Mr. Carter: The Secret Future Husband

[Snarkette]

Top contender seems to be Enver Gjokaj, which suits me just perfectly, but I'm half-hoping that Mrs Anna drops dead and Peggy ends up as Mrs Butler. 

[Malbec]

I had always liked the fanon (I think it's fanon rather than canon?) that Peggy married one of the Howling Commandoes, with Gabe Jones being my top choice.  But at this point, I'd also be totally OK with it being Sousa.  They've done a nice job establishing him as her "type" without making him too much of a Steve knock-off. We know that Peggy lives to old age, and I could see Sousa being the type you grow old with.  Assuming he isn't secretly HYDRA, of course!

 

As for Jarvis... I wouldn't necessarily object if he was the future Mr. Carter, but to me their chemistry works very well platonically and doesn't read as particularly sexual to me.  That said, I like Atwell and D'Arcy together well enough that I could go with it.

[Minneapple]

An article at EW.com put forth the idea of Thompson/Peggy, which...might make me squirm a bit. Thompson hasn't done anything particularly horrible other than be a douche, but I just can't get over The Chad. I keep having bad One Tree Hill flashbacks.

Not fond of the idea of Jarvis/Peggy, particularly after the way he spoke about his wife in yesterday's ep.

[Llywela]

I had always liked the fanon (I think it's fanon rather than canon?) that Peggy married one of the Howling Commandoes, with Gabe Jones being my top choice.

I think it's fanon, but it arises from the fact the Winter Soldier film specifically tells us that Captain America saved the life of Peggy's eventual husband, which many fans link with his saving of the captured Howling Commandos in the first film. The show has yet to draw that link with anyone - none of the other characters give the impression of ever having met Steve.

[Danny Franks]

An article at EW.com put forth the idea of Thompson/Peggy, which...might make me squirm a bit. Thompson hasn't done anything particularly horrible other than be a douche, but I just can't get over The Chad. I keep having bad One Tree Hill flashbacks.

Not fond of the idea of Jarvis/Peggy, particularly after the way he spoke about his wife in yesterday's ep.

 

I think it would be interesting if they did an about turn with Sousa/Thompson, and revealed Sousa as a villain and Thompson as a good guy who just acts like a tool. It'd would be more interesting than the current, rather unimaginative characterisation of both of them.

 

I just find Sousa to be a sort of ultimate, non-threatening fantasy guy, and not a very interesting one. I'd rather that we discover that we haven't met Peggy's husband yet, because that really isn't of interest to me, nor should it be to Peggy, at this stage.

[Malbec]

Ehhhh Thompson.  Unless he's secretly working for Howard and the "patronizing toolbag" thing is a COMPLETE act, I'm not here for Thompson/Peggy.  The "jerk who just needs to be softened up by a woman" is a fairly tiresome cliche in its own right.

 

I think it's fanon, but it arises from the fact the Winter Soldier film specifically tells us that Captain America saved the life of Peggy's eventual husband, which many fans link with his saving of the captured Howling Commandos in the first film. The show has yet to draw that link with anyone - none of the other characters give the impression of ever having met Steve.

 

Right - I do remember that, but I couldn't remember if Gabe/Peggy was ever a thing in the comics.  Doing some Googling tells me that it was.

[kennyab]

I just find Sousa to be a sort of ultimate, non-threatening fantasy guy, and not a very interesting one. I'd rather that we discover that we haven't met Peggy's husband yet, because that really isn't of interest to me, nor should it be to Peggy, at this stage.

 

I know people are just interested because we know a bit of how her future is going to turn out, so there's an air of mystery about the husband's identity (maybe this is what became of the failed pilot for How I Met Your Dad), but it does oddly feel like the meta version of the woman who runs the hotel inquiring about the future prospects of the women living there.

[Advance35]

I don't think Peggy even thinks about romance anymore.  HA gave an interview where she said the "death" of Steve knocked the romance out of Peggy and I think that comes through in the show.   She's not a sobbing mess or lovelorn or anything like that.   She just seems like a woman who's closed the "romance" chapter of her life and is going to focus on other things.   As she said, she's "married" to her work.

 

As for Sousa and Thompson.  I like both as characters and for what they bring  to the story but I don't think enough is known about either yet.   I can say, I think these writers have given VERY good development and life to Peggy, Jarvis, Angie and if they get around to it, I trust them to make both Sousa and Thompson dimensional.

 

I did notice that the producer or whomever put Thompson forward as someone to be considered, so I'm interested to see what layers the writing will give him in the upcoming episodes.   I am loving this show so much I hope they get another Mini-Season.  If not ABC than hopefully Netflix.   If they keep writing like the first 3 episodes, they can focus on everything else and in A Mini-Series 3 give the audience a clear idea of whom Peggy will end up with, even if the characters themselve's don't get around to it.

