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S03.E16: For All You Know


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...I'll have to rewatch, but I don't recall Gregson ever saying a thing about it, shy of cutting the interrogation short. Sherlock was the only one I recall absolving Gregson (to Joan).

stealinghome's post is pretty much verbatim Gregson's words from the episode:

...in the next scene, Gregson said something like "Because it's you, we have to do everything 500% by the book, so I couldn't give you a heads-up."...

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stealinghome's post is pretty much verbatim Gregson's words from the episode:

 

 

..in the next scene, Gregson said something like "Because it's you, we have to do everything 500% by the book, so I couldn't give you a heads-up."...

 

 

I didn't watch the episode "live".  I just rewatched the entire episode twice on my DVR, and that scene wasn't there. I'll have to take your word for it, but I'm curious - what two scenes did Gregson's "apology" and the above dialogue appear between?

 

On another note, I was impressed that Sherlock had the presence of mind to steal one of his assailant's wallets during their "brief physical relationship". 

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So, I kind of fell off this show for a while, but I just binged the last few episodes, and I am really glad I did. I really loved this episode. The last few episodes have been great in general, but this one might be my favorite in while. Of course, I always love episodes about Sherlock`s issues with drug addiction, without making him seem to dependent on Joan to deal with his issues. More of that please! 

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(edited)
I didn't watch the episode "live".  I just rewatched the entire episode twice on my DVR, and that scene wasn't there. I'll have to take your word for it, but I'm curious - what two scenes did Gregson's "apology" and the above dialogue appear between?

Twilight Zone here too.  I remember the lines from when I watched it "live."  But I also subscribe to the entire season on Amazon and I swear those lines on not on their copy.  Makes me wonder how many other great scenes throughout the seasons have been deleted.

 

Also, as long as he behaves like a perfect gentleman* around Watson, I think I am ready for a pickup on the Mycroft storyline.  Rhys Ifans is one busy guy so I am not sure that is logistically possible.

 

*Perfect gentleman = a man who keeps his pants on when he is around his brother's partner.  Maybe I should request this be added to the Urban Dictionary...

Edited by MaryHedwig
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I didn't watch the episode "live".  I just rewatched the entire episode twice on my DVR, and that scene wasn't there. I'll have to take your word for it, but I'm curious - what two scenes did Gregson's "apology" and the above dialogue appear between?

 

Twilight Zone here too.  I remember the lines from when I watched it "live."  But I also subscribe to the entire season on Amazon and I swear those lines on not on their copy.  Makes me wonder how many other great scenes throughout the seasons have been deleted.

 

 

I never saw that scene with Gregson's explanation and I am very certain they do not exist on my recordings. Even so, I think that Gregson could/should have given Holmes the slightest of hints that this was not your average consultation.

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I was with those that had said Gregson said something to Holmes after the first meeting, but he didn't. He did relay to Watson that Gregson couldn't let him have access to any of the files and I'm thinking I just saw it in my head. what I find especially fascinating, is hubby thought there was a scene of that, and others here, too! It's like we know Gregson so well we're able to make a scene out of our heads. Hee.

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(edited)

If it's not in this episode I had to have heard Gregson say it to Holmes in another episode, because I find it really strange that a bunch of us all remember that "500%" part. Either he uses that number a lot, or he did say it in this episode and it's not included in the repeat of it. Because I remember him saying we have to do everything 500% by the book. We all can't be having the same delusion. LOL.

Edited by sinkwriter
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Maybe it's related, I was sure that right before the episode there was a preview scene with Holmes saying "You have the wrong man" and Bell replying "then we're back to square one."  But it didn't appear in the show correct? Or was that a "previously?"  However, it's possible that people are remembering scenes in the preview that didn't appear in the episode?

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(edited)
If it's not in this episode I had to have heard Gregson say it to Holmes in another episode, because I find it really strange that a bunch of us all remember that "500%" part. Either he uses that number a lot, or he did say it in this episode and it's not included in the repeat of it.

