him the way he was rather than some silly obsession.  Plus he was smart and always two steps ahead of them

Orpheus was awesome in that way and Rojohn was not dumbed down like he was during the Kristen years for Orpheus to hatch his diabolical scheme. In fact, Rojohn figured out that Marlena was alive because of a videotape. It was an oversight on Orpheus part and it reminded us why Rojohn was a great detective. It is always the littlest things that bring criminals down because there is no such thing as a perfect crime by imperfect human beings.  Stuff like that is missing on soaps, the heroes were not stupid for the villains to win. The villains were interesting but not at the expense of the heroes.

Edited by Pearson80
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5 hours ago, Mckinnonsgirl said:

if you go to my IGTV page I have clips posted;  1983-1987 to be exact... just don't share them on Social or we'll lose them. https://www.instagram.com/rachelslimelife19/channel/

I hope that's ok to share my handle, if not please remove. 

i should edit that, right now I'm on 1986; but 87 is slowly approaching.   oh I should add, my clips are Bo and Hope centric, but there are plenty of other characters in the scenes. 
 

edited to add, I’m glad I let everyone know my clips are Bo & Hope centric, because I know some people don’t like them .  But man oh man rewatching the early years again was both nostalgic, entertaining and some of the subject matter that went over my head at ten years old in 1983 makes sense now 😂 .  
 

I quit watching full time when Marlena was possessed.  I still keep tabs on the show though. 

Edited by Mckinnonsgirl
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On 12/11/2020 at 3:13 PM, Mckinnonsgirl said:

I quit watching full time when Marlena was possessed.  I still keep tabs on the show though. 

That was a hot mess, the beginning of the end in my humble opinion.  The runner up to that is John not being Roman, it was stupid unnecessary and shortsighted.. 

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13 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

That was a hot mess, the beginning of the end in my humble opinion.  The runner up to that is John not being Roman, it was stupid unnecessary and shortsighted.. 

In retrospect it was shortsighted at the time I think they thought Wayne would stay but the dynamics of the show changed after that and WN's Roman didn't fit anymore. The Buried Alive story didn't help(although that one I enjoyed) but it wasn't as bad because the Michael/Crystal left shortly after.

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22 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

In retrospect it was shortsighted at the time I think they thought Wayne would stay but the dynamics of the show changed after that and WN's Roman didn't fit anymore. The Buried Alive story didn't help(although that one I enjoyed) but it wasn't as bad because the Michael/Crystal left shortly after.

Remember Wayne was never supposed to come back. Deidre Hall made it a condition for her return on the show.  The ratings were going down they were desperate and gave in to her demands.  All of the plans for Drake as Roman were scrapped and the tale of two Romans came to be.. Drake was very hurt by that development. 

Edited by Pearson80
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One of many instances where you should never listen to an actor's demands. I liked WN's Roman/Marlena however even I admit at that point that ship probably sailed.  The worst part of WN's return is that they killed off Isabella shortly after... so even then I should've known that they were going to have John/Marlena together.

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56 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

One of many instances where you should never listen to an actor's demands. I liked WN's Roman/Marlena however even I admit at that point that ship probably sailed.  The worst part of WN's return is that they killed off Isabella shortly after... so even then I should've known that they were going to have John/Marlena together.

Sherry said that the affair was going to happen even if Drake had remained Roman.  I often wonder what would have happened if Isabella  had never died and had stayed on the show.  Would Brady exist? Would Isabella go bad like Kristen? Would Belle exist? The dynamics of the situation changed when it became a Roman/Marlena/John triangle as opposed to a Marlena/Roman/Isabella triangle that was planned with Drake as Roman..

Edited by Pearson80
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I think Isabella would've been demonized (which is why I was glad they killed her off instead). They just replaced Isabella with Kristen.

 

I think Brady would've still existed though as they didn't kill her off till after he was born.

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4 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I think Isabella would've been demonized (which is why I was glad they killed her off instead). They just replaced Isabella with Kristen.

 

I think Brady would've still existed though as they didn't kill her off till after he was born.

Isabella was only killed off because the actress could not negotiate a contract with the show.  Also the person who wrote Kristen's descent into evil was not the same writer that wrote for Isabella.. So we will never know what might have been but it is cool to speculate..

Edited by Pearson80
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On 12/14/2020 at 1:13 PM, CanaryFan98 said:

One of many instances where you should never listen to an actor's demands. I liked WN's Roman/Marlena however even I admit at that point that ship probably sailed.  The worst part of WN's return is that they killed off Isabella shortly after... so even then I should've known that they were going to have John/Marlena together.

Well, I do recall the rumor that John was going to have an affair with Marlena even if Isabella had lived which I would have LOATHED. So - as I loved their pairing - I guess having Isabella die with John still loving her was actually the better ending, as sick as it sounds.

