Spoilers, Speculation & All Things Media!

[Tim]

45 minutes ago, Sonik Tooth said:

I think the example is not quite accurate. You don’t only just stop eating there (stop watching), you also start a campaign to shut the restaurant down (cancel the show). Surely there are still some people who might want to eat there because they like the other half of the food and maybe the location (might want to watch for other reasons than Caskett).

Can't speak for other quotes in your response but mine is a PERSONAL choice I made, based on how I FELT, and the accuracy was never about anyone starting a campaign to shut the "Restaurant" down, it was an analogy to explain the legitimacy those screaming for the poor 400 people who will loose their jobs if we STOP watching, no where did I mention a campaign to shut the show down,

 

5 hours ago, Tim said:

IF they get S9 which for the remainder of the crew I would not wish harm

If you are going to quote me DON'T take it out of context.

[WendyCR72]

OK, folks. Emotions are high, but I think everyone needs a step back to breathe and re-gain some objectivity here. What's done is likely done, regardless of decision. So short fuses won't help anything, anyway.

[WendyCR72]

3 hours ago, Kromm said:

The first--just as a stab in the dark because the character isn't that popular--would be the Castle 2.0 kind of concept, starring Alexis

 

But it seems the whole thing is to keep Fillion - he of sci-fi/geek fandom/quasi "royalty" - in the fold. The name is just the means of doing so. And since ABC is hurting as it is, maybe they think it's worth the risk of reinventing a known entity than starting again with Fillion in a new role.

Obviously, it doesn't seem to be shaking out as ABC had hoped. But I do think this is/was the intent.

[Tim]

23 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

But it seems the whole thing is to keep Fillion - he of sci-fi/geek fandom/quasi "royalty" - in the fold. The name is just the means of doing so.

Agree Think it was Bowman who said they had found their "Tent Pole" in NF when talking about the 120+ actresses they auditioned at an early Paley event.  Seems they still feel the same

[Sonik Tooth]

2 hours ago, Tim said:

Can't speak for other quotes in your response but mine is a PERSONAL choice I made, based on how I FELT, and the accuracy was never about anyone starting a campaign to shut the "Restaurant" down, it was an analogy to explain the legitimacy those screaming for the poor 400 people who will loose their jobs if we STOP watching, no where did I mention a campaign to shut the show down,

 

If you are going to quote me DON'T take it out of context.

Tim, I didn’t mean the “you” as in you personally would do something, I meant to say “one would…” (as I was once told that the “you” although meaning “one” is more common in the English language). The context wasn’t your post alone. It was your post replying to TWP replying to sugarrush’s post that dealt with fans wanting the show to get cancelled. I’m sorry if that wasn’t clear.

[verdana]

Wendy is right and as for the internet campaigns and general bluster and hysteria I don't believe that any such fan pressure to cancel the show factors into the networks decision making.

In any case, if I was working the in this business regardless if I was the tea lady or a director I'd be assuming I'd be lucky if I stayed in a job two consecutive seasons. Job security in Hollywood is not something that very many can take for granted. 

[femmefan1946]

So here are some ideas about limits on where the show could go.

 

[TWP]

Trying to figure out why they delayed the renewal announcement. I wonder if renewal confirmation would have been a spoiler for some aspect of the next episode. Or maybe they figure the publicity they're getting on the internet is good and they don't want it to die down yet.

Wouldn't it be something if next season's Castle was effectively the pilot for Take Two, Marlowe's new show?

[BellyLaughter]

They're probably just trying to negotiate a lower licensing fee...you know, make it as cheap as possible given they have no choice other than to move forward with it and they know it's turned into a mess for them PR wise.  

Edited May 7, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[WendyCR72]

19 minutes ago, TWP said:

Trying to figure out why they delayed the renewal announcement

 

All I can figure is, maybe ABC liked their new pilot selection and are now saying "screw it" regarding S9.

[Kromm]

4 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

 

But it seems the whole thing is to keep Fillion - he of sci-fi/geek fandom/quasi "royalty" - in the fold. The name is just the means of doing so. And since ABC is hurting as it is, maybe they think it's worth the risk of reinventing a known entity than starting again with Fillion in a new role.