 

 

I did not watch a repeat. I watched a DVR version of the first run. I have now watched it FOUR times and at no point does Gregson make any kind of excuse or apology of any sort to Sherlock. After Gregson cuts short the interrogation. he ushers the 35th guys out and then leaves Holmes alone in the room. Gregson is not seen again until much later in the show, and never with Holmes alone. Either a scene was cut in some areas, or a bunch of you are having a mass hallucination. ;)

 

He did relay to Watson that Gregson couldn't let him have access to any of the files and I'm thinking I just saw it in my head.

 

 

Pretty sure that didn't happen either. Sherlock says to Watson that Sherlock promised Gregson that he would not investigate the crime to which Watson responds "but I didn't". Neither Holmes nor Watson officially had access to official paperwork. Joan was working off old newspaper files and Sherlock's notes.  

 

eta: I misread "He did relay to Watson"  as Gregson relayed that message, but I never saw a scene like that, either, though it was clear by Sherlock's "I promised the captain..." that Sherlock wouldn't have access to the files.

Edited by basil
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Joan: Captain should have told you. 

Sherlock: It would have been indefensible for him to show me special consideration. And he has every confidence that the detectives are wasting their time.

...

Joan: You know we're gonna figure this out.

Sherlock: Well, I've been asked not to interfere.

Joan: You say that like you haven't heard it before.

Sherlock: Never been a suspect before. Besides, we're at a grave disadvantage. Ordinarily the police would share their files with us, we'd have access to evidence, we'd have access to the victim's remains. We can't even say how I knew her.

Joan: Then that's where we'll start.

Sherlock: Watson...

Joan: We know her name. You said you saw pictures of her with her family, I'll talk to them.

Sherlock: I promised the Captain.

Joan: I didn't.

 

I feel like there was an extra scene between Holmes and Gregson before this scene with Joan, and maybe it got cut from subsequent showings? I could have sworn there was a scene between the two men in Gregson's office, where he said that line about the 500%. But again, I've been watching season 2 episodes of Elementary over the past week or so; it's possibly that scene came from one of those episodes and got meshed into my memory of this past week's episode. It seems strange, but... not impossible.

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What time zone are you in, Basil?

 

 

I live in nyc so it was est when I recorded the show. As I've said before, I have worked on the show (though always second unit) and I am 99 and 9/10s sure that there was no scene between Gregson and Holmes where Gregson explains why he didn't give Holmes a a head's-up and an "apology". It really would be out of character for Gregson to apologise pr even explain himself..

 

Thanks for printing out that dialogue, sinkwriter. I honestly believe that there was no cut scene (not one that was ever shown, anyway). It was much more powerful having Gregson say very little, usher the the 35 guys out, closing the door behind him and leave Holmes alone in that beautiful, quiet moment.

 

And this was perfection:

 

Sherlock: I promised the Captain....

Joan: I didn't.

 

 

I honestly think there is conflation going on here between episodes.

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The 500% scene occurred between Joan, Bell and Gregson. I believe it was when discussing how they couldn't get the witness' name from the other cops. He explained that they had to be really careful about the whole thing because of who Sherlock is. Sherlock was not in the scene because he did not go to the police department after the initial "consultation" about the case.

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The 500% scene occurred between Joan, Bell and Gregson. I believe it was when discussing how they couldn't get the witness' name from the other cops. He explained that they had to be really careful about the whole thing because of who Sherlock is.

 

 

You're right about the discussion about the inability of (immediately) getting the witness' name, but the figure 500% never came up in that discussion. I don't think that number came up in this episode at all.

 

Are you very sure that Gregson said those words of explanation/apology to Sherlock, shapeshifter?

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 Because I remember him saying we have to do everything 500% by the book. We all can't be having the same delusion. LOL.

I'm tempted to re-watch so I can verify for myself that it wasn't said, because I am having the same delusion.  I'm sure my re-watch will not yield anything variance from anyone else's, but ...

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DeLurker, I am begging you to rewatch and solve this mystery for me. I recorded this episode as it ran, EST in NYC. I have now watched it beginning to end FIVE times and there is no scene of Gregson apologising to Sherlock for not giving him a head's-up, nor does the term 500% show up anywhere in the episode.

 

Either I'm losing my mind, I have a ghost in my machine, or some of you are conflating this with another episode (maybe the one where Bell was a suspect?).

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Gregson: All I could get out of my buddy at the 3-5 was that some new witness came forward.