Still remember reading in SOD (the SOD with Drake/Staci on the cover, green background, as it was around the holidays!) that the magazine was inundated with letters wanting Roman/Marlena and John to stay with Isabella. (Granted, it may have been a concentrated number?) But it makes me wonder how an affair with Isabella alive would have been received. Especially since Isabella obviously loved John no matter who he was, and she wasn't evil.

I would have hated if she were sacrificed and made the villain to make Marlena look good.

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On 12/14/2020 at 8:13 PM, CanaryFan98 said:

One of many instances where you should never listen to an actor's demands. I liked WN's Roman/Marlena however even I admit at that point that ship probably sailed.  The worst part of WN's return is that they killed off Isabella shortly after... so even then I should've known that they were going to have John/Marlena together.

Still think WN 's Roman should have been killed off in the mid 90s . 

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5 hours ago, Rafael said:

Still think WN 's Roman should have been killed off in the mid 90s . 

I am going to say something very controversial.  Roman committing suicide over all that he has lost due to Stefano's machinations would have been a tragic obstacle for Jarlena to overcome. Imagine the guilt both would have felt for their affair. Not to mention, how that would affect Sami, Eric, Carrie and the rest of the Brady family..

Has there ever been a major character who committed suicide on a soap?

Edited by Pearson80
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2 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

I am going to say something very controversial.  Roman committing suicide over all that he has lost due to Stefano's machinations would have been a tragic obstacle for Jarlena to overcome. Imagine the guilt both would have felt for their affair. Not to mention, how that would affect Sami, Eric, Carrie and the rest of the Brady family..

Has there ever been a major character who committed suicide on a soap?

The only soap suicides I can think of off the top my head are Frank Walker on Santa Barbara (who was a pedophile/rapist that was about to get caught) and Angus Mckay on General Hospital (who was an old mobster in jail and IIRC, which may not be, agreed to kill himself so "they" wouldn't kill Duke, his son.)

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On 12/14/2020 at 10:13 AM, CanaryFan98 said:

One of many instances where you should never listen to an actor's demands. I liked WN's Roman/Marlena however even I admit at that point that ship probably sailed.  The worst part of WN's return is that they killed off Isabella shortly after... so even then I should've known that they were going to have John/Marlena together.

I think if they'd brought Wayne back earlier OR he decided to come back in 86 the story would've worked better, But Drake was already established by 91/92 as Roman, and I recall actually being annoyed when Wayne came back and that's saying something , because I loved him on his original run.    I felt like the writers at the time wanted to knock the halo off Marlena and they sure did it. 

If you haven't noticed, I tend to loathe soap writers from around 1996 to anyone currently penning daytime drama, they've gotten extremely lazy and rely on shock value instead of storytelling and cast interactions. 

I can imagine for an actor just there to collect a paycheck it wouldn't matter, but for actors who are invested in the history of the character they play, I bet it's frustrating.    

Recently I watched a interview with Peter Reckell (ex-Bo Brady) on YT  I don't know how old the interview was, but he was living in New Zealand so I think it's recent, anyhoo, he talked about how when he came on the show in 1983 that the writers and directors let him shape the character, case in point he came on the set one day with a fake tattoo of a dagger and it ended up  being worked into Bo's character and a story was made out of it, he brought in his own clothes and wore them, they even used Peter's Harley in scenes and I think when he came back later the writers didn't give him the same freedom , they had an arc and they wanted it played that way.  Great interview, just type in Michael Fairman and Peter Reckcell in YT 

 

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24 minutes ago, Mckinnonsgirl said:

they even used Peter's Harley in scenes and I think when he came back later the writers didn't give him the same freedom , they had an arc and they wanted it played that way. 

I don't think that's necessarily wrong in and of itself, because if you have too many people directing the story, it may go haywire.

However, I heartily agree with this:

24 minutes ago, Mckinnonsgirl said:

f you haven't noticed, I tend to loathe soap writers from around 1996 to anyone currently penning daytime drama, they've gotten extremely lazy and rely on shock value instead of storytelling and cast interactions. 

Although I might move the year back a bit to 2000 or so.

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6 hours ago, Katy M said:

The only soap suicides I can think of off the top my head are Frank Walker on Santa Barbara (who was a pedophile/rapist that was about to get caught) and Angus Mckay on General Hospital (who was an old mobster in jail and IIRC, which may not be, agreed to kill himself so "they" wouldn't kill Duke, his son.)

Ben (played by Matt Bomer) killed himself instead of killing Marina when his stint as a serial killing gigolo was exposed. Still rooted for him, though.

But I'm okay that they try to stay away from suicide given the negative effect it can have on people who see it and think that's a solution. 