 

I believe Peggy at one point in comics DATED Gabe Jones but they ended it. 

Edited January 15, 2015 by Advance35

[funkopop]

Ehhhh Thompson.  Unless he's secretly working for Howard and the "patronizing toolbag" thing is a COMPLETE act, I'm not here for Thompson/Peggy.  The "jerk who just needs to be softened up by a woman" is a fairly tiresome cliche in its own right.

 

 

Right - I do remember that, but I couldn't remember if Gabe/Peggy was ever a thing in the comics.  Doing some Googling tells me that it was.

I remember seeing comic strips on Tumblr regarding the storyline for Gabe/Peggy, at least surrounding them being kidnapped by Red Skull because of their interracial relationship which was supposedly written because of the meta reaction they were getting from the readers.  I am not sure if this was prior to or after the timeline the show will cover.

[Danny Franks]

 

I know people are just interested because we know a bit of how her future is going to turn out, so there's an air of mystery about the husband's identity (maybe this is what became of the failed pilot for How I Met Your Dad), but it does oddly feel like the meta version of the woman who runs the hotel inquiring about the future prospects of the women living there.

 

It is, actually, now you make that point. Fans waiting to find out who Peggy's husband will be, as some sort of 'end point' for her. It does come across as something like that, when in terms of the story the show is telling, a husband is no sort of conclusion.

 

I'm not here for Thompson/Peggy.  The "jerk who just needs to be softened up by a woman" is a fairly tiresome cliche in its own right.

 

 

I'm not here for Peggy/anyone, I'm just here for Peggy. But I don't think that there needs to be any 'softening' on either part, just character layering that makes people more complex. Peggy has depth already, thanks to the movie and Hayley Atwell's performances, but the rest of the characters need to be rounded out, and I think they will be.

 

So far, Sousa=nice and Thompson=tool is okay as a starting point, but they need to move them beyond that if they're to develop lives outside the scenes they appear in. And I think Thompson has already shown more complexity than Sousa, since the pilot.

 

I don't think Peggy even thinks about romance anymore.  HA gave an interview where she said the "death" of Steve knocked the romance out of Peggy and I think that comes through in the show.   She's not a sobbing mess or lovelorn or anything like that.   She just seems like a woman who's closed the "romance" chapter of her life and is going to focus on other things.   As she said, she's "married" to her work.

 

 

 

I'd agree with this, and I think I'd be very wary of any suggestion that she needs romance at this point in her life. She seemed sad, for reasons beyond Steve's death, but they tied that into the idea that she's isolated herself from all people. Now she has Jarvis and Angie, as friends, and maybe some of the people she works with, and some of the other women she lives with. She's career-minded and focused on getting to where she wants to be, and while that doesn't preclude any chances at romance, I just don't think she's really interested it at the moment.

 

As for Peggy/Gabe, I think the argument against it would be that it would mean the show was taking on even more in terms of 1940s attitude challenging. We've already got women in the workplace and sexism, but throw interracial relationships on top of it? I think the show could become too much of a lecture on how backwards attitudes were, even as recently as the 1940s. It's too big a theme for them to be able to just nibble at. And they'd be accused of really soft soaping it, if they didn't show the racism of the period, which would surely have been at its worst when directed to a black man dating a white woman. I don't think they could do it justice and still keep the show about Peggy's career.

Edited January 15, 2015 by Danny Franks

[Raja]

 

As for Peggy/Gabe, I think the argument against it would be that it would mean the show was taking on even more in terms of 1940s attitude challenging. We've already got women in the workplace and sexism, but throw interracial relationships on top of it? I think the show could become too much of a lecture on how backwards attitudes were, even as recently as the 1940s. It's too big a theme for them to be able to just nibble at. And they'd be accused of really soft soaping it, if they didn't show the racism of the period, which would surely have been at its worst when directed to a black man dating a white woman. I don't think they could do it justice and still keep the show about Peggy's career.

I have often made the point that in Captain America The First Avenger, Jim Crow did not seem to exist, Captain Rogers did not have to fight against it along with the Nazis/Hydra. The only mention of race has been Dum Dum Dugan being surprised at a Japanese American prisoner of war so maybe the 442nd RCT still existed because of Pearl Harbor. The US Army, war bond tour audiences nor the Strategic Scientific Reserve were segregated. And in Agent Carter we had a Black hood/club owner opening about to have sex with a blond woman without a batting of an eye from his white minions

[funkopop]

I have often made the point that in Captain America The First Avenger, Jim Crow did not seem to exist, Captain Rogers did not have to fight against it along with the Nazis/Hydra. The only mention of race has been Dum Dum Dugan being surprised at a Japanese American prisoner of war so maybe the 442nd RCT still existed because of Pearl Harbor. The US Army, war bond tour audiences nor the Strategic Scientific Reserve were segregated. And in Agent Carter we had a Black hood/club owner opening about to have sex with a blond woman without a batting of an eye from his white minions

 

Not only that but the SSR knew that was his "weakness" and had nothing to say about that and they seem to have something to say about everything.  That did get a bit of a head scratch from me.