Joan: Someone who said they saw Sherlock kill Maria?

Gregson: No, someone who says they heard him threaten her life a few days before she disappeared.

Joan: I don't believe it.

Gregson: The guys at the 3-5 do. Right now, that's all that matters.

Bell: I don't suppose you were able to put a name to the witness.

Gregson: They're keeping everythingunder wraps. Like they should. Holmes is not a cop, but he's close. They got to protect their case.

Bell: You have any luck with that list I sent you last night?

Joan: We did. Sherlock knew one of the names. We talked to the guy.

Bell: Is it someone you like for the murder?

Joan: No. But I'm pretty sure another conversation is in order.

 

No mention of 500 .. yeah, nothing on the Boston CBS affiliate (watched live and now dvred show)

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I'm joining the hive mind because I could swear Gregson says the 500% line also. I feel like I am remembering him putting his hands in his pockets as he's saying it, but if it isn't in the episode what is going on? Is this the latest what color is the dress thing?? I am going to have to rewatch before this drives me crazy...

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I'm joining the hive mind because I could swear Gregson says the 500% line also. I feel like I am remembering him putting his hands in his pockets as he's saying it, but if it isn't in the episode what is going on? Is this the latest what color is the dress thing?? I am going to have to rewatch before this drives me crazy...

So I am remembering Gregson putting his hands in his pockets too when he said it.  Hey, what mental hospital are we all going to move into together?

 

Seriously, there must be some past episode where a hand-in-pockets Gregson said 500% that is blending into this one for all of us.  At least that is the explanation I am most comfortable with....

 

A guaranteed "like" for the person that can come up with the name of that episode

Edited by MaryHedwig
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I re watched on On Demand and the scene wasn't there.

You know what we need? To hire a good P I.

But on re watch, it seemed to me that Oscar was a bit too quick and looked a healthy weight to be a junkie. TV has taught me that junkies are dirty (well, that one seems to fit), scrawny & chronically brain addled.

I was hoping he'd pocket the rehab info after Sherlock turned away.

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But on re watch, it seemed to me that Oscar was a bit too quick and looked a healthy weight to be a junkie. TV has taught me that junkies are dirty (well, that one seems to fit), scrawny & chronically brain addled.

I known what you mean, he looked like an actor playing a junkie.  But I think they did nail down that "lean and hungry" look...something about Michael Weston's eyes...  Breaking Bad had the same problem, Aaron Paul (Jess Pinkman) had the whitest, most even, perfectly shaped teeth in the world, they looked nothing like a junkie's teeth.  I guess there is only so much you can ask an actor to do....

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So I am remembering Gregson putting his hands in his pockets too when he said it.  Hey, what mental hospital are we all going to move into together?

Seriously, there must be some past episode where a hand-in-pockets Gregson said 500% that is blending into this one for all of us.  At least that is the explanation I am most comfortable with....

A guaranteed "like" for the person that can come up with the name of that episode

 

 

My guess is Details, where Bell was the suspect. I'm still waiting on shapeshifter and stealinghome to tell me where Gregson's apology for not giving Holmes a head's-up is ;)

 

I re watched on On Demand and the scene wasn't there.

 

 

Thanks, Delurker. I was seriously beginning to doubt myself.

 

But on re watch, it seemed to me that Oscar was a bit too quick and looked a healthy weight to be a junkie. TV has taught me that junkies are dirty (well, that one seems to fit), scrawny & chronically brain addled.

I was hoping he'd pocket the rehab info after Sherlock turned away.

 

 

 

 

I think the card was just a business card. Oscar only has to remember the name of the place, show up and give his name - and yes, I think Sherlock paid for it. Maybe there's hope for Oscar yet.

 

I known what you mean, he looked like an actor playing a junkie.  But I think they did nail down that "lean and hungry" look...something about Michael Weston's eyes...  Breaking Bad had the same problem, Aaron Paul (Jess Pinkman) had the whitest, most even, perfectly shaped teeth in the world, they looked nothing like a junkie's teeth.

