Tennis Thread

[truthaboutluv]

I've been meh since Rafa lost. And once Djokovic had another retirement and I saw the writing on the wall, I was done.

I'm still interested in the women's final because I like Kerber. I also think it could be a good match, since Plishkova just beat Kerber in Cincinnati.

But as for the men, yeah no crap given. Even people who aren't anti-Novak, I think will still be "who gives a shit" if he wins, considering how it happened. It's just disappointing and uninteresting for the game.

Edited September 10, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[BitterApple]

57 minutes ago, MostlyC said:

I didn't get to watch the match- what happened?

Monfils tanked parts of the match, including pretty much the entire fourth set. 

[mojoween]

Much like when Tiger was playing, now that Serena is out I've lost interest.

Also I have no one to really root for on the men's side.  I guess I can get behind Stan but he's no Delpo.

[Ohwell]

42 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Monfils tanked parts of the match, including pretty much the entire fourth set. 

Did he really?  Was he hurt? I didn't watch the match.  I do believe there are some people who are just like kryptonite to athletes; try as they might, they just can't seem to beat them.  I just think that, unfortunately, Djokovic is his kryptonite and I just give a sigh and accept that.

I'm done with the men's side now that Monfils and Delpo are out.  I thought the women's final would be meh because I figured Serena would be in it, but now it's looking more interesting. 

Edited September 10, 2016 by Ohwell

[BitterApple]

1 hour ago, Ohwell said:

Did he really?  Was he hurt? I didn't watch the match.  

In his press conference he said he did it deliberately to see if it would throw Djokovic off, because his original game plan wasn't working.

[pennben]

So weird.  He went down 5-0 in the first set in 24 minutes (so indeed, whatever his initial plan was, it wasn't working!!:), then just basically stood inside the baseline and stuck his racquet out when the serve came and ended up breaking Djokovic before the set ended at 6-3, I think.  Then he went back to hangdogging it in the second, but occasionally would play a few good points, but then after a couple of breaks, back to awful.  At the end of the second set, he made it look like he hurt his ankle and hobbled off to the side to boos.  He thereafter came back out (perfectly fine, of course) and played his best tennis of the match and won the third set.  Back to hangdog in the fourth, hands on knees between all serves (unless he won the point), followed by trainer timeouts by both (with Monfils leaving the court during Djokovic's medical time out); just an awful, awful final set and match.  Oh, I forgot to mention when Djokovic blew 3 break points in the third set to get back on serve, he ripped his shirt half-way down to his navel and had to play the rest of that game with a shredded shirt.  It was just an unbelievably bizarre match.  Apparently it was horribly hot and humid so they were both wiped by the end.

Edited September 10, 2016 by pennben

[Ohwell]

Ouch.  That does sound like it was a weird match.  And Monfils got booed?  Glad I didn't watch.

[BitterApple]

As much as I love Monfils, it was warranted. It looked like he was making zero effort at times. The crowd probably felt that both their time and money was wasted watching this match.

[bluepiano]

Anyone else find it ironic that McEnroe lambasted Monfils for disgracing the game of tennis with his antics, when during his own playing days, many people said the same thing about McEnroe? He came along at the tail end of a generation of players like Laver, Ashe, and Rosewall, who always conducted themselves on the court with great dignity and sportsmanship. McEnroe completely broke with tennis tradition and acted like an obnoxious spoiled brat. Now he tries to pass himself off as the defender and protector of the sanctity of tennis. I ain't buying it.

As for what Monfils did, well, all I can say is that he did get himself back into the match, and nothing he did is technically against the rules. Plus, I admit that I loved seeing Novak getting his cage rattled. The commentators said that Monfils was playing "rope-a-dope," a reference to the old Muhammed Ali tactic. Interesting that when back when Ali was doing that, boxing purists were outraged and said that it wasn't "real boxing" and that he was demeaning the sport. So Ali is now an icon, but he pissed people off back then, the way Monfils did yesterday.

[xaxat]

Tennis fans, how good would Monfils be if he had his head on straight? To this casual observer, he's always seemed physically talented, but emotionally flaky and easily distracted. 

[Ohwell]

I don't know if I would call Monfils "emotionally flaky" or "easily distracted" but throughout his career, he's been painted as physically talented but not mentally strong enough, and he's taken a lot of lumps from critics like McEnroe because of it.  Monfils used to frustrate the hell out of me and many other people who love his personality.  However, I've gotten over my frustration because I don't really know what's in his head.  Neither do McEnroe and the rest of the critics.  

