S08.E06: The Expedition Approximation

[Shermie]

That's just speculation here. Leonard seemed slightly hurt that she sold a major gift from him without talking about it, and Penny quipped, "aw, did you want us to take a picture in front of it first and then have me frame it in a puffy pink frame with hearts on it?" To which Leonard sheepishly replied, "Ye-es" and she surprised him by pulling out that exact gift for him.

So not only is Penny not a thoughtless shrew, Leonard got over his very minor hurt. Their main argument was who should take the money, and all I kept thinking was "take a fun trip!" Because travel is always on my mind, heh.

[CherryAmes]

Why not? She makes more money than he does. We wouldn't criticize if it were the other way around.

 

I would.  Especially if the other way around included the husband giving an allowance to a stay at home mom as if she has no real right to access or spend the money coming into the household.  In the case of Howard and Bernadette though the issue isn't that she makes more money, the issue is Howard figured that because so much money is now coming into the house that meant it was ok for him to spend money like a spoiled Beverly Hills teenager.  Bernadette quite rightly put the brakes on that.  However I wish they'd stop with the "ha ha Bernadette makes more money so Howard is whipped" crap.

Edited October 21, 2014 by CherryAmes

[antikking]

Sweaty Raj WAS cute!  

 

Best moment, though, for me was when Penny asked Leonard to pass the salt and the look on his face when he realized she gave him the perfect setup.  

 

All in all, a few laughs but the episode as a whole didn't do much for me.  Hated the Howard/Bernadette subplot.  

[jjj]

I give away good and new household items all the time (mixers, flatware, toasters) to students setting up house, and tell them to give them away or sell them on Craigslist, but they are no longer my possessions, and the students are free to do whatever they want with them.

 

But if I gave a fiancé/e a car, including a used car, I'd feel quite rejected if it was sold without a word to me a few months later.  It is more than a car, it has sentiment attached. 

 

No one commented on the CASH!  Where did she sell it, an abandoned parking lot to someone laundering cash?  And sorry, used cash is not something I want to scatter on my bed, let alone dive onto it without clothes! 

[Hecate7]

I love this theory! Looks like Sheldon isn't the prude he wants us to think he is :D 

As regards Bernardette and Howard - yes, there are couples who delegate the management of money to one partner. I see nothing wrong with that, or with stipends and allowances if the couple is wanting to save up etc. What rubbed me the wrong way is that Howard was clearly unhappy with the arrangement and Bernardette seemed oblivious to this (or worse, knew he was unhappy and didn't care). Yes, many couples tend to seek parental figures in their spouses but the Bernardette and Howard dynamic crosses that line between funny and creepy in my opinion. 

 

I agree that the writers think this is a lot funnier than the audience does. It's a little funny that he's childish and has turned her into Ma 2.0, but I want them to be happy anyway. I worry that ultimately Howard will follow in his father's footsteps.

 

Having Stuart and Debbie become a happy couple, might cause Howard to stop in his tracks instead. I hope it does.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Hecate7

[LoneHaranguer]

 

Howard acts like a child particularly in this episode.Pretty soon Bernadette will be packing his lunch with smiley face notes and a juice box.

I don't know about a juice box, but we heard Howard complaining to his mother about a missing Ding-Dong, so there will likely be some sort of snack food.

 

 

Leonard still thinks that what he does in bed is genius and Penny doesn't want to burst his bubble.

Leonard is very much the kind of person that would hang onto whatever "worked" long after the novelty is gone.

[Mischievious]

I was okay with Penny not laughing or agreeing with Leonard after he claimed to be a genius in bed. Only because I'd have been the same way should a boyfriend say the same thing to me. Not because I might not agree with it but more so because I'd view it as fishing for a compliment and that is a pet peeve of mine.

[Oldernowiser]

 

But if I gave a fiancé/e a car, including a used car, I'd feel quite rejected if it was sold without a word to me a few months later.  It is more than a car, it has sentiment attached. 

 

No one commented on the CASH!  Where did she sell it, an abandoned parking lot to someone laundering cash?  And sorry, used cash is not something I want to scatter on my bed, let alone dive onto it without clothes!

Maybe if it had been a nice car I'd feel differently about it, but as I recall, it was pretty much just a way for Leonard to give her reliable transportation and a way for him to show he was supporting her acting career less than anything special about the car itself.

It's credible to me that Penny would want to give him the money back as a gift back to him and tangibly demonstrate that she doesn't need to be with him just for the hand-outs, she's there because she wants to be. The relationship was pretty one-sided financially for a long time and I seem to recall that paying her debts (at least to her friends) was important to her.

He surprised her with the car and she wanted to surprise him with her "gift," is how I read it.