Obviously, it doesn't seem to be shaking out as ABC had hoped. But I do think this is/was the intent.

I did also say "the chance of this working is virtually nil". The point is that a stab in the dark with Fillion caries baggage, so the possible benefit of something like a reboot like one starring Alexis in another city would be that Fillion could be used as the second fiddle without the baggage he now has as a continuing lead with a co-star who's absence is now going to be awkward/stupid (whereas it wouldn't be if Beckett was simply busy back in New York and Castle just stopped by Alexis' Detective Agency in lets say... L.A.... a few times per season. 

But really that was just spitballing. The Perry Mason/Matlock/Almost Every Old Detective Show approach of TV Movies would have been what I'd have done. Assuming they aren't totally lying about Fillion getting Katic kicked off the show and it was as they're trying to claim strictly financial. You simply lock in a commitment for lets say 4 Castle TV movies over an unspecified period with an option to renew a new order for another bunch or two if they succeed, and presto. A way to get around the problem, because those would be budgeted, marketed and sold to advertisers totally differently from the TV show (and could even be coordinated to make extra money as Home Video releases, a few months after they air, as an extra source of income). 

Edited May 8, 2016 by Kromm

[femmefan1946]

The first-...--would be the Castle 2.0 kind of concept, starring Alexis ... Again, the chance of this working is virtually nil, ,,,, but it would be a cheap solution to try and see if they get lucky, and then you simply have Rick drop in every few episodes to spike viewer interest (and an easy situation where Beckett showing up is easy to explain, because lets say Alexis relocated to start a Detective Agency in another city... bingo...

 

Maybe if the show moved to a network that appealed to young women. Or maybe Lifeline, which as I understand it, is aimed at women viewers.

 

Just saying "make your own ending in your mind', by the way, is really insulting, in my opinion.

All that angsty fanfiction, gone for naught!!  I enjoy reading fanfic (and sometimes writing it). Often the characters are more interesting than the screen portrayal.

 

I wrote, way up the thread about making 2.0 an anthology with Richard Castle imagining new stories for a new private investigator - played by NF.  No need for his family, but the idea of PI!Alexis, Ryan and Esposito types for real police,  and even Hayley staying in the cast would work as part of that.

No great character development, or real need for continuity. Hmm.... sounds perfect for syndication.

[Tim]

Found it interesting that so many dismissed Shonda's new show The Catch, but wasn't lost that they bumped Castle S8 to air a Re-Run of it in Castle's time slot, perhaps as Wendy says it is a pilot or a move to appease ABC's Goddess Of Drama, if Shonda pushes it she will win, hands down and Fillion and company will be doing Fund Raisers for the next Con Man series.  The longer the delay, the more inclined to think that second thoughts are taking over for renewal

[MaryM47]

For a moment there, I thought that maybe they were waiting to share any news about it at a time when fewer people would be on the internet and eager to throw pitchforks at them. Perhaps with the Friday news dump or over the weekend, when I hear some people actually go out into the sunshine. I was chatting with the hubby about it, who came up with the same new show idea as many here have - Father and Daughter PI's. I told him that many fans have become quite disenchanted with Alexis, when he suggested a time-honored way to get rid of pesky daughters - a mountain lion! 

[metaphor]

Deadline attributes the postponement of a renewal decision to the need to finish hammering out actor deals. Seamus Dever will return.

[KaveDweller]

34 minutes ago, Kromm said:

. The Perry Mason/Matlock/Almost Every Old Detective Show approach of TV Movies would have been what I'd have done. Assuming they aren't totally lying about Fillion getting Katic kicked off the show and it was as they're trying to claim strictly financial. You simply lock in a commitment for lets say 4 Castle TV movies over an unspecified period with an option to renew a new order for another bunch or two if they succeed, and presto. A way to get around the problem, because those would be budgeted, marketed and sold to advertisers totally differently from the TV show (and could even be coordinated to make extra money as Home Video releases, a few months after they air, as an extra source of income). 

I actually would have really liked if they did that. The writers could probably do a better job with 4 2-hour episodes than dragging out ideas over 22 episodes. They could make the cases better because they wouldn't have to come up with as many, and scatter in some cute Caskett scenes that don't seem as repetitive/superficial.  It would also lesson the burden for the actors. If they had more time off, they may not ask for as much money or other perks. Well, okay, they'd probably still ask, but they may give in easier.