Frankly, I'm sick of the criticism and McEnroe can go kick rocks.  I just appreciate and enjoy watching him play now and I'm so happy when he wins.  Plus, I think he's done well with endorsements.   

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, xaxat said:

Tennis fans, how good would Monfils be if he had his head on straight? To this casual observer, he's always seemed physically talented, but emotionally flaky and easily distracted. 

I think Monfils' talent and athleticism alone would make him a top 5 player, I just think he lacks the killer instinct to really gut out tough matches on a consistent basis. I don't know if he wants it bad enough. The physical side is there, but the mental isn't.

[Ohwell]

I'm not even sure it's just Monfils who might not want it bad enough.  I do believe that there are some players, including Monfils, who are perfectly happy taking in one or two million a year or more in prize money and endorsements, without having to deal with the pressure of being in, and staying in, the top five.  And that's fine by me.

[bluepiano]

In last year as a junior Monfils came very close to winning the junior version of a calendar year Grand Slam, winning at the Australian Open, French Open, and Wimbledon. That amazing year generated huge expectations, and so he's been regarded as an underachiever, never having reached a Slam Final or won a Masters. He also has a pretty dismal record in tournament finals, winning only 6 of 25.

10 hours ago, Ohwell said:

I'm not even sure it's just Monfils who might not want it bad enough.  I do believe that there are some players, including Monfils, who are perfectly happy taking in one or two million a year or more in prize money and endorsements, without having to deal with the pressure of being in, and staying in, the top five.  And that's fine by me.

This sounds right to me. Combined with the fact that he came along at a time when Federer, Nadal, and Djokovic were dominating tennis. I think he looked at these guys with their fierce, all-consuming desire to win, and realized he had the talent but not the drive to compete with them. Or a desire to put in the work. He's someone who wants to enjoy life, and tennis is a means to making that happen. Even if he never reaches the very top level of the game.

In a way he's kind of a throwback to an earlier tennis era, when the big money didn't exist, and guys played tennis to be able to travel and party and not have to get a "real job."

But even in that weird semi-final he showed flashes of brilliance. When he began playing defensively to throw Djokovic off, slicing the ball and hitting off-speed, I was thinking, wow, this guy can do anything he wants on a tennis court.

Edited September 11, 2016 by bluepiano

[Ohwell]

Before he played Djokovic, the commentators discussed how focused Monfils had become.  I think part of it is that he turned 30 and realizes that he's got maybe five more years to really be competitive.  Also, I read that he's bought a luxury penthouse condo in Miami and when he won the Citi Open, I joked with a friend that he's really motivated now since he has to pay for another home.  

[truthaboutluv]

Okay, so folks watching right now, is Djokovic pulling some gamesmanship with this medical time-out? First of all, I am pretty sure I saw him holding around his groin area and walking like that was troubling him, yet they are checking his toes? And he's taken both shoes off and this all needed to happen before Stan's serve, even though a changeover was coming up after he served? 

[Ohwell]

12 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Okay, so folks watching right now, is Djokovic pulling some gamesmanship with this medical time-out? First of all, I am pretty sure I saw him holding around his groin area and walking like that was troubling him, yet they are checking his toes? And he's taken both shoes off and this all needed to happen before Stan's serve, even though a changeover was coming up after he served? 

Short answer:  Yes.  Even the announcers have as much as said so.

I didn't see most of the match with Monfils but it appears from the discussions that they both tried to play the injury card and Djokovic won out? 

[bluepiano]

Yeah, that was BS. As McEnroe said, the referees don't have the guts to enforce the rules when it comes to the game's superstars. Can you imagine a guy ranked outside the Top 50 (or even outside the top 10) being allowed a full medical time-out when there was no changeover, barring a major injury?

And now Novak seems to be moving around with no issue. Gee, what a surprise.

Edited September 12, 2016 by bluepiano

[truthaboutluv]

All is right in the world. I'm sorry, yes it wasn't Djokovic's fault but if he'd won that title with the way he got to the Finals, it would have left a VERY bad taste in my mouth. Stan more than earned that title. And talk about impressive - 3-0 in Grand Slam finals. Dude knows how to show up on the big stage. 

[Ohwell]

Major congrats to Stan.  Djokovic tried his best to throw him off his game and he just wasn't having it.  I'm so happy for him.  It would have been a travesty if Djokovic had won considering how he got to the finals.