6 hours ago, Mckinnonsgirl said:

Recently I watched a interview with Peter Reckell (ex-Bo Brady) on YT  I don't know how old the interview was, but he was living in New Zealand so I think it's recent, anyhoo, he talked about how when he came on the show in 1983 that the writers and directors let him shape the character, case in point he came on the set one day with a fake tattoo of a dagger and it ended up  being worked into Bo's character and a story was made out of it, he brought in his own clothes and wore them, they even used Peter's Harley in scenes and I think when he came back later the writers didn't give him the same freedom , they had an arc and they wanted it played that way.  Great interview, just type in Michael Fairman and Peter Reckcell in YT

Sometimes this is okay.  I don't think incorporating a tattoo, especially given the kind of character Bo was supposed to be, is crazy. 

But I also agree with @Katy M.  I've read interviews by actors that showed me they're perfectly aware of who their characters are.  I've read interviews by actors who were too aware of who their characters are to almost a rigid extent that doesn't always work on a soap.  (IMO, soap writers can have their characters do a lot of things that would otherwise seem out of character but they need to build up the story to where that choice makes sense.  Too often, they have characters do things for plot purposes or shocking twists---i.e.e the Jack/Kate affair. At the same time, I think actors need to try to making the writing work.)

And I've read enough interviews with actors about their characters and what they'd like their character to do and felt "what the hell are they thinking?" 

 

Edited by Irlandesa
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8 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

I am going to say something very controversial.  Roman committing suicide over all that he has lost due to Stefano's machinations would have been a tragic obstacle for Jarlena to overcome. Imagine the guilt both would have felt for their affair. Not to mention, how that would affect Sami, Eric, Carrie and the rest of the Brady family..

Has there ever been a major character who committed suicide on a soap?

I wouldn't have minded this as controversial as it would've been at least it would be memorable instead they just wasted him for the last 20 years.

 

Ben on GL I hated it too because I was a Ben/Marina fan at the time.

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48 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I wouldn't have minded this as controversial as it would've been at least it would be memorable instead they just wasted him for the last 20 years.

 

It would have given Sami's vendetta against Jarlena even more weight.. It could have also backfired on the show and there could have been a backlash against Jarlena..

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6 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Ron had some controversial tweets about the Stefan/Abby storyline I'd post them but not sure if they should be allowed here.

What did he say?  Give us the tea please! Ron is an ass so I expect to be offended...

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So, basically, Ron is up to the same Twitter antics he pulled while on GH? Good to know he learned NOTHING. Maybe the end result will be the same, too, and he will eventually be fired - AGAIN. (Especially since the show's ratings are awful right now!)

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2 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

So, basically, Ron is up to the same Twitter antics he pulled while on GH? Good to know he learned NOTHING. Maybe the end result will be the same, too, and he will eventually be fired - AGAIN. (Especially since the show's ratings are awful right now!)

While I want Ron fired as much as the next person he would probably be replaced by Dena. If we're lucky and that part doesn't happen I'd be content with them promoting Ryan Quan to the position. He can't make the show worse.

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I think it has been pretty clear that's his take given the writing that is using putting Abigail's relationship with Stefan on par with her relationship with EJ.  They didn't just do it in the fight but Gwen brought it up today.

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11 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

What did he say?  Give us the tea please! Ron is an ass so I expect to be offended...

For the love of all that is good ,please get rid of this hack.

 

Seriously ,he has got to go. I am prepared to declare that he is just as awful as Dena Higley . 

One can simply sum up his writing in one sentence: plot, plot, plot.

 

How do you explain this clown killing Adrienne off and keeping Bonnie ?

 

he even admitted that he had no good reason to kill her off. He simply said that somebody simply had to die during the time jump .

 

his writing is lazy and generic and his love for insane women is just bizarre. 

He only won an emmy for writing because he was up against fellow hacks such as Jean Passante ,Mal Young and the creatively bankrupt Brad Bell the year he won the emmy. He was simply the best out of the bad bunch.

 

 

Edited by Rafael
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3 hours ago, Rafael said:

For the love of all that is good ,please get rid of this hack.

 

Seriously ,he has got to go. I am prepared to declare that he is just as awful as Dena Higley . 

One can simply sum up his writing in one sentence: plot, plot, plot.

 

How do you explain this clown killing Adrienne off and keeping Bonnie ?

 

he even admitted that he had no good reason to kill her off. He simply said that somebody simply had to die during the time jump .

 

his writing is lazy and generic and his love for insane women is just bizarre. 

He only won an emmy for writing because he was up against fellow hacks such as Jean Passante ,Mal Young and the creatively bankrupt Brad Bell the year he won the emmy. He was simply the best out of the bad bunch.

 

 

I agree with this entire post. Ron needs to go!

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