9 minutes ago, MaryM47 said:

For a moment there, I thought that maybe they were waiting to share any news about it at a time when fewer people would be on the internet and eager to throw pitchforks at them. Perhaps with the Friday news dump or over the weekend, when I hear some people actually go out into the sunshine.

I thought of the same thing, but I couldn't decide which announcement they think will be worse. Some fans will be happy with the cancellation, but it may look bad to the others and then that they did all this and couldn't even close the deal to renew.

[MaryM47]

From an LA Times article about the end of The Good Wife:

Quote

In recent years...the pressures of a 22-episode season began to tell..."The Good Wife" suffered a bit from "Downton Abbey" syndrome - the devotion to keeping a beloved cast together (ed. note - not the case with Castle!) often led to plot repetition and far too many characters getting arrested.

[WendyCR72]

6 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

I thought of the same thing, but I couldn't decide which announcement they think will be worse. Some fans will be happy with the cancellation, but it may look bad to the others and then that they did all this and couldn't even close the deal to renew.

Which basically shows, at this point, ABC is damned if it does, and damned if it doesn't. So, IMO? Just drop the bomb, be it canceled or renewed, and allow the last vestiges of outrage to play itself out.

[BellyLaughter]

So signing supporting cast is vital to the continuation of this show??  ...... Ok then. 

 

They seem prepared to carry on as long as Nathan is there....filling in the gaps with whatever....

Edited May 8, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[MaryM47]

So Castle PI will still be all up in the 12th precinct's business, despite no longer having a direct connection to them? I think I'm running out of disbelief to suspend. 

[BellyLaughter]

I (naively?) assumed that the 12th would be eliminated and the PI thing would be a go with fresh cast members alongside Hayley and Money Penny!?! I thought Jon and Seamus would be lucky to score recurring contracts at best...shows what I know! I guess it pays to be buddies with the big boy!! 

Edited May 8, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[CheshireCat]

26 minutes ago, BellyLaughter said:

So signing supporting cast is vital to the continuation of this show??  ...... Ok then. 

 

I think I missed the memo that said supporting cast is so important that you can't renew before their contracts are secured but you can easily let your co-lead go and just keep the show going... But hey, you live and learn, right?

[WendyCR72]

I cannot begrudge Dever or Huertas if the show is renewed and they stay on. I just can't. They are actors and this is a pay check. They didn't fire Katic and Jones.

If they feel they can go on and are willing, more power to them.

Who knows if this is it in terms of a long-running show for either? As discussed, competition is fierce. Ride the wave for as long as they can pad their bank accounts and sincere wishes of good luck to both.

[BellyLaughter]

9 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I think I missed the memo that said supporting cast is so important that you can't renew before their contracts are secured but you can easily let your co-lead go and just keep the show going... But hey, you live and learn, right?

Yep! Kill the central core of your story but you had better make damn sure you secure the contracts of supporting actors before you renew....

*where is that roll eyes emoji when you need it*

[WendyCR72]

I just hope Dever and/or Huertas aren't ravaged on social media too badly. But I guess that's why - if they are - the block button was invented.

[CheshireCat]

5 minutes ago, BellyLaughter said:

Yep! Kill the central core of your story but you had better make damn sure you secure the contracts of supporting actors before you renew....

 

Just reading that made me laugh. It sounds so ridiculous!

What's puzzling me is how many comments I see from casual viewers (on non-TV show forums) who say that they won't watch or planned to stop watching after S8 anyway (and are suggesting ABC end the show with dignity) and ABC still pushes forward. I think even if there are those who would watch a S9, the general mood seems pretty obvious. Is ABC really banking all of its money on the fact that people are going to come back anyway, regardless of what they're saying now? Even though they lost a million viewers after the wedding that wasn't and another after that separation? Or do they simply not have enough good pilots that they think it's worth the risk?

[WendyCR72]

Or, with the overhaul, maybe ABC is hoping for more male viewership.

[KaveDweller]

1 minute ago, WendyCR72 said:

I just hope Dever and/or Huertas aren't ravaged on social media too badly. But I guess that's why - if they are - the block button was invented.

