Girlfriends - General Discussion

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, eXiled said:

Just checked into a random Season 2 episode on Netflix this morning to see if I might change my original opinion, but nothing has changed. These women are not friends.

In the episode (in truth, only a few minutes) I watched, Toni is engaged to a man Joan couldn't get a commitment from and Joan is angry. Despite Joan originally claiming she was okay with the relationship, she finally admits that it's not cool that Toni is with this guy.

They start bickering. Maya gets involved (threatening to beat Toni's ass). Lynn attempts to play peacemaker...

Seriously, these women go at each other the way younger me did when I just wasn't about a bitch. By the time I started talking to a woman this way, if we had been friends, we wouldn't be after these conversations. I never would approach a woman I loved and respected in that manner. I just don't get it. If the show had been produced by a gaggle of clueless writers unaware of African-American culture, I MIGHT give it a pass. But seeing this portrayed -- over and over -- by people who should know better is really frustrating.

I hate to keep making comparisons to Living Single, but my opinion still stands. Living Single might be sillier and less sophisticated, but it also had more heart. Even when the women disagreed, I never got the impression they secretly hated each other or would step to each other, ready to fight.

I wish I liked Girlfriends more. The show and its stars look great. The production value is high; it doesn't come off as cheap or thrown together, something I've noticed with other shows catering to a black audience. But for me, at least, its tone is off. I'm never quite convinced these women like or respect each other. If anything, it seems as if they simply tolerate each other -- which isn't the best basis for true friendship, in my opinion.

It kind of like the women writing it never had any real female friends or stuck together a bunch of tropes.

 

On 11/22/2020 at 9:42 AM, luckyroll3 said:

I never really watched this show when it was on, save for an episode here and there, so I just started a rewatch on Netflix.  I'm near the end of season 6; and while I liked the earlier seasons, I started to hate this show somewhere around season 4 or 5. And as an avid watcher of The Game, I'm seeing that this is a trend of the Akil's. Their shows always start off great and then they start careening downhill fast.

I hate every single one of the characters.  Of the ladies, I hate Joan the least. She can be annoying, she sabotages every single one of her romantic relationships, and she clings so deeply to the ideal that if a woman is married by her 30's then something's wrong with her. But, she's a good friend to all of them.  At some point, each one of the ladies has lived with her rent free. And she supports everything they do.  And then the show went to my least favorite TV trope, male-female friends who ALL of sudden are in love, but have never shown any signs of it for years. 

I'm sorry, but I cannot stand Toni, although she's the only one that has been consistent throughout the series.  But she's the worst kind of friend.  And I wish they had done more with Lynn than have her be an over the top mooch. And Mya was just whatever (also, I can't stand the actress after seeing her on that reality show). 

The first thing Joan needed to do to get her life together was to get rid of all these mooching friends who just take her for granted. She always seemed to desperate to not be alone. It is better to be alone than have toxic people in your life.

[luckyroll3]

6 minutes ago, qtpye said:

The first thing Joan needed to do to get her life together was to get rid of all these mooching friends who just take her for granted. She always seemed to desperate to not be alone. It is better to be alone than have toxic people in your life.

It was very telling that when Joan started to put herself first and enjoy what little popularity she got from her restaurant (her "it-girl" episodes"), that the other ladies were so against her, because how dare she not cater to every single one of their needs all the damn time. And of course the writers just had to put Joan in her place.  All those episodes did for me was highlight how shitty Joan's friends were, not what a "bad" person Joan was being. 

[qtpye]

19 minutes ago, luckyroll3 said:

It was very telling that when Joan started to put herself first and enjoy what little popularity she got from her restaurant (her "it-girl" episodes"), that the other ladies were so against her, because how dare she not cater to every single one of their needs all the damn time. And of course the writers just had to put Joan in her place.  All those episodes did for me was highlight how shitty Joan's friends were, not what a "bad" person Joan was being. 

