S21.E13: The Girl Who Gets Caught In A Lie

[BathKol]

I agree with you, BathKol, that he seems to be deliberately trying to provoke a response, but I'm not sure whether that's to get them to be more "themselves" in front of the camera, or whether to let them get a taste of what the real world might be like, or some combo dictated by TPTB. He seems a genuinely nice guy in the interactions I've had with him, and models who have worked with him have nothing but nice things to say. (of course, there may be some self-serving going on there, because people want to continue working.)

It's a mixture, I think, since in the beginning he was firm with everyone but not mocking. I'm no stranger to teachers being hard on you - it's part of life. But after the Ice Rave Challenge, Yu completely went south. I really enjoyed his observations of Adam Man's awkward frat brat behavior in the beginning of the season. Maybe he hit his head in the shower or something and it changed his personality? Who knows. I hope now that Chantelle is gone we can go back to the routine we had sort of established.

[BathKol]

When Chantelle was in the hallway crying because they caught her in the lie, who was sitting across her? I swore I saw a pair of legs but the others were all in the apartment :/

Probably one of the cronies that holds fort on set. TV productions are notoriously tight because their greatest fears are ethics violations and lawsuits that can shut you down for years. They probably told her she could only be outside of the hotel room by 300 yards and that someone would be with her always.

[ExMathMajor]

About 15 minutes into this show I knew Chantalle was going home. It's like the editors didn't even try to fool me this time around.

 

I have a hard time believing she would lie about her and Keith, especially to people who she knows don't like her. I totally agree with Talented Tenth here...I really wish she'd done this:

 

 

Chantelle is very young, but I wish she would have spun it around on Shei and said in front of everyone that she let them believe something happened to see if she could trust them.

 

I didn't realize she was 19. Maybe it's my age, or maybe it's because I know what it's like to be accused of being arrogant when all you're doing is living life, but all I ever saw when looking at her was someone who had to develop an extremely strong sense of confidence to pursue her particular dream. I mean, despite how "tolerant" everybody pretends to be nowadays it's not like "fashion model" and "vitiligo" are words you see together very often. I think Lenox in particular was threatened by her, and her attitude rubbed off on some of the others. Oh well...I'm glad she's working and I hope she has a long and lucrative career. Lenox on the other hand...I'm ready for her to go but sadly she's probably going to be the last girl standing.

 

Hey, Yu Tsai: If someone says "don't call me out of my name" then DON'T DO IT. End of story. I'm glad Chantalle stood up for herself and reminded him that SHE knows she's on TV even if he doesn't.

 

The go-sees were kind of boring IMO. Not surprised that the two biggest successes were the two most model-like people (Keith and Lenox).

 

Never thought I'd say this but...Keith is growing on me. He still has a way to go to catch up with Adam though, at least in my horny old lady mind. If Adam were 20 years older and not on ANTM...oooooh... *fanning myself*

Edited November 15, 2014 by ExMathMajor

[phoenix780]

Lennox has been dogging the girl ever since she came back. She's obsessed.

 

I don't understand why Chantelle gets the benefit of theories about editing and Lenox doesn't.  From what I've seen, she makes most of her comments about Chantelle in interviews, and we know that they reuse those- they resused one from Will twice within 10 minutes at the beginning of the episode.  Couldn't you make the argument that the "obsession" we're seeing is manufactured and they're treating Lenox unfairly?  Shouldn't we pity her, too instead of continuing that unfair treatment?  

 

Also, I don't think that Lenox is coming from nowhere.  Chantelle told her that she wasn't excited about being back (or at least Chantelle played it down).  I can understand how that might annoy people in a competition setting where "wanting it" and showing that you do is important.  Is it the most mature attitude?  No, but, like Chantelle, Lenox is young.    

 

I don't know why I'm feeling compelled to defend Lenox, I don't particularly like her.  I guess it's just that...I really don't see any of them as villains or victims (as someone said upthread- there's no simple binary).  This is a pretty complicated cast of characters, especially for this show.  And I can't quite grasp why we wouldn't apply the editing defense across the board...except that Chantelle cried, it's more obvious why she'd be as defensive as she seems to be, and we have a cultural obsession right now with bullying and victimhood.

[saber5055]

 

If Adam wins, I am trying out for next season as my drag persona, Boris "Biff" Stroganov, Russian mail order husband.

I don't predict you will have to come out as Boris Biff, but start thinking of a new persona when Keith wins.

 

 

About 15 minutes into this show I knew Chantalle was going home. It's like the editors didn't even try to fool me this time around.

Me too. And last week, after Will's over-done THs about how he would miss Raelia if she went home. Zap, she's gone!

 

I continue to LOVE Ivy's photos each week in the photo-post page. Funny she was the first one "voted off."

 

As for Chantelle "working" now ... is anyone sure about that? Or are her photos a trade off: "You pose for me/my magazine and I'll get free ad pics and you'll get portfolio shots." If she is indeed signed by and working for an agency, now THAT'S different, and how models actually make a living. The other thing? Even if pics are posted online it doesn't mean she's paying her bills through modeling.

[belligerent]

 

I don't predict you will have to come out as Boris Biff, but start thinking of a new persona when Keith wins.

 

It's up to Tyra to give me a makeover into what she wants.  I look better with a fake beard than Denzel ever did and know how to apply one, so Her Tyness can do her worst.  I predict a gender change.  "Biff, you're getting a total makeover so that you will now be competing as a girl because the boys find it a bit threatening for somebody without a Y chromosome to be competing with them. So now you are a male model who is really a woman but competing in drag as a woman"  "dammit"  "Also your new name is betty booch"  "DAMMIT"

 

 

I continue to LOVE Ivy's photos each week in the photo-post page.