I agree, those two don't deserve any flak for wanting to keep their jobs. I'm sure they aren't making the kind of money Nathan, or even Stana is pulling in and need to keep working. I've also never seen either be anything but supportive of Stana in interviews, so her fans shouldn't have that to hold against them.

[BellyLaughter]

2 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Or, with the overhaul, maybe ABC is hoping for more male viewership.

I think this is exactly what their motivation is for keeping the show on life support.  I do admire their determination to turn a strongly female skewing show into a male skewing show... esp. with the spotlight they have now put on themselves.... surely there were smarter ways to go about this.  

[WendyCR72]

I'll just reiterate this: ABC may indeed be shooting itself in the foot here. Historically, however, it comes down to the idea that people can bitch, moan, groan, and complain. But that is still interest. It shows a level of caring.

As long as the show is being discussed, to the network, it is exposure and, therefore, a "win".

Apathy is the only real measure of true displeasure.

[BellyLaughter]

13 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

Just reading that made me laugh. It sounds so ridiculous!

What's puzzling me is how many comments I see from casual viewers (on non-TV show forums) who say that they won't watch or planned to stop watching after S8 anyway (and are suggesting ABC end the show with dignity) and ABC still pushes forward. I think even if there are those who would watch a S9, the general mood seems pretty obvious. Is ABC really banking all of its money on the fact that people are going to come back anyway, regardless of what they're saying now? Even though they lost a million viewers after the wedding that wasn't and another after that separation? Or do they simply not have enough good pilots that they think it's worth the risk?

Obviously ABC has total faith that the casual viewers will still watch and in a way I can't fault them for that.  So many people watch TV more out of habit than actual investment.  I stayed with the brother and sister-in-law last week and was forced to endure an episode of Grey's Anatomy.  They watch it every week....apparently.  However, after the show ended I was under the impression that I knew more about a show I stopped watching 7 seasons ago than they know about a show they apparently watch every week lol  

 

I would say the one thing that could jeopardise ABCs plans for Castle is if they move its timeslot.....by all means, kill the central core of the show but god forbid they move it's timeslot....forcing people to reprogramme their DVRs does more damage than completely destroying the basic premise of the show.  What does that tell you about average viewing habits of people???

Edited May 8, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[TWP]

1 hour ago, metaphor said:

Deadline attributes the postponement of a renewal decision to the need to finish hammering out actor deals. Seamus Dever will return.

Oh wow, they really "blued" Seamus' eyes in the shot they used. He looks like an alien. Glad he'll be back. He and his wife seem very real.

[CheshireCat]

I just read something that got me wondering - THR claimed that NF was demanding Huertas and Dever must be back or he wouldn't be back. And yet, we learn that NF had reached an agreement before we learn that Dever has reached one and we haven't heard anything about Huertas. If it really was one of NF's demands, wouldn't they have had to reach and agreement with Dever and Huertas before they could reach one with NF?

[TWP]

13 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

I'll just reiterate this: ABC may indeed be shooting itself in the foot here. Historically, however, it comes down to the idea that people can bitch, moan, groan, and complain. But that is still interest. It shows a level of caring.

As long as the show is being discussed, to the network, it is exposure and, therefore, a "win".

Apathy is the only real measure of true displeasure.

Yep, "hate buzz" stirs curiosity probably more than satisfied viewers do. People love a (figurative) train wreck.

28 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

I just hope Dever and/or Huertas aren't ravaged on social media too badly. But I guess that's why - if they are - the block button was invented.

People from the show have been passing around a block list.

[WendyCR72]

2 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I just read something that got me wondering - THR claimed that NF was demanding Huertas and Dever must be back or he wouldn't be back. And yet, we learn that NF had reached an agreement before we learn that Dever has reached one and we haven't heard anything about Huertas. If it really was one of NF's demands, wouldn't they have had to reach and agreement with Dever and Huertas before they could reach one with NF?

Not necessarily. Perhaps the only sticking point in doing this is to ascertain that Dever/Huertas were open to discussion. That would basically secure Fillion if the network was negotiating with Dever/Huertas in good faith.