8 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Dude knows how to show up on the big stage. 

He sure does.

[azshadowwalker]

Great job, Stan. Will always think he was a scumbag for the way he treated his wife when she was having their child. Will always think he looks like Droopy. Of the options, though, I am happy he won. Unlike Monfils, he has gone from that guy who basically gave up vs Federer in the SF of the Aussie to the guy who has won 3/4 of the majors. Respect the hell out of what he has done late in his career after climbing out of Fed's shadow. 

And, of course, Djokovic returning to his medical time-out ruse he loved when he was younger. Got some shit-talking about Vika that needs to be shoved down his throat. What an asshole. 

Edited September 12, 2016 by azshadowwalker

[Ohwell]

Honestly, I don't even know what the "unlike Monfils" stuff means and I don't think it's fair to compare Monfils to Warwrinka.   Two separate guys.  Two separate paths.

[azshadowwalker]

I know you don't want any criticisms of Monfils, but they are going to happen. No, I don't care how many endorsements he has. He, like Wawrinka, was mentally weak when they were young and caved often. Stan got his shit together. Gael did not and doesn't appear to care enough to do so. Love the guy, but he deserved to be booed for tanking. He should find something else to do. Sports are for people who like to compete. It's kind of the point. I don't watch sports to see rich dudes indulge themselves. I watch to see players compete. 

Hell, Kournikova made a shit ton on endorsements. And she seemed to care about coming up short on the court. I have more respect for that. 

Edited September 12, 2016 by azshadowwalker

[BitterApple]

If Djokovic had came back to win after that bullshit "injury" time out, I would've thrown something at the tv. Stunts like that are why the crowd will never fully get behind him. And to pull that crap right before Stan's serve. They really need to change the rules to end this sort of abuse and gamesmanship.

[Ohwell]

There were times when Djokovic looked downright desperate, and I really enjoyed that.   

12 hours ago, azshadowwalker said:

I know you don't want any criticisms of Monfils, but they are going to happen.

Oh please.   I've criticized him in the past, you tend to critique people you like and are interested in.  However, I gave up a few years ago because I'm not him, so I just enjoy watching him play.  

You mentioned Stan and his wife, and I heard he left her so he could concentrate on his tennis (I don't know if they're still together and I don't care enough to look it up).  Apparently, it worked for him but if that's what it takes to get your shit together, some people might say he sacrificed a lot to win a few slams--not me, mind you, because I don't care, but I'm just sayin'.

[Qoass]

Is there the smallest chance in the world that the Mac brothers will quit talking about Djokovic like he's the second coming now?

Nah; didn't think so.  I think half the reason I hate Djokovic so much is because all the announcers love him so much.  The other half is that to me he looks like a mean version of the Man in the Yellow Hat from the Curious George books.

And speaking of color, I love that Wawrinka outdid that orange & pink plaid of last year with a solid magenta outfit this year.

[truthaboutluv]

Quote

I think half the reason I hate Djokovic so much is because all the announcers love him so much. 

They do? I think Djokovic would be a happy man if they did love him more. I think they all respect his talent and success but I've never gotten this deification from them that happens with Federer and even with Sampras when he was dominating. John McEnroe was the one who earlier this year stated in an interview that Djokovic very well may end up surpassing Federer in Grand Slam titles and yet he will never be as beloved as Federer or even Rafa. 

[Qoass]

True, but all I ever hear is how unbeatable NJ is so it tickles me when he is defeated.

[roseha]

I could probably stand Djoker (except when he tries to pull a fast one as he did yesterday) but I'm glad Stan beat him and doubly glad they had to stop showing Boris "mind games" Becker celebrating.  There's a guy I'd like to see off my TV for good.  It was only about a year ago that Becker tried to stir up something by claiming Nole and Roger "didn't like each other."  Some people never change.  I think BB's major contribution as "coach" is coming up with ways to try to fake out the opposition.

[BitterApple]

Speaking of coaches, did anyone notice how incredible Magnus Norman looked yesterday? What is it with these ageless Swedes? There must be something in the water.

[roseha]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Speaking of coaches, did anyone notice how incredible Magnus Norman looked yesterday? What is it with these ageless Swedes? There must be something in the water.

Yes, I noticed that when Stefan Edberg (one of my all time faves along with Federer) was coaching Roger very recently.

Edited September 13, 2016 by roseha
Corrected spelling of Stefan's name!