[Mockingbird]

I loathe the idea of Peggy/Thompson. I'm actually sort of concerned about the pairing--not only because a producer was taking about it--but because Thompson refrained from his normal interrogation techniques with Jarvis. If Thompson had physically hurt Jarvis, I could safely cross him off the potential husband list as I couldn't see Peggy or the viewers forgiving that.

[blackwing]

I remember the idea of Peggy and Gabe Jones too.  And I could have sworn there were some hints on "Agents of Shield".  Wasn't one of the characters (either Mac or the now deceased Tripp) hinted at being the grandson of Gabe Jones?  I thought we were saying that would make him the grandson of Peggy Carter.

[Snarkette]

Not much of a spoiler, but protected in case people hate that sort of thing. This is from the advance press this past summer.

One specific character that may be seen -- or at least teased -- is Peggy's unnamed husband, mentioned in this past spring's "Captain America: The Winter Soldier" as someone who Steve Rogers saved during World War II.

"We're aware that's a question that people are going to ask, and we will certainly hint at different options," Fazekas said.

[FurryFury]

So far, I don't have a clear favorite. I wouldn't mind if it's even a nit yet introduced character. Sousa hasn't impressed me yet, at all, but this may change, and the same could be said about Thompson (I don't have a pre-set dislike for the actor, I think I've only seen him on early seasons of Gilmore Girls). I do think Sousa's just way too obvious, though, not only is he a nice helpful guy with a possible crush in Peggy, but his disability could be seen as a parallel to Steve, who was also originally physically unfit for action.

[Llywela]

I remember the idea of Peggy and Gabe Jones too.  And I could have sworn there were some hints on "Agents of Shield".  Wasn't one of the characters (either Mac or the now deceased Tripp) hinted at being the grandson of Gabe Jones?  I thought we were saying that would make him the grandson of Peggy Carter.

More than hinted - we've been outright told that Agent Triplett was the grandson of a Howling Commando, but precisely which one has never been confirmed; Gabe Jones is the fandom favourite for reasons of skin colour. His ancestry has been talked about enough, though, and Peggy Carter has been mentioned often enough, that if he was also the grandson of SHIELD's founding mother, we'd know by now. I'm pretty certain there's no way he could be Peggy's grandson without us having heard about it by now.

Edited January 15, 2015 by Llywela

[paigow]

The Smithsonian Exhibit film clip with Carter is dated 1953. It is highly likely we will not see "Mr. Carter" this season.

[Minneapple]

I'm not here for Peggy/anyone, I'm just here for Peggy.

Yeah. I think they're telling a fine enough story without adding any romance. And with only an eight-episode run and so much plot happening in every episode, plus solid development in several characters, a romance seems like it would be tacked-on and awkward.

 

BUT I think they could give us a tiny hint, like in the final episode. A smile, or a look, or the guy asks her out and she says yes, to indicate who her husband will be. And then it fades to black and we can fill in the blanks.

 

I don't have a pre-set dislike for the actor, I think I've only seen him on early seasons of Gilmore Girls

 

That was about the only role I could stomach him in (Tristan was actually my favorite of Rory's love interests). I hated him on both Dawson's and One Tree Hill, where his "acting" mostly involved squinting a lot. CMM appears to have improved since those days. Maybe it was the writing, since I thought he was serviceable on Gilmore Girls.

[kattahj]

Chiming in (hi!) to say that if this is the article discussed, the way it's written makes me think that they just threw Thompson in there as a red herring. I find it more likely that it's either Sousa or someone yet unseen (like a Howling Commando). I wish it could be Angie, but alas...

 

Of course, it could just be that I really don't want it to be Thompson.

[Malbec]

It is, actually, now you make that point. Fans waiting to find out who Peggy's husband will be, as some sort of 'end point' for her. It does come across as something like that, when in terms of the story the show is telling, a husband is no sort of conclusion.

 

 

I'm not here for Peggy/anyone, I'm just here for Peggy.

 

For some people, "who is Peggy's husband?" may be the period at the end of the sentence.  But for a lot of other viewers, like me, it's one of many aspects of her character that I'm curious about.  The way the show has been written so far, Peggy is unfailingly the central character and has a lot of complexities.  I trust these writers to introduce romance/a husband in a way that doesn't derail the character. 

 

I also want Peggy to be treated the way male heroes are treated, frankly.  And male heroes have love interests all the time.  I mean Jack Bauer had 3 or 4 love interests over the course of 24  and it nobody said "Why can't this show just be about Jack?"  Yeah, the future Mr. Carter probably shouldn't become the all-consuming focus of the show. But I think it would be nice if the show averted the "you can excel at your job OR you can have a man" thing that hits women even today.