 

I thought Ivy would go really far based on what we saw in the "pre-season" semi-final episodes.  She is really stunning and I think with the right direction takes very good photos.

[Surrealist]

Yea, what I took from this episode is that they're all (including Yu Tsai but excluding Adam) immature, shit-stirring assholes. I love Will, but he is probably the #1 shit stirrer this season, with Lennox maybe tied. Lennox and Shei came off very immaturely. Like who gives a fuck about what Chantelle told you, Shei, move the fuck on. Lennox seems to have a very strange vendetta against Chantelle. But then Chantelle came off very immature and terrible, too. When Adam comes off as as the most mature person, it's pretty bad!

 

I am glad someone else is disturbed by Keith. I started to get real scary vibes in the ep where he was just eviscerating Mirjana in confessionals with a very nasty sounding 'bitch' every second. And when he confronted Chantelle in front of everyone I was so put off by that. It was so immature and cruel and it really felt like he wanted to humiliate her and make sure everyone knew he thought she was unattractive.

 

I want to marry your entire post. I feel like none of these contestants deserves absolute sympathy from me.

 

I do like Will, but he gets caught up in the b.s. I really wish he wouldn't. When Chantelle returned, I knew there was going to be a lot of focus on her. Obviously she's booked jobs in the real world, so whichever edit the producers gave her didn't affect her job prospects after leaving the show.

 

Will is too tall to model, but his face is stunning. I could stare at it for hours.

 

I never know what to make of Keith, but he's made plenty of unkind remarks about his fellow contestants (mostly the female ones). For a guy who admitted (during a TH) that his mother is a lesbian, I'm kind of surprised by how he talks about women. I would think his mother would slap him upside the head for some of the crap he's said on the show. I know that's what I'd do.

 

I want to like Lenox. I've said this before, but she's actually the most editorial looking out of all of them. While it might be due to tricky editing, she focuses way too much on other contestants and always has something pissy to say. If she were as badass as she wants people to think she is, then she should confront the sources of her frustration. Throughout this season, she's been overly obsessed with Mirjana and Chantelle. I don't understand why. Someone here mentioned she probably feels threatened and I think that's probably the case.

 

I like Shei too, but in this episode, she kind of grated on me. I wanted her to be the type who doesn't resort to starting a fight. I don't think she should have said anything to Keith about Chantelle.

 

As far as Chantelle is concerned, she strikes me as aloof. I've known people like that, but I know why they're like that. I'm not sure if it's a personality trait that will succeed in the fashion industry, but she has landed jobs and campaigns post-ANTM. I can't imagine what having vitiligo is like. She's only 19, so the bullying against her probably didn't end that long ago, when she would have still been in high school. For me, that explains the aloofness, but she also needs to lose a little more control.

 

Watching the exchange between Yu and Chantelle made me physically uncomfortable and that never happens when I watch this show. I had a feeling that Yu wasn't going to let his opinion slide for a moment. He's very over-the-top. When he refused to call Matthew "Matthew" instead of Matt, I was in defense of Matthew. People's names are important to their identity. I don't like people assigning nicknames to me, especially when I've asked them to use my full first name. It's courtesy. So I'm on Chantelle's side about being called "Panda." She said she wasn't personally offended by the nickname, but she was worried about others who watch the show and might think it's OK to tease others with a similar skin condition. My sister has psoriasis (like Caridee!) and I know how awful that's been for her. I hope she doesn't get teased because I know she's insecure about it.

 

Given the brouhaha over what Chantelle supposedly said or didn't say, we didn't get those scenes. For all I know, the editors really edited the hell out of the film.

 

I think I was more offended by how Adam was portrayed. I get that he parties because he's naturally shy and uses alcohol to loosen up, but I felt like the show was pushing this idea that he's a raging alcoholic. I know plenty of men his age who still drink about that much alcohol. We don't see every second of tape. He's acknowledged that he parties and the others have said similarly, but again, editing. Acknowledging that he should cut back on the booze is fine, but painting him as an alcoholic is kind of dickish on the producers' part. I think it's going a bit far.

 

That said I have to give Adam credit for staying out of all the drama. For that alone, I wouldn't have a problem seeing Adam make it closer to the finale. I don't think he has a prayer in winning, but he takes constructive criticism well and seems genuinely interested in improving himself. Early in the competition, I never thought I'd say these things about Adam.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Surrealist

[C0mputerGeek]

I honestly don't have any sympathy for Chantelle. Interviews with the eliminated contestants have made it clear that they wanted a supportive environment. To that end, they tried to friend everyone. Mirjana, Romeo, and Chantelle were not interested in being friends. 

 

I am female. I've had a guy lie about sleeping with me. Let me tell you, Keith was a *hell* of a lot kinder with his response. In my case, I was completely harsh with the lying asshole and made sure to verbally eviscerate him. Keith had absolutely no responsibility to respect Chantelle's feelings. The best way for her to avoid the situation would have been for her to not tell the lie in the first place.

 

Yu Tsai's response does not surprise me given what an ass he was about the whole Matt-Matthew thing.

 

Who is Kevin and when did we see his "junk"? Also, Kari was 23 to Keith's 26 and Chantelle's 19 so I am not seeing how this is relevant. Kari, at 23, would not have been too young for Keith.

And Kevin is full of bullshit, talking about Chantelle is too young. Dude, you had your junk dangling openly on TV when Kari was still around. If you're that shameless I doubt Chantelle's age disturbs you as much as you claimed.

 

As for antics, Shei and Will said in their last interview with AfterBuzz (link here) that Chantelle called out Shei at panel (during Episode 11) and accused Shei of ostracizing Chantelle from the group. So it really should not have been a surprise to Chantelle when Shei screwed her over.