[TWP]

I thought I would mention that I was thinking about the jobs long before this controversy arose. When I talked about Stana or Nathan potentially signing or not, I mentioned, actually several times, that they must feel some pressure because if they quit, it puts a ton of people out of work. And I don't think the stars of any show take that lightly unless they're jerks, which some maybe are, who knows.

9 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Not necessarily. Perhaps the only sticking point in doing this is to ascertain that Dever/Huertas were open to discussion. That would basically secure Fillion if the network was negotiating with Dever/Huertas in good faith.

Or it could be that Fillion's rep said, no wait, we need to seal these contracts before you announce.

[metaphor]

And Hawley finally broke his twitter silence to post:

Alexi Hawley ‏@AlexiHawley  10 minutes ago

Here we go. Scoring session for 822. #Castle https://www.instagram.com/p/BFISlutArRH/

This entire debacle has simply been handled so poorly, IMO. 

Edited May 8, 2016 by metaphor

[BellyLaughter]

It's like they're sitting in their rooms, blocking their ears and singing "I'm Henry the VIII, I am" 

[Annec]

49 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I just read something that got me wondering - THR claimed that NF was demanding Huertas and Dever must be back or he wouldn't be back. And yet, we learn that NF had reached an agreement before we learn that Dever has reached one and we haven't heard anything about Huertas. If it really was one of NF's demands, wouldn't they have had to reach and agreement with Dever and Huertas before they could reach one with NF?

Doesn't that end the argument that NF doesn't have the power to demand that SK not "be asked back?

[WendyCR72]

2 minutes ago, Annec said:

Doesn't that end the argument that NF doesn't have the power to demand that SK not "be asked back?

No. Because it is still ultimately ABC's call.

[TWP]

1 minute ago, Annec said:

Doesn't that end the argument that NF doesn't have the power to demand that SK not "be asked back?

He clearly has the power to decide if he'll sign and to state contingencies under which he'll sign. He has the right to decide how he plans to live his own life and what's bearable to endure.  It's up to ABC to accept his contingencies, which means they are ultimately responsible. 

I suspect that if she'd signed and he'd said "nah, forget it, I'll just walk" people would accuse him of trying to sabotage Stana's show and career by walking. I don't think he can win, so smart idea to be a loser while taking the paycheck.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, WendyCR72 said:

Not necessarily. Perhaps the only sticking point in doing this is to ascertain that Dever/Huertas were open to discussion. That would basically secure Fillion if the network was negotiating with Dever/Huertas in good faith.

Well, the article in question stated that Fillion had said he would not return without Dever and Huertas. Which implies that if they don't ink a deal, he walks away, too. Why would the network then agree to terms with him first/release that he had agreed to terms if they don't even know if the deal sticks? (Although I guess if one wants to believe the article, one could argue that that is why Huertas and Dever have to agree to a deal before a renewal is announced but I'm not sure about THR's credibility)

Oh, and what's up with Hawley's tweet? Neither he nor Winter manage so much as an official statement about Katic's exit and now he's tweeting as if none of that has happened?

Edited May 8, 2016 by CheshireCat

[statsgirl]

Jose Molina was on Castle for one season and then jumped ship. Then he moved on to Sleepy Hollow and was one of the people responsible for the terribad mess that it's second season was.  If anything, I think he was reacting to the fury of the Sleepy Hollow fans with Abbie killed and nothing more than a prop in Ichabod's journey.

On 5/6/2016 at 5:40 PM, Kromm said:

Ergo, that's the power of Fillion vs, Katic. I know some folks love her, but she's interchangeable in many ways with any number of similar actresses. No legion ofsuperfans is going to be talking about her, decades from now, like they do anyone who appeared on Star Trek, or on Buffy The Vampire Slayer, etc. That's deeper passion, and Fillion's name and identity has that because of Firefly.

Nobody has that kind of passion for someone who's fame is only through a procedural show.  Even one some people credited with (at one point) having a good deal of charm. The viewership of shows like this is wide (thus large), but not deep (where people invest permanent loyalty to the stars that will follow them for the rest of their lives).  

Have you met the Tony fans from NCIS?  I swear, there is no more obsessed a group unless it's the Tiva fans from the same show.