As for the cash...yes, euewwww to touching it, let alone having sex on it, but it's visually a much cooler gift than "Here! I got you a really nice cashier's check!"

[One Tough Cookie]

Penny's been overrated for the entirety of the show, but this season has really turned her into an intolerable asshole.  Meh.

 

People keep talking about what an insufferable prick Sheldon is, but Penny's actually worse.

 

 

 

 

so many yeses to this.  I have always felt that Penny was as user and that Leonard could do better. Other than her hair I never considered her that cute....

[VillaVillekulla]

I enjoyed this episode because my mom -- an engineer --  has actually gone underground into a former gold mine where they're currently doing research on neutrinos and dark matter. She goes on business trips to this place and texts me spooky pictures of what it's like there. I asked her yesterday if it's really that hot down in the mine and she said it's usually more like 80 or 85, not quite 102. But the mine she visits is in South Dakota and she usually goes in winter!

[sinkwriter]

 

The writers need to let Leonard BE a genius in bed. There's no reason on earth why he couldn't be.

 

I always thought that's how they were leaning because not only did Penny say it once in an episode, but there have been several other episodes where Sheldon complains about how loud they are and how the noise-canceling headphones don't block everything out, and how he hears Penny say all sorts of things, including "yee-ha!" Sounds like Penny was even so loud once that the neighbor woman heard her. Given all that, I would say that Leonard's doing pretty well. So it annoys me when the writers then forget all that and have Penny insult Leonard. Even in this episode, while she didn't have to agree that he was a "genius" about it, she could have given him a kinder, more positive response than just glaring at him over her wine glass and drinking more. He had said it kind of jokingly, she could have responded that way in kind. Instead, she treated him like he's not good at all, and I just don't think the writers have presented their sexual relationship that way over the years. It bugs me when they rewrite history just for the sake of a bad joke.

[Hecate7]

t if I were Leonard I would have put Penny in her place. If she wants to count nickels and dimes and give him all his money back, she should feel free to do so - but I have a feeling that as she counts how much she actually owes him she will retract very very quickly. 

Nickels and dimes? She sold a CAR. She paid him back.

 

They have successfully avoided the pitfall of starting their new life together with her owing him piles of money. The car was a gift, and he insisted she did not owe him that money. That is actually a GOOD thing. He didn't want the freaking car! He wanted to know that she appreciated his gift, and she proved that she did, by taking that photo and framing it and being very sweet and sentimental about it.

 

I am personally loving that Penny is gradually showing that all this time, she has kept mementos of her time with Leonard, and that he has always meant way more to her, than she was willing to admit at the time.

[needschocolate]

I couldn't make up my mind in the Penny and Leonard plot - I can see both sides.  She wants/needs to feel independent and Leonard wants to be a nice guy.  He saw the car as a gift without strings attached and she saw the car as a loan, of sorts, for someone in need.

 

But I really liked when she said "Do you want me to take a picture and have it framed, etc...." Leonard's face showed that was what he would want, and then she pulls out the framed picture.  This little interaction showed that Penny does care about Leonard and his feelings.  Sometimes, they are very cute together.

[terrymct]

I would. A married couple should not give 'allowances' to each other. I realize most couples are different, but if you do not trust someone enough to give them access to your money, you should NOT be marrying them.

 

Howard was infantilized by his mother and he likes it.  He likes a woman to cut his meat for him, to do his laundry, to drive him to doctor's appointments.   Bernie is continuing to an actually lesser degree what Howard knows and likes.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

Sounds like Penny was even so loud once that the neighbor woman heard her.

Penny was drunk and very much took charge. Things may not go as well when Leonard has the lead; a guy whose partner dozes off during foreplay is a guy that's not paying as much attention as he should (and definitely should take responsibility if it happens). If he needs Penny to be more vocal, he should say so; she probably holds back to avoid saying something that he might take as criticism.

[antikking]

To villavillekulla....where do I know that name from? Pippi Longstocking maybe....?

[VillaVillekulla]

Precisely! It's the name of her house.

[Trichromatic]

Nickels and dimes? She sold a CAR. She paid him back.

 

 

I might be assuming here, but based on the dynamic of Penny (out of work actress and struggling waitress) and Leonard (successful scientist) I would imagie that Leonard has picked up the bill a lot of the time they've been out. Which is fine because he wanted to do that for her. 

 

Giving back the money for the car might have given off a smug 'hah! I don't need you anymore', which Leonard might have been hurt by. She lacks the gratitude that should go along with her gesture. Perhaps a bit more emphasis on her thanking Leonard for his finanacial suport over the years would not have gone amiss. 

