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mariah23
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That movie is weird (and cut so short - how many of the women do we actually see, ten?).  One would think MGM would have been through sticking Myrna Loy in those "exotic" roles by then, but it still took them a bit longer to catch on.  Thank the universe for Woody Van Dyke.

According to imdb.com trivia, which I take with a grain of salt, here are only 11 women in the movie, not 13. Two were cut to give more scenes to Irene Dunne, who had just had a hit at another studio.  One of the actresses who had their scenes cut was Betty Furness, who was also Myrna Loy's hand double in the movie.

 

The odd thing is I can only think of 6 women: the circus acrobat, the woman who kills her husband, the woman who kills herself, then the three we see who live, Irene Dunne and her two friends who arrive for the reunion dinner.

 

Okay, now this is getting ridiculous!!!  In the past week, Martha Hyer, Ruby Dee and now Carla Laemmle have died.

I had not heard that any of them had died!  Very sad!

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Oh damn, I didn't even know about Martha Hyer's passing. 

 

I loved Martha Hyer's speaking voice. I have no idea what that kind of voice is called. Linguistics experts probably have a term for it. I've heard the sound elsewhere but not very often. It's not a dialect, it's something to do with the voice production itself. Maybe some very slight nasality in the sound? I think it was her most distinguishing feature.

 

(I mean, certainly she was a capable actress, and easy on the eyes, but that voice was what made her stand out, IMO.)

Edited by Milburn Stone
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Did anyone else catch the mini bio on Michael Curtiz just after Andy Hardy? I love that they finally gave him his due homage. Not an auteur like Ford but he did every genre imaginable with great end results. A studio director for sure but there's nothing wrong with that. It's all about entertainment,

 

He is my fave director basically  because almost all his  films are the very definition of Classic. You can run down the list of his films and it is just astonishing how many good ones he made. 

 

 

Warners was my favorite studio. Gritty compared to lavish like MGM (not that there's anything wrong with that.)

Edited by prican58
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"If there's one place the Church should leave alone it's a man's soul"

                                                               Clarence Day Sr.

                                                                Life With Father.

 

Answer: "The director of this film from where this quote is taken?"

 

"Who is Michael Curtiz?

 

 

I rest my case. Happy Father's day.

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I decided to watch Forsaking All Others (1934) today. Ugh. Joan Crawford and Clark Gable in their one on one scenes? Couldn't be more perfect. They're not just great actors but they give off a certain air. I think that's why I immediately responded to them in the first movies I saw and why I continue to be won over in almost all of their roles. They have a sense of intelligence and cleverness about them. And in the films from this period (as opposed to the earlier ones) they just feel so... adult in some way. There's no sense of playacting or childishness. It feels adult and genuine. 

 

Some of the Adrian gowns are lovely though there are certainly some that are over the top. 

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Some of the Adrian gowns are lovely though there are certainly some that are over the top.

 

I'm fascinated by Adrian gowns every time I watch one of the many movies for which he was costume designer.  They work better on some actors than others - and I think Crawford is one of the ones for whom they work best - and some are just over the top regardless.  But they're pretty amazing.

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It has the exuberance and playfulness and party atmosphere of those flapper movies.

 

Robert Montgomery was much less of an ass in this movie compared to other Montgomery-Crawford movies. Or well, he was still an ass but he was a more tolerable ass. He was an ass in the way people are in these love triangle/adultery movies where they're just kind of selfish and carefree and callous without necessarily being malicious. 

 

Lots of shirtlessness in this movie. 

 

The cornflowers were a sweet symbol in the beginning that just got hammered into the ground in like the last 10 minutes of the movie. It went from being a subtle thing to an easy way to a 3 minute resolution. 

 

Just once, I'd like to see a straight Gable/Crawford romance where she's not pining after someone else for most of the movie and he's not a criminal. Does one of those movies exist? (Besides Possessed, which I love.)

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Just once, I'd like to see a straight Gable/Crawford romance where she's not pining after someone else for most of the movie and he's not a criminal. Does one of those movies exist? (Besides Possessed, which I love.)