We don't know what Stana Katic will do. She was relatively young when she got the role of Beckett and there hasn't been time for her to do much since.  Maybe she'll tank, maybe she'll go on to have a career like Susan Sarandon and Julianna Moore, who both got their start in soap operas.

All things being equal (i.e. women have an equal chance of landing good roles as men do), I'd put my money on Katic becoming the actor.  It's been a long time since I've seen Fillion acting rather than mugging.  But things are not equal so he may be the more famous one yet.  I don't think it will be because he did 13 episodes of a show in 2005 that played on a lesser station and got cancelled because of low ratings and a wrap-it-up movie.  It's not like the Veronica Mars actors are breaking the box offices post cancellation and that show lasted for 3 seasons..

15 hours ago, Lee4U said:

I wonder if they are even going to wait about the announcement until after Monday's show airs - if so, interesting, albeit, odd strategy.

I too remain amazed people don't care if hundreds lose their jobs because a fictional couple is coming to an end.  

Castle is made by the ABC production company so many of the people working on it are probably hired by ABC rather than freelancers.  Publicity, make-up, the crew are probably on permanent contract to the company. The people who will be affected most are the creatives, the producers, writers and actors.  Directors are hired by the episode and move from show to show.  And don't forget, if Castle gets cancelled, another show will fill the 10 pm Monday timeslot on ABC and there will be jobs created on that.

But setting that aside, I've been watching this season and for me, without the Castle/Beckett spark the show falls sadly flat.  I don't care about the goofy antics of the Castle/Esposito/Ryan frat boys (I hated it a couple of episode ago when Ryan and Espo were tricking Lanie) and I've come to hate it when Alexis or Hayley appears on the screen.  That fictional couple is what raised the show above mediocrity and it's quite literally shooting itself in the foot getting rid of Beckett.

Quote

Oh, and what's up with Hawley's tweet? Neither he nor Winter manage so much as an official statement about Katic's exit and now he's tweeting as if none of that has happened?

I always thought that Hawley and Winter never gave a damn about Beckett. Their ideal show is Castle swanning around town and dating the beautiful ladies.

Edited May 8, 2016 by statsgirl

[CheshireCat]

I just had another look at the ratings. I had thought there had been only two episodes which had been below 6 million but there were several more. Has ABC actually looked at their ratings for this season? They declined gradually since the split, then dropped below 6 million after the winter break (due to until when I'm assuming that was due to Castle and Beckett not yet being back together coupled with the long hiatus) and then jumped back over 6 million once Castle and Beckett were officially back together (and then started to decline again after the news broke). I know I'm a broken record, but I had forgotten how obvious it actually was and I'm confused as to what ABC is seeing that I'm not seeing.

[verdana]

5 hours ago, BellyLaughter said:

I (naively?) assumed that the 12th would be eliminated and the PI thing would be a go with fresh cast members alongside Hayley and Money Penny!?! I thought Jon and Seamus would be lucky to score recurring contracts at best...shows what I know! I guess it pays to be buddies with the big boy!! 

I assumed if they got rid of Katic they would be far more invested in securing especially Jon, Seamus to try maintain some kind of continuity for the viewers. I must admit these days I prefer Jon and Seamus together than Caskett so they may be on to something. They'll also need Toks to stay as cheap screen filler because if they get rid of her they're only going to have hire someone else plus some fans appear to enjoy her screen presence. 

As for playing buddies with the big boy I don't blame them honestly, if it was a choice and I was that kind of person I'd be sucking up to Nathan too. 

Edited May 8, 2016 by verdana

[westwingfan]

3 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

I just had another look at the ratings. I had thought there had been only two episodes which had been below 6 million but there were several more. Has ABC actually looked at their ratings for this season? They declined gradually since the split, then dropped below 6 million after the winter break (due to until when I'm assuming that was due to Castle and Beckett not yet being back together coupled with the long hiatus) and then jumped back over 6 million once Castle and Beckett were officially back together (and then started to decline again after the news broke). I know I'm a broken record, but I had forgotten how obvious it actually was and I'm confused as to what ABC is seeing that I'm not seeing.

The important demo rating has been around 1.1 since the premier, I think the 0.8 for Witness for the Prosecution can be ignored because of its Sunday night airing.

