S04.E07: Test Of Strength

[RedheadZombie]

The scene of her tearfully telling Jimmy about the cruel world was seriously the most moving scene in the series thus far. (A close second was her scene with the kind doctor). Kathy Bates was just phenomenal in both scenes. I like what Lange is doing with Elsa, but the sorrow and humanity that comes off of Ethel in waves is just heartbreaking.

I think her accent is getting better too and I have lived in and around Baltimore for 25+ years.

 

Kathy Bates is just amazing.  I like Jessica Lange, but I'm tired of her getting all the nominations.  She's chewing the scenery while Kathy slays with subtlety and nuance.  And in a beard!

[Cruella]

This is such a stupid blackmail!

First, Dell is in one of the better places to be "queer" at. Not that "freaks" can't be homophobic, they easily can, but they seriously have bigger fish to fry than to worry why Dell visited gay bar and got angry. And if they say an unpleasant word, throttle them or something, and others will keep their trap shut. Second, he's married to hermaphrodite! Nobody thinks he's normal anyway. Did anyone care by the way? No. Third, not much is tying him to this place, he could just leave. I understand he wouldn't want to, but his wife left him, and Jimmy he was trying to kill just few hours ago. Nobody likes him. 4th: He could just say that he was looking if there were any hermaphrodites in a bar because he missed his wife, or was super horny but couldn't get laid with normal women of this small town. I don't see anyone but his ex caring much either way and she hates him already. I mean, his wife has a penis. His unusual sexuality is old news in here.

 

So as stupid as Del is I just don't believe he'd be so dumb as to start murdering people just because of that. And like others pointed out, it makes zero sense that he'd go after Amazon Eve at that.

 

Even Peters is a pretty good singer, though it doesn't mean he should attempt Nirvana songs. This one is my favorite while we're at it.

 

People talk like there is only one Mutter Museum in a world. There is kunstkamera in my city (St. Petersburg) and I assumed something like that would be in most european capitals and the like. Antropogical museums etc.

 

 

Is it much less exploitative than an actual freak show?

Well, they used to make lots of money at those, and some really liked performing apparently. Now we'll just avert our eyes probably so god forbid nobody thinks we're staring. Sometimes I think we know even less what to do with different people.

Edited November 22, 2014 by Cruella

[Beezel]

This is such a stupid blackmail!

First, Dell is in one of the better places to be "queer" at. Not that "freaks" can't be homophobic, they easily can, but they seriously have bigger fish to fry than to worry why Dell visited gay bar and got angry. And if they say an unpleasant word, throttle them or something, and others will keep their trap shut. Second, he's married to hermaphrodite! Nobody thinks he's normal anyway. Did anyone care by the way? No. Third, not much is tying him to this place, he could just leave. I understand he wouldn't want to, but his wife left him, and Jimmy he was trying to kill just few hours ago. Nobody likes him. 4th: He could just say that he was looking if there were any hermaphrodites in a bar because he missed his wife, or was super horny but couldn't get laid with normal women of this small town. I don't see anyone but his ex caring much either way and she hates him already. I mean, his wife has a penis. His unusual sexuality is old news in here.

 

Cruella, I think you  lay out all the reasons Dell's behavior makes no sense. Though, Desiree is not a hermaphrodite, since she recently found out in episode 5 that  she's a woman with an enlarged clit. Despite this technicality, up until this point everyone did believe her to be a hermaphrodite (including herself),  so you're points remain valid.

 

Regarding the songs sang on this show, I read somewhere that the producers picked songs from artists who said they felt like freaks in their own lives.

 

While I enjoy some of the anachronisms on this show, Jimmy belting out Nirvana in a year where rock music wasn't even invented yet was a bit of a reach.  What next, is Elsa going to whip out her iPhone?

 

I can appreciate what they are going for, but my one reservation with the songs is that they jump across all these eras, which I suppose is meant to be  pleasantly surprising, but just takes me out of the show. I would have much rather them stick with one artist (Bowie), then they could pull from different eras and keep it cohesive. Or because I'm a dork, I would have loved them to stick with songs from the 70s since it's such a "freaky" era. Also, can  you imagine Evan or Jessica singing the Carpenters or Captain and Tennille? It kind of makes me wish a future season would take place in a 70s variety show, especially since they seem to be so fond of the musical numbers. But like i said, I'm a dork.

Edited November 22, 2014 by Beezel

[wrestlesflamingos]

I did have issue's with Evan's song and I'm usually a fan. My issue was the sound mixing was so badthat it felt like a talent show. Evan didn't sell the stomping around either. He was slightly too polite in his movements, maybe too deliberate. However, Evan can do no wrong and its pretty awesome from someone with less experience. The sound guy owes us an apology though.