Does either "Love on the Run" or "Dancing Lady" fill these requirements?

 

Bringing the topic back around to Myrna Loy....after watching Jimmy Cagney in "Boy meets Girl", I though he would have been could in "Libeled Lady"  And then I wondered why they didn't have Clark Gable in the "Haggarty" role for Libeled Lady?  Any back stage buzz?

 

Have you caught the , oh I'll just call it a promo, for Greer Garson by John Carradine?  He mentions that Greer Garson got the role in "Goodbye, Mr. Chips" because Myrna Loy turned down the role.   I'm fan of Myrna Loy, but I can not see her in that role.  Can you imagine what would happen when Chips brings her home to meet the rest of the his colleagues?  Greer was enough of a shock, but with Myrna, heart attacks all around.

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Does either "Love on the Run" or "Dancing Lady" fill these requirements?

I haven't managed to catch either of those movies in their entirety yet but they're on my list. Basically all the Gable/Crawford movies are on my list. They just have such fantastic chemistry.

 

Libeled Lady is on my list of movies to watch but I either don't record it or let it disappear from the DVR because I just can't deal with Spencer Tracy. I'll suck it up one of these days so I can watch some of his movies but with so many movies out there that I want to watch, it's going to take a while.

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So it feels right that my first PTV post is about "Silent Sundays", and Rudolph Valentino.

 

Last night was a reminder that he was mighty fine with that trademark slicked-back 'do, but when the brilliantine was missing (that scene in Martinique from Conquering Power)...WOW.  I think I blacked out for a moment.

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Libeled Lady is on my list of movies to watch but I either don't record it or let it disappear from the DVR because I just can't deal with Spencer Tracy. I'll suck it up one of these days so I can watch some of his movies but with so many movies out there that I want to watch, it's going to take a while.

 

You're in luck. He's barely in it, and his character is a selfish, dishonest, manipulative jerk, so you can enjoy the rare pleasure of not feeling pressured to like a Spencer Tracy character :)

 

Powell and Loy were fun together, but for me, Powell's scenes with Jean Harlow are the standouts. I don't know if they were already involved when they made the movie, but they seemed to be having a lot of fun together.

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I wouldn't have imagined a Libeled Lady recasting--I like Tracy, sue me, :-)--but Cagney and Gable are strong choices.  Powell and Harlow were indeed quite involved while the movie was being made.

 

Speaking of Gable--aradia22, did you catch Night Nurse?

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And then I wondered why they didn't have Clark Gable in the "Haggarty" role for Libeled Lady?  Any back stage buzz?

 

If I recall correctly, Gable was indeed MGM's first thought for the role, but the timing didn't work out; he was doing a film with Joan Crawford.  Tracy was still pretty new on the lot, and they wanted to get him out there more, so he was tapped for the role instead.

 

I'm hit and miss on Spencer Tracy - and most of the hits come from when he's paired with Katharine Hepburn - but I quite like him in this role.  Gable could have done it, sure, but it works well with Tracy.

 

One of my favorite films. 

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Speaking of Gable--aradia22, did you catch Night Nurse?

I am so sad. We had to trade in the DVR because everything was super choppy and everything is gone... Night Nurse, Red Dust/Mogambo, The Thin Man/After the Thin Man, The Umbrellas of Cherbourg, etc. 

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I'm hit and miss on Spencer Tracy - and most of the hits come from when he's paired with Katharine Hepburn - but I quite like him in this role.  Gable could have done it, sure, but it works well with Tracy.

 

One non-Hepburn I like him in is Bad Day at Black Rock. He gives good badass.

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My favorite Spencer Tracy role was in The Last Hurrah, which was also a sort of reunion for the John Ford stock company, which I loved. I didn't even mind Jeffrey Hunter, who I thought few of his movies used well. I also thought, as admirable and progressive as it was, that far and away the best thing about Guess Who's Coming To Dinner was his character's battle between his basically decent principles and how he reflexively wasn't willing to sacrifice (what he saw as) his family's comfort for them.

The alternate casting I would have loved to see was Katharine Hepburn's original choice of Spencer Tracy for the Jimmy Stewart part in Philadelphia Story. That would have been a really interesting movie.