[Sakura12]

We know from CA: Winter Solider that she gets married and has two children. So a love interest in inevitable. As to if we are going to meet Mr. Carter on this show that's up in the air. We don't know when she got married and I'm guessing this show takes place in 1 year of her life. I am also thinking if she meets someone it will be after clearing Stark's name. 

[blackwing]

I think if this series is intended to be a tryout for a full season pickup next fall, and they already had this planned in mind, that we may not even find out by the end of these 8 hours.  

[Danny Franks]

I also want Peggy to be treated the way male heroes are treated, frankly.  And male heroes have love interests all the time.  I mean Jack Bauer had 3 or 4 love interests over the course of 24  and it nobody said "Why can't this show just be about Jack?"  Yeah, the future Mr. Carter probably shouldn't become the all-consuming focus of the show. But I think it would be nice if the show averted the "you can excel at your job OR you can have a man" thing that hits women even today.

 

I see people saying, 'ugh, why is there romance in this show?' about every show I've ever watched, regardless of the sex of the protagonist. Sometimes, it just isn't important, for the journeys that the characters are currently embarked on.

 

I never bothered with 24, but I know his wife gets killed at some point. So if the next season started with him suddenly hooking up with women, I'd have called foul. There is a grieving process, there is time for healing and reassessing your life, deciding what you want. It's not a breakup, it's the death of a loved one. And in Peggy's case, she never even got to have that relationship with the man she loved. If she meets her husband-to-be in this season, I'd be extremely disappointed if the relationship ever got off the ground. Too soon for her as a character. 

 

And this is eight episodes (nearly halfway over already). That's it. I'd much rather see her form friendships with Jarvis and Angie and her co-workers, and solve cases. I know she eventually gets married and has a great life, I don't care who it's to. I'd rather it not be Sousa, because he's bland and completely forgettable. I'd rather it not be anyone we've seen yet on the show.

 

BUT I think they could give us a tiny hint, like in the final episode. A smile, or a look, or the guy asks her out and she says yes, to indicate who her husband will be. And then it fades to black and we can fill in the blanks.

 

 

That's about as big a hint as I'd like to see. It could be done in quite a smart way, to show someone who perhaps evokes all the best things about Steve, but is still his own person.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Danny Franks

[Malbec]

I don't think it's too soon, necessarily.  Steve went down in 1945; Agent Carter takes place in 1946.  There's no time limit on grief, of course, but I don't think that's an unreasonable period of time between Steve and whoever may come next. 

 

I compare it to Jack Bauer because while he did have love interests, the show was never "about" his love life.  It was always first and foremost about whatever crisis he was trying to stop on that particular day.  And when there was a love interest present, she was always one among many relationships that fleshed out Jack's character, (mostly) given equal importance as characters like Jack's daughter, Jack's friendships with fellow agents like Tony and Chloe, Jack's relationship with the President, etc.  While Agent Carter is a different show, that's the kind of balance I'd be happy with for Peggy.

[Snarkette]

 

I'd rather it not be Sousa

But, but, but....Enver Gjokaj!!! Trust me, he can be very very not-bland and very very not-forgettable when he has the script to support him, which means he's probably going to end up working for Hydra. To hire Gjokaj and use him so minimally screams either of incompetence or a deeper game.

[Bruinsfan]

Ehhhh Thompson.  Unless he's secretly working for Howard and the "patronizing toolbag" thing is a COMPLETE act, I'm not here for Thompson/Peggy.  The "jerk who just needs to be softened up by a woman" is a fairly tiresome cliche in its own right.

It would have the novelty of involving literal softening (as in bruises and broken bones) rather than the figurative opening up emotionally sort.

 

AGENT THOMPSON: That was one helluva workday. I'm beat. Hey doll, how about fixing me a drink before you get dinner started?

EXT - HALLWAY OUTSIDE APARTMENT: Door bursts into flinders as Agent Thompson is hurled through it.

[Cranberry]

But, but, but....Enver Gjokaj!!! Trust me, he can be very very not-bland and very very not-forgettable when he has the script to support him, which means he's probably going to end up working for Hydra. To hire Gjokaj and use him so minimally screams either of incompetence or a deeper game.

 

Yes, this. He really stole the show on Dollhouse. I'm sure there's more to Sousa than we've seen so far.

[Grammaeryn]

Eh, I don't really care. I'd rather see her accomplishments at the SSR and the beginnings of SHIELD. Or is the show just a placeholder before she meets Mr. Right? I dunno, maybe I have my pinchy Feminist pumps on, the whole purpose of the show is not Agent Carter: Sex in the City. Speculating on her future spouse feels like it takes away from the show. Plus Enver is my future husband!

[Malbec]

 I dunno, maybe I have my pinchy Feminist pumps on, the whole purpose of the show is not Agent Carter: Sex in the City. Speculating on her future spouse feels like it takes away from the show.