[Mattipoo]

I wish Chloe Sevigny would have been a series regular too. She could easily take over all the roles Emma Roberts has had so far and killed it.

[basil]

People talk like there is only one Mutter Museum in a world. There is kunstkamera in my city (St. Petersburg) and I assumed something like that would be in most european capitals and the like. Antropogical museums etc

 

.

Well....there is only one Mutter museum in the world. Its original collection was created by a doctor named Thomas Dent Mütter, and while yourstruly is probably correct in that it was the inspiration for the museum of oddities in the show, its original purpose was as a medical teaching tool. Back in the 1800s, cadavers for study and practice were hard to come by and very expensive. Mütter's collection was a boon for aspiring doctors.

 

It was not the shallow, for-entertainment-only gathering place of the louche and bored elite looking for a cheap thrill portrayed in AHS. To be sure, the Mütter museum is savvy enough to take advantage of its creepier side for fundraising purposes, but its mission is still educational.

 

There are other places that house curiosities and anatomical collections, but there is only one Mütter. The Kunstkamera is a wonderful museum, even older than the Mütter, and houses collections of all kinds, even gemstones.

 

Topic, you say?

 

Not that "freaks" can't be homophobic, they easily can, but they seriously have bigger fish to fry than to worry why Dell visited gay bar and got angry

 

True, but remember this is set in the 50s. Homosexuality was considered deviant behavior and was most definitely illegal. Dell could end up in a prison, an asylum or dead. Dell also doesn't strike me as particularly bright. 

 

BTW - The actor who plays Eve is transgender. Is her character supposed to be transgender, too, or just a really tall woman?

 

 

I'd like the answer to this, too, RazzleberryPie. I have seen an interview with the actor saying that the casting agents were looking for a male to play the role, and that she auditioned as a male, for what that's worth.

[Bruinsfan]

I changed my mind again. Where is Edward Mordrake when you need him? .

Agreed. It's odd to be glad of the introduction of a nightmarish ghost that drags freaks off to Hell, but in this instance I hope he's a Checkov's Gun that comes back for Dell in the third act.

 

I hate to go there, but if they were going to display Ma Petite would they really keep a dress on her?

In her case the featured abnormality is her size, so I guess that would be just as apparent clothed as nude. I'm still not 100% convinced that scene was happening in reality, though. Wouldn't the authorities get mighty suspicious if Stanley starts showing up with multiple recently deceased human oddities that just happen to match disappearances from a freakshow in Florida?

[WearyTraveler]

JIMMY: "I want to keep my balls!"

 

LMAO!

[morgankobi]

But he did also point out if you are going to threaten someone who has a short temper, do so publicly. The implication being that if anything happens to him, everyone will know / assume it was Del who did it.

Yeah, but in the meantime you're dead, so what difference does it make to you then? :)

 

Mordrake only comes on Halloween, correct? Pity. All we have now are a couple of regular people killing other regular people, and Dandy's been dormant a while.

Edited November 22, 2014 by morgankobi

[basil]

Mordrake only comes on Halloween, correct?

 

 

I'm not sure that is correct. We know that Mordrake comes if a freak performs on Hallowe'en, but do we know that it's the only time he comes?

 

Is Del that stupid? His first choice in targets is arguably the one who would be most capable of defending herself.

 

I do think Del is that stupid, but count me in as one who admires the ass-kicking Eve gave him. The actor playing Eve has an impressive resume regarding fighting and weaponry skills, too. 

[Happytobehere]

 

If Denis O'Hare knows that Del has been visiting a gay bar because he saw him there... then Del knows the same about Denis. And he can't hold that gun 24/7.

Dell couldn't put that together because he is stupid. It was my first thought when the threat was made. However, I guess we are to interpret that as Dell being so panicked about being discovered that he didn't see what was right in front of his face.

M. Petit was sad but expected. The scene that got me was what was done to Penny. What kind of person, let alone parent does something like that.

What does it say about the complete and utter vileness of the characters on this show when three characters (Dell, Stan and Elsa) are in many ways worse than the sociopathic serial killer on the show?

[Zanne]

I'm not sure that is correct. We know that Mordrake comes if a freak performs on Hallowe'en, but do we know that it's the only time he comes?

 

 

Don't spoil the ending to the very special Martin Luther King, Jr. Day episode!