Edited by Julia
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While we're recasting, as much as I love Katharine Hepburn - and the Hepburn/Tracy combo - I'd have liked to see The Sea of Grass with my other favorite, Myrna Loy, as was originally planned.  I'm not a big fan of the movie, so I'm not attached to it as-is, and I like when studio actors get to do something a little different.  Having grown up in Montana, Loy could have brought an interesting perspective to the role (and she was pissed when MGM gave it to Hepburn without even telling her; just one of many issues she had with the studio by that point, leading her to ask for early release from her contract).  There isn't much interaction between Loy and Tracy in Libeled Lady, but I like the way they worked together in Whipsaw and Test Pilot.

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I am so sad. We had to trade in the DVR because everything was super choppy and everything is gone... Night Nurse, Red Dust/Mogambo, The Thin Man/After the Thin Man, The Umbrellas of Cherbourg, etc.

Oh, that is the WORST, isn't it?  We have TimeWarner and last year we went through THREE cable boxes! And I was so looking forward to talking about Night Nurse with you!  But you know  it is even more tragic that a big Gable fan like you has never seen Red Dust - his chemistry with Harlow is amazing.

 

Well, happy birthday anyway, hon. 

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My favorite Spencer Tracy role was in The Last Hurrah, which was also a sort of reunion for the John Ford stock company, which I loved. I didn't even mind Jeffrey Hunter, who I thought few of his movies used well. I also thought, as admirable and progressive as it was, that far and away the best thing about Guess Who's Coming To Dinner was his character's battle between his basically decent principles and how he reflexively wasn't willing to sacrifice (what he saw as) his family's comfort for them.

The alternate casting I would have loved to see was Katharine Hepburn's original choice of Spencer Tracy for the Jimmy Stewart part in Philadelphia Story. That would have been a really interesting movie.

 

Indeed, but I thought she and Stewart had a lot of chemistry in that movie. I really like The Philadelphia Story, but when I first watched it, I really thought she would have ended up with Stewart. Cary Grant is great, but I really liked Stewart's character. Have people seen the remake High Society, the musical version with Grace Kelly replacing Hepburn. I think Louis Armstrong was the memorable thing about it for me.

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Have people seen the remake High Society, the musical version with Grace Kelly replacing Hepburn.

Yup. I've only seen The Philadelphia Story in pieces and The Philadelphia Story and High Society were on the DVR so I could do a double feature and compare them. The first time I watched it, I wasn't aware that High Society had a Cole Porter score. Anyway, what I remember from that movie is the white outfit Grace Kelly wore by the pool. It had this interesting detail at the shoulders. Also, I think it was a bit boring because I remember almost falling asleep during a song that might have been called "True Love" when Bing Crosby and Grace Kelly were on the boat. 

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Yup. I've only seen The Philadelphia Story in pieces and The Philadelphia Story and High Society were on the DVR so I could do a double feature and compare them. The first time I watched it, I wasn't aware that High Society had a Cole Porter score. Anyway, what I remember from that movie is the white outfit Grace Kelly wore by the pool. It had this interesting detail at the shoulders. Also, I think it was a bit boring because I remember almost falling asleep during a song that might have been called "True Love" when Bing Crosby and Grace Kelly were on the boat. 

 

I remember it being boring too. That scene stuck in my head for being so "try-hard". It was just so earnest trying to sell their great romance and I didn't think Kelly was an exceptional singer either. I do remember Sinatra being vaguely entertaining in it.

 

I know you mentioned it earlier, but gosh, I love The Umbrellas of Cherbourg. The director's follow up with the twins and Gene Kelly movie was not as good though still visually interesting.

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Have people seen the remake High Society, the musical version with Grace Kelly replacing Hepburn.

Oh my favorite example of how wrong a remake can go.  Sure there are the big names, some great songs, but what kills the movie for me is that it tries too hard but even more than that the supporting cast doesn't work.   What makes "The Philadelphia Story" so much fun for me are the performances of Virginia Wielder, Roland Young, Ruth Hussey, and Mary Nash.  They support the craziness that is going on and are a much as a part of it as the rest of the main trio.