 

 

 

Cassius was a heroin junkie? ;)

 

....but seriously folks - big. BIG difference between a meth addict and a heroin addict. Meth is almost uniformly devastating to a person's health and looks (especially teeth), whereas a heroin addict can be high functioning and in comparatively good health for decades with a  steady supply of high grade heroin - I've seen it. I know a heroin addict that you wouldn't have a clue used heroin - quite a successful businessman. Nice teeth, tailor-made suits - and shoots heroin every day. Has for over a decade. Still does.

 

eta:

While I don't expect them to send a muffin basket and "Sorry we shunned you for thinking you murdered a family member" card ( Hallmark has that right?), something from the brother who Sherlock could still put back in jail if so moved. Maybe a phone scene where Joan asks and Sherlock says it's the brother and that Prentis( ?) owes him a favor. Something. Same for the cops from the 3-5.

 

The 35 police were just doing their job, following up a valid lead. They didn't mistreat Sherlock, just asked him questions. The murdered woman's brother did unjustly beat Sherlock (wonder who the other guy was?), but even Sherlock said he bore him no ill will, and let's not forget that it was the brother that gave them the information that lead to the murderer's arrest. I think Sherlock considered that apology enough (I'm still laughing at Holmes' description of the beating as a "brief physical relationship").

Edited by basil
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The 35 police were just doing their job, following up a valid lead. They didn't mistreat Sherlock, just asked him questions. The murdered woman's brother did unjustly beat Sherlock (wonder who the other guy was?), but even Sherlock said he bore him no ill will, and let's not forget that it was the brother that gave them the information that lead to the murderer's arrest. I think Sherlock considered that apology enough (I'm still laughing at Holmes' description of the beating as a "brief physical relationship").

Elementary does such a good job of making their extras seem like full human beings that we want to know more about them and have their stories continue.  I am still holding out for more air time for Pam who drove the snow plow...  Along with the up-thread poster, I was looking for some apologies or restored justice from the 35 and the victim's brother.  Maybe because one of the worst things I can think of, besides the illness of a family member, is being falsely accused of something.

 

I could imagine Richard Brooks from the 35 popping up again when he needs a consult and Sherlock using Prentis as an irregular, that was a solid acting performance, wasn't it?  Two plot problems I had though, Prentis seemed very antisocial and impulsive, and yet he is together enough to own/manage an auto shop?  Also who was the other thug that made Sherlock's "physical realtionship" a three-way?  That's a big favor to do for your boss.

Edited by MaryHedwig
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I was looking for some apologies or restored justice from the 35

 

 

What do they have to apologise for? Questioning a valid suspect? They didn't even play hardball. As to the brother, Sherlock is used to taking beatings as far back as boarding school, and once took a pretty brutal beating in order to get information from an undercover agent. Plus, gotta say. this Sherlock does seem to be a bit of a masochist , sexually and otherwise, at times.

 

Two plot problems I had though, Prentis seemed very antisocial and impulsive, and yet he is together enough to own/manage an auto shop?

 

 

It actually is not terribly uncommon for former criminals to own/manage places like that. It's honest and decent paying work, and most of your interactions are with machines, not people. The antisocial bit was probably also part fear of Sherlock having him arrested, part protection he built up while in prison.

 

 

Also who was the other thug that made Sherlock's "physical realtionship" a three-way?  That's a big favor to do for your boss.

 

 

Nice, adding the "three-way" bit. ;) I asked the same question, but once I thought about it, I just figured it was another brother. The murdered woman seemed to have a fairly large family. If not, Prentis is a former criminal. Maybe it was an old cellmate who owed him a favor - in which case, lucky Sherlock picked the right pocket.

 

I watched part of Details, the episode where Bell was a suspect, and Gregson said something about having to "color between the lines" on this one because Bell was the suspect.

 

stealinghome's post is pretty much verbatim Gregson's words from the episode:

 

 

This could be an interesting social experiment, regarding the "500%" remark and Gregson's apology to Holmes after the 5 minute interview. Delurker didn't see that scene upon re watching, nor did fartypants or myself (and I watched it only one hour after it aired). I realise you may not visit here often, shapeshifter and stealinghome, but is it possible for you to re watch and verify that you saw the Gregson 500% by the books apology scene after the interrogation? I am now very curious whether that scene existed at all.

 

ps: Thanks, jhlipton. I was hoping someone would catch that. Such men are dangerous, you know...  ;)

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I am now very curious whether that scene existed at all.