[Insomnia]

Yeah, but in the meantime you're dead, so what difference does it make to you then? :)

 

The same as any threat, I guess. It's the threat of being outed, as gay, as a murderer that stops Del from shooting the guy threatening him. It's blackmail without money; "Give me a million dollars and I won't tell me people are gay!" "If you kill me everyone will know it's you because I haven't fought with anyone else and you will go to jail!" Only instead of money, it starts out with outing him.

 

Yeah, O'Hare would be dead, but his threat is that his corpse would be pointing right at Del if it ever happens. Presumably Del doesn't want to go to jail. 

 

Del isn't the smartest person on the show, but even brilliant people can be emotionally manipulated. It doesn't have to make sense if you are worried your secret will get out, and the other person has any power over you. And O'Hare's character has the power: 1) I will tell everyone you are gay if you don't do this thing for me. 2) If you kill me everyone will know it was you because we just fought in front of a whole bunch of witnesses, you are an't known for keeping your temper. And it'll probably come out somehow you are gay as well, people will think we had a lover's spat.

 

So, as we've seen O'Hare's character hasn't ended up dead, so so far, it's worked.

[RedheadZombie]

I wish Chloe Sevigny would have been a series regular too. She could easily take over all the roles Emma Roberts has had so far and killed it.

 

Chloe can act circles around Emma, but there is a seventeen year age difference. I'm not sure Emma's current character is supposed to be significantly young, but last season her character was school age (I think).  I do wonder why RM hasn't utilized Chloe more - she's incredibly quirky and unique.  I guess it's possible that Chloe didn't enjoy her prior role.

 

I wonder if RM is only keeping Emma Roberts because he gets the added publicity of her turbulent relationship with EP.  It can't be for her acting.

[RedheadZombie]

I am glad Maggie was only on a small amount. She may not have killed anyone but she is aware of what Stanley wants and will do and she has done nothing to stop it.

 

I consider her a co-conspirator.  She didn't say a word, and I'm sure she will happily take her cut.

 

I thought I was going to feel devastated if Ma Petite was killed but I don't know, something about her murder didn't work for me. I don't know, maybe her death scene wasn't that powerful after her fake death.  I felt worse for Gummer; her dad must die. (Dell must die too, several times, if possible).

 

I didn't even realize she was a Gummer girl until this episode.  She had her hair up and looked exactly like her mother.

 

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to feel about the twins.  I don't want them harmed, but they confuse me.  Bette is supposed to be sweet and loving, but she killed their mother, fell in love with Dandy, and was quick to become a diva and condescend to Dot.  Dot is smart and clever, but she tried to kill Bette (which I still don't understand because she would have died as well), and hates her sister enough to have a surgery that will automatically kill her.  I can't imagine Bette would sign a surgical consent knowing it will be her death.

[Dancingjaneway]

I don't see how Del is going to be able to hang around after Ma Petites death. After he attacked Amazon Eve he became a dead man so Ma's disappearance should be the nail in his coffin. There is no way they would think anybody but Dell would do it. He's the only one who has tried to harm another freak(minus Elsa but she would never hurt Ma Petite). I wonder how RM is going to get around this one. 

[JakeyJokes]

Chloe can act circles around Emma, but there is a seventeen year age difference. I'm not sure Emma's current character is supposed to be significantly young, but last season her character was school age (I think).  I do wonder why RM hasn't utilized Chloe more - she's incredibly quirky and unique.  I guess it's possible that Chloe didn't enjoy her prior role.

 

 

Here's what she told Entertainment Weekly:

 

I was kind of a little disappointed with my character Shelley on American Horror Story: Asylum. I was like, ''Okay, I have six episodes, and three out of the six I was gurgling.'' I wanted more to do. I didn't just wanna be the gurgling monster. Like, I would have rather been Anne Frank or something meatier than just ''Gurgle, gurgle.''

[xls]

While I enjoy some of the anachronisms on this show, Jimmy belting out Nirvana in a year where rock music wasn't even invented yet was a bit of a reach.  What next, is Elsa going to whip out her iPhone?

I hate it when they use modern music,it just does not work for me

[iMonrey]

 

I think Ma Petite would have been worth more to the museum alive than dead.

 

Not really, because it's a legitimate museum of oddities and curiosities, not a Freak Show with live Freaks. Assuming they could get Ma Petite to willingly participate they'd have to feed and house her, and perhaps pay her a salary. The corpse in the jar is simply property. Granted, I don't know how they get around proving ownership of that kind of property, but it's certainly a lot cheaper to keep her that way.

[MarkySnark]

Done with this season. This episode did it. First, Lobster Boy singing Nirvana? No. Just stop. Then Vic Mackey kills Ma Petite? I'm out. Unless I hear that Kathy Bates shaves her beard and goes all Annie Wilkes on Dell, I won't be coming back.