I think she needs to learn not to say things to people, no matter how innocent. She could have told Shei she saw Keith putting strawberry goobly gop lip balm on and it would have come out as he had on a wig, high heels, and a pink bra. Shei is not stupid. She knew what she was doing. She found an opportunity which Chantelle gave to her and used it against her. Never let the wolf taste your blood - he will be back.

 

[Surrealist]

I am female. I've had a guy lie about sleeping with me. Let me tell you, Keith was a *hell* of a lot kinder with his response. In my case, I was completely harsh with the lying asshole and made sure to verbally eviscerate him. Keith had absolutely no responsibility to respect Chantelle's feelings. The best way for her to avoid the situation would have been for her to not tell the lie in the first place.

 

I had the same thing happen to me in high school. Also, I reacted in the same way you did. That never happened again.

 

I'm on the fence about Keith. He's pretty soft-spoken, which contributes (I think) to my confusion about what I think he's about.

 

Thanks for mentioning the ex-contestant interviews because I haven't read or seen any of them.

 

I miss Matthew. He was a sweetie.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Surrealist

[C0mputerGeek]

I have followed quite a few of them on social media. Most of them seem quite close; it was great to see Will and Raelia's reunion. Keith comes across as quite genuine.

I'm on the fence about Keith. He's pretty soft-spoken, which contributes (I think) to my confusion about what I think he's about.

[aradia22]

While ANTM's 'anyone can model' nonsense can be kind of fun I did enjoy the smack down this week on the go-sees. Will is too tall. Adam is too short. No one is into Chantelle's vitaligo. Shei's makeover is weird. I particularly loved the 'why are her eyebrows two different colors' part. Lennox is a blank slate = good working model.

[peachmangosteen]

I'm on the fence about Keith.

 

I am, too. I didn't expect to really like Keith, but I ended up really liking him and finding him very sweet. But then the ep where he just called Mirjana a bitch like 10,000 times in the confessionals kinda made me wonder. It seemed WAY over the top and very nasty. And then is this ep I thought him confronting Chantelle the way he did was unnecessary and I don't think he needed to give that confessional where he said she wasn't attractive. But, then I did think about how I would probably feel differently if their genders were reversed.

[aradia22]

 

And once again, the best photos from this shoot were by the eliminated contestants (Raelia, Ivy, Matthew).

I liked Keith, Raelia, Will, Lennox, Ivy, and Matthew in that order. Ivy is fine for a shoe ad but bad as a model. Matthew looks more like he's on the poster for an action movie and he's not really selling the shoes. Also, I just realized that because of the stupid fan score, everyone gets to go to Korea. This is unacceptable. Also, damn, some of those other shots were bad. 

 

She seems to get accused of a lot of petty stuff that for whatever reason is never caught on camera. Changing makeup and hair, insinuating she hooked up with Keith, having a bad attitude (or at least any worse attitude than the rest of them). You'd think if she was that bad, they'd have more on camera. Shei is two faced for telling Keith anything.... I didn't get why Keith was so mad.... Unless something really did go down. The rest of them just seem extremely negative towards her, it would no wonder she kept to herself and tried not to engage in their drama.

I agree that she was right to stand up to Yu Tsai. But we have seen her change her makeup and hair. The thing with Keith might have been said in a private moment when there were no cameras around. They will sometimes film them getting ready but I'm sure there are some privacy rules about when they're using the bathroom and whatnot. The contestants know how to get around the cameras. And she never denied it. She was just mad that they revealed something she confided during 'girl talk' or whatever which is a bad excuse. It reflects poorly on Keith's character and more than that, to spread a rumor like that takes away some of your agency and your power to create your own self image. Imagine if Adam had gossiped like that about hooking up with Lennox (I picked those two because I think their ages are comparable). 

 

You know it also made me feel weird to listen to a few of the Korean fashion people make the comments about her face. How strange it was to them. How they'd have to think about it. How they've never seen a face like that. How it just wasn't right for their brand.

I feel like it's just more of the same. It's great that you're tall or short or you have vitiligo or whatever new issue Tyra dreams up. But the age of the supermodel has passed. The point is to blend in not stand out. Even the biggest models like Karlie Kloss get so much work because they can adapt to so many different brands. The exception might be someone like Kate Upton who is a horrible model but keeps getting booked because... guys find her attractive/people are interested in her. I don't know. Look at her ads sometimes and imagine her on top model. Her face, the way she positions her body... terrible. Also, Chantelle never took really great pictures. When they ran through her photos at the end there were maybe one or two that I liked. 

 

Lennox has been dogging the girl ever since she came back. She's obsessed. Keith's behavior disturbs me because a few episodes ago, he was calling Mirjana a bitch and not in a playful way. I am just going to be blunt - he acts like he has engaged in humiliation of girls before. It's a common problem on HS sport teams, one people don't like talking about.

Slow down. I don't like the word 'bitch' either but it's Mirjana we're talking about it. It's not like it's entirely unwarranted.

 

Plus no one would be cool with Chantelle giving him some vaguely racist nickname like clang clang because he's so loud.

That made me laugh way too hard.

 

Why are they lying to Will? No, Will, even if they like you, they are NOT going to design clothes to accomodate your height.

Thanks for reminding me about that. I felt like they kept repeating it but they didn't push it really hard because they knew it was a blatant lie. You'd have to be bloody fantastic (or more likely an actor like Hugh Jackman or Brad Pitt) for them to accommodate you like that. It's highly unlikely they'd go out of their way to make a model who was 6'6 an outfit even if it just the matter of one job like a photo shoot and not casting for a runway show or something.