 

Me too! I wish I had kept my DVR version after watching it that night, in order to go back and check it again, but I usually delete right after I watch an episode, in order to keep my DVR "inbox" from getting too overwhelming.

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I am now very curious whether that scene existed at all.

 

 

Me too! I wish I had kept my DVR version after watching it that night, in order to go back and check it again, but I usually delete right after I watch an episode, in order to keep my DVR "inbox" from getting too overwhelming.

 

 

See, that's the thing. I DO have my recording, I have watched it beginning to end FiVE times (I have the flu, so I don't have much else to do). Nowhere in it is the scene that shapeshifter is certain that stealinghome is quoting "verbatim", nor is the figure 500%.. I'm just wondering if they can re watch to see if they are conflating this with another episode or this is a weird anomoly.

 

It isn't uncommon for scenes to be cut from reruns (usually for time) but it is very uncommon for scenes to be cut first run, especially in major markets like Boston and NYC.

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I watched on the West Coast, and I would absolutely swear that there was a line by Gregson that went "Because it's you, we have to do things (300? 500?) percent by the book."  I've never been part of a mass hallucination before!

 

(I'm sure I'm not conflating something from another episode -- the only thing I can think is remotely possible, besides the scene somehow existing in some transmissions but not others, is that I could have been influenced by reading this forum before I saw it.  Or the line appeared in Better Call Saul, which is the only other thing I watched last weekend.  But how can so many people be so sure it was in this episode?) 

Edited by rk23
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I watched on the West Coast, and I would absolutely swear that there was a line by Gregson that went "Because it's you, we have to do things (300? 500?) percent by the book."  I've never been part of a mass hallucination before!

 

Yessssss. Join us!  ;)

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I watched on the West Coast, and I would absolutely swear that there was a line by Gregson that went "Because it's you, we have to do things (300? 500?) percent by the book."  I've never been part of a mass hallucination before!

 

 

Not that you know of ;)

 

I'm sure I'm not conflating something from another episode -- the only thing I can think is remotely possible, besides the scene somehow existing in some transmissions but not others, is that I could have been influenced by reading this forum before I saw it.  Or the line appeared in Better Call Saul, which is the only other thing I watched last weekend.  But how can so many people be so sure it was in this episode?

 

 

Then you're not sure ;)

 

Eyewitness accounts have been proven to be notoriously unreliable. People are easily suggestible. Is there one single person on this forum who has a recording of that scene?

 

Just one?

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I watched on the West Coast, and I would absolutely swear that there was a line by Gregson that went "Because it's you, we have to do things (300? 500?) percent by the book."  I've never been part of a mass hallucination before!

I watched it on the West Coast as well and I would have sworn Gregson said 500%.  I can tell you it is not mentioned on the version I bought on Amazon.

 

Gosh, I spent all day feeling sane at work and now I come back to my peeps and our shared delusion.

Welcome to the shadow world...

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Makes me wonder how many other great scenes throughout the seasons have been deleted.

 

 

Scenes get filmed and deleted all the time - but we don't even know if this one ever existed. Recently, I think a scene in a preview ended up on the cutting room floor before the show aired. I haven't worked on this show since last summer, but I'm seriously tempted to see if I can't get my hands on this script.

 

I watched it on the West Coast as well and I would have sworn Gregson said 500%.  I can tell you it is not mentioned on the version I bought on Amazon

 

.

 

See that makes even less sense. If a scene were going to be cut, it would have been cut on the East coast (unless there was some odd time factor involved). I can't think of any reason at all why it would be cut from Amazon.

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Gosh, I spent all day feeling sane at work and now I come back to my peeps and our shared delusion.

Welcome to the shadow world...

I'm glad I have company - it sucks when you hallucinate all by your lonesome.

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It's a mystery!  I watched on the west coast, and there wasn't a scene like that in my broadcast (though it's very easy for me to imagine a scene like that because I could totally see Gregson saying that exactly), and I watched my DVR'd live version twice to make sure.  