 

To each his own, but my feminist pumps are getting a little pinchy over the idea that having a romantic relationship automatically renders a female character bubbleheaded and frivolous, when male characters are rarely if ever seen as "less than" because of a romantic subplot/ship tease.

 

Did Steve's interest in Peggy in CA:TFA render him less serious or take away from his worth as a character?  No, it contributed to his characterization.  If Agent Carter suddenly does nothing *but* focus on Peggy's love life I would object to that, and I'd never argue that Peggy MUST find a man.  But the idea that any romantic subplot would automatically make her story less valuable is also, in its own way, fraught with some not-so-feminist implications IMHO.

[myril]

Eh, I don't really care. I'd rather see her accomplishments at the SSR and the beginnings of SHIELD. Or is the show just a placeholder before she meets Mr. Right? I dunno, maybe I have my pinchy Feminist pumps on, the whole purpose of the show is not Agent Carter: Sex in the City. Speculating on her future spouse feels like it takes away from the show. Plus Enver is my future husband!

 

Right there with you, my first reaction to such speculation as well. Can't a woman be great lead without some romance story going on? 

 

To each his own, but my feminist pumps are getting a little pinchy over the idea that having a romantic relationship automatically renders a female character bubbleheaded and frivolous, when male characters are rarely if ever seen as "less than" because of a romantic subplot/ship tease.

 

Did Steve's interest in Peggy in CA:TFA render him less serious or take away from his worth as a character?  No, it contributed to his characterization.  If Agent Carter suddenly does nothing *but* focus on Peggy's love life I would object to that, and I'd never argue that Peggy MUST find a man.  But the idea that any romantic subplot would automatically make her story less valuable is also, in its own way, fraught with some not-so-feminist implications IMHO.

 

You're right though as well. Why should a romance take away from the worth of a female character, can't she have both, happiness in love and a career? It shouldn't.

 

But the thing is, as I see, it often does, the answer way to often still is: No, she can't have both. In reality and in fiction. People seem to have some difficulty to make romance not the main point of a female character, just something adding to the story, happening mostly in the background. The moment romance comes into play things still often get different for women on screen (and in reality). I would love to see it differently, sure would, but my hopes are not that high for any show. Let's say bad experience (thinking right now of a fantasy show which turned into crappy soap opera where particular in the reception of the audience it seems to boil down by now to happy ending equals marriage and kids for the core characters and nothing else - and I have a problem with the nothing else there).

 

I  don't see people talking as intensely about a male lead finding Mrs. Right to make his life finally all satisfactory. Maybe there somehow is seldom a doubt he will, he is the hero after all, so it can happen by the way. In fairy tales the princess is often enough the reward for the hero to win when successful in his adventures.  Meanwhile for a female lead it somehow seems that her live only will be fulfilled when she finally will find Mr. Right, or often it's more be found by Mr. Right (it would be a tiny progress if at least we would consider Mrs. Right as well - I am aware, a possibility already excluded in this case). Men are defined by their own doings, their action, the success at work or in saving the world, while women still tend to be defined mostly by relationships and their success in relationship, not at work but in what we call private life, mostly family.

 

It sometimes seems to me, to get away from these narrowing ideas we might have to ignore for a while relationships for women and focus on the success in career, at work. Like we have done for quite a while with men. 

 

Just take a look at any news article about a professional woman. There is pretty much always something about juggling career and family in it. How many times do you see that very same question discussed when successful men are portrayed? We smile at the 1940s and 50s (any time before our so progressive modern generation), thinking, how stupid some ideas were, like women have to marry to be decent and stop working outside their homes, bah ridiculous. But are we truly that progressive? When a woman finds love and even marries then her obligations and responsibilities change, from herself to her family, and we still can't quite get it out of our heads that this means, manage the homes, take care of kids. Obligation and responsibilities change for men as well when they marry, but their obligation to their families is to provide for them, make good money, have a job, a career. These ideas are still around and have some influence.

 

It's not wrong to discuss Mr. Right, don't get me wrong, we know there is one or will be one. Let's just say I would prefer to not see much of him or the inevitable going to happen romance in this show any time too soon, being pessimistic, that when it happens it might distract from all the other greatness Penny Carter has to offer. Guess I have not much trust in any screenwriters to do it differently.

Edited January 17, 2015 by katusch

[Danny Franks]

And to focus a bit more on the idea of Mr. Right, katusch, I think an additional problem this show would have is that there isn't one, at the moment.

 

Whether Peggy pursues romance or not, and whether it's the right writing choice or not, I think that the guy should be pretty goddamn special, to be someone that Peggy Carter falls for and marries. Steve was a hard act to follow, and they shouldn't try to create a Steve replica, but this has to be a guy who is worthy of her. And quite frankly, the show has provided no suitable options yet.