[Mattipoo]

I hate that this season is becoming like "Glee" with the musical numbers that are shoehorned into the narrative. This week's Nirvana number is especially so. I hope they don't plan to have anymore of that coming up in the season.

Jessica Lange is really, really boring me with her character this season. Elsa Mars has to be my least favorite of all her AHS characters by far.

We need more Pepper backstory. Now that Ma Petit is gone, she is the only sympathetic character left. Wonder when Sister Mary Eunice makes her return to the show.

Was the actor who plays Dandy ever on "Glee"? He looks like someone who would be on "Glee".

Kathy Bates is nailing all her scenes as usual. The scene between her, Jimmy and Amazon Eve was just perfect. She should win an Emmy for playing the hell out of the bearded lady.

[editorgrrl]

We need more Pepper backstory. Now that Ma Petit is gone, she is the only sympathetic character left.

Paul, Ethel, Desiree, Penny, Amazon Eve, and Jimmy are all sympathetic.

Edited to add Suzi and Salty, too.

Edited November 27, 2014 by editorgrrl

[Pixel]

I don't care much for Desiree, which is odd because I usually love Angela Bassett, but I do love Ethel.  I don't want her to die.

[uoflfan]

"Everytime Kathy Bates appears, I want "FER YER CONESIDUREESHUN" or whatever that would sound like phonetically in Balmerese to flash on the screen. She's knocking her scenes out of the park, even with that weird accent.

Kathy Bates is a Goddess and a hell of a scene stealer. Also, I quite enjoyed Evan Peters this episode.

[Blakeston]

This is such a stupid blackmail!

First, Dell is in one of the better places to be "queer" at. Not that "freaks" can't be homophobic, they easily can, but they seriously have bigger fish to fry than to worry why Dell visited gay bar and got angry. And if they say an unpleasant word, throttle them or something, and others will keep their trap shut. Second, he's married to hermaphrodite! Nobody thinks he's normal anyway. Did anyone care by the way? No.

The only explanation I can come up with for why Dell is so scared of the blackmail threat is that he still thinks he has a shot with Desiree, and he doesn't want her to find out about the action he gets on the side.

Even after Desiree told Dell off, he was still determined to make sure that she keeps her phallic clitoris the way it is - to the point of breaking her doctor's hands to prevent him from performing the procedure. As Dell sees it, Desiree is still "his."

 

Then Stanley comes along and threatens to tell everyone that Dell is obsessed with a beautiful male prostitute who he met at a gay bar. I think Dell knows that Desiree is even less likely to come back to him if she hears that.

 

I'm still not 100% convinced that scene was happening in reality, though. Wouldn't the authorities get mighty suspicious if Stanley starts showing up with multiple recently deceased human oddities that just happen to match disappearances from a freakshow in Florida?

Stanley told Maggie that they don't have to worry about getting caught, because the police care so little about freaks that they wouldn't bother investigating.

I got the impression that we're supposed to think he's right. But I, too, find it hard to swallow that no one would care enough to put the obvious pieces together. Even in the 1950's.

Edited November 30, 2014 by Blakeston

[canter]

Yeah, O'Hare would be dead, but his threat is that his corpse would be pointing right at Del if it ever happens. Presumably Del doesn't want to go to jail.

What I don't get is, won't it be plain as day to the freaks that Dell killed Ma Petite? He attacked Amazon Eve, then the next day Ma Petite goes missing. Won't the freaks kill Dell for that? Why isn't he worried about that, but he'd be worried about the repercussions of killing O'Hare's character?

Was the actor who plays Dandy ever on "Glee"? He looks like someone who would be on "Glee".

He looks a lot like Blaine from Glee to me, in actual looks, in mannerisms, and in his "dandy" style of dress. The expression on Dandy's face after the twins left with Jimmy was exactly the same expression on Blaine's face during his guilt-ridden rendition of "Teenage Dream" on Glee.

[Drusillla]

Why didn't Dell just kill Stanley instead of Ma Petite? It's not like he has any trouble killing people. And Stanley did not offer him money; he was blackmailing him. So yeah, kill him instead of the little innocents.

Edited April 9, 2020 by Drusillla

[ShadowHunter]

On 4/9/2020 at 1:54 PM, Drusillla said:

Why didn't Dell just kill Stanley instead of Ma Petite? It's not like he has any trouble killing people. And Stanley did not offer him money; he was blackmailing him. So yeah, kill him instead of the little innocents.

Yes I remember people asking that when it happened. Dell sucked that was about it.  You are right though.