[C0mputerGeek]

Eh. Will has referred to Mirjana as a bitch approximately 1000 times too.

I am, too. I didn't expect to really like Keith, but I ended up really liking him and finding him very sweet. But then the ep where he just called Mirjana a bitch like 10,000 times in the confessionals kinda made me wonder.

[Surrealist]

I am, too. I didn't expect to really like Keith, but I ended up really liking him and finding him very sweet. But then the ep where he just called Mirjana a bitch like 10,000 times in the confessionals kinda made me wonder. It seemed WAY over the top and very nasty. And then is this ep I thought him confronting Chantelle the way he did was unnecessary and I don't think he needed to give that confessional where he said she wasn't attractive. But, then I did think about how I would probably feel differently if their genders were reversed.

 

That "Mirjana's a bitch" thing bothered me more, but a few of them have said that. Maybe I shouldn't just be picking on Keith for that?

 

Keith's entitled to say he's not attracted to Chantelle. I don't see the harm in that. We aren't attracted to every person who crosses our paths either. Another thing is: would anyone care if he said that if she didn't have vitiligo? Probably not. That said it was an unnecessary TH.

 

I do the same as you. I think about my reaction if the sexes were reversed.

 

COmputerGeek: Ah, thanks. I don't follow any of them on Twitter, but it's nice to know that some of them have come away from this competition as friends.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Surrealist

[peachmangosteen]

Eh. Will has referred to Mirjana as a bitch approximately 1000 times too.

 

It didn't come off the same way to me personally. Especially since it seemed like it came out of nowhere on Keith's end. Like he never had anything to say about Mirjana and then suddenly he was seething about her and calling her a bitch a million times. That could be editing though, of course.

 

Keith's entitled to say he's not attracted to Chantelle. I don't see the harm in that. We aren't attracted to every person who crosses our paths either. Another thing is: would anyone care if he said that if she didn't have vitiligo? Probably not. That said it was an unnecessary TH.

 

True, no one should feel obligated to be attracted to anyone, but at the same time it just seemed like a pile on to me. Like he had to confront her in front of everyone and then also go on to make sure everyone knows she's unattractive to him in the TH. It was just unnecessary.

 

I think all my issues with Keith might be stemming from the horrendous editing though.

 

I never liked Chantelle and I think these people have legit reasons to not like her, but they just seemed to all take it way OTT. I give Lennox a bit of a pass because she is young, but Keith is 26. I'm not sure about Will or Shei, but they at least look a bit older to me.

Edited November 16, 2014 by peachmangosteen

[C0mputerGeek]

Since her lie was public, Keith had every right to make his stand public.

 

If, as has been reported, Chantelle made it clear that she was not there to make friends, then it should not surprise her - or anyone else - when people then decide not to be her friend. Sometimes, you get what you ask for...

 True, no one should feel obligated to be attracted to anyone, but at the same time it just seemed like a pile on to me. Like he had to confront her in front of everyone and then also go on to make sure everyone knows she's unattractive to him in the TH. It was just unnecessary.
 
I never liked Chantelle and I think these people have legit reasons to not like her, but they just seemed to all take it way OTT. I give Lennox a bit of a pass because she is young, but Keith is 26. I'm not sure about Will or Shei, but they at least look a bit older to me.

[aradia22]

 

Hey, Yu Tsai: If someone says "don't call me out of my name" then DON'T DO IT. End of story. I'm glad Chantalle stood up for herself and reminded him that SHE knows she's on TV even if he doesn't.

Was it ANTM where they made them come up with alter egos/nicknames for themselves one year? There have been so many seasons that I don't know whether I hallucinated some of these things. Imagine if next season along with makeovers they get a nickname from Yu Tsai. The more offensive the better.

[peachmangosteen]

Since her lie was public, Keith had every right to make his stand public.

 

Her lie was made public because Will is a shit-stirrer, Shei is a follower, and everyone hates Chantelle. I just think Keith should've been the bigger/more mature person and not made a public scene with her in front of a bunch of people he knows actively hate her.

 

I think Chantelle came off badly in this ep (and in every other ep), but that alone doesn't make the rest of them look good or in the right IMO.

[C0mputerGeek]

Her lie was made public the minute she decided to open her mouth and tell an untruth.

 

I've said that I had a guy lie about sleeping with me. I was not gentle when I called him out, nor did I do so quietly. For that reason, I don't think Keith owed Chantelle any consideration. This situation could have been avoided entirely by Chantelle keeping her lies to herself.

Her lie was made public because Will is a shit-stirrer, Shei is a follower, and everyone hates Chantelle. I just think Keith should've been the bigger/more mature person and not made a public scene with her in front of a bunch of people he knows actively hate her.

 

I think Chantelle came off badly in this ep (and in every other ep), but that alone doesn't make the rest of them look good or in the right IMO.

[Julia]

I still think Adam is way too short but knowing that he's not ACTUALLY party monster

I would go with that from what I see onscreen, maybe, but I have a problem reconciling the nationally famous for gaybashing while drunk thing. And his explanation for that was

_So chalk this up as me being a drunk asshole, a frat guy with too much testosterone, or whatever you want to call me I really don’t care. I just want everyone to know that that’s literally all it was, that’s the honest truth. I’m not some ignorant bigot looking to bash homosexuals, so please don’t think that._

Because there's a direct link between testosterone and calling someone a f***** while you have them in a headlock.

So, no, on behalf of the nerds, including the one he assaulted, not seeing it.

[EvilApplesauce]

I'm predicting that next week, Will goes home :(. Not sure what else to say about this episode that wasn't already eloquently stated by posters above mine.