 

Jarvis is married, but I think their friendship has already begun travelling down the sibling route. Little exchanges like her saying "aren't we getting confident?" when he asked if she had a spare gun, put me in mind so much of the know-it-all bigger sister and the younger brother who wants to be as cool as her. It's sweet, but not at all sexual.

 

Sousa is weak. I don't mean physically, but mentally. He comes across as a spectator in life, just sitting around looking soulful and occasionally trying impress Peggy. He struggles to come up with more than the occasional passive-aggressive comment when someone is a dick to him. He's just so milquetoast that if he's not a bad guy, he's a waste of time.

 

Thompson is a tool, and an unrepentant one. He has the mental and physical strength that Sousa lacks, and so far he seems to be a guy who will fight his own corner, but has no heart or apparent ability to empathise and understand people who are different to himself.

 

Howard is Howard, and Peggy is just too smart for that. Also, we know that's not how things go down, but if it had, Steve learning Tony was Peggy's son would have been hilarious. But sad at the same time.

 

So quite apart from narrative reasons, Peggy marrying any of these guys would seem like she was settling for, not second best, but fiftieth best, after Steve. Which means they'd need a new character, and wouldn't have enough episodes to establish him. So I would be fine with a post-credits scene in the last episode of Peggy in the automat with Angie, and a guy sitting at another table smiles at her. She smiles back and... fade to black. Make it as well known an actor as they can get. It'd be hilarious if it was a ridiculous Matt Damon cameo or something. But I guess that would cause problems for any follow up season.

Edited January 17, 2015 by Danny Franks

[Malbec]

It's not wrong to discuss Mr. Right, don't get me wrong, we know there is one or will be one. Let's just say I would prefer to not see much of him or the inevitable going to happen romance in this show any time too soon, being pessimistic, that when it happens it might distract from all the other greatness Penny Carter has to offer. Guess I have not much trust in any screenwriters to do it differently.

 

Right.  I think you and I are on the same page -- the last thing I want to see is a badly-written romance for Peggy.  I'd rather see none at all than see that. Really, the only point I'm making is that I see a difference between  "I don't want to see a romance for Peggy because I think the writers will mess it up" (fair enough) versus "Even thinking about Peggy's future husband is a disservice to her character" (something I will really object to).

 

I also have to say that while I know there is a lot of depressing precedent for romance derailing female characters... I also think about characters like Captain Janeway on Voyager, who got little to no romantic action during the show's run.  She had a male partner back home, and she had some ship tease with Chakotay (and *cough* Seven), but she was a really celibate character compared to her predecessors Kirk, Picard and Sisko.  Or you have a character like Olivia Benson on SVU, whose love life noticeably sucks (so do some of the male characters', to be fair, but Stabler and Amaro at least made it as far as having spouses and children).  It's not that I think either of these characters GOTTA HAVE A MAN, but it does sometimes have the unfortunate implication that heroic women don't get to have fulfilling personal lives because female strength = emasculating.  So I find it refreshing when this is averted, honestly.

[kattahj]

I think Sousa's weakness of will is actually an interesting character trait. He's got a lot of things going for him - he's smart, funny, polite and righteous, but then he has this tendency to just roll over and take it whenever the world throws shit at him. Which seems to be deliberate; I saw an article where Gjokaj described how Sousa accepts his position, in contrast to Peggy who fights back (though she chooses her battles).

And considering that they seem to know exactly what they can get from Gjokaj, I doubt that his current characterisation is all we're going to get. Evil, though? I don't know. At the moment, he seems more likely to be to this show what Art Bell was to season 1 of Orphan Black, the guy always on the heroine's tail. (ABC writes that "his sharp acumen could make him Peggy's most dangerous rival", which could mean this or that he'll go evil, either way.)
Truth be told, I have a soft spot for the lad, but right now my favourite scenario is one where he's Peggy's beard to cover up her romance with Angie.
As for whether the topic of "future husband" is even a legit one, I think we're in a special situation in that we know so much about Peggy's future. We know what her profession is going to be, what her aims in life will be, how long she'll live (more or less, she's not dead yet!) and whether or not she'll find out that Cap is still alive. So speculation on the more obscure bits of her future seems valid enough. As for shipping in general, it's gonna happen (regardless of gender) and it's overwhelmingly Peggy/Angie at this point anyway.

[Cranberry]

Is it? I thought it was just my Tumblr friends, haha. I guess it's inevitable when the star herself tweets that Peggy loves Angie, huh?

[kattahj]

Well, I'm primarily judging by Archive of Our Own, which presently has 39 Peggy/Angie stories, which is a lot more than any other ship for this show (not counting Peggy/Steve ships written before the show aired). The general viewing audience probably sees things differently.