The average audience for seven of the eight episodes that aired in 2015 was 6.7M, Cool Boys stood out at only 6.1M. In the last couple of seasons Castle has seen a fall after the Christmas hiatus and when it returned in 2016 8x09, 8x12, 8x13, and 8x14 averaged 5.4M, I've ignored 8x10 (4.2M Sunday airing) and 8x11 (5.2M up against the Grammy's). From 8x15 the show has had the benefit of DWTS as the lead in and the first three after DWTS came back have averaged 6.4M and the three that followed the news about Stana and Tamala have averaged 6.0M. 8x15 -8x17 averaged 2.7M additional viewers for L+3 but only the numbers for 8x18's L+3 are out yet and they were 2.3M. So you could argue that since the announcement about 400K have stopped watching live and the DVR numbers may also show an additional slight loss when they are published.

The S8 average overall for live viewing is currently 1.1/6.1M compared to an average for S7 of 1.6/8.5M. A lot of shows have seen their numbers fall this season, Scandal opened its latest season with 3.3/10.3M but the latest episode only managed 1.6/6.1M.

Edited May 8, 2016 by westwingfan

[verdana]

5 hours ago, TWP said:

I thought I would mention that I was thinking about the jobs long before this controversy arose. When I talked about Stana or Nathan potentially signing or not, I mentioned, actually several times, that they must feel some pressure because if they quit, it puts a ton of people out of work. And I don't think the stars of any show take that lightly unless they're jerks, which some maybe are, who knows.

I don't understand why Stana and Nathan should be made to feel responsible for other people's livelihoods and I don't believe it makes them jerks if their sole focus is ultimately on what is best for them and their families, isn't that what most of us do when it comes down to it?  

I'm saying this as someone who is looking at the writing on the wall in my particular job, my department might be disbanded completely in two or three months time due to a reorganisation that I didn't see coming which was announced last month with various bigwigs at the top leaving but I've accepted it. I'm busy cutting back on my spending and stockpiling my cash and making preparations just in case the worst happens thinking about what I want to do next.  I'm someone at the bottom of the pile in this place I'm not a manager.  But what I'm not doing is looking at my soon to be ex Managing Director who is due to make a lot of money selling out thinking "you bastard I hope you feel bad I might have to look for another job!" because that's life, he's doing what's best for him and his family. People get fired/leave/retire and firms go bust/restructure all the time and most sensible people shrug, accept nothing stays the same, make plans and move on with their lives as best they can. 

Also as others have stated if Castle ends something else will take its place, every one in Hollywood circulates on jobs constantly you see the same faces popping up on any number of shows either on screen or BTS after a while.  Hanning and Creasey have already found new jobs I'm fairly confident Rob the prop guy and the rest of the crew (God even Luke) will find something else. 

My mother gave me some good advice when I started my first job she said don't rely on other people for your own happiness and especially your financial security - be prepared. Over the last twenty years I've tried to heed her words with a few stumbles along the way. I've never signed a contract where an employer promises to keep me in a job guaranteed for life I know what I signed up for I could be out of a job in a month. I'm sure everyone involved in Castle knows their job security lasts a season at best although a network could in extreme circumstances pull the plug immediately but that's rare. Eight years is a long time for a show to last.  Everyone had a good run and they know it, all things have to come to an end sometime. 

Edited May 8, 2016 by verdana

[verdana]

Thanks for the recap on the ratings westwingfan. 

For all the furore over the separation etc the demo hasn't tanked as some predicted it would. 

[verdana]

4 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

Oh, and what's up with Hawley's tweet? Neither he nor Winter manage so much as an official statement about Katic's exit and now he's tweeting as if none of that has happened?

It's disappointing that neither of them have had the good grace to say anything even a bland "I wish Stana well in future endeavours" one liner, I don't believe for one minute they are forbidden from saying something like this even if other restrictions have been place upon their statements by ABC. 

It's simple good manners and they've gone even further down in my estimation. 

And if ABC have told them to keep silent then it further highlights the network's utter incompetence at handling these kind of situations. 

[westwingfan]

Ooops wrong thread

Edited May 8, 2016 by westwingfan