[belligerent]

I would go with that from what I see onscreen, maybe, but I have a problem reconciling the nationally famous for gaybashing while drunk thing. And his explanation for that was

_So chalk this up as me being a drunk asshole, a frat guy with too much testosterone, or whatever you want to call me I really don’t care. I just want everyone to know that that’s literally all it was, that’s the honest truth. I’m not some ignorant bigot looking to bash homosexuals, so please don’t think that._

Because there's a direct link between testosterone and calling someone a f***** while you have them in a headlock.

So, no, on behalf of the nerds, including the one he assaulted, not seeing it.

 

I'll quote your whole post because you didn't quote any of the relevant parts of mine. 

 

I said:

 

 

I still think Adam is way too short but knowing that he's not ACTUALLY party monster, but an introverted math nerd, makes me get him a lot more.  My brother and I are like that, too, so I get it.  He really is very socially awkward without alcohol.  It's like he starts drinking and becomes Superman, so it makes sense that he would be hesitant to go without.  If you're an entertaining drunk, too, people are a lot more willing to let you continue.  The fact that the other people in the house seem to like him so much means I guess he is probably not as much of a douche as some of the shit he's said or done would indicate.  But people who aren't REALLY assholes are still capable of asshole behavior and don't get a pass for those behaviors.

 

I'm not sure where you think I'm giving him any kind of pass on the gay-bashing.  I said that his using alcohol as a social crutch makes me get him more, not that I like him or that it excuses his past behavior.  He's also said some pretty messed up things about women.  I don't think he gets a pass for any of this just because he is putting on a front.  If you punch somebody in the face to impress your friends, even if you wouldn't normally do that, you still have to deal with the repercussions.  Maybe he's learned some stuff since then, maybe he hasn't. 

Edited November 16, 2014 by belligerent

[Julia]

Sorry, I guess I misinterpreted you. I had trouble reconciling the behavior he excused with drunkeness as "entertaining." I'm pleased you agree.

[Mattipoo]

I think the best part of this episode was when the go-see designers called out the obvious flaws with the remaining hamsters: Adam is too damn short, Will is too damn tall, Shei's makeover is weird. What was Miss Jay's panel hairstyle supposed to be? 2000s Destiny's Child or Lil Kim? Glad Chantelle is gone. Panda-gate and the Keith hookup drama aside, the photos of her they showed at the end really revealed that her "modeling" is extremely one-note with the same upturned face and "black girl modeling 101" type hoochie poses. I think Keith has this in the bag. Adam needs to go next.

[Black Knight]

Her lie was made public the minute she decided to open her mouth and tell an untruth.

 

I've said that I had a guy lie about sleeping with me. I was not gentle when I called him out, nor did I do so quietly. For that reason, I don't think Keith owed Chantelle any consideration. This situation could have been avoided entirely by Chantelle keeping her lies to herself.

Problem is, we have no way of knowing who was lying, Chantelle or Keith. We don't know these people. In your case, since you were one of the involved parties, you of course knew the truth. If Chantelle lied, I agree that he doesn't owe her any consideration. But we have no evidence supporting either possibility, and both possibilities are plausible. People do also lie that they haven't slept with somebody if they think that it makes them look bad to others. And men Keith's age sleep with women Chantelle's age all the time. So in the end, I simply don't know what happened. I'm a little puzzled that it seems to be taken as gospel that Chantelle's the one who lied. She only admitted to telling Shei, not to lying. Any opinion is based on speculation, not on hard evidence, and considering how very shitty either of these lies are - it's as awful to lie about not having slept with someone as it is to lie about having slept with someone - I'm going to presume both of them innocent until something concrete surfaces (which will probably be never) because it's a terrible thing to hang on either of them with no evidence.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Black Knight

[Kromm]

 I can't remember if Shei is considered biracial or not (I know her genetic test mentioned Irish and some other things), but Adam is, and I don't know how most Koreans feel about mixed-race Korean people.

I think it's a complex situation in Korea.  Overall that entire region is very intolerant of mixed race. Japan (a very mixed-race intolerant society themselves), when they made Korea a protectorate in the early 20th century actually tried to encourage Koreans to think of themselves as the same race as Japan (so they wouldn't be unahappy at being ruled by Japan), and the Koreans unsurprisingly rebelled against that idea in their ideologies and culture.  

 

But Korea had something like a million and half Americans cycle through their country a few generations ago, and quite a few left their genetic material behind.  So I think they've been stuck with dealing with the issue fairly head on. I believe the issue is sticky enough that they had to pass a specific law a few years ago to try and stem discrimination against foreigners, and that certainly included mistreatment of mixed race offspring.

 

The big example I can give you of the issue is US football player Hines Ward, who's half black, half Korean. Go look up the story of him and his mother. His mother moved to the US when he was young, even though he was born in Korea, and he only returned after winning the freaking Superbowl, so I don't think he suffered racism that much directly, but his visits to Korea after the Superbowl win stirred up the whole issue and that's where you can find a lot of media reports about the issue.

[belindasmiles]

 

I'm a little puzzled that it seems to be taken as gospel that Chantelle's the one who lied.

It's mostly because of how she reacted to Keith when he brought it up, and that later on she was mad at Shei for spilling the beans (if she was telling the truth, then wouldn't the anger be directed moreso at Keith, who would have been straight up lying about them hooking up in front of everyone and accused her instead of lying?). 

 

Mostly though I didn't think much of the drama in the house - Chantelle is aloof and defensive for sure, but understandably so if she was bullied as a child, but at the same time I don't feel like the rest of the house was super mean to her or anything, they seem pretty normal and courteous with her as with anyone else there. So it's also understandable they wouldn't or shouldn't feel like they have some big responsibility to treat her extra nice and be extra friendly with her either. The fact is, they all bonded with each other over the course of the competition while she was out very early - so I feel like a lot of it has to do with the circumstance - you have this group that have become close and then someone they barely knew came back, obviously they wouldn't be as close to that person than to the rest of the group, and it's not really the fault of that person or the group that they're not friends. I feel like that's all there is to the drama really, small potatoes really compared with other seasons. 