 

In "High Society", those characters just seem to be there, watching the action, rather than being part of the story.

 

Strangely, though, one might think, I do like the June Allyson version of "The Women".  I thought they did a good job of translating the "culture" of the women from the original movie and putting into the world of the theater.  I actually like the addition of the men to the story, some of them have the best reaction shots.  I always am happy to see Sam Levene.  I think the addition of seeing Buck give them the chance to set up the comeuppance of the Crystal character.  (sidebar: The mistake that was made with the Meg Ryan remake of the story was that they did not update it enough, they should have set it in another insular world in New York, publishing or public relations or something - Just Skip This One!)

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I thought Celeste Holm was good in the Ruth Hussey part, although she did have less to compete with. Well, Did You Evah was fun, and you can never have enough adorably baked Louis Armstrong.

Honestly, though, I think that may be about it.

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I think it was a bit boring because I remember almost falling asleep during a song that might have been called "True Love" .... 

"True Love" is indeed the name of the song, and I remember what a big hit it was in my youth -- it was on the radio all the time, and it stayed on Your Hit Parade week after week. But it may be the dullest song Cole Porter ever wrote. To those who treasure his classic songs from the 1930s, or his great score for Kiss Me, Kate, for the polished subtleties of their craftsmanship, it's almost unbelievable that he would sign his name to a simple-minded uneventful slow waltz like this. (And for what it's worth, I'm far from the first musicologist to say this.) His achievement is secure of course, and can survive a blip or two like this. Some of the other songs for the movie are better (and "Well, Did You Evah!" is lifted from his 1939 musical DuBarry Was a Lady -- a last-minute interpolation, it's said, so that Sinatra and Crosby could have a duet).

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The alternate casting I would have loved to see was Katharine Hepburn's original choice of Spencer Tracy for the Jimmy Stewart part in Philadelphia Story. That would have been a really interesting movie.

I recall that she wanted Spencer Tracy and Clark Gable, but I had always thought that it was the other way around Tracy for Dexter and Gable for Mike.  I wonder is she had someone in mind for George that was never mentioned.  (There goes George)

 

For the play on Broadway, her costars were Joseph Cotten as "C.K. Dexter Haven" and Van Heflin as "Macauley Connor",

 

This is one of those movies that I can not imagine anyone else but those cast in the roles.

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Woo! They're showing Night Nurse again in August and then in September. Watch me not even enjoy this movie...

I guess that's possible, but I think it's a really fun movie.

 

Rock Hudson star of the month and TCM shows Giant in the middle of the night and Pillow talk in primetime?  Aargh!

That's a little weird - but on the other hand Giant is a movie they show at least once a month.  They were showing Pillow Talk a lot on the weekends a few years back when they were on a big Doris Day kick, but not so much recently.

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Oh my favorite example of how wrong a remake can go.  Sure there are the big names, some great songs, but what kills the movie for me is that it tries too hard but even more than that the supporting cast doesn't work.   What makes "The Philadelphia Story" so much fun for me are the performances of Virginia Wielder, Roland Young, Ruth Hussey, and Mary Nash.  They support the craziness that is going on and are a much as a part of it as the rest of the main trio.

 

This!  The supporting cast of the original is the main reason I watch it. Weidler was such a talented kid and she is fascinating in TPS (as well as The Women). Roland Young is just always so damned good. Another actor I like and I think would have been good in the role was Charlie Ruggles. Physically the are quite alike.  They were both in Ruggles of Red Gap. I love that film. 

 

Tonight is Pirate Flynn night. Captain Blood and The Sea Hawk. Each time I see him, I like him more and more. What a movie star! I wonder how audiences received him back in the day when he came on the scene. I would imagine quite the visceral reaction. I know it's not a pirate film but Robin Hood sure would fit into this schedule, I think Robin was a kind of pirate.

Edited by prican58
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Tonight is Pirate Flynn night. Captain Blood and The Sea Hawk. Each time I see him, I like him more and more. What a movie star!