[Harry24]

Quote

 

Speaking of coaches, did anyone notice how incredible Magnus Norman looked yesterday? What is it with these ageless Swedes? There must be something in the water.

*************

Yes, I noticed that when Stephen Edberg (one of my all time faves along with Federer) was coaching Roger very recently.

 

My lord, yes!  Add Borg to that pantheon of middle aged beauty.  I call it LWS (Living While Swedish).

So happy Stan won.  I find his game so beautiful, especially that great backhand, and just can't warm to Djoker.  It doesn't help that the aesthetics of his game, however great, do not appeal to me.  Same problem with Murray and Serena too, so it's been rather a dull time for this tennis fan.  So glad that Stan struck blow for Beautiful Power Tennis.  Now if Kvitova would just get her act in gear.  I'm hoping that Pliskova's success lights a fire under PK.

Edited September 12, 2016 by Harry24

[caracas1914]

Novak couldn't help but revert to ole gamemanship Joker when the chips were on the line, that was such a flagrant abuse of the rules when Stan was about to serve.  Novak got into a tough physically draining match and panicked so I'm glad it didn't work out for him.  So I guess the trick for Wawrinka is to actually make it to a final, where he's unbeatable. 

Agree that Magnus Norman has an aging portrait somewhere back in Sweden.

Edited September 14, 2016 by caracas1914

[sacrebleu]

I was happy that Stan won, I was even happier when the announcer accidentally called the runner up Jo-vac Nokavich. heh

and, although I know it's fruitless-- I really wish someone would tell the USTA that the whole prize money thing is sooooooo tacky. The USA Open is the only slam that mentions the cash during the award presentation, and it suffers for it.

(I think I complained about this before-- but it can't be said enough-- show some class, USTA!)

[bluepiano]

Stan played an amazing match, and to have won all three of his Grand Slam finals shows what a great big match player he is. I'm not a Nole fan, and deplore the gamesmanship, and his constant talk about his "team," but he did seem gracious in defeat. He said that Stan was the more courageous player, and that was a good way to describe it.

I'm thinking also of the shot of the tournament, that screaming down the line backhand that saved match point against Daniel Evans. Stan had the courage to go for an out right winner. It's like he was saying, I'm going to hit my best shot, and I'll either still be in the match or out of the tournament. He let it all ride.

Personality aside, there's just something about Novak's game I don't find inspiring. He's the greatest defensive player I've ever seen. He's like a human backboard. But even if he wins 20 or 25 Slams, people will never look upon him with the mixture of awe and affection accorded to Roger or Rafa.

And aesthetically, the one handed backhanded is still the most beautiful shot in tennis, whether it's Stan, Roger, Gasquet etc. I don't think anyone has ever described a two handed backhand as "elegant."

Edited September 13, 2016 by bluepiano

[EVS]

On September 12, 2016 at 9:06 AM, Ohwell said:

There were times when Djokovic looked downright desperate, and I really enjoyed that.   

Oh please.   I've criticized him in the past, you tend to critique people you like and are interested in.  However, I gave up a few years ago because I'm not him, so I just enjoy watching him play.  

You mentioned Stan and his wife, and I heard he left her so he could concentrate on his tennis (I don't know if they're still together and I don't care enough to look it up).  Apparently, it worked for him but if that's what it takes to get your shit together, some people might say he sacrificed a lot to win a few slams--not me, mind you, because I don't care, but I'm just sayin'.

FWIW, from what I remember (and I'm terrible with details), Stan and his wife divorced and he was/is dating a female player whose name I don't recall. (Did they show her during this final? I watched with the volume down/off during most of the match) The female player used to date Australian player Thanasis Kokkinakis.  When Stan and Nick Kyrgios had a spat last year, Kyrgios (on court) made a crude comment about Thanasis and Stan's girlfriend.  (Eta:) Kyrgios got fined for the comment. 

Edited September 15, 2016 by EVS

[Ohwell]

6 minutes ago, EVS said:

FWIW, from what I remember (and I'm terrible with details), Stan and his wife divorced and he was/is dating a female player whose name I don't recall. (Did they show her during this final? I watched with the volume down/off during most of the match) The female player used to date Australian player Thanasis Kokkinakis.  When Stan and Nick Kyrgios had a spat last year, Kyrgios (on court) made a crude comment about Thanasis and Stan's girlfriend.  

Yes, you're right I remember that dustup with Kyrgios.  But before that happened, I read an article where Stan said that he separated from his wife to concentrate on his tennis.  (What he didn't say was that he also probably wanted out of the marriage.)