 

But, Yu Tsai can just go screw himself though. I thought Chantelle handled it best she could and Yu Tsai was just super gross, which means the show is super gross in backing up that pathetic excuse of a reason. It doesn't matter if Chantelle has attitude problems or not, that's entirely irrelevant - Yu Tsai was out of line, period. And it's weird, because you'd think Tyra would have jumped on it, have the 'it's not ok to use slurs' PSA kind of thing, and tell us all a story of how she dealt with photographers/clients calling her names and stuff and how she rose above it all to be awesome. Such a missed opportunity, Tyra.

 

edit: Is either Shei or Adam korean or even part korean? Purely speculation, but they don't seem like they are.

Edited November 16, 2014 by belindasmiles

[C0mputerGeek]

I believe neither is Korean.

edit: Is either Shei or Adam korean or even part korean? Purely speculation, but they don't seem like they are.

 

From Lenox's Tumblr (yikes at the response)

Anonymous asked:
The winner of ANTM is meant to be a role model, not just a model. I'm not in the slightest bit inspired by either you or Shei for being so rude to a girl who clearly had her guard up due her emotional isolation in the house, and a lifetime of abuse over her medical condition. You should learn to not be so obtuse. Chantelle never visibly provoked an attack on you, she only stood up for herself, when necessary. I hope one day you will have grown enough as a person to be able to apologize to her.

Chantelle is a mean, hateful, and arrogant girl. I lived with her, you did not. Chantelle’s skin literally had nothing to so with the reasons for me, and the rest of the house, not liking her. I did not like her for HER. Her skin was a bonus in my eyes because it was so stunning, and I think it’s very sad that something so beautiful could be used as a weapon against her.

 

As for her being “guarded”, no. She was always rude and hateful which is not something she can fall back on as being “guarded”. If anyone was “guarded” it was Mirjana and I defended her millions of times because of it.

 

I will not apologize for anything I said to her because I was very careful with what I said to her and meant anything that came out of my mouth. I never did anything in a malicious manner because that is not me and childish.

 

I really don’t care if you see me as a role model or not because I stand by what I truly believe is right. If you disagree with me simply based off of what an edited TV show shows then that’s totally your choice.

1enox.tumblr.com/post/102734679559/the-winner-of-antm-is-meant-to-be-a-role-model-not#notes

Edited November 16, 2014 by C0mputerGeek

[aradia22]

 

edit: Is either Shei or Adam korean or even part korean? Purely speculation, but they don't seem like they are.

From the episode with the stupid soul food announcement I think they said something about Shei being Korean. I can't remember about Adam because the only thing they've been talking about lately is his budding alcoholism.

[C0mputerGeek]

They brought this up in a recent AfterBuzz interview. IIRC, neither is Korean.

From the episode with the stupid soul food announcement I think they said something about Shei being Korean. I can't remember about Adam because the only thing they've been talking about lately is his budding alcoholism.

Edited November 16, 2014 by C0mputerGeek

[Kromm]

Shei said right on an episode something like "I'm going home" when they announced the location of the travel (remember they did it a few episodes in advance).

[Mattipoo]

Wikipedia says Shei is Vietnamese and Adam is Malaysian. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/America's_Next_Top_Model_(cycle_21)

[WhineandCheez]

That photoshoot outfit wasn't any better either.  She really needs to stop trying to dress like a teenybopper.

A massive trucker hat and a weave makes you look 16 I've heard.

 

One thing I've forgotten to comment on is the prize package item when they get "the chance to be represented by NEXT models."  I'm 57 and weigh 1 _ _ pounds and i too have the chance to be represented by them if I walk in their offices.

 

LOVED the hair on the one male owner of the company where the challenge winner gets to walk in their show (was it Max and something, don't know).  That is one of the Cycle 22 makeovers!

Edited November 16, 2014 by WhineandCheez

[kingshearte]

Chantelle's edit, true or not, is just horrible. Why paint a contestant in such a bad light. Even Romeo wasn't edited this bad, in fact his actions were edited as a little justified, all up to the physical altercation at least.

Really? You thought Romeo's edit showed him any sympathy? I find that fascinating, because I found basically nothing redeeming in anything they presented us with.

 

Adam is starting to remind me of Fun Bobby from Friends. A dude who everyone thought was really fun to hang around until they noticed how much he drank, so they talked to him about it, and he stopped drinking, and then he was no fun at all anymore. I don't mean to suggest that Adam can't be fun without the booze, but it's starting to look like that's what he thinks of himself, and that makes me kind of sad. From what we've seen here, he seems like he might actually be a decent dude (who, as I think I've said I think his behaviour suggests, has learned from certain past incidents), and I don't think he needs to drink to be someone worthwhile. I hate that he seems to think that he does. I would love for him to either cut back or ditch the drinking entirely, and find out more about who he actually is, and learn to be confident in himself for whoever that is, whether that's someone who's outgoing or not. I feel like he thinks that he has to be outgoing to be likeable or fun, and that's just not true.

 

And about Yu Tsai, the less said, the better. I have not particular like for Chantelle, but I am 100% on her side on that issue. Explain that you meant no offence, sure. But when informed that you are in fact causing some, stop what you're saying. It's not bloody hard.