I know!  I've been loving this Friday Pirate Night theme!  And seriously it doesn't get better than Captain Blood and The Sea Hawk.

 

Although the one I'm going to record (because I've never seen it) is Fortunes of Captain Blood with Louis Hayward in the Flynn role. 

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I guess that's possible, but I think it's a really fun movie.

I hope so. I just think life thinks it's funny to be ironic and I might put in all this work to catch this movie and then dislike it.

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I didn't think Night Nurse was a great movie, but it's fun to watch something old Hollywood that incredibly cynical. If they made the same movie today, it would be considered edgy.

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Has anyone ever seen an unknown actor playing a role in a favorite movie but then you never see them in anything else? Then one day you watch a film that's older than dirt and lo and behold there's that actor. Talking about Stanwyck  in her pre Code days I remembered Babyface. There is a very important role in the film that's played by Theresa Harris. Who is she? She played Cleo the housekeeper/cook to Maureen O'Hara in Miracle on 34th Street.  If you look her up in imdb there is quite the resume. It's good read.

 

I want to see more of her. I always thought her 1-2 speaking lines in Miracle were quite effective. There was such a sweetness there. 

 

Captain Blood on now. Oh and need I mention it is directed by Michael Curtiz? I didn't think so.

 

Must add that Flynn looked very uninterested in Against All Flags. Yes he was past his prime but really he looked bored. And why wouldn't he? Studio system was on its last breath. 

 

Hey Charlie Baker, The Big Sleep is such a confusing convoluted hot mess but it's maybe my fave Bogey/Baby film. Fun,fun,fun.

Edited by prican58
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I finally sat down to watch Pillow Talk for the first time today. I can definitely see how they rehashed the plot for Lover Come Back. But other than the troubling gender politics (which I generally expect from all movies from the 50's and 60's) I think it's aged well. I still found it funny and I don't know when Rock Hudson isn't going to be charming... although he might be too handsome. It's almost a little generic... like a Ken doll. I think I would have enjoyed the movie even more if I hadn't seen Lover Come Back first but it was still a lot of fun. The singer at the piano bar eavesdropping and then singing "You lie" to him as he was leaving with Doris Day was cheesy but cute. The movie kept a lightness that made the moments that should have bothered me seem more inoffensive, though in retrospect, the way it downplayed coercion, unwanted male attention/attempted rape, and a lot of characters who condoned/ignored the behavior (carriage driver, singer, etc.) is a bit troubling. 

 

It was a bit weird watching Rock Hudson delivering those lines about gay stereotypes and implying that his alter-ego was gay. I think they managed to integrate most of Doris Day singing in the film in a way that felt organic but it did seem a little gimmicky with the split screen and the footage of Day and Hudson imposed over the various NY landmarks, etc. They definitely weren't shy about pulling out all the tricks. It bugs me a little that she wasn't able to act professional and was first petty and vengeful in decorating the apartment and then childish and petulant as he carried her around. And again, all those people were complicit.

Edited by aradia22
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What I love  about any Doris Day movie is the pound and a half of vasoline on the camera lens during her close ups.

Aw, poor Doris Day. But yeah, it's kind of been throwing me how old she looks in the films I've seen (Move Over Darling, Pillow Talk, Lover Come Back, The Thrill of It All). When I hear her described, I picture this very fresh-faced movie star in maybe her late 20's/early 30's. Am I just picking all her later movies? I was under the impression that these were her big hits. Like, I'm looking for Sandra Bullock in Miss Congeniality and Reese Witherspoon in Legally Blonde and Kate Hudson in How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days. Not Sandra Bullock in The Proposal and Reese Witherspoon in This Means War and Kate Hudson in Something Borrowed. (By the way, I could do this all day.)

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What I love  about any Doris Day movie is the pound and a half of vasoline on the camera lens during her close ups.

 

Yeah, it's the contrast between the two-shots and the close-ups that's really striking.