[LucyEth]

Why are Penny and Leonard together, can someone remind me?  Why does Howard live his life letting Bernadette treat him like a child?  Why are the writers going there all the time.  

[CherryAmes]

Giving back the money for the car might have given off a smug 'hah! I don't need you anymore', which Leonard might have been hurt by. She lacks the gratitude that should go along with her gesture. Perhaps a bit more emphasis on her thanking Leonard for his finanacial suport over the years would not have gone amiss.

 

Her having the photo was a pretty nice gesture that told Leonard how much she appreciated what he did for her and how much she cares about him.  I don't see any evidence at all that Leonard is upset that Penny doesn't need his financial support any more - for that matter if the only reason Penny has been with Leonard is because of the money it's surprising that she's been so commitment shy, living with him and better still being married to him would have given her a lot more financial security and it's not like she couldn't have left him had something better come along.

[pennben]

So, when Penny takes money..she's wrong. When Penny repays money..she's wrong. Just saying...

[MaryHedwig]

So, when Penny takes money..she's wrong. When Penny repays money..she's wrong. Just saying...

I get your point.   On another topic, I think Penny was "wrong" (meaning foolish) to sell that car after a few weeks of employment anyway.  She must still be on probation, might work on straight commission anyway (so her income level is not guaranteed), and she shouldn't use a company car for anything but business.  Pasadena does not have a good public transporation system (although arguably better than other parts of LA) so, believe me, Penny is going to want to hop into the car to go even to the yogurt shop (I am guessing Cherry on Top around the corner).  Is she now assuming that Leonard will drive her to all non-work related activites: to get groceries? to buy shoes?

[MaryMitch]

... and she shouldn't use a company car for anything but business. 

 

I have never known anyone with a company car that was limited to only using it for company business. That's not practical for most people, and companies recognize that. (It might be different in a government job.)

[CherryAmes]

I've never known anyone who was given a company car who was told they could only use it for business either, and that includes my husband :).  The real catch, at least here in Canada, comes at tax time as it's considered a taxable benefit.  On a sitcom in tvworld though I doubt this will be an issue.

Edited October 26, 2014 by CherryAmes

[ginger90]

Government vehicles are not supposed to be used for personal travel. As a perk I'm sure companies do allow it though. It seems a bit early in the job for Penny to get rid of a car though. Perhaps she's not supposed to be using it off he job and she'll get fired?

[Italian Ice]

Has Penny even passed the test yet? I don't recall that being mentioned before.

 

Also, Penny must not have had "new jobs" very much before, because a good rule of thumb is to wait on any drastic purchases or lifestyle changes until AFTER your probationary period is over. Selling your car before you even pass the test is a completely idiodic move, especially if she *doesn't* pass the test, and is stuck having to give the company car back.

Edited October 26, 2014 by Italian Ice

[CherryAmes]

It seems unlikely to me though that she'd have been given a company car in the first place if the company involved was in any doubt about her staying on. 

[Italian Ice]

It seems unlikely to me though that she'd have been given a company car in the first place if the company involved was in any doubt about her staying on. 

Not necessarily. Absolutely everything in sales is image based, and if they feel she needed a better car for their image, or a more reliable form of transportation immediately (sales areas for pharmaceutical reps can span over several cities across the state, all done by car), then that's what they'll do. Also, as with *any* commission based sales job, even if they like you personally, if you don't meet your sales goals, you're toast. You're shown the door faster than you can say "bye." From what we've seen of her trying to sell, she can't even sell a paper bag convincingly.

[anna0852]

While I think her method was a bit clumsy (envelope of cash, really?) I can appreciate that Penny is sensitive about going into the marriage on a less than equal footing. She's spend years as the 'poor' (for lack of a better term) and struggling-career-wise member of the group. While Leonard meant the car as nothing more than something nice for the person he loves and as far as we can see, doesn't keep score (really I just don't ever see that being part of his character), I can also see how Penny would worry about it. Even if those worries have no basis.

 

They could use a few session with a couples counselor before they get married, not because they have problems but because I think they could use the help in recognizing the other's communication styles and attitude towards finances.

[CherryAmes]

The powers that be have decided that Penny is going to have a new career and it's going to work out for her.  It doesn't tend to make for funny moments though when someone is just doing a good or even excellent job.  Just as one example we are constantly told how successful Bernadette is and how much money she makes yet whenever she talks about her job it's almost invariably about how she accidentally crossed the ebola virus with the common cold or things like that. 

[Italian Ice]

The powers that be have decided that Penny is going to have a new career and it's going to work out for her.  It doesn't tend to make for funny moments though when someone is just doing a good or even excellent job.  Just as one example we are constantly told how successful Bernadette is and how much money she makes yet whenever she talks about her job it's almost invariably about how she accidentally crossed the ebola virus with the common cold or things like that. 