[paigow]

 

I also think about characters like Captain Janeway on Voyager, who got little to no romantic action during the show's run.  She had a male partner back home, and she had some ship tease with Chakotay (and *cough* Seven), but she was a really celibate character compared to her predecessors Kirk, Picard and Sisko. 

Travelling at transwarp turned Janeway & Paris into lizards that mated......

[Danny Franks]

 At the moment, he seems more likely to be to this show what Art Bell was to season 1 of Orphan Black, the guy always on the heroine's tail. (ABC writes that "his sharp acumen could make him Peggy's most dangerous rival", which could mean this or that he'll go evil, either way.)

Truth be told, I have a soft spot for the lad, but right now my favourite scenario is one where he's Peggy's beard to cover up her romance with Angie.

 

Well they'll have to bring him up to speed quickly on that front, because he seems like the last guy in that office who's likely to rumble Peggy. He's too busy casting those soulful looks in her direction, while the other guys actually seem to be investigating stuff. Even Kyle Bornheimer was cottoning on to it, before he was killed. I struggle to see Sousa as anything more than an accommodating doormat and/or unwitting accomplice to Peggy's heroics.

 

A Peggy/Angie romance? From a purely scientific perspective (*cough*), that would be interesting to watch. But the show's not going down that route, at least not in a romantic sense. I'm all for Angie being Peggy's most important relationship on the show, because Peggy needs a good friend who challenges her. Jarvis does that job too, but he has a caution about him that Angie lacks. She's 'in your face' and straightforward in ways that I think Peggy really needs in her life. And of the characters introduced so far, Angie is actually the one who seems to have the strength of character to be a match for Peggy.

Edited January 18, 2015 by Danny Franks

[kattahj]

Well they'll have to bring him up to speed quickly on that front, because he seems like the last guy in that office who's likely to rumble Peggy.

 

 

He's the one who's got the photo that shows Peggy's bullet wounds. He's the one who answered the phone call and heard Jarvis's attempt at an American accent. He's the one who questioned how Stark's stuff was so neatly placed in their way. He's the one who's sworn to "find that bastard". And he's the one who actually knows Peggy well enough to be able to guess that she'd pretend not to have heard of Joe DiMaggio

 

I think it's highly unlikely that he's not meant to be doing something with all of those clues (though I don't know how far he'll get with them). And the fact that he's casting "soulful looks" at Peggy (which he actually does less than he's investigating stuff) means that he's a) paying attention to what she's doing and b) not underestimating her.

 

I mean, I could be wrong, but to me it looks like they're Chechov's Gunning his every other scene.

 

A Peggy/Angie romance? From a purely scientific perspective (*cough*), that would be interesting to watch. But the show's not going down that route, at least not in a romantic sense.

 

 

I know, I know. A girl can dream.

[Malbec]

Travelling at transwarp turned Janeway & Paris into lizards that mated......

Ha... I knew somebody was going to bring that up :p 

 

I think it only furthers the point if the only way Janeway could get any action was to literally evolve into another species! 

Edited January 18, 2015 by Malbec

[Shanna]

But, but, but....Enver Gjokaj!!! Trust me, he can be very very not-bland and very very not-forgettable when he has the script to support him, which means he's probably going to end up working for Hydra. To hire Gjokaj and use him so minimally screams either of incompetence or a deeper game.

This is why I am all in for Sousa, I adore the actor!!! And I hate cmm so you know. Also the fact that he is a decent guy is not a bad thing or boring to me. I think he's investigating and watching Peggy. He's got the contrast with captain America of course which is nice. I think they could have good chemistry if they would start spending more time together although I definitely enjoy her with Jarvis, he's married. And maybe gay. Whatever.

But I dont think we need to go all in on romance I these first 8 episodes, which I really hope are leading to another partial or full season. I want to see their friendship and working partnership develop and for him to get in on what Peggy is doing. But I am patient and like slower pacing on this sort of thing.

I don't know who Gabe Jones is. Was he in the first captain America? I saw it but it's been a while..

Edited January 19, 2015 by Shanna

[Lokiberry]

I've been on the fence about whether I wanted to meet Peggy's future husband until now. Romance will overshadow everything else in the show. Shipping will overwhelm everything else in the fandom. Ship wars will break out between Peggy/Sousa shippers and Peggy/Angie shippers, and there won't be any peace anywhere.

 

I'd much rather see Peggy kick butt, clear Howard's name, and become the founding mother of SHIELD. I'd be perfectly happy to trade any romance plots for her friendship with Angie, and friendship/partnership with Jarvis.

[Llywela]

I don't know who Gabe Jones is. Was he in the first captain America? I saw it but it's been a while..

He's one of the Howling Commandos in the first Captain America film.

[ostentatious]

I can't help but think the Anna situation isn't quite what we're led to assume, mainly because why play games if it's that simple?