[EVS]

1 minute ago, Ohwell said:

Yes, you're right I remember that dustup with Kyrgios.  But before that happened, I read an article where Stan said that he separated from his wife to concentrate on his tennis.  (What he didn't say was that he also probably wanted out of the marriage.)

I remember reading that too. 

[sacrebleu]

so.. here's our 'first look' at Shia LaBeouf as John McEnroe. (this looks bad guys)

http://www.gq.com/story/shia-labeouf-john-mcenroe-movie

[Ohwell]

Ugh.

[xaxat]

I was surprise to read that Kyrgios is only 21. 

It feels like he has been an asshole on the tour for a looong time.

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, xaxat said:

I was surprise to read that Kyrgios is only 21. 

It feels like he has been an asshole on the tour for a looong time.

He's just 21?! Christ on a cracker, it seems like we've been watching him act like an arrogant douchebag for a decade. I just read on ESPN about him being fined for lack of effort during a match. Someone on his team better tell him to get his shit together before the bottom line ($$$) starts hurting.

[truthaboutluv]

Yeah I can believe he's that young because I'm pretty sure he was only 18/19 when he beat Rafa at Wimbledon and that was in 2014. It's why some of the tennis media have tried to excuse his shitty behavior with the "he's young, he'll grow out of it" spiel.

[shok]

On 9/15/2016 at 4:24 PM, Ohwell said:

Yes, you're right I remember that dustup with Kyrgios.  But before that happened, I read an article where Stan said that he separated from his wife to concentrate on his tennis.  (What he didn't say was that he also probably wanted out of the marriage.)

You're right, Stan did separate from his wife using the excuse he wanted to concentrate on tennis. At the time his baby was only about 6-8 months old so he got a lot of flak for it. They reconciled a while later but split up again after a couple of years. Again, his dirty laundry got aired in public as his wife (who is 10 years older than him) gave an interview to a Swiss paper saying the divorce was all Stan's fault, that he hadn't been faithful, that he hadn't even tried to work on their problems. There were rumors about Stan having a fling with 17 yr old Donna Vekic so her being under-age didn't help his reputation but after a couple of years, they're still together and she sits in his box at his matches (as does he for hers) and their relationship is now accepted and acknowledged in the tennis world. She's maybe 20 now.

[roseha]

Boris Becker says Novak Djokovic's form dipped due to absence of Roger Federer and Rafael Nadal

Boris "man of a thousand excuses" Becker strikes again!

[khyber]

 That  was a crazy epic Davis Cup. Congrats to the Argentines  for finally doing it . 

[bluepiano]

I'm glad that Argentina, a great tennis nation, finally won the Davis Cup after being runner-up several times. But I'm really thrilled for Juan Martin Del Potro, a terrific guy who would've accomplished a lot more in his career if not for all the injuries. The Olympics Silver Medal must've been sweet, but this is probably even bigger for him. (I think most Americans have no sense of how important the Davis Cup is around the world)

With Argentina facing elimination, he came back from 0-2 in sets against Marin Cilic, who's been playing very well, and he did it in Croatia, with thousands of crazed fans against him. That's an amazing and historic win.

I would love to see him stay healthy and win another Grand Slam. I think that tennis fans everywhere, outside of hardcore Djoko and Murray supporters, would root for him. With the future looking shaky for Federer, tennis desperately needs a Slam contender with charisma and popularity, someone who communicates a sense of joy at playing the game.

I'm personally not looking forward to a constant diet of Djokovic vs. Murray finals. They're great players, no doubt, but it's like watching a couple of machines going at it. For the most part, the only emotions they ever show are negative ones. Djokovic will occasionally acknowledge another player's great shot, which I like, but that's overshadowed by all the chest thumping and "look at how great I am" posturing.

Edited November 29, 2016 by bluepiano

[crimsongrl]

Petra Kvitova suffers 'severe' hand injury by knife-wielding burglar

[roseha]

On 12/20/2016 at 9:38 AM, crimsongrl said:

Petra Kvitova suffers 'severe' hand injury by knife-wielding burglar

I just saw this story today.  Poor Petra, it sounds like she was very brave though.  The great news today is that she can move her left hand so is hopeful of an eventual comeback.  Here is the story.

Edited December 24, 2016 by roseha

[dcalley]

How horrible.

In happier news, Victoria Azarenka had her baby.