 

I did a little googling because I thought maybe there were other versions of the promo that might have had that scene (since there will often be scenes in the promo that don't make it into the final cut), but I only found two versions online and neither had the scene.  What I did find in my googling though, was a tumblr post with Sherlock and Bell, with Gregson in the background and the caption reading "Captain Gregson is 500% done with Sherlock's obvious crush".  Which I'm sure was from back when Bell and Sherlock were on the outs, but that's obviously not the right context.  The other thing I noted was that, having read that the title sequence at the beginning of the show is edited longer or shorter depending on how long the episode is, this title card was just the final "Elementary" with NY in the background, no rolling marble at all so the episode itself was already as long as it could be to fit in the time slot without a scene like that being included.  But I'm still hoping that there is a scene like that somewhere out there!  Has anyone asked the @Elementary_CBS or the @ELEMENTARYStaff twitter?

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I am now very curious whether that scene existed at all.

 

Thank you Previously TV Monitoring Staff for letting us continue to wax on about this, I have been dreading a kibosh from them. 

 

I did come up with a name for us last night, the 500% club.

 

On a different topic, really there are other ones, for the first time this week I have had an Elementary song run through my head.  It a background instrumental that goes on while we watched Sherlock move around in the solving zone.  When he does this at a crime scene, others are watching him with expressions that range from awe to disgust.  I believe the first time I heard it was in the pilot episode when he was on the floor in the kitchen.  I believe that in the recent flashback-to-London episode it played while he was teaching Kitty to open a door with a chain using a rubber band.  It could be in every episode.  Have a given someone here enough clues to identity it?  If so, and you know, can you please tell me more about the song?

Edited by MaryHedwig
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I think I heard Gregson say that the dress was 500% white and gold... no, that's not right! I seem to recall hearing the 500% as well (in Los Angeles). I don't have the episode any more either, and don't have time to slog through On Demand right now. Maybe this week-end.

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You're right about the discussion about the inability of (immediately) getting the witness' name, but the figure 500% never came up in that discussion. I don't think that number came up in this episode at all.

Are you very sure that Gregson said those words of explanation/apology to Sherlock, shapeshifter?

At this point, y'all could totally convince me I was possessed by the "hive mind" while sleep watching when I "heard" the "500% by the book" line, LOL.

If I find something definitive, I'll post.

ETA: If it helps: I watched live the first airing.

Edited by shapeshifter
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Does anyone know what the song or music was at the end of the episode? When a Sherlock goes to see Oscar about rehab. It was perfection. It worked beautifully with JLM's portrayal of Sherlock being haunted by his demons, past and present.

Edited by Texasmom1970
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Does anyone know what the song or music was at the end of the episode? When a Sherlock goes to see Oscar about rehab. It was perfection. It worked beautifully with JLM's portrayal of Sherlock being haunted by his demons, past and present.

I was given a link to a website that posts the music from various tv shows.

 

It says the song was Dark Hopes by Barbarossa.

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On a different topic, really there are other ones, for the first time this week I have had an Elementary song run through my head.  It a background instrumental that goes on while we watched Sherlock move around in the solving zone.

Figured out the answer to my own question.  It is all over youtube, mostly called Sherlock's theme (or Elementary: Sherlock's Theme.)  It has gotten into my pores.

 

Regarding our folie à deux, shared psychosis, a psychiatric syndrome in which symptoms of a delusional belief are transmitted from one individual to another, I believe this happened to us because we immersed ourselves so deeply into the Elementary world that we imagined a dialogue verbatim for a scene that was not there.  Can't you imagine a scene between Bell and Watson that might have occurred in this episode in which Bell insists on helping Watson find the victim's real killer; Watson says she doesn't want Bell to get in trouble; Bell tells Watson to leave it to him to explain his involvement to Gregson if he has to; Watson asks how she can repay him; Bell says "repay me by calling me Marcus"; Watson inscrutably bats her eyelashes; we all wonder if sparks are flying....

Edited by MaryHedwig
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I record a lot of tv, and have a lot of shows that I'm still making my way through from last season.  Anyways, I just watched the version that I originally recorded back when it first aired, and all I can tell you is that there was no scene of Gregson talking to Sherlock after the interrogation and apologizing for not giving a heads-up.  Gregson doesn't appear again until about 40 minutes into the episode, and there's no further one on one with Sherlock.

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