 

You'd think things like this would have been obvious on the big screen (I mean the big movie screens of the time) compared to home screens. But I think it's the reverse. Today's high-res picture and sound make it far easier to observe discontinuities than the technicians of the past had any reason to expect. What I'm trying to say is that the tricks-of-the-trade by technicians back in the day, which seem ridiculous, were not ridiculous, given the exhibition realities of their day. They were correct that visual discontinuities would largely be ignored or overlooked by audiences in large auditoriums, and audio discontinuities (like changes in ambience, looping, etc.) would be totally lost inside the acoustics of large auditoriums.

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But yeah, it's kind of been throwing me how old she looks in the films I've seen (Move Over Darling, Pillow Talk, Lover Come Back, The Thrill of It All). When I hear her described, I picture this very fresh-faced movie star in maybe her late 20's/early 30's

Maybe it my old eyes, I still am seeing the fresh faced movie star in her 30s.

 

What I love about Doris Day movies is her clothes!

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But yeah, it's kind of been throwing me how old she looks in the films I've seen

I think the hair and makeup she wore in that time period were kind of harsh and unflattering.  She's only 34 in PIllow Talk!  But she tends to look kind of dumpy compared to the way she looks in her movies from the forties and early fifties, or for that matter from the way she looked a few years later on her TV show.

 

a reaction to sun damage and much younger co-stars.

Sun damage, yeah, very likely.  Also the studios didn't want her to appear with her "ugly" freckles so the pancake is pretty heavy  and that kind of heavy pancake works best in stills.  Too much caking  when your face is in motion - it makes you look older close up because of the way it sits on the skin.

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I finally sat down to watch Pillow Talk for the first time today. I can definitely see how they rehashed the plot for Lover Come Back. But other than the troubling gender politics (which I generally expect from all movies from the 50's and 60's) I think it's aged well. I still found it funny and I don't know when Rock Hudson isn't going to be charming... although he might be too handsome. It's almost a little generic... like a Ken doll. I think I would have enjoyed the movie even more if I hadn't seen Lover Come Back first but it was still a lot of fun. The singer at the piano bar eavesdropping and then singing "You lie" to him as he was leaving with Doris Day was cheesy but cute. The movie kept a lightness that made the moments that should have bothered me seem more inoffensive, though in retrospect, the way it downplayed coercion, unwanted male attention/attempted rape, and a lot of characters who condoned/ignored the behavior (carriage driver, singer, etc.) is a bit troubling. 

 

I agree about Hudson. I wouldn't say he was vapid or lacking all charm, but he always seemed just a bit too Ken for me. Doris shone in all her movies. I also thought she and James Garner had a lot of chemistry in The Thrill of It All which was my first Day movie from when I was a kid. Plot is ridiculous, but they worked off each other well.

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Doris Day's career had different phases--her 40s and 50s musicals and then the Pillow Talk and after-era, which I think I read somewhere was the peak of her box office power.  Re what she wore: one movie, which was pretty entertaining, but in which I always thought her wardrobe was AWFUL, was Please Don't Eat the Daisies. And the camera filtering really was out of hand on her late 60s/early 70s sitcom, too noticeable even on TVs at the time. (Yep, I was there, and yep, I'm old.) 

 

As I noted earlier here, my favorite performance of hers was the atypical Love Me or Leave Me. There have been stories around that she was considered for the movie of South Pacific, and she would have been such perfect casting for that.  

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What I love about Doris Day movies is her clothes!

I find some of her outfits kind of boxy but she had a great figure so she pulled it off. I think Pillow Talk probably had the best fashion. Apparently interior decorating paid really well back then. I even just like the scoop neck of that burgundy dress. I think I read that "jean louis" did the costumes in the opening credits. I find that I'm generally drawn to the unusual when it comes to her fashion in these movies. For instance, from Lover Come Back the outfit that sticks out to me is the sort of crop top she wore with all the spangly bits. I think it was when Rock Hudson's character came for dinner.

 

Also, I think we did this on the old TWoP forum but am I the youngest one here?

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As I noted earlier here, my favorite performance of hers was the atypical Love Me or Leave Me.

Yeah, that's a great one.  And according to her autobiography playing the part of a woman living in an abusive relationship was not a million miles removed from her own experience.

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