It like when Joan is in the hospital and Lynn is so upset that Joan did not remember that she got another one of her 40 million degrees (which she admits she only gets so she does not have to face the real world) and Joan actually apologizes. She actually apologizes to the woman who has been living rent free in her house for years.

There is no way anyone would stay friends with Lynn...she is just a user and it was not funny.

[luckyroll3]

7 hours ago, qtpye said:

There is no way anyone would stay friends with Lynn...she is just a user and it was not funny.

I agree. I wish they had evolved Lynn's character into becoming and establishing a business as a life coach or something along those lines, who vacillated between being hippy-dippy and a dropper of truth bombs, instead of the musician angle which came out of nowhere (other than the actress was starting a music career around the same time). I really liked her when she would call people on their shit out of the blue and then go back to being ridiculous or to whatever wackiness she was up to, because then everyone was always like, "oh yeah! She does actually have multiple degrees in this and knows what she's talking about."

[qtpye]

This article has some interesting thoughts

https://medium.com/illumination/why-sex-and-the-city-fans-should-give-girlfriends-a-chance-695646691e79

[qtpye]

I don't agree with her about how the show is not worth watching but she makes some good points.

 

[Not4Me]

I’m binge-watching it on Netflix right now after not having seen it in several years. Toxic is the only word to describe “Girlfriends.” Like many others in here I think the production value is high, the writing actually has some very strong and sophisticated moments yet it never allows the characters to truly evolve, making them unwatchable. It feels like these are friends out of convenience and co-dependency. 

While Toni is definitely the worst girlfriend human being ironically she’s the one that shows the most growth in the series, learning from her failure of her terrible marriage and raising Morgan; she is also the most interesting of the girls. Though IMO I feel Joan owed her nothing, and I’d argue she didn’t even need to agree to be a character witness for her custody battle considering the crap Toni put her through over the years. But I did appreciate how the show acknowledged the reality that their friendship had to end, if albeit to address Jill’s quiet exit from the series.

Joan is a more successful version of Carrie Bradshaw, annoying, masochistic, and needs to make herself the center of everything and everyone. That’s how she allowed herself to be a doormat to her selfish friends, and hence my least favorite.

Maya was annoying but at times grounded, and probably the better friend to Joan. I tend to skip past a lot of Lynn’s aimless grifter storylines, minus the episode where her white sister visits and the show thoughtfully addresses cultural appropriation.

Edited August 20, 2021 by Not4Me

[Keywestclubkid]

Toni “I’m afraid that when I die, I won’t be missed “ 

[Keywestclubkid]

On 8/20/2021 at 3:17 PM, Not4Me said:

yet it never allows the characters to truly evolve, making them unwatchable. It feels like these are friends out of convenience and co-dependency. 


 

This I was just watching a season 4 episode where Toni flakes on Joan’s auction they str8 up call each other bitches to their faces and later Joan calls Toni a narcissistic  waste who has never been the dependable friend she deserves and the next episode they are going out clubbing … 

[qtpye]

Yes, there was a lot of toxicity in the friendships.

[Not4Me]

It’s kinda neck and neck to see which is the worst girlfriend.

Joan - will play the martyr and suffocate you.

Maya - will have a 3-hour lunch break on your dime and still demand time and a half.

Toni - may vindictively try to sleep with your man.

Lynn - may destroy your credit rating if she had access to your wallet.

 

 

[KWalkerInc]

During an episode of Unsung on TV One the other day, they suddenly put a "Girlfriends 20th Anniversary" trivia logo on the lower part of the screen.  It said that during season 3, three of the leading ladies (all but Tracee) were wearing braces.  What confused me was the "20th anniversary" thing because the show started in 2000.  And TV One doesn't even air the show right now; it's only on their sister station, CLEO.  I'm guessing someone just hit the wrong button and somehow came up with facts that were being used for a marathon a couple years ago.