So, I am in the ring for Jarvis for her, because a woman with the career ahead of her that Peggy has needs someone like him. The #1 common trait amongst female CEOs is that their husbands are SAHs, or else have very very flexible careers that require no focus.

He is also the only character that we witnessed Peggy meeting, and it was framed as significant. It felt important. Everyone else, she has an association of at least a few months standing. First meetings between characters are important. So, I place importance on the one we were given to witness.

They're certainly the relationship they focus the most time upon, and it is impossible that they are simply writing to actor chemistry, since this is what they're doing with them out of the gate.

If there was no "Anna" being brought up, I don't think you'd have so many doubters, but placing an ostensible impediment there gives the audience a reason not to see what's right in front of them.

I do agree that this ship isn't sexual - yet. But neither is it void. It seems to me to be appropriate for the situation. But I think little things will continue to happen that indicate growing awareness. Like Angie last ep pointing out his shoulders, and the close physical proximity. And he's a good person, the one whose goodness is the most Steve-like. They don't have anything else in common, but they do on the innate goodness front.

So, I like her, so I want her to have good things. The best things. I know she marries and has two children. I think Jarvis is the best, so I want her to have him. I think they are probably expecting at least a season two, so we'll see.

But that Anna situation...nah, something's up. I'll buy it when they physically produce an Anna who is married, married *to Jarvis*, and in control of all her faculties and not in an institution somewhere, which still doesn't feel right. Until then there is some reason they're treating her like Wolowitz's mother, and IMO the reason is that in reality she isn't the ship blocker we assume.

Edited January 19, 2015 by ostentatious

[Raja]

I don't know who Gabe Jones is. Was he in the first captain America? I saw it but it's been a while..

 

 

He's one of the Howling Commandos in the first Captain America film.

The Black one played by Derek Luke. Gabe Jones is thought to be the grandfather of Agent Triplett of Agents of SHIELD. But I don't think it was said on screen so another Howling Commando may have had a black spouse

[Danny Franks]

I can't help but think the Anna situation isn't quite what we're led to assume, mainly because why play games if it's that simple?

 

 

I'm pretty sure it's exactly what we're led to assume. Jarvis is happily married to a Jewish Hungarian woman, and sacrificed his military career to rescue her from the Nazis. It's a nice story, and not one that seems made up to fool Peggy for some bizarre reason. Especially because Jarvis has been seen talking to her at home. So either she's real, or he's insane.

 

In this last episode, she told him to leave the dishes and she'd take care of them. So what is that? A robot? A figment of psychosis? His mother or sister who he pretends is his wife when people ask who he lives with (and who he also calls "darling")? None of these things seems likely to me. And even if they were likely, they'd hardly present him as a 'catch' for anyone, let alone Peggy.

 

And if she wasn't real, why would the SSR think she was, and why would Jarvis be so angry when Thompson started talking about her?

[ostentatious]

I suspect she's ill, possibly degenerating, and the person calling to him is Howard. Thus far, the calling has been done at times when he was interacting with Peggy via phone, or when she was approaching the house. So, it could be a signal, of sorts. I am not entirely sure that Anna is in the house. She could be in a hospital. He says that "recently" he's had to lie to her about what he does. If she's unwell, he'd be very protective, and furious at the idea of anyone harassing her.

 

It sounds like he had to leave her behind in Budapest and his plan was thwarted, because he says that Howard got her out/was instrumental in helping him get her out. So, there's really no telling what happened there. That's the story he says he'll leave for another time. It could have taken years.

 

But I do think we'll know that answer next episode, depending upon what we find out about Howard's whereabouts. If it's not Howard, then it must actually be her. Even though it's a comedy trope, and does not jive at all with this sweeping epic romantic backstory.

 

There is no reason to hide Anna if she is simply some nice lady happily married to Jarvis. This is not a sitcom.

Edited January 19, 2015 by ostentatious

[Danny Franks]

Howard adopts a woman's voice and tells him that he'll do the dishes? So he's really not like his son then? Jarvis calls Howard "darling" and accepts said offer to do the dishes? That scene happened in isolation, with no other character around. So I would say that Jarvis is either married or he's insane, based on these three episodes.

 

The most plausible reason they've not shown Anna is because they've not cast her. Because they don't want to waste any of their budget on characters who don't have a purpose in these eight episodes.

[Snarkette]

My head canon says Anna's one of the Gabor sisters, so cannot be shown on screen.

[ostentatious]

Howard adopts a woman's voice and tells him that he'll do the dishes? So he's really not like his son then? Jarvis calls Howard "darling" and accepts said offer to do the dishes? That scene happened in isolation, with no other character around. So I would say that Jarvis is either married or he's insane, based on these three episodes.

 

The most plausible reason they've not shown Anna is because they've not cast her. Because they don't want to waste any of their budget on characters who don't have a purpose in these eight episodes.

 

It happens as Peggy is walking up outside. My assumption is that this is a signal between them.