 

 

Well, she *is* successful because she has a PhD, and works for a pharmaeutical company in development. That is success by any measure. Penny only got the job because she hates Bernadette. She didn't have the skill set to back up the job.

Edited October 26, 2014 by Italian Ice

[MaryHedwig]

Penny only got the job because she hates Bernadette.

Penny only got the job because the person that interviewed her hates Bernadette, right?  Penny just jumped in and agreed with him on the things that bug him about Bernadette.  (I am not trying to correct you, I am honestly just asking because I am trying to keep up  with the story line here.)

 

By the way, trashing an employee, especially a successful one, while you are a rookie is the first step towards the path of political suicide.

Edited October 29, 2014 by MaryHedwig

[CherryAmes]

Penny got the job because she and the HR person bonded over their mutual fear of Bernadette.  The HR person may have said he hated her but I don't think he did - I do know he said he was afraid of her.

 

Well, she *is* successful because she has a PhD, and works for a pharmaeutical company in development.

 

Sure, just the same way Howard is successful because he's been to space and works for a university, however most of the time when we see Howard at work we see Howard screwing up.  For that matter for all that everyone including Penny talked about how she wasn't a good waitress she managed to hang onto the job at the Cheesecake Factory until she decided to leave, by some standard that makes her successful at being a waitress as she could have held onto that job for as long as she wanted it.  In today's economy that is being a success!

[Hecate7]

Has Penny even passed the test yet? I don't recall that being mentioned before.

 

Also, Penny must not have had "new jobs" very much before, because a good rule of thumb is to wait on any drastic purchases or lifestyle changes until AFTER your probationary period is over. Selling your car before you even pass the test is a completely idiodic move, especially if she *doesn't* pass the test, and is stuck having to give the company car back.

Penny isn't dumb. She is naive and a bit lazy, and impatient, because she's used to getting by on her looks.

 

She worked hard to pass the test, passing up fun with friends in favor of studying, for the first time in her life. She does not hate Bernadette, she's a little scared of her. Everyone who loves Bernadette is a little scared of her, even her own father. Bernadette is scary. Look how cowed by her Howard is. An angry Bernadette is very scary.

 

What Penny did, was not trash Bernadette, but rather, found common ground with the guy in a position to hire her. They both LIKE Bernadette, but they agree she is intimidating. I'm not sure that will come back to bite her later, because Bernadette is sort of proud of being intimidating.

 

Let's not forget, Bernadette is the one who recommended her. This is a new thing for Penny--someone had faith in her, and pushed her. If that had happened with the acting career she might have had an acting job by now. In fact, if that had come from someone inside the industry, she'd have had a Tony or an Oscar by now.

 

I find it alarming that so many people seem to be objecting to Penny having some kind of success. Hasn't she had enough failure?

[romantic idiot]

Think the concern is that this isn't really success and worry that it is a set up for failure.

 

Re: the car - Leonard can always buy her another one...Also, she was given one specifically because she might need to drive to auditions etc. If she does lose the company car, she may be okay with public transport in her new job - whatever it may turn out to be. And if she's unemployed public transport would presumably be cheaper than gas? Not like she couldn't get a ride. Or maybe she'd borrow Howard's scooter. Doesn't he still have it?

Edited October 27, 2014 by romantic idiot

[Hecate7]

If Penny loses the job, they still have the money from her sale of the old car. Leonard can always buy her another one, and it's possible, if Penny loses the job, that she will get another acting job through her pal Will Wheaton, or start some kind of weird web series that goes viral and launch a career that way.

 

The sales techniques she is learning, are skills that she didn't have when she tried to launch the acting career. I found it ironic when Bernadette gave Penny a pep talk about selling herself as a product to Emily, because that is what actors have to do, each and every time they audition. Over and over and over and over. And Penny probably was not quite really doing that, or she'd have commented on that herself.

[One Tough Cookie]

Is she now assuming that Leonard will drive her to all non-work related activites: to get groceries? to buy shoes?

 

 

Just who does she think she is? Sheldon????? :)

[CleoCaesar]

Penny isn't dumb.

 

The fact that she has trouble following long sentences makes me doubt this.

[pennben]

 

   

Is she now assuming that Leonard will drive her to all non-work related activites: to get groceries? to buy shoes?

 

    

 

Just who does she think she is? Sheldon????? :)

 

Hands down, best play of the season, One More Time.  Well played!

[LoneHaranguer]

 

The fact that she has trouble following long sentences makes me doubt this.

Do you have any examples? I thought her problem was with her vocabulary.