[SourK]

Oh, man. I'm bummed out that the show tried to send the message that it's okay to call someone a name they don't like as long as you don't think it should offend them. :( I also felt sad about it, because Chantelle was clearly trying to tell herself that he was doing it out of love, but he made a big point of explaining that the reason he did it was because he didn't like her and was trying to put himself in a better mood around her, so that he could overcome not liking her. And therefore, she couldn't ask him to stop doing it, because it was really her fault somehow. What a shitty thing to say to someone.

 

I'm used to Shei's look, but I've had weeks and weeks to adjust to it. I remember that, when they first gave her this makeover, my reaction was like "!!!" and that's probably how it still is for designers seeing her for the first time. I'm surprised that the show was willing to air the comments from the designers specifically saying that they didn't like the makeover, though. Good for them.

 

The go-sees kind of made me sad this time, beause I felt like they really hammered home the idea that Top Model is a fantasy and not a real modelling competition. The show picks people who have a bunch of different looks -- and different measurements and different heights -- and behaves as though they all have an equal chance of succeeding, but then you drop them in a semi-real situation, and the reaction from people in the industry is like, "Ugh, this is not what I was expecting." :(

 

The complete photo set (including eliminated contestants) for this week

 

I haven't been looking at these, so this is the first time I realized that Denzel has to keep wearing his fake beard after being eliminated. Ha ha ha.

 

You know Kelly was disappointed she couldn't be a raging bitch to someone for being late after the go sees. She probably had to steal candy from a baby after to make up for it.

 

I know! My favourite part of the whole episode was how obviously disappointed she was when she walked in and everyone made it back on time. I don't think she even told them good job on time-management. She was just like, "Oh... and everyone's here... moving on."

 

I still don't know what to think about Keith's actions towards her about the supposed lie. As I watched I was rather surprised by his response and yes I also considered how it would be if the genders were reversed but he seemed to really go after her in a particularly humiliating way. He could have privately confronted her and then asked her to straighten the story out with the others. He was making me feel really uncomfortable when he said "She likes me but I don't find her attractive" I mean come on she's 19 and we really don't know what happened between them and what the deal with those stories is. It seemed bizarrely ruthless of him.

 

I also felt uncomfortable about the way Keith reacted. I'm trying to imagine how I would react if some guy I was aquainted with told people we'd had sex when we hadn't, and I think I would be either angry or uncomfortable, depending on what our relationship was like, and what I thought the purpose of the comment was. I can't imagine a situation where I would be like, "Ha ha LOL @ you for saying you had sex with me. Stand here and tell everyone how you lied because you have a crush on me, so we can all laugh at you as a group!"

 

If he's telling the truth, and it's a lie (or an exaggeration), he seemed to understand that the lie was based on some combination of immaturity, wishful thinking, and having feelings for him, rather than maliciousness -- I feel like that would make me want to be more gentle about my approach, if it were me.

[Zima]

I'm predicting that next week, Will goes home :(. Not sure what else to say about this episode that wasn't already eloquently stated by posters above mine.

 

If this happens, I just might ugly-cry. 

[saber5055]

 

Problem is, we have no way of knowing who was lying, Chantelle or Keith.

And my question is, who the heck cares?

 

Zima, me too. I want Will to at least make final three so I can stare at His Loveliness another couple of weeks.

[snakenax]

 

Adam is probably a natural introvert and drinking helps him to be more outgoing.

What I get the feeling of is that Adam comes from one of those super high expectations, high pressure upper middle class families so he has two modes of behavior: all stiff and serious and formal when he's not drinking and loose, silly and happy when he is. Which really isn't unusual to me, it's pretty common among those who are in upper middle class career families(lawyer/doctor/engineer etc) i've met, kind of a culturally accepted way of letting off steam when your public face has to be perfect at all times.

[SeenYouWitKieffah]

This is the first time in Top Model history I have liked so many contestants. Now that Chantelle's gone, I can relax and just watch, because I'd be happy with any of these people winning. I think Lenox and Keith are actually the most marketable and should win in the real world, but I L-O-V-E Shei and Will, and Adam has really grown on me too. I enjoy watching all of them, they're all GORGEOUS, and all have pulled their weight in photos, IMO. Admittedly, I'll be pretty surprised if Adam or Shei wins because I think they have the weakest portfolios, but I don't care!! Usually near the end, there's either no one left I like (C4 - Naima, Kahlen, etc) or there's one person I am obsessed with, one person I hate, and others I don't care about (C8 - One-Note Jaslene v. Queen Natasha) 

If only Chantelle had gone before Raelia, then I could have had a perfect F6. In my mind, they all would have skipped through the streets of Korea together, holding hands and singing the Top Model theme song.

 

PS. I wish Matthew was there too!!! Willthew 4evr

Edited November 16, 2014 by SeenYouWitKieffah

[Talented Tenth]

Who is Kevin?

[Kromm]

Wikipedia says Shei is Vietnamese and Adam is Malaysian. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/America's_Next_Top_Model_(cycle_21)

Unless they cite somewhere else (and something reliable), Wikipedia is no authority.

Possibly the person who put it in there that Shei is Vietnamese concluded it because Phan is a common Vietnamese surname. But it's also a Chinese and Korean surname as well (although it's sometimes spelled a little differently).

Or she could indeed be. Maybe she meant the statement she made to mean the entire Asian region and not the specific country.

Adam does look Malaysian, although I might have also guessed Polynesian as well.

[Talented Tenth]

Problem is, we have no way of knowing who was lying, Chantelle or Keith. We don't know these people. In your case, since you were one of the involved parties, you of course knew the truth. If Chantelle lied, I agree that he doesn't owe her any consideration. But we have no evidence supporting either possibility, and both possibilities are plausible. People do also lie that they haven't slept with somebody if they think that it makes them look bad to others. And men Keith's age sleep with women Chantelle's age all the time. So in the end, I simply don't know what happened. I'm a little puzzled that it seems to be taken as gospel that Chantelle's the one who lied. She only admitted to telling Shei, not to lying. Any opinion is based on speculation, not on hard evidence, and considering how very shitty either of these lies are - it's as awful to lie about not having slept with someone as it is to lie about having slept with someone - I'm going to presume both of them innocent until something concrete surfaces (which will probably be never) because it's a terrible thing to hang on either of them with no evidence.

 

I'm so glad you posted this and it expounds on what I posted earlier.  The viewing audience does not know if Keith and Chantelle hooked up or not.  All we know is that Chantelle told or implied to Shei that she and Keith hooked up.  We know that in front of others, Keith accused of lying on him, but Chantelle did not say she lied.  There are various motives Keith could have for not wanting to admit something happened and for Chantelle not to defend herself in that moment.

[C0mputerGeek]

Eh. Lenox stated on her Tumblr that Chantelle lied. Plus, Chantelle's response was rather a give away.

I'm so glad you posted this and it expounds on what I posted earlier.  The viewing audience does not know if Keith and Chantelle hooked up or not.  All we know is that Chantelle told or implied to Shei that she and Keith hooked up.  We know that in front of others, Keith accused of lying on him, but Chantelle did not say she lied.  There are various motives Keith could have for not wanting to admit something happened and for Chantelle not to defend herself in that moment.

[saber5055]

 

We know that in front of others, Keith accused of lying on him, but Chantelle did not say she lied.

Except check the name of this episode. The editors/producers know exactly who lied and they put it in the title of the episode. Whether we were shown the actual footage makes no difference.

 

Unless they cite somewhere else (and something reliable), Wikipedia is no authority.

Maybe, but if my background was on a Wikipedia page and was incorrect, I'd edit it. I think these contestants are cyber-wise enough that they can and would fix their own bios.

 

Who is Kevin?

I'm waiting to learn that as well.

Edited November 16, 2014 by saber5055

[Surrealist]

What I get the feeling of is that Adam comes from one of those super high expectations, high pressure upper middle class families so he has two modes of behavior: all stiff and serious and formal when he's not drinking and loose, silly and happy when he is. Which really isn't unusual to me, it's pretty common among those who are in upper middle class career families(lawyer/doctor/engineer etc) i've met, kind of a culturally accepted way of letting off steam when your public face has to be perfect at all times.

 

I don't want to veer off topic too much, but I was thinking about Adam's family picture. He has an equally attractive brother. After reading your post, I started wondering if his brother is older or younger and whether the brother is the "favorite." That kind of plugs in to what you've said.

 

For the record, I'm not overlooking Adam's homophobic headlock incident. That was wrong. Period. According to him, he's paid for it. I'm not saying he gets a pass because he admits that, but at the same time, I believe people deserve a second chance.

 

I'm sure Will knows all the details and he's defended Adam and says he really likes him. I'll take Will's word that Adam is a good guy and probably has changed.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Surrealist

[Black Knight]

Eh. Lenox stated on her Tumblr that Chantelle lied. Plus, Chantelle's response was rather a give away.

 

And Lenox knows this for a fact how? Unless Chantelle told Lenox that she lied, Lenox doesn't know. She just has an opinion, and is hardly an objective party. And it goes both ways - if, say, Adam were to say on his Twitter that Keith lied, I wouldn't take that as evidence either because, again, how would he know?

 

One reason for Chantelle's response could be that she had been lying. Another reason for her response could be that she was telling the truth, but felt she would look pathetic if she kept insisting that she and Keith did sleep together after she found out that he was denying it, especially in a house where his word was going to be taken over hers because he's more well-liked. It wouldn't have been a flattering situation to be in.

 

It's all just speculation. Until either Chantelle or Keith say straight-up, "I'm the one who lied," we can never know. I am not going to condemn either of them on speculation.

 

The editors/producers know exactly who lied and they put it in the title of the episode.

 

No, we know who they want to be believed to be the liar. They didn't have the footage of Chantelle telling Shei that she and Keith had hooked up, or they would've included that in the episode. Chantelle and Shei were able to have that conversation without being filmed, so Chantelle and Keith, by the same token, could have had sex without being filmed. The show is proud of having a ex-NFL football player in the cast, and Tyra wants him to win. So of course he's going to be presented as the truth-teller. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. We don't know. The show doesn't know.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Black Knight

[chocolatine]

I have no problem with Keith calling Chantelle out on her lie in front of the others. In my experience, if you confront a liar in private, they will deflect, make excuses, and otherwise try to weasel their way out of the situation. It's harder to get away with that in front of other people who know the truth, though Chantelle tried with "this is hilarious". Yes, she's young, she's been bullied for her skin condition, and she's feeling isolated from the other contestants, but none of that gives her the right to make false statements about Keith.

[Mreid]

Hello everyone Im new around here just joined today. But I have seen every episode this season and as far as my two cents for this past episode while I did find Chantelle to be very annoying Yusi really made me mad this episode when he said I guess Ill just call you porcupine from now on. It was like he was being a hypocrite claiming calling her panda was meant as a compliment but then coming back with the porcupine thing that really made me mad. And I did find it very very weird that Chantelle lied about the whole Keith thing I didnt quite understand that.  Too bad Ben didnt come back in the competition instead of Chantelle I think the house would have had a more positive atmosphere in Korea.  I really do like Adam alot he just seems like a cool guy and hope that he gets help with his drinking.  

[saber5055]

 

They didn't have the footage of Chantelle telling Shei that she and Keith had hooked up, or they would've included that in the episode.

